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VOTE: Kazyan
Handful o' chocolate chips, but, like, a crappy kind with so much butyric acid that it barely tastes like chocolate. I'm just trying to make it to today's catered lunch at work.In post 22, Nixie wrote:Let me know what you eat for breakfast, as that will form the basis of my scumhunting.
It's an RVS gag? Weird question.
Is that was RVS is supposed to do? Huh. Fair, then. I haven't noticed reactions to RVS-voting someone being important, but apparently, voting for myself can get a response too.In post 42, Nathann wrote:But the sacred rules of RVS say that you must vote someone else to try to read their reaction and immediately start solving the game. It's not a weird question.
This is a good point. geraintm, can you elaborate on "weird"?In post 36, GrandpaMo wrote:VOTE: geraintmIn post 20, geraintm wrote:Oh....this game is going to be weird from what I've read above.
Will post more later.
This is post 20
I thought it might be a little scummy to ask a probing question over something that clearly doesn't matter, but then I realized that a "peck" at someone hasn't historically come from scum in my games--Lunar Martian in Mini Normal 2187, or T3's initial questions in Not Quite Normal Multiball. And then you gave a reasonable answer, so now I'm not getting any scum vibes from you.In post 48, Nathann wrote:In theory, at least. Debatable how well it accomplishes that in practice. Does the response tell you anything?In post 46, Kazyan wrote:Is that was RVS is supposed to do? Huh. Fair, then. I haven't noticed reactions to RVS-voting someone being important, but apparently, voting for myself can get a response too.
A vague "this is weird" suggests that you have more information about the gamestate with which to evaluate it. To me, having an Innocent Child isn't enough to consider this a bizarro world game, but given that your experience is different, your comment makes more sense.In post 49, geraintm wrote:whats the good point?
weird - because i have never seen a game with day 1 mod confirmed townie before
I'd wait for more data before making so many hard extrapolations, but this is worth being a working hypothesis.In post 67, ssbm_Kyouko wrote:If that's the case I'd hazard a guess that "our mob" was not a typo but was in fact a traitor crumb and geraintm voting me is chainsawing for Margot
Definitely more reasonable in that context, then.In post 99, geraintm wrote:As my last game has just finished, my "weird" comment about day zero IC might make more sense. I was a day 3 IC in it, so to see one in this game that flipped straight away I found odd
That second bit is right there in the game rules, so...
Because I did not think to follow up with a vote switch when I was fixed on finishing the promised task: sort every player. VOTE: Dwlee99In post 151, Nathann wrote:Okay, I will ask the obvious question: why are you voting for Alice when you have a stronger scumread in Dwlee?
It's unflattering, yeah. Basically, I mean that you're not fitting the mold of a generic Mafiascum.net player, mostly be presenting your thoughts in a way that most don't. I don't want to interpret mere nonconformism as scummy.In post 150, geraintm wrote:i take it goober isn't complimentary?
im fine with that. i just said in my post mortum to my last game every single one of my day 1 scum pings were wrong.
In post 159, Ythan wrote: Twelve years I've been on this site. 2021 games are not a learning experience for me.
In post 161, Ythan wrote: Shrug shrug shrug
Lolwhat? Apologies for snubbing your experience level, though.In post 162, Ythan wrote: By the way where do you think I got this title hmmm.
I mean, I had one game where 2ndchosen1 and unwind put on Oscar-worthy scum performance that secured them the game, but in every game since then, I've never been able to pick out scum theater that mattered. So I don't actually know. I just saw post 145 and thought "is this really how you pick on your scum partner? No, probably not..." but if it's actually consistent with 'typical' scum theater, then that's more interesting. (Except that I can't solve the game on Day 1.)In post 170, Nathann wrote:Do you have really low expectations for Scum's ability to do theatre? Their conversation seemed like boring meta blabber to me. Why does it give you the impression that it's difficult to fake, more than anything else we've seen in the game so far?In post 165, Kazyan wrote:Thinking about recent interactions, though, I'm pretty sure the scumteam can't be Dwlee+Ythan, actually, since I have a hard time seeing this whole conversation as distancing. So if Dwlee were to flip red, I'd give Ythan a huge pile of towncred, or vice versa, but that's thinking so far ahead that it's not super helpful.
Seriously, if anyone is missing a take on Dwlee/Kyo/Alice right now, please provide it so we can sort this.In post 198, Kazyan wrote:The more I think about Dwlee and read reactions to them, the more confused I get
I'm weirded out by Dwlee making observations that I agree with, but they're still not towning in my eyes, and I don't know what to think about Kyo being in the crossfire of this. Kyo looks town to me even if I think she's extrapolating too far off of so little data, so, like. It is scummy to acknowledge the townie? To argue? I'm sure Dwlee would have hadsomethingto say about the content instead of 'yup that's town' if the scumteam was Alice/Dwlee, so, that's probably not the scumteam?
There's no daychat, so I'm not sure Neighborhoods can even exist, unless there's some kinda Night Neighbor role.In post 200, ssbm_Kyouko wrote:Who all is in a neighborhood?
I don't usually do that, and in fact, I'm usually pretty thumbs-down about pre-flip associatives. However, I'm used to there being 40 pages by this point instead of 11, so it's easier for me make weak statements about pairings rather than strong statements about individuals.In post 243, Nathann wrote:I'm not saying I think they're Scum together, I was just pointing out that the interaction didn't seem like anything too difficult to fake.
Kazyan, I noticed that you were focusing a lot on potential team reads (202, 198, 165). Is this something that you usually do? Oh, regarding your Dwlee read, what gave you the feeling of opportunism regarding their interaction with Ythan?
People have already asked Alice to 'elaborate' here, but I'm instead going to point out that these are some pretty limp takes.In post 247, AliceK wrote:Kazyan progression is quite random which I think comes from Town. Geraintm also gives good vibes. I will keep my vote where it is.
I like the things you're saying, but the way you're saying them doesn't lock you in as town yet. Now that we know there are only two scum, which of these three do you think is the townie? Or does the calculus change entirely?In post 107, Nixie wrote:Alice, dwlee, geraintm are the three scum. We can pack it up.
I'm not sure if it's even necessary that scum knew that you had the info. It seems like an obvious fake-assumption to make that this game has the default number of scum.In post 264, Jolyne wrote:So anyways - people should never be cleared for assuming 3 scum at the start of game before I outted it - Last time we had a funny setup like this with info like this, the scum were also informed of a town player having the info. I assume the same is present here. However - those that mistakenly thought my info was referring to traitors being possible are pretty much townslipped. That's why this setup is so troll because stuff like this gives town free clears out of the social aspect of assumptions being inherently different from scum to town.
In post 289, DrippingGoofball wrote:Nixie is town.
In post 290, DrippingGoofball wrote:I like Nathann for town.
In post 293, DrippingGoofball wrote:Andres is scum.
In post 295, DrippingGoofball wrote:I'm not getting geraintm town vibes, but it's early in the game and I have faith I'll be able to read that slot eventually.
In post 299, DrippingGoofball wrote:Enchant is scum.
There is literally one (1) thought here. DGB is straight-up rolling dice to determine its reads.In post 302, DrippingGoofball wrote:I just iso'd AliceK, that was quick, I say LAWK TOWN
DGB or GrandpaMo. Whenever someone plays the "I'm not bothering to read the game but I still have strong opinions" game, that irks me on a personal level. They're either scum or actively detrimental to a town, and either way, need to get ejected.In post 437, Nathann wrote:Enchant, when can we expect something from you?
Kazyan, is there anyone your heart does want to vote?
Aight, town, what do we think about these responses? I asked about random-ass people to throw Enchant off-script, but the Nixie read seems genuine; if scum were just playing it cool and trying to give real responses, they wouldn't verbally shrug like that.In post 490, Enchant wrote:GrandPa idk, he just looked on post where i was voted and like "Wait wot". Perhaps confused townie, because mafia would simple say "Ye Enchant indeed maf go" and so on.In post 487, Kazyan wrote:Enchant, gib reads. Do you have an opinion on any of the following people: GrandpaMo, Nixie, and/or Andre?
Nixie who the hell is it
Andre confscum, i am not gonna change vote ty.
In post 542, GrandpaMo wrote:You will look at my iso and realize the shitpush you just made lol.
If you're just going to set me up for a double bind, then I won't bother.In post 541, GrandpaMo wrote:Please feel free to do so, you sheep.
AndIn post 555, Andresvmb wrote:I don’t understand why you’re backing away from a fight so easily.In post 552, Kazyan wrote:Now that I'm not just grumping about fluffy posts, there doesn't appear to be anything scummy in this ISO. UNVOTE: GrandpaMo
Well, yeah. I've never once been able to catch scum without a truth wizard holding my hand, and am surrounded by people who keep pushing back against my reads with greater experience and evidence. To present my observations as anything more than "something to consider" would be arrogance, not good play.In post 558, Andresvmb wrote:But your reaction sticks out in that you have seemed not to really believe in any one push you’re making.
In post 559, Nathann wrote:Now, onto Part 2... What the hell is Kazyan doing.
Kazyan's mentions of GrandpaMo, prior to this little spat, are: 46 (having a good point), 149 (gut scumlean), 478 (willing to yeet, no explanation), 525 (badposting). A pretty much consistent scumread, never any elaborate explanation given for it.
Looking at their ISO of GrandpaMo (552) - Why is giving a simple read on Nixie Townie? (Yes, I know you wrote a comment how Scum probably lets a comment like that slide, so I guess my question then is, do you expect scum to be doing nothing? Or, what's the line between something Scum would or wouldn't let slide? There's probably no correct answer to this, but I wanna see some sorta thought process here.) Why is setup speculation Townie?
Regarding you Townreading his 369, could you give me your opinion on the second paragraph of my 436?
And, probably the question I care about the most - why were you consistently Scumreading GrandpaMo in the first place? I don't care if you changed your mind in the meantime or whatnot, because this shift feels extremely weird. Maybe I'm biased in thinking that GrandpaMo isn't Townie, I could be. But I don't know if I find your current thought process regarding him to make any sense whatsoever.
I didn't expect any content in the early ISO, because it was so early in the game, and not-quite-RVS posting could have come from anyone. We were early enough in the game that people like Pooky, unwnd, et al. are still passing out "HI *GLOMPS U*" kind of posts in other games, so I didn't think anything of it. My bad.In post 565, Andresvmb wrote:And it’s not like this takes tremendous skill either. That’s just blatant fluff. If you don’t know how to present a point of view without giving yourself up as Scum, you often see stuff like that. Now, I’m not saying this is bulletproof or anything - I’ll keep reading. But I don’t like that you just backtracked on your read *after* having read that, and just failed to properly account for it.
And even if you’re wrong or don’t have a whole lot of confidence in your reads, putting them out there and your thought process is helpful. If only in that people can point out where you’re going wrong and you can have a genuine conversation.
Yes, you got that right. As for why...I mean, I'm getting convinced by Andre that I had wrong expectations for the appropriate amount of fluffposting, there. I open up the ISO and think "early game starts here", but when I'm in the moment of viewing posts as they trickle into the game, I start thinking "no longer early game" after a few days. So there's that disconnect.In post 569, Nathann wrote: So, if you're not paying attention, those posts make you scumread a person, but when you reread, you found them NAI, did I get that right? Why do you no longer find it Scummy then?
And I'm not sure if you got what I'm saying here. Or maybe I don't get your reply. I know GrandpaMo wouldn't think of his own post like that. However, my issue is that he uses someone else's confusion at his post to Townread them. Ythan's reaction was basically "wtf", and GrandpaMo declared that reaction as Townie because "only town would react in a way where they thought the way i said was weird." I get the feeling there's something off about thinking that only Town would react with confusion at a confusing post.
There is a lot to unpack in this one line. Can you unpack it?In post 646, Ythan wrote:Y'all are both gonna be sad when Gramps isn't here to soak up votes.
In post 649, Ythan wrote:As to your only question the only wagon with two votes besides Gramps happens to be those exact two players. On Andres who is posting mad content.
To actually answer you though obviously yes.
I mean, we have a lot of players who have gone practically silent, so we kinda need a huge majority of active players cooperate to avoid a no-lim today, not just n/2 + 1. VOTE: GrandpaMo. Andre, if you're scum, you're really good at providing scumcases on people.In post 651, Ythan wrote:On second thought this is actually a weird question.In post 647, Kazyan wrote:Also, should we consolidate wagons?
There is a specific purpose to that post. ♬~In post 679, Ythan wrote:This feels to me like not purely fluff but a subtle suggestion that you are uninformed town. And other than that it is fluff which makes it stand out.In post 92, Kazyan wrote:I like that we have things to talk about already besides the IC, though I'm still kinda in the phase where I only know anything about Jolyne's role and my role. So, I'm going to watch and reread for a while in order to differentiate people in my mind.
I'm still learning all of these Mafia acronyms; what is "NoU" short for?In post 685, Enchant wrote:I catched more scums than you already.In post 683, Ythan wrote:Look for scum or I'll hang you later.