Mini Normal 2168 | So Many Bats! | Game Over!

[Noraa]

What I get from redados' reply is "no I have so many reasons but they just all happen to be invisible/nonexistent"

[Noraa]

Norwee you dont understand why I am SRing redados?

[Noraa]

I dont see any good reads from u on absolutely anyone

[Noraa]

I bet some of those reads are right however the reasoning which u r going by aren't gonna convince me any time soon

[Noraa]

Norwee you dont understand why I am SRing redados?

Yes, it seems to me like you’re tunneling/being too aggressive so i’m not sure how trustworthy your read is.
Can you just make a TL;DR of why exactly Redados has been scummy? What’s your main point?

He is the one tunneling in on me. He started tunneling a while back when he said shelly and I were scum for our playstyles. Then I got really pissed over it so he backpedaled and said it was out of anger towards one of my snarky posts. But then when asked if he would be dropping that vote, he was like nope. That just means that it 100% was NOT an anger vote. As for what it is, he's not clarifying which is confusing because I feel like both town and scum would want to clarify so idk wtf he's trying to do there. Then he just disappears for a shit ton of time and comes back and catches up with the shittiest most scummy post I've ever seen and Foses everyone that has a SR on him(OMGUSing). All his accusations r completely empty. He's not trying to solve and its really clear when u do an ISO on him. I'll be very surprised if he flips green. Everything he does is just scummy. That catch up post accused me of everything that post was-unhelpful, fluff, immature, and whatever tf the other points were

[Noraa]

Well said uno.

I do agree with the above post quite a bit. However I do think that it is AI for Redados bc he was far more eager to solve in doggos and didn't randomly accuse me of absolutely nothing. Ngl I thought my SRs in On this day were weak but I'm really sure that his are more weak. Arguments attacking my age and my unhelpfulness aren't at all good arguments to be using to back up a Fos or a SR

[Noraa]

And I honestly think this says a lot about him and the reason is that he's literally even scummier than me in On this day where everyone called me really scummy and antitown. I think he's either going for a TSTBS sorta vibe or he's literally given up and is kinda just like idc anymore.

[Noraa]

If we get a Redados flip, here's what I think. If he flips scum that likely means he told his partners to bus him to get a shit ton of towncred by jumping on his wagon. If he flips town, I will be baffled and literally just stfu for a while while I think about how I ended up strongly SRing a townie. I doubt he will flip green tho ngl. He's seriously just been way too scummy for me to even honestly consider that possibility

[Noraa]

If we get a Redados flip, here's what I think. If he flips scum that likely means he told his partners to bus him to get a shit ton of towncred by jumping on his wagon. If he flips town, I will be baffled and literally just stfu for a while while I think about how I ended up strongly SRing a townie. I doubt he will flip green tho ngl. He's seriously just been way too scummy for me to even honestly consider that possibility

then again this post is a bit early so I will just hold this thought for now and not elaborate so that scum can mess around with my brain

[Noraa]

*can't

[Noraa]

Also one observation I made is that Redados 100% buddies Jester. Its very very obvious that he does it and makes me question him a lot. Jester I personally think is likely town however he definitely has some pretty antitown moments and the fact that Redados has chosen to pick at nonexistent things on me over existent things on jester isn't rubbing me the right way. Redados is purposefully trying to overlook these and I'm not sure why. I think if Redados flips red, I will have to start considering a scum!jester possibility even though I have gotten town vibes from that slot over all

[Noraa]

I’mhappy with UNOwen’s response, I feel like we can have a good discussion.

Nora, I don’t feel like your last few posts have been helpful.

OHO such a helpful post I see above
stop accusing me of doing something u do every post bc 1)I dont do it and 2)if that's the way we're judging this round, then u deserve that lim more than anyone else

[Noraa]

If we get a Redados flip, here's what I think. If he flips scum that likely means he told his partners to bus him to get a shit ton of towncred by jumping on his wagon. If he flips town, I will be baffled and literally just stfu for a while while I think about how I ended up strongly SRing a townie. I doubt he will flip green tho ngl. He's seriously just been way too scummy for me to even honestly consider that possibility

downvote. you should always consider the possibility that someone might be town. only looking for scum motivation means youll see scum everywhere and very rarely in actual scum

I cannot imagine a world where town!Redados exists here. It's not something that my brain is willing to process aorn

[Noraa]

If we get a Redados flip, here's what I think. If he flips scum that likely means he told his partners to bus him to get a shit ton of towncred by jumping on his wagon. If he flips town, I will be baffled and literally just stfu for a while while I think about how I ended up strongly SRing a townie. I doubt he will flip green tho ngl. He's seriously just been way too scummy for me to even honestly consider that possibility

downvote. you should always consider the possibility that someone might be town. only looking for scum motivation means youll see scum everywhere and very rarely in actual scum

I cannot imagine a world where town!Redados exists here. It's not something that my brain is willing to process aorn

then get a new brain or take a break. thats the wrong attitude. its page 8 and theres a 75% chance or so that a randomly selected person is town. you scumread pretty much everyone, especially if they disagree with you. and you tunnel really easily on townies.

how would you know? You have never played with a town!Noraa. No shit I tunnel and SR townies while I'm scum. Am I expected to go SR my partner?
no offense take its alright

[Noraa]

Im not taking it as a scum accusation. I'm saying that she shouldn't be backing u up since I'm fairly confident town!me has good reads ... or decent at the very least. And she hasn't played a game with town!me before this one so its true that she doesn't know that "I tunnel easily on townies" for a fact. Either way stop stalling and refute all my points on you

[Noraa]

Alright

[Noraa]

Watch shelly completely disappear from redados' SRs just bc of her above posts

[Noraa]

Redados is using TSTBS and he literally says it himself in that spoiler. Look how his SRs on Uno and I stand while his SRs on Taylor and Shelly start to falter. This is OMGUSing at its finest. Your don't need to reply a "+1" to everyone that says something in ur favor. It just ends up looking like u want to make sure they know u saw it which is just not a good look here. You have zero new points. You literally can't think up anything new to accuse me of because there is no more. I'm not taking it personally however you explained it multiple times and my conclusion was that u SR me for no reason except my playstyle. I'll be untunneling for now not bc I don't think u r scum anymore but bc I slightly agree with Taylor now that I should try to consider a town!redados world. My brain isn't liking it however I admit there is a slight possibility that he is town and in that case, I would be utterly wrong in my reads and would have to reevaluate everything. So I am untunneling and looking for scum elsewhere. However I still stan a redados wagon and think he's scum.

[Noraa]

@redados what's the odds from your pov that it's TvT since you bring up the posibility

idrt the noraa/uno thoughts almost verbatim is partner-y?

I haven't ruled out the possibility that it's TvT but that would be incredibly disappointing play from Noraa. I respect her enough to believe that she's scum doing this. If she's town then she needs to seriously do some reflecting on her play.

I could say the same to u however I highly doubt ur town

[Noraa]

I already explained it is bc I want to consider a town!redados world in case my read was indeed wrong

[Noraa]

Taylor Swift, what do you think UNOwen's alignment is and why?

townlean, waiting on more content from uno to give a more confident stance. good posts and takes, seems to be looking at the game and trying to solve rather than pushing an agenda

I will second this post here. There isn't much on uno aorn however he is definitely seeming more towny than redados

[Noraa]

oooooooooh check noraa's ISO for the word UNO

this is amazing

pedit: noraa/taylor/uno vibing together so much sets off alarms as to how someone is deep pocketed

Redados disappeared from Shellys reads and Shelly disappeared from Redados' reads.

Shelly/Redados scum team

[Noraa]

lmaooo did I just get accused of pocketing uno?

[Noraa]

......this is pretty bad scum theatre if my guess was correct

[Noraa]

like one star performance

[Noraa]

Townblocks are trash

btw don't you scumread me? your ISO points how im "weird" or "scummy" multiple times

yeah I think you're scummy, but the past couple of pages point to ShellyC and Noraa not being scum partners imo

honestly if anyone thought we were scum partners, they'd have to be like delusional. Shelly's done nothing but make empty accusations on me and start a bunch of lil tornadoes everywhere. Thats literally it -_______-

[Noraa]

Shelly's done nothing but make empty accusations on me and start a bunch of lil tornadoes everywhere. Thats literally it -_______-

Shelly would do that regardless of both your and her alignments.

I made my above observation based on your behavior; not hers.

and what'd I do that was so so special?

[Noraa]

I don't see why scum!redados would wanna say shelly and I aren't scum but that might be something that ur saying to try to make me think its not a shelly/redados solve

[Noraa]

but yeah no shit the solve isn't shelly/noraa here as well as doggos

[Noraa]

well ik that but I still have a strong SR on u and looking at it from scum!Redados perspective, the only reason I can see u say that is if u want to get me off ur tail

[Noraa]

No I think it would be to get me off ur tail. The reason is that anyone that assumes Shelly and I ended up both rolling scum again has to be a low-key delusional townie that wants the pieces that clearly don't fit together to fit together. You saying you ruled out the possibility just makes u sound more town cuz the probability of that happening is literally god knows how low. And considering a possibility that is literally so damn small definitely looks town imo. But then I'm kinda like mmm what if scum!redados is trying to change my mind with this bc he knows I overthink the shit outta everything and anything?

[Noraa]

Yeah redados' reads still have absolute zero content and I'm not sure what to think about that at this point

[Noraa]

who did I sheep?
u tell me shelly

[Noraa]

you sheeped my suspicion on redados for not compellingly casing me.

no wtf

you sheeped my suspicion on redados for not compellingly casing me.

wait, nope. what?

Taylor is witness and here to prove I'm not the insane one :3

[Noraa]

Uh it was a literal comment on my part. It was not a reply to ur post otherwise I would've quoted ur post. I sheep openly when I find it the right and necessary thing to do

[Noraa]

besides generaly your posting hasn't been very game advancing

your FoS on redados sheeps UNO
your sus on me sheeps jackson, jester
you fluffpost a ton

I've already addressed duppin's post telling me the exact same thing maybe pay more attention

My fos on redados started long before uno's did so ur just straight up lying here.
You're telling me as long as my sus comes after theirs its considered sheeping? Not to mention my sus on redados came before Uno and that's also considered sheeping. ur logic sucks.

"you fluffpost a ton"
Wow shelly ur sheeping like 4 different people with this right here. U see its very unoriginal at this point.

Stop with this sheeping argument. Its a terrible one and by ur own argument, ur a sheep :3

[Noraa]

yeah ur just accusing based off of nothing too.
u and redados might as well be the scum team here. ur both sus as hell

[Noraa]

the confrontation from noraa at you was mainly because of your meta scumread, not directly sussing you or casing you

it. wasn't. a meta. scumread. *bangs head against wall*

yes it was

[Noraa]

Redados is using TSTBS and he literally says it himself in that spoiler. Look how his SRs on Uno and I stand while his SRs on Taylor and Shelly start to falter. This is OMGUSing at its finest. Your don't need to reply a "+1" to everyone that says something in ur favor. It just ends up looking like u want to make sure they know u saw it which is just not a good look here. You have zero new points. You literally can't think up anything new to accuse me of because there is no more. I'm not taking it personally however you explained it multiple times and my conclusion was that u SR me for no reason except my playstyle. I'll be untunneling for now not bc I don't think u r scum anymore but bc I slightly agree with Taylor now that I should try to consider a town!redados world. My brain isn't liking it however I admit there is a slight possibility that he is town and in that case, I would be utterly wrong in my reads and would have to reevaluate everything. So I am untunneling and looking for scum elsewhere. However I still stan a redados wagon and think he's scum.

I feel like ur just making out whatever he says to be scum indicative.
Has he done anything you think is townie?

Honestly, no not imo. I think he's been absolutely scummy this round but I do agree that the fact that he decided to tunnel me a shit ton at the beginning over my playstyle made me pretty angry so that definitely played into this SR. I agree that this will make my read a bit unfair overall because it'll be a lil emotionally driven however, I think even if he didn't piss me off by being a bad sport, I would still have a SR on him at this point in time. But also Norwee have you not seen his points against me? I think ur also being biased here in trying to force out a town!Redados perspective bc all of his points against me are not to be mean but complete garbage. All he can say is that I'm unhelpful, immature, sheepy, and a bunch of other synonyms. And he literally has nothing to back it up. Its just like "OH that post. No I dont like it. Why? Oh just because Noraa wrote it therefore its sheepy, immature, spammy, fluffy, and very unhelpful"

that's fair. my thoughts totally could have been easier to read, and are probably not easy reading. I didn't proofread it. If I were scum, this would be hard to do because I could have slipped up while writing it and given y'all ammo against me. I'm town so I have nothing to hide. Look at it more as collateral than evidence, in this way.

I disagree that it is hard to fake as scum, there are potential benefits to that style. Commenting on each post individually makes contradictory stances somewhat expected for example. That said, I do think you slipped up. Your suspicion of me is I suppose justifiable from your point of view when considering my overall posts but I do not see how you could have developed that read on the basis of my first two posts. That your argument was even technically accurate in that the "odd poking question" was exactly one question is also alarming. It looks more like you had already decided to scum read me before you started your stream of consciousness.

Another OMGUS from Redados in other words.

TSTBS + OMGUS = battle of the buzzwords?

??????? untunneling for no reason? idk what tf this is, sounds like scum backtracking

Not liking this post, looks like scum!Shelly shading Noraa for stopping to tunnel a slot. (Which is actully pretty townie from Noraa imo.)

At this point I just feel like all of shelly's accusations against me are pretty empty just like Redados'

@redados so you're null on taylor?

noraa's subtly shading me
what if this whole thing redadosvnoraa was scum theatre

VOTE: Noraa

I kinda think noraa's scummier than redados based off the reactions, noraa just seems insincere moreso than redados. i think redados IIOA is still scummy. considering scum theatre possibility

Scum theatre my ass.
VOTE: ShellyC

LMFAOOOOOOOOOOOOOO I actually love this. However as I've said before ... shelly plays weird. I have a hard time reading her. I feel like she just gives off scummy vibes no matter her alignment. Idk when it comes to reading her, I seriously dont know.

Scum theatre my ass.
VOTE: ShellyC

ok you're wrong

this sounds lots like one of ur posts from doggos when someone called u scum

[Noraa]

The tree drank some youth potion so it stays green forever and ever

[Noraa]

PAGE TOPPPPP

[Noraa]

Sorries about the fluff:(
I couldn't help it T^T

[Noraa]

I like 1164 from Gyrados. You can kinda see his progressions evolve through the post. I gotta say though, I sincerely hope I'm not being pocketed because he finds my jokes funny. If the entire scumteam are just planning to keep me in their pocket by going along with my shenanigans, then...well played.

Also, about Redados's catchup wall there: I like the number of times he reaffirms he's still scumreading UNOwen throughout that post, it gives me the feeling he's constantly thinking about the read while he catches up, and is keeping us updated about it. Also, his thoughts on UNOwen early kinda mirrored mine in that he was being a little too selective in his posting, which is why I prompted him to talk to me about Noraa. Redados pushing this over someone like shelly who looks like a far more viable counterwagon I also like. I don't think Redados is scum.

Noraa calling my post a “shit reason” in post 832 rubs me the wrong way and I’m feeling bery proud of myself for being so respectful in post 833. Good job, redados from four days ago. You did good.

This is also very towny.

Next 6 posts from Noraa are more obvtownity. I think you're tunneled though, Noraa, would you be this confident Redados was scum if his crosshairs were on someone else with those reasons?

No his reasons are terrible. Uno agree with me on this and Uno isn't me. I think I am not going crazy and my gut scum pings from redados are indeed not imaginary. I, for one, think ur pocketed Jester. Ur basically the only person that he's buddied hard so far. He hasn't said ANYTHING whatsoever about u. he hasn't even considered a scum!jester. Not once. He hasn't tried to solve ur slot. NOT ONCE. All he does is quote all ur posts and say they're funny. Not game advancing, not helpful, and NOT TRYING TO SOLVE. and only scum doesn't needa solve cuz they already know who tf the dang scumteam is -____________-

VOTE: REDADOS

DIE SCUM

phew T^T I promised Norwee I would untunnel. It's really not working. I. WANT. A. REDADOS. LIM
hold up gotta take a chill pill and listen to some zen piano music. adios. I'll be back after some yoga. no jk ew I hate yoga

[Noraa]

I think even jester doesn't really have any good reasons backing up that TR on redados. I dont see any points that overrule my points as to why I SR redados

[Noraa]

YAYYYYYY PLUS IS HERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Noraa]

one of me fav people from doggos
T^T sorries I fooled u there

[Noraa]

I didn't get a mention
T^T fine be like that

[Noraa]

hmphhhhh T^T serves u right to have 55 pages to read for not making Noraa feel loved >:(

having fun reading them all :3
And then after ur done tell me thoughts on NoraavRedados
RedadosvUno
ShellyvNoraa
RedadosvShelly
and yeah

[Noraa]

JV sheeping is -3 townpoints

Yeah fuck off

agreed that annoys the fuck out of me
i like this jackson guy he's probs town
im also gonna challenge odd day jesters first 10 pages of wifom and say he's probably scum so far. I get wanting to do a gambit like that to look for an early elim hungry fellow but in reality he's being way too overt so I don't think that's his real goal here, he just wants to look like a crazy towny

Townreading ur own slot like its not urs is a really bad look.

Town:
JV

Null:
Jester

Scum due to playstyle:
ShellyC
Noraa

Scum:
Saudade (but I have been told this is his town meta)

this feels weirdly fabricated to me

oooo why?

[Noraa]

I'm fine with Redados's answer regarding why he's less emotive this game btw. It's what I figured and at times I get this "this is really irritating but I'm going to stay cool" vibe from him when replying to scumreads line Noraa's and I find that kind of tone really town-indicative.

Still need to catchup on page 49 to 54(?). I'll probably skim some stuff but will still be on the lookout for anything particularly towny or scummy.

I wasn't the one accusing back on like page 10 about straight up playstyle. I got a bit heated bc all his dang accusations r like "Noraas sheepy, fluffy, unhelpful, spammy, immature, etc" Literally I get tunneled by him for the stupidest reasons and I feel like tho I tunneled back harder, he happened to be the one randomly SRing based off of nothing very early in the dang game.

all caught up
first impressions from quick reading and no iso diving (unordered)

townish: shelly, jackson, suade, noraa, odd day (i take it back vca leads to him being townier), NE, mundi (meta), duppin, bug, un

reddish: reddados, grendel (taylor was better), mini,

How is Taylor better? I think the opposite ngl.

oh as for my own read on Saudade I said early on why I thought he was slightly suspicious earlier, generally it comes to me getting the impression that he was just trying to be heard and make sure he had a presence without actually attempting to game solve. My initial plan was to just give him some time and wait for him to do something. he and a couple of other players talked about him having good reads and I have to admit I thought it was a bit odd how he kept talking about his own good reads while also saying he had no real reads yet since it is early on in the game. Don't get me wrong it obviously makes sense for him to not have good reads yet and it is definitely not fair for me to call him out for that, but i think you will agree that it is harder to fake good reads as scum which was why I wanted to give him some more time to see if he would come with these so called "god reads", but then a little later norwee decided to vote on him which I did not expect, but I decided to join the wagon since I thought it would be interesting to see what would happen. Unfortunately he had to deal with some real life stuff which made the push rather lackluster in my opinion

duppin can u try to solve anyone outside of the {saudade} pool?

[Noraa]

Eh the uh preflip shit was directed at me cuz I did a huge paragraph on what would happen if redados flipped red.

I think u should still try to solve me regardless of what's going on with the newbie thing. Even a wrong SR is better than nothing considering we are on page 57 and close to the end of day 1 ... maybe?

I have two finished scumgames which u can use for meta if ur really struggling

[Noraa]

U see if u did use my playstyle to form a read, I would be a lil upset(as shown with redados) However he started doing that on like page ten or something so I definitely think that was on him. But I mean its page 57 rn. It is what it is and ur gonna have to solve me someday. Might as well make that day today.

[Noraa]

plus can we uh try to have better reasons/explanations to back up ur reads？Otherwise u just sound exactly like redados

[Noraa]

duppin u gonna solve me or no?

[Noraa]

Ok uk what that's fine. Just dont solve me for now then. I have a few games that should be ending soon. I'll tell u to read those and ig just dont look at which role I am until the end. That way it'll be fair right?

[Noraa]

Its not rvs we should be encouraging more content.

[Noraa]

ehm please stop quoting that horrendously long quote

[Noraa]

Ngl when I saw duppin's catch up posts, I had a few kinda like "uh ok then" moments.
I wasn't greatly confident in them and still am not tbh so I will still be leaning town for now

[Noraa]

gut sus read here on the wagon

yay someone is vibing this

joyed are you now jack or megabyte

jack? I think?

[Noraa]

Ngl when I saw duppin's catch up posts, I had a few kinda like "uh ok then" moments.
I wasn't greatly confident in them and still am not tbh so I will still be leaning town for now

so youre suspicious of everyone, but then comes someone with legit questionable posts and you just townread? uhm? what?

"legit questionable posts" is a very subjective thing and seeing that I'm townleaning here kinda just means I dont agree with u that

[Noraa]

Plus this is why u end up dying early in all the games ... too the point that after being on ur wagon in every single game where u literally get hammered day 1/2 as town, I cannot read u at all. I seriously cannot. Please literally PLEASE IM BEGGING U. please produce some content. I seriously cannot read u if u dont and then I'll feel really bad if I end up being on ur wagon and u flip green for the third time or something. literally please just please. Can you PLEASE show me somehow that ur town and not scum. Literally I'll believe anything just PLEASE.

[Noraa]

*to

[Noraa]

joyed is producing content gut reads are reads

however jack is still a scumslot. joyed's better than jackson though

@joyed if you don't mind entertaining me - can you provide me info on your meta as town and scum

no plus is playing exactly like he did everywhere which got him limmed early as town. I already know what's going to happen here if he doesn't stop but my problem is I really dont wanna mislim him again. It makes me feel bad and what he does is literally never AI but it just seems so damn AI that idk what to think sometimes.

[Noraa]

NO its not ok. He doesn't put enough effort into games and it really looks scummy af. And I hate that he gets mislimmed so often. He will be limmed here based on my past knowledge on how games with plus go regardless of his alignment. I am NOT ok with that!

....is this TMI. wtf shelly. it's not like scum!shelly wouldn't know that I'm town since I'm not in ur damn pt

[Noraa]

It literally pisses me off when I'm town and have a hand in limming some LHF townie. I HATE IT. HATEHATEHATEHATEHATEHATEHATEHATEHATE

[Noraa]

>:(

[Noraa]

Ok its pretty late. night adios til tmrw

[Noraa]

I still remember my case on Jackson and I stand by it

I want to interact with joyed but joyed’s play is super LHF and weird which may colour my read. they were lynchbait in both my scumgames with them

iS tHiS tMi sHeLlY?

No i mean it's an unpopular opinion to wagon someone that's inactive/VLA.

Yeah no we are NOT limming Saudade today. I do not stan.

My lim order goes like this now
Taylor
Jackson
Saudade
Duppin
Redados=Noraa

I don’t really know what to make of duppin’s TR on me which is pretty controversial
idrt duppinVtaylor is town vs town and I think it’s likely TvS aorn

p-edit: give me some time to Quote Things and make a big ugly quote wall

How'd scum!Noraa get a free town pass so fast? Shelly my SR on u has been wavering since I didn't see u tunnel or flip flop as much as you normally do in a scumgame. but this specifically is actually starting to make me raise some eyebrows.

it's also why my townread on shelly is not as strong as the others because i dont really follow most of her logic, but her tone and aggressivenes to me just resemble more of a townplay. to me it does not come across as her having an agenda. You seem to suggest it is part of her scum meta, but could you explain what you think is different compared to her townmeta then?

.......thats literally EXACTLY how I would describe shelly as scum.... As town she's a bit less aggressive...

[Noraa]

I still remember my case on Jackson and I stand by it

I want to interact with joyed but joyed’s play is super LHF and weird which may colour my read. they were lynchbait in both my scumgames with them

iS tHiS tMi sHeLlY?

No i mean it's an unpopular opinion to wagon someone that's inactive/VLA.

Yeah no we are NOT limming Saudade today. I do not stan.

My lim order goes like this now
Taylor
Jackson
Saudade
Duppin
Redados=Noraa

I don’t really know what to make of duppin’s TR on me which is pretty controversial
idrt duppinVtaylor is town vs town and I think it’s likely TvS aorn

p-edit: give me some time to Quote Things and make a big ugly quote wall

How'd scum!Noraa get a free town pass so fast? Shelly my SR on u has been wavering since I didn't see u tunnel or flip flop as much as you normally do in a scumgame. but this specifically is actually starting to make me raise some eyebrows.

it's also why my townread on shelly is not as strong as the others because i dont really follow most of her logic, but her tone and aggressivenes to me just resemble more of a townplay. to me it does not come across as her having an agenda. You seem to suggest it is part of her scum meta, but could you explain what you think is different compared to her townmeta then?

.......thats literally EXACTLY how I would describe shelly as scum.... As town she's a bit less aggressive...

[Noraa]

FUCK MY WIFI

[Noraa]

PlusJoyed you scumread Tayl0r. Wanna join this wagon? It seems better than Redados.

No this is stupid. Theres literally no lim better than Redados today however if I was required to choose a different wagon ... I could prolly think about compromising on Taylor.

okey. i haven't done a full analysis on taylor but grendel was sus af

UNVOTE: red
VOTE: taylor

Plus: comes in, votes the biggest wagon, Redados
When people start shifting wagons, he jumps to a Taylor wagon with literally no reason.

VOTE: Plus

Ik in general ur considered easy limbait but I want to put pressure on u for flipflopping. Please defend your actions to prove you are town. Yes I am hesitant to vote u and shit cuz I been wrong about u before but I want an answer bc this one really isn't reading hot.

[Noraa]

I dont want a plus lim today, no. But I want an answer and I will use my vote to get one

[Noraa]

Duppin attention is interesting, I thought he had townie vibes earlier but I guess there are some questions worth asking.

@duppin

-If you agreed with sus!redados why not join the wagon for pressure when it became clear saudade would not be returning any time soon?
-Are you aware (1404) that Jester floated the exact same theory when they first replaced out?
-Do you consider "he was actively trying to solve the game when he could have easily just camped his vote" to be a still accurate assessment of bugspray?

UNO's thoughts have been almost identical to mine all round(except more well worded and organized versions of my thoughts)
Even some things that I briefly thought that I didn't post, UNO posts. Im almost 100% convinced UNO is town at this point. If he's not then idk how tf his scum mindset is almost the exact same as my town mindset

[Noraa]

Why is shifting to a different wagon scummy, Plusjoyed did state they scumread Taylor earlier.

shifting that fast makes me think he didn't at all think about it. He's just going with the flow. I feel like shelly's going straight against the flow is more towny honestly and shelly isn't seeming very towny here

[Noraa]

I dont want a plus lim today, no. But I want an answer and I will use my vote to get one

this neuters the power of your vote to include a qualifier like this

my vote wasn't supposed to be powerful. It is there to get me the answer I want. However if it doesn't get me a good answer, then it will start becoming a real vote.

UNO's thoughts have been almost identical to mine all round(except more well worded and organized versions of my thoughts)
Even some things that I briefly thought that I didn't post, UNO posts. Im almost 100% convinced UNO is town at this point. If he's not then idk how tf his scum mindset is almost the exact same as my town mindset

Mhm, I think you and UNOwen are town.

Speaking of strong townreads I had; bugspray, could you give us an insight into the notes you've been making? Even some highlights would be helpful.

Alright I like that we are on the same page about uno. I can kinda see a fairly good town book forming here and I'm happy about that tho my early day 1 town books tend to be ... absolute shit but anyways I'm happy about it for now
Jester if u think uno and I are town, why do you think redados is town? Unless you think the whole NoraavRedados and UnoVRedados was all TvT? I ... have a hard time believing redados is town which is why I currently think both those were SvT where Uno and I are town and Redados is scum

[Noraa]

Yeah I'm not interested in explaining this again. If you read all my posts saying that he did this to shelly which lead to a muslim day 1, u would know redados 100% is a type of person to use playstyle to justify and go thru with a mislim.

[Noraa]

*mislim

[Noraa]

I dont have huge confidence in Taylor flipping green tbh but regardless of her flip, I definitely still think redados is scum.
Norwee and Jester have been pretty against this redados wagon. I think they are both coming from a town perspective tho so I'm not too sure redados flipping red means they r scum

[Noraa]

well put it this way noraa
if taylor flips green then we probably flip reddados. And if reddados flips red NE is highly likely to be scum because he's trying to derail a red wagon

Talk to me more about this because I don't think I've pushed or scumread Taylor very much if at all

lets not lie now. ur iso doesn't disappear. u SRed Taylor for a long time until she agreed with u on a few things and u just completely forgot about it

[Noraa]

I changed my mind. The last 5 ish posts by Taylor have sounded town as hell.
Taylors in my town book

[Noraa]

I've been on the fence about it. But i think i'm ready to admit that i don't really agree with the Redados wagon. I'm thinking he's town.

NB (can i call you that?), I checked your recent iso, but you were thinking about wagonomics. You posted this and never gave any reasoning at all. In fact I must say not a big fan of your recent posts. And I'm not a big fan of you trying to break off from reddados here after mulling it over on the fence. Scumpartners are usually very careful on their read of their partner and from my experience are almost always read last after putting them on the fence. I can def see a reddados/NB team atm

you just sheeped Norwee's Taylor vote and now that Taylor is coming out here pointing out shit, u flip on Norwee. I dont understand. Please stop flip flopping

[Noraa]

Spoiler:

VC 1.10

Bat Fact #11:

Bats belong to the animal order chiroptera (Greek for "hand wing").
They are named for their four long fingers and thumb, each of which are connected to the next by a thin layer of skin.

EXILE STATUS

[3] Tayl0r Swift:

Odd Day Jester, NorwegianboyEE, PlusJOYED

[2] Saudade:

MiniMegabyte, duppin

[1] Redados:

UNOwen

[1] shellyc:

Mundivore

[1] Noraa:

bugspray

[1] MiniMegabyte:

Saudade

[1] UNOwen:

Redados

[1] duppin:

Tayl0r Swift

[1] PlusJOYED:

Noraa

[1] Not Voting:

shellyc

With 13 still flying around the place, it takes 7 votes to ground someone.

The Day 1 deadline is in:

(expired on 2020-10-03 14:30:00)

Mod Notes:

MiniMegabyte is being replaced.

[/mech]

The Rise and Fall of the Redados Wagon: A Tragedy in 62 Pages.

funny thing is I have a gut feel on unOwen being scum but their posts seem towny

again, it's not what he's saying but what he's NOT saying

There is reasonable logic to this, I have been focused on you and have made few comments elsewhere. If you are town then I should be suspicious to you. But you have claimed to understand my perspective, so my question is why you think I am scum trying to push a miselimination and not town who thinks you are scum?

nuuuuu uno im coming back
VOTE: Redados

[Noraa]

I changed my mind. The last 5 ish posts by Taylor have sounded town as hell.
Taylors in my town book

Disagree. Confidence is not necessarily towny, I think the push/aggressiveness on duppin is unwarranted for what it is. Many in this game have elaborated on reads less than duppin has, so I don't get the focus there.

confidence is making people TR shelly. why can't I tr Taylor for it?

i think the scumteam is somewhere in reddados, NB, taylor, mini or possibly duppin or even UN.
I TR suade, shelly, noraa, mundi, and clown
my null slots are basically duppin, un, mini and bugspray

This read is pretty similar to mine ngl.

[2] Tayl0r Swift: Odd Day Jester, NorwegianboyEE
[2] Saudade: MiniMegabyte, duppin
[2] Redados: UNOwen, PlusJOYED
[1] shellyc: Mundivore
[1] Noraa: bugspray
[1] MiniMegabyte: Saudade
[1] UNOwen: Redados
[1] duppin: Tayl0r Swift
[1] PlusJOYED: Noraa

This is an ridiculous VC for 60 pages.

I agree but then why are you starting a whole new wagon if u think that?

i think the scumteam is somewhere in reddados, NB, taylor, mini or possibly duppin or even UN.

You changed your read on me real fast.

I think its not AI for plus but I would also like to hear an explanation.

i think theres likely scum in norwee or plus, more likely plus.

its possible but I'm not too certain that's correct atm

[Noraa]

PlusJoyed setting up this dichotomy about Redados flip being vital to solve me and other slots is genuinely awful and scummy as heck.

trying to derail a wagon that probably has scum in it is a pretty big scumtell bro

Ok ok I think Redados is scum however I think Norwee and Jester's reasoning for why he is town is understandable as well. I think this Redados wagon isn't a great way to find scum bc its a huge mess atm anyways so scums can really really easily mix in here. I still want this wagon to go thru but I must admit its kinda a hot mess rn

[Noraa]

Spoiler:

VC 1.10

Bat Fact #11:

Bats belong to the animal order chiroptera (Greek for "hand wing").
They are named for their four long fingers and thumb, each of which are connected to the next by a thin layer of skin.

EXILE STATUS

[3] Tayl0r Swift:

Odd Day Jester, NorwegianboyEE, PlusJOYED

[2] Saudade:

MiniMegabyte, duppin

[1] Redados:

UNOwen

[1] shellyc:

Mundivore

[1] Noraa:

bugspray

[1] MiniMegabyte:

Saudade

[1] UNOwen:

Redados

[1] duppin:

Tayl0r Swift

[1] PlusJOYED:

Noraa

[1] Not Voting:

shellyc

With 13 still flying around the place, it takes 7 votes to ground someone.

The Day 1 deadline is in:

(expired on 2020-10-03 14:30:00)

Mod Notes:

MiniMegabyte is being replaced.

[/mech]

The Rise and Fall of the Redados Wagon: A Tragedy in 62 Pages.

funny thing is I have a gut feel on unOwen being scum but their posts seem towny

again, it's not what he's saying but what he's NOT saying

There is reasonable logic to this, I have been focused on you and have made few comments elsewhere. If you are town then I should be suspicious to you. But you have claimed to understand my perspective, so my question is why you think I am scum trying to push a miselimination and not town who thinks you are scum?

short answer is because I know I'm town and I don't think that I've done anything scummy enough to warrant a vote unless you're sketch. Re-reading that and thinking about that, that seems illogical and OMGUS-y.

I'm new to this I've never been scumread before/never had a serious wagon on me before, so it pops as scummy when you and PlusJoy vote for me. I just don't see why y'all would vote for me if you weren't scum.

Of course, that's not a valid argument for you to stop voting me, so feel free to carry on. Thanks for having me think from that perspective.

You attacked me for using my newbie card in doggos and I'm sure as hell sure that I was newer in doggos than you are here

[Noraa]

@Plus im not going ISO diving rn. Im busy. find it urself. I assure u its there

@Taylor plenty of people have had weaker reads. If ur going based off of that, I dont get why ur not on the redados wagon

[Noraa]

You attacked me for using my newbie card in doggos and I'm sure as hell sure that I was newer in doggos than you are here

I have four completed games and I have never been limmed during the day, only nightkilled. I've never had a serious wagon on me before. does that help explain what I'm saying?

I have two finished games and I haven't used my noob card here.

this is probably omgussy but i don't care, there's actually like no way i can see NB being town so I'm gonna shoot my shot for now
UNVOTE:
VOTE: NorwegianboyEE

I hate this post so much that I almost want to say screw redados, plus seems more scummy but u are always LHF and idk wtf to do now.

@Plus im not going ISO diving rn. Im busy. find it urself. I assure u its there

@Taylor plenty of people have had weaker reads. If ur going based off of that, I dont get why ur not on the redados wagon

noraa i just looked through his iso its not there

u need to pay more attention cuz hell yeah its there

[Noraa]

@Plus im not going ISO diving rn. Im busy. find it urself. I assure u its there

@Taylor plenty of people have had weaker reads. If ur going based off of that, I dont get why ur not on the redados wagon

its not just the weakness of the read. its the lack of attempt to explain scumreads and then the doubling down and refusing to cooperate or look for scummy posts. scum have a hard time faking scumhunting. heres someone who is semi-capable of townhunting or stating reasons why people should be town, but then is SUPER fence-sitty in all scumreads, gives no explanations, and yet states scumreads. like i dont think you get to state scumreads but then also fence-sit and not give reasons.

hmmm but still I think duppin is not one of the top choices for a lim today so I think you need to just put that aside for now. A duppin lim I do not think is going to happen today bc lots of people r pretty null on him rn, including myself.

Starting a new wagon on someone you scumread? OMG so scummyyyy

well but the thing is u just said that out VC was a mess cuz there were so many wagons. starting another doesn't really help....
I think everyone's gotta calm their butts about plus. I agree plus is seeing scummy asf here but honestly I feel like he's just LHF. Literally just read some meta on him and u will see that he tends to get limmed early in every. single. damn. game.

[Noraa]

PAGE TOPPPPPP

[Noraa]

ITS NOT DUCKING THERE NORAA

also NB i explained why I suspected reddados already, you should focus less on keeping your team alive and more on not being obvscum

Norwee quote ur points where u said redados was town pls

[Noraa]

You attacked me for using my newbie card in doggos and I'm sure as hell sure that I was newer in doggos than you are here

I have four completed games and I have never been limmed during the day, only nightkilled. I've never had a serious wagon on me before. does that help explain what I'm saying?

I have two finished games and I haven't used my noob card here.

Congratulations!

uk that read really bad for u right?

[Noraa]

And also Jester pointed stuff out.

ik but plus said he couldn't find urs specifically. I figured that meant he could find jesters

[Noraa]

no i never said I needed an elim right now unlike NB. We have time to spare and it's way better to hit obvscum imo

The blood lust

is

unreasonable considering we are waiting on two replacements (one of them being among the higher interest slots). I can't say I don't understand the idea of wanting to see a flip to get on more solid ground though.

plus is one of the replacements. The other is still in the process of replacing or something

[Noraa]

Norwee is likely town aorn and if u want to SR than siot, ur gonna need a shit ton of evidence cuz they are universally TRed rn. Norwee is not on the block and I think its literally impossible and we'd all have to be insane to lim a slot that seems that town day 1. ISO Norwee, he's pretty townie rn.

[Noraa]

My impression of your play; I semi-read/kept up with the game. I re-read the game. On my re-read, I noticed that you weren't taking stances. you were asking questions and being present but in a way that wasn't actually helpful/hunting.

Hmmm.

plus is one of the replacements. The other is still in the process of replacing or something

Yeah I was thinking that Saudade might also be replaced. Whether he is or isn't I would like to have seen something more from that slot before day is over.

I basically forgot dude existed <.<
he was pretty townie too tho imo

[Noraa]

You use a newbie card in a game where someone newer than u isn't even using it
@Redados does that not read bad?

[Noraa]

you posted zero evidence. half was piggybacked off of something I replied to one of his posts and I dont even think he's scum. I was just pointing something out and trying to get Norwee on the redados wagon

[Noraa]

My Noraa read is that she is tunneling on me, it reads like new player energy but I know that she's capable of using that to her advantage.

Hmmmmm. Can you expand this read to contain something to do with her alignment?

not without seriously pissing Noraa off

its more like "no because I dont have anything else"

you posted zero evidence. half was piggybacked off of something I replied to one of his posts and I dont even think he's scum. I was just pointing something out and trying to get Norwee on the redados wagon

my case on NB is pretty compelling methinks
but if you wanna wall me out cause your fighting reddados whatever

I'm leaving gu alone for now. I think ur just being a normal LHF plus. I want to wait and see what you do here. Theres lots of opportunities to make me TR u.

My Noraa read is that she is tunneling on me, it reads like new player energy but I know that she's capable of using that to her advantage.

Hmmmmm. Can you expand this read to contain something to do with her alignment?

Noraa's reads and tunnels are anti-town.

OH WOWWW

Noraa's reads and tunnels are anti-town.

Anti-town is still leaving the door open for town. Do you think she is scum or not?

I think she's scum.

DOUBLE WOWZER

VOTE: REDADOS

[Noraa]

Redados has no case on me. He's literally just OMGUSing me to hell and back. I admire scum!Redados' courage to not backpedal but all his arguments are just "Noraa is scum. Why? Just because she is"

[Noraa]

Lol Norwee the main wagon has jumped around a shit ton this round. I still think he's scum bc this whole SRing me for not reason does not seem likely to come from town. I was thinking about compromise wagons tho bc the redados wagon starting falling a lot but I'm very happy with having a redados flip today

[Noraa]

Redados has no case on me. He's literally just OMGUSing me to hell and back. I admire scum!Redados' courage to not backpedal but all his arguments are just "Noraa is scum. Why? Just because she is"

no he has a case for sure I just disagree with it

where the fuck is that case? I sure dont see anything

[Noraa]

well im down to vote reddados again I still prefer a NB elim though
maybe NB busses here maybe not.

UNVOTE: Redados

Im worried plus is gonna hammer or something and idk where redados is at rn

[Noraa]

Plus I dont like how agreeable u r.
Also redados hands down doesn't have a case on me. There is none. Reading his ISO one million times won't help you

[Noraa]

WTF no the meme didn't

VOTE: Redados

[Noraa]

I want to request a VC cuz idk where redados is at rn but mod already has her hands full with us spammy potatoes

[Noraa]

also and this is such a garbage read but i just cant help myself and no one should try to pursue it but part of me can't help but wonder if jackson and mini replaced out because one of them accidently learned the others alignment in which case it would make sense if they already replaced out, but i just think it would be even more likely if the alignment was scum. but yeah this is just a non sense theory for post game

This post.

ok good thats a strange post but to me its just ??
that doesnt help me sort duppin without more context. does that ping you one way or another? if so, why?

The logic definitely makes sense to me but yes we aren't supposed to talk about it so lets just drop this point.

what do you think of duppin's scumreads?

Idk, he seems to be voting Saudade mainly so there's not much to say about it.

I agree. I see some soft tunneling from him on Saudade which is a bit strange. Saudade has posted so few posts and duping kinda just strikes me as a player that saw saudade as a lil sus or easy limbait(depending on alignment) and basically skimmed everything else and decided to cling to saudade and not let go for the life of him.

[Noraa]

I mean Taylor, has either redados or plus had any good reasons to back any SRs up?

Btw autocorrect should apologize to duppin for being an ass

[Noraa]

Why are u SRing based on activity? Plus' reads have been terrible so far. They all sound far more scummy than duppins. Redados' and duppin's r basically the same but still. My reasons have started a wagon that is the biggest wagon so far. I dont "always tunnel for no reason" That literally describes redados perfectly. It's normal for me to hear something really scummy and cling to it until I get a flip, yes. But someones gotta say something pretty damn scummy for me to do that...

[Noraa]

^this post is for Taylor

[Noraa]

Announcement : we are on page 69 of this game >.<

[Noraa]

U-U ending fights in awkward silence is easy
imma god at it :3

[Noraa]

not to be rude I find the above post really funny. but ight T^T. I haven't fluffed .... too much recently :3

[Noraa]

yeah .... rip

I'll try to keep it to like .... 2 fluffs a day <.<

[Noraa]

He's basically VLA. How can u expect him to stand up for himself here?

[Noraa]

I never SRed him in the first place and its just annoying me that people are continuing to sus him cuz there's no point. Theres is ZERO WAY we will get a saudade lim today. Why not put that away for a bit and bring it back when he gets back? Discussing him now is a terrible idea and there's no point

[Noraa]

Well it doesn't matter. He's not back. And as long as that's the case, there is absolutely no point in discussing him.

[Noraa]

I never said at any point that my scumread on Saudade had to do with him being afk. See this is why I am really confused as to why you do not just ISO me.

I admitted when I engaged Saudade that my read on him might be influenced by the players hyping him up yes but my read on him was that he was posting to be heard rather than to gamesolve. To me it felt like he was trying to play very safe and I thought it was really odd how he on one hand also hyped his own "god reads" yet on the other hand also pushed the "no reads this early" - and I am perfectly aware that it is on one hand a reasonable enough statement to not have good reads early on, but it felt off to me plus his posts overall felt like he just wanted to make sure people noticed him which I think is scummy. My first idea was to give him some time to see what he would do but then out of nowhere he engaged Norwee and Norwee reacted really well in my opinion and gave me a townread on him plus he voted on Saudade and then I was tempted to join the wagon to see what Saudade would do so I joined. Shortly after that he went V/LA. So ultimately nothing has happened since to really sway my initial impressions of him.

The other scumread I gave early on was on Redados. I have also explained my reasoning for this several times.
I think it would be easiest to refer to this post actually since this was the gist of it:

duppin what other reads do you have

i don't really concur with your red read, fwiw he seems pretty disagreeable by thinking that the game is moving in a direction he dislikes

yes but just complaining about the state and not attempting to move it in a direction is suspicious to me. he seems to be complaining about the game state and being very careful with his reads (he essentially ended up only giving town reads) which to me indicate is trying to avoid confrontation while still appearing active. I am perfectly aware it might be too early to tell but that is the impression I am left with

As I said when I gave my reads before he hasn't really done much to change my mind. No matter what his alignment is I believe he is too caught up on Noora's push on him.
What I will say though is that I am actually a bit surprised with his latest posts as I did not expect him to defend me. If he is scum it seems more logical for him to at least try to discredit me a little bit since I called him scummy.

point to specific posts where redados posted in a way that intentionally didnt advance the gamestate. why is it scummy rather than just useless? you essentially have only given townreads. getting a scumread from you is like pulling teeth. why not move your vote of saudade? its useless there? can you point to specific instances where saudade is "playing it safe"? again, why are these scummy rather than NAI?

You are choosing to label duppins "unhelpful ness" as scummy while ignoring redados'. I'm with duppin on this one.

I never SRed him in the first place and its just annoying me that people are continuing to sus him cuz there's no point. Theres is ZERO WAY we will get a saudade lim today. Why not put that away for a bit and bring it back when he gets back? Discussing him now is a terrible idea and there's no point

i mean i kind of get your point but i also kind of disagree with the sentiment as it would be easy to just go v/la to avoid pressure as scum then (obviously not what Saudade did, just saying)

since we all agree he didn't do that, then drop it until he is replaced or back. I repeat one last time : THERE. IS. NO. POINT. Because we will NOT get a Saudade lim today so long as he's not back and if he comes back from whatever issues he had irl and sees everyone tunneling the hell outta him, all he's gonna do is be really scummy cuz he's gonna be pissed.

[Noraa]

As I said when I gave my reads before he hasn't really done much to change my mind. No matter what his alignment is I believe he is too caught up on Noora's push on him.
What I will say though is that I am actually a bit surprised with his latest posts as I did not expect him to defend me. If he is scum it seems more logical for him to at least try to discredit me a little bit since I called him scummy.

My current limpool is {noraa, unowen, mundivore, shelly} although I'll probably have to widen that to avoid a mislim of course.

Where is bugspray?

Where is mundivore?? Mundivore has done very little hunting today and has stayed mostly under the radar. VOTE: Mundivore

wtf? Why are u voting a really inactive slot now?
VOTE: Redados
ur so scummy its unbelievable

[Noraa]

noraa I feel like I can't win with you.

scum slip. No shit scum!redados can't win with me. I'm SRing u so hard.

As I said when I gave my reads before he hasn't really done much to change my mind. No matter what his alignment is I believe he is too caught up on Noora's push on him.
What I will say though is that I am actually a bit surprised with his latest posts as I did not expect him to defend me. If he is scum it seems more logical for him to at least try to discredit me a little bit since I called him scummy.

My current limpool is {noraa, unowen, mundivore, shelly} although I'll probably have to widen that to avoid a mislim of course.

Where is bugspray?

Where is mundivore?? Mundivore has done very little hunting today and has stayed mostly under the radar. VOTE: Mundivore

wtf? Why are u voting a really inactive slot now?
VOTE: Redados
ur so scummy its unbelievable

Why do you think that's a scummy thing to do?

Lurkers/less active players are easy to get mislims on

[Noraa]

Lurkers/less active players are easy to get mislims on

I put them at E-6.

You started their wagon in other words. So?

[Noraa]

but noraa do you believe mundivore is town?

Mundi's pretty null on my radar rn. They've said like 2 things so eh.

[Noraa]

i see. Out of curiosity if it was someone other than Redados who voted, would you still have concluded it was an attempt at pushing a mislynch rightaway or is this assumption based on your read on Redados?

I would assume this for anyone that did this that I currently have even the slightest SR on.

[Noraa]

If it was some innocent jellybean like Norwee, I prolly wouldn't

[Noraa]

I think the fact that duppin skims is pretty obvious at this point. I can't blame him ngl.

[Noraa]

we finally got a replacement
phew thank the lords
now prove mini to be innocent

And also welcome!

[Noraa]

Thanks for the welcome.

now prove mini to be innocent

That's what the PM says but not sure why you'd be heavily invested in me proving it. I tend to just play as me and not care what a pred has done unless there's a mob after them already.

there's a .... idk baby mob or something after u :3

[Noraa]

This one's going to be more weird than most because there are only a couple players I've seen before, at least by these names. If there are alts involved it's possible I know more of you, but I tend not to dig for that unless necessary.

Have u seen me before?

[Noraa]

You read thru 72 pages that fast?

[Noraa]

Also Redados'

[Noraa]

Spoiler:

Norwee and Jester have been pretty against this redados wagon. I think they are both coming from a town perspective tho so I'm not too sure redados flipping red means they r scum

elaborate

why do you think Norway and jester are coming from a town perspective when they oppose your prefered wagon

This logic is trash. Ur telling me as long as they oppose my wagon, they r scum. wtf shelly.

how are people letting duppin get away with not explaining reads at all? everyone who posts about duppin seems to agree that the posts are bad, but theres no momentum towards the wagon, and immediately a shitty counterwagon forms on me.

duppin is 90% scum here.

can you actually *case* duppin for once
can you explain instead of saying that “they have no reads” which isn’t strictly AI

Ouch. ngl its kinda true tho

nuuuuu uno im coming back
VOTE: Redados

noraa stop being manipulated so easily if you’re town or we’ll have to policy you

also, a comment on PlusJoy
they’re LHF and my limbait in all scum games ive been in with them
but I still think the slot is scum because of Jackson

U dropped ur case on Jackson so many times that I dont even believe u there anymore. Im not being manipulated.

wtf? Why are u voting a really inactive slot now?
VOTE: Redados
ur so scummy its unbelievable

didnt you "not want plus to accidentally hammer a townie"
weird as fuck switch

this logic is so flawed I dont even understand how they have anything to do with each other.

VOTE: mundivore
there is too much content for me to read but i checked activity overview and noticed that mundivore has even fewer posts than me which I find unthinkable considering how low volume my posting has been

ur saying we should give u a pass for being inactive but not Mundi?

the vote has deeper reasons, i did a quick iso skim and i felt the ping a few times, i think if saud is not lying about depression and is indeed town then the wagon's long lasting momentum was almost certainly supported by scum that want to make townies waste their precious thinking time on a wagon that they don't expect anyone to actually hammer. it reminds me of reservoir dogs ddu (where i was mr pink) how i kept tring to roleplay that the rats (scum) were just yap yapping and preventing meaningful discussion from taking place

this is weak. very. very. weak.

i need to actually look at the saude wagon and not just do this pointless vote VOTE: unvote

pedit
which scumgame?

Why did you refer to a game in which I was town as "my scumgame"?
VOTE: Tayl0r Swift

why you keep flip flopping?

joyed you’re not the centre of the universe. I read the norway/joyed intersection as TvS or SvS-ish probably due to the absence of actual SOLVING and instead you two just go “NO U!” at each other

Norway is probably town and jackjoyed is probably scum there

mmm no. Explain.

Holy fuck what happened while I was gone. After catching up I think I dont like bugs anymore. VOTE: Bugs

[Noraa]

Bugs comes back after a hot break and accuses Mundi for doing the EXACT SAME DAMN THING(coasting) He then unvotes rq and switches to the largest wagon(Taylors) for ??? reason

[Noraa]

bugspray is prime launchbait btw. They've been launched day 1 more than any other player I've seen on-site. It's why I was so happy to see a natural push from them early, so I could slot them as town, because something like that is rare from them as both alignments.

Psyche's post from this game where bugspray was a town PR who was launched day 1 is a very good assessment in reading them:

the more i think about it, the more it seems that the reason i haven't felt much affinity for the bugspray wagon is that i've seen so many townies get lynched for not being productive, coherent players. it's not really an alignment-indicative behavior on its own (scum have plenty of interest in being productive/coherent), but for some reason people on mafiascum.net just eat that shit up. everywhere i look in fact i just see half-assed justifications for voting them like what looker's decided is enough to justify a hammer.

maybe when i look closely at bugspray i'll see something stronger than that weaksauce but so far it's just a void why is it just a void

I think nothing bugs had posted early on scream LHF to me so I think my SR there is very fair.

Noraa, I agree with your logic on bugspray.

expand on this thought some more and I think I might just start TRing u. I'm definitely starting to see a town!Redados whether or not my prideful self wants to admit it. He stopped tunneling when he realized other people were more fishy than me even tho I hard tunneled him the whole time. I see this as a town mindset that cares more about town winning than a small "fight" with me. I've been a bit unreasonable here I must admit. I have slightly mixed feelings on Redados still tho since he really did strike me as pretty scummy at the beginning but as he's untunneling and actually helping move the game along, I'm feeling like maybe the scummy vibes I felt were partially caused by my tunneling and pressure on him. I find people tend to always seem a bit more scummy when under pressure and have decided that I want to try to solve Redados without all that stuff. Town can also be OMGUSy and unreasonable at times and I will be having redados as a slight town lean for now bc I do really need to stop tunneling.

[Noraa]

Uno do you agree with my shift of opinion on redados?

[Noraa]

On ISO reread I still think duppin is town. I understand why the occasional text blocks that appear look like he is too concerned with explaining himself but I think that might just be his style, some of the arguments he makes are so meandering I don't know why he would bother with them as scum. The bugspray town read was not so lazily held as I thought it might be, he went back to bugs at least a couple of times which shows interest in actually solving. The Saudade vote continues to be a stain but I guess I can see why he would want to hold onto it when it was his major hook in the game and disappeared in a puff of smoke. Despite this focus, there is still an interest in the rest of the game throughout his posts and I can't detect any scum agenda.

i think this is right at this point. I don't like duppin's playstyle and think he's been incredibly lazy, but hes shown that him not articulating his position and thoughts doesnt mean they werent there. i wish hed contribute to the game with his vote and do a bit more, but for now ill UNVOTE:

i was very happy to come into the thread today and see that the wagons started to develop the way they ought to. mundivore sheeped me on the duppin wagon for reasons i dont fully understand, and norwee is pushing everyone to lunch me without even scumreading me! look at norwee's recent iso. he just wants blood.

hectic why arent you playing like your normal self here? is it just the gimmick account?

VOTE: norwee

DAYUMN IT'S HECTIC?! I tr Taylor still bc of this untunneling. seems pretty protown here and I likey.

Uno do you agree with my shift of opinion on redados?

I'd still like to execute him. But yeah I am reconsidering, the most recent explanation he gave for his scumread against me seemed more honest. Earlier he had claimed to not be holding a suspicion of me before he started his reread, now he says my posts were already in mind. I'm still not sure whether I believe he made came to suspecting me after two posts but I am thinking on it. And in general his posting has improved. As much as I agreed with your point against them, bugspray is more of a placeholder vote for me while I try and work out whether I am just tunneling on Redados or if my vote might be better elsewhere.

I agree. He seemed pretty scummy early on especially with that OMGUSy attitude toward both of us. His recent explanations and posting has def improved so that's why I'm dropping an SR on him. It'll be a slight town lean unless I feel he's going back to being really scummy. I'm still trying to sort bugs aorn but anyways the vote is there for pressure:3

[Noraa]

T^T I was the only potato that didn't know
now I'm saddddd

[Noraa]

I nu likey that game hmph. I died too fast ;(

[Noraa]

hm this feels rather weird to me. Tayl0r unless I misunderstood you claim to have a townread on me now but I am unsure as to why that is actually, could you elaborate?

well im not sure about you atm. i still dont really buy a lot of the reasons you gave in your defense and i think your playstyle is lazy and helps scum. but i can sorta see the town mindset, and the way our wagons formed today suggests to me that this is TvT, more likely than not. its more that im fairly convinced that norwee and mundivore are scum, and i dont see you being scum with them.

I think Taylor seems towny here(in this game). Like legit she does seem pretty town. but this here strikes me as backtracking. Ur SR on duppin was really damn strong just like a hot few hours ago. You were basically screaming for his blood in the thread. Now u say ur unsure. Can I know what made this change in opinion?

[Noraa]

Why is backtracking not scummy? O_o

[Noraa]

T^T ik the talky balky type is talking about me...

[Noraa]

All jokes aside, I don't think Taylors the scum here

[Noraa]

Both bugs and Redados are by far scummier than her. I won't be voting Taylor today unless we absolutely need the extra vote but otherwise, no

[Noraa]

Mundi I want a read on me as well please while ur here

[Noraa]

Mundi I want a read on me as well please while ur here

Nah. <3

HMPH

[Noraa]

My first town game finished. Go get meta if u want it. Newbie something ANCIENT ARTHROPODS

[Noraa]

I think she's scum.

We got there. So going way back to my previous question which you did not answer - can you point to where you believe she has been anti-town in this game in a way that you wouldn't expect from town!Noraa? What about her reads suggest she is scum?

this isn't a place where I would pick out posts from her ISO to back up my point. What I would say is that most of her points directed towards me and maybe half of her posts in general are anti-town, throwing scumreads at the wall and seeing what sticks, not reading/listening carefully.

Why isn't this a place you'd do that? It'd be very helpful if you could explain which of her scumreads and pushes you don't like. This is the closest you've gotten to explaining your scumread on her, and it's not very much. I'm sure Noraa won't mind if that's your concern, she'll probably be happy that you're giving us more content to sort you.

Redados can't back up his SRs on me bc in the first place if it was TvT, we were just being OMGUSy and low-key petty. That was a bunch of tunneling on both parts. I'm not too convinced he's town still but I felt I needed to stop tunneling cuz nothing is gonna change the fact that he had zero arguments on me but kept SRing me. and that just makes me mad and I start forming a strong SR bc his SR on me is trash. And I want to stop that cycle cuz I'm not gonna be able to really focus on anything if that keeps happening. Let's just drop this for now and accept that he doesn't have any reasons. Redados if u have reasons, nows the time to drop them. A few sheepy/immature/not helpful/whatever u mentioned before posts will not cut it and I'd rather u just completely ignore all this if that's the case. I dont think u have arguments but feel free to prove me wrong.

Ignore shelly. This is how you find scum:

Claim 7-shot Strong Loyal Miller
All 3 scum will jump onto your wagon as they will want to get rid of such a strong role
Admit you were fakeclaiming and launch everyone on your wagon
???
Win

..............hectic back at it with some absolutely *wonderful* advice.

I am hard claiming strong loyal multitasking fruit vendor doctor vigilante cop watcher tracker mailman motion detector role cop role watcher psychologist jail keeper neighborizer

ah yes now we'll definitely out some scums here after this *bomb* claim

[Noraa]

VOTE: Bugs

no content. flip floppy. scum scummy. Imma be placing pressure around here for the time being

[Noraa]

I'm placing my suspicions out there but I will be changing my vote to make sure a lim happens don't u worry

[Noraa]

Noraa, Duppin. If you two voted Taylor now we'd have 1 scum down.

Norwee are you certain Taylor is scum here? Cuz I'm seriously not feeling a scum!Taylor here

[Noraa]

i didnt call it a team solve but like if i had to triple dayvig to win the game thaat's the one i would consider most game winning rn
did i ever actually tr you? let me post this and iso my readlist brb

did u ever actually have a good SR on me that wasn't like uhhhh Noraa is scum. Why? Oh bc she voted the mod in fucking rvs from 60 pages ago. Yup wonderful reasoning

[Noraa]

Noraa, Duppin. If you two voted Taylor now we'd have 1 scum down.

Norwee are you certain Taylor is scum here? Cuz I'm seriously not feeling a scum!Taylor here

Yes, i’m actually quite convinced of it.
Why do you think they are town?

she's acting just like town her basically is. I mean I see no difference. The amount she posts, the reasoning, the tiny amounts of anger and annoyance. It's all exactly like her in on this day where she was town.

[Noraa]

I hear ur points Norwee but I dont think she's scum. I'm good with just about any wagon today but tomorrow I want bugs. Redados is off the hook for now bc I want to untunnel. Bugs is not looking hot rn.

[Noraa]

Im debating whether or not to cave rn

[Noraa]

Taylor intent was stated please claim now. Unless ur a pr, I plan on caving in and hammering ... unless duppin wants the hammer ofc since he asked first. My SR on u has existed in the past, disappeared, come back, disappeared again, etc. I think limming u is the best option today due to the fact that 1) town agrees on a Taylor lim and 2) ur one of my nulls reads atm which is def better than limming one of my TRs today

[Noraa]

A Taylor flip today is beneficial to town overall since u are by far the most SRed person of this round. No matter alignment, if u get limmed day 1, I'm sorry cuz that's never fun I understand. If ur town, look forward to whooping our asses in post game. If ur scum, bid ur scum buddies goodbye in the pt.

[Noraa]

shit I didn't read the pedits

[Noraa]

Oh that’s really interesting Taylor. Because i’m an informed role and i’ve been specifically told this setup has an mafia doctor.

does this contradict her claim?

[Noraa]

Idk how the setups work in close setups with weird ass roles so inform me pls I'm confused

[Noraa]

Hold up. Im taking a trip to the roles wiki, I'll get back to everyone about this after I find out wtf a role stopper is

[Noraa]

Taylor's off the block since we won't be limming her after that claim. We need to get a counter wagon started asap. So role blocker is basically like ... jailkeeper is what the wiki basically says. It's pretty important and she's right that she'll prolly die tonight if that claim's real. Anyways I want a bugs or redados counter wagon please

[Noraa]

the good news for me is that norwee's counterclaim makes norwee a bigger target for the night kill than myself

....isnt jailkeeper the most powerful role tho?

[Noraa]

Im back to this
VOTE: bugs

[Noraa]

should we claim the masons right now? i get the feeling we got masons

what in the fuck. don't fucking out more prs.

[Noraa]

VOTE: bugs
VOTE: bugs

I don't give two shits if we have masons but don't ask them to out wtf

[Noraa]

im actually a bit concerned how easily people bought my claim. if people genuinely scumread then their reactions should have been closer to norwee's reaction

my SR on u was always the weakest piece of shit anyways so idc I'll just believe it for now

[Noraa]

Would you rather I been a stubborn fuck and stuck to redados and not cared about town getting a lim?

[Noraa]

its the bugspray gambit where i claim to have a reason to think there are masons when i have no reason to think that and then i find out who is town
VOTE: noraa

this just looks like scum backtracking after trying to get more prs to out. STOP

[Noraa]

its the bugspray gambit where i claim to have a reason to think there are masons when i have no reason to think that and then i find out who is town
VOTE: noraa

This vote is OMGUSy and also this whole "it was a test" thing just sounds stupid. Definitely not rubbing me the right way. I think bugs isn't town here.

[Noraa]

Tbh I also assumed u were a pr. I can't think of another case scenario where you could know that a role exists in a closed setup unless ur lying. Idk I thought the same thing there so that might just be a noob thing. The rest of plus' case on u isn't flattering I must admit. it's rather .... weak.

[Noraa]

this is a hot mess. what do u want to hear from me norwee?

[Noraa]

??????

[Noraa]

I saw a connection?

[Noraa]

PAGE TOPPP

[Noraa]

Yeah that doesn't make sense. If anything u were SRing Taylor to hell and back

[Noraa]

Informed townie is a thing?
tbh tho I've never heard of a role in general that can tell u the setup in a closed setup but there's a lot of roles so idk

btw norwee does ur thing tell u all of the setup or only one role on the scum side? If u know all of them, I think u should tell us that way we'll know. But don't say the town pr roles bc we wouldn't want to let scums find out the exact setup they are against. Telling everyone the mafia roles does benefit town tho since we would be more informed and they don't benefit since they already know all their roles.

[Noraa]

Informed townie is a thing?
tbh tho I've never heard of a role in general that can tell u the setup in a closed setup but there's a lot of roles so idk

btw norwee does ur thing tell u all of the setup or only one role on the scum side? If u know all of them, I think u should tell us that way we'll know. But don't say the town pr roles bc we wouldn't want to let scums find out the exact setup they are against. Telling everyone the mafia roles does benefit town tho since we would be more informed and they don't benefit since they already know all their roles.

norwee?

[Noraa]

T^T why wuz mod so greedy with giving ya the tea?
hmphhhhh

[Noraa]

I was hoping we could get all the setup info but dang

[Noraa]

but I mean that'd be nice 8(

[Noraa]

I thought u did get it all until I realized it was a ripoff and we're still on square one with one extra piece of info which is that there is a mafia doctor. *siiiiiiiigh*

[Noraa]

I doubt that piece of info will help us much until much later into the game

[Noraa]

what's a watcher and what's a vigilante?

[Noraa]

so just like a town version of goon
and a .... better version of tracker? :3

[Noraa]

yeah imma have to tell all future mods to never make a vigilante then. I feel like I'd prolly just give scum a double town kill three nights in a row and it'd be game over

[Noraa]

*make me

[Noraa]

Norwee what's the best wagon today besides plus?
I don't want a plus lim today. I haven't yet determined if I think he's LHF here or scum here.

[Noraa]

I don't think it's uno. The other ones ... I'm not sure

alrighty go get some sleep.

[Noraa]

If only I was a quick reader 8(

[Noraa]

the above posts were a bit ...... yeah

[Noraa]

im the town rolestopper.

alrighty
UNVOTE: Taylor swift

My alrightys have spread :3 ik its contagious

[Noraa]

Plus never claimed.....right?

[Noraa]

that's a role?
I thought he was joking or something

[Noraa]

that's a thing ....?
wtf
but also if he wasn't kidding, shelly its 100% ur fault for this pr outing bc I think most people thought it was a joke not crumbing and now u make a fuss out of it....

[Noraa]

it was not a claim as far as I'm concerned cuz I 100% thought it was a joke and just skipped over it.

[Noraa]

no it was a clear joke

[Noraa]

and a joke like that at most is a crumb not a claim cuz no one took it seriously until u came along and called it a claim

[Noraa]

it was literally worded like a joke. what more do u expect?

[Noraa]

I was saying if that wasn't a joke and just a crumb, then its ur fault

[Noraa]

I just realized HOLY FUCK we're on page 92 on a day 1
can we get a hot second to appreciate how spammy everyone is?
shhh don't let me take the blame myself U-U

Gosh the so many pages honestly kinda got me into a more day 3 ish mindset ig? Normally most games I'm just day 1 mindset entire game but this game my mindset got developed faster cuz there was more content :3

[Noraa]

Thinking Redados might not be a bad idea now honestly, I thought the "scum because of playstyle" caution was towny from him early on, but it seems he's committed to actually scumreading both of Noraa/shelly without ever explaining why.

Looking through his ISO, he's restated or acknowledged those scumreads like 10 or so different times, but not once has he mentioned

why

he scumreads them or given any reasoning despite repeatedly being prompted for it...maybe he doesn't actually have any reasons and is just rolling with the reads from early on? His wall in 1164 infact have a bunch of lines where he says shelly is being protown or that he agrees with something shelly has said, but then these come with no explanation:

P12 - I am scumreading ShellyC

Page 38 - I’m scumreading ShellyC.

Redados

help, WHY do you scumread shelly and Noraa?

This is a point I've been trying to get across for an eternity and everyone ignored me except uno ;(

Saudade has posted a tiny bit before repping out in another scumgame of his too.
I remember because it’s the slot i replaced into.
Large 228 for reference.

Anyway i think Redados/Mundivore/Saudade is a good place to start focusing so gj there Hectic dude.

The replacement thread blew up with his games. I don't think talking a little this time is AI.

[Noraa]

Thinking Redados might not be a bad idea now honestly, I thought the "scum because of playstyle" caution was towny from him early on, but it seems he's committed to actually scumreading both of Noraa/shelly without ever explaining why.

Looking through his ISO, he's restated or acknowledged those scumreads like 10 or so different times, but not once has he mentioned

why

he scumreads them or given any reasoning despite repeatedly being prompted for it...maybe he doesn't actually have any reasons and is just rolling with the reads from early on? His wall in 1164 infact have a bunch of lines where he says shelly is being protown or that he agrees with something shelly has said, but then these come with no explanation:

P12 - I am scumreading ShellyC

Page 38 - I’m scumreading ShellyC.

Redados

help, WHY do you scumread shelly and Noraa?

This is a point I've been trying to get across for an eternity and everyone ignored me except uno ;(

Saudade has posted a tiny bit before repping out in another scumgame of his too.
I remember because it’s the slot i replaced into.
Large 228 for reference.

Anyway i think Redados/Mundivore/Saudade is a good place to start focusing so gj there Hectic dude.

The replacement thread blew up with his games. I don't think talking a little this time is AI.