Micro 475: Instant Lylo Mafia!

[SilverWolf]

Hi, no one vote please. We are in lylo. Scum will be strongly resistant to votes on their partner. The rest of us really need to make sure we come to a consensus before we vote because we have no info. to go on otherwise.

Also, not feeling well so I may not get to this until tomorrow.

[SilverWolf]

Hi guys, not sure how to approach this set-up. Scum having daytalk kind of gives them an advantage plus we have no previous content to analyze. No flips, kills, etc. All we can do is read each other in the next 10 days and hope for the best. I'm going to be looking out for a couple things that might be scum indicators but I'll say what they are when/if I see them rather than tell scum what I'm looking for.

Hoping the ones who haven't posted say something soon.

[SilverWolf]

Yes, I realize that but Jeanne's post barely counts. She is saying nothing really. I'm not sure what else to post here tbh. Are you looking for a reason to cast suspicion over nothing?

[SilverWolf]

Maybe just curious why you seem to be reading so much into a simple statement. You do realize we have to get discussion started somehow right?

[SilverWolf]

Meh-That's actually a good point. I feel like you are trying to start discussion but the way you are going about it is in a way to automatically put someone on the defensive. I tend to scumread people who look for scum where there isn't but this is a different kind of set-up so o.k.

[SilverWolf]

Well because her posts at least say something besides hello. It's not a lot but it looks slightly townish at this point. I realize I don't have a lot to go on so that's gut.

@Jeanne-What is your opinion on the players who have posted so far?

[SilverWolf]

I wouldn't be surprised if scum tried to lurk this out but I sure don't want to vote Jeanne or Brantz with zero input.

[SilverWolf]

All I know for sure is I'm town and I think kittenlicks might be and if I can figure out the third, I've got it made here. Brantz needs to post.

[SilverWolf]

Without BRantz posting, I can't make a call yet guys.

[SilverWolf]

I said I think you might be. I said it was gut. It wasn't an insta town read. I have no clue what type of player you are. It was just a general read of your posts so far. Way to exaggerate things and scumpaint me right away.

Are you trying to lynch me already based on that?

[SilverWolf]

Nope, I re-read and I never said I know you are town. You majorly misrepped me in several ways with your response which is over the top. You don't seem like you are approaching this in a town lylo be careful type manner but more of a type of manner rushing a scumread and trying to get everyone on your side to get me lynched right away. You think enomis is towny-he's probably your partner if you are scum.

And why immediately try to get Jeanne and BRantz to help you scumread me? Your quick reaction to me here is not making me feel good about you any further. I don't see you even trying to sort alignments so you don't lynch wrong.

Boy was I wrong about you.

[SilverWolf]

Because if I can get a sort of town read on a third player, then the chances are higher that one of the other 2 are scum and we only have to lynch one of them. I'm basically trying to crowd out the scum in a way by figuring out who is town first rather than who is scum. I can't see a better way to do this but if you have one, I'd like to hear it.

I was just surprised you wanted to scumread me right away without knowing anything or saying anything at least about Jeanne or BRantz. Jeanne saying she knows I am town doesn't sit well with me either which is why I didn't return the townread.

As far as being scumread early game as town, yep that has happened more often than not. Especially if I'm in a game with people who haven't played with me before. Usually that gets a lot better the longer I am in the game.

[SilverWolf]

I'm a she and yeah, I'm not going to self meta. I felt like she came into the thread singling me out for a scumread and trying to get Jeanne (who she shouldn't know the alignment of) and BRantz (who hadn't even posted yet) to join her in scumreading me. It's not reaching. It's how her posting made me feel when I read it. I think the fact that you two appear to be somewhat working together (you defending her and her townreading you, both of you singling me out while ignoring others) is a valid observation in a set-up where scum have daytalk and are likely to coordinate. The fact that both of you are asking me self meta questions is another sign you are possibly communicating with each other. I have zero information to go on besides what is in this thread but I am going to make note of what I see when I see it. That said, I don't like Jeanne's lurking and quick townread (buddying) of me either and I'm leaning scum there which means I could just be being paranoid about the two of you. BRantz is null so far. I have zero townreads which sucks.

[SilverWolf]

I don't even care any more. If you lynch me, I'll flip VT and town will lose. The fact that I put an effort here when BRantz and Jeanne have said nothing and you have seemed determined to paint me as scum from the start and twist everything I say as scum is something I just don't even care to deal with. I gave you an honest answer to how I get read in games and you paint that as scum. I'm done with this. I hate being scumread for stupid shit by players who can't read me.

[SilverWolf]

Please feel free to paint that as AtE and call me scum for it and call me defensive and stupidly say that's a scumtell. I know you will anyway. You've made zero effort to work with me and I don't see town winning a game where the players are playing like this.

[SilverWolf]

SW-Brantz or SW-Jeanne
If SW is town it would have to be either Enomis-Jeanne or Brantz-Jeanne, neither of which sit well with me. Neither does Enomis-Brantz.

Have you ever considered Jeanne/BRantz?

Nope, you haven't even listed them. The fact that you can see me as scum with Jeanne or BRantz is ridiculous. Do you have a reason for that at all?

You are townclearing enomis way too quickly.

How long have you been playing mafia?

Are you scum?

[SilverWolf]

Meh, you listed BRantz Jeanne I guess. I'm very tired and missed that. Why on Earth doesn't that sit well with you? You don't think scum is going to lurk this one out for the win?

[SilverWolf]

Anyway, I don't even know what else to say here. I don't care for this set-up. It's very scum-sided because they have daytalk and we have zero info. to go on and dumb town is throwing the game or smart scum is taking advantage of lurk town is going to frustrate me to now end.

So, don't expect much more from me.

[SilverWolf]

BTW-If you are town calling someone town for saying things you are thinking, then I don't know what to tell you. Scum isn't going to be disagreeable in a set-up where they have to do very little to win.

The fact that you aren't even really looking at BRantz or Jeanne is insane to me.

I want some town players I can work with here, not ones who think defensiveness is a scum indicator.

*sign*

[SilverWolf]

Ugh-KIttenLicks, I apologize.

dumbtown is a term I used to describe town that isn't making smart decisions and I am including myself in that because I'm talking about town as a whole this game

I do not think you are a bad player because I don't know you as a player. That was unfair of me to imply and I am sorry about that. I'm usually not this crabby in games and the last thing I want to do is give it to scum by discouraging other players from wanting to play.

What really got to me is I gave you an honest answer about how I get scumread in early game as town usually by people who don't know me and you said I gave you the one answer that would explain my behavior which to me, made me feel like I was in a no-win situation where no matter what I say, it's wrong or scum in this case. You have to admit you and enomis have been implying that with your posts so far.

It would be a fantastic scum strategy to pick out one person and scumpaint every move they make to get a mislynch. That's what it felt like either you or enomis was doing because you seemed to be singling me out.

I do not feel like anyone has been under scrutiny but me.

I feel like you are townclearing enomis (who may or may not be town) because he's thinking like you when I feel like scum would not try to cause waves here.

Anyway, No I don't want you to replace out.

I'm tired and shouldn't of posted until I woke up some.

[SilverWolf]

Anyway, KittenLicks is likely town here due to her response to my frustration. enomis MAY be town but Jeanne and BRantz are wildcards so I don't know.

I think if one of more people lurk and don't post, town isn't going to win. That's another reason I don't feel like putting much effort in here.

[SilverWolf]

KittenLicks-Explain your scumread on BRantz. Is it PoE or something else? I'm null on him and Jeanne completely.

[SilverWolf]

I think if one of more people lurk and don't post, town isn't going to win. That's another reason I don't feel like putting much effort in here.

Well, yeah, I mean, if a single townie does not vote we auto-lose.

What I mean is people like BRantz and Jeanne making it to lylo as town can very easily lose the game for town because they can't be read easy. As scum, it's a strategy that might work here if we let it.

enomis ISO doesn't look like something scum couldn't do, Jeanne's one post is worthless, and BRantz agreeing lurking is scummy but continues to lurk

I feel o.k. with KittenLicks townread or enough of one not to lynch there but I need to figure out who is at least one scum of the other 3 and I need to see more posts because there is nothing else to go by as this game is instant lylo which, quite frankly, is a losing think for town IMO.

[SilverWolf]

What a friendly game we have going here..................................

[SilverWolf]

Yeah, I checked my posts and never expected anyone to be here 24/7 or slung any mud.

This is no fun for me so I'm going to check out for awhile.

Enjoy!!

[SilverWolf]

It's not mud slinging. It's reaction testing and trying to get you to post so I can read you. Your reaction is unnecessarily hostile and accusatory. Attacking me will get you nowhere. I'll just leave the thread until you are more reasonable.

[SilverWolf]

Nope, I said you weren't saying much. All true. In a game like this, posting is the only way to win and the only way to get reads. When I signed up, I knew I'd have to post. If someone isn't, I'm going to say so. We have 10 days, so even 24 hours is enough for me to comment on it.

Next?

[SilverWolf]

I've played with Jeanne before and she posted fluff and nonsense posts and was scum. My lylo comment was because she made it to lylo and town lost. I don't think she's going to be much help. I also don't know if she's the best lynch because she is a lurker in general.

Do you have any reads on anyone in the game at this point right now?

And yeah, I do get frustrated and not want to play if a game is too hostile. I'm not going to deny it or apologize for it. Sometimes a cool down period is best so I can come back with a clear head. If someone works with me and talks to me reasonably, then I'm more likely to be reasonable back. If someone yells at me, I'll yell back.

I've played quite a few games here so I know how it goes. I'm not expert or overly experienced but I do know how things work.

[SilverWolf]

Mostly her 42 reaction to my frustration. I'd think as scum, she'd make it worse. She seem to genuinely feel bad about it. She also said if I'm scum faking that, it's shameful or something so I would think she wouldn't respond with emotional manipulation back at me as scum.

But hey, I could be wrong here. enomis isn't scummy per se at all but his ISO is nothing that can't be said by scum.

I thought you might be scum, you are looking better.

Yeah, Jeanne may be scum but unfortunately she plays like this either way.

I'd like us to come to some sort of consensus before voting since it's lylo.

[SilverWolf]

That's my concern with both Kitten and enomis. There almost single-minded focus on me exclusively. It bothers me still.

[SilverWolf]

I actually wouldn't mind if Jeanne was replaced at this point. It's been 2 plus days since she's posted.

@mod

[SilverWolf]

Wolf:
I think your blowup was totally weird. And that post below that blowup is essentially what you have been accusing us of doing, "Painting people scummy".

Don't care if you think my play is weird tbh. You'll have to elaborate quite a bit on how any of it makes me scum if you are going to scumread me for it. I do see people as scummy for quickly trying to call me scum and concentrating so much on me because that's an excellent strategy for a scum win here.

Explain to me how you went from kitten town to kitten scum and back to kitten town.

Already answered to BRantz-ISO me.

And you know, you have been repeating:

enomis isn't scummy per se at all but his ISO is nothing that can't be said by scum.

At least two times or more now. This is basically nonsense. Okay then tell me, what does Kitten ISO have that cant be said by scum.

Already answered, I think her reaction to my frustration was genuine. Your ISO is something I could do as scum easy. Jeanne's is worthless. BRantz seemed kind of genuine in his anger to me today.

Your whole play is just Overly defensive, blowup at weird timings and give the "nobody can attack me because i am not OBV scum.". i really do need to meta you. Will do that some time soon or else i can't read you.

Yeah, I don't like being scumread for stupid shit like defensiveness which is not a scumtell and never has been. If I lynched everyone who got defensive when everything they say is being attacked, I'd be lynching a lot of town.

Did you meta him already?

I've already said once that I'm a she. This is the second time now.

Are you reading the game because you are missing some things and asking me questions I've already answered.

[SilverWolf]

No, You are misrepping me now. Kitten looked sort of town but it was by no means certain. Her singling me out was a red flag because that's a sure-fire scum strategy for a win in this game and I didn't like how she singled me out. Her reaction to my frustration felt genuine and townish to me. You concentrating almost solely on me and calling everything I do weird and illogical isn't sitting too well with me because all scum has to do is convince town on one person and they win. If you don't like how I play, I can't answer to that and won't. I'm not going to spend a ton of time and energy explaining myself since I've put way more effort in here already than anyone else has. It's nice how you are also going to say my interaction with BRantz was funny and say he can get angry but I can't get angry or that's "weird" "funny" "illogical" Your motivation for this does not look good to me.

I do want to know why I'm the only person in the game you are concentrating on though. I'm here interacting with everyone but there are other people in the game. You null reading everyone isn't really helpful for me in reading you.

[SilverWolf]

I haven't given a read on you at all because I don't have a sure read on you. I'm here interacting with people because I don't know how else to win this one.

BRantz anger could be scum or town, not sure there. His follow up to it seemed like he was trying to read me which felt townish rather than just accusing me of things without trying to read me.

None of my reads are solid because there isn't enough to go on. A lot of it is just feeling by interaction. I'd like Kitten's comments on BRantz now that he's posted more as well.

[SilverWolf]

BRantz seemed kind of genuine in his anger to me today.

The fact that you make a point to mention this in your post which happened to be your only summary of "Brantz" implies to me that you think this is important isn't it? If it can come from either town or scum, why mention it? Why not mention his follow up on you?

--------------------------------------
You said that the "sure-fire way" is a red flag for you.
Kitten qualified for the red flag, that's why you went from kitten town to kitten scum
So why was i not qualified for the red flag then?

I don't know what you mean by sure read. So are your kitten and Brantz reads sure reads?

It wasn't the BRantz anger I was concerned about but his follow-up after he calmed down which seemed to be trying to sort me that I felt good about although I tend to read emotions as genuine when I shouldn't really but I do.

You were qualified for the red flag and I'm pretty sure I mentioned it a few times. It's just one indicator. Not the only thing I'm looking at. I'm looking for scum motivation in things.

My Kitten and BRantz reads are not a sure thing. If I get a better read on you and who replaces in for Jeanne then they can change because if I decide you are town (I haven't yet but I like your line of questioning) then they both can't be town so it can change.

[SilverWolf]

I've taken a V/LA in my other games until the 23rd, due to the nature of this game, I'll try not to do that here but my posting will not be nearly as frequent until then.

[SilverWolf]

Jeanne has been signing up for a bunch of games and flaking in them like this one and another one I was in with her and several others. Mods should be aware of this if she signs up for their games.

[SilverWolf]

@Silverwolf:

Let's phrase it this way.
The red flag was enough of an indicator to turn someone who you townread by gut into scum
But it wasn't enough for you to turn someone who you nullread into scum.

I am curious about the distinction btw me and kitten. I am thinking there could be the possibility of the whole fiasco btw u and kitten was acted out. That could explain the distinction.

I don't fake emotions ever. It's not a tactic I believe in. I think I explained the kitten and you thing to you numerous times. I'm not sure how to say it any better. Kitten seemed somewhat genuine in her reaction to my frustration and I got a gut town feel. It's weak as hell but it's better than nothing. I haven't played with any of you but Jeanne once. I don't have time to meta. It's the best I can do. That said, she needs to react to the latest conversations at this point or that read will fade.

It wasn't the BRantz anger I was concerned about but his follow-up after he calmed down which seemed to be trying to sort me that I felt good about although I tend to read emotions as genuine when I shouldn't really but I do.

But it was him being genuine in his anger that made you think he was town.(That's what's your post 67 implied).
-----------------------
And your sentence doesn't really flow which to me is scummy.

First part is about his follow-up which you think is town
Second part is about you reading emotion as genuine but you shouldn't(which doesn't matter because we agreed that it could come from both scum and town).
So you reading emotions as genuine have no effect on the follow up.

Or am i missing something?

Sentences not flowing well is not scummy IMO. I thought his frustration was over the top at first but then thought it might be genuine and then I realized, since I can't decide-it's probably null or either alignment could of done it. I like the rest of his posting as trying to sort me out but again this is weak.

The replacement's view will help a lot.

I like your questioning. I think that's fine. But I am concerned that you are concentrating on me so much. I'm sure it's because I've posted and interacted with you the most.

BUT, I'm not the scum you are looking for-if you are town.

[SilverWolf]

OMG KIttenLicks-I am so sorry. Here I am bitching at people for calling me he and I've been calling you she. Oops, you guys are all he but me and Jeanne. LOL

[SilverWolf]

@SW:
Do you even have any completed scum games?

That one Kitten linked is not completed.

I have several completed scum games. How many do you want? Here's one. Let me know if you want more.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=60334

[SilverWolf]

Also, click on my user ID, hit completed topics-should show all my games, scum and town.

[SilverWolf]

*view their topics* lower right corner of profile

[SilverWolf]

I'm having a hard time even figuring out one scum this game and part of that is because we have one player who isn't even here posting. We need that replacement I think.

[SilverWolf]

Yeah, I just realized topics has everything I've ever posted in at all in it.

I can give you my most recent scum and town games because they are pretty similar in how I played if your really want them.

OTOH, if the majority of you have correctly called me town, then it's not necessary.

I also feel like the mod has abandoned this game because I haven't seen or heard from him in days. I also think he site flaked for ~reasons~ ~ongoing~ so I don't know if we should contact the list mod or consider this game abandoned. Especially since one of the spots needs replacement.

[SilverWolf]

I'm a VT BTW.

[SilverWolf]

enomis is probtown, he was the one I was the most unsure about

I don't know who is scum among BRantz or KittenLicks

The replacement may be scum but too risky to vote for

If I don't see anything from Aero by Tues. I'll contact the List Mod.

[SilverWolf]

No problem Aero. Hope everything is o.k. now.

[SilverWolf]

I want to call BRantz and enomis town with me right now.

Kitten seems off to me for a few reasons and the replacement isn't here so is scum by default.

[SilverWolf]

Hi droog, So sorry you drew scum against me for a third time in a row.

[SilverWolf]

droog is good as scum, so don't expect to be able to figure him out easily if he's scum this game, I've played two games with him where he was scum and he won them both.

droog-I see you have questions for me. I'm going to be busy for awhile but I will answer everything later after you are all caught up or tonight-whichever comes first

Welcome <3

[SilverWolf]

That makes no sense droog.

Are you scumreading me or not?

[SilverWolf]

Oh I get it. You are using the FoS as a way to cast a vote without it counting. OK, that makes sense.

I'll be back later to answer your questions but I do wonder, considering you have played with me before and I've posted a lot here, how you can not really know my alignment by now.

[SilverWolf]

It's a legitimate point. I've posted a lot more than anyone else, I've interacted with everyone else in this game, and you've played with me before so you should have a pretty good idea by this point where I am at. You eye-rolling that is obnoxious and unhelpful at best.

[SilverWolf]

All I know for sure is I'm town and

I think kittenlicks might be

and if I can figure out the third, I've got it made here. Brantz needs to post.

so quickly?

Yes but it was just a gut read and it was very light and I used the word might. Here's the two posts.

Hi everyone! How are you all doing? :3
This game feels kinda weird to me. Half of the people I'm going to interact with are guaranteed scum? :S Scary thought.

^^ Never live till lylo before?

Only once. But in that game I had 2 people I was 100% sure were scum, so I could safely ignore them and listen to my fellow townies.
I mean, I was wrong that time anyway, but it was still a very different situation.

This just kind of looked newbtown to me on initial read. It was just a feeling I got from reading her posts at first glance.

[SilverWolf]

I said I think you might be. I said it was gut. It wasn't an insta town read. I have no clue what type of player you are. It was just a general read of your posts so far. Way to exaggerate things and scumpaint me right away.

Are you trying to lynch me already based on that?

are you trying to lynch her
already
based on that?

No, I wasn't but I thought his reaction was over the top. Looking back on it, it's kind of townish in a way. As scum, he wouldn't fight me on an initial townread of any kind, but to turn it into a scumread right away without really questioning me about it was way too reactive and put him back to null/ maybe slight scum for me after that.

I will repeat what I said before. Scum will try to find just one townie they can convince others are scum to win. His quick reaction to do that to me raised some alarms.

[SilverWolf]

droog is good as scum, so don't expect to be able to figure him out easily if he's scum this game, I've played two games with him where he was scum and he won them both.

have we ever played town together?
kinda hoping we are
after 425 scum silver is as cary idea

Nope, we have not been town together in a game. I am not scum in this one so you don't have to worry about me if you are town. If you are scum, you do.

[SilverWolf]

Because if I can get a sort of town read on a third player, then the chances are higher that one of the other 2 are scum and we only have to lynch one of them. I'm basically trying to crowd out the scum in a way by figuring out who is town first rather than who is scum. I can't see a better way to do this but if you have one, I'd like to hear it.

if youre trying to figure out who /not/ to lynch
this looks more like white flag guarding

It seems like a good idea for town to handle nightless like this. I've never even played white flag before. I was hoping some others would have some ideas for a strategy but I don't think anyone but you has really.

[SilverWolf]

so its vintually impossible
to scumread somone
with a kitten avatar
hi

Too friendly. Too much trying to get him on your side. Don't like.

If you are scum faking that, whatever, but I genuinely feel really awful that I've discouraged you from continuing.

hm
ive seen this kind of blowup from town silver
but ive seen silver blow up in lots of games

Overexaggeration. You've played with me in two games. I did lose my cool in one of them but you and the other scum were emotionally manipulating me so to say I blow up in lots of game is trying to discredit Kitten's townread on me.

im a sucker for silver when shes angry

What's your point here? I got angry with you for emotionally manipulating me as scum. It is because of things like that, that I don't use those tactics myself. I also got angry at another friend of mine in a recent game who went after me in a much worse way than you did in that game. He had to apologize to me post game, it was that bad. These two examples are why I never, ever fake or use emotions to my advantage. I may be willing to lie and be more manipulative as scum than I would be as town-I don't know how you win as scum if you don't-but I have my limits. If I get upset, it's real.

[SilverWolf]

Here's one I was town, droog was scum game.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=84&t=59948

Here's another one.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=84&t=59720

[SilverWolf]

Question for everyone else in the game except droog: What do you think of droog's enterance to the game so far?

[SilverWolf]

I didn't ask you to clear me. I asked you to read me. There is a huge difference there. If you can't, then we might have a bit of a problem here because I have you as scum by PoE and I'd love to be able to rectify that if you are town.

[SilverWolf]

I'm not asking for a townread. I'm saying there should be enough material there to at least have some sort of idea about me outside of actually null.

And droog-Your slot, Jeanne told me I was town and she was town in her first/only post. I hadn't posted much then so how in the world did she know I was town?

[SilverWolf]

One thing I will say about Jeanne, she might of been townreading me because she just got out of a game with me where I was town and she was scum but it seemed weird that she was so certain of it. Also, her lurking caused me to scumread the slot because lurking is a great strategy for scum this game with a strict deadline. I know you don't lurk as scum though.

[SilverWolf]

droog is good as scum, so don't expect to be able to figure him out easily if he's scum this game, I've played two games with him where he was scum and he won them both.

have we ever played town together?
kinda hoping we are
after 425 scum silver is as cary idea

Nope, we have not been town together in a game. I am not scum in this one so you don't have to worry about me if you are town. If you are scum, you do.

clear this up for me
maybe this isnt your intent
but this sounds a little like
"if you suspect me ill know youre scum"

That quote in particular was just me telling you, you only have to worry about me if you are scum. This quote might be helpful in explaining why I get upset at being scumread as town. It was in my last towngame and was said to me by Psyche.

Your vote on me is based on this naive assumption basically every townie has every game that they are

obviously

town. That if someone thinks they're scum then that someone is either ridiculously dumb or mafia pushing a mislynch. I'm a victim of it, and right now, you are, too. But it's an unrealistic assumption that results in lame situations like these.

[SilverWolf]

One thing I will say about Jeanne, she might of been townreading me because she just got out of a game with me where I was town and she was scum but it seemed weird that she was so certain of it. Also, her lurking caused me to scumread the slot because lurking is a great strategy for scum this game with a strict deadline. I know you don't lurk as scum though.

'so certain of it'
like your reads
youre blowing up really small events

I am a very difficult mislynch for scum because I fight back very aggressively against any scumread of any kind. I have a habit of being kind of OMGUSy and reactionary to being scumread or wagoned for what I see as bad reasons by either scum pushing a mislynch or town thinking I'm scum because I'm being scummy as town. It's not really a strategy. It's just kind of the way I am. I tend to get emotional a lot. I do it more as town than I ever have as scum. I don't know why. I am trying to work on this very hard because I don't like getting upset in games. It's stupid because it is only a game and is supposed to be fun. Stepping away works pretty well and that's why I say things like "I'm just not going to play for awhile or don't expect much for awhile" It's extremely scummy AtE but it's totally a towntell for me. That's self meta but whateves.

[SilverWolf]

One thing I will say about Jeanne, she might of been townreading me because she just got out of a game with me where I was town and she was scum but it seemed weird that she was so certain of it. Also, her lurking caused me to scumread the slot because lurking is a great strategy for scum this game with a strict deadline. I know you don't lurk as scum though.

'so certain of it'
like your reads
youre blowing up really small events

I mean she said she KNOWS I am town.

When someone uses the wording "I know you are town" right away-doesn't that seem scummy to you?

[SilverWolf]

each time we've playde efore
i never really had to scumhunt you
now i do

This is a fair point. I can give you a few townpoints for this.

I honestly don't know for sure who is scum which is why my reads are changing like crazy. There is just not enough to go on. Whoever is town in this game has to participate or I don't see how town can win outside of guessing correctly.

[SilverWolf]

yeah
but youre not goin to convince me
that my slots town

What?

You aren't town?

[SilverWolf]

I'm not scum with anyone so that should help you quite a bit. Droog could be town. I'm starting to lean that way due to his approach towards me which is much different than how he approached me as scum.

KittenLicks trying to solve the game looks somewhat townish right now.

So yeah, enomis/BRantz-enomis is townier than BRantz but enomis tunneling on me had me worried (it's easy as scum to just sit and tunnel/question someone and that's most of what he did) and BRantz hasn't really said or done a lot to draw attention to himself being pretty UTR and hard to read-perfect strategy for scum.

My guess:

enomis/BRantz scumteam with a better chance of BRantz being scum if I'm wrong on the team here:

FoS: BRantz

[SilverWolf]

Also, BRantz was townreading enomis all game and enomis was null reading BRantz.

[SilverWolf]

Need to hear from enomis.

[SilverWolf]

I skimmed the conversation btw SW and droog but they seem useless to me.

If you think the conversation between droog and I is worthless, that tells me you have no interest in trying to sort droog which makes no sense coming from town.

[SilverWolf]

Also enomis, droog asked you some questions which you ignored. You clearly aren't reading the game and going from tunnel to tunnel.

I'm actually pretty good with enomis as scum and I'd go along with a vote on him if town wanted to go that way.

[SilverWolf]

sw just shifted on enormis too easily

Considering I had him and BRantz as a possible team, I didn't. I don't really care for him saying our conversation is worthless and not even trying to figure you out. It makes no sense coming from town.

[SilverWolf]

That post by Kitten says nothing. It is a wall of words that says absolutely nothing. There is no trying to figure out the game there SW. Don't be blinded by it.

FoS: Kitten

I am here droog, whats up?

I also don't like this post because clearly Kitten's post said something.

[SilverWolf]

droog-You've been going after me and misrepping me since you got in the thread

It is not at all uncommon for me to change my mind and my reads very easily when I don't have all the answers. I'm getting sick and tired of you coming in here and doubtcasting me every time I post something. It's getting old. It's a waste of time. I am not scum and we have about 3 days left after today.

I do that shit all the time as town. It's because I don't have the answers and I worry I might be wrong. I can point you to a game where I was voting for all 3 of the scum at one point and let them all go because something got me to change my mind or remember Antarctic where I let LP go when he was at L-1. It's something I'm working on because I'm very indecisive sometimes. I'm a lot more sure of myself as scum when I know all the answers.

droog-I thought you might be town but I feel like you are tunnelling on me because everyone is townreading me. It's exactly what enomis did. I don't like it.

I'm allowed to change my mind based on new information I see. If I didn't change my reads and I was super sure of myself, I'd probably be scum. I'm not. I'd like you to concentrate on someone else for awhile because I am not scum and I don't want to lose.

[SilverWolf]

but then when i look through your posts
your read on enomis is really inconsistent
it jumps from 'may or may not'
to slowly becoming scum
and then it jums to town

and once i start playing
it jumps back to scum

BS, that's crap. enomis did not jump back to scum because you were playing, stop with the damn misrep

Kitten got townier to me with his last few posts trying to figure out teams and his theory of BRantz/enomis made sense and was well thought out, enomis came in here ignoring you completely which was alarming to me since if he's town, he should be answering your questions and trying to figure you out.

This whole game has been concentrating on me and that's fucking annoying because I am not fucking scum this game.

You especially have started your damn tunnel after I was already attacked almost immediately by Kitten early game, tunnelled by enomis, and BRantz got ticked at me also.

Fuck, If I was scum, I'd lurk this shit out for the win. Seriously. OR I'd concentrate on one person who I knew was town, trying to get a mislynch-kind of like what you and enomis have been doing.

Wouldn't be surprised if you two were the scumteam here at this point.

Call me when it's time to vote. I'm putting stock in Kitten being town and will go along with him mostly likely with a vote. If he's scum, then it wouldn't be the first time I'm wrong.

Tired of this shit.

[SilverWolf]

its kind of ilke
youre willing to compromise
and haggle over
your reads

It's kind of like

This is a blatant misrep of me entirely

[SilverWolf]

its lik your reads
jump based on whoever is in the thread
aty any give ntim

hm

My reads are based on new input whenever it gets put in the thread.

I don't give a shit who's around when I post my thoughts.

I could just STFU for the rest of the game since most are townreading me correctly but I'd like to give my input when I have something to say and it'd be nice if you could actually not misrep everything I say every time I say something or I will give up until voting time.

[SilverWolf]

This game is only 10 days with very limited information. I have to be willing to change my mind very quickly. Because I don't have tons of time or info. to analyze.

That should be pretty obvious and I'm giving reads whenever I get them. Who else is doing that? Mostly Kitten. Who I think is town and who I'm probably going to sheep and hope to hell I'm right about.

Good night.

[SilverWolf]

BS, that's crap. enomis did not jump back to scum because you were playing, stop with the damn misrep

as in
how is this even a misrep
enormis was a townread for you
"probtown"
after i come in the game
((yes, given some time))
he becomes a scumread again

I've explained this twice now. His reaction to your entrance to the game was that our interaction was worthless and he ignored your questions. Not trying to figure you out is not town motivated IMO.

Kitten made sense with enomis/BRantz as a possibility.

He's tunneling on specific people.

BRantz deciding Kitten's posts didn't say anything when they clearly did, did not sit well with me either.

At least you are trying to figure things out. I get suspicious when I'm the sole focus of it however but this is not as strong of a suspicion as enomis and BRantz behavior and even that isn't super strong because the info. on them is limited due to being instant lylo this game

[SilverWolf]

BRantz-It would be super helpful if you explain why Kitten is off. If you can't do that, I'd really like the mod to replace you and freeze deadline then. You haven't posted much and you are making yourself unreadable by saying Kitten is off but not telling us why and going V/LA.

[SilverWolf]

You know, I realize everyone is busy with RL but this game was supposed to be fast paced when you signed up and I feel like people did not keep that in mind when they signed up or they are scum.

I am fine voting BRantz, if I'm wrong, then so be it. I think enomis/BRantz is the likeliest scumteam.

[SilverWolf]

@Brantz

If you were scum, who would your partner be?

If you are going to disappear, please answer my question first?

What is the point of this question? Do you think anyone is going to tell you who they are likely scum with, especially if they are scum? What will this tell you exactly?

[SilverWolf]

@enomis: kitten is a little different. But I don't want to explain why just yet.

@Kitten: I may or may not answer your question about what I hoped to get out of your answer later. (If not during the game please feel free to remind me in post game and I will cetainlt answer then.

Is this something you can elaborate on?

[SilverWolf]

Hey. Sorry about being inactive.

@Kitten:

That whole logical argument of your makes no sense to me.

Explain why.

[SilverWolf]

e
kitten looks town

What is this read based on?

[SilverWolf]

@Brantz

If you were scum, who would your partner be?

If you are going to disappear, please answer my question first?

What is the point of this question? Do you think anyone is going to tell you who they are likely scum with, especially if they are scum? What will this tell you exactly?

No. I am about 90% sure that if Brantz was scum the name he gives me would not be his partner. Is that not a very valuable piece of information to you?

I have to tell you, if I was scum and you asked me that question, I wouldn't answer it at all.

[SilverWolf]

@Brantz

If you were scum, who would your partner be?

If you are going to disappear, please answer my question first?

What is the point of this question? Do you think anyone is going to tell you who they are likely scum with, especially if they are scum? What will this tell you exactly?

No. I am about 90% sure that if Brantz was scum the name he gives me would not be his partner. Is that not a very valuable piece of information to you?

I have to tell you, if I was scum and you asked me that question, I wouldn't answer it at all.

Hey, SW, if you were scum who would your partner be? <3

Probably you or droog. <3

[SilverWolf]

enomis-I did not say scum play that way every time. I said that would be the best strategy for this game and one of the things I was looking for. I have not really raged. I do get frustrated easy but it's a personality tell for me and I've already explained why it happens. It's not something that happens in every town game or never happens when I'm scum. I can change my meta so I would caution you against relying too much on meta to read people although I tend to meta a lot as well. I really liked your last post so now I'm confused and thinking you MIGHT be town here. I really can't figure it out for sure. The only thing I feel semi confident in is BRantz scum right now and that's by no means a sure thing but he hasn't really been doing much like you said. droog may be town because he's taking a different approach to the game than I've seen him do as scum but that could be the mechanics of this game. I also consider him trying to sort and interact with people to be more town than scum in this type of game and if you disagree-well, so be it. Unless something major happens, I'm good with voting BRantz when we get closer to deadline.

[SilverWolf]

@Brantz

If you were scum, who would your partner be?

If you are going to disappear, please answer my question first?

What is the point of this question? Do you think anyone is going to tell you who they are likely scum with, especially if they are scum? What will this tell you exactly?

No. I am about 90% sure that if Brantz was scum the name he gives me would not be his partner. Is that not a very valuable piece of information to you?

I have to tell you, if I was scum and you asked me that question, I wouldn't answer it at all.

how can he avoid it?

He hasn't answered it yet. He's been avoiding a few questions.

[SilverWolf]

e
kitten looks town

What is this read based on?

i liked the way kitten answered my questions
the thing with her logic feels town
both make it look like
shes really spending time reading this game

Nice-You give Kitten a townread really quick for spending time this game answering questions and trying to game solve but tell me you aren't going to clear me just for putting in more effort than anyone else.

Is there some reason you are harder on me than him?

[SilverWolf]

hm
im scared
sw
are you scum with droog?

No, I am town. The townreads on me are correct. That means though that it is likely at least one scum has decided to townread me and maybe both of them have.

droog is the only one here who has played with me before-he was scum both times against town me, he never even bothered trying to mislynch me. His going after me is one of two things:

-He's scum that wants to change his meta with me and get me to townread him by not buddying me or townreading me like he has in our past games where he's been scum.

-He's town who has played with me before and thinks he can figure me out the easiest and is concerned about everyone townreading me because scum will probably townread their partners

-that logic makes me think the scum is either enomis/BRantz since BRantz townread enomis right away, enomis/Kitten since Kitten townread enomis right away or droog/Kitten since droog is giving Kitten an easier townread than me

-I'm leaning enomis/BRantz only because of the interactions between them are pretty weak and BRantz is the least towny player in the game.

You'll notice neither one of them want to townread Kitten so I doubt either of them are scum with him.

[SilverWolf]

OK you have Kitten as town-what about anyone else? Town or scumreads?

[SilverWolf]

I'm pretty confident in a BRantz vote eventually but there is a small paranoid part of me that thinks it's Kitten/droog in which case, they will probably win.

^^^^^^^^^^^

If that isn't the team, then a BRantz vote will likely be a win. I'm not seeing enomis/Kitten at all really. If they are the team, then gg.

droog-Your ability to read me is crap then if you still think I might be scum or you are scum with a different approach. I'm used to losing to you as scum though so w/e.

[SilverWolf]

Soon we should come together and talk about how we are going to vote and anyone can say anything else they want to before then.

[SilverWolf]

Chasing me would be a mistake but I don't think you are going to believe I'm town until the mod flips me when the game is over.

It's either Kitten/droog, enomis/BRantz for teams for me. enomis/BRantz are far more likely IMO than Kitten/droog.

I am fine with voting BRantz as he could go with anyone if I'm wrong about teams.

[SilverWolf]

I'm V/LA in my other games but not this one because we are so close to deadline.

I'm ready to vote whenever the rest of town agrees. BRantz is my first choice but I'd be willing to listen to more input if anyone has anything else to say.

[SilverWolf]

That's fine but we have about a day left. So tomorrow, I'm voting unless someone else has something to say. If BRantz is town, he lost the game by going out of town and not posting for days in a game like this. I simply do not care what the reason is. You sign up, you play or you replace. In a game like this, it's especially important.

[SilverWolf]

I'm at the point where I just don't want it to be a NL and scum to win that way.

It's not me and Kitten. You've been paranoid of me all game. I really feel like I'm just over defending myself this game.

I will be voting BRantz tomorrow and whatever happens, happens. He works best as partners with the most people and he feels like scum who doesn't even want to try.

[SilverWolf]

Well, the mod never came in and said one day remaining so I'm not sure how much time we have left but I'd actually like a countdown timer if possible.

Or I will come back in a few hours and vote BRantz. If someone has a case for someone else I'm willing to listen.

droog/enomis is possible but I think BRantz goes with more people and I really don't like how either enomis or BRantz is writing off Kitten's trying to figure out the game as nothing or myself or droog actively trying to engage and sort people as non-alignment indicative. I don't agree with either of these things.

[SilverWolf]

droog/kitten scumteam is possible and makes me very paranoid

enomis-do you think it's possible BRantz is scum?

[SilverWolf]

So as far as I know deadline is today. BRantz is obviously not going to post any more. Does anyone know where our mod is?

[SilverWolf]

I think you are townreading Kitten too easily compared to anyone else but there isn't much I can do about it if you two are the scumteam.

I don't even think BRantz will be around to vote. I'm kind of disappointed that people signed up for a game that required participation to play and decided not to participate.

[SilverWolf]

I am not scum but droog does worry me some with his eagerness to call you town and stubborn refusal to drop his scumread on me. However, there isn't much I can do about this right now. I doubt he's scum with enomis (since enomis is calling him scum right now) so if he is scum, it's likely with BRantz or Kitten. I'm fine losing to Kitten/droog if that's the case. I will go along with a BRantz vote if that is what is decided. I'm not even going to be upset if I lose just so long as we don't lose with a NL.

Is everyone ready to vote?

[SilverWolf]

You've been implying it's me for awhile now. What do you want me to say to Kitten? I've been saying she's wrong and the only person I feel like she could be scum with is you and I already accepted, at this late date. that I will lose if that's the case.

If you want to change the story to me being scum again on the last day, you go ahead but you better not bring us to NL.

[SilverWolf]

I can vote for either BRantz or enomis.

Kitten-what do you want to do?

If you, droog, and myself are all together, I think we'll be o.k. here.

*hopefully*

[SilverWolf]

Since you have a paranoia read on me, how about I vote first? I don't know where the mod is but hopefully he'll check in soon. I'm ready to vote and have nothing else to add. If you and droog are scum, gg. It won't be the first time I fucked up lylo. See 425 that droog was in

VOTE: BRantz

[SilverWolf]

It shows me that you and droog are not the scumteam which is exactly what I needed to see.

[SilverWolf]

I really don't have anything else to add and feel confident with my vote. If you want me to unvote I can but it isn't going to change anything.

[SilverWolf]

I wish I knew what happened to the mod. Today is supposed to be the last day and I haven't heard from him since he said 2 days left. But I'll leave the decision up to you Kitten. I've voted and done all I'm going to do.

[SilverWolf]

I'm sick and tired of losing as town. I've been losing all my town games and it sucks. I suck at this game.