Micro 657: Vanillite Mafia (Game Over!)

[Dark Horse]

What do you guys think of gucci mane

[Dark Horse]

What do you guys think of gucci mane

I don't know what gucci mane is?

gucci mane

He's a rapper.

(I don't listen to rap. I just looked it up myself).

Personally, rap is not my personal style of music that I enjoy.

Damn thats not very trill of you guys but I'll let it slide.

I would RVS but I don't think anything will happen.

What does this mean

[Dark Horse]

I am so lit right now so trill and turnt my dudes!

"Rock with it lean with it styrofoam with lean in it party not poppin less my whole fuckin team in it" - Gandhi, probably

[Dark Horse]

@Dark Horse are you related to Zachstrilka at all?

No idea who that is

[Dark Horse]

VOTE: Aeronaut

[Dark Horse]

Creature how are you townreading shannon

[Dark Horse]

@Dark Horse are you related to Zachstrilka at all?

Though maybe since I don't know who zachstrilka is I don't get how this contributes to the game at all. Feels more like an rvs questoin

[Dark Horse]

@dark horse it's just me making conversation. Zach also posts song lyrics in almost every post.

Yeah that's what I figured, which makes getting a town read off it it weird

Does this zach guy posts lyrics from good songs

[Dark Horse]

VOTE: shannon

Found scum boys let's this game moving

[Dark Horse]

34 and 35 both sound way too cautious. That second line in 35 feels really forced

[Dark Horse]

k

lol do you honestly think your "reads out of weird things" are better

[Dark Horse]

Tell me when your reads start "developing" because it doesn't seem like you'll do anything before then

[Dark Horse]

ThinkBig why did you wait until now to vote creature

[Dark Horse]

ThinkBig why did you wait until now to vote creature

Mostly to try and get some activity going.

Shannon's scum though, there's no need for "empty votes" right now

[Dark Horse]

Dude I literally answered your first question earlier today. Try to actually

comprehend

stuff before asking questions

If someone hammered her at L-1 right now then they've basically admitted that they're scum.

[Dark Horse]

Because no townsperson should want to end the day right now, where it feels like half the town is still stuck in rvs.

[Dark Horse]

There are four scenarios for if shannon is put at L-1 right now and then immediatley quickhammered.

Shannon is scum, Person hammering is town: though it would nail scum, hammering as town rn if a really bad decision because of how little this game has progressed
Shannon is scum, person hammering is scum: Would be one hell of a bus, but very unlikely, considering how much scrutiny the hammering person would be under
Shannon is town, person hammering is town: See first option. Hammering as town now is really stupid
Shannon is town person hammering is scum: Denies the town the rest of the day while not lynching your partner. The only option that doesn't involve shooting yourself in the foot.

As such, the only scenario where I see a quicklynch actually happening is if shannon is town and the person hammering is scum. It's not like I 100% known that shannon is scum

lol @ Aeronaut thinking I'm tunneling just because I'm actually trying to put some effort wrt a scum read

[Dark Horse]

She hasn't said anything that changes my opinion. How are you getting a strong town vibe

[Dark Horse]

I'm focusing on you because think big asked me about you specifically. What I laid out applies to any one in that situation.

Give me one scenario where a townie should hammer another townie this early

[Dark Horse]

Hammering right now is incredibly anti town because half the town has yet to make any meaningful contributions
If there was someone at L-1 right now and a townie quickhammered I'd never want to play mafia with that townie again

[Dark Horse]

Aeronaut what are your reads

[Dark Horse]

And if you answer "nothing solid" then you have no right to say that i'm tunneling

[Dark Horse]

There you go, I was wondering how long it was going to take for you to come out and actually say that I'm scum. Trying to discredit me only to vote algebra was a bad move

Creature's town, thinkbig's slightly town

So I asked you this before, why is shannon town? It's annoying that instead of answering this you've tried to discredit my push instead. The fact that you asked me to clarify the hammering stuff, and then then tried attacking me for clarifying hammering stuff was terrible.

[Dark Horse]

PS - I agree with you about scum being more fun to play, but hopefully neither of us is having a fun game today and we're both Team Town.

My biggest problem with shannon comes with how forced this line feels. Yeah, I can see a noob town doing "fwiw I have no reads right now," but this in particular comes off as incredibly unnatural.

The whole reason why it seems like I'm "tunneling" shannon is that it seems like most of the people who are actually posting in this town are putting zero commitment in their votes. That's why it felt like an RVS stage for so long. You want to get out of RVS? You have to actually try to get the game moving, which is what I did. I think she's scum, and by actually sticking on her instead of trying to pressure inactives like some other people here I was able to give us some actual meaningful discussion

I didn't give you my reads earlier because town reads aren't as important in this stage of the game.

And of course, there's only so much I can do to get the game moving. For this game to really take off we need opinions from people like algebra and thinkbig, who have yet to take any meaningful stances.

[Dark Horse]

Creature's town, thinkbig's slightly town

I felt like creature was also making an effort to get past RVS, and I liked thinkbig's quickhammer question

[Dark Horse]

Dark horse is town

Are you going to say anything else

[Dark Horse]

i really would like to lynch algebra tbh

I can get behind this. 99 is janky as hell, plus the general lack of contribution

[Dark Horse]

Creature how were you scumreading thinkbig

[Dark Horse]

Why did you only jump on thinkbig after creature suggested thinkbig scum first

[Dark Horse]

@mod can we get a replacement for flames, he clearly doesn't give a shit about this game

VOTE: Algebra

[Dark Horse]

Then why didn't you do it earlier

[Dark Horse]

Anyone who bothers to keep track of the votes should know that I put him at L-1.

Algebra's posts since #99 have been scummier than anything you've done.

[Dark Horse]

Why don't you answer my question

[Dark Horse]

Nvm, "I was still sorting out the game" was a pretty terrible response

[Dark Horse]

Welcome flames!

Bruh postie has given more reads in her first post than you have all game

[Dark Horse]

Thinkbig's #135 is so so bad. It's annoying because I'm not sure if he's scum or just that bad.

My biggest gripe with newbtown algebra is the fact that he doesn't have a good reason for why he waited until creature brought up thinkbig scum. I feel like a townie would have some reason, instead of a vague "I didn't have the game sorted out"

[Dark Horse]

Thinkbig's #135 is so so bad. It's annoying because I'm not sure if he's scum or just that bad.

What exactly is bad about it?

I am new and still learning the game, so please bear with me.

Your first two questions were already explicitly answered. I'm not sure how you possibly missed that.

You say you're fosing creature and agree with shannon saying I'm scum but you're not voting either one of us

It's incredibly annoying how little thinking you've put into this game. The majority of your posts just seem to be you saying "Why X?"

[Dark Horse]

Shannon's 105 did very little to generate discussion, as evidenced by the fact that

literally no one discussed

it until Aeronaut brought it up now.

Compare that to my push on shannon, which actually generated discussion.

Also creature why are you saying that shannon's basic reads list is "ok since we're on page seven," but my initial evidence on shannon from page two was "too flimsy." You're holding me and shannon to two very different standards.

[Dark Horse]

Plus complaining about activity in the thread but not doing anything else does nothing to encourage activity. I honestly have no idea how you think that shannon has contributed the most to this game

[Dark Horse]

And here you are, now following what Postie is doing just like you were following my read of algebra.

Don't try to take any credit for that. algebra's posts since 99 are the scummiest content in this entire game. Anyone who didn't at least consider algebra scum was doing a poor job scumhunting. Notice how outside of creature's very early vote, no one aside from you was voting algebra before that. People who started suspecting algebra (such as me and shannon) did so primarily on the basis of algebra's wagon hopping and further interactions, which is very different than if we were trying to sheep you.

... no it didn't. You're "push" on shannon to which you later admitted was just because you didn't feel good about one single post and had no real reasoning as to why; please point out any place where that generated any sort of discussion, because the only discussion I see that it created was me realizing you're likely scum this game

Are you fucking kidding me? My push on shannon was what started legitimate discussion in this thread. Me vs shannon and me vs you were the first legitimate debates in this thread. Before it was rvs and people saying "oh lets vote an inactive to pressure" and then preceding to do absolutely jack shit. Literally this entire postie-me-you discussion comes from what I've said. Compre that to shannon's read list.

Please lay out a case for why she is scum. Also, can you tell me why you decided Algebra was more deserving of your vote than her when you switched? Thanks.

Why on earth would I lay out a case for you, considering the leaps and bounds of logic you're willing to take to say that she's town

I already answered your second question multiple times including posts 121

Ok, but in most of her posting, she seems to be very genuine to me, just as you somehow think that the handful of shitposts that Algebra calls an ISO is somehow genuine. AGAIN, she could have very easily been much less active and allowing the game the die instead of continually posting.

Her activity posts are among some of the laziest content you can attempt to provide in order to "look busy." They're more scummy than town, as it makes a person look like they're participating without actually having to produce any content.

What? So shaky reads don't matter...? ok, well can you show me where at all he "committed" to them? The point i'm trying to get across to you is that he didn't commit to them. He had exactly one read he was pushing very hard, which was Shannon. He went with the "X is scum, vote them please" without reasoning early game schtick that almost always comes from scum. He seemed very sure of this read but then cited like ONE LINE OF ONE POST and said "oh this sounded too cautious" which is absolute bullshit.

Do you not understand what pressure is? Day starts, I see shannon doing something somewhat scummy. Instead of being comtent with rvs voting or voting an inactive, I decide to try and get some pressure going, in order to get a better sense of whether shannon is town or scum.

You're also claiming that I gave no reasons for inisitally voting, which is completely wrong.

VOTE: shannon

Found scum boys let's this game moving

VOTE: shannon

Found scum boys let's this game moving

What made you think Shannon is scum?

34 and 35 both sound way too cautious. That second line in 35 feels really forced

I gave reasons immediately after I voted. The only way you could have missed it is if you were trying to be reachy as fuck

Not to mention, when you showed up Postie and voted ThinkBig, he immediately 180'd his townread on him and immediately started showing shade on him and calling him scum. If anything, Dark Horse is going with the flow as much as possible.

I said I'm not sure whether thinkbig's post is indicative dumbtown or dumb scum. There's a reason why I'm not voting him, and that's because I'm leaning towards dumb town more than dumb scum.

He has shown no aggression in trying to push other people, and still just jumps on whoever the bigger players (e.g. you and I) are voting. See his vote on Algebra, see his shade on Thinkbig, directly after each of us started moving that way. There's no actual original reads that he has besides those two town reads that he's since 180'd on anyway, and shannon who he's not pushing.

It's funny how when I was first pushing shannnon you were passive aggresively complaining about how I was tunneling her asking me stuff like "are you really going to tunnel for all of D1?" when it was lke the 2 or 3rd irl day and now suddenly I'm the one who's being too passive

And I haven't been pushing shannon because I've been dealing with oushing algebra and now I have to deal with you

[Dark Horse]

And if by "straightening out" my DH read you mean getting me to change my vote, then you're not going to accomplish that today. You've provided us with no other case on anybody else except for ThinkBig, which is minimal at best. You've also given me no points on why my reasoning on DH is wrong. I have a very solid case here and it's time that you join me on this wagon.

For supposedly not being a newbie you are dense as fuck

[Dark Horse]

Why am I always scumread gosh darn it going from a player that I pushed for being inactive to someone that I think is scum isn't even wagonhopping

Why did you only jump on thinkbig after creature suggested thinkbig scum first

@mod can we get a replacement for flames, he clearly doesn't give a shit about this game

VOTE: Algebra

Why did you only jump on thinkbig after creature suggested thinkbig scum first

I would've voted thinkbig regardless if creature did or not

Then why didn't you do it earlier

The primary purpose of these interactions was to determinne if algebra was noobtown or noobscum. I said that I'd be willing to lymch because nothing gets noobscum more nervous than more people being willing to lynch them. I found that algebra was unable to answer several questions that a noobtown would have probably been able to answer. What did you do again? Vote an inactive, and then say you'd love to lynch him with no reason give?

[Dark Horse]

Again postie, I don't see how you don't look at those four posts and see someone who trying to discredit me for pushing him, instead of actually responding to any of things I was asking.

You're questions were a thinly veiled attempt at discrediting my post without having to call me scum. Especially considering some if your questions (Asking me if I'm going to tunnel a read right after I decide to pursue it?), I was incredibly skeptical of your intentions

[Dark Horse]

I'm glad you've started to join and ask me things too instead of letting postie do all the work.

Shannon's 105 did very little to generate discussion, as evidenced by the fact that

literally no one discussed

it until Aeronaut brought it up now.

Compare that to my push on shannon, which actually generated discussion.

Also creature why are you saying that shannon's basic reads list is "ok since we're on page seven," but my initial evidence on shannon from page two was "too flimsy." You're holding me and shannon to two very different standards.

Plus complaining about activity in the thread but not doing anything else does nothing to encourage activity. I honestly have no idea how you think that shannon has contributed the most to this game

Just because I'm not trying to clog the thread doesn't mean I'm ignoring what you say

So you do not have a case. You understand that you're not helping anybody to understand why we should vote with you if you're not going to provide reasoning, right?

Right now trying to convince people that shannon's scum is not a priority for me

Ok, you did. Would you say algebra is still the scummiest?

Yep

Please show me some posts by Flames, Thinkbig, Algebra, you, or myself that are less lazy/genuine, because I don't see any.

Thinkbig's questions, Algebra's reads, this whole argument we're having. All of these do significantly more to progress the day than just complaining about inactivity.

That's a shady as fuck reason for how sure you were trying to make it seem. Either way, I'm more focused on the fact that you were trying to look busy and eventually backtracked anyway.

If you want good results you can't half-ass your pushes. The reason that the game got off to such a slow start was because everyone was half-assing their pushes

What would you say Shannon's alignment is now?

She's been less scummy. I feel like a noobscum could have easily followed you in accusing me. The fact that she's willing to look at it from her own angle is very town.

After looking back, you're right, you didn't explicitly call him scum, and that's my bad. You did tell me though that you had had a townread on him, and now you've sort of redacted that? What's your current read on him?

I had him as solidly dumb town, but his catch up post was really bad. I still think he's town, but not as convincingly as I did before his catcb

Good thing you redacted the first part of this post where I say that 44 is an exception to that. As I've said, in what Postie cited as you being "aggressive", 3/4 of those posts were just you yelling and complaining because I was pushing you in the slightest way. Thats not aggression, it's flailing.

Why would I be flailing? No one else is supporting your read on me. Even the person you've been whiteknighting thinks that I'm town

Again, you're the one that's commenting on the conversation I'm having with Postie. Feel free to go do whatever you want with Algebra. I still feel like he could be scum; if you want to present a case to me as to why he's worse the you, go ahead.

Algebra's very clearly badnwagoning, and is only active when he's on the chopping block. When he's not on the spotlight, he'll just occasionally toss out a read, and provide nothing else (See: right now). There are several actions he's done where noob townie would have some sort of justification for, that he can't answer.

Yeah, but to me it feels like you didn't say anything about it until I was on board.

As you can see from the shitstorm of quote-walls in this game, trying to get a lynch through that I don't agree with is going to be difficult

, especially since we've got 7 people which is way too small to making dumb lynches. Granted, It's not like it was that long in between the time where Algebra puked all over the game and the time when I said he'd probably be a good lynch, so maybe I should give you a pass there.

By the time I had shown up to the thread after algebra's 99 post, you had already commented on it. You might have had a valid case if I had posted anything in between Algebra's 99 and your post, but I hadn't. Hell, you posted you're "I'd like to lynch algebra"

five minutes

after Algebra's post. How was I supposed to comment on algebra's 99 before that?

You take too much pride in the bolded part. These walls are incredibly anti-town, and do a good job clogging up the thread.

What do you make of Postie's opposition to an Algebra lynch?

She said she'd elaborate on it, so I'll wait until she does that

Postie just did a similar thing for about two pages on me, but I don't see you calling her out for it?

Postie has made much more of an effort to get her hands dirty than you had. She has also explained why she thinks I'm town, which is something you hadn't done. Do know how wack it is to see someone try to discredit approach without giving any in depth reasons for why he thinks my scumread's town?

What? In the span of four posts he discredits me, calls me scum, and basically says I'm shit player. You just described to me exactly my own reasoning for why he's scum. It's not a "gradient" if it's in the span of like 20 minutes

You're acting like I made those four posts in a row. They were all based on different lackluster responses that you had made over time. The 20 minutes remark is completely false. Anyone who has looked at that part of the thread knows this. Why are you making stuff up?

[Dark Horse]

okay so wow reading all of this is painful, everything is just one or two lines. I really don't like that 90% of dissucssion between pages 6-9 are just postie/aero talking back and forth. I'm not entirely sure what to think about this interaction though. There's been quite a dominant force of aero/postie deciding where the game goes and I don't really like that at all.

I haven't really seen any posts silencing anyone though, so I guess that's more on everyone else not posting.

I would like to hear more from algebra, as I feel his alignment will come rather naturally to everyone if he just posts more content. I'll do a read over again tomorrow when I get the chance, it's hard to process everything when it's as quick as lackluster as I feel it currently is. I'd like to see more content from EVERYONE, no one is really

explaining reads to the full effect that I'd like

. Or really sharing hard reads at all. I get that it's early into the game, but you have to start somewhere.

@postie With all the attention you've been giving to aero, do you still find TB to be your topscum?
@TB and algebra I'd really like to see both of your top town/scum reads in the game currently.

Underlined part feels really weird

What is the full effect you're talking about

This feels like a post you'd make after page 2 or 3, not right now. We had a person at L-1, and whole arguments over specific scumreads. Why are you trying to claim that no one in this town is sharing "hard reads"

[Dark Horse]

Why would everything being "quick and lackluster" make it more difficult to read the thread? Wouldn't it be easier, due to the lack of content?

Why are you asking algebra and thinkbig for a full reads list when you haven't given out any reads yet?

The more I look at 206 the less I like it

[Dark Horse]

Since I forgot to answer this

I am not sure what more I could have posted during a period where no one else seemed to be playing the game? What would you have done in my place?

I would have tried to ask questions, so people would have something to discuss. If you don't give people something to discuss in situations like that then its very easy for the situation to stagnate

[Dark Horse]

@Aeronaut what do you think of Wyvernite's entrance?

[Dark Horse]

V/LA UNTIL MONDAY AROUND 3:30 PM EST

I will still be reading and will try to post during this time, but I will have limited access until then.

Oh come on

[Dark Horse]

Aeronaut what ever happened to your algebra push?

[Dark Horse]

Scumreading the two people who call you out? Boooooo

Since you said it was a quick lowdown, I won't grill you on your lack of detail until you make a post that actually explains stuff like why Aeronaut's detail stands out, and why you don't like my defense at all.

There's several other wack parts about your posts, though.

If you and shannon have similar thought processes, why are your reads so different? Both of your scumreads are people that shannon thinks are town.

Postie's defense on me is far more then "it seems town." She's been cery clear with how she thinks I've been showing a logical thought process, which your strong townread Aero has said is very town indicative.

I hate the fact that you say you "pretty much agree" with what aero's saying about me. You sound like scum trying to piggy back off of a townie's read.

You better have some good content when you have time to provide more, because postwise you're 0/2

[Dark Horse]

I said that your 206 was bad while pointing out its flaws, and postie agreed with me that it felt very forced. That's calling you out.

You said your though process was very similiar. That's very different compared to "I can clearly understand what her though process is"

Postie explicitly mentioned posts where she explained how my thought process is town, so saying there aren't any is willful ignorance

Is there any reason for me to want you and DH dead, and shannon/aero alive?

Really now

[Dark Horse]

I feel like there's scum trying to create artificial factions between me/aero and DH/Postie. It's not an either/or situation, folks.

Yeah, it feels like wyvernite saw two groups of townies arguing with each other, and is trying to align himself with the townies that haven't criticized him yet

[Dark Horse]

Yeah aeronaut I feel like our argument has pretty much run its course. Especially now that shannon seems less and less likely to be scum with wyvern on the scene

I meant beforehand. Like when Shannon was making her posts, do you see anything that was any better?

There were people like thinkbig asking questions, but w/e.

Ok, now imagine the way you feel about me allegedly discrediting you, and reverse the situation. That's how I feel about that early posting.

Yeah I guess I can see where that confusion came from

I don't recall saying them in a row. You just got angry when I pushed you, which generally is a scum tell so early on.

I interpreted your post as thinking that my thought process change was very quick, when in reality it wasn't

Postie seems very sure that Algebra is town and I want to hear that reasoning first.

Fair enough

[Dark Horse]

VOTE: Wyvernite

I was going to wait until you went more in depth with your reads, but it doesn't look like I need to wait for that. This is textbook flailing scum

[Dark Horse]

Postie I think you have a good point with how stubborn algebra was vs thinkbig. However, I feel like there are times where it seems like he has switched his reads (He said that he hated one of creature's posts, but then later said he agreed with shannon that creature was town), and I don't like the fact that he basically admitted to sheeping shannon's reads. I still think he's scum. It doesn't help that he only posts frequently when he's basically on the chopping block

[Dark Horse]

I feel like there are times where it seems like he has switched his reads (He said that he hated one of creature's posts, but then later said he agreed with shannon that creature was town),

I can't find this anywhere in his ISO.

Shit I meant Aeronaut not creature. I'm talking about this post

Postie is just trying to sort me, which is fine. I'd rather her realize I'm town at this point so that we could work together, but not much is gonna get done at this rate

I really hate this, looks really fake

and I don't like the fact that he basically admitted to sheeping shannon's reads.

If you're talking about 260, I believe he was saying he townread shannon for having similar reads to him (which, btw, is a terrible reason to townread someone), not that he was sheeping her. I don't see why sheeping someone would be scummy anyway though.

It feels like he's trying to piggyback off of a townie's reads, especially considering how little reads he's given publicly

[Dark Horse]

I realize I might've been interpreting algebra's 260 wrong. I was assuming that he meant share reads as in "all of shannon's reads are similar to my reads" instead of "shannon's reads line up with the 2 reads that I have"

Though if he's not calling aeronaut town, I don't like that he basically's said nothing about aeronaut aside from that one post criticizing something aeronaut said

[Dark Horse]

Wyvenite scum makes me think the scum team's more of algebra/wyvernite than you. His interactions regarding you feel A LOT like scum trying to buddy a townie. Now there's multiple people who have acted signifigantly scummier than anything you've done, hence why I think it's less likely you're scum.

[Dark Horse]

Don't know what you mean by "super scum read"

[Dark Horse]

After that trash backtrack? You better have something good

[Dark Horse]

Wyvernite's posts read like he was banking on aeronaut stubbornly staying on me, and he's scrambling to come up with something now that it's no longer the case

[Dark Horse]

Your slot hasn't voted since rvs

So I'm assuming it's suppossed to be coincidence that as soon as Aeronaut started reconsidering his read on me, AND both of your town reads started voting you, you do a reread and retract your scum reads? Yeah no

[Dark Horse]

What? All of the active townies have expressed a willingness to lynch him. It's not like was more enemies for him to make by changing his reads.

He's now looking at algebra, the other person "up for lynch today". That looks like pursuing another wagon to me

Most of wyvern contents is incredibly scummy. I'd prefer to lynch scum over lynching an inactive

[Dark Horse]

Not only is wyv signifigantly scummier but a TB lynch gives us next to nothing. Considering there might be two scum in this setup, we could go to lylo with no progress on anything this day.

[Dark Horse]

Not only is wyv signifigantly scummier

I'm going to have to strongly disagree here.

Wyv has been incredibly scummy and I can't believe you honestly think he hasn't been scummier than someone you think is scum just from PoE.

If we lynch him today and he flips scum:

• algebra is cleared

Algebra wouldn't be confirmed town and we're absolutely not treating algebra as such.

[*]we're left with a pool of 4 people to choose between to lynch, all of which are actively posting[/list]

See above

If we lynch him today and he flips town:

• we eliminate an unknown who was going to be lynched eventually anyway

We're probably only allowed one mislynch the entire game. I'd prefer to give us room for error in case of a mislynch.

[*]we don't have to keep get frustrated over the fact that he's not doing anything[/list]

True but that's not a good enough reason for one mislynch. I wouldn't be surprised if he gets force replaced at this rate

If we don't lynch him today:

• we'll likely have to decide whether to lynch between him or algebra tomorrow, and if we choose wrong we lose
  
• that's not a choice I trust town with please let's not go there guys

If wyv flips scum (which is what I'd suspect), then we'd have an extra mislynch. That scenario would also allow us to look at the possibility of algebra scum before a three man lylo, which sounds terrible

Wyvern should absolutely be the play today

[Dark Horse]

You have wyvern as more town than aeronaut? Yean








No

[Dark Horse]

Algebra wouldn't be confirmed town and we're absolutely not treating algebra as such

You think algebra would decide at the beginning of the game to tunnel his partner?

Considering how noobish his play has been I honestly wouldn't past him. What's important is that were not disregarding the scummy things that he's done just because of that.

You have wyvern as more town than aeronaut? Yean
[...]
No

If Wyvern is scum here he has zero understanding of basic scumplay and absolutely no common sense. Why isn't he trying to push through a lynch that isn't him? Why is he attacking some of the only people who stand any chance of being convinced to not lynch him?

Have you not noticed that he's started push thinkbig now that you've pushed for it? Have you not notice the fact that he started disliking algebra when it looked like that would be the only viable wagon the wasn't himself. Have you motice how both of these are big twists from his "I have absolutely no read on both of them"? Have you notice that he's changed his reads compeltely, to a reads list that's more in line with what the 4 most sctive players have been thinking? There's so much of wyvern's play that you seem to be willfully ignoring to support your wyvern town theory

[Dark Horse]

Like he has done stuff that contradicts your

main points

for him being town. That's ridiculous

[Dark Horse]

He hasn't been pushing ThinkBig though. All he's done is expressed minor suspicion of him, and the same with algebra. He has done absolutely nothing to try and make a lynch happen on either of them.

Because he doesn't have to. Both of the lynches of substance behind them. Especially in the case of thinkbig's lynch, there's nothing he needs to do because of how hard you're gunning for it.

Considering how noobish his play has been I honestly wouldn't past him. What's important is that were not disregarding the scummy things that he's done just because of that.

There's playing like a newb, and there's playing borderline anti-wincon. No one decides at the start of the game "no matter what happens, I'm going to try and get my partner lynched on day 1 because why not".
And what has he done that's scummy?

In addition to everything that put him in the spotlight, he's gone back to lurking while occasionally making a comment that he has no intention of following up. That's scummy as hell.

[Dark Horse]

Because he doesn't have to. Both of the lynches of substance behind them. Especially in the case of thinkbig's lynch, there's nothing he needs to do because of how hard you're gunning for it.

That's not how things were for the vast majority of the time he was sitting on his hands and letting things happen.

Badically as soon as he got put at L-1 he comes out with a new readlist where he doesn't like algebra and is not as sure as he is with thinkbig. That's clearly self preservation. Then you started calling him town.

In addition to everything that put him in the spotlight, he's gone back to lurking while occasionally making a comment that he has no intention of following up. That's scummy as hell.

Why?[/quote]

It's shows that he's very delibarate with his lurking. He could post more (As shown by what he posted when he was at L-1), but chooses not to, as long as he's not on the spotlight.

[Dark Horse]

He actually had one post in between that, but it wasn't much. He basically abandoned his reads when he was put on the chopping block

[Dark Horse]

Not if he doesn't do anything with those reads. He didn't even say he was scumreading either of them. IIRC the most we got was a FoS.

Should we be treating your scum reads lightly because they all come from process of elimination?

I didn't see him producing any more content at L-1? As I've already pointed out in 265, he was incredibly uncooperative at L-1

He started posting a lot more stuff like "I don't get why I'm scum" when people started attacking him. Then he went back to lurking

What? All he said at L-1 was that ThinkBig was scum, which he had already said before. That's completely consistent.

I was talking about wyvern

[Dark Horse]

I don't know what that has to do with anything.

Just because he hasn't explicitly said "I think they're scum" doesn't mean we shouldn't consider the fact that those are his scummiest reads. Should we ignore your read on thinkbig becuase you just have him listed as "Not Scum"?

Why do you think this is scummy? If he's telling the truth about being mislynched in past games, then it makes sense as a reaction.

Because it shows he's deliberately lurking and trying to coast

Oh, right. Again, he may have changed his reads, but he didn't push for either of them to be lynched and seemed very unsure of himself, so he got nothing out of it.

You were telling him "If you don't want to be the lynch, vote thinkbig" after he posted his reads list. What more did he have to do?

[Dark Horse]

Even if you think that wyvern hasn't been pushing his reads at all: That's even worse, as it shows that he's willing to sit back, especially now that you've tried to shift the focus of the day from him to think big. There's no need for him to do the "push for another lynch" thing that you're saying he'd do if he was scum, because pretty much immediately after he posted his reads list you started trying to shift the lynch target for the day into a different direction. Now look: he hasn't done shit, and now you've actually gotten aeronaut to believe what you're saying to, lowering the chances of him getting lynched. There's nothing he needs to do with you helping him out so much

Deliberately lurking, yes, but why does that equal coasting?

Do you not think coasting is scummy?

[Dark Horse]

Do you think it was townie that wyvern didn't vote either of us when he said we were scum?

I use coasting to mean "trying to have as little presence as possible by barely contributing," which is what I feel like algebra's doing.

[Dark Horse]

No, but I don't think it was scummy either. What does this have to do with anything?

Because a common theme throughout wyvern's action is that he wants other people do the busy work of actually pressuring people. Do you think it was coincidence he called us scum while aeronaut was arguing with both of us? That's why he hasn't been pushing people himself

I disagree that that's what he's doing. I think he's simply sticking with his principle of only sharing "major" thoughts, and/or being lazy.[/quite]

His major thoughts sound like excuses. Especially when he doesn't do anything with some of this "major thought" (see:criticizing aero).

[Dark Horse]

When ThinkBig flips scum I want shannon speedlynched. TIA.

Yeah no this isn't happening

[Dark Horse]

@aeronaut get back on wyvern

[Dark Horse]

Think big get on wyvern. Postie and algebra aren't getting lynched today. If you screw this up you'll find yourself lynched by an increasingly wack wagon.

[Dark Horse]

Oh he absolutely was trying to avoid getting lynched. His whole inital reads list was him trying to buddy the guy that was attacking the two people who called him out. His whole readslist change was to try to backtrack and appease the town. There are mutliple ways he's tried to avoid getting lynched

At what time is the deadline on the 16th?

[Dark Horse]

Fuck this, Aero's back in my scumpool.

lol now you're reacting like wyvern did when he aeronaut started to disagree with him

[Dark Horse]

Why aren't we lynching thinkbig

What a waste of a player slot

[Dark Horse]

Your vote count's wrong, you're at L-1. Quit fucking around and give us the content you promised you'd give us

[Dark Horse]

Postie everything about your 391 applies to algebra too. Do you think TB's "refusal to cooperate" is town, just like you thought algebra's was?

[Dark Horse]

Wouldn't be surprised if thinkbig's given up. Dissapointing

[Dark Horse]

The "At least I'm posting" defense is when you know you're in deep shit.

[Dark Horse]

Or he's just scum that's given up.

NoobTown is a million more times likely than noobscum

Weren't you townreading algebra for the same reason?

[Dark Horse]

No. I can easily see scum!ThinkBig realising he has nothing and just asking for tips for how to look town for next time.

He could have regurgitated other people's reads if he was that desperate, but he didn't. Considering all he has to do is provide a reads list, he could have almost certainly come of with something in order to save himself

Your scumteam if thinkbig's town is hilariously awful

[Dark Horse]

Bruh if you die because you were on mafiscum while driving

[Dark Horse]

Yeah I'm probably going to die tonight so LISTEN TO THIS SHIT TOWN

If thinkbig flips town (which I am more and more certain that he will), wyv is 100% the play tomorrow. No exceptions. If postie somehow manages to convince you otherwise then this town as a whole is straight garbage. If wyv flips scum, focus on postie. Her defense of wyv is awful, her thinkig push is awful.

Scum is most likely within Algebra/Wyv/Postie, most importantly DON'T LET WYVERN LIVE THROUGH TOMORROW.

[Dark Horse]

Thinkbig I'd recommend watching some mafia games/ playing a newbie before playing more. It's clear there's significant aspects of the game that you haven't grasped yet

[Dark Horse]

Yeah I'm probably going to die tonight so LISTEN TO THIS SHIT TOWN

If thinkbig flips town (which I am more and more certain that he will), wyv is 100% the play tomorrow. No exceptions. If postie somehow manages to convince you otherwise then this town as a whole is straight garbage. If wyv flips scum, focus on postie. Her defense of wyv is awful, her thinkig push is awful.

Scum is most likely within Algebra/Wyv/Postie, most importantly DON'T LET WYVERN LIVE THROUGH TOMORROW.

Nah you're cool I reckon bro.

Wish you'd spoken up earlier though and helped Aero choose Wyvern today instead of TB, though. And I probably should've pushed for that, instead of questioning Postie. Aero, don't feel too bad about going 'fuck it' though, I can see how you got there and I probably would've done the same if Postie was nagging at me like that.

Mafia's going to try and kill me because I didn't budge on thinkbig and they can't paint me as noobtown, hence the "probably going to die tonight"

There was not much more I could have done. The last part of this day like trying to do an alley oop but instead of dunking it thinkbig grabs the ball, runs to the other basket, and scores for the other team.

[Dark Horse]

ball is life

[Dark Horse]

Yeah I'm probably going to die tonight so LISTEN TO THIS SHIT TOWN

If thinkbig flips town (which I am more and more certain that he will), wyv is 100% the play tomorrow. No exceptions. If postie somehow manages to convince you otherwise then this town as a whole is straight garbage. If wyv flips scum, focus on postie. Her defense of wyv is awful, her thinkig push is awful.

Scum is most likely within Algebra/Wyv/Postie, most importantly DON'T LET WYVERN LIVE THROUGH TOMORROW.

[Dark Horse]

Yeah that was infuriating