Newbie 2036 - Game Over

[donkihott]

VOTE: donkihott because I can't tell if your name is a goof on Donkey Kong, something to do with donks (cars or butts?), maybe the i is an Apple thing, or Don Quixote.

You were right with your last guess, it is indeed related to Don Quixote, it is just the way it is pronounced in my native language.

I will vote for Gawr cuz she talks too much and I don't want to die on D1

VOTE: Gawr E-2

[donkihott]

I'm not very experienced but is there a way to actually get information on D1, since we have no information whatsoever.

[donkihott]

Okay, it seems I skipped a page and didn't answer appropriately. It might have been a mistake put someone on E-2 that soon, I just didn't thought of what the pace of the game is going to be and how are we going to "extract" information of each other.
My vote had no reason behind it whatsoever it was just a shot in the dark. I am not sure if you would've reacted the same way if I didn't explicitly declared the E-2 (I read it is a good practice to say it.
What I "sensed" in the 2nd page is that 'hessian' seems very sus of me and this makes me sus of him which is not a solid argument at all.

[donkihott]

I think you are the only one overreacting here.

[donkihott]

Very well; do you have any views on the rest of the thread that you'd like to share?

Well not much to be honest, I noticed that Gawr started really loud and he is dead quiet now even though he's been asked a direct question, Marky likes longer posts and Taylor prefers short.
Right now to me Marky seems like one of the good ones or at least he is really trying to appear as one.
What is a good pace of the game? Like, should we pressure people to vote and/or defend themselves to go on the next phase or should we take our time.

[donkihott]

Would also be good to get some general reads from gwar/fred who seem to be content to stay in the shadows

Lmao yeah that's enough.

VOTE: Marky Mark

What's enough? What are your reasons behind voting Mark?

[donkihott]

Also why did you skip saying you're putting him on E-1?

[donkihott]

That is really fishy. I think everybody can count to 5 so you don't need maths to see someone is at E-1. I think you just wqnt to get rid of him fast.

[donkihott]

Well, fk it.
VOTE: Marky Mark

[donkihott]

Did you know it is proper etiquette to first declare intent before hammering so that everyone could voice their opinion on the matter? Not only have you robbed us of time, you have also robbed us of information.

No, just read it though. Anything I can do on the matter?

[donkihott]

Okay, first I want to apologize for the hammering.

Now to address the accusations of hessian, which by the way start from page 2. I think it is obvious to all (town aligned) that that hammering should prove my innocence on 95%.

Since there is a etiquette for hammering (which I again apologize for not following) it means that we would've have 24 hours to hear Marky's thoughts. I am not sure why a sane mafia would hammer his teammate and try to win the game on its own.So the argument that I tried to prevent people from getting information sounds absurd.


Mark did a graph where he placed his thoughts on town/mafia so I think we should take the sets of the people who didn't vote for Mark, the people Mark stated as town aligned, get the intersection and start from there.

Which are {Hessian, Olivia, Gawr} and {Me, hessian, satisfaction, gawr, trendall} which leaves us with Hessian and Gawr.

Another interesting thing is that hessian had his first vote was for Trendall and exchanged some arguments with him. Also on Mark's diagram hessian is pretty close to me on the town scale.

Personally I think Gawr is not playing at all so my vote goes to hessian. VOTE: hessian

You are all free to suspect me, I have nothing to fear about

[donkihott]

Also what do you think are the odds that a SE like Mark who hasn't played for 6 years would agree to sacrifice himself on D1 to let the newbie carry the game on his first game?

[donkihott]

Was it obvious? Why was it obvious? You had hard evidence on him or what?

[donkihott]

There are two mafias right? Who of you is throwing

[donkihott]

If I physically could I would've hammer within 5 minutes. As you can see from the start I am a little impatient and couldn't really get any idea about any of the players so I wanted to speed up the process.

[donkihott]

[quote="In post 145
can we make this the quickest game in years?[/quote]

Nope.

[donkihott]

Can you paraphrase that, because I didn't really understand what I was asked.

[donkihott]

I'll wait for a 3rd person to ask me this (except hessian)

[donkihott]

I think it’s fair to wait. If somebody was asking me to claim, I’d like it to be somebody who actually held a hammer.

^this

[donkihott]

Sure, I'm Vanilla Townie.

[donkihott]

Go for it then sherlock.

[donkihott]

Just on D3 take your time to look into hessian. My guess is that Fred is the next victim.

[donkihott]

Well I don't know for sure (apparently y'all don't either) but hessian seems most sus to me atm.
I mean
1) she is high on town-aligned/strong-read chart that mark did
2) One of the players that didn't vote for Mark
3) Had an argument with Trendall accusing him with the same "overreacting" thing she tried to put on me.

[donkihott]

Well she tried, to rebutt it, actually talked about 2/3 of it and didn't really convince me.

Saying she had no time is irrelevant to me (in her case) because she had no suspicion on Mark whatsoever.

Saying that someone is "quite suscpicious" (Hessian to Trendall) seems more than a mild argument. Even more when Trendall says everyone seems town except hessian who defended Mark.

Otherwise I think everyone else seems like town other than hessian who piggybacked Marky Mark's sketchy 'generating content' and 'look how town I am' stuff. Plus they both made some rough arguments (Marky Mark in post 27, hessian in post 34).

Anyway even if I'm wrong about her I think that it is the better choice. Rather than accusing the man who hammered the mafia and saying that he is the mafia because Mark's ship was long gone and no one could've saved him. Because if you think that then you think the same about me and if you do then this just means that you had no clue about Mark either and your votes were RVS.

If you want to "teach me a lesson" for the shitty play I made, because, hello its my first game then vote me off I'm completely fine with that, but mafia accusation is absurd (at least to me).

[donkihott]

Why I didn't hammer sooner?

[donkihott]

Well I am re-reading the rules and didn't see if discussing outside the game related stuff is illegal or not so basically I had lectures at the time and posted in the breaks

[donkihott]

First I was accused of putting someone at E-2 very early in the game and when Trendall didn't say he was putting someone on E-1 I wanted to play the same card and provoke a reaction. But then (as I stated already) decided to just hammer and speed up the game. That is all the drama about that vote.

[donkihott]

Once.. irl... total mayhem

[donkihott]

I know you have your reasons to be mad at me, losing your teammate on D1 must be a hard pill to swallow. But trying so hard to vote me off just makes your low chance of winning even lower. Do you think you won't be suspicious if at D3 i turn out Town? If you are mafia you will probably lose on D3, if not well then the mafia will probably get 3 free kills.

I've already said what I had to say regarding my thought of process back then. Now will you believe me or not is entirely up to you. I don't intend to explain myself again and again over the questions.

[donkihott]

As you can see from the start I am a little impatient and couldn't really get any idea about any of the players so I wanted to speed up the process.

But then (as I stated already) decided to just hammer and speed up the game. That is all the drama about that vote.

[donkihott]

Are you going to ask me the same question after 50 more posts or ?

[donkihott]

So, you were lying about thinking Marky Mark was town?

Can't lie as a town, sorry.

[donkihott]

Well if Gawr was replaced doesn't it mean that she didn't do the night kill.

[donkihott]

Did you think Marky Mark was town when you hammered?

This is my answer for the nth time:

...

couldn't really get any idea about any of the players so I wanted to speed up the process.

Here’s the thing. As far as I’m concerned, Fredrick is nearly confirmed town thanks to Mark’s 85.

I think the same, this is why I sus hessian because its the opposite. wiyvern (gawr) I kind of think is town just based on my thoughts that if you get mafia or just a role other than vanilla you would be less likely to avoid a game.

I'm scum reading donki and kind of scum resding Olivia. If you want me to explain any of the reads I can.

Yes, I want you to explain.

[donkihott]

A lot of people are defending hessian and I hope that someone with a role cleared her but wants to preserve his role. I really want to think that Oram is from the good guys since he was marked as scum from Mark.

I too am not a fan of the idea that Mark intentionally left wiyvern out of the picture. He couldn't build an argument against him at all since wiyvern (gawr then) didn't say anything whatsoever. I would've say something about wiyvern hopping on the "donkihott's an obvious mafia who slipped up" train kind of thing but then Omar mentioned it as well so I think that it is just an argument a lot of people seem as reasonable.

I may bring my Mjolnir soon if you are okay with it and wiyvern can't defend himself, even though I still have some ptsd from the previous one .

One last thing, when someone is replaced how do you address the player. Should I just use wiyvern's nick interchangeably or should I base it on context, since what gawr said may not be what wiyvern thinks at all.

[donkihott]

UNVOTE: hessian

[donkihott]

Well... it doesn't seem like scum post actually quite the opposite. I hope that "satisfies" you as a direct response

[donkihott]

Well, idk what else to really say and I can't really defend myself from a bunch of votes with no reasoning

We want to know your role

[donkihott]

Sure, I'm Vanilla Townie.

VOTE: hessian

Let's get it over with.

[donkihott]

Good luck with the 50/50

[donkihott]

Because I don't think it is you or Tay. I prepared a post already in which I share some of my thoughts and as a side note I wrote to myself "if hessian dies vore ORAM and vice versa«. If it is Satisfaction though I would vote for him on the next day or if I die you and tay would probably vote him.

Since ORAM sussed me, wiyvern and hessian it means that none of us is the mason. Maybe reveal who is the other mason to be 100% sure about someone. I will post my pre-written post in a sec.

[donkihott]

This is the post I had pre written:

(I wrote the following before the nighkill so I don't know if a VT is dead or a PR or if there is a doctor and no one died and if we will know he was saved so we can clear him/her out which would be sick. I didn't know that roles will be revealed when players die since the irl mafia I've played we don't reveal the roles, on D2 however I realised how important these reveals might be and why without them it would be impossible for me at this state.)

Okay.. this game (mafia in particular) is really hard.
At least my gut that gawr (wiyvern) wouldn't be a PR was right.

I think we should consider and the players who were "scum read" by Mark on D1. There is a good chance he wanted to do just this, place his teammate high on the scum scale to separate from him/her and potentially setup a later town read on him/her or as a last resort at least save him/her from getting sus/killed in the following days.

I want to trust Satisfaction because I just can't find anything suscpicious in his posts and him wanting me to back down from hessian seems like a town move.

By the amount of suscpicion between fred and tay vs Mark I want to almost completely eliminate them from the scum list (Even though I don't like how Tay seems apathic and throws votes like hot bread).
My only guesses are ORAM (Olivia) and hessian (lower sus than ORAM now (based on Satisfaction's posts)).

//So we are (hope not) 5 people on board which means that (from what I undertand) we potentially have 1 shot left (before it is F-3 and it is 50/50 or 100/0) So is it good to discuss the potential setup and somehow work with the PRs to reveal the mafia (with or without revealing the people with the PRs.//

Though you can suspect me again, I will just rely on you seeing the truth behind my posts.

[donkihott]

Correct me if I'm wrong, the mason is in a private thread with the other mason, isn't he?

[donkihott]

VOTE: Satisfaction E-1 Works for me

[donkihott]

Wowww I am sooo hyped haha

[donkihott]

Good luck with the 50/50

This is an oversimplification.

To me it is not I am confused af hahaha

Tay's argument with Mark was kind of the biggest one. So it is between fred and hessian for me now.

I thought I had a way to clear hessian but unfortunately it is unreliable. Her "last online" status was showing 27 october a couple hours ago but now when she is posting it says 28 october so I don't know if it is broken or I'm interpreting it wrong.

Btw Satisfaction you made my day. I think you expected too much in a newbie game haha. For defending your role against a counterclaim would've been sickkk.

I am 99.99% sure you are the mason though, it is nearly impossible to know both the setup and the other mason that early in the game.

[donkihott]

UNVOTE:

[donkihott]

UNVOTE:

Is it youu?

[donkihott]

Does anyone want to counterclaim the mafia PR ?

[donkihott]

@donkihott: is there a single towniest thing you think you've done in the game? What is it?

I cold-bloodedly hanged Mark. And how good of an actor a newbie do you think can be? Its just not relevant anymore to suspect me I'm clear as a water drop.

Still think it is unlikely that Tayl0r Swift pushed her scum partner that hard on day 1.

Who do you think it is then?

I know this is long shot, but... just to float the idea: could Mark have been playing a gambit where his goal from the beginning was to sacrifice himself to towncred his partner?

Do you mean me by that?

[donkihott]

im already voting donki,

i encourage the rest of you to join me.

sOuNdS fAkE

[donkihott]

Can you remind me which interactions exactly. Just asking.

[donkihott]

As alluded to immediately above, I will post my current reads in more detail later and will make a meaningful (non-RVS) vote at the same time but for now:

UNVOTE: Satisfaction

While your logic for voting me seems a little thin, I like the fact that you are analyzing other player's motives for posting and trying to be proactive. Again, this could be scum trying to build a case against me out of nothing, but that is a WIFOM rabbit hole that I am not going to go down right now so I will take this on face value as townish and remove my earlier RVS vote, which has outlived its purpose.

Even then, why unvote?
VOTE: Marky Mark

Now to get to voting and also respond in doing so to Taylors point in #80 that me calling her out for not engaging with the game is artificial.

What I am basically really scared of is letting people fly under the radar - it's been a long long time since I have played, but the most insidious type of scum to deal with in my previous experiences is the type that just lurks and doesn't post a lot as it is hard to differentiate between this and someone who just generally isn't engaged with the game. What I really don't want to happen is that we end up on D2 or even further and we have no meaningful info to go off on certain players as they haven't said anything of substance in previous days. As such, I am trying to be clear in my thoughts and my intentions and I want to see others do the same - it is in the interests of the town.

Of the players in this game, the ones I am currently finding the most suspicious (with the noteable exception of donki) also happen to be ones that are sitting back and not giving us much to go off.

FOS Taylor

I've covered this already but her general disinterest and lack of explanations is starting to feel anti-town. #80 is a flail and #81 is opportunistic. There is absolutely zero reason not to state E-2 in #81 - it is to the town's benefit to know when someone is within 2 votes of a lynch.

VOTE: Fred

Weaker read than Taylor but potentially more scummy. The lurking combined with the 0 context vote on me as soon as I voice my suspicions of you is fishy. I also feel like my vote will do more on Fred than it will on Taylor as hopefully we will actually get some substance/explanation out of him but they are both looking shady to me right now.

As alluded to immediately above, I will post my current reads in more detail later and will make a meaningful (non-RVS) vote at the same time but for now:

UNVOTE: Satisfaction

While your logic for voting me seems a little thin, I like the fact that you are analyzing other player's motives for posting and trying to be proactive. Again, this could be scum trying to build a case against me out of nothing, but that is a WIFOM rabbit hole that I am not going to go down right now so I will take this on face value as townish and remove my earlier RVS vote, which has outlived its purpose.

Even then, why unvote?
VOTE: Marky Mark

That's a 0 context vote?

so would be good to hear from him more.

I'm just continuing to vote for Gawr, I dunno if they're gonna come back and say more, and then if they do I'll decide what to do. Lynch on Marky Mark is fine I have no objection to it. Marky Mark's votes just flail around between whoever is 'offering less content' or whatever, and his whole entire posts are just about how people should be generating content and explaining themselves and so on - there was no indication that people weren't going to sorta do this anyway so I don't know if it needed to be said once. So I've read so much about how it's important to generate content, and him signposting exactly what he's doing and how towny it is that I just think 'yeah I don't need to read this any more we can lynch him it's fine'.

Otherwise I think everyone else seems like town other than hessian who piggybacked Marky Mark's sketchy 'generating content' and 'look how town I am' stuff. Plus they both made some rough arguments (Marky Mark in post 27, hessian in post 34). Actually yeah I think one of those two will be the mafia and then yeah maybe Gawr for the other one.

In my opinion, post 27 is a lot stranger than post 34.

That is everything between Mark and Fred. I crossed him out of my sus list because Mark put him so high on the scum scale. I take those words back and vote for him, the rest is up to you. VOTE: Fredrick A Campbell

[donkihott]

Btw Satisfaction you won't survive the night, you know that right?

[donkihott]

pages

I'm voting for Fred and saying that Satisfaction is going to die? Feel free to kill me I want to see how is it in the private thread of the dead as well.

[donkihott]

Watch your back

[donkihott]

You understand the point of the game for townies isn't to stay alive, right? It's not a Battle Royale.

I know, "it was just a joke".

final thought: if it is a mislim and im dead tomorrow, please go for hessian.

It will be a mis elimination and what if it is Fred all along and you vote hessian? Fred is awfully quiet right now. And btw I don't think you will die cuz Satisfaction is 100% clear and the mafia can try and put suspicion on you as well.

[donkihott]

+ saying to vote hessian if you die is just stupid. What stops Fred (for example) from killing you and using your post as an excuse? It will result in a recursive thinking.

[donkihott]

I'm here. Just don't know what to say. I'm not sure about anyone tbh and would like to follow satisfaction's gut. If it is hessian in the end and I was right from the beginning it would be madness haha

[donkihott]

Yea, I think Taylor is pretty solid.

[donkihott]

Haha gg guys, told ya I'm too dumb to be scum haha

[donkihott]

UNVOTE:

Is it youu?

Yes.

[donkihott]

Yea, made me smile though :p