Newbie 1572 - Chicken Parmigiana Mafia (Over)

[Seraphim]

Why the fuck is it Day 3 with only one person dead?

Anyway, I'll read this tomorrow or at the very worst this weekend. I'll get to it soon is what I'm saying.

[Seraphim]

Yeah, I'll get to this tomorrow, I promise.

[Seraphim]

Well I'm about halfway in and I'm pretty sure I know who the scum are already. I'll finish reading just to make sure I'm not wrong.

[Seraphim]

Alriiiiiight I'm drunk lets get this party started.

So DDD is scum. I am like 85% sure. I am also pretty sure that BRantz is his scumpartner.

Vote: DDD

There are two players that I think are confirmed town at this point basically: those players are Diego and Drixx. Both are waaaaay too honest to be scum and if they are scum it's one of the most compelling performances I've ever seen.

I will be watching the remaining players obviously. I don't have anything specific questions about what's gone down so far because quite frankly I don't know how useful that would be.

The ika lynch doesn't surprise me but it is still unfortunate; there was definitely a point where it was fairly obvious that he was town but hindsight is 20-20 I suppose.

[Seraphim]

Strong gut reads. Also BRantz's predecessor was scummy as hell. DDD, as ika so wonderfully pointed out for us, DDD is usually way more aggressive than he is currently. Instead, he has been wishy-washy and non-committal. It is time to take him down.

[Seraphim]

Haha that was from a long time ago. But yes, generally speaking DDD tends to play very aggressive. Even if we assume he's having an "off game," he does not pursue any player with any sort of energy and sort of seems to passively move from wagon to wagon. His vote for NumberQ comes off as weak to me. Just ISO him and you'll see what I mean.

[Seraphim]

I feel it like this: if it's the Doctor, we have two confirmed town players. If it's a Jailkeeper, they might want to consider claiming especially if they've protected the same person twice idk

Im pretty drunk so I should be taken with a grain of salt

[Seraphim]

Well obviously whatever powerroles should use their discretion. if you want answers, a claim is what's reuiqred

[Seraphim]

@zombie:a What is your suspicion of bitmap/ what caused the suspicion?

It was just from having a quick look through day 1 and seeing his reaction to ika's scumminess on day 2 but I really need to properly read through everything again and also assess everyone's posts individually. Haven't had the time to do that without suddenly falling asleep though lol
I wouldn't say Bitmap would be my strongest scum read right now but I'll VOTE: Seraphim anyways because yay~

This is remarkably unhelpful. I can only be responsible to some extent on the actions of my predecessor, but simply voting me because "yay" is not really scumhunting. Do you have any reasons for voting me or something I could respond to?

[Seraphim]

Blarg, preview not submit, idiot.

I mean I disagree with this strongly and obviously; the game hadn't gotten to a point where someone needed to die yesterday when I had to be away for like four/five days and when I came back I wanted to change my vote but avoiding a no lynch was the higher priority for me. Then when I did get the opportunity I did aggressively go right after ika and got him lynched. And annoyingly you've interjected yourself where you didn't need to in regards to the numberQ vote but sufficed to say I haven't dithered with the vote, I voted and haven't tried to tap dance away from it or anything.

"Annoyingly?" I am free to interject myself wherever I see scum behavior k thanks.

I am just very surprised that you are not aggressively pressing any lynches this game, especially given your insistence that you would not necessarily be playing as an IC unless questions were asked of you. Maybe I have a mistaken conception of your play (unlikely seeing as you did not disagree with my assessment of your play being typically "aggressive") but even right out of the gate, you are passively commenting on what's happening rather than actively pursuing any player for extended portions of the game.

Also, ika was maaaaaajor low-hanging fruit. I know that is meaningless given that I'm coming in post-flip but your case on ika was less than impressive and sort of pushed itself. But I digress. Honestly, I had a scumread on you from your second post where you buddy Bitmap super hard without contributing anything new of your own. It's super jokey but it looks like bullshit to me.

@Seraphim

, you say BRantz is scummy based on his predecessor. What about BRantz himself? I had enough of a townread on him to turn my scumread around on that slot.

I honestly think that "Letters" was so scummy that any replacement would be colored by that assessment...but still, BRantz's play, while better than Letters, is lukewarm at best and not enough to shake my read. He might change my mind but those are my thoughts.

[Seraphim]

It is a mistake to completely discount the scum read on a slot just because a replacement comes in and appears different. Nothing a replacement says or does can in any way impact what the prior player(s) said and did, and just crossing out the earlier stuff seems like a really good way to go about losing newbie games.

Who is scum?

[Seraphim]

I don't care who you know for sure. I want to know who you think is scum.

[Seraphim]

You should vote one of them or something. Or question them.

[Seraphim]

Reaction votes on D3? tsk tsk tsk

[Seraphim]

Unvote
Vote: BRantz

I'm down for this. Hopefully I can convince ya'll with DDD tomorrow.

[Seraphim]

Oh boy people voting me based on... oh thats right "gut" and "I can't put my finger on it". Really solid cases there boys.

The more you post, the more your scumminess reveals itself to me. Ah, it is so wonderful. Nah, DDD and BRantz is the scumteam alright.

[Seraphim]

Your post reeks of the stench that is "I am scum caught for the 'wrong reasons'"

[Seraphim]

This could be true. Or it could be false. How would I go about reading you if I have no idea? If I had the wrong idea, at least it would be an idea of reading you, but apparently I have no idea.

[Seraphim]

that makes sense to me, I guess. I still think you're scum but it makes sense.

[Seraphim]

Unvote
Vote: DDD

Actually I've changed my mind. This is the play today. I have enough doubt about my BRantz read to make this the play. DDD-scum can stop coasting, the game is afoot!

[Seraphim]

@Seraphim:

What is your read/thoughts on numberQ and Jelly?

Both are them seem fairly town. Jelly and Jelly's predecessor seemed like they were generally pretty solid on doing some honest scumhunting. I have a few reservations about numberQ (like his vote on Diego is lol) but I feel decently about him.

[Seraphim]

So deadline is in three days and we've like what, three pages of posting? Come on, people. I only have one vote, this needs to be a TEAM effort.

numberQ: convince me of zombiekitty scum. ZK is definitely null for me, show me some aspect of the posting that I'm missing.

[Seraphim]

That's a fairly cogent argument numberQ. I can think of at least one reason that frequently influences new players to behave the way Zombiekitty has that isn't at all scummy. So ... how do I tell whether the kitty is legit scummy or just a newer player falling into bad play for a reason that many newbies also do the same thing?

Can you clue us in on that reason?

If you help me lynch DDD (or his so-far unimpressive replacement) today, I will definitely help you lynch zombiekitty tomorrow. Color me convinced by your arguments but not convinced enough to move my vote.

[Seraphim]

Also your post really helped me lock onto a townread for you which narrows the pool to davesaz/BRantz/ZK for scum/null so thanks for that.

[Seraphim]

Sorry, that was directed at numberQ. You have been town for a while for me because you have been WAY too earnest to be scum (take that as a good thing).

That reason is not obvious to me, so I would love to have it pointed out to me.

[Seraphim]

I mean zombie isn't THAT new at this point.

[Seraphim]

First, it's a gut meta tell for me. I've played with DDD before, usually he is WAY more aggressive and pushes shit hard.

Here, he seems to be coasting and is not really interested in finding scum. Not only is it uncharacteristic of his town game, I find it to be very untownlike behavior.

It's not a super strong case by golly but my gut feels this lynch very strongly.

[Seraphim]

First, it's a gut meta tell for me. I've played with DDD before, usually he is WAY more aggressive and pushes shit hard.

Here, he seems to be coasting and is not really interested in finding scum. Not only is it uncharacteristic of his town game, I find it to be very untownlike behavior.

It's not a super strong case by golly but my gut feels this lynch very strongly.

I've been there too. Sometimes my gut is right and occasionally it's wrong. Not much I can do about DDD's tenure. All I can do right now is work for town and see if that's enough to turn this around.

Can we talk about your other scum reads?

zombiekitty and BRantz are the only other players that are scum based on PoE. I have strong townreads on the rest of the town. I don't like a BRantz lynch for today, though, because some of his reactions to my play look more town than some of his past posting...so I am questioning my read enough to postpone his lynch.

I am fairly certain however that if we lynch from the you/BRantz/zombiekitty pool that we will hit both scum. Given that she's being replaced now, I would not mind a compromise lynch on zombiekitty if it prevents a BRantz lynch.

[Seraphim]

If it gets too close to deadline, I will hammer.

[Seraphim]

I honestly think that dave would be the better lynch though, if I can convince people of that.

[Seraphim]

Sorry for disappearing guys. I was really busy these last few days. Luckily there is little I have to catch up on.

Personally I still think the scum lies in snscompt1 and davesaz. numberQ and Drixx look pretty damn town from where I'm standing and I like ForWhom decently enough. I don't know if No Lynch is a fantastic idea because it's very likely that scum will either No Kill or kill someone obviously town (like me or Drixx for instance).

Consider my vote to be on davesaz.

[Seraphim]

It's a misnomer that MYLO is somehow less dangerous than LYLO; in most situations, they are equally as dangerous because there's a higher likelihood of lynching town than in LYLO. Scum might have reasons to no kill to allow the MYLO state to continue, unless there's a player they want to kill, in which case we are playing right into scum hands.

[Seraphim]

I think we should lynch today. I'm just saying that scum might not play nice and kill someone off for us and we just end up in the same situation. Or an obviously town player dies and we're in the same situation sans one person.

[Seraphim]

I think we play the odds regardless and that lynching today just means more town players. I am not particularly committed one way or another.

Drixx, I will attempt to fulfill your request but it may be a day or two.

[Seraphim]

Or, let me put it this way: I will hammer No Lynch but will continue pushing for lynches until that happens.

[Seraphim]

I apologize. I just got done with all of my shit today. There should be postings tomorrow.

[Seraphim]

Alright, reads:

Drixx - town. Earnest, cares about the game, cares about scumhunting. I can point to plenty of posts where I've seen Drixx leading the town in a manner that looks town to me. If he's scum, he is doing an incredibly impressive job.

NumberQ - weakish town. Same as Drixx, but not quite as strong. I also think there are a number of so-called "towntells" that could be attributed to him (as has already been pointed out) but my gut read is nowhere close to Drixx's for his town credentials. His responses to the early D3 wagon on him looks very town to me in particular; it demonstrated excellent and honest calm as well as a drive to scumhunt.

snscompt1 - nullish scum, I did not like his predecessor but this current iteration is doing a lot better at what looks like real scumhunting and engagement. He is perfectly middle of the road for me at the moment.

FWTJR - nullish scum, since sns has replaced in, my read here has slipped. His recent absence (relative, I know I've been holding things up) looks more like scum play rather than hands-off town. I would have a hard time choosing between him and sns for the last scum.

davesaz - SCUM. Do people really need me to reiterate? DDD and his now-replacement have been weak town players with only a passing interest in scumhunting. Scum scum scum scum on a cracker, lynch it lynch it. It's the sort of passivity you expect to see from scum perfectly personified.

[Seraphim]

Stalled a lot on giving reads that should only have taken a few minutes to type up.

I would like to point out that this was due to low levels of activity on the site in general and that I just haven't had time to get to it until due to various real life concerns. For the record, I also did some rereading (brief ISO skimming) which I had wanted to do for a while so it took much longer than a few minutes to make that post.

[Seraphim]

I am 99% sure that if we lynch dave he will turn up scum.

[Seraphim]

I want to hear from FWTJR first.

[Seraphim]

Vote: davesaz

[Seraphim]

Unvote

I need to think about this.

[Seraphim]

We have four days, if people are active we can work this out. I have a lot of tinfoil scenario running around in my head now that I need to get quieted down so I can make a rational decision.

Did anyone else think that exchange was a little TOO choreographed or was it just me?

[Seraphim]

Actually, I am still on board for a dave lynch.

My condensed thought process: (1) at least one of them (sns, dave) must be scum. (2) Both might be scum. If both are scum, then sns is looking to use his buddy's death to coast to endgame. HOWEVER, there is no way for this to have been choreographed beforehand, upon reflection because sns made his crumb before he would have had a chance to talk in the QT. Therefore, scenario 2 is a bust. (3) sns might be scum counterclaiming dave, however that breadcrumb is pretty damning for Dave. My only concern is that scum definitely have a good reason to counterclaim here, as a lack of a counterclaim would mean dave not getting lynched and being confirmed town. There's also no guarantee that Dave's shot has been expended (scum might have a reasonable guess, but Diego throws them into doubt) so he is a risky kill tonight and in the future.

However, it all comes back to that breadcrumb and my initial reads, which tip me towards lynching dave. Similar to Drixx, I am willing to let the simplest and clearest explanation shine through rather than get lost in paranoia, which is to say that dave knew he was going down and is claiming BP to trip us up.

[Seraphim]

Vote: davesaz

Nope, this is happening.

[Seraphim]

I am 95% sure that Jelly is scum and would vote Jelly in a heartbeat. If sns is scum, he played a masterful gambit and probably deserves to win because he definitely could not have planned that with his scumbuddy. I have a strong townread on numberQ and sns looks to be confirmed town now (barring tinfoil). PoE says Jelly. That's my thought process, Jelly can try to convince me otherwise.

We could also try no lynch but I am very confident in Jelly lynch today.

[Seraphim]

Welcome to the fun and wacky world of MYLO.

[Seraphim]

I am tentatively down with no lynching today.

Vote: No Lynch

[Seraphim]

okay lol

Unvote

[Seraphim]

Basically, I am of the position that it's either Jelly or No Lynch for me today.

[Seraphim]

To get it going? idk. I'm an impulsive guy. No lynch because I'm just unsure enough about everyone to make no lynch a good idea, but conversely I would not mind lynching Jelly either. If you and sns are convinced, I am willing to trust my gut and call it a day.

if that's an answer at all.

[Seraphim]

I do somewhat resent my play being called "tunneling" because I did have other scumspects and did do other things besides push dave. It's a bit of a misconstrual to say that all I've done is tunnel, I think. If numberQ votes for Jelly, I will hammer. Just a heads-up there, number.

[Seraphim]

Time to rock n roll ladies and gentlemen.

And here's the hammer.

Vote: Jelly

Fingers crossed.

[Seraphim]

If zombiekitty hadn't been replaced, I almost certainly would have lynched that slot. Damn. Replacements do make a difference.

Excellent crumbing, as usual. I have never ever won in LYLO so it's good to continue that streak.

Drixx in particular deserves accolades for being perhaps the most obviously town player I have ever played with.

[Seraphim]

Also, Diego with those doc protects! Holy shit.