TM2020 - Large Theme - Gay Mafia IV: TOWN WIN

[Ankamius]

First, before I go into why the scumteam is nomnomnom, Flavor Leaf, Kuribo, and davesaz (probably), I want to go a bit into why some of the other slots are town.

EspressoPatronum

Spoiler:

Lmao, now I have FL in the doctor hood telling MariaR he needs her vote on Ank.

Is this some next level attempt at derailing an Ank wagon? Or did FL just slip??

I said I think we need your vote on Ank, Maria

Not Panth or FB.

2 separate posts. I didn’t look at it like that, but I guess I see why he’d call it out like that.

This is correct.

Lmao, now I have FL in the doctor hood telling MariaR he needs her vote on Ank.

Is this some next level attempt at derailing an Ank wagon? Or did FL just slip??

Maria’s vote was already on Ank. I was telling you I wanted your vote on one of them.

But my vote was also on Ank already

Lmao, now I have FL in the doctor hood telling MariaR he needs her vote on Ank.

Is this some next level attempt at derailing an Ank wagon? Or did FL just slip??

? My vote is already on Ank? Is this some last ditch effort or something? No, FL isn't the selfless type.

I have no idea what's going on... that's why I brought it up to the group. I

Why would FL ask for your vote on Ank in the doctor PT?

I already asked my team what they think. More to come when they weigh in.

UNVOTE:
Gobble has advised I unvote until we sort out what happened in my hood.

What exactly are you trying to sort out?[...]

Whether FL accidentally posted in the doc hood instead of the Scum PT.

If it's the scum PT, then you and FL are scum. If it's just a miscommunication, then I'll go back on my merry way.

From gobble:
@MariaR why does an Ank scum flip make me town and FL scum?

@Ank what do you think of the FL+MariaR hood stuff?

Gobble suggests we lynch MariaR or lynch nom+venge MariaR to test it. A MariaR scum flip strongly suggests FL is scum.

What about your Ank stuff??

If we're lynching someone else than Ank, it's FB.

If the FL stuff is real, then all my Ank stuff is possibly wrong.

Yeah I agree. I just think it's just better to lynch FB in that case though, I demonstrated clear logic as to why he's scum. This gamestate is the proof of it.

VOTE: FB

How does the gamestate prove FB is scum?

And further, if we're looking at FL+Maria vs Ank, why vote outside of that?

The reason gobble suggested killing you was because I told him a MariaR lynch would probably be tough to get through today. Killing you and having you venge her achieves the same result, albeit in an inefficient manner.

This trajectory is never scum. Period. End of story. I shouldn't even have to explain this beyond the fact that it would indicate that there's some reason EspressoPatronum suddenly needs me alive and/or MariaR to die... which makes absolutely no sense with using that specific avenue of switching. It's so out there that it's almost better to just opt into "sorry I changed my mind, VOTE: MARIAR" rather than to go this route. Even then, he stays on course when given a juicy FB wagon to bite onto. I don't see in what universe this ever comes from scum, sorry.

Almost50

Spoiler:

This Town:

@Almost- same question and also can you remind me why you're personally voting DV right now? I kind of want to go back to voting him but I've lost track of your specific reasons for being on him in the vast posting wasteland

In no particular order: kuribo, davesaz. FL

I am voting DV because I decided I'd be kuribo's proxy vote for the day. kuribo is voteless, and I have come to a point I could/would vote certain slots out of spite rather than for an actual scum case. I tried to fight it and gradually became apathetic, so I decided to give my vote to kuribo to use it for today.

Note: There are other reasons to my apathy, such as other games. In the Open Setup they flipped 2 scums and then failed to nail the third and are lynching my TRs instead. In the Normal I can't offer much help to my team representative because I can't keep up with all the noise. In the mini-theme jjh was the N1 kill. Also jjh took a break since he was NK'd and has yet to return, so all this plus how I'm hating certain slots in our game contributed to my apathy.

VOTE: nom

I think this is correct. If nom is Town she can Vengekill whomever she sees fit. If she's scum then we have no say on whom she kills anyway.

Oh, and @EC: Your reads suck (aside from your change of heart about me). FL is TOWN, and Maria looks like Scum to me now. I am not pursuing the case on Maria because I know I always find a way to SR her, just like your Ank will always find a way to SR me of late. I still didn't fully get over that game with multiple hoods where Ank replaced in and decided to SR me just because, and even claimed she has a semi-perfect record if reading me, and then she NK'd and mastina tunneled me for it.

I still don't want a nom lynch, I feel like I'm quacking in the wind on that one.

My reason to vote nom is NOT that I SR her, because I don't. My reason is that she is Vengeful, and I think we need to make use of that extra -Town motivated- kill.

In a world were nom is Scum *not my current world); that's a good lynch (a lynch on Scum is always a good lynch).
However, in the world I'm in it still is good to lynch Town!nom and have her Vengekill a SR (I'd suggest someone in particular, but I don't want to affect nom's decision in case I'm wrong).

If you really rely on me to make a good shot here you've lost your mind

You know what

I think scums think they know where I would shoot, so they think it's safe to vote me.

Perhaps it changes how I view this whole game...

Vengekill Maria. I will either be called a hero or a fool until the next TM is upon us. (If she flips Scum it was a JJD call. If she flips Town it was AP.) :lol: :lol:

UNVOTE:

Just to give both nom & kuribo their space to try and convince me/us otherwise.

I'm actually starting to regret requesting the roleblock on our neighborhood and abstaining from vote removing, because just putting the game at one less vote to lynch is something that would help us a lot right now while the game is this apathetic.

Someone doesn't even know how it works, but they insist they know how to play mafia and are trying to force their reads and views too. :facepalm:

On another subject:

@nom: DO NOT EVEN THNIK about targeting kuribo. DON'T.

You know what? Take ME out. Give Ank the bloody Vig shot.. I don't care anymore. This game has already turned into a circus and I congratulate the scum team not only for winning here but for managing to win the whole tournament.

It all started with some idiot who thought it was cool to break the rules and use a trust tell in a bloody tournament game. That -well deserved- modkill turned the game into a night start, only with scum being more informed than they would have been had it really been a night start.

Then another idiot thought it was funny to kill the towniest player's motive by making them voteless. Then that idiot hoined forces with another idiot into making our hood PT totally useless by practicing their favourite hobby of calling me scum for lolz.

And here we are.

So, I

really

don't want us to win this now. At least it guarantees Chenn and -likely- Ank not winning.

P.S. Right now the only reason I don't want Ank lynched is because I TR what EC says through her.

So, yeah, non should be the lynch to make our resident genius Ankamius feel better, and nom should vengekill me to further help Ank lead us to

demise

victory. It also gives her a Vig shot to kill another townie, which would be a remarkable achievement if she really is town. She would have single handedly lead us off the cliff, and my money is she won't even apologize for it post-game. Instead, she will call me, kuribo, and probably DL bad players.

Maria is my top scum read and I feel I’ve been very vocal about that

VOTE: Maria

Now put your vote where your mouth is and commit to it.

Tell me, what happened to the wagon on DEB that magically went away?

Get it bloody resurrected and I'll support it. Everybody's "asking" why not this or that, but nobody's actually taking the initiative to vote someone other than nom.

GDI, Maria. You're making it damn too hard for me to SR you for real this game. :(

UNVOTE:

Like, ig you are scum, WELL BLOODY DONE

Well, I should've p-edited, but whatever. I saw Ank voting Maria while I was submitting the previous post, and now I know I don't want to lynch Maria this game. (Hint: That was NOT why I unvoted, as I wasn't even aware Ank had voted her)

I was writing a long post going into why I had reads the way they are, but I decided not to post it. Instead I'm going to do it this way.

Ankamius

Almost50
Firebringer
Gammagooey
nomnomnom
Panthaleon

davesaz
Flavor Leaf

Dr Easy Bake
kuribo
MariaR

EspressoPatronum

And yes, I'm changing my mind on DEB, somewhat, solely because of his vote on nom today.

I don't think his lynch is at all useful to the game other than the exact same reasons that nom is a good lynch, that being that it relieves a source of tension from the game.

In fact, let me try to understand something here.. if I may: You are "unsure" about DEB/kuribo/Maria, and your only confident SR is EP??

GDI, Maria. You're making it damn too hard for me to SR you for real this game. :(

UNVOTE:

Like, ig you are scum, WELL BLOODY DONE

I legit blinked at my screen in shock for a good five seconds. I thought I was gonna have to deal with you vote parking me. What changed?

There was a post on the middle of a page that got me thinking "this isn't Scum", and then one at the top of the next page that sealed it, iirc.

For what it's worth, I agree that nom giving her reads would be helpful.

And I strongly disagree. You see, let's say nom intends to vengekill Scum (let's say she either provides one strong SR or she has a poll of 4-5 players who have 3 Scums in them). Scum are NOT going to lynch nom, and will instead NK her.

Now let's assume she provides a pool of 4-5 players that contains 0-1 Scum in them. It's not only safe to lynch her, but is also safe NOT to NK her immediately and have her lynched in a day or two. It also guarantees they shoot elsewhere if her pool is of 1-2 townies.

So you see, whatever nom's reads are they will always provide SCUM with more data to work with deciding their next move.

Town!nom should keep her cards (what's left of them) close to her chest. Scum!nom isn't gonna tell us the truth anyway.

In my massclaim, I said the lightning rod is X-shot. FL and I specifically talked about doing this in our hood to make it seem stronger + thus more of a threat to scum.

MASSCLAIM:
Hood: Leading Actors
Members: EP, FL, X Elements
Power: Doctor
LMS: X-shot lightning rod

So, @Ank, how did you know it was a 1-shot

before

anyone in the thread mentioned it?

RED ALERT

Please finish the massclaim:

Almost50 - Ankamius - Chennisden

- Vote Remove / Vigilante

Elements - EspressoPatronum - Flavor Leaf

- Doctor / 1shot Lightning Rod

Firebringer - nomnomnom - Volpe14

- Commuter / Vengeful

Kuribo - MariaR - Panthaleon

- Roleblocker / ???

Dr Easy Bake - Gammagooey - Volxen

- ??? / ???

Davesaz - Deasvail - Farkran

- Inventor / ???

Basically everything is out already so there's no reason to just leave the rest unclaimed

(this message from EC)

Good catch! Good catch indeed!!

The problem is this has like 1163 different explanations!

Like, Scum!Ank slipped? She either knew it from you (EP) or from FL... OR made a logical deduction (how many shots does a Lightening Rod usually get anyway??), or it was mentioned in the Scum PT with NEITHER FL/EP being Scum, or it was her skimming and not paying much attention... etc.

Town!Ank ALSO could've skimmed and made that assumption, or could have deduced it. She obviously would not have learned about it from either of FL/EP nor would she have read in the Scum PT, but she could also be making a WRONG assumption and you really are X shot (where X > 1, which is unlikely but theoretically valid).

Oh, wait! It could have been from her TEAM PT (and it still could be Town or Scum).

I'll spare you what the other 1153 explanations are for now (saving some space and time), but to sum it all up.. this is NAI. (Note: NAI as IT COULD BE TRUE IR IT COULD BE FALSE).

My question here is: WHAT DO SCUM GAIN FROM A LIGHTNING ROD ABILITY?? Do they want to redirect the kill unto themselves?? If so, WHY THE HELL DID THEY SABOTAGE THE COMMUTER HOOD BEFOREHAND? It was their ONLY way to survive without being sus as hell. (Note: FL declared he won't be using the ability and it does look bad on him of he doesn't die either way).

Still, I don't think the designers decided to factor in precisely THAT, and thus still think EP/FL are both Town, hence Ank could not have learned about the 1-shot thing from either, and thus it still is bloody NAI in my book.

P.S. I could very much bend my narrative ANYWAY you like me to. I mean, Yes.. Ank is Scum with FL and you can reread the whole game and find a load of fitting evidence. Or you can assume Ank is Town and EP is Scum trying to capitalize on an honest mistake and you still could find enough evidence to support the case too.

Now another question: Why would Scum want to give ME the Vig shot?? I don't think ANYONE would be able to guess whom I might shoot (not even I tbh) at this point.

So, you see.. this -and more- is all going through my head, and I don't know what to do!

Just look at this. It's all either directly relevant to the game, him posting his reads, or just trying to put out what he's thinking. He's not trying to appear any specific way, just... raw thoughts. I didn't quote his several joke posts and I left out a couple of 'relevant' posts, but this is literally what his most recent 20ish posts look like. With the sheer amount of chaos going on, I'm not seeing anything indicating he's trying to take advantage of it to push his own agenda. This is TOWN.

Panthaleon

Spoiler:

Nothing about nom's behavior indicates to me someone playing to work towards the benefit of the town or of our mutual success. I see a player pushing for herself and her safety, and has done nothing with the breath of fresh air she was given except cast suspicion on those who still have the audacity to vote her.

The deadline is tomorrow. Nom has failed to do anything with her time, so I strongly advocate for a Lynch on her. I am suspicious of DV but I can say least see angles of his behavior as coming from town.

I think the people that are scums on my wagons are the one that are still on it, or anyone after Ank/DEB because I feel those two unvotes in particular were extremely townie, the rest is up for debate

Ah who could forget the classic scum tactic of "everyone gets on the same wagon and stays on it." Classic move

FB you should join the nomnom wagon. it's very cool and very in

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DV I figured out why nomnom might be less enthusiastic about killing firebringer

This is a dumb vote

I'm going to pout, sit on nom, hammer DV if someone needs to by deadline, and then spend tomorrow tunneling on nom until she, like, does anything.

The DV lynch is dumb. The hammer was dumb. This game is dumb.

I wish I was scum. I keep joining games as a favor and getting stuck in as town.

MS has changed man. Everything is about jacking off your ego and trying to single handedly solve the game instead of collaborating and communicating.

VOTE: Nomnom

Parking this here to start with. Hey nom play for serious please. Of you are town, tell me who scum is

After her behavior yesterday, I am not looking anywhere other than nom.

As a happy coincidence, there's also a vengeful kill. If she's scum, we get rid of a liability. If she's town, we get a second Lynch. It's a win win win

If you really rely on me to make a good shot here you've lost your mind

I mean you're not making a shot alone. You're doing it with the consensus of the town, if you are town.

But really does NOBODY else look at nom suddenly becoming vengeful because of a scum action and think 'Oh, that's pretty clearly b/c nom is scum and they want to give her a vengeful on the way out'

Hey tell me more about this statement

I would like Gamma to tell me more about that pls

Gamma spikes in suspiciousness

Hey nom obligatory "do anything." You can't just mope your way through another day.

It makes me mad because as a player I am way better when the spotlight isn't on me and I can take the time to analyze discussions, I genuinely cannot read people when it's me that's on the spotlight. It's really terrible.

The spotlight went off you and things didn't get any better.

Please concisely list out the playerlist and your reads on everyone. You spent a lot of yesterday complaining that you couldn't give reads because you had too much pressure on you. I have the utmost faith that you were able to take advantage of the fact that your reason fell apart to calm yourself. And I'm certain that voting DV who you claimed to be scum reading forever only for him to flip town helped you revaluate your reads.

Hey nom what if, and hear me out on this one, you list out your goddamn reads

This is asinine. Is being this unhelpful just NAI for you?

I'm not going to reward petulant whining by doing nom's work for her. Someone who cared about winning with the town would do more than mope about how town is dumb for lynching her and how she's not going to do any work.

Obviously if nom is scum, giving her a list of people to kill just communicates details to scum anyway.

I would suggest that since nom is an actually useless slot, we put a second vote up and FoS properly for the second Lynch. This at least gives us the ability to turn a useless slot into a double day.

What if you tried to contribute to the discussion and explained who YOU thought was town or scum.

I mean I'm pretty sure you're just going to throw a fit and shoot me on the way out anyway because that's on par with your engagement so far.

Well to be honest I'd really like to make it to LYLO, or at least get further in the game if I end up getting lynched so I have less chances to be wrong. I think lynching me now is a strategic blunder .

Spoken like a true townie

Nom: there's no point to me playing because I'm going to get lynched anyway

Nom: why do you keep pushing me you should stop talking about me

Nom: you guys definitely shouldn't lynch me it's a mistake

Thinking emoji

Yeah no, this is a town trajectory. There's no manipulative subtext to this and I can't see this emotional shift as fake, especially in a case of SvS with nom, because all this really achieves is derailing the lynch while also leaving him in the awkward spot of having to find somewhere new to park, which he pretty aggressively just doesn't do. The entire mindset doesn't make sense with him being scum, and I can't see him being scum with a town Nom because he's pretty blatantly baiting her into just shooting him if she gets lynched. This is the type of gamestate where it's entirely possible the game will just derail over and over again to make the game harder to predict, so it's really risky to bank everything on a play that has a high likelihood of backfiring if it happens to go badly.

---

Firebringer, MariaR, and Dr Easy Bake will be explained in the next post, but ultimately they are the scumteam's picks in mislynches on future days. Gammagooey stands out as another possible scum, but I find it far less likely that he is scum than Davesaz.

[Ankamius]

PART I: PREVIOUS WAGONS/LYNCHES

I've mentioned multiple times in the past that the Volxen wagon was forced through bizarrely fast while every other wagon that has ever existed in this game has been bizarrely lethargic. Who was on the wagon?

Creature

(9): Almost50,

nomnomnom

,

Gammagooey

, MariaR,

kuribo

, EspressoPatronum,

davesaz

,

Flavor Leaf

,

chennisden

nomnomnom

(4): Vex Vience, Ankamius,

DeasVail

,

Volpe14

Not Voting (3): Dr Easy Bake,

Creature

, GuyInFreezer

LYNCH HAS BEEN REACHED.

Literally everybody on the scumteam. Unless you believe that the scumteam is Panthaleon + myself + Dr Easy Bake + Firebringer,

scum are always on this wagon.

With how different this wagon was from literally every other wagon in the game,

it is absolutely insane to assume that scum had absolutely nothing to do with this wagon.

If you want even more evidence that it makes absolutely no sense that scum didn't have anything to do with the wagon, just remember that the wagon literally started by Almost50 shouting from the rooftops that skitter30 had a meta scumread on Volxen and was literally YELLING AT ME to get the fuck on the wagon and that it was degrading his read of me rapidly by not doing so. In what universe do I stubbornly stay on a nom wagon, in what universe do multiple scum not hop onto the free town lynch that multiple people are already hard sheeping and that will promise to be easy to deflect by the fact that Almost50 basically built the wagon

ALMOST ENTIRELY BY HIMSELF

?

It's fucking nonsense. From scum's point of view, it's a free town lynch. It simply makes far more sense for scum to be mostly on the wagon, yet the scumteam are arguing that multiple slots in the narrow lynchpool are OUTSIDE of it.

Now, if you want more evidence that the other wagons never taking off is because of where the scum are voting, just look at these two arbitrary VCs, the first one being when the modkill happened and the second being the VC before the Deasvail wagon took off.

GuyInFreezer (3): Vex Vience,

davesaz

,

nomnomnom

Flavor Leaf

(2): Dr Easy Bake,

Farkran

EspressoPatronum (1):

volxen

nomnomnom

(2): GuyInFreezer,

DeasVail

davesaz

(3): MariaR,

chennisden

, Gammagooey
Elements (2):

kuribo

, EspressoPatronum

chennisden

(1):

Elements

Dr Easy Bake (1): Almost50

Not Voting (3):

Flavor Leaf

,

Volpe14

, Ankamius

With 18 alive, it takes 10 to lynch. Deadline is 1/16 at 10PM EST.

nomnomnom

(3): panthaleon,

DeasVail

, Gammagooey
Dr Easy Bake (1): Firebringer

DeasVail

(2):

davesaz

, Almost50
panthaleon (1):

nomnomnom

Flavor Leaf

(2): Ankamius, MariaR
MariaR (2): EspressoPatronum,

Flavor Leaf

Not Voting (3):

kuribo

,

chennisden

, Dr Easy Bake

The scumteam is

hard aligning

with each other. These players rarely if ever vote each other, and because town is struggling to get together and push a wagon through independently, scum DO NOT NEED to do anything more than to just refuse to vote each other for the game to just inevitably devolve into a town mislynch when the momentum inevitably swings against scum and onto whichever poor sap town happens to have the most momentum for the day. That's exactly what happened on day three with Deasvail.

Speaking of which, let's look at that Deasvail wagon, shall we?

nomnomnom

(2): panthaleon,

DeasVail

DeasVail

(8):

davesaz

, Almost50, Ankamius,

nomnomnom

, EspressoPatronum, Gammagooey, Firebringer,

Flavor Leaf

Flavor Leaf

(1): MariaR

nomnomnom

(1):

chennisden

Not Voting (2): kuribo, Dr Easy Bake

With 14 alive it's 8 to lynch. Deadline is 2/1 at 9PM EST.

Oh.

The only scum not voting Deasvail is the one that literally can't vote while multiple scum are being voted. Fancy that.

PART II: GAMESTATE AND THE NIGHTKILLS

Part one sets a good groundwork for why this scumteam works, namely the fact that these four players never seem to be willing to vote each other, even when multiple wagons on scum pop up at a time. However, there's something interesting that is also popping up today, specifically, for why the game has progressed the way it has.

First, the most damning thing about it is the following:

1. Davesaz is the only remaining member in the investigative neighborhood, and has openly refused to share his results from the night before. It is 'incorrect' to lynch him because he is our only investigative power left in the game.
2. nomnomnom has been forced into being the only remaining member of the commuting neighborhood, which simultaneously removes that power as well as gives nomnomnom a free kill if she ever gets lynched, which is both a potential swing for scum if she gets lynched as well as giving the scumteam room to argue against lynching her 'now'.
3. Flavor Leaf is part of the doctor hood, which is now one kill from not existing and becoming a lightning rod instead. He's consistently argued that lynching within that hood is bad because then they no longer have a doctor shot, and he's against flipping nomnomnom because he is insistent that she will vengekill him, thus making EP a lightning rod that will die that same night.
4. Kuribo is part of the only remaining 3 player hood, which also has MariaR (who has been a paranoia and potential mislynch target for most of the day) and panthaleon (who has only been under significant flak by players in this list, interestingly enough!) as targets by these players.

Isn't it interesting that there are two slots that have mechanical reasons to not be lynched, one that is being argued as optimal to lynch ~later~, and one that is buried in a neighborhood with two targets that are being discredited and pushed while he's being ignored by those same slots? This looks like a Flavor Leaf styled scumplan to me!

Flavor Leaf brags about his scumgame and how he always plays for perfect scum wins. Lo and behold, the scumteam are actively avoiding voting each other and the nightkills/night actions happen to coincide with the lynches of these players being either very difficult or outright suboptimal to do mechanically.

Now, what do the nightkills have to say about this?

Night 1 - Farkran

: Farkran was pretty clearly, as suggested in the past by me, the primary slot that was the most likely to bring the town together and rally them onto lynches that the scumteam couldn't control just by manipulating the flow of the game. I haven't actually checked, but if Volpe was correct that Farkran was onto nom/FL as a scumteam, then that's another very strong reason to nightkill him.

Night 2 - Volpe14

: All I have to point out is this:

Fark was the best NK for FL/nomnom and a below average NK to a team outiside of nomnom/FL that should be more worried about Ank the paragon reaching the conclusion that it's a lot of TvTs.

Ank wasn't nightkilled and is getting pushed today.

I don't buy that.

I think Ank reads right now is serving scum and they couldn't get her when I made it clear that I was commut'ing the slot.

Fark also had hot takes on nomnom/FL although was more lukewarm recently therefore it would less bad (as it did) to them.

I checked, Volpe14 never goes back on this. Why does a slot that is getting disinterested and is backing a slot that is incorrectly tunneling town die? I'll give you a hint, it's because he's

RIGHT

, is not willing to back down from this stance, and also is a proponent of potentially bringing town together in the future.

Night 3 - chennisden:

This has a pretty simple explanation. First, he was pretty obviously town that nobody was talking about. Second, Almost50 and I had a significant amount of tension between us; getting chennisden out as the strongest link in that neighborhood makes sense. Third, I strongly suspect that the scumteam wanted to be very careful to keep the neighborhoods in a state where it would be very difficult for town to make proper use of the LMS powers, so killing in a 3person neighborhood also makes a lot of sense here.

None of these are nonsensical from this scumteam. When you look at two town that are playing in a way that is looking to get town to work together being killed first, then it makes sense with the idea that the scumteam are actively avoiding lynching each other while the town languishes in its inability to get a proper wagon going on scum. Manipulating the neighborhoods to control the LMS powers makes sense with the idea that the scumteam is abusing the mechanics to avoid being a potential lynch.

It all

just makes sense

.

PART III: FUNNY SCUMBUTTS

1a.

Spoiler:

Panth isn't giving reads and bitching at me, which is either town frustration or just scum doing their cinema and pretending to discuss. Judge by yourself.
I should be asking you what you think about it, not the contrary.

pedit: I am not whining. I am stating the fact that my input here is 100% useless, and all I need to do is shoot correctly. This is the reality of lynching me today. Now discuss your reads instead of this shit lol also what you're saying is what I'm trying to say but you're acting like what I'm doing is bad

Well to be honest I'd really like to make it to LYLO, or at least get further in the game if I end up getting lynched so I have less chances to be wrong. I think lynching me now is a strategic blunder .

Also FL according to DDL he thinks Kuribo and Ank are good lynch decisions today.

He mentioned Maria, he thinks it's not impossible that she's just letting things go by because of the hectic gamestate. He also pondered the idea of you and Maria being paired together, but in the end he thinks you're town.

pedit: Why do you insist on lynching me when it's a strategic blunder? I thought you were smarter than this Ank

The strategic blunder is making me use my vengeful shot when I have the most chances to miss scum. This should be pretty obvious why it's a blunder. It's a simple numbers game here.

NOT ALSO LOOKING AT THE FACT I AM LIKE CONFTOWN FROM THAT LMS THING

It is relevant considering I am literally conftown and that you are removing someone conftown from the game just for a shot in the dark!!!!
This is what scums want. This is why they gave me that venge shot. Use your brain pls.

pedit: not it's not playing with one less confirmed town player is bad, jsut straight up bad

1b.

Spoiler:

I am suddenly scum okay lol

Ank you're really bad at this

lynching nom when there's one scum left is optimal regardless

That's not what you think at beginning of the day hahahaha

You are REALLY bad at this lmao

Ank explain how I suddenly became scum to you I really want to hear this

But you said I was in the scumteam, not any of that stuff lol

Am I town or scum

Incongruent. This is self-preservation behavior.

In that similar timeframe, she's deadset on FB + myself being scum and that FL is never scum.

2.

Davesaz does like... nothing all game. I'm seeing no strong scumhunting, only mechanical stuff and just asking questions that don't ever go anywhere. I checked his most recent 1/4 posts and I can't even tell what exactly his opinions are. And yet nobody's really ever talked about him potentially being scum or really anything but someone in the investigative hood???

3.

Spoiler:

@kuribo: I am starting to feel apathetic about this game (and the whole tournament. tbh), so I', willing to make you a deal. How about you use ME to vote whomever you want? I am your proxy vote today.

I feel that, though Xtoxm came through with some reads I'm about to share.

My problem is typical of me as town in that I have too many scum reads. I can't focus and I feel isolated out here and doubly so in Team Mafia.

DV/DEB/Ank/FB. Dealer's choice. The latter two are annoyance lynches, but if the idea is that there's scum in Dave/Ank/chenn, I don't think it's Chenn. FB just annoys me and is in a bad slot, I probably wouldn't vote that right now because i don't scumread it as much tbh. DV's responses to the wagon against him have been bad and the same applies to DEB. I don't want DEB in endgame. I've explained to DV why I've cooled on him, and I haven't liked his responses.

I'm still waiting for someone to explain to me why nom is scum. But since I have no vote, no one will bother.

Xtoxm says he also doesn't understand the scum read on nom. A50, EP, FL, he townreads all three. He likes the way dave handled the claim but says there's not much else to townread him for. (Agreed) He got a slight townread from one of Ank's posts, enough to put ank in the middle of the pack.

Xtoxm's scumreads are DEB, DV, Maria, FB. He didn't elaborate much, other than FB deathtunneling as town isn't unheard of but that he should be strung up if he doesn't back off from it.

Xtoxm also said that only three scum in the setup would be weird in a game this size, but not to discount that the Survivor can be balanced as a sort of traitor since it could presumably joint with scum.

He concludes by stating that he supports the complete mass claim and finishing it.

Kuribo, please let me know any needed additions/subtractions/edits to the following list

GOOD ENOUGH TO MURDER, I GUESS
nom
Deas
Dave

YEAH, PROBABLY STILL GOOD ENOUGH TO MURDER I GUESS
DEB
Flavor Leaf
kuribo
Ankamius?
the rest of the playerlist in some order?

Real quick because shits fucked at my house. And my cat is missing. So fuck this earth and everyone in it.

Deas is in his proper place

Nom is town, I've been clear and unflinching on this and no one has managed to convince me otherwise

Flavor leaf is probably town, I don't think I've stuttered there either

I'm town because the mafia gods were not kind enough to bless me otherwise

DEB is higher on the good enough to murder list.

Replace Flavor's name or my own with Firebringer. I've warmed up a bit from "wouldn't miss him if he died" to "might still be scum but I'd miss him because he entertains me." If he's scum I'd like to kill him last.

Take Dave off the top list, I get town leanings from him since the reveal. Not much else to town read before that.

Town reading A50

Ank can go back to good enough to murder, I didn't like him throwing shade in our last exchange

I like your posting, you can be town

Maria and panth also likely town. If there's scum in my group, I'd guess maria because I can't read her for shit. Vex and panth both very genuine to me. I don't think there's scum with us though.

I still don't want a nom lynch, I feel like I'm quacking in the wind on that one.

I just don't like the idea of lynching my town read on day 4 just because they're vengeful


Like I'd rather lynch a scum read regardless because then you're not trading a town for that scum

Don't get me wrong I do love high risk high reward gameplay, and if it were me who were vengeful, I'd be begging you people to put me out of my misery so I could yeet someone into the shadow realm

Consistent townreads on the other three slots in this list. Attempting to 'fix' other slots' reads into aligning with the general push that this team is trying to create today. Beyond this, he's doing basically fuck all jack shit other than bitching about scumreads about him and misrepping everything I say.

4.

Spoiler:

I'm actually reasonably confident that the major conflicts are either TvT or irrelevant in the grand scheme of things

it's more productive to look on the outliers for that and see who's working the sides of it than anything

this reminds me that chenn mentioned stuff about this that would indicate town although I'd need to double check to lock that

if the pieces are falling into place properly, GIF/Deas/Gamma/'lurkers'/EP/elements should probably have the scumteam

I'm struggling to see most of the other players fitting into this right now

Ok. May i suggest taking a step forward from simple generalization and try to concretize these posts into actual names?

Volpe vs FL = TvT
Farkran vs Chennis = TvT
Farkran vs Nom = TvT
Farkran vs Ankamius = TvT

...that's a lot of farkran, adding in that i've been fighting with FL too. You must really think i am bad at being town, if every one of my "fights" has been picked against town. I'm not taking it on a personal level or being prideful, i just find it hard to believe that you think i have been wrong every single time, yet you're still townreading me. I would understand not being sure, but *all* of those people -including me- are hard townreads of yours.

I see that you are treating Nom vs GIF and volpe vs Elements, perhaps Maria vs Daves? in a different fashion though. However... i don't understand why? What's the difference?

I've finished my reread of GIF ISO, can't find anything wonky or scummy in there, but i found out that my hardtownread was probably mostly out of early agreement bias and i may need to update it. I'd like someone to point out anything i am missing.

On the other hand i think i don't scumread FL anymore after his recent exchange with chennis. Dave and gammagoey probably fell for the bait, but reacted spontaneously so that's a confirm about dave for me, and improving my gammagoey read.

VOTE: ankamius

You’re pushing it like Fakran died for no reason, and I’ve been trying to avoid bringing it up, because I town read you earlier pretty strongly, but these were literally Fakran’s last posts.

It makes a hell of a lot of sense for you to kill Fakran. And I’ve been trying to test the waters to see if I think it was a frame or not, but everybody was pushing the NKA aside. I don’t think it was some random kill.

I've been working from both scum! and town!anka POV when reading your posts. You are not aggressive nor inquisitive, which is usually a scum trait in my experience, but i have seen town players do that so it's nothing decisive.

I'm only aggressive when I'm confident in my own conclusions and find inherent value in pushing them, I'm not going to be aggressive when I'm not expecting any results from what I'm pushing

I had a lot of issues with deathtunneling years back so I'm more careful about what I push and why

Ok, trying from a different angle: how are you scumhunting in this game? What are you looking for in people's posts to form reads, besides activity and effort?

Because my problem with you now is that i don't see you doing any of that. It is early, but you're feeling way too cautious and you seem to be expecting the game to solve itself, but contrary to a lurker you are also paying enough attention and posting stuff that i see as empty. This is the point of me asking you "why am i wrong?", because surely you don't think your posts are empty... i guess?

Also what's the point of having a readlist that almost coincides with post count? Did you notice it at all?

oh

yeah you just don't understand my playstyle

huh

my first thought was not having farkran's read hang over me would help me get more into the game

but I'm even more uninvested than before

strange

There was 1 more brushing off Fakran for not knowing your playstyle post on your 1st page of ISO that didn’t show up, and I feel like your constantly shutting down any pushes I make.

It makes a lot of sense for me to kill farkran, yes

It makes sense for nearly everybody to kill farkran, yes

If you got that I was saying farkran died for no reason, then you're just putting words in my mouth. I think farkran died because he was a universal townread and generating the most information. Who in their right mind doesn't kill farkran?

It makes a lot of sense for me to kill farkran, yes

It makes sense for nearly everybody to kill farkran, yes

If you got that I was saying farkran died for no reason, then you're just putting words in my mouth. I think farkran died because he was a universal townread and generating the most information. Who in their right mind doesn't kill farkran?

I wouldn’t have killed Fakran. I wasn’t town reading him as strongly as you guys were, and he had just come around town reading me, something that wasn’t necessarily going to be happening throughout this game, and now I seem to be in the semi clear after Fakran dies?

Hell no, I’m being sheep dogged here.

Sheep dog gin’, when scum are actively guiding, or herding, a townie to play into a specific area in the game to have them completely controlled and contained, even if they go unpredictable. They let them run in their little pen, and if they become a hassle, they can just take them out.

Alright genius, who exactly do you kill in his place than

Alright genius, who exactly do you kill in his place than

Volpe.

You'd nightkill into the single biggest source of tension in the entire game?

You'd nightkill into the single biggest source of tension in the entire game?

Yes. Do you think I wouldn’t?

Certainly not the play I would've made!!!

Like, is FL being stupid or obviously scummy

Like, is FL being stupid or obviously scummy

This is pretty much the golden standard comment for FL town who’s about to get into deep solve mode, regardless of what Maria’s alignment is.

Certainly not the play I would've made!!!

Sort of the point that was being made here from the beginning.

Quite funny how FL went out of his way to pin Farkran's death on me and that he definitely wouldn't do it when I explain why he was simply the best possible choice!

Runner up for the funniest part of his ISO is his hardon for protecting the doctor hood when there's nothing stopping the scumteam from just killing one of them.

5.

FL focuses a lot on me from day two on after EP and I mutually scumread each other initially on day one. I expect FL helped fuel it in the neighborhood and made sure to keep endlessly engaging anything I do in order to drown it in bullshit so that I wouldn't focus on solving the game and figuring out that EP is town rather than just keeping the tunnels going long enough that it's too late to solve the hood at all. When it's 'incorrect' for the gamestate to lynch scum, then it's only a matter of time before this 1v1 just goes out of control and gets town to just vote me out in order to shut it up.

Of course, I realize that going into lengthy engagements with EP is not conducive to a solving environment, so I refuse to do so and get further scumread for it, which furthers the tunneling on both sides and gives even more town infighting that allows the scumteam to just skate by while hard-aligning with the same reads and refusing to budge on voting each other while town inevitably tears itself apart. EP is a fucking pawn in their game, the town slot that is in the perfect spot to be manipulated by the scumteam to keep town from being able to function as a unit while the scumteam coast their way through the game.

Ever wondered why I put so many attempts out there to rally town together, to get people to get their teammates into the game to help solve it? Why none of them ever worked out?

It's because the scumteam tore me down every time I tried, and the rest of the town is so downtrodden and unable to pick up the slack that it just results in me looking ridiculous while the scumteam get away scot free. Now I've done it enough times that, along with the initial nom push that half the town either isn't interested in or doesn't want to go through with for one reason or another, the scumteam are outright pushing and misrepping everything I say in order to make it so that town is going to be swayed by the momentum they're providing to remove me from the game so that town no longer has any ability to work together as a unit at all.

I think the scumteam specifically expected me to either make a push against town, in which it would interestingly get pushed through with no effort... or that they'd expect me to push down one of their own or EP, which can be easily argued down mechanically, making me lose even MORE credibility and looking ridiculous in the process.

THIS ENTIRE GAMESTATE IS A TRAP SET BY THE SCUMTEAM

THERE'S ENOUGH EVIDENCE HERE SHOWING THAT THIS SET OF PLAYERS IS THE SCUMTEAM, WE JUST NEED TO BREAK THROUGH IT AND FINALLY WORK AS A TOWN UNIT FOR THE FIRST TIME THIS GAME.

[Ankamius]

VOTE: Kuribo

This is the optimal lynch today.

It is very important that we lynch the scum within the roleblocking hood first, because then we run the lowest risk of the Vigilante shot getting roleblocked if we hit a situation where we are afforded one in this game. If we do get a vig shot, it is

always

on nomnomnom first. Otherwise, we lynch her after flipping the other scum slots.

Davesaz, if by some miracle is town, will have enough information to give us something in future days with his ability. Otherwise, the second lynch upon a kuribo scumflip is Flavor Leaf, specifically because he will be the most difficult of the remaining three to lynch and I don't expect it will be easy to scrape together enough votes before people get fed up with the bullshit he'll inevitably spew in the thread when he gets wagoned.

Assuming that both Kuribo and Flavor Leaf flip scum, then the game is just a lock and davesaz/nomnomnom should just be obvious lynches. If that doesn't end the game, then the last scum is probably Gammagooey or DEB, but I expect that this solve is exactly correct.

Let's finally get this game going so that we can avoid having an embarrassing perfect scum win in the large, please. Vote kuribo.

[nomnomnom]

It is very important that we lynch the scum within the roleblocking hood first, because then we run the lowest risk of the Vigilante shot getting roleblocked if we hit a situation where we are afforded one in this game. If we do get a vig shot, it is always on nomnomnom first. Otherwise, we lynch her after flipping the other scum slots.

this literally contradicts everything you've said previously

I think you might be a bit on bullshit mode tbh

[Flavor Leaf]

This is all just IioA.

Also, can Roleblock ability hit the LMS abilities? I thought it was for the Group Actions only

[MariaR]

Me and my whole team have dnd soon. But, we'll read this after

[Ankamius]

scumteam is nomnomnom + kuribo + davesaz + FL

I'd be willing to bet AT LEAST three is correct.

nom gets lynched last so that even if we're wrong on her, we get one more shot at it

easy.

sure thing nom

[Flavor Leaf]

And a lot of incorrect assumptions because you have me as scum in there.

I also think it’s incredibly convenient timing for you to flip on EP, myself, because of the inner issues we have going right now, and it feels like you’re trying to swing momentum off of you rather than finding scum.

[kuribo]

This is all just IioA.

Also, can Roleblock ability hit the LMS abilities? I thought it was for the Group Actions only

The mod confirmed to me that we cannot block LMS, because the group is dissolved once the last man wins the group.

[Ankamius]

looooool

[kuribo]

It is very important that we lynch the scum within the roleblocking hood first, because then we run the lowest risk of the Vigilante shot getting roleblocked if we hit a situation where we are afforded one in this game. If we do get a vig shot, it is always on nomnomnom first. Otherwise, we lynch her after flipping the other scum slots.

this literally contradicts everything you've said previously

I think you might be a bit on bullshit mode tbh

I mean it's literally contradicting 250 pages of her read on you, so

[Ankamius]

LOOOOOOOOOL

LOOK AT THE DISCREDIT TRAIN ROLLING IN

[Ankamius]

I rest my case.

Good night!

[kuribo]

As if your hands are clean on that Deas lynch, Ank

[kuribo]

LOOOOOOOOOL

LOOK AT THE DISCREDIT TRAIN ROLLING IN

Oh honey, you've had that train parked in this town for days

[kuribo]

Speaking of which, let's look at that Deasvail wagon, shall we?

In post 5055, Sir Elton Hercules John wrote:
nomnomnom (2): panthaleon, DeasVail
DeasVail (8): davesaz, Almost50, Ankamius, nomnomnom, EspressoPatronum, Gammagooey, Firebringer, Flavor Leaf
Flavor Leaf (1): MariaR
nomnomnom (1): chennisden

Not Voting (2): kuribo, Dr Easy Bake

With 14 alive it's 8 to lynch. Deadline is 2/1 at 9PM EST.


Oh.

The only scum not voting Deasvail is the one that literally can't vote while multiple scum are being voted. Fancy that.

So the only "scum" not voting Deas is me, when I was voteless... but you were voting him too, dude, you didn't even bother coloring your own name green because you're hoping people forget.


So by your own assertion, you also voted with the scum team on that lynch.


How cute that this makes me scummy.

[Flavor Leaf]

Quite funny how FL went out of his way to pin Farkran's death on me and that he definitely wouldn't do it when I explain why he was simply the best possible choice!

Runner up for the funniest part of his ISO is his hardon for protecting the doctor hood when there's nothing stopping the scumteam from just killing one of them.

This is straight up just wrong.

I shaded you a little sure, but I ended actively defending you and town reading you.

I remember specifically because that was the day that the “daddy/SK” comments were coming up.

Also I spent most of this day phase explaining to you about why it had to be THIS day phase to hit the doctor hood, because a commute would block

[Flavor Leaf]

Like we’ve literally spent a good portion of this day talking about that exact thing, Ankamius just flat out misrepped with it.

I just got to my climbing gym, I’ll be back in a couple hours.

[Ankamius]

so the running tally on the reasons given for my case being wrong is:

1. IIOA (???)
2. "contradicting everything I said before" (which is provably false as I've already shown)
3. "contradicting 250 pages of my nom read" (because reads evolving is scummy)
4. because kuribo wasn't voting Deas because he was voteless (which I literally said) and that I was voting him too (ignoring everything else that ties into it)
5. "it has to be THIS day phase to hit the doctor hood" (because it was clearly yesterday that he was fear mongering about the doctor hood and not today)

and that's three slots that have their initial response be to discredit the case
two slots that just nitpick specific points out of context
two slots that shade me like they 'just realized I'm scum' like they haven't been pushing me as scum for the last 100 pages

ok

[Ankamius]

if this isn't a fucking obvscum response then nothing is

[Ankamius]

A message from Eddie Cane!

I've been told that nomnomnom is really bad at mafia, whatever I really don't care

FL, Kuribo, legitimately if either of you two are town, then you have to know Ank is out of her scum range. Replying to the case with random shade doesn't change that fact.

Also

, both of you have played enough to understand that being inconsistent is a towntell more than a scumtell.

The burden is on you to find Ank as town now if either of you are also town, because your responses have been abysmal to me.

I came around on EP being town about 2-3 days ago IRL. I'm reevaluating now because even though this isn't my game, I care too much about winning (and really, remembering games like this is why I mostly quit in the first place)

I'm about 90% confident that Ank has at least 3 scum in her solve, and 95% of at least two. Could she be wrong on one? sure, but you guys aren't showing any solving in response and it's reinforcing my scumreads on both your slots. I don't think Ank is even capable of this as scum, even compare it to her best scum game on the site FotM and you'll see that it's different.

[Firebringer]

nom, are u gonna ignore RC message to u?

[Firebringer]

how does anyone read 6175 or 6176 and say

"ohh yeah. That is fake scumhunting. Those are scum posts"

[Firebringer]

hey kuribo, if ur are town stop being a reactionary player. I know u aren't like this when ur town but all uve done today is react and aren't even pushing lynches.

U just yell and scream anytime someone calls u scum.

[kuribo]

FL, Kuribo, legitimately if either of you two are town, then you have to know Ank is out of her scum range.

Hey Eddie if y'all were town, ank would know I'm way way fuckin out of mine here so that appeal means shit