Newbie 1817 - Bolo (Game Over)

[adilm29h]

VOTE: FancyPants

[adilm29h]

VOTE: FancyPants

[adilm29h]

Guys I am not sure how to make the vote box. If you could tell me that would be nice.
And I think that it is FancyPants. He first voted Aster, (the one person who' started talking). and after that gorny another person who started talking.
I feel, that he feels intimidated by them, and wants to get them out. Trying to get Mafia to win

[adilm29h]

VOTE: FancyPants

[adilm29h]

I also have a question, on why it says peoples roles underneath their name?
Is this a bug?

[adilm29h]

I also have a question, on why it says peoples roles underneath their name?
Is this a bug?

You mean the "townie" part listed right under your name at the left there just like it says "goon" for me?

It's post count related: faq.php#f1r5

Also welcome adilm29h!

Cool, thanks

[adilm29h]

sorry, another question. What is scumread, and scumtell? and in general what does scum mean? is the scum the mafia?
Also I still have tiny bit suspicions on FancyPants still. So for now my vote is going to stay on him until i feel someone is more suspicious or FancyPants becomes a little less sketch.

[adilm29h]

I also have a question, on why it says peoples roles underneath their name?
Is this a bug?

I am highly sceptical of this post. There are two possible situations:

1. He genuinely didn't know those "roles" were meaningless;
2. He did know those roles were meaningless and pretended he didn't.

In the second case, I'd definitely call scum upon this post. Whenever a human is guilty of something, it is their instinct to ask questions about things they already know to make it appear as if they don't have a clue about the situation. I'd call this a very strong scumtell, significantly beyond just "trying too hard to appear town."

However, we also have the first case to consider. Could it be true he was genuinely unaware about the function of those "roles"? Let us assume that this case is true, then there are some odd things about his post:

(Note: keep in mind that, according to his post in the sign-up thread, he has card-game mafia experience but no experience on this forum.)

• There is a "coincidence" that he voted FancyPants who is titled "goon" because he thinks FancyPants is scared of Gorny who is called "goon" as well;
• He didn't point out that FancyPants was marked as goon—is it because he didn't notice it at that time, or because of some other reason?
• Given that he has card-game mafia experience, he must know that having everyone's roles public is an absolute no-go. His reaction of "Why are ... is it a bug?" seems a bit passive for such a massive screw-up.
• Arbitrary titles under people's names are a common feature on many forums. If he has been on other (non-mafia) forums before, there are good chances he could guess what those titles represented.

Alright, none of the above is conclusive enough to show that he really knew that the titles were meaningless, but I wouldn't just blindly assume his "I really didn't know what those titles meant!" to be true.

Moreover, even if he really didn't know what the titles meant, that does not in any way prevent him from being scum and asking. Note that he asked "why our roles are under our names" and he didn't ask "what those titles meant". His way of asking suggests me that he was intentionally trying to slip a "hey I'm town" into his question.

Tl;dr:

I suspect adilm29h posted the above-quoted post with the intention to tell us "Hey I'm Town!" more than that he really wanted an answer to his question.

UNVOTE: FrozenMagpie
VOTE: adilm29h

This is my first time on the forum, I just have a lot of questions, because the Mafia card game we play vs how this forum is played is so different. There are soo many more rules and variations, And also I voted for FancyPants because:
1. Obviously he has goon under his name.
2. and the fact that He put suspicion on two people, and the two people that talked the most and were somewhat pretty active.

The card game mafia we play, is way more based on the emotions, and small signs you notice when a person get's nervous vs finding a slip up. Not try and seem like a towns person. Because trying to have obvious signs that you are a town person is pretty hard, and I would not think of anyways to do so, other than "How many Mafia's are in the game?"
I would say as I am still learning the strategy to playing "FORUM MAFIA" I would not be that advanced in trying to trick people trying to convince that I am town.
And Card Mafia vs This mafia, uses completely different strategies.

[adilm29h]

Adilm29h, can you please answer the following questions?

• At the point you voted FancyPants, were you aware that Gorny had the title "Goon" as well?
• Also, were you aware that Draynth had the title "Mafia Scum"?
• Finally, do you know how many scum/mafiae this game has?

Yea when I voted FancyPants, I realised Gorny has the title goon as well. But no I was not aware that Daynth has Mafia Scum.
And I'm Pretty positive that this game has 2 Mafia's.

[adilm29h]

My Read is that, I retract My vote from Fancy Pants for he seems very relaxed about being mafia, unless that is his technique.
I am not sure about Gorny, as he seems to try and find a blame onto someone.
Its hard to tell whether Grey Ice is scum or town, because they have a prominent voice which seems pretty convincing.
So far on My list are Aster and Mother.
I feel in the recent posts, motherGospel had very scum like readings, feeling way too defensive when being accused by GreyIce.
I feel Aster because he is quick to put the blame on someone else and divert their attention, on a simple question I asked.
As this being my first game, I barely know tactics to tackling this game.
i feel those are my two strong reads.

[adilm29h]

UNVOTE: FancyPants
VOTE: MotherGothel28

[adilm29h]

My scum reads so far are MotherGothel, for the main reason that she got really defensive when being voted by GreyIce. Also the whole thing where she says 'Now we are getting in the meat of the game', only when she was being accused, where as the game had already started of pretty intense for me at least since a lot of people had been accused which puts them in a pressure spot. Obviously MotherGothel feeling the pressure, mentioned that.
My other guess is Aster, but since there is only one vote allowed, I cast my vote onto MotherGothel28

[adilm29h]

well those are my reasons for me thinking that she is mafia. The small sign that she cracked under pressure. The fact that she is getting really defensive over one person voting for her, and just pretty much beating around the bush instead of just stating her point. For me that seems pretty mafia like.

Other than that I feel that you are mafia, with the way you are talking. My read is that People who unnecessarily talk to much are hiding something, and just talk a lot to cover up their mistakes, and you made a lot of long posts way in the beginning, Especially over my simple question. Where accusing me would be okay, but you really really looked into trying to force a scum read onto someone

[adilm29h]

headache-inducing

explain?
and interesting how you just stated how you felt, to make my others look at my post from a certain angle.

[adilm29h]

to make others look at my post from a certain angle*

[adilm29h]

headache-inducing

explain?
and interesting how you just stated how you felt, to make my others look at my post from a certain angle.

You are suggesting that people actively posting stuff and contributing to the discussion are more likely to be mafia than for example lurkers who only say the minimum amount necessary to avoid modkill or policy lynch. Or something in that direction.

This notion is downright toxic for the town community: it is well-established that it is important for the town to have an active discussion in order to find mafia. Do you notice how some of us have been calling upon others demanding they say something? That's because the less one says, the harder it is to get tells on them, and if we let them get away without saying anything, then they may be mafia who are just lying low while the talkative townies kill each other. So we're trying to encourage activity into others, so that everyone can get a better view of everyone and make a better-informed decision.

It takes the "discouraging activity" that I accused FancyPants of to a whole new level: do we

really

want townies and mafiae to believe that the best way for them to survive is to lay low? I definitely don't. That'd frankly be the worst possible thing that could happen to town.

If scum is really active, then you should be able to find plenty of scumtells or otherwise genuine reasons to vote them in their posts. You basing your vote on high activity tells "This player has said a lot of things, but I can't find scumtells in those posts." If you can't find enough cause to vote somebody in the huge amount content in the posts, maybe you should take a hint?

Also, on a side note, you are saying that I'm posting a lot in order to cover something up? My obnoxious level of activity started with accusing FancyPants. Before that, only the RVS happened. Please tell me what I'm trying to cover up.

It is very interesting on how, you change the whole meaning of what I was saying. You can definitely be active, and post necessary information and ask other people for information, without talking too much. What I am trying to say is you talk way too much for unnecessary reasons, and from my past experiences playing mafia IRL, people who do that, are trying to get a lynch on certain people As soon as possible, and are in a rush. Or are just paranoid, and the best they can do is talk a lot with power to divert their information else where. and you are really really looking into things trying to pin small details to a person and convincing people that they are mafia

[adilm29h]

My scum reads so far are MotherGothel, for the main reason that she got really defensive when being voted by GreyIce. Also the whole thing where she says 'Now we are getting in the meat of the game', only when she was being accused, where as the game had already started of pretty intense for me at least since a lot of people had been accused which puts them in a pressure spot. Obviously MotherGothel feeling the pressure, mentioned that.
My other guess is Aster, but since there is only one vote allowed, I cast my vote onto Mother
2nd othel28

I'm not sure how I'm being overly defensive by replying to posts directed at me. I've replied to everyone who has directed anything to me, not just to GreyICE who happened to place a vote (I honestly thought more people were voting me until we just got a vote count update).

Can you point out exactly where I overreacted, cause I honestly see myself as just responding to points and pointing out a huge flaw in logic against me.

Yes even though you said "now we are getting in the meat of the game"
but i am not going to focus on that one small thing.
What i am more focussed on is
1st how defensive you got when someone voted you, and immediately found a reason to put them as scum. In my theory only a mafia would do that, where a town would be a little more accepting and figuring out whether "GREY ICE" was actually mafia. Very quick to change your vote once he voted you.
2nd I am going to use your own logic against you where 97
In post 97 you state how it is scummy to skim through the posts. Where as I disagree that it is scummy to skim through the post because it would take an extremely really long time to read everything and look into it. where people would pretty much skim through it multiple times.
Using this logic I feel you are mafia.
1. being going with your logic: why did you think that more people were voting you, where you just skimming and were not paying attention.
2. If your logic does not make sense, and skimming is not a mafia thing to do. You jut made up a reason for someone to be MAFIA, just because they voted you out and that they are an IC which means they have experience and is a Strong role (not regarding roles, but regarding them as a player it self). Power role meaning strong voice

[adilm29h]

Frozen magpie
you have been awfully too quiet from the start

[adilm29h]

MotherGothel? Not replying to my comment.
Have you been stumped?

[adilm29h]

My scum reads so far are MotherGothel, for the main reason that she got really defensive when being voted by GreyIce. Also the whole thing where she says 'Now we are getting in the meat of the game', only when she was being accused, where as the game had already started of pretty intense for me at least since a lot of people had been accused which puts them in a pressure spot. Obviously MotherGothel feeling the pressure, mentioned that.
My other guess is Aster, but since there is only one vote allowed, I cast my vote onto Mother
2nd othel28

I'm not sure how I'm being overly defensive by replying to posts directed at me. I've replied to everyone who has directed anything to me, not just to GreyICE who happened to place a vote (I honestly thought more people were voting me until we just got a vote count update).

Can you point out exactly where I overreacted, cause I honestly see myself as just responding to points and pointing out a huge flaw in logic against me.

Yes even though you said "now we are getting in the meat of the game"
but i am not going to focus on that one small thing.
What i am more focussed on is
1st how defensive you got when someone voted you, and immediately found a reason to put them as scum. In my theory only a mafia would do that, where a town would be a little more accepting and figuring out whether "GREY ICE" was actually mafia. Very quick to change your vote once he voted you.
2nd I am going to use your own logic against you where 97
In post 97 you state how it is scummy to skim through the posts. Where as I disagree that it is scummy to skim through the post because it would take an extremely really long time to read everything and look into it. where people would pretty much skim through it multiple times.
Using this logic I feel you are mafia.
1. being going with your logic: why did you think that more people were voting you, where you just skimming and were not paying attention.
2. If your logic does not make sense, and skimming is not a mafia thing to do. You jut made up a reason for someone to be MAFIA, just because they voted you out and that they are an IC which means they have experience and is a Strong role (not regarding roles, but regarding them as a player it self). Power role meaning strong voice

Except I haven't made a case out of someone voting me or not voting me. GreyICE brought up where my vote was place and had no idea where it was. That is my point. Don't try to Lynch someone off of FALSE information. Conjecture is one thing, something that is clearly not factual is a complete other issue.

Erm you mention and i quote "how can something as obvious as a vote be missed"
yet you don't know how many people voted for you?
and second thing what false information have i provided?
im lynching you on the same basis you are lynching grey ice

[adilm29h]

my suspicions run highly with MOTHERGOTHEL28

[adilm29h]

I dislike adilm29h's opener (37, 39) for fairly obvious reasons. I also dislike how Gorny felt the need to welcome adilm29h in the following post (40), he could have just answered the question and moved on—the welcoming just seems forced (especially when you consider he didn't welcome or say hi to anybody else).

(43, 69) are two other posts I don't like. I don't understand how adilm29h's post could be seen as a town tell. Anyone who has used a forum in the past would know that most users usually have small titles like that under their name and unless he hasn't used a forum before—which I highly doubt—his post was forced. Even if he really thought that people's roles were written under their names, don't you think he would have went 1 page back and named every people who had "goon / mafia" under their name (FancyPants & Gorny) and called it GG?

Sure, he did vote FancyPants, however it was with "reason"—(37). But, in post 63 he added "obviously he has goon under his name" (keyword: obviously) as a reason for suspecting FancyPants, however Gorny also has "goon" under his name and adilm29h never said anything about that until it was brought up (67). If it's so "obvious", then why didn't he call the scum team to be FancyPants & Gorny at that point?

One last thing about adilm29h that seems forced is post 55. No one answered his question, yet in future posts (124, 167, 191) he went and called people scum/scummy and pointed out his scum-reads.

Even though no one answered my question I figured that scum meant being mafia or goon just by reading others posts.

I think gorny was just welcoming me because this is my first time here, where no one else claimed it was their first time.

Let me also tell you that no i had no clue that the name under meant nothing. Was just a simple question and i just kept posting with my thought flow. I just decided to wait for the answer to my question before accusing everyone. And I knew fancy pants had goon in my reason but as I said that was not my main reason for lynching someone otherwise i would have brought other people's names up.

[adilm29h]

I would like to change my vote
UNVOTE: MotherGothel28
VOTE: GreyIce
GreyIce's profanity and irrational behaviour must tell me that he is some power role. For if it was something helping the town, I feel like he would have spoken differently. But I feel like he is Mafia, for a townie would have no reason to add swearing and be hostile.

[adilm29h]

This is my first time playing forum Mafia. But i have played maybe a whole of 10-15 times in real life.
I am not talking about By power role I meant he is a Mafia, not trying to find who he is or anything, just commenting on GreyIce's play style.

And i feel a townie wouldn't be hostile or swear because he has no reason to bring in profanity to emphasize his point. Seems some what mafia like to do that.

[adilm29h]

Welcome CD, I see you are scumreading Adilm. Are you scumreading anyone else? Are you townreading anyone in particular?
Also just addressing your last point in 266, don't you think it's plausible that Adilm would A) google what the terms meant after no-one directly answered him? After all he uses the terms over 70 posts later. B) GreyIce kind of addresses what 'scum' means in his opening IC post, I'd say that was enough to either work out what scumread meant or to then be prompted to find out for himself. The fact that you're scumreading him for this feels scummy to me. Seems like you think he is scum and are finding evidence to support that theory instead of the other way around

I'll need to read the thread over one last time to give you my exact scum-reads since I feel I've focused a bit too much on adilm/Gorny, but currently I don't have any other scum-reads.

Not town-reading anyone in particular right now, no. I did have a slight town read on Aster for having the same initial thoughts that I had about adilm, but it's not strong at all.

I do think it's very plausible that he figured it out on his own. But, my main concern about all that was the fact that he needed to ask what "scum" and "scum-reads" were. Again, it seems like something that is very obvious and doesn't need to be asked.

If he played mafia previously (which he did), do you think he would always say "I think this person is mafia", "I mafia-read this person", "I'm suspicious of X" or similar things, as opposed to saying "I scum-read this person" when he thought someone was mafia? I've never played mafia before where someone didn't know what "scum-reads" were, it's like one of the things you first learn when you start playing mafia.

I do have a tendency to scum-read people who are new to the game* and that ask unnecessary obvious questions which is why I'm not currently voting him.

* Yes, he does claim to have played mafia before, just not forum. But to me, he's coming across as someone who's entirely new with his questions like "why are roles shown under names" which if anyone played mafia before they would know that roles being secret is rule #1. And, questions like "what are scum-reads" when it's one of the most basic and most used line in mafia. That's why I don't think those questions with his previous experience (which is apparently 10-15 games) adds up.

On the basis of Mafia, No i do not know what scum read is. When we play Mafia in real life, we just choose someone as mafia, based on the small signs such as how jittery they are, or if they are acting different from how they usually do. I have never heard scum read till here. But once playing the forum more, i pretty much figured out scum meant mafia, and scum read means you think someone is acting mafia, which is pretty basic and easy to catch on without someone telling me. Also to be honest i didn't google. Because I already googled soo much about forum Mafia, as it is different to real life Mafia I play. We play it pretty simple, as there are soo many new and different rules with forum mafia. and plus I did say this person is 'Mafia' in my early threads, but as soon as i saw people using scum/scum read, I thought i'd give it a shot in using those particular terms. As there are soo many terms you guys use that i do not understand such as OMGUS etc..
And plus just on the basis of me asking a few questions, i'm suddenly read as scum according to Aster and GreyIce and You.
In what world is asking a few newbie questions, scummy. Vs Someone losing their temper and adding hostile language as well as profanity not seem as scum.
I find it very interesting how people come up with theories for certain people, that if they do something it can seem town, backing them up and teaming up with them, but however if i ask a question it is supposed to be more scum than townie?

[adilm29h]

Thanks draynth

also about the post with the titles under each name was cleared In the next post, so I went on with the game.
again, I did not know the names under if they meant something or not, i just posted it. But the next post cleared it out for me, which is why I did not vote anyone out based on the titles. ASTER, you have three points on the fact that you think i thought for a long time that the titles under were the roles, when it was cleared the next post...
and i've played 10-15 games of real life mafia, over the span of 5 years. And let me tell you there is not much tactic involved, just quick thinking on your feet.
And i never said active players are mafia. I only said that people who talk a lot unnecessarily beating the bush, would be mafia. Please PLEASE stop changing my words, and changing my intentions, misreading things on purpose or accidentally for you to back yourself up. And i Still think using profanity is a sign for Mafia, For you would have no reason to swear and lose your temper.
Imagine that post^^
vs
You fucking dumbass Aster, who the fuck do you think you are lynching me based on facts your lying ass made up just to make me seem mafia, pretty pathetic attempt.
You see the difference, between profanity and losing your temper vs just defending yourself. I feel it is a very scumy thing to do ^^
VOTE STAYS on GREYICE.
*Confused* why Aster has been trying to lynch me from the start on every small thing I do, and justifies it with some reason he made up?

[adilm29h]

CD
ofcourse it depends on the personality, but if they were the kind that swears to get their way, and if it is their personality i guess they would have used profanity earlier.
However using profanity and being hostile, I feel as that is pretty scummy. Being hostile, and rude for no apparent reason.
"As a personal preference, and because you're not a newbie I'm not going to lay it out all formal-like. Don't fucking make shit up about why I'm doing something unless you want me to come rip your throat out and decorate the walls with your blood."
Especially a post like that from GreyIce^^
I could say the same thing to Aster "Don't fucking make shit up about why I'm doing something unless you want me to come rip your throat out and decorate the walls with your blood."
But i wouldn't knowing Aster is trying to find every little detail on trying to lynch me for him thinking I am scum

[adilm29h]

Sorry Guys I was out the whole day. I would like to say that I I too have been convinced after Gorny Has been brought into the light, Or shall I say dark.
But anyways, He seems very wishy washy with his reads, where he says one thing and then says the opposite for the same person, which shows that he doesn’t really have any reads on the players, and is just making up some BS as he goes and getting mixed up in his own mind.
UNVOTE: GreyIce
VOTE: Gorny
FancyPants please give your views on the recent Gorny? You have been 're-reading' since yesterday.
My top two suspects at the moment are Gorny, And GreyIce

[adilm29h]

yea i knew I had the Hammer

[adilm29h]

my vote for now lies on Grey ice due to previous mentioned reasons
VOTE: GreyIce

[adilm29h]

As I said before voting for him
"I too have been convinced after Gorny Has been brought into the light, Or shall I say dark.
But anyways, He seems very wishy washy with his reads, where he says one thing and then says the opposite for the same person, which shows that he doesn’t really have any reads on the players, and is just making up some BS as he goes and getting mixed up in his own mind."

I voted and hammered him out because for once we were getting some where with some solid reads on people, which others agree on. And to me I do not think we should focus on how people react to the Gorny Lynch, because we have very little evidence to prove that Gorny was Scum. The possibility, that he was town is way higher than the possibility of him being scum. Therefore reacting to people's reads on Gorny being SCUM, and lynching people based on that could prove false for we would be going on False accusations.

And If I was scum I would have lynched CD as the first victim, for he had the strongest opinion on me and has a loud convincing tone, which would easily result in my lynch.

[adilm29h]

As I said before voting for him
"I too have been convinced after Gorny Has been brought into the light, Or shall I say dark.
But anyways, He seems very wishy washy with his reads, where he says one thing and then says the opposite for the same person, which shows that he doesn’t really have any reads on the players, and is just making up some BS as he goes and getting mixed up in his own mind."

I voted and hammered him out because for once we were getting some where with some solid reads on people, which others agree on. And to me I do not think we should focus on how people react to the Gorny Lynch, because we have very little evidence to prove that Gorny was Scum. The possibility, that he was town is way higher than the possibility of him being scum. Therefore reacting to people's reads on Gorny being SCUM, and lynching people based on that could prove false for we would be going on False accusations.

And If I was scum I would have lynched CD as the first victim, for he had the strongest opinion on me and has a loud convincing tone, which would easily result in my lynch.

[adilm29h]

My vote remains on the IC who is supposedly supposed to help people, but instead Swears at them over simple things. This isn't your first time either, everytime someone slightly disagrees with you 'GREYICE' you start getting really defensive and offended as if someone stole something from you, and then you further start to call them names, get angry for no reason and start swearing. Either you are really scum or you have some serious personality issues.
*Vote remains on GREYICE*

[adilm29h]

Im going to have to back CD up here and say, GreyIce acted way aggressive over someone questioning him, there's a difference between being defensive and completely avoiding the question by using swear words, all this could have been avoided if GreyIce just replied normally, however he tried to add more commotion, which in my opinion is scum like behaviour due to them Creating a side diversion as to letting out scum tells

[adilm29h]

Firstly I would like to address that how can I not know that I have the hammer if you guys all said that he is at L1 etc. Darynth stated that he is at L1 couple posts right before I hammered in. So no I am not lying.

Second Firstly I think there is utterly no reason for someone to get angry and throw in profanity and purely insult the other player, as it does not get any results, and is not a proper defence. It's just someone screaming and throwing in bad words, so he can have a strong voice, so people can side with him.
Also it seems as though he uses those swear words to create a commotion instead of just answering the questions and co-operating.
Why would I townie try and cause more commotion instead of trying to get to the problem and solving it. <---- My read on CD vs GreyIce.
Cd- Trying to solve the problem and move forward.
GreyIce- Swearing and trying to create more problem.

And FANCYPANTS... as an IC, being experienced, he should have read the posts and see who was killed and who was lynched. How could he not even know Darynth was killed...
1. He is a HORRIBLE IC with the way he is playing using swear words, and not knowing who even got killed. (I don't think IC's are supposed to be like that)
2. He is smart and uses this as a leverage to making people thinking he is town.

Result:GreyIce definitely Scum.

[adilm29h]

Firstly I would like to address that how can I not know that I have the hammer if you guys all said that he is at L1 etc. Darynth stated that he is at L1 couple posts right before I hammered in. So no I am not lying.

Second Firstly I think there is utterly no reason for someone to get angry and throw in profanity and purely insult the other player, as it does not get any results, and is not a proper defence. It's just someone screaming and throwing in bad words, so he can have a strong voice, so people can side with him.
Also it seems as though he uses those swear words to create a commotion instead of just answering the questions and co-operating.
Why would I townie try and cause more commotion instead of trying to get to the problem and solving it. <---- My read on CD vs GreyIce.
Cd- Trying to solve the problem and move forward.
GreyIce- Swearing and trying to create more problem.

And FANCYPANTS... as an IC, being experienced, he should have read the posts and see who was killed and who was lynched. How could he not even know Darynth was killed...
1. He is a HORRIBLE IC with the way he is playing using swear words, and not knowing who even got killed. (I don't think IC's are supposed to be like that)
2. He is smart and uses this as a leverage to making people thinking he is town.

Result:GreyIce definitely Scum.

While it might be logical that getting upset and causing a commotion doesn't help town. I don't see how it helps scum Greyice either, if anything it just draws attention to yourself.
People get emotional for all sorts of reasons, and while scum can get emotional, I don't see why getting emotional is inherently townie.

Also I don't see how the person who killed Draynth could forget they were dead, how does scum GreyIce literally forget the name he sends in to the mod. Now I know it's fakable which is why I didn't make a big deal out of it, but if you believe he's being genuine than you can't think he's scum.
You say he is a horrible IC and then in the next sentence say he is smart. Classic scumulate .

When I started listing. I listen that 1 either he is a horrible IC or 2 a smart scum.
Me agreeing with the latter.
1 and 2 contradict each other. Therefore you know I am mentioning either 1 or 2. Rather than 1 and 2

[adilm29h]

FancyPants asked me who I thought was scum. My opinion hasn't changed much from yesterday: it's crystal clear that adilm29h is scum. I called this case slam dunk yesterday, and nothing has done to lessen that notion today. In fact, with another lie from adilm today and some nice correlations, the case became even clearer than it already was, to the extent that's possible. With the additional bonus that there aren't any scumpartners left, so can state with confidence that everyone who isn't adilm, is town.

Adilm still seems to be busy doing his old scummery business. Without much thinking, he hammers Gorny because he wants to get some of the bussing bonus and can't risk that somebody else takes the last available spot from him. During the next day when asked to explain, he makes up yet another story which is inconsistent with his earlier statements. With this kind of behaviour, it's almost as if he's just trying to figure out how much bullshit he can get away with.

There's pretty much nothing to say and nothing to discuss. The evidence against adilm has already been stated and I don't feel like repeating it again (u mad, cd?). Adilm being scum implies that everyone else is town. Nobody but adilm is scummy. We know everything we ever need to know.

---

Unfortunately, some people seem to have started to internalise adilm's towniness as an ideological belief, at which point it may become impossible to convince them otherwise. If somebody believes deeply enough that all grass is red, he keeps preaching that even when standing in the middle of a green grass field. Why? Because the alternative, admitting that they're wrong, is downright unacceptable, so their human brain rejects it.

And at this point, when people start acknowledging that adilm is lying yet still maintain that that isn't a scumtell, the situation starts looking pretty hopeless. Frankly, I'm don't even feel like arguing about this anymore. The pile evidence has been stated and it is at least four times as large as any pile we're ever going to collect against anyone else. If you're still not convinced, I won't be able to convince you.

VOTE: adilm29h

"with another lie from adilm today"
Erm firstly I never lied.
Secondly what you said is not proof. All you have repeated was that im up to my "same scummy business" and how sure you are i am scum.
And the further on continue to say something which is not true?

"Without much thinking, he hammers Gorny because he wants to get some of the bussing bonus and can't risk that somebody else takes the last available spot from him."

Please explain this

and explain what story I made up?
you are just stating things without any evidence.

[adilm29h]

And nice of you to add the second bit, to convince everyone that It is hopeless etc. Using that as a leverage for you not having any evidence to lynch me.

I am sorry unless there is solid evidence, we aren't going to lynch someone lol. you can say things like "i am not going to repeat myself"
But no one is going to lynch anyone without solid evidence.
Such as the evidence against GreyIce.
Please amuse me with my "Scum tells" and say it straight to the point with evidence without saying extra things.

"Adilm is scum because xyz. and xyz is a scum behaviour. he has lied here in xyz where as he says zyx over here. this prove he is lying."

Similar to how CD and I have given to GreyIce, How his Absurd behaviour means he is Either a retarded IC or scum for sure. With us going for the latter.

[adilm29h]

once again you guys are stating that im a careless person etc. But please state a mistake made?

[adilm29h]

I asked you for your reads because Even though I knew I had the Hammer. I thought Gorny would have a "Staage of defense, where he gets some time to explain why he is not scum". And then a revote would occur and then someone would be lynched. If it is someone different, They also get a stage of defense and repeat. I thought this because that's how it is in real mafia, I knew I had the Hammer, But I thought Gorny would go into a stage of defense.

Early game I thought people who talk too much are mafia, because usually that's how I deduct who is scum while playing IRL mafia. But usually its a bit of jitteriness which is a scum tell. I guess I mistook that for a Scum tell, but during Play time I realized that, I may be wrong.
The reason I may play unorthodox is because I am kind of mixed up between real mafia and this, as they are different play styles for it is easy to mask your tone, unless you don't like GreyIce "which I think is done on purpose". I would agree with you if I was playing this in real life, for people may get very emotional in that. Where as in Forum mafia, I feel there is no need to get emotional. Because you are typing and therefore have the option of backspacing, and re reading what you wrote before sending it. This is why I think GreyIce's Outrage is Intentional as a cover up and has no reason to insult another player or get angry, or refuse a question etc.

Last thing I think that Darynth's Kill meant that the person made a silent kill because they wanted to make the game more fun, with active people as Darynth barely contributed compared to others. It would be similar to killing Xa. Every Kill would be a good kill if justified right, and good is a very subjective words, so it may seem different to everyone.
But me personally I guess if they killed someone who was siding with Gorny, That would be a good move and make the game interesting.

[adilm29h]

yea i thought he would go into a stage of defence and then get voted out depending on the circumstance.
So based on that you believe I am scum?
Clever of you to not, respond to anything else I said...

[adilm29h]

FancyPants I am not going on any wagon?
The only Wagon I went on was Gorny, I thought GreyIce was scum for one of the longest time?
It's pretty stupid how there is votes on me when It is pretty obvious GreyIce is scum here with the way he is Acting?

[adilm29h]

Also what I think about the nk isn't relevant at all. It's just a bunch of guessing and second guessing, so pretend I humored you and explain your line of thought please.

Please humour me anyway, NK information is bad information, but it isn't unusable. I've seen games where NK information has helped with the lynching of scum.

@Adlim, I meant the wagons who have been on in the past, not your current wagon (although also your current wagon).
Adlim you've already said yourself that GreyIce is either a bad IC or scum (in your eyes) why is it more obvious to you that she is scum?

I already gave my reasons as to why he was so obviously scum in my last post in this and the previous page.
But to some it up, this is forum mafia therefore you can re read your posts before actually submitting and taking time to think etc. Therefore GreyIce got emotional on purpose. An experienced player such as GreyIce would have definitely thought of using profanity as a cover up. He has used it twice so Far when prodded rather than co-operating. Why would a townie have no reason to Co-operate, And if they do not want to co-operate why not just give a reason, rather than being an asshole.

I feel like he is hiding something, I really feel like he is a Scum in my opinion, It is pretty obvious with his behaviour. He isn't always like that, when agreed with he co-operates, however when someone prods him a bit he gets very angry and way too defensive for no reason. Even a small prod such as to not avoid the question. He gets way too defensive.

It is everyone's right to be prodded and to communicate unless you have something to hide why would you resist and create a 2 page commotion for no reason.

[adilm29h]

GreyIce, I've considered such things as well since we won my last Newbie with a mass claim but what if Gorny submitted the kill?
Then the jailkeeper and the tracker tell us nothing.

Gorny was fucking dead.

Dead people don't submit fucking kills.

Those words of anger sound really fake and forced^^ just saying

[adilm29h]

Yes I have only played one variation. I have played mafia like 10-15 times in total only and in one card game version with the same people.
Well in all honesty, I just really enjoyed playing Mafia in real life, i just saw this forum and then joined it.
I did read all the rules but there were soo many that i forgot half of them.

I didn't mean to lynch him, But now that I have, I still feel it is a good move in my opinion lynching him.

[adilm29h]

and i still think it was FUCKING unnecessary of you to swear you dumbass.

[adilm29h]

Fine, I'll humor as much to say I think the draynth kill was good for town in that he wasn't the most vocal town. It also makes me suspect a newer player because he was an SE, but I'm not giving that a lot of weight.

Pretty much my thoughts.

I generally find scum will defend their validity of their kills even when, people say it's bad.

Which is why adlim's response about why the NK was a good one was weird.

Perhaps just getting rid of adlim is the move here. Mothergothel thoughts?

this makes no sense bro?
You ask me if Darynth was a good kill? I am going to put my self in the shoes of scum and answer that question, as if I killed Darynth. It seems like you are just trying to put the blame on me

[adilm29h]

Look, there's swearing here. As in most of the world, it's not a big deal. For the record I've cut way back on it for this game, but this is not a children's group.

Listen here bro. Swearing is okay while trying to get a point across, but swearing unnecessarily and putting people down is a BIG, NO GO in my book.
Your replies never seem genuine enough.

[adilm29h]

and i still think it was FUCKING unnecessary of you to swear you dumbass.

You weaken your argument, no matter how correct it is by doing the same thing you're tellng him not to do. Also GreyIce why don't you chill out some, you're really aggressive for this being a game.

It's called Irony bro...

[adilm29h]

Don't Lynch Me for I am a cop...
and that is why I am really pushing GreyIce...

[adilm29h]

Fine, I'll humor as much to say I think the draynth kill was good for town in that he wasn't the most vocal town. It also makes me suspect a newer player because he was an SE, but I'm not giving that a lot of weight.

Pretty much my thoughts.

I generally find scum will defend their validity of their kills even when, people say it's bad.

Which is why adlim's response about why the NK was a good one was weird.

Perhaps just getting rid of adlim is the move here. Mothergothel thoughts?

this makes no sense bro?
You ask me if Darynth was a good kill? I am going to put my self in the shoes of scum and answer that question, as if I killed Darynth. It seems like you are just trying to put the blame on me

You "put youtself" into scum shoes and justified the kill as a good one, when it's clearly a bad kill.
As I said I feel scum will tend to justify their own NK as a good one.

Anyway happy to wait for the flip, It's still possible adlim is fake-claiming like a idiot .

BRO this is what i said "
Last thing I think that Darynth's Kill meant that the person made a silent kill because they wanted to make the game more fun, with active people as Darynth barely contributed compared to others. It would be similar to killing Xa. Every Kill would be a good kill if justified right, and good is a very subjective words, so it may seem different to everyone.
But me personally I guess if they killed someone who was siding with Gorny, That would be a good move and make the game interesting."

I didn't say it was a good kill i just said every kill is a good kill if justified right, and the person who killed him, just shut up someone who was not active, which leave us with less clues.

Dont twist my words.