micro theme 1093: u-pic [game over]

[Aureal]

[Aureal]

So, uh. If I VOTE: Theta Alpine does it take away HP?

[Aureal]

this game will have seven apple-aligned players and two orange-aligned players.

this phrasing does not preclude there being more players i am realizing
huh

Yeah but apparently the other one's existence doesn't count towards the number needed for majority since it's at 5/10 rather than 6.

[Aureal]

Oh wait, maybe it's because of your HP thing? I guess you sort of exist outside the votecount.

Uh, do you get to vote even though you can't be voted?

[Aureal]

Wesley on a scale of 1 to 10, are you played by another player here and/or the mod?

that seems more like a yes/no question

Yeah, how dare you try to trip up our not at all suspicious pile of skulls with weird questioning? VOTE: IceDragon70

[Aureal]

Like this could possibly be a boss fight when she only has 100HP, pfft.

HEAL: Theta

[Aureal]

I think based on everyone in the game appearing in the votecount, everyone has a vote.

It is more likely that either there is a role making the number to eliminate lower, or something is making us perceive it as such. The rules say a majority is needed for an execution but the votecounts talk about chomping on dust

Are you saying you think the actual number for an elimination is different and the five to chomp dust is a misdirection? That's just Skygazer's flavor, she likes coming up with all sorts of weird ideas there.

[Aureal]

Maybe it changes every day or something?

[Aureal]

BTW, how exactly does one "kabout" and why?

[Aureal]

the last assessment was made today tho

Oh, good point, it's only been about 20 hours, not a whole 24. You're clearly paying more attention than me!

BTW, how exactly does one "kabout" and why?

if i explained i dont think you'd understand

HURT: kabouter wesley

[Aureal]

Darn it, wesley is still posting. I was hoping that hurt would make it vanish in a puff of logic.

[Aureal]

i mean if i had to guess it is a town being able to provide a poe without saying so themselves
or scum being able to provide a poe attempting to mimic the first
or the mod just putting out a list of people for reasons

number three being the only one where i would expect to see you on it

Yeah, who knows if it's someone specifically doing it, I wouldn't rule out it being randomized somehow yet.

[Aureal]

i personally consider "fucking eldritch horror who Should Not Be" to be a compliment, but to each their own

I can hardly think of a higher compliment! Don't waste them on wesley.

[Aureal]

i mean if i had to guess it is a town being able to provide a poe without saying so themselves
or scum being able to provide a poe attempting to mimic the first
or the mod just putting out a list of people for reasons

number three being the only one where i would expect to see you on it

Yeah, who knows if it's someone specifically doing it, I wouldn't rule out it being randomized somehow yet.

I am possibly ruling out it being randomized somehow yet.

[Aureal]

I don't know if that or wesley's avatar is more disturbing.

[Aureal]

This puts a bad taste in my mouth because I feel like this both rewards

Wheme

for acting rashly and that these townreads are likely not all uninformed.

I disagree because:
1. A read is not a "reward", it's what I think about a person. This is like saying that if somebody who's known for high-efforting as scum plays a low-effort game I'm "rewarding" them for low effort by townreading them. It's silly.

Yeah, but sometimes people are going to feel like playing in that 'silly' way anyway, like they expect to be able to bend others' playstyle to their liking through rewards and punishments in their reads.

(Yeah, I'm still grumpy about T-Bone voting me in ELO instead of scumDrew as punishment for suspecting him as the partner due to him screwing around all day talking about voting Save The Dragons for not doing much of anything despite T-Bone having already called Drew confirmed scum. )

[Aureal]

come on, vote me again and well have a wagon to talk about

Uh, sure?

VOTE: Taly

[Aureal]

come on, vote me again and well have a wagon to talk about

Uh, sure?

VOTE: Taly

*checks watch sadly* I was promised a wagon to talk about!

[Aureal]

i suppose if we had to grasp at straws that thats a good one because oranges are, well, orange, and apples are many colors. we happen to all be green ones however so it feels like a weird comparison but its fine i think

You're lying, some of you are oranges and I think you're an orange apple.

[Aureal]

The best way to read Wheme is that his scumgame is extremely deliberate and he does things he believes will advance his win condition. Town wheme does whatever he wants to and takes whatever action he thinks is correct, but is a lot easier to sway and more amenable to engage with logical arguments. On a really surface level, scum!Wheme might see an argument that conflicts with what he is saying or doing, and acknowledge it but just say nah I don't agree. Town!Wheme will see the same argument, and even if he disagrees I think he acknowledges the argument in some light at least.
On a more advanced level, Whemestar is essentially a prime example of where my main townhunting methodology works best because in psychological terms, when town!wheme gives up some ground in an argument it is almost always informational and not normative influence that is the cause. I've played a lot of games with Wheme at this point so I've got a lot of familiarity there, and then I also think he's probably one of the more transparent players when you're looking at this anyway.

Which posts of WhemeStar's did you read as indicating he was actually engaging with your arguments on more than a surface level?

[Aureal]

Shit's really not moving, huh

VOTE: Meuh

Any particular reason behind that vote?

[Aureal]

dafuq

Dragon is probably town

He's always like this

[Aureal]

This has got to be the shittiest flashwagon ever

On a holiday weekend no less

[Aureal]

Oh... hmmmmm, I wonder... I didn't even look at who was on this wagon yet, now I seeeeeee...

[Aureal]

This really is a funny game

[Aureal]

what

Surprised?

[Aureal]

It's very clearly not twilight, Taly


Actually, I think this particular use of the chaos is anti-town so I'm just gonna out my theory without being even remotely cryptic


The rules set out that there are 7 town players and 2 scum players. I think Kabouter Wesley is a puppet account controlled by one of the players in this game. I expected them to be more of a double voter if this was revealed but if they can't even vote then they are probably just a chaos gremlin

Yes, I think that's pretty clearly the obvious answer. This is exactly the effect I was expecting when wesley ended up on what's supposedly a majority vote.

[Aureal]

But really, turboyeeting Dragon is a huge mistake, if any of you were seriously trying. The guy regularly gets scumread early on in the game, but often becomes obvtown before long.

[Aureal]

this is my first instance with

dragon

what about their posts are likely to be town that is wrongly scumread versus actual scum?

What about his posts seems to be making you think he's likely to be scum? He's acting the same as any other time I've seen him from what I can tell.

[Aureal]

OK, more properly reading those flash wagon pages and found it.

dragons

progressions were inconsistent and the emotion in their posts read as false, they also didnt have any detailed opinions on the game and i felt like their questions would be ones id fake as scum to keep below radar

Hoo boy. You really haven't played with him before because this really does seem to just be describing his play style. I assume the "emotion" you refer to is his energetic way of engaging with things. His inconsistency definitely can (frustratingly) show up as town when he's not got a lot of time and isn't even reading properly. I don't know who

has

detailed opinions on this game yet other than on the mechanics, it's basically been a lot of mechanics discussion and not much else up until now.

[Aureal]

if this thread is as null as some people elude then a good way to relief that is mod confirmation of a slots alignment

And that seems rather backwards to me. Things are pretty null because of a dearth of alignment-related interactions. What good does confirming a slot's alignment do without much interaction about it?

[Aureal]

this felt a bit intense emotion relative to the lack of knowledge we had on the setup

Disproportionately intense emotion to fairly mundane things is sorta his thing, yes. Take a look at a few of his early game ISOs:
viewtopic.php?sid=&f=23&t=91827&user_select%5B%5D=37246
viewtopic.php?sid=&f=51&t=90809&user_select%5B%5D=37033
viewtopic.php?sid=&f=11&t=90539&user_select%5B%5D=36973

How about I get Theta down to 10 and then I’ll stop

I don't trust your ability to count and think you or someone else would probably just tip Theta over the edge at some point when nobody is looking

Didn't you say you wanted to RVS or something?

VOTE: Taly for bianco's VC thing

this doesnt really align with what is said later

I don't really follow what you mean, and expecting Dragon to have perfectly sensible and consistent thoughts always is a recipe for frustration. I've been there.

I disagree because:
1. A read is not a "reward", it's what I think about a person. This is like saying that if somebody who's known for high-efforting as scum plays a low-effort game I'm "rewarding" them for low effort by townreading them. It's silly.
2. Why do you think it's informed? I mean I don't have meta on scum!Wheme so maybe I'm wrong, but to me it seems very unlikely that scum!them would act with such rash / goofy behavior in a way that draws a lot of attention. How is that not a valid read?

i found 2 to be rhetorical on a second glance but i could see an alternative perspective

Not sure what you think is rhetorical, or why it'd be problematic if it was.

The probelm I have is with Taly not answering it at all and also not really responding to what bianco said.

this felt like an overexplanation

This feels like nitpicking his posting style.

VOTE: Dragon

The probelm I have is with Taly not answering it at all and also not really responding to what bianco said.

Alright I will do some ISO job to see if I find anything scummy

Didn't you already find something scummy

I honestly kinda forgot about that

But yeah I should probably pressure that

Oh look I'm already voting Taly

this was after my response to his prompt, which is the main ping i had with this slot

i also tend to scumread promises that arent kept

What promises are you referring to here? He did start looking at ISOs. And what exactly 'pinged' you? That he apparently didn't acknowledge a response from you?

[Aureal]

I have skimmed backwards to about page 8 or nine.

What is this game Sky? Lol

I was gonna ask who Wesley is as well, but seems like it is a mystery to all.

Also, Aureal will hopefully get a chuckle out of hard defending mybslot without even knowing it lol.

(Though I do find it odd that she was so greatly defending Ice, but I don't think I could scum doing that unless they really really want the town cred......plus seems kinda par for the course on how she acts when fired up town).

So far that is my only real read, but still at work so will catch up more later on.

Yeah, thinking Dragon was getting turboyeeted based on vague "he feels weird" suspicion was rather alarming since he normally comes off that way early on. He's certainly capable of putting on a strong showing once things get past there so he's like, the last person who should be getting a swift boot.

(Although personally I feel better about my chances of reading you accurately, can't count on thinking the same thoughts as him all the time like I needed to finally townread him last time )

[Aureal]

I don't understand why are we just assuming that Drew is condemned over the much simpler explanation that some effect just prevented his wagon from being a majority.

Because some people don't care to think about mechanics I guess?

Also someone having a vote weight <1 would explain the 5/10 thing.

VOTE: wesley

Why vote wesley?

[Aureal]

aureal

is strong on

dragon/drew

slot being town here

To be more precise, I'm strong on it being a terrible idea to turboyeet the slot halfway through day one. I don't have a super strong read anywhere yet, though I do get some town vibes making it even more likely than the default 3-1 odds of being town.

[Aureal]

Also I assume I wouldn't know if I was loved, right?

I feel like you

typically

would be told about such a thing. This is obviously a quite bastard game so I wouldn't lay money on it, but I

really

do not think that is the explanation for what's going on here and find the way some people are trying to find alternate explanations other than the obvious one to be

quite

peculiar.

[Aureal]

... and I find the way you are declaring the "delayed execution" theory the

obvious

to be quite peculiar. To me the "someone is voteless" theory is much more credible.

Uh, I think you need to double check who's pushing the weird theories that do not involve Wesley being a sham without a vote, because they sure are not coming from me.

Look, I'm lazy, and don't see any appealing reason not to just cut the very obvious gordian knot in the room.

Do you need an appealing reason to not vote for no elimination?

[Aureal]

dafuq

Dragon is probably town

He's always like this

Ok, I guess I should have just read a few more posts haha.

Aureal, did you think Dragons was limmed at this point?

Yeah, I was playing Valheim for a while then looked in to see a bunch of posts and people going "let's just flip Dragon" "ok" so I went "?!?!?!?" and skimmed quickly to the end to see wtf was going on now. It wasn't until the announcement of the prod on Meuh came in my pedit that I started twigging to it not actually being twilight. Which was exactly what I'd been expecting if wesley ended up on a 'majority' wagon, I just hadn't registered that one of the votes came from that slot.

[Aureal]

do i wanna wagon

bianco

or

hpe

I don't wanna do Bianco, but I definitely could do Hpe

Why?

[Aureal]

That seems to be par for the course this game- apart from the flash wagon there hasn't really been much in the way of people expressing scumreads. That's a little worrying, combined with how there's not been anything else in the way of real wagons either.

VOTE: HPE

[Aureal]

Like usually I can feel like ppl are obv town and I was thinking princess was earlier when I was doing my hurting theta thing but idk everyoen is meh

So you were just doing that as a reaction test?

[Aureal]

I assume referring to me as bitch was the grievous misspelling?

Now I do think it was funny, initially I was like wtf did I do

I am so lost.

[Aureal]

I assume referring to me as bitch was the grievous misspelling?

Now I do think it was funny, initially I was like wtf did I do

I am so lost.

do i wanna wagon

bianco

or

hpe

I don't wanna do Bianco, but I definitely could do Hpe

Why?

Based it off of the votes on the Dragon flash wagon.

I will say I feel more strongly of Bianco as town than Hpe as scum.

bitch said fair enough and then scumcases for me it...

A poorly placed typo by HPE

OK I wasn't

that

lost. . I just have no idea how there's a typo or how you decided that it was given that there was no correction given.

[Aureal]

Like usually I can feel like ppl are obv town and I was thinking princess was earlier when I was doing my hurting theta thing but idk everyoen is meh

So you were just doing that as a reaction test?

Oh I glossed over this, don't think I skimmed far enough back to see that it was When who hurt Theta.

Why would you hurt her, if you thought she was obv town?

Pretty sure that refers to him thinking HPE was obvtown for trying to stop him.

[Aureal]

Can you elaborate on the thought process that led you to thinking that someone resisting your effort was obvtown, than?

[Aureal]

Real threat assetment board this time, still can't read its intent.

Really?

not voting

(4) - Theta Alpine, Taly, Doctor Drew, HighPrincessErinys

mod notes:

order threat assessment board

#1 --> Theta Alpine
#2 --> Taly
#3 --> Doctor Drew
#4 --> HighPrincessErinys

Hmmmmmmm

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

I feel good about whoever's setting this, I also think it's very threatening that so many people have not bothered to vote.

[Aureal]

VOTE: Taly

Of the wagon, there's me, HPE who is not unlikely to be town off of the TA thing, wesley that, well I still want out but I'll give you it's probably not a tenth orange player, so it would remain jj and Taly. Now jj is also in the TA thing, thou notably entered it last, and at that point TA would probably not actually have done it if left to her devices anyway, so that's not enough for me to pluck him out of this semi-poe

Can't even parse this. If I assume "the TA thing" is Wheme hurting her and "TA would probably not actually have done it" means "TA probably wouldn't have actually died" it's going out of the way to keep jjh in the pool while saying nothing about Taly, which is who bianco votes here.

VOTE: biancospino

[Aureal]

Darn it, I knew I should've moved my vote earlier, I could've been the power townie.

[Aureal]

Well I like my theory better but I don't see why that one must be bunk.

More importantly...

WHY AREN'T YOU VOTING

WHAT ARE YOU GUYS DOING

DEADLINE IS IN NINE HOURS

[Aureal]

bianco felt town though guh
like their latest theory is a bit hard to understand but that does not feel alignment indicative

THEN WHY DON'T YOU VOTE SOMEONE ELSE @_@

[Aureal]

I don't get what there is to parse here, HPE (an myself) had already stepped in at the point where jj enetered the frey so clearly by that point Wheme was already not going to end up going all the way.
And I'm not voting jj, so clearly I'm placing him at the bottom of that poe anyway

Yeah that's what I assume you meant but it's not what the words said. And why Taly over jjh?

VOTE: HPE

[Aureal]

VOTE: jjh927

I'm still not really sure wh everyone seems to want to focus on the Dragon wagon but w/e

[Aureal]

if we are in that world then uh

that would probably also be the world where dragons/drew is scum though
i am not really sure there are two other people off that wagon that could be scum together without involving dragons/drew as one of them

If there was ever a wagon that probably isn't going to break nicely into whatever split of where scum are likely positioned, I'd say it's that wagon. It came about in the course of an hour, I think it's more a matter of who was paying attention at the relevant time.

And I could totally envision like, a Meuh/WhemeStar team. This gamestate is freaking weird with how dead wagons have been. This suggests to me that scum are fine with no pressure and it all coming down to a last minute rush. Maybe they're just too lurky to care, or maybe they feel well positioned/confident enough to get out of trouble if things start to coalesce on them.

[Aureal]

i kind of want to say that if dragons is scum their partner might actually be hpe

This is a thought which has also occurred to me.

[Aureal]

so can you answer my question on why

jjh

is scum?

Why do you think jjh is town?

wesley i have mechanical reasons to think you are not scum and yet you are challenging my self control to not vote you

mindmeld

Really? I think this is hilarious.

I guess you guys just aren't as convinced about what wesley's existence here means as I am.

VOTE: WhemeStar

[Aureal]

You think Theta is the one who doesn't have a vote? You realize she's voting you right?

[Aureal]

What exactly does 'fucking up the vote counts' refer to then? Having the bar only be at 5 despite allegedly there being ten players?

[Aureal]

Why would the weirdness apply when IceDragon70 got to five votes but not you?

[Aureal]

Yeah, theoretically we might not actually be in twilight yet. I don't expect we aren't and neither does Wheme, but he's got a very different idea of what caused a lack of twilight before apparently. So I don't know why he expects it now.

[Aureal]

Why would the weirdness apply when IceDragon70 got to five votes but not you?

Idk what this means

Dragon hit five votes. It didn't end the day. You hit five votes. Why do you expect day to end now?

[Aureal]

Why would the weirdness apply when IceDragon70 got to five votes but not you?

Idk what this means

Dragon hit five votes. It didn't end the day. You hit five votes. Why do you expect day to end now?

Definitely feels like Wheme is playing dumb here

After Weird Dreams I don't even know what to think of this, other than frustration ._.

[Aureal]

Hmmm

So Drew, tell me more about why you thought Wheme was being coached to lurk and not fight his elimination?

[Aureal]

Hmmm

So Drew, tell me more about why you thought Wheme was being coached to lurk and not fight his elimination?

Just seemed like he was too ok with his lim, like I could see a buddy in that situation telling him to just act like you have no idea what is going on and don't fight.

But honestly, started to feel like he was being coached as I questioned him a bit about not having any reads at all despite what has transpired.

What parts seemed coached, and what questioning are you talking about? From what I can see, you asked him one thing, and he didn't even reply to it. And what made you think he was okay with being the lim when almost all the votes came on him at once, without him posting in between? Wheme was at one vote then didn't post again until he was at four.

[Aureal]

Oh we flashwagoned like half the game, it was great(?!)

[Aureal]

well

i mean

i have a theory as to that actually
i have a suspicion that anyone not on the board requires an extra vote to eliminate

I... suppose it's possible but I don't see much reason to think that. I've been thinking maybe it's a list for a compulsive role to act on, and it gets posted publically because why not?

[Aureal]

i still want to launch

biancospino

into space

Why? I know you've said you're not really into mech but Theta and I both seem to think bianco's power is pretty pro-town. Doesn't feel like something likely to be given to a scum role.

[Aureal]

Hmmm

So Drew, tell me more about why you thought Wheme was being coached to lurk and not fight his elimination?

Just seemed like he was too ok with his lim, like I could see a buddy in that situation telling him to just act like you have no idea what is going on and don't fight.

But honestly, started to feel like he was being coached as I questioned him a bit about not having any reads at all despite what has transpired.

I might have been projecting how I would have handled things though heh.

Pre Edit: Theta, do you think this is something we legit should pay attention to? I have been kinda ignoring it so far

this feels too specific a reason to come from scum at the velocity of the wagon

I think Drew

needs

to pull out 'specific reason' here to have any chance of not throwing giant red flags all over the place here. So no, I don't agree with you there. This very much reads like an excuse to me because Drew has good reason to think I'm going to suspect him for this. Drew and I have played with Wheme before, in Weird Dreams which I referenced earlier. Guess who got voted out day one after doing very little and even saying a lim on him wouldn't be bad? Guess who fought tooth and nail against the limbait-Wheme wagon? I'm finding it hard to reconcile Drew's readiness to yeet Wheme here with his contempt for such things elsewhere. What was so different about Wheme here, Drew?

[Aureal]

Why do you think jjh is town?

namely read accuracy that i dont think is faked

I'm confused. What do you mean by 'read accuracy'? Having good reasons for reads?

[Aureal]

Hmmm

So Drew, tell me more about why you thought Wheme was being coached to lurk and not fight his elimination?

Just seemed like he was too ok with his lim, like I could see a buddy in that situation telling him to just act like you have no idea what is going on and don't fight.

But honestly, started to feel like he was being coached as I questioned him a bit about not having any reads at all despite what has transpired.

I might have been projecting how I would have handled things though heh.

Pre Edit: Theta, do you think this is something we legit should pay attention to? I have been kinda ignoring it so far

this feels too specific a reason to come from scum at the velocity of the wagon

I think Drew

needs

to pull out 'specific reason' here to have any chance of not throwing giant red flags all over the place here. So no, I don't agree with you there. This very much reads like an excuse to me because Drew has good reason to think I'm going to suspect him for this. Drew and I have played with Wheme before, in Weird Dreams which I referenced earlier. Guess who got voted out day one after doing very little and even saying a lim on him wouldn't be bad? Guess who fought tooth and nail against the limbait-Wheme wagon? I'm finding it hard to reconcile Drew's readiness to yeet Wheme here with his contempt for such things elsewhere. What was so different about Wheme here, Drew?

I have played with Wheme more than just Weird Dreams, and I have seem him much more engaged as town then here(admittedly I don't remember much of Weird Dreams outside of me saving Python and killing scumTitus at the same time lol). It wasn't until this moment that I remember him as the D1 lim there until you brought it up.

If memory serves me correctly, I have seen Wheme be very blase as scum in Pokemon? I could be misremembering that, but the point being, Weird Dreams had no factor in my read of Wheme here.

I already explained in detail why I thought they were scum here, if you don't like the reasoning behind, so be it......you do you. It was few hours until deadline and someone I had already voiced concern with was the leading wagon(wheme) and I didn't want one of my top town reads(Bianco) limmed, and to a lesser extent jjh or Taly limmed(over wheme least). Maybe I talked myself into it a bit too much, if I am gonna be self critical......maybe I justified it in my head, but he seemed to fit the pieces of a good scum lim for D1.

Pokemon huh? OK taking a look...

Gosh, he was so much more engaged there. Just looking at the first 24 hours of his posting there, I feel he was doing way more in that time than he did all game here. Or maybe even here plus Weird Dreams, though he did start getting involved while being wagoned right at the end in that one.

I'm still not getting how this makes you come down on the side of voting a lurker day one when the other wagon was also someone you'd expressed suspicion towards.

[Aureal]

Wheme and jjh were both at 3 when you popped in with a vote though?

Do you have any examples of town games where you voted a lurker at deadline?

[Aureal]

OK, I guess I wasn't paying that much attention to where the other votes were, I'll grant you that.

But really, when have I ever tunneled you?

Also, why did you not vote for so long? It's kinda weirding me out how several people expressed suspicion of HPE but I was the only one who actually voted there.

[Aureal]

And yes Drew, I definitely remember that you despise voting out lurkers day one.

Spoiler:

So we are limming a lurker at deadline?

If they flip town there are definitely some people who need to be power limmed tomorrow

So we are limming a lurker at deadline?

If they flip town there are definitely some people who need to be power limmed tomorrow

Zero percent chance I make this post as scum.....full stop.

If I were scum and KKFC is town, I would just let the wagon go through, probably even join it.

If they were scum, as I said, I have no issue with bussing and also probably would just join the wagon.

And I asked Snivy why they haven't responded to me since they said my posts have been awful.....with NO evidence to back it up......and even now still refuses to show examples of my 'awful' posting.

I would prefer Aureal or Snivy......if people are focused on limming a lurker then go after NM, at least a wildcard is gone......or like I said Enchant.

LIMMING A LURKER MAKES IT EASIER FOR SCUM TO HIND BEHIND AND TAKE NO RESPONSIBILITY FOR THE MIS LIM.

And if they are scum, offers little info on other scum.

I will stand behind this every single game I play.

Would you consider Aureal or Snivy lurkers

No.....I can at least remember posts they have made

Would you consider Aureal or Snivy lurkers

And they offer some info depending on the flip.

Snivy I am just thinking is obvScum here though

Meh, if anything I think that post, if Drew's scum, would quite possibly be him trying to intimidate people into not voting his partner KKFC. He did something of the sort when I was sussing him in ELO last time, trying to scare me off of voting him. But I'm still just not really feeling it. And I don't think a Not_Mafia wagon is suddenly happening here but I'll be around at deadline if you wanna prove me wrong.

VOTE: KatyKimFanClub

I intimidated to get votes off me......I don't try to save a buddy like that.

But fine, if it is either me or KKFC....

VOTE: KKFC

I feel dirty lol

You seem to be trying to define 'lurker' more narrowly here than you did in that game, seeing as you called Enchant a lurker there, even though he was posting regularly and had plenty of reads (just expressed entirely in emoji). Then again you did seem more open to that tier of 'lurker' elimination so maybe your stance isn't as hardline as it initially appears.

This isn't the only concern that's jumping out at me about you, though it did catalyze other stuff. You're definitely taking a different tone talking to me than I usually feel. Maybe it's because you're actually townreading me for once? Or maybe it's because you're trying to pocket me. That makes me worry more about this comment:

Also, Aureal will hopefully get a chuckle out of hard defending mybslot without even knowing it lol.

...okay, I just now realize that you probably mean that as me defending you without knowing it was going to end up being you specifically (since you apparently think

I

tunnel

you

, Mr. In The Lead For Day One Aureal Miseliminations? ) I've been squinting at that for a while thinking it was saying I don't know your alignment which is a little... sus. Even though it's pretty safe to assume I'm town because, y'know. ._.

(Though I do find it odd that she was so greatly defending Ice, but I don't think I could scum doing that unless they really really want the town cred......plus seems kinda par for the course on how she acts when fired up town).

This still feels like possibly a bit of an easy pockety type read, though, like you did with saying Alianna seemed to be acting like her usual self .

[Aureal]

Support for my wesley theory continues to grow.

Sorry for whoever got eaten by toucans, lol.

[Aureal]

"all targets who have fruit" in their PMs should be everyone who has a town (apple) or Mafia (orange) PM. So, y'know, no need to even say as much, if that's everyone in the game. But then there's wesley too. Who might not even have a PM at all. What do you even write for a sock puppet?

Well, it's Skygazer, so probably something silly anyway.

[Aureal]

You wish!

[Aureal]

So at what point in Overeasy did I display such a difficult to fake emotional level, anyway? I thought I was reasonably level that game, though I probably pushed my reads more strongly at times than may be usual.

[Aureal]

Taly was getting obv townier and townier so I can’t say I’m relieved
Glad the role wasn’t anything super powerful though

Can you explain why you felt Taly was so towny? I didn't have any strong feelings on her one way or another so this confuses me.

[Aureal]

Taly’s role just sounds like a 3p finder so not targeting Wesley with it is ??????

"Why bother, it's not going to work because it's obvious wesley isn't town or scum, and I won't even necessarily have a way to confirm that it didn't work other than trying to grill wesley into admitting it" is probably what my train of thought would be there, given that ability.

Why do you even care? Weird thing to kvetch about when Taly already flipped town.

[Aureal]

Aureal’s what’s your take on jjh?

I don't really have much of a take yet, I've mostly been thinking about Drew since the flip and haven't gone back over others. I wasn't convinced at all that jjh's townread of Wheme was accurate. His push of the Dragon wagon was a little worrisome. I don't really know what else I'm supposed to think about someone who I guess has mostly just gone "hmmm yes I see that x is y alignment, because I say so".

[Aureal]

Taly’s role just sounds like a 3p finder so not targeting Wesley with it is ??????

"Why bother, it's not going to work because it's obvious wesley isn't town or scum, and I won't even necessarily have a way to confirm that it didn't work other than trying to grill wesley into admitting it" is probably what my train of thought would be there, given that ability.

Why do you even care? Weird thing to kvetch about when Taly already flipped town.

Why is this your reaction here? Seems disproportionate to me just dropping a comment on Taly’s role
Also, it’s impossible to confirm someone is not in a hood… but:
1. Wesley wouldn’t know they were meant to be in a PT, right? So Taly could catch Wesley just based on that lack of knowledge
2. If Wesley is shown to be in a PT, then we know they’re much less likely to be 3p.
Incredible utility? No. More potential than any other option? Yes.
Though I guess arguing this at length is pointless cause as you said, Taly’s dead!

Because Taly isn't in the game anymore, it's kinda rude to scold dead town over their night action decision-making. You sounded like you were trying to shade Taly's credibility.

And I wouldn't put it past this game for 'wesley' to know about PT stuff despite not being able to actually be in it.

[Aureal]

Taly was getting obv townier and townier so I can’t say I’m relieved
Glad the role wasn’t anything super powerful though

Can you explain why you felt Taly was so towny? I didn't have any strong feelings on her one way or another so this confuses me.

Taly’s role just sounds like a 3p finder so not targeting Wesley with it is ??????

"Why bother, it's not going to work because it's obvious wesley isn't town or scum, and I won't even necessarily have a way to confirm that it didn't work other than trying to grill wesley into admitting it" is probably what my train of thought would be there, given that ability.

Why do you even care? Weird thing to kvetch about when Taly already flipped town.

Hold on, you have been giving me the business about why I voted Wheme and not JJh, and here you are, Aureal, trying to make the person pushing JJH(Meuh) look bad.....just as the JJH wagon is gaining steam.

I even looked backed to when you switched from voting JJh to Wheme, literally was right before I voted Wheme......you gave me shit for not voting him and choosing to vote Wheme, when you LEFT the JJh wagon to vote Wheme!

I think you are trying to play both sides here, trying to push JJh while also keeping others in the conversation for a mislim. I was looking at you like 'of course Aureal is town' but taking a step back I see I was probably wrong. Ironically you pushing me on why I voted Wheme caused me to take this step back, so thank you for that lol.

VOTE: Aureal

Well you

are

hilarious, whatever your alignment is, I'll give you that much.

[Aureal]

Taly’s role just sounds like a 3p finder so not targeting Wesley with it is ??????

"Why bother, it's not going to work because it's obvious wesley isn't town or scum, and I won't even necessarily have a way to confirm that it didn't work other than trying to grill wesley into admitting it" is probably what my train of thought would be there, given that ability.

Why do you even care? Weird thing to kvetch about when Taly already flipped town.

Why is this your reaction here? Seems disproportionate to me just dropping a comment on Taly’s role
Also, it’s impossible to confirm someone is not in a hood… but:
1. Wesley wouldn’t know they were meant to be in a PT, right? So Taly could catch Wesley just based on that lack of knowledge
2. If Wesley is shown to be in a PT, then we know they’re much less likely to be 3p.
Incredible utility? No. More potential than any other option? Yes.
Though I guess arguing this at length is pointless cause as you said, Taly’s dead!

Because Taly isn't in the game anymore, it's kinda rude to scold dead town over their night action decision-making. You sounded like you were trying to shade Taly's credibility.

And I wouldn't put it past this game for 'wesley' to know about PT stuff despite not being able to actually be in it.

I’m more bewildered than mad, which is what I was trying to show with the question mark spam, but I suppose it also could’ve come off that way, so understandable

That's why I asked. I've had people chew me out because they thought I was criticizing dead town's night action, when actually I was just asking if it was common to do it that way trying to get more context because I didn't have the experience to be sure what scum would expect and was trying to theorize what scum would have done.

[Aureal]

Like the biggest momentum since daystart has been Bianco and I pushing for jjh, and then earlier, Aureal’s had some back and forths with you and Wesley’s been calling jjh scum. If she’s scum and jjh is town, I feel like she gets herself into trouble for no reason by posting like she is currently.

What about my posting seems like it could get me into trouble? I'm asking you guys questions because I'm trying to figure out what you're doing so I can hopefully figure your alignment. You did nothing all day one and suddenly you're spitting intensely confident reads and I probably haven't even read all of what you're saying yet while trying to peek in from work, let alone processed it.

[Aureal]

zomg wesley, it's MY job to place third votes this game

How could you steal my job like this, it's so cold

[Aureal]

I think you know what I must do

VOTE: jjh927

LOOK GUYS IT'S DEFINITELY TWILIGHT

PANIC

[Aureal]

THE GODS DO NOT DETECT ADEQUATE PANIC LEVELS

[Aureal]

IT'S DEFINITELY TWILIGHT GUYS

DON'T LISTEN TO YOUR LYING EYES

[Aureal]

IT'S DEFINITELY TWILIGHT GUYS

DON'T LISTEN TO YOUR LYING EYES

I dunno, that threat assessment board makes me wanna vote you 7 times haha.

VOTE: JJh

I eagerly await your acquisition of a septuple voter role. XD

[Aureal]

I guess you guys were right though, there was momentum on jjh! I looked at that comment and was like 'huh I saw two votes without much reasoning, is that supposed to be momentum?'

I guess so!

[Aureal]

*looks*

You win this one, Skygazer! *shakes fist*

[Aureal]

No moderator lies so we can presume that Wesley is one or the other and not a hidden third thing even if he's a fucking enigma otherwise still.

The same section that says no moderator lies also says the setup is seven and two. Not

at least

seven and two, just straight up seven and two. There can't be ten players but also just nine players. The player list itself being the fudged thing is the most sensible conclusion. Methinks Skygazer has a rather broad definition of what a moderator lie is, after the Andante VT thing last game. >.>

[Aureal]

oh nice we hit scum

that does
not confirm or deny my theory guh
since the board did not have jjh on it at the time of having four votes

but it does seem likely that if anyone is voteless it is wesley

my own role suggests there were only 2 oranges as well so

Uh, jjh was on the most recent board when he hit four votes. It changed in the next vote count but surely someone wouldn't be able to come along, see a hammer, and change the board quickly to change the threshold and nullify the hammer?

[Aureal]

No moderator lies so we can presume that Wesley is one or the other and not a hidden third thing even if he's a fucking enigma otherwise still.

The same section that says no moderator lies also says the setup is seven and two. Not

at least

seven and two, just straight up seven and two. There can't be ten players but also just nine players. The player list itself being the fudged thing is the most sensible conclusion. Methinks Skygazer has a rather broad definition of what a moderator lie is, after the Andante VT thing last game. >.>

The Andante VT thing wasn't even much of anything, it was me !!

Exactly, everyone thought that was the lie! Except it wasn't, it was your role!

[Aureal]

Lol, everyone left in this game was in that game. We've done a great job driving out the interlopers, team!

[Aureal]

Exactly, that's what I've been trying to say forever

I mean really, the mod answering a question with the specification "according to the player list" really should be a big clue that there's something up with the player list

[Aureal]

Hey Drew, I'm still waiting for you to explain what you thought was so emotional about me in the other game where you were scum.

[Aureal]

More questions about it? But you haven't even answered what I originally asked.

And you're saying your sudden suspicion of me here was a reaction test?

[Aureal]

So at what point in Overeasy did I display such a difficult to fake emotional level, anyway? I thought I was reasonably level that game, though I probably pushed my reads more strongly at times than may be usual.

Please show me where you answered this because it seems to me to exist as much as wesley's vote does

[Aureal]

I guess I do need you to tell me how I acted. What kind of hard to fake emotion did you think I was displaying there, while chuckling in the scum PT about how I looked like flailing scum?

[Aureal]

I guess I do need you to tell me how I acted. What kind of hard to fake emotion did you think I was displaying there, while chuckling in the scum PT about how I looked like flailing scum?

Lol, you appeared as flailing scum to anyone besides me and RC/Snivy.

The over the top emotion is what I mean, very similar how I get when frustrated when people can't see how I am town it don't believe me in general.

That is what made me think you were town when displaying that same sort of emotion here in this game in regards to Dragon.

I mean, how many times do I need to keep saying the same thing when you keep asking me to explain??

Look Drew, here is what I was doing at that point. I don't recall having any "over the top emotion" there other than trying to project confidence because I needed Snivy to listen to me to have a chance at winning, and looking back at it doesn't do anything to make me feel otherwise. I was pressing perfectly sound, logical arguments with a tone of confidence (that I didn't quite actually feel because Snivy seemed to be slipping away for dubious reason but I had no choice but to commit to the argument that he was the other town). T-Bone was the one who got emotional there and voted me in a fit of pique because I'd called out how wrongheaded he was. (This is actually what I was referring to when I replied to Dragon's musing about reads being rewards earlier this game ) If you want instances of frustrated Aureal, I can think of plenty but this definitely isn't even top five.

So it's kind of hard to see how you would readily equate that with my posting around the Dragon "hammer". Totally different circumstances, different emotions, different posting styles.

[Aureal]

that leaves a final poe of aureal drew and hpe

Bit early to leave yourself out of that poe innit?

Why would you expect someone to have themself in their PoE?

[Aureal]

HPE should really not be in the poe. For one thing, it just makes very little sense for it to be partnered with jjh-- that would require it and jjh to have jumped in the wheme/TA kerfuffle with essentially the same behaviour at essentially the same time, and I really struggle to see that happening.

Eh, maaaaybe? I don't feel like trying to interrupt the string of Wheme's hurts is very AI behavior though, possibly even slightly scum-indicative because it's so easy and meaningless. "Let's not kill Theta just for funzies" is a really really easy and attractive position to take (whereas town might spent a little more time to think over whether Wheme had a point) so I wouldn't put it in the same category as scum partners pushing the same read (which I still wouldn't take as something that they definitely wouldn't do).

And also, consider:

Also feel like at this point the vote shenanigans HAVE to be something to do with wesley. No way this guy is real like c'mon

Hi Drew! Congrats on the doomed slot!

wesley is an orange-controlled puppet, like at this point on that much I'd bet money. Now, scum!hpe should have been feigned ignorance of voting shenanigans in 404, which would actually be a deliberate strategic decision, save almost immediately kind of weakening the premise in 442 and finally blatantly demolishing it in 640. Which would make sense,

in the pow of someone actually not having done its mind on the matter

, as opposed to an informed pow.

Was Dragon really the only other one who thought wesley was sounding like Skygazer? I think it'd be more strange for wesley to be player-controlled. Consider the potential logistical impacts of giving some random player a role where they're supposed to use a separate account to post in addition to their own. What if they post using the wrong account? Awkward! What if they slip and post in the wrong game with it? Massive out-of-game influence headache! What if they don't post from it and wesley needs to be 'replaced'? How the hell do you replace a player who didn't sign up in the first place, make yet another puppet account and gripe at the person who's supposed to be posting with it that they need to post from it this time?

I suppose wesley being scum-controlled could mitigate the last point since having two people available to use it makes it less likely to just be ignored. Some of the ways which wesley has acted could indicate that the Dragon/Drew slot is scum, since in that case I'm guessing wesley voting jjh was meant to keep others from voting there (and thus was a grave miscalculation which feels like could easily come from Drew thinking that I'm too ponderously slow to act to dare vote there). The wesley vote had a disruptive effect on the Dragon wagon as well; note that jjh unvotes after people start realizing that it's not actually twilight, so even though he's the one who kicked off the flashwagon he could have felt more comfortable risking the incitement on a partner slot like he did because he expected a wesley 'vote' to create enough confusion that it would fall apart if it did actually reach an apparent five votes.

But still. Would Dragon really try to write like Skygazer just so he could say "hey it seems like Skygazer's writing" and get me hopefully starting to think maybe we're going to be on the same page a lot again this game? If so, nice job lol

[Aureal]

bianco i cannot see being scum due to role and what meuh revealed

It has occurred to me that it's only confirmed bianco knows there's an effect that doesn't lock the thread during night, not necessarily that that's caused by bianco's role. It probably is her role and there's other reasons to think she's not scum here, though.

[Aureal]

Drew doesn't get to be #1 anymore.

well
time to browse meuhs posts and figure out who they targeted

Are we doing this claim thing any particular way? I don't think I've been too subtle about my role.

[Aureal]

I feel pretty confident that Meuh targeted jjh

[Aureal]

Sadly, the threat assessment board cannot actually protect anyone, merely assess threats, or I would've protected Meuh since I figured there was a really good chance she was getting shot and was likely an investigative.

[Aureal]

It... does what you see?

I really was kinda hoping it was secretly funnelling targets to someone's actions, though.

[Aureal]

Especially after Meuh targeted jjh, who had been the next person up on the board XD

[Aureal]

I doubt it would be a player's role doing it, were that the case. Just a hidden aspect of the game that you were informed about.

[Aureal]

Maf could just be informed of things in their PT rather than their role, Skygazer did it just last game.

[Aureal]

Scum have a Rolecop? Seems like scum have 5% of a rolecop to me. BTW, why were people thinking jjh saying he'd targeted bianco with it makes bianco definitely not partnered, I didn't really get that.

[Aureal]

I don't feel like a protective fits well here with a cop, a watcher, and randomish Neighborizer for town unless the other Mafia has some really good power. Plus not knowing what the role even does is kind of weird. The other roles we've seen are pretty clear what they do, even if what they do is oddball (I hope Skygazer had some sort of script to turn 95% of the ASCII into asterisks rather than having to do that by hand, yikes )

Hmm, would a Neighborizer even be seen by the watcher?

[Aureal]

Also:

instinct makes me want to flip

dragons

before replacement but that probably wont happen before one enters

nonsense! i'm here to help.
VOTE: IceDragon

mod notes:
- IceDragon70 is v/la through november 25th

We're about to solve that cause yeah this ISO does rather stink.

VOTE: IceDragon70

what

I knew I didn't trust that this reaction was real!

[Aureal]

in a situation where we can queue up multiple eliminations in the same day which
to be fair i am not sure we are in that situation
depleting my boss bar will have an effect that prevents any other eliminations from happening that day if i understood my role correctly
i would rather not explain further but that is the important bit

needless to say we would want to be sure someone is town before doing that

...can you now explain what you were saying here, because I don't get it?

[Aureal]

Theta, can you elaborate on why you think the Dragon wagon makes that slot feel unpaired?

Drew, can you elaborate on why you hammered jjh?

[Aureal]

That feeling when everyone suddenly gets on the same page as you while you're playing Valheim

And you look in and go "oh I should hammer, I told Drew I'd catch him next time... I'll get dinner first though, Theta isn't gonna steal a hammer this fast"

[Aureal]

also this means we were super close to hammering scum D1 if this one didn't interfere with wesley sillies and also aureal comically defended them the whole way

And I'll do it again if people try to turboyeet Dragon off early game tonal weirdness again!

Thanks for modding, Skygazer!

[Aureal]

Well yes, I can identify your AI tonal weirdness! Dragon's is just weird!

Also Dragon, sorry for spelling out your other alt, I didn't think you intended it to be secret since you literally told everyone in the last game you were signed up for this.

[Aureal]

HPE carried the "screwing with scum" shenanigans though. And here I had thought

my

role was going to be good for silliness. XD

[Aureal]

dead thread

- viewtopic.php?t=91979

toucan stomach 3

- viewtopic.php?t=91993

mafia thread and the other two toucan stomachs will be released in 48 hours barring no redactions

*smashing the like button again*