[Game Over] Newbie 1784 - Escape Room

[StealthyNoodle]

Hello! Nice to meet you all. So we're stuck here then.

First game and I'm already overwhelmed. I do get that this strategy puts town in a better spot, but I agree with Nancy that it seems like a rather bad way to start out a game for newbies, and not much fun at all. I'm sure there will be plenty of time to read about this strategy inbetween later games. On second hand TesXX and Loopdan both seem eager to steer the victory towards town, while Nancy doesn't seem to support this agenda. For now I'll claim not BP and
VOTE: nancy.

Feels a bit bad, as you're the first person I've agreed with in here.

[StealthyNoodle]

How are they eager to steer town to victory?

Well about 80% of TesXX' posts till now relate to the BP-claiming-strat and it's usefulness for town.

As for Loopdan

Everyone needs to make their BP or notBP claims immediately. Do this in your first post. Do not stall. Do not claim or hint at any other roles you may have and don't hint that you do

not

have a power role.

Seems pretty eager to me.

Why vote Nancy if you feel bad about it?

She still wants to boycott a town-winning strategy. Even though I agree with her that the strat is more frightening than helpful in a newbie-game, I'd still say there's a higher probability she's scum.

[StealthyNoodle]

VOTE: StealthyNoodle

Trumping up the charges against nancy and gross exaggeration are pretty classic scum tactics.

I have nothing to hide; my vote is solely based on supposed probability. If some other good theories come around, I'll surely listen.

What are your reasons for defending her on the other hand? Joking around with friends is something anyone could do; scum or not.

[StealthyNoodle]

Do you think that makes TesXX towny? If so, why?

Not at all, I just find it more likely. He supports the use of a pro-town strat, while you don't. Simple as pie.

I don't think the strat is frightening in the least.

You're right, my bad.

Why did you claim even though you agreed with me, and why did you vote me? You're at L-2, btw.

Well, let me just re-quote your quote of me.

She still wants to boycott a town-winning strategy.

Even though I agree with you, I have no reason to not claim not BP.

[StealthyNoodle]

VOTE: StealthyNoodle

Trumping up the charges against nancy and gross exaggeration are pretty classic scum tactics.

Oh and I simply explain my reasons for my vote, because you ask me too. I'd say calling it a gross exaggeration, is an exaggeration in itself. Shame on you.

[StealthyNoodle]

If you agree that the strat should not be used, you have every reason not to go along with it.

I didn't go along with it, because I didn't want to end up in your position. Seems like I dug my own grave instead.

Everyone needs to make their BP or notBP claims immediately. Do this in your first post. Do not stall.

Not claiming anything would put me in a bad spot, regardless of whether I supported the idea(of introducing this strat in newbie game) or not. Or am I missing something?

If you agree it shouldn't be done but do it anyway, that's appeasing.

I've never said it shouldn't be done. What I said, was that it felt like a bad way to start a newbie game.

[StealthyNoodle]

If you agree it shouldn't be done but do it anyway, that's appeasing.

Do you not see how regardless of your alignment it is anti-town to refuse the BP claims when others have already done it?

thank you

[StealthyNoodle]

This person has been staring at that noose for hours, not uttering a single word.

UNVOTE: nancy
VOTE: bjc0303

[StealthyNoodle]

I don't want a BP claim or a Doc/Tracker claim on the board before Day 1 has even begun. It kills the game. It's not fun or interesting. It's simply churning mechanics and not what mafia is about, not how newbies should be learning to play. Tes has gotten away with being read as Town while producing 0 content whatsoever simply by pushing this strat and that is a perfect example of how crap it is.

I still agree.

[StealthyNoodle]

The mechanics play a big role in the game, and the newbies

should

learn to use them to their advantage.

I'm not really that eager to discuss this subject(and I know far too little about it), but doesn't this strat put a scummy newb in a really tough spot?
I mean the main reason I dislike this strat, is because it seems to bring unbalance to the game.

[StealthyNoodle]

Care to elaborate on the ew?

Pretending to be proactive and generating content, but really that's a useless vote.

In his current state, he's only making it easier for scum. He might or might not be scum himself, but being inactive isn't the way to prove your innocence.

Engaging with someone who hasn't even made an entry seems counter productive. There is nothing to gain, you can't even ask him a question when you don't know any of his stances.

So you'd rather trust someone who won't respond to your questions then, than someone who does? You're just proving my point here, mate.

[StealthyNoodle]

I have such a splitting headache
that I can barely tell bold text apart.

Blows. Get well soon!

[StealthyNoodle]

He hasn't come online since this game started. It's a lazy push.

A bjc is useless when he was last online 12 hours before this game started.

Why the heck would he go online just to lurk? It would simply weaken his position as scum. Your reasoning makes no sense.

trying to engage someone who hasn't even entered the game will not help us progress the game.

He entered the game at the moment he accepted his role. He might be flaking, he might be lurking. And hopefully he'll show up to speak his mind about that sooner or later.

If you are town, stop being lazy with your vote.

Stop shoving people around. Again, if I feel like someone's more fit for the vote, I'll gladly change my mind.

[StealthyNoodle]

Well, what I've trying to push you towards looking at not strictly whether the you like the vote, but whether you like the post. I got hints of you reading into that in 159, but I wanted to see whether you just thought that voting lurkers on policy was bad or whether you were reading into Noodle's motivation and finding it lacking.

It looks like you have done this somewhat after all, which is great. But I'd also encourage you to question Noodle on it rather than just come to the conclusion that it's a bad post. (I certainly didn't), for instance, or may just not have thought it through very well, or may have been following a thought process that hadn't occurred to you, or something else entirely. The only way to know for sure (granted, he could always be scum and lie, so you can't really know for sure) is to question him.

Start a dialogue, create content. You think his push is lazy, but what does that mean about his alignment? Both Town and scum can be lazy, and both Town and scum can make good or bad posts. So what you really have to figure out here is how Noodle's post indicates one alignment or the other.

Insight. And thanks.

Noodle may very well not have realized that bjc hadn't come online since the game started

I knew.

[StealthyNoodle]

Why the heck would he go online just to lurk? It would simply weaken his position as scum. Your reasoning makes no sense.

Same if he were town? Him not posting in this thread is therefore not alignment indicative, as you have previously implied.

So, do you agree that he might very well be lurking then? And do you deny that lurking is a pro-scum strat?

He entered the game at the moment he accepted his role. He might be flaking, he might be lurking. And hopefully he'll show up to speak his mind about that sooner or later.

Convenient how you just snipped out the whole part about putting words in my mouth while replying to me.

For what reason would I include it? It's not at all relevant to my reply.

Stop shoving people around. Again, if I feel like someone's more fit for the vote, I'll gladly change my mind.

Your vote is wasted on a slot that hasn't even logged in since the game started, and you voting him will not pop him an email telling him to check in on this game and post his thoughts.

And when he does finally catch up, he will post his thoughts accordingly. Your one vote doesn't do anything. It will not spur any sort of reaction, it does not give him any sort of incentive to pay more attention to this game, because he is not ignoring this game. Because he hasn't even logged in yet.

Your vote does not do anything. His inactivity thus far is not alignment indicative.

It doesn't seem like you're reading my posts at all. So let me rephrase:
If bjc0303 is lurking, he sees this. If there's more pressure and he's still lurking, there'll probably be a response as well. To explain further:

He doesn't have to be online to lurk.

I don't get why you keep pushing such an invalid argument.

he hasn't logged on since the game started.

And that goes for you as well.

[StealthyNoodle]

But idk I'm bad at mafia

Sounds like a scummy thing to say.

[StealthyNoodle]

I highly doubt there was a substantial thought process behind that vote. bjc hasn't even posted anything yet.

Not sure if you're trolling, or just trying to be an a-hole.

[StealthyNoodle]

Even if he was scum lurking he can only lurk for so long before he gets prodded. And that's an actual incentive for him to post.

Lurking does not mean you do not post entirely. You post minimally, enough to dodge prods.

I admit a huge flaw from my side, not taking prodding into consideration.

I highly doubt there was a substantial thought process behind that vote. bjc hasn't even posted anything yet.

Not sure if you're trolling, or just trying to be an a-hole.

I'm just being honest. It was a simple vote, there wasn't much behind it. Which is why I disliked it, because I think it's a real waste of a vote.

Still, simply assuming that I didn't put any thought into my vote just doesn't help in any way, nor does it make me want to change my vote. In the aftermath it seems like you're at least trying to hear me out, as well as change my opinion.

So, do you agree that he might very well be lurking then? And do you deny that lurking is a pro-scum strat?

Do you agree that he could also just not have logged in and your actions literally do nothing to encourage content from his slot because he possibly hasn't even checked the site?

Both are entirely possible.

And do you deny that lurking is a pro-scum strat?

I definitely do. I'd be very interested to see somebody give me a

good

scum mindset involving lurking.

Scum1:

Cool, we're scum! Okay, let's think of a strategy to get rid of town.

Scum2:

Hmm... Oh, I know! Let's lurk!

Scum1:

But why would you want to lurk? Won't you get replaced?

Scum2:

Then I'll just post useless crap to avoid getting replaced!

Scum1:

But if you have to post eventually then what's the purpose of lurking?

Scum2:

JUST SHUT UP AND LURK

Lurkers won't reveal information about themselves, nor assist in identifying other players. They'd "shut up and lurk", as you phrased it, while we'd vote each other out. It might not be much of a strategy in itself, but it certainly doesn't help town.

[StealthyNoodle]

79/89 - Says that he agrees with Nancy that the strat isn't good for new players, but proceeds to say by not supporting it, she has a higher possibility of scum.

[...]

You're a hypocrite. Stating that you agree with what she said, but those words make her a scum read to you makes no sense.

94 - Again, you agree with her ... what makes you vs her different? That she took a more direct stance?

For clarity's sake, I presume this is what you're referring to:

First game and I'm already overwhelmed. I do get that this strategy puts town in a better spot, but I agree with Nancy that it seems like a rather bad way to start out a game for newbies, and not much fun at all.

Why vote Nancy if you feel bad about it?

She still wants to boycott a town-winning strategy. Even though I agree with her that the strat is more frightening than helpful in a newbie-game, I'd still say there's a higher probability she's scum.

VOTE: StealthyNoodle

Trumping up the charges against nancy and gross exaggeration are pretty classic scum tactics.

I have nothing to hide; my vote is solely based on supposed probability. If some other good theories come around, I'll surely listen.

To elaborate:
I don't know much about the BP-strat, but I've come to understand that it's generally considered a strat that puts town in a considerably better position than scum. All over, it seems like a strat that would make it difficult for a newbscum to do much at all, thus I believe it would be wise not to include it in a newbie game.

I mentioned this here:

The mechanics play a big role in the game, and the newbies

should

learn to use them to their advantage.

I'm not really that eager to discuss this subject(and I know far too little about it), but doesn't this strat put a scummy newb in a really tough spot?
I mean the main reason I dislike this strat, is because it seems to bring unbalance to the game.

Concidering this is my first game online, it seems pretty ridiculous to go against the majority, refuse to claim, risk being lynched only to enforce my incomplete views. I shared my opinion on the matter, and that's that. If I wanted the use of this strat in newbie-games to cease, I'd probably discuss that in a non-game thread.

I was also confronted by Nancy on this matter:

If you agree that the strat should not be used, you have every reason not to go along with it.

I didn't go along with it, because I didn't want to end up in your position. Seems like I dug my own grave instead.

Correction: I should've been "I went along with it", not "I didn't go along with it"

It seems to me that she's braver than you and posted her opinion while you just want to look good to town.

Yes. Or it could be a great excuse to stop the strat from taking effect. Later on though, she did claim(in a way) that she wasn't BP.

Even tho she didn't cooperate, you should've stuck to what you believed in lol. While I don't necessarily consider her as pro town, you make her seem so much better. You could be bussing her idk.

Well, I explained this further up in the post, so.

If the majority of the players said that this strat was bad and she was the only who argued it was good, I think you wouldn't have gone along with this strategy xd

Sure. And?

[StealthyNoodle]

#3 Can everyone stop with the wall post of quotes. Pain in the ass for mobile guys like me. Especially when it's time to quote things.

I agree, we shouldn't quote more than necessary. Instead of quoting an entire post, you could just quote the part you're replying to. Imo. quotes do assist in clarifying what you're responding to. It also helps you avoid situations like this:

A) Who are you talking in regards to that post

Lastly, for curiosity's sake: Do you happen to be Scandinavian?

UNVOTE: bjc0303

[StealthyNoodle]

I was unaware mentioning emotions was scummy.

Not really, but your statement does come through as fishing for compassion. Something a wolf in sheep's clothing could do.

[StealthyNoodle]

Noodle, who do you think could be scum?

I still keep one noodle on nancy, for the same reasons as before.

On a side note this flavour is hilarious lol

I did have a laugh.

[StealthyNoodle]

Let me also add that Pine has been awfully quiet, considering he posted in several threads only yesterday. Can it be considered coasting, or is there something I'm missing?

Pine?

[StealthyNoodle]

*Waves*
Anyone alive?

Hello hello.

Well, Pine just posted in two other threads. Either he's forgotten about this thread, or he's simply not responding on purpose.

[StealthyNoodle]

Hopefully he's writing a juicy post right now. There are just hours left till prod.

[StealthyNoodle]

@nancy what is it that makes you townread Pine this much?

They seem to have history. I don't think there's much more to it, but I don't know.

[StealthyNoodle]

Then why respond to someone else's question?

Fair enough.

[StealthyNoodle]

Wtf does AtE even mean

Appeal to Emotion.

Source: https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?ti ... to_emotion

[StealthyNoodle]

I still keep one noodle on nancy, for the same reasons as before.

nancy is prob town though. Ignoring her setup spec stances(actually even if I took them into account), her approach to the game has been largely towny.

Well I'll try to shed some light on my suspicions then.

Before that, am I the only one who'd prefer that nancy

didn't

put teaching above playing to her win-con? Is there anyone who prefers that she's playing this way?
nancy, depending on the outcome, would you change your playstyle?

(let me add that I'm really glad you're eager to assist and explain. I simply do not want you to cast aside your win-con for that)

[StealthyNoodle]

AtE = Appeal to Emotions.

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?ti ... reviations

Thanks

40 minutes earlier:

Appeal to Emotion.

Source: https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?ti ... to_emotion

YOU'RE WELCOME

[StealthyNoodle]

Before that, am I the only one who'd prefer that nancy didn't put teaching above playing to her win-con? Is there anyone who prefers that she's playing this way?

No, I would have preferred she just went along with it and save us the trouble, but I do not think that alone tells anything of her alignment.

If nancy's town, I find it weird that she's decided to share that she'll cast aside her win-con for teaching others to play. In addition to being a minor rule break(or am I in the wrong here?), she's soley agreeing to lower the majority of players' chances of winning.

If nancy's scum, she could simply be lying about casting aside win-con for teaching, merely using it as a coverup. She wouldn't be breaking any rules either(being a self-proclaimed SE, I suppose she'd do her best to respect the rules).

[StealthyNoodle]

Whatever. It's obvious I'm VT anyway from this whole stupid thing.

Also, care explain why you think this is obvious?

[StealthyNoodle]

Understand it from her POV. The whole point of a newbie is to learn how to play the game, getting a hang of forming reads, associations, learning lingo, and practicing skills like fake-claiming and ccing etc.

Can't we do this while playing a normal game, trying to obtain our win-cons at the same time? Do you mean we shouldn't be suspicious, because she's simply being helpful?

I also find it suspicious how she proclaims she's an SE, here to assist the IC in teaching! Then corrects herself six minutes later, saying that she just realized she's not "technically" SE, but will take the teacher-role anyways. I'd like to think it's very likely she already knew she wasn't an SE in this game.

We don't play newbies with the intent of breaking the setup to find the most ideal strategy

I'm not referring to the BP-claim incident. I'm refering to her statement that she'll cast aside her win-con to teach:

It's my opinion that teaching should always take precedence over playing to my win-con in the newbie queue, so that will be my approach throughout the game.

because if things go well we would be playing a follow the tracker as early as page 1, and that's pointless.

This sounds like a highly unlikely scenario though. And again, it's more about the fact that she's proclaiming she'll avoid playing win-con, even when it's borderline

against the rules

. Only practical reason I see, for it not being rulebreaking, is that she's scum pretending to cast aside win-con. Does my scumlean make sense?

[StealthyNoodle]

I'm an SE in the newbie queue, just forgot that I wasn't in an SE slot this game. I corrected it immediately.

Thanks for enlightening me on this. What made you realize that you weren't an SE in under six minutes?

VOTE: nancy

[StealthyNoodle]

I gotta go to bed, but I'll add that I find you suspicious as well, Chronicle.

You're laying low, sharing few original ideas.
You seem to be asking others' for their opinions instead of providing/sharing your own; it would be a great way to spur heat between other players.
You seem very eager to disprove of me and nancy's "useless" vote. Maybe you actually just really disliked those votes "going to waste".
Or you could've taken advantage of an obvious bad vote, and attack it to appear as an engaged townie.

Exactly why I can't justify a vote on bjc.

Your repetitive naked votes let's you lie low. You avoid any comeback, thus robbing us of your reaction.

I'm going to be doing naked votes often, I'm beginning to like them.

And you do seem to put a lot of effort in defending nancy, concidering you were among the first ones to take note of her claim-refusal.

I do not like this strat at all, I think it's a bad way to teach newbies to play and I refuse to claim either way.

Refusing to claim even though it's a pro-town strat?

[StealthyNoodle]

Whatever. It's obvious I'm VT anyway from this whole stupid thing.

Also, care explain why you think this is obvious?

I'm an SE in the newbie queue, just forgot that I wasn't in an SE slot this game. I corrected it immediately.

Thanks for enlightening me on this. What made you realize that you weren't an SE in under six minutes?

I'd like to hear nancy's response to these two questions first. Concidering she's made 6 posts in other threads between then and now, I'd say it's likely she's dodging the questions.

I also find it suspicious how she proclaims she's an SE, here to assist the IC in teaching! Then corrects herself six minutes later, saying that she just realized she's not "technically" SE, but will take the teacher-role anyways. I'd like to think it's very likely she already knew she wasn't an SE in this game.

What's so suspicious about that?

In the case she

didn't realize

she wasn't SE:
There must've been something made her realize she wasn't, within the time span of 6 minutes(the time between her posts),

while

focusing on a response for you:

Actually I just realized I'm not technically an SE lol. But yes, the above still applies!

I have read your explanations and I have seen the strategy in play and I think it's a bad way to teach newbies to play. I do not want this to be a topic of discussion when we should be focusing on RVS so please drop it.

In the case she already

was aware

she wasn't SE:
She could use this as an excuse for feeling obliged to teach us about the game, rather than focusing on her win-con. She never had to mention this, but the fact that she does "justifies" her reason to not claim anything.

Had to check, and it looks like she applied as an SE. I might be firing shots in the dark here, but shouldn't she be placed as SE in another game then, instead of taking up new-player spot here? Is this because there's a lack of new players?

[StealthyNoodle]

Chronicle, thanks for fast response. I'll make sure to look into it once I get home.

[StealthyNoodle]

Well I guess that makes sense. I'd still like her to answer my two questions.

[StealthyNoodle]

I have never ran away from explaining my thoughts, if you ask I will deliver, unless there is something I want to try.

Then I suppose you were trying to provoke some kind of reaction here:

@chronicle it was not a good idea to vote me and just leave me hanging. You just simply voted me and left. Do you have anything to add?

I'm going to be doing naked votes often, I'm beginning to like them.

Or would you like expand on this vote, and the reason you didn't add anything when WhyMafia asked?

Also because I thought she could be town.

Well, I think you're putting a lot of effort into it, concidering she should be fine defending herself as town.
Then again, as a town-player I agree it's only fair to defend others who one believes to be townies.

I also like to stubbornly think I'm right.

I'll agree to that!

[StealthyNoodle]

Tes and noodle are screaming town to me.

Thanks. Not sure about Tes yet.

[StealthyNoodle]

Hello CogMachine.

SEs can replace into as many games as the want I think. She took up a new player spot in pregame since that player didn't confirm their role

Allright, thanks for clarifying.

VOTE: Pine

Why vote Pine? He just got prodded.

[StealthyNoodle]

Not tracker btw

[StealthyNoodle]

It's easier to lynch someone when they are not around to defend themselves.

Still, for what reason? He's made 5 game-related posts, and been inactive till the point where he got prodded as an IC. He'll possibly be replaced soon, and since he got prodded I suppose he's not lurking either.

Is being prodded in any way a scum-strat for making lurking more believable?

[StealthyNoodle]

It's easier to lynch someone when they are not around to defend themselves.

But why in the world would you say that you'd like to lynch someone who's unable to defend themselves??
As he hasn't done anything to make himself suspicious, there's like a 75% chance of being townie. To be honest, after being prodded, I'd say his chances of being a townie are even higher.

And we're not playing to ease the burdens of the mod.

For what reason would IC get lynched anyways?

I prefer we stick to arguments and let players put up a defense.

[StealthyNoodle]

You're aware that lynching means you kill them of, right? This whole thing could just be a misunderstanding.

[StealthyNoodle]

Why does being prodded give a higher chance of being town?

A prod is a Private Message sent from the moderator to a player who has fallen afoul of the moderator's set activity rules.

He's an IC. He'll likely try to follow the rules. I suspected he was lurking earlier on, but it seems he has forgotten about this game. Also, if he's not responding in 24 hours from when he got the prod, he'll be replaced.
I doubt being prodded can be considered covering up for lurking, but I don't know.

Would you say there's a lower chance for him being town? In that case, why?

[StealthyNoodle]

Better than a possible mislynch of an active town. Can you agree with that?

What are suggesting? That lynching an active player will be mislynch by default? That it doesn't matter if we lynch Pine, even though he's town? I don't get your logic.

I'm starting to see Loopdan's multipurpose.

[StealthyNoodle]

Edit: What are you suggesting*

[StealthyNoodle]

p-edit

For what reason would IC get lynched anyways?

That's not really a good reason to not lynch somebody. I wouldn't defend Pine

just

because he's an IC

Oh, I agree. I was referring to his argument:

IC will get lynched later anyway.

[StealthyNoodle]

I'd rather focus on teaching and if I have the chance to royally fuck over a newbie like I do right now with Noodle I'm not going to because it won't be fun for him or anyone else. I'm not going to play hard because I care about teaching.

Instead of letting it drop as a difference in philosophy you've continued to push the fuck out of this all game long as though I'm not playing to win. It's nauseating by now, for the love of god.

I'd feel bad about lynching you for being helpful, should you actually be serious about this. But considering you're a player and scum would use every strat to avoid looking suspicious, I'll stand my case;
I find it suspicious that you're so keen about proclaiming that you'd like to teach.
Guess it's not enough though, and MiniDeathStar's latest post makes me doubt my theory. Ugh.

I read the playerlist. Come at me bro.

VOTE: Noodle

Okkay

an objectively obvscum [...] and if I have the chance to royally fuck over a newbie like I do right now with Noodle I'm not going to because it won't be fun for him or anyone else.

I'd like to see you try!

Stop pitying me, and give me your best shot. If I'm obvscum it shouldn't be hard at all. We all got into the game prepared to be lynched at first day. I won't be bitter, and I doubt the others will be either. Being an semi-experienced player, you know this - and tbh you're just making yourself more suspicious.

[StealthyNoodle]

nancy

@nancy how does claiming BP or not BP f up RVS?

Look at this thread for evidence. RVS has been stilted by the philosophical differences in your insistence that people claim and my refusal to claim. Discussing theory at this point is not at all conducive to scumhunting, which is what we should be doing and which is what RVS is designed to facilitate.

Ok, you're town. (Not just for this post, but this sticks out to me as a post no mafia would make)

nancy's simply stating that because

she

had another philosophy than the rest(and therefore refused to vote), the game was stalled.
is this your strongest townread of her?

Srceenplay

: Calling you out!

You're aware that lynching means you kill them of, right? This whole thing could just be a misunderstanding.

Yes.
Let's kill him.
Better than a possible mislynch of an active town. Can you agree with that?

This is a mafia argument. Period. It sets up "well at least we killed a lurker!" and "No one can be blamed".

I don't think it's much more than a simple vote, and his logic might be that he'd rather keep someone active, that he believes to be townish.

StealthyNoodle

: You're not very stealthy are you?

*noodles into hiding*

[StealthyNoodle]

Tes your profile pic gives me nightmares

It's just L eating a banana.

If you'd be inactive for 72 hours, you'd probably get replaced by someone like this:

Spoiler:

[StealthyNoodle]

Readlist - StealthyNoodle

Likely Town	StealthyNudes!
	WhyMafia, Loopdan
	TesXX, Srceenplay
Null	CogMachine
	Pine
	Chronicle
	nancy
Likely Scum

[StealthyNoodle]

The psychological pressure of the Escape Room seemed to have taken its toll on bjc0303, who
had been staring at the noose for hours and not uttering a single word.

hahah *applauds*

[StealthyNoodle]

If you had to day kill someone right now, who would it be?
If you had a doctor protection, who would you protect (and you can't self heal)

I'd kill nancy I guess? I feel like I'm pushing pretty hard on her after all, so it's probably no surprise. This might also sound pretty arrogant and scummy, but

worst

case scenario we kill of a VT(she claimed she was one) and not a Power Role. Unless she lied to protect her PR, of course.
If we lynched a townie, I'd protect the least scummy person among those who didn't vote for the townie.
If we lynched a scum, I'd probably protect the most towny person among the lynchers.
It's really dependent on the outcome of day 1 though.

[...]scum are able to blend in and get away with things far easier[...]

I'm aware, and it's worrying. You're more active than others here, and I've read that scum in general tend to be more quiet.
Still you've dodged our questions several times, so I'll ask again:

How did you come to the conclusion I'm obvious scum?

What made you say that your VT-role was obvious, so early in the game?

[StealthyNoodle]

They could of course just be exaggerations.

[StealthyNoodle]

[...]in general[...]

[StealthyNoodle]

If you had a doctor protection, who would you protect

I'd really, really like to hear your reasons for asking this.

[StealthyNoodle]

The doc prot shows how much you think somebody is town.

I guess it was a bad plan tho :/

Wouldn't asking us our strongest townread have the same effect?
Asking us who we'd protect as docs, sounds like something scum would ask to avoid a blocked kill.
Then again, you still read town to me. So does Srceenplay.

[StealthyNoodle]

The doc prot shows how much you think somebody is town.

I guess it was a bad plan tho :/

Then again, you still read town to me. So does Srceenplay.

Why and why?

Whymafia:
*Is pretty actively asking relevant questions.
*Seems to put some effort into providing theories of his own.
*Seems to be pushing the game a lot, and is somewhat annoyed when the game stalls.
*He's fine with claiming, and just looks to genuine to me.

He could be a really great actor though, and I've taken notice that a lot of his posts are simply rephrasing of other's already-mentioned theories. Anyways, for me he's still on town-side of life.

Srceenplay:
Much of the same, and his most recent scumlike-action is just too simple to be read as a scummy imo. If he's scum and keeps pushing arguments like "better a defenseless null than an active townie", he'll probably be lynched later anyways.

[StealthyNoodle]

Shredding Pine's Wallpost - Part 1

Page 1

[...]leads me to think nancy is Town. This isn't based on standard tactics or anything, it's largely based on my relationship with nancy. I have a sense that she tends to play a bit fast and loose when she's Town, especially in the early game. A first-post scumclaim-in-jest isn't something I see her doing as scum.[...]

So you've been witnessing her play as scum then? If so, could you share with us a game in which you were? If not, how can you be sure that she'd play much differently as scum?

(Is this unethical or too out-of-game to ask for btw?)

-WhyMafia jumping on Chronicle for being vote 2 on Stealthy instead of LoopDan for being the third vote strikes me as odd and disingenuous, and if this weren't a Newbie game I'd be all over that. We'll see how it plays out.
-WhyMafia then jumping onto nancy looks like scum falling into her trap. Definitely putting a pin in that.

It's page one. They look like random votes to me. He could just as well have joined the bandwagon and vote me.

Page 3

-Pine enters, nancy interaction is pretty obvTown.

I still don't get why you feel that anything obvious, based on this short interaction.
She should be perfectly fine tricking you, taking advantage of you knowing each other. The fact that you wish to ignore that fact is just weird.

Page 4

-Stealthy's entrance looks like newScum. Praises TesXX and LoopDan for empty reasons

They're already more reasonable than yours, considering we're page 4.

votes nancy as the most dynamic player present. Does not support BP-claiming strategy, agrees with nancy, but does it anyway? Then flips around and says she's not supporting a pro-Town agenda? Naaaahhh.

I explained why several times. Did you simply ignore those posts?

Also as noted in Post 90, exaggerating charges against nancy.

I responded to you on that one as well:

Trumping up the charges against nancy and gross exaggeration are pretty classic scum tactics.

I have nothing to hide; my vote is solely based on supposed probability. If some other good theories come around, I'll surely listen.

What are your reasons for defending her on the other hand? Joking around with friends is something anyone could do; scum or not.

(though you might've gone offline at that point, as you never replied to my question)

-WhyMafia continues to make moves that come off as opportunistic, specifically moving against LoopDan for a page 1 RVS vote. Hesitating a little on my scumread though, not sure even newScum would do this.

Contradicting yourself? You just accused WhyMafia's page 1 RVS vote for being suspicious, yourself. And this just seems like a basic push to me:

Yea he's viable to look into.
Loopdan, explain your vote
VOTE: Loopdan

Gah, this takes so much time. I'll continue after I come home tonight(or in the morning). I'm glad Pine's back, despite our disagreement.

[StealthyNoodle]

^hahaha

[StealthyNoodle]

^48 hours, if they don't respond to the prod within the next 24 hours, they'll get replaced.

[StealthyNoodle]

Has he been asking relevant questions? Has he been pushing the gamestate?

Might sound silly, but the fact that he makes a post(222), doesn't get a response within the next 3 hours, and proceeds to this:

*Waves*
Anyone alive?

makes me believe he's pushing the game state and want feedback for his ideas/statements. As scum, he would probably gain more from just waiting instead? And it wouldn't look suspicious either.

But he only made nine posts. What patterns did you see in his posts that made you TR him?

He made four game related posts. I also fail to see how one could tell if it's a town read after so little info, even if prior friends

In this post he "corrected" TesXX' response to nancy, by stating that Pine only made 4 posts that were game-related, which means he actually went back to check. Unless he and Pine are scumbuddies, I see it as potential scumhunting.

Not only that, we gain far less info from a pine lynch

He wanted to kill Pine of all people.

Well, he's very protective of Pine. Heh.

Why are you so sure pine is town?

I personally think pine is worth looking into -

Concidering he pushed him earlier on.

His questions always seem aimless and empty, and his posts are forgettable and have never stood out.

Well, I guess. But I don't see any great reads on him being scum either.

Not sure if I really agree on that Noodle read, I like noodle for town.

And thanks.

[StealthyNoodle]

^Yep I don't really find it scummy. Your reason seems pretty valid. Still I don't see the "Pine

of all people

"-bit. Is it because he's IC?

[StealthyNoodle]

My vote is on Srceen until he gives a good explanation as to why he contradicted himself.

I don't think there's any logic to his statements. Then again, one doesn't have to be scum to contradict oneself.
His first statement was not a good one to begin with. If he realized that later on, why should I need to defend it?

[StealthyNoodle]

why should

he

need to defend it*
lol

[StealthyNoodle]

the fact that he makes a post(222), doesn't get a response within the next 3 hours, and proceeds to this:

*Waves*
Anyone alive?

makes me believe he's pushing the game state and want feedback for his ideas/statements. As scum, he would probably gain more from just waiting instead? And it wouldn't look suspicious either.

@CogMachine Are you copycatting WhyMafia, to make me believe you're townie as well?

I'm bored.

People should post so we can get to lynching mafia.

[StealthyNoodle]

I have another few hours sitting at a starbucks. So no. I am legitimately bored.

Guess I'm over-suspicious.

I'm more interested in what you think about my comments on Loopdan tbh. Or just your read on him.

Regarding your Loopdan, it's fine research. I agree he's more silent here than in previous games, though I don't think it's a good enough reason to consider him scummy. Might come in handy later on though.

To compare:
Newbie 1739(VT)- 52 of the 382 first posts were his (counting from post 150, when he replaced)
Newbie 1746(VT) - 49 of the 382 first posts were his.
Newbie 1767(BP) - 46 of the 382 first posts were his.
This game - 24 of the 382 first posts were his.

Content-wise, I didn't really bother to check.

[StealthyNoodle]

^and knowing myself, I'm pretty sure I'll slow down in later games as well.
[For whoever's digging up this thread in later games. See this?? Your argument is invalid!]
(gotta secure my future wins, eh)

[StealthyNoodle]

I don't know if that means my reads are off, their reads are off, if one of them is scum and the other's reads are off, or if they are both scum.

That game is actually where Pine taught me not to tunnel. Very quality lesson that I suggest everyone heed.

Concidering they have some sort of senpai-kohai relationship, I find it likely that they support each other's theories no matter the reason.

Pine and nancy, obviously

[StealthyNoodle]

At your service

[StealthyNoodle]

@Nancy-- I really want a more in-depth read from you on Pine.

Seconded. And I agree with your townreads; her posts are convincing.

Why did you choose these three games to compare?

Those were the games CogMachine mentioned.

here's a list

Well then, welcome to the top of my readlist.

[StealthyNoodle]

Srceenplay: You what, mate? Can you even count to five?
TesXX: (Still cackling) April Fools, nubs.

Such wonderful flavoring.

Also,

Happy birthday MiniDeathStar!

[StealthyNoodle]

How come this puts him at the top of your realist? What's so alignment indicative about posting a list of games you've played?

Heh, I tried to joke about him buying his way to the top of my readlist.
Still, I believe his post puts him in a more townish spot(maybe not on top though); he wouldn't have needed to post that list at all, but since he did I'd see it as a sign of cooperation.
He could be scum pretending to cooperate, but laying low would probably work better.
That, and his analysis of nancy(both scum- and townreads) looks genuine.

[StealthyNoodle]

Sorry about this, didn't mean to hit submit

How do you write a whole post of gibberish and press Submit by accident?
u must b trying to achieve something, but I'm not sure what.

[StealthyNoodle]

I love how WhyMafia's beautiful Yoda-haiku just fetched him a vote.

[StealthyNoodle]

Someone outside of us told him to do something in this thread and he did.
I'm plus it's funny but can get him lynched.
And didn't like how the both seemed to be on the same page about it.

It made my gut sick.

Well I didn't get all that, but as scum WhyMafia'd be smart to avoid doing out-of-the-normal stuff. I don't think his yoda-talk says anything about his alignment. Maybe it makes him more townish even.

[StealthyNoodle]

Anyway, can we move on?

Yeah, I don't see any problem. The reason games shouldn't be discussed is probably to avoid any interference with the game. You didn't talk about the game, so you probably didn't break any rules either. Let's move on.

The game is kinda stalling at the moment. If I have time tomorrow I'll try to do a decent read of every player,

[StealthyNoodle]

Oh wait, I just read MiniDeathStar's comments. It was pretty serious. Anyways, we're past that now, so let's go!

[StealthyNoodle]

odds of one of the two of us being scum is somewhere north of 40%

I think it's 21%, if you don't take any reads into concideration.
Since you've both been participating in the game, those numbers don't really matter though.

I'll make a more comprehensive Towncase on nancy and scumcase on Noodle in the morning. I've only slept like four hours in the last two days.

When are these coming around?

[StealthyNoodle]

^it did sound like cheerleading didn't it? Anyways I don't really see how I could respond much differently. Post 548 was to cover up for saying that he didn't break any rules (in 547). I think my arguments were pretty fair. If anything I would've dropped the "heh" in the beginning.

Posting from phone so sorry about not linking the posts.

[StealthyNoodle]

I think my arguments in post 500 were pretty fair.*

[StealthyNoodle]

Sorry about this, didn't mean to hit submit

How do you write a whole post of gibberish and press Submit by accident?
u must b trying to achieve something, but I'm not sure what.

Defends whymafia by attacking Tess over nothing.

Unless Tes posted an encrypted attack on Whymafia, I don't see how my post was even mildly related to a defence of WhyMafia? Please share.

[StealthyNoodle]

WRSGFFFFFFFDKJoisu bgyufjwdsyewfwhiusFIUHSHFiuhjixshfkdfjdshfKFLAJGHjndJKFAGVJDKksAVUHklfvgdsjk dghesjuosfKSFJLk:LSEDFJklaBgkiedgjDJjuvvhdv jkthnjuivfkhjmncvkjm nc kjm vcd xkjm, vkj,mv k,j vc m,vc mk, vc km,kjm vckjmcdkdcvxckm ,kl klk k skml d mmnmnx

Code: Select all

knjmdcsxjkmc dkjdckjn dsfkdsfkjdsfkjdfsejkdsfjkdsfehndsfehjndfsejhdfszehdf

To add on this, I do really believe this "gibberish" looks like an encrypted message. Possibly solved through a combination of simple ciphers. Not sure if it's directed at town or scum though. And maybe I'm ruining the whole point of the message by mentioning this.

[StealthyNoodle]

I agree that Chronicle has been really sure of me being town. He doesn't seem to be concerned at all, that I might be going behind everyone's back, dodging votes(except for nancy's and Pine's which really lack any explanation for now). Why are you so sure I'm town Chronicle, and who do you find most likely to be scum atm?

Sorry for not posting detailed reads yet. I'll get to it.

[StealthyNoodle]

Help me pressure chronicle then

My nancy-vote isn't doing much at the moment. But I'd feel safer lynching her, than Chronicle; nancy has already claimed to be a

Vanilla Townie

, and Chronicle might still be a

power role

.
Chronicle is suspicious to me, but I'll save the vote for now. Considering he's at L-3, my vote will put him at L-2. Should two scum be left to vote, he'd most likely get lynched.

Why are you so sure I'm town Chronicle?

Well ignore this part, I see now that you already explained yourself a couple of times on that matter.

[StealthyNoodle]

^I'm pretty certain you're not scum

[StealthyNoodle]

expect that no one could possibly bother to read it..

I did. Twas a fine read.

Another major flaw in my towngame was laziness, and this is probably one of the most common flaws you'll find.

This one is tough, and I struggle with it myself. I feel like I should be able to deliver a good read, but it really takes a lot of time. Concidering every post from both town- and scum-angle. Weigh one's reaction up to another's. And there's a big possibility no one's gonna care, or just see your dedicated investigation as a bad read. I feel like the easiest way to overcome this, is to read and get involved often. Stacking up a day of two of posts feels like saving work for the weekend. And your reads will probably end up being more sloppy.

Pine has been the centerpiece of my time here, and I call him Senpine for a reason.

He seems like a great IC, so it sucks that he's most likely gonna be replaced. It also takes away a lot of consistent read-material.
I'm about to post a big read on him soon though, so I hope your friendship won't cloud your judgement too much.

Anyways. Long read, but good. I do believe you have a genuine philosophy about teaching. It's just difficult to be certain that you're not using it as a cover-up(considering that's the essence of the game we're playing).

[StealthyNoodle]

UNVOTE: nancy
VOTE: pine

[StealthyNoodle]

I'd say I'm close to

certain

that WhyMafia is not scum.
I've been taking notes on him from every page, and I just can't see it.

He's been way too active, genuine, seemingly honest, butthurt and quarreling. He's been taking pretty wild risks, and he's been admitting mistakes and regrets. Regarding Chronicle, it seems like stubbornness/tunneling.
I admit there's been some shady situations(like the doc-prot. question and the "lynch-me"-part), but he's been open about discussing them and have admitted that he sees, in hindsight, that they make him suspicious. The whole trial-error-play is way too risky for scum.

If he was scum putting up this play, I'd be impressed.

Ugh, I'll do the big scumPine post later. This whole investigation-biz takes forever.

[StealthyNoodle]

nancy I read it. Don't really know what's the relevance to this game.
Think is was worth an unvote?

Not in itself, no. And I still don't see her as town yet. Still, my core-argument isn't really that strong anymore. And I've changed my mind about Pine. To me, he's suspicious in many ways.

[StealthyNoodle]

And there's a big possibility no one's gonna care, or just see your dedicated investigation as a bad read.

I don't really know why Noodle was scumreading me in the first place, and I have even less of an idea why he'd be pushing an empty slot over me now. Suffice it to say that the behavior is pretty strange and I also don't get why he's be defending WM so consistently throughout the game.

Well, this pretty much sums up what I hate about putting effort into this; you're simply ignoring everything relevant I've posted so far. Pretending you don't know why I was scumreading you. Why do you even bother?

[StealthyNoodle]

Shredding Pine's Wallpost - Part 1

Page 1

[...]leads me to think nancy is Town. This isn't based on standard tactics or anything, it's largely based on my relationship with nancy. I have a sense that she tends to play a bit fast and loose when she's Town, especially in the early game. A first-post scumclaim-in-jest isn't something I see her doing as scum.[...]

So you've been witnessing her play as scum then? If so, could you share with us a game in which you were? If not, how can you be sure that she'd play much differently as scum?

(Is this unethical or too out-of-game to ask for btw?)

-WhyMafia jumping on Chronicle for being vote 2 on Stealthy instead of LoopDan for being the third vote strikes me as odd and disingenuous, and if this weren't a Newbie game I'd be all over that. We'll see how it plays out.
-WhyMafia then jumping onto nancy looks like scum falling into her trap. Definitely putting a pin in that.

It's page one. They look like random votes to me. He could just as well have joined the bandwagon and vote me.

Page 3

I never got any response on this. Not sure if people just ignored it, but here starts my case on Pine.
For a Town IC, I don't like Pine's Wallpost at all. His arguments are simple and pretty pointless, a bunch of them are just rephrasings of other players' posts.
-Pine enters, nancy interaction is pretty obvTown.

I still don't get why you feel that anything obvious, based on this short interaction.
She should be perfectly fine tricking you, taking advantage of you knowing each other. The fact that you wish to ignore that fact is just weird.

Page 4

-Stealthy's entrance looks like newScum. Praises TesXX and LoopDan for empty reasons

They're already more reasonable than yours, considering we're page 4.

votes nancy as the most dynamic player present. Does not support BP-claiming strategy, agrees with nancy, but does it anyway? Then flips around and says she's not supporting a pro-Town agenda? Naaaahhh.

I explained why several times. Did you simply ignore those posts?

Also as noted in Post 90, exaggerating charges against nancy.

I responded to you on that one as well:

Trumping up the charges against nancy and gross exaggeration are pretty classic scum tactics.

I have nothing to hide; my vote is solely based on supposed probability. If some other good theories come around, I'll surely listen.

What are your reasons for defending her on the other hand? Joking around with friends is something anyone could do; scum or not.

(though you might've gone offline at that point, as you never replied to my question)

-WhyMafia continues to make moves that come off as opportunistic, specifically moving against LoopDan for a page 1 RVS vote. Hesitating a little on my scumread though, not sure even newScum would do this.

Contradicting yourself? You just accused WhyMafia's page 1 RVS vote for being suspicious, yourself. And this just seems like a basic push to me:

Yea he's viable to look into.
Loopdan, explain your vote
VOTE: Loopdan

Gah, this takes so much time. I'll continue after I come home tonight(or in the morning). I'm glad Pine's back, despite our disagreement.

[StealthyNoodle]

Shredding Pine's Wallpost - Part 1

Page 1

[...]leads me to think nancy is Town. This isn't based on standard tactics or anything, it's largely based on my relationship with nancy. I have a sense that she tends to play a bit fast and loose when she's Town, especially in the early game. A first-post scumclaim-in-jest isn't something I see her doing as scum.[...]

So you've been witnessing her play as scum then? If so, could you share with us a game in which you were? If not, how can you be sure that she'd play much differently as scum?

(Is this unethical or too out-of-game to ask for btw?)

-WhyMafia jumping on Chronicle for being vote 2 on Stealthy instead of LoopDan for being the third vote strikes me as odd and disingenuous, and if this weren't a Newbie game I'd be all over that. We'll see how it plays out.
-WhyMafia then jumping onto nancy looks like scum falling into her trap. Definitely putting a pin in that.

It's page one. They look like random votes to me. He could just as well have joined the bandwagon and vote me.

Page 3

-Pine enters, nancy interaction is pretty obvTown.

I still don't get why you feel that anything obvious, based on this short interaction.
She should be perfectly fine tricking you, taking advantage of you knowing each other. The fact that you wish to ignore that fact is just weird.

Page 4

-Stealthy's entrance looks like newScum. Praises TesXX and LoopDan for empty reasons

They're already more reasonable than yours, considering we're page 4.

votes nancy as the most dynamic player present. Does not support BP-claiming strategy, agrees with nancy, but does it anyway? Then flips around and says she's not supporting a pro-Town agenda? Naaaahhh.

I explained why several times. Did you simply ignore those posts?

Also as noted in Post 90, exaggerating charges against nancy.

I responded to you on that one as well:

Trumping up the charges against nancy and gross exaggeration are pretty classic scum tactics.

I have nothing to hide; my vote is solely based on supposed probability. If some other good theories come around, I'll surely listen.

What are your reasons for defending her on the other hand? Joking around with friends is something anyone could do; scum or not.

(though you might've gone offline at that point, as you never replied to my question)

-WhyMafia continues to make moves that come off as opportunistic, specifically moving against LoopDan for a page 1 RVS vote. Hesitating a little on my scumread though, not sure even newScum would do this.

Contradicting yourself? You just accused WhyMafia's page 1 RVS vote for being suspicious, yourself. And this just seems like a basic push to me:

Yea he's viable to look into.
Loopdan, explain your vote
VOTE: Loopdan

Gah, this takes so much time. I'll continue after I come home tonight(or in the morning). I'm glad Pine's back, despite our disagreement.

I never got any response on this. Not sure if people just ignored it, but here starts my case on Pine.
For a Town IC, I don't like Pine's Wallpost at all. His arguments are simple and pretty pointless, a bunch of them are just rephrasings of other players' posts.

*Edit: Not sure what happened, but THIS is the correct post. Ignore the previous one.

[StealthyNoodle]

Page 1

-Post 17 (and subsequent posts) leads me to think nancy is Town.

Page 2

-Not much to observe here, nancy continues to come off as Town.

Page 3

-Pine enters, nancy interaction is pretty obvTown.

Page 4

-Stealthy's entrance looks like newScum [...] votes nancy as the most dynamic player present. [...] exaggerating charges against nancy.

Page 5

-A little concerned about LoopDan's push against non-claimers in the BP strategy. [...] Also not a fan of his dig at nancy about her statement about teaching>wincon[...] As a player new to SE-status, nancy is allowed to be wrong about meta.

Page 6

[...]TRs (Town reads) include nancy and Chronicle.

Page 11

-Noodle attacks on nancy continue to be trying to make something out of nothing.
-Tentatively agreeing with nancy 314, LoopDan looks like stubborn Town SE sticking to bad reads.

Pretty much brushes away every argument towards nancy as useless. Puts up an effort to make me look more scum with useless arguments. Might be tunneling, but concidering Pine's an IC with 11k+ posts and likely a lot of games behind him, I'd doubt it. Also, his reasoning should be way better than this! An experienced town player would at least take others' opinions and reads into consideration - Pine simply doesn't. He just brushes them away as "obvious" scumreads.

[StealthyNoodle]

Well, this pretty much sums up what I hate about putting effort into this; you're simply ignoring everything relevant I've posted so far. Pretending you don't know why I was scumreading you. Why do you even bother?

It just makes no sense.

Fine. Then why do you bother to defend yourself? Rhetorical question, don't answer.

[StealthyNoodle]

Taking down a Town IC and dynamic SE would virtually guarantee a scum win.

Not sure why this is mentioned by an IC at all. It's a bad argument to avoid getting lynched, and shouldn't be used if one were an experienced town-player.

I'd also like to think that Pine would've had more insight as an IC, than to tunnel me from beginning till end. Not

once

did he see any of my posts as slightly townish, and avoided mentioning the posts that weren't scummy enough. As town, I'm pretty sure he'd be more open to more views.

Now, can we vote Pine?

[StealthyNoodle]

I mean, I actually kinda haven't bothered?

ok

[StealthyNoodle]

^Superb. Pine or Nancy here

[StealthyNoodle]

UNVOTE: pine
VOTE: nancy

[StealthyNoodle]

Is it really necessary? Of the two you've always been the more suspicious one. You also have more content to read into. You try to repel a lot of descent scumreads, yet you don't flinch at any of the "unstable" reads I left about Pine. You seemingly blindly went for him, stating there's sophisticated logic behind it, defending your own argument against me changing my vote to an empty spot (Pine), and votes him yourself once me and Loopdan are up for lynching him. You're looking for the easy way out, and don't seem to care about a town-win.

[StealthyNoodle]

How have I always been the more suspicious one? What do you mean when you say I try to repel a lot of decent scumreads? What unstable reads are you referring to? I wasn't really defending anything, I was just correcting src's misconception.

You're simply repeating my post, only with questionmarks. Like you did back when we first started arguing. (Post 100). It's a great method to make people less interested to get involved.

I don't see any need to elaborate on my post, as it should be pretty understandable to whoever has been paying attention to the game.

As for the unstable reads, go back and read through my post(for real this time), and I'm pretty sure you'll find a couple. You obviously didn't care to do so the first time.

[StealthyNoodle]

You're now spamming the thread with a bunch of game-unrelated posts, which makes my arguments less visible. This still stands:

(This is the part where you explain why you're abandoning your push on Pine so easily.)

Is it really necessary? Of the two you've always been the more suspicious one. You also have more content to read into. You try to repel a lot of descent scumreads, yet you don't flinch at any of the "unstable" reads I left about Pine. You seemingly blindly went for him, stating there's sophisticated logic behind it, defending your own argument against me changing my vote to an empty spot (Pine), and votes him yourself once me and Loopdan are up for lynching him. You're looking for the easy way out, and don't seem to care about a town-win.

UNVOTE: pine
VOTE: nancy

[StealthyNoodle]

I can't be the only one who sees this.

[StealthyNoodle]

@nancy-- Please explain your pine vote and then unvote.

I've had a secret scumread on Pine for most of the game

Post 695, we're 12 days into the game. Come on.

[StealthyNoodle]

^ok

[StealthyNoodle]

Then how come you voted Pine in the first place?

Think is was worth an unvote?

Not in itself, no. And I still don't see her as town yet. Still, my core-argument isn't really that strong anymore. And I've changed my mind about Pine. To me, he's suspicious in many ways.

This, pretty much.

[StealthyNoodle]

If 699 is all you have to say, Noodle, I feel very good about lynching you.

Feel free to explain why you kept your scumread of Pine secret for 12 days.

[StealthyNoodle]

I kept my scumread of Pine secret for reasons that I've already stated in the /same paragraph/ as where I stated that I had kept it secret. You cannot dance with a scum if they do not think you are Townreading them.

You actually want us to believe you had a scumread on Pine from day one, kept it secret for 12 days, only to reveal it now? Do you hear how ridiculous that sounds?

if you want to not be lynched you should get off your ass and expend a little more than the modicum of effort I've seen from you so far.

And once again you keep showering me with empty threats; I won't get lynched.

[StealthyNoodle]

@WhyMafia, how do you feel about nancy's reactions after being targeted? Post 667 and out.

[StealthyNoodle]

Also ... saying you're not going to get lynched looks a LOT like bravado. I'm tempted to try and put you at L-1 just to see what you do.

Just because you feel like I'm pushing my luck? That would just be stupidity. I feel certain I won't get lynched.

[StealthyNoodle]

How is it not doing me any favours? Why do I look a little like caught scum? Why should I be lynched based on not bringing more that empty attacks on other slots?

[StealthyNoodle]

And

Why in the world

would I want to explain myself to someone who regard all my reads as

garbage

completely unsubstantiated nonsense

vacuous and lazy

modicum of effort

[StealthyNoodle]

making posts that are designed to make people believe you don't care if you get wagoned or lynched.

The fact that you are spending a bunch of time posturing is really bothering me.

What is really bothering me, is experienced players looking so hard for clues in reverse psychology, which to me feels like complete BS.

I'm tired of nancy acting all high and mighty, claiming she's can "royally fuck me over", but won't do it because it would be unfair to me as a newbie.

So if I get a chance to call out her ridiculous empty threats, I'll do so.

[StealthyNoodle]

Sure you are.

[StealthyNoodle]

Of the two you've always been the more suspicious one.

How have I always been the more suspicious one?

There haven't been much content from Pine at all. There have already been several arguably fine scumreads on you already. This should be obvious to you, considering the way I've been onto you for the most part of the game. Meaningless question.

What do you mean when you say I try to repel a lot of decent scumreads?

Regardless of what you say, you are pretty defensive.
On several occasions, instead of casually responding by giving a counter-argument, you answer with a whole bunch of questions(

only

when you're being scumread):

Refusing to claim even though it's a pro-town strat?

Yes. Have you been reading my posts? What do you think about my refusal? Does it mean that I'm scum? You should probably go ahead and lynch me, if so.

Not at all, I just find it more likely. He supports the use of a pro-town strat, while you don't. Simple as pie.

Do you not think that scum can argue in favor of pro-town strats in order to seem to be Town? Do you think that scum are more likely to go along with whatever Town says in order to blend in? Do you think that scum would be likely to argue against a pro-town strat if it put them in the spotlight and got them a lot of negative attention?

And with her stances on pine and noodle(disagree with both of them) as well as her recent reaction, it kinda reads as scum getting defensive.

I don't get defensive as scum but which parts read as scum getting defensive?

How have I always been the more suspicious one? What do you mean when you say I try to repel a lot of decent scumreads? What unstable reads are you referring to?

What unstable reads are you referring to?

Well, first of: I find it weird how you were not responding at all to my Pine-post. It's like you didn't read it, which would be weird considering you voted him moments later.
I scumread him for defending you and attacking me. It's pretty much the same game you've been playing. If you were

town

, you'd likely be all over this, and calling out my read for being bs (like you usually do).

[StealthyNoodle]

tl;dr:
*annoyed and salty about nancy, she still looks scum to me.
*nancy makes some post about having secretly scumread Pine for most of the game, thus defending herself jumping on the two votes already on him.
*scumreads me for not elaborating on my read on her
*she claims there's a great indicator for her not being scum in 713. spoiler alert: it's not great.

[StealthyNoodle]

^@chronicle

[StealthyNoodle]

your noodle push sucks

my hero

@WhyMafia, how do you feel about nancy's reactions after being targeted? Post 667 and out.

@WhyMafia

[StealthyNoodle]

Wait so you just killed of our tracker then?

[StealthyNoodle]

Because that means we have no doc to protect the tracker. Am I wrong?

[StealthyNoodle]

Tes, as for you being the the pusher for this whole strat, why don't you (seemingly)care about nancy killing of the tracker?

Why are you so obsessed about surviving this nancy, that you'd like to sacrifice tracker for your own survival. You didn't even have to use this argument before you were L-1, and if you didn't it could be played out pretty well, scum believing tracker was protected. To me you look like town, ruining the game. Or scum claim to be BP.

Obviously no one else are gonna counterclaim BP, because everyone claimed not to be already. If someone's gonna claim, it gotta be the doc, but that's risky, so don't. We'll know if nancy is scum as soon as someone manages to survive the night.

Please, thoughts on this.

[StealthyNoodle]

I fully expected Noodle to CC nancy here.

So you thought I also claimed not to be BP, to ruin the strategy then? Is that even accepted townplay? I can't see any other result of this than maybe ending up counterclaiming scum, while one guarantees a tracker's death (as soon as he claims).

[StealthyNoodle]

However, it is more likely that scum!nancy would make this mistake, as she has to put herself in the mindset of herself being town and "scum reading" pine, who she then has to convince that she is town

I see your thinking, but it's probably just as likely it's a typo.

[StealthyNoodle]

Ah okay.

[StealthyNoodle]

at the very least you are a policy lynch.

I agree, but

If she's actually BP, we're gonna end up killing of both our Power Roles in one day.

It's terrible townplay from nancy, in an attempt to save her own butt.
Or scumplay. Anyways, we should be certain before lynching her. A policy lynch here is gonna ruin the game.

[StealthyNoodle]

If someone survives the night, it means we have a doc. Not sure if scum are allowed to not vote, but to do so would for certain be a risk. They'd let a player stay alive, on the assumption we'll end up lynching nancy.

[StealthyNoodle]

If someone fake-claims doc, we'll likely lose BP, tracker and one more(N2), for the trade of a scum.

[StealthyNoodle]

Okay, I'll read everything and respond once I get home tonight. I dont know what softclaim is, and the wiki says nothing about it. Sorry for not participating all yesterday.

[StealthyNoodle]

The difference is that noodle said that a lack of kill would/should result in you being lynched

I thought a night without a kill guaranteed there was a doc existent > nancy!scum. This is the reason I mentioned I'm not sure if scum could refrain from nightkilling (I said

vote

in the post, sorry bout that).

If someone survives the night, it means we have a doc.

Or that there's a BP or (less likely)scum just nokills

Okay, so scum can nokill (but that'd be risky for them, yes? Because we might not DK nancy next day either. There's also the chance that a doc claim comes around tomorrow). Sorry, I forgot about the BP.

Stopping a night kill and THEN doing the trade would be much more powerful.

Isn't this kinda what I just suggested...?

[StealthyNoodle]

Wait counterclaim as in claim that I'm doc?? Or claim that I'm not doc?

[StealthyNoodle]

Nvm, I understood now. It's not directed at me lol.

[StealthyNoodle]

Obviously the doc wouldn't want to counterclaim incase you're scum.

[StealthyNoodle]

Judging by his early game content, he seems better than that.

Hmm. Thanks?

[StealthyNoodle]

Of course. Wow, I'm playing ridiculously bad today..

[StealthyNoodle]

Please, thoughts on this.

The only thing I'm thinking of is why haven't you unvoted?

For some reason it really feels like a defeat, ughh.
UNVOTE: nancy

[StealthyNoodle]

Okay, there's a lot to read, and I'm gonna keep reading until I feel up to date.
Just want to make this post first (just to make everyone more paranoid):

just to make everyone even more paranoid:
*someone can obviously claim doc, even though they're scum. just to get town!nancy lynched. (two power-roles and one vt dead for one scum)
*if the REAL doc claims though, scum!nancy would obviously accuse doc for fakeclaiming. (also two power-roles and one vt dead for one scum)

I might be wrong about this theory, so for now I'm not gonna chase this hypothesis. Please prove it wrong if it is (I've been saying a lot of faulty stuff today, so).

If I'm

not

wrong about the theory, I don't see how her recent claim make her any less suspicious.

[StealthyNoodle]

How does it feel like a defeat, Noodle? What does defeat look like to you?

Obviously because I'm pretty confident my scumreads on you were fine reads. And I can't shake of this feeling...
You strike me as clever scum.

[StealthyNoodle]

Readlist - StealthyNoodle

Likely Town	Blackvoid
	WhyMafia
	Loopdan
Not sure	Chronicle
	-
	TesXX
	-
Likely Scum	Drixx, nancy(either or)

@nancy
Refresh my mind(or refer me to post) on why you see Drixx as scum.

[StealthyNoodle]

I know there absolutely has to be a 1-shot BP or a doc in the game. If there is, then counterclaim and we lynch nancy. If not, then nancy is confirmed town.

I want you to disprove of my theory above, or reevaluate your ideas.

[StealthyNoodle]

but also for his interactions with me. He repeatedly hard defends me from every push against me. Not saying I don't appreciate it, but it's fishy.
[...]
Sorry if you're town Noodle :/

Well, this is pretty much the same statement I made about Chronicle from my perspective, so it's a fair read imo.
No offence taken.

[StealthyNoodle]

No one has counterclaimed, so nancy is confirmed town. What is left to discuss?

Fine, one final scenario then:
Doc doesn't want to counterclaim, because it's gonna guarantee his death during night(or day if we end up lynching him instead of nancy). Either way he's screwed.

Maybe I'm thinking too far ahead. I guess doc counterclaiming is optimal play.

[StealthyNoodle]

That's seven alive, two conf-town, one scum. That's a very advantageous situation for town.

Allright, thanks for explaining. I'm on board.
VOTE: Drixx

[StealthyNoodle]

Out of curiosity. We're D1, it's post 968 and we've been playing for what. 15 days?
Is this normal for a newbie-game(or regular ones for that matter)?

[StealthyNoodle]

Readlist - StealthyNoodle

Likely Town	Blackvoid
	WhyMafia
	Loopdan
Not sure	Chronicle
	-
	TesXX
	-
Likely Scum	Drixx, nancy(either or)

Would be great if you could explain all these reads.

Blackvoid

I suppose is obvious due to his tracker-claim. If it was fake, there would likely be a counterclaim.
Humble

WhyMafia

is too cozy. It takes a good actor to keep up this kind of play. My reads of him are here and here and still count.

Loopdan

provides theories of his own. I've

rarely

seen him take advantage of others' theories and reads. His scumreads and questions have mostly been directed at you, likely because he(as me and others) have seen you as scummy to the bone.

Chronicle

is pretty much my Pine; defends me a whole bunch, and likes to mention it whenever it's suitable. I suspected him back in 256, but he has steadily dismissed those arguments. Still, I still suspect him for being the devil on my shoulder, earning my trust, supporting my attacks on you. Anyways, he came to my rescue when I was about to give up arguing with you. That's my favorite post by far.
[...]
I'll finish this, but first:

I think Drixx is L-1 now. Should we let him defend himself before it's too late?
Not too familiar with how this works, but when the last vote comes around, we're not allowed to discuss anymore, right?

UNVOTE: Drixx (this is temporary)

[StealthyNoodle]

Readlist - StealthyNoodle

Likely Town	Blackvoid
	WhyMafia
	Loopdan
Not sure	Chronicle
	-
	TesXX
	-
Likely Scum	Drixx, nancy(either or)

Would be great if you could explain all these reads.

Blackvoid

I suppose is obvious due to his tracker-claim. If it was fake, there would likely be a counterclaim.
Humble

WhyMafia

is too cozy. It takes a good actor to keep up this kind of play. My reads of him are here and here and still count.

Loopdan

provides theories of his own. I've

rarely

seen him take advantage of others' theories and reads. His scumreads and questions have mostly been directed at you, likely because he(as me and others) have seen you as scummy to the bone.

Chronicle

is pretty much my Pine; defends me a whole bunch, and likes to mention it whenever it's suitable. I suspected him back in 256, but he has steadily dismissed those arguments. Still, I still suspect him for being the devil on my shoulder, earning my trust, supporting my attacks on you. Anyways, he came to my rescue when I was about to give up arguing with you. That's my favorite post by far.
[...]
I'll finish this, but first:

I think Drixx is L-1 now. Should we let him defend himself before it's too late?
Not too familiar with how this works, but when the last vote comes around, we're not allowed to discuss anymore, right?

UNVOTE: Drixx (this is temporary)

Edit*

[StealthyNoodle]

Reads cont'd:

TesXX

doesn't put blame anywhere, rather he keeps(or pretends to keep) his theories to himself. He makes it difficult to obtain any kind of read from him, by doing so. He tends to elaborate a lot on logic, rather than accusations and assumptions (considering his avatar, that makes sense). To be the main-driver of this BP-strat would be a favorable position for scum, considering someone else could just as well have ended up suggesting the same strat. Especially if there was no tracker. I also suspected him for being nancy's scumbud. They've been arguing, but neither has delivered any scumread strong enough to push the other one (this argument is probably not valid anymore though). My final suspicion is that weird (seemingly encrypted) message he posted. Not sure if it's a way of reaching out to scumhunting town, or just a "Death god eat apples" in case he wins.

(on second thought, he might not deserve his current readlist-position. I'll move him up a tad; right below Chronicle)

Well, after settling with

nancy

being conf!town I suppose she's up there with WhyMafia. Which leaves

Drixx

. Like nancy, my arguments for him being scum are mainly from Pine's participation, explained in 650, 654 and 656.

[StealthyNoodle]

If you're ever struggling, please feel free to ask me directly for help on anything. Even if you're scum.

Most important thing in any game as always, have fun!

This Town deserves to lose tbh.

I'm gonna put this on my fridge.

[StealthyNoodle]

Alas, there was no hope for your struggling students.

[StealthyNoodle]

Humble WhyMafia is too cozy. It takes a

good actor

to keep up this kind of play.

noodle's flashback

Forgive me, you will

Like yoda, talk I shall

Meesa sad now :/
Meesa tried

...
wait a minute

[StealthyNoodle]

...
Any Chewie-sounds now and I'll fix my readlist for sure.

[StealthyNoodle]

Unless a sad C-3PO that is
of the hook for now you are

[StealthyNoodle]

@chronicle even now, my gut is screaming that nancy's scum. I'm waiting for doc to claim before deadline.

[StealthyNoodle]

Loopdan edited 81, btw.

MiniDeathStar:

Please don't respond to violating posts in the game thread. Report them directly to me!

[StealthyNoodle]

VOTE: Drixx

L-1

@nancy-- Your unvote on Drixx makes no sense.

I unvoted Drixx to give him a chance to defend himself before lynch. I suppose nancy did the same.

[StealthyNoodle]

Is Drixx L-2 or L-1? How long until deadline? I'm on phone.

@nancy, whats about my townreads on loopdan then?

[StealthyNoodle]

If you have a townread on Loopdan, Noodle, I'd love to hear all of the stories about it.

Loopdan

provides theories of his own. I've rarely seen him take advantage of others' theories and reads. His scumreads and questions have mostly been directed at you, likely because he(as me and others) have seen you as scummy to the bone.

[StealthyNoodle]

@Stealthy
Please explain what unique theories Loopdan has brought XD

Most his theories are his own. Prove me wrong by showing me a bunch that aren't instead.

[StealthyNoodle]

I disagree with this categorization so much it makes me sick, but OK.

What do you mean you disagree with the categorization?

[StealthyNoodle]

The scumreads on me are ridiculous and I don't give a shit about them.

What world are you living in, nancy? One of the reason players suspect you, is because you're so mad defensive all the time. Attacking every hint of a read on you that isn't town.

[StealthyNoodle]

I mean I think that your interpretation of his ISO is super inaccurate.

Which parts of it is inaccurate? Everything? How are they inaccurate?

[StealthyNoodle]

I've barely attacked anyone all game

I said you're

attacking the reads

, not the players. It's like you don't allow anyone to be suspicious of you. Feel free to correct me by pointing to one scumread of you that you didn't try to rip asunder.

[StealthyNoodle]

Again, I wouldn't call questioning attacking.

Combined with the way you constantly ridicule scumreads on you, it obviously comes of as being

overly

defensive.

I don't question people's reads on other slots nearly as much because I think it's bad form when those slots should be doing it themselves and not having people butt in to do it for them.

Town-players are obviously great at making themselves more suspicious, so there's nothing wrong about providing objectivity to the matter. That goes for scum-

and

townreads.
More than often townies tend to be blind to reads that makes themselves town, thus end up getting lynched.

[StealthyNoodle]

@WhyMafia ISO means Isolation. Press "ISO" next to the post number to isolate all posts by the poster.

[StealthyNoodle]

Well then, I'll put my vote back on and go to sleep.
VOTE: Drixx

[StealthyNoodle]

Cya in the morning

Yep!

Also, one last scumread for Drixx:

Drixx

, like Pine, is an IC. I suppose he experience with these kind of situations.
He likely knows that putting up little resistance, stating his incapacity to defend Pine's actions, might make town doubt their lynch.
As replacement scum, this loss wouldn't be a huge, as he haven't invested a lot of time into it. I'd say he's taking a risk by not defending himself, but it's a valid strat. As town, wouldn't he at least try to interact more before his lynch?

[StealthyNoodle]

Cya in the morning

Yep!

Also, one last scumread for Drixx:

Drixx

, like Pine, is an IC. I suppose he has experience with these kind of situations.
He likely knows that putting up little resistance, stating his incapacity to defend Pine's actions, might make town doubt their lynch.
As replacement scum, this loss wouldn't be a huge, as he haven't invested a lot of time into it. I'd say he's taking a risk by not defending himself, but it's a valid strat.
As town, wouldn't he at least try to interact more before his lynch?

*Edit

[StealthyNoodle]

inb4 contradicting myself btw

[StealthyNoodle]

@nancy, blaming him for reading me with reverse psychology. I'm kinda doing the same to him.

[StealthyNoodle]

Morn

quote="In post 1302, nancy"]Why the fuck did you just hammer.

Mini is asleep right now thank goodness.[/quote]
This act is terrible. I want to lynch nancy so bad.

Also starting to suspect Drixx nancy as scumteam. You've soley been acting as his lawyer, making sure it looks like you didn't want him out for forced reasons.

[StealthyNoodle]

Morn

Why the fuck did you just hammer.

Mini is asleep right now thank goodness.

This act is terrible. I want to lynch nancy so bad.

Also starting to suspect Drixx nancy as scumteam. You've soley been acting as his lawyer, making sure it looks like you didn't want him out for forced reasons.

*Edit

[StealthyNoodle]

You assume Drixx is town based on me attacking you. Oh the stupidity.

[StealthyNoodle]

Nvm, suspecting Drixxnancy doesn't make sense after hammer went down.

[StealthyNoodle]

I still find it likely that doc is in play, not revealing his position. As Ive said, there are so many things about nancy that screams scum that I find it hard to put her as conf!town.

[StealthyNoodle]

*subtle victory dance*

Good morning then!

Well, if the doc is still out there, now would be the time to counterclaim:

Doing so guaratees a town win(and almost a perfect one at that):
the doc-claim is real, we lynch scum!nancy
the doc-claim is fake, we lynch town!nancy. Upon her flipping town, we'll lynch scum!doc.

There obviously won't be no fake-claims though.

Pretty sure, nancy is not scum though:

case 1:

scum!

not

nancy would likely shoot for tracker as there's no one around to protect him. Not doing so, would be a great risk to scum as they're the only one left.

case 2:

scum!nancy would've known doc is in play, thus take out anyone but the tracker.

case 3:

scum!nancy nokilling would look as if someone tried to take out her or tracker(case 1). This is risky play though, and less likely. She could do this to avoid case 2(which makes her almost certain scum).

case 4:
town!nancy fake-claimed BP to trick scum into shooting tracker, doc is still alive not counterclaiming. This is

highly unlikely

, as she'd risk the doc would reveal himself, thus getting both PRs killed.

footnote: I did enjoy that postmortem(pun not intended), last-gasp attempt to make the bus look real. Concidering it came arond

after

hammer went down, it pretty much cleared me more than it hurt me.

---

tl;dr
a doc-claim now would pretty much guarantee our win.

[StealthyNoodle]

Wait wait wait. My read is way off here.. Hang on, gonna correct. I have visitors, but I'll try to find time to be active today!

[StealthyNoodle]

Wait, why wasn't there a kill tonight? Either doc is here and protected someone, or they went for nancy(BP)? Why wouldn't they try to kill tracker, when they're the only one left?

[StealthyNoodle]

UNVOTE:

Okay, I was gambiting. I actually tracked Chronicle who went nowhere.

If he went for a nokill it wouldn't show, right?

[StealthyNoodle]

Possibilities here:
Since doc haven't claimed(guaranteed win, so

please claim if you are

), it's not nancy.
Also it's most likely a shot at BP, or a nokill as Chron mentioned. If it's a nokill from Chron, that would return nothing for Tracker (right?). Why in the world would scum not attempt to kill tracker. Anyone else being killed would suggest scum!nancy, but as long as doc doesn't claim, she's out of the question.

[StealthyNoodle]

@nancy Why was TesXX cleared again?

Pedit: @WhyMafia. Better to take that risk now, while there's like a 1/6 chance of being tracked. Tonight the chance is even higher.

[StealthyNoodle]

Does the track on me make me clear though with a no kill on our hands? I could be scum pulling a no kill, so it doesn't really clear me.

If he went for a nokill it wouldn't show, right?

If it's a nokill from Chron, that would return nothing for Tracker (right?).

Hmm I've mentioned this twice.

[StealthyNoodle]

Where art thou Loopdan? Come hither?

[StealthyNoodle]

I feel fine about Srceen and WhyMafia.

Gahh, where is l00p?

[StealthyNoodle]

Well then, I suppose one way to narrow down the possibilities would be to look at every read on Pine\Drixx, from every remaining player.
And sorry in advance, but I'm probably not even gonna be close to as active as I was on D1.

[StealthyNoodle]

Why would a VT claim BP though? Why would doc not counterclaim?

Last possibility is of course that nancy is doc, pretending to be BP. There wouldn't be no conflict, because she has the role that needs to CC.

[StealthyNoodle]

^Actually, I find this most likely. It would explain why she was okay with "sacrificing" the tracker. It would also explain the "no kill", which was probably a kill aimed towards the tracker. In that case, I'd say Chron is out of the question.

I suppose I might be giving away valuable information here. Is that considered badplay, or is it fine considering we're trying to narrow down the possibilities?

pedit:
Well, now that it's out there...

[StealthyNoodle]

Right, I'll calm my noodles then.

[StealthyNoodle]

^I'm trying really hard. halp?

[StealthyNoodle]

Hmm, well observed

[StealthyNoodle]

Sorry for site flaking. Some stuff came up and I'm going to have to be VLA until the 19th. If you'd prefer I replace out I'm fine with that.

I don't mind VLA. It's only 4 days. And we're Day 2 with one scum out.

[StealthyNoodle]

^For every replacement a bunch of information is lost. The player replacing, likely won't sit down and read through our 1600+ posts. Also, reads and contradictions won't be as effective as if the original player was still in the game. If he's only gonna be out for 3 days (even though it's usually frowned upon), I'm okay with it if that means he's gonna play for the rest of the game.

[StealthyNoodle]

What's notable here is when he was accused of defending Pine, he jumps to say that he was defended another slot as well.

I like this observation as well. Here's some further investigation.

Deerstalker On

Actually, I did take note of post 176 (which is his only defense of Cog, as mentioned in 463). And something was off about it: I remember being a bit annoyed because he pretty much spewed out the same non-sense as Chronicle:

Your vote is

wasted on a slot

that hasn't even

logged in since the game started

, and you voting him will not pop him an email telling him to check in on this game and post his thoughts.

And when he does finally catch up, he will post his thoughts accordingly. Your one vote doesn't do anything. It will not spur any sort of reaction, it does not give him any sort of incentive to pay more attention to this game, because he is not ignoring this game. Because he hasn't even logged in yet.

Your vote does not do anything. His inactivity thus far is not alignment indicative.

It doesn't seem like you're reading my posts at all. So let me rephrase:
If bjc0303 is lurking, he sees this. If there's more pressure and he's still lurking, there'll probably be a response as well. To explain further:

He doesn't have to be online to lurk.

I don't get why you keep pushing such an invalid argument.

Why are we debating his alignment when he's not even lurking - he hasn't

logged on since the game started

. This is

wasting time to find scum

, unless we're using this to gauge reactions.

But idk I'm bad at mafia

And that goes for you as well.

I've included WhyMafia's whole post 176 in this quote. Had to alter it in order to get my point across.

This was his

only defense

of bjc(the one Cog replaced), and it's pretty much Chron's words, rearranged.

[StealthyNoodle]

^There's also the "debating his alignment"-thing, which is also pretty similar to Chronicle's post(s).

[StealthyNoodle]

Well that sucks.

[StealthyNoodle]

I miss Loopdan...

[StealthyNoodle]

VOTE: WhyMafia

[StealthyNoodle]

VOTE: WhyMafia

How did I go from a town read to someone worth voting xd

You're right. Let me just
UNVOTE: WhyMafia
There

[StealthyNoodle]

Alisae, you doc? I want that perfect town win.

[StealthyNoodle]

Why did you vote me in the first place. To hurt my nonexistent feelings?

Just a little goof and a bit of a spoof.

Well I planned to vote you immediately after the post I made about you. But I wanted to give Alisae a chance to claim doc first. I guess I have to go over my townreads on you again, though.