Newbie 1765 | URW | Endgame

[TheDominator37]

VOTE: Dom
EARLY GAME WAGON WOOOO!!!!!

[TheDominator37]

The goal for day one is to create conversation. A self-vote doesn't really have the ability to do that. Which is why it's considered scummy to vote for yourself.

It seems to be working rn

[TheDominator37]

VOTE: superhans

Lickety seems very noob town to me.

[TheDominator37]

The goal for day one is to create conversation. A self-vote doesn't really have the ability to do that. Which is why it's considered scummy to vote for yourself.

It seems to be working rn

I don't like this attempt to take credit for starting conversation; it should be obvious that very little (if any at all) discussion is centering around your self-vote.

I also don't like the vote on Superhaus; seems like an easy vote to make with LQ backing you up.

Vote: TheDominator37

Then what started it if my wagon didn't?

[TheDominator37]

Personally in my opinion, the only right moment for lurker hunting is if they had contributed nothing at all and half of our given time has gone. I mean otherwise, hunting for lurkers is a very easy way of lynching players and if done right, can be an advantage to the scum more so than the town as the ratio of mafia to town is 2:7.

If I have solid townreads on three people and I lynch a lurker, I have a 40% chance of lynching scum. If I have solid townreads on 5 people and I lynch a lurker, I have a 66% chance of lynching scum. You point out that the odds are against us early but that shouldn't mean anything; when we lynch we aren't lynching randomly and waiting for information to fall into our lap is silly when there is no guarantee it will ever do so.

But there is still a chance that your "solid town read" can be scum right?

[TheDominator37]

So Nachos, how is it a good idea to start hunting for lurkers when 24 hours hasn't past, not giving the players enough time to post as they may have things going on in their lives or are simply asleep? Also for the others which had jumped the wagon on myself, explain to me what type of evidence are you trying to gather from this?

You keep framing the wagons like they have no purpose unless they are perfectly justified - nothing in mafia will be perfectly justified. Oftentimes you will catch scum for the wrong reasons. Content generation is about putting people in positions where they will have alignment-relevant reactions; maybe everyone votes you and you simply flake out (not alignment indicative), or maybe you get fired up and try to read the people voting you (what you did). I'm fine with giving people room as far as lynching is concerned, but I have no problems with pursuing a lead whenever and wherever I might find them.

Nacho, we've kinda moved on from discussing the Lovesick Wagon, as it wasn't really that fruitful.

This post doesn't really sit well. Almost halting town discussion.

[TheDominator37]

Nacho, we've kinda moved on from discussing the Lovesick Wagon, as it wasn't really that fruitful.

Why wasn't it fruitful?

Huge amounts of arguments in which Lovesick was ONLY commenting large amounts of defensive content, and not actually offering anything original at all.

Doesnt mean its not fruit full.

[TheDominator37]

@Nachomamma8, in answer to your questions on why isn't it fruitful to talk about the Lovesick Wagon and my reads on Lovesick.

Lovesick's first comment was:

ICs can be any alignment I believe, they're here to help the new, troubled players with the ways things work and etc however no more than that - correct me if I'm wrong though. Hopefully we have a spike of activity at one point otherwise this game may get difficult.

Calling for more activity, yet offering nothing herself to help initiate the activity. After the Lovesick wagon, she certainly provides content, but it the kind of content that clogs up your drains and makes sewege spill out of your toilet when you try and flush:

#113 Game theory & Defensive talk.
#131 Game theory.
#132 <-- After this I remove my vote on her for her scum readings on you (or so I thought)
#157 Buuut her next post actually takes back what I thought was a scum reading on you
Post 157 also contains this nice little passage which I have already commented on in #268
#160 Actually a scum read on me, which would be good, but I don't think contributes that much, as there is no examples, or further evidence.
#163 Game theory.
#165 Game theory.
#166 Game theory.
#173 Game theory.
#180 Game theory.
#207 Scum read on me, but also not very in depth. & Defensive
#211 Scum read on Nacho, but honestly its really not very deep.
#216 n/a
#223 Game theory.
#226 Game theory.
#229 Game theory.
#231 Defensive
#236 Game theory.
#237 Game theory.
#241 Game theory / Defensive (?)
#244 Good questions.
#248 n/a
#251 n/a
#261 n/a
#271 Scum read on me for being too jumpy, doesn't expand upon this. Has reads on Nacho, Connor and Rauth.
#272 Game theory.
#276 Defensive.

I whipped this list up quickly, and Game theory is a really really loose term, basically I used it to label her posts that didn't analyse other peoples comments, didn't ask other people questions or offer reads. If Lovesick implicitly mentioned someone as being scummy/towny/suspicious etc I put the scum read next to it.
You can see that most of the posts are on game theory.

Common Lovesick Game Theory Themes

By game theory I just mean discussions that are often imho not very constructive and look into the best way we should be playing the game.
Lovesick emphasises:

* Playing it slowly on other servers.
* Whether you should target multiple suspicious players at once
* Whether it is productive to target lurking players.

I basically disagree with most of what Lovesick believes. I think that early game lurk wagons are a good idea, Lovesick doesn't;
Lovesick is playing it far too safe for my liking, and even though she does make scum reads, they are all 'on the fence' scum reads, like Superhans you're suspious for x reason, but I need more evidence.
If Lovesick thinks I'm suspicious she should interrogate me, or provide quotes as evidence or offer examples of my "jumpy behaviour".

tldr

I think that Lovesick is town, but is offering virtually nothing of value to the conversation. I think she is town just because of how defensive she became when we were on the Lovesick-is-a-lurker wagon.

I thought that she had made a scum read on you in post 132, but when then takes it back, saying it wasn't a serious suspicion.

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Good point. I've got mixed feelints on hans so null for me.

[TheDominator37]

So what I get from the past few posts is that LQ votes based on his gut and not specific reasons. Which would make it extremely difficult for him to answer my question.

UNVOTE:

I still don't know for sure if you're town, LQ, but I noticed something a bit more disconcerting.

VOTE: TheDominator37

Somehow you've gotten away with three posts, two of which were votes. One of those votes was an RVS self-vote, and the other was an unexplained vote for Superhans. An explanation would be more than appropriate.

The self vote was RVS and the hans vote was a pressure vote

[TheDominator37]

The goal for day one is to create conversation. A self-vote doesn't really have the ability to do that. Which is why it's considered scummy to vote for yourself.

It seems to be working rn

I don't like this attempt to take credit for starting conversation; it should be obvious that very little (if any at all) discussion is centering around your self-vote.

I also don't like the vote on Superhaus; seems like an easy vote to make with LQ backing you up.

Vote: TheDominator37

Then what started it if my wagon didn't?

Are you kidding me? I thought TheDom at least made 2 more posts, but I guess I read wrong.
TheDom is either a horrible town player or scum.

ILYT

[TheDominator37]

The goal for day one is to create conversation. A self-vote doesn't really have the ability to do that. Which is why it's considered scummy to vote for yourself.

It seems to be working rn

I don't like this attempt to take credit for starting conversation; it should be obvious that very little (if any at all) discussion is centering around your self-vote.

I also don't like the vote on Superhaus; seems like an easy vote to make with LQ backing you up.

Vote: TheDominator37

Then what started it if my wagon didn't?

Are you kidding me? I thought TheDom at least made 2 more posts, but I guess I read wrong.
TheDom is either a horrible town player or scum.

So quick to judge the wrong things...

Yes, Dom has been sub par so far. But yes, I think he might pick his play up at some point. He is playing his game right now, let him do his thing (At least I will be pressuring him vicariously through other people, watching and waiting).
No, Dom is not either a horrible Town player or Scum. Not necessarily at least.

Awww I love you as well

[TheDominator37]

UNVOTE: TheDominator37
VOTE: Nachomamma8
I think it's time we got some scum.

A little hypocritical naked voting nacho isnt it?

[TheDominator37]

Omg lovestick its the dominator not denominator

[TheDominator37]

Superhans seems noob town to me. My explanation for us being polite with each other is that we're both new players and realize that about each other.

Yeah if han is scum we're lynchng rauth and vice versa

[TheDominator37]

The goal for day one is to create conversation. A self-vote doesn't really have the ability to do that. Which is why it's considered scummy to vote for yourself.

It seems to be working rn

I don't like this attempt to take credit for starting conversation; it should be obvious that very little (if any at all) discussion is centering around your self-vote.

I also don't like the vote on Superhaus; seems like an easy vote to make with LQ backing you up.

Vote: TheDominator37

Then what started it if my wagon didn't?

LQ's 6 created more meaningful conversation than your self-vote did.

I disagree. My vote and more people talling about it and had more of a lasting impact

[TheDominator37]

Connor, why do you think that Dom is a bad line of pursuit? So far, the only contribution he's managed to make is attempting to take credit for starting the game, which doesn't really seem like a town mindset to me.

It seems like you are trying to discredit me and I don't know why

[TheDominator37]

Nacho why the push for my lynch? You misrepped connor to try and get him to join me.

[TheDominator37]

I'm not scum though. Though the other Power role could probably realize something I've left out and hinted at a few times.

Is this a PR claim?

[TheDominator37]

Oh, sorry, forgot to add this:

That's L-2

I am now inclined to vote Dom. I don;t know what his game is - it just seems nuts either as town or a scum.

I will not put him on L-1 though until it has been discussed more. I am going out in 30 mins and won't be back for the rest of the evening

I assume that Dom will now not be replaced as he has posted - if not then I would agree with a lynch as he is about as much use as a chocolate teapot.

But a chocolate teapot is usefull

[TheDominator37]

@Dom can you answer my question from 127,
"can you explain why you voted for me?"

What do you mean by pressure vote? Can you elaborate.
What results did this pressure vote yield, e.g. any reads as a result?

I wasn't really active enough to pursue it correctly but if anything I thought you were a little defensive. Your slot is too confusing though I'm getting town and scum vibes from you so null

[TheDominator37]

Nacho why the push for my lynch? You misrepped connor to try and get him to join me.

Misrepped? I'm not familiar with that term.

Misrepresented- when someone says one thing and another person distorts that to acheive a goal. In our case you had your readlist and nacho said that you should vote for me because I was your biggest scum read.

[TheDominator37]

ConnorJC- Sheeps nacho way to much for my liking but the way he's being manipulated by nacho makes me think xthat if nacho is scum than connor is town. So overall slight town lean
Rautherdir- I'm still confused whether or not it was PR claim so idk.
toblerone187- Kind of mixing in with the crowd but has mae a few good points. Town
Superhans- Getting mixed feelings so null but most likely is the same allignment as rauth
Lovesick- I little to much IIOA for me. Slight scum lean
FancyPants- A little lurky at the start (heh) but had a nice sentrance slight town lean
LicketyQuickety- Can not ever find scum intentions in his posts. Moves town discussion along. Town
TheDominator37- My PM is green so Town
Nachomamma8- Is tunneling me and is manipulating others into voting me. Scum

VOTE: nacho

[TheDominator37]

A chocolate teapot is good for iced tea

[TheDominator37]

Err... not its not? Its based on instinct which is pretty much as basic as it gets?

And instinct of a player who is new to playing scum isn't to claim PR immediately.
When you first started playing, your instinct when you were overwhelmed by pressure was to disappear completely; this is a far more typical reaction than "claiming PR out of the blue". Off the top of my head, I can remember about 2 extremely premature claims (both VT claims, both town); extremely premature claims are pretty rare in the first place and the risk that the move carries for a scum player,

especially

for a PR claim, makes it that much more unlikely that it's coming from scum.

A site I used to play on had only role madness and no duplicate roles so the first people to claim were almost confirmed town. I could see someone thinking ms is the same and coming out with a PR claim.

[TheDominator37]

AND, oh baby did you see that read I gave on Dom. That was one of the sickest Town reads I have ever given on someone.

I don't really see a town motive in this post :/

[TheDominator37]

Question addressed to both LQ and TheDominator.

You're both voting for Nacho (on board a Nacho Wagon so to speak) but you are both basing your votes on completely separate lines of logic.

What do you think of each other's line of logic? LQ do you agree with Dom's reasoning, Dom do you agree with LQs reasoning?

The enemy of my enemy is my friend so yes

[TheDominator37]

But there is still a chance that your "solid town read" can be scum right?

Yes.
What does this have to do with anything?

Yeah if han is scum we're lynchng rauth and vice versa

Why?

I disagree. My vote and more people talling about it and had more of a lasting impact

I disagree, but I'm not particularly interesting in this point because I don't think it's that meaningful. Why bring it up? Why was it when you came into the thread in 110 that you felt that the most important thing for you to do was to pat yourself on the back for generating discussion? What was the lasting impact that you believed that it created?

It seems like you are trying to discredit me and I don't know why

I'm scumreading you. I don't think that when you post, you're doing so because you want to find and lynch scum. I aim to make it as transparent as possible so that if I'm wrong, people can correct me, and if I'm right, you can get lynched. Was there some huge contribution that you made at that point that I unfairly missed?

Nacho why the push for my lynch? You misrepped connor to try and get him to join me.

I didn't misrep connor; I was unfamiliar with Connor's top suspect at that point because I wasn't fully caught up.

Nachomamma. You've left a few questions unanswered. I'd be on the fence regarding you otherwise.

What questions have I left unanswered?
Why is Dominator almost a townread for you; what has he contributed that you agree with or think comes from a town mindset?

-You assumed in that post that if a person is a solid town read tgat are for sure town.
-their interactions between each other are weird like they were town reading each ther out of the gate. I guess that doesnt really matter anymore because he is conf town.
-It lasted a few pages and then the game was off but like you said this is irrelevant.
-Sure but I have been hunting today and I couldnt in the past because was out of town.
-But still why didn't you read the thread before pushing for my lynch?

[TheDominator37]

41 Scum -

ConnorJC

61 Town -

LQ

88 Town -

ConnorJC

94 Neutral -

Lovesick

187 Town -

Superhans

214 Read on

Lovesick

295 Explaining town read on

ConnorJC

317 Townjk -

Superhans

560 Scum -

TheDenominator

idk if this will be that helpful, I started making it before 886.

Pls. Make it stop

[TheDominator37]

-But you said just a second ago they could be scum
-He claimed PR and I'm willing to assume he is telling the truth
-But you're not taking the present into account though. You are holding onto a vote from 25 pages ago and acting like nothing said in there matters

[TheDominator37]

Funny that Dom and I joined 4 days apart and yet we don't run into each other until over and year and a half later in a newbie game.

I didnt actually join a game until that summer so

[TheDominator37]

This is very interesting. I feel there's at least 1 scum in Nacho/TheDom/LQ, but I don't know who it is.

Dom and I are the Scum team.

Shhhhhh dont tell them

[TheDominator37]

Ok, so I'm going to guess either Nacho or TheDom are mafia, with a high likelihood that LQ is scum if TheDom is.

@TheDom, you haven't really addressed this: What was the purpose of your extended lurking?

I was at two Christmas parties out of town and then when I tried to catch up I fell asleep and forgot about his thread

[TheDominator37]

I'm bored of this game tbh. Ill catch up later