Mini Normal 1809: Game Over
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Weak as fuck Page 1 scum reads:
Wake - Seems excited
Vedith - Basically copied Blank but changed the name then buddied Cmit
Cmit - Overly friendly and then called Hoopla's reaction "strange" without a vote or further thoughts
Hoopla - That reaction to BBMolla.
Rob - Over reaction to Elyse's vote on him.
^Yes, there are five. That's ok because I highly doubt I'm scumreading all five when I finish reading.
Now, progressing past Page 1, I like Rob's questioning Cmit for that comment about Hoopla. And I notice Cmit appears to be calling it scummy and still hasn't voted.
Hoopla's tone seems to be intentionally trying to get people to town read her. I see Rob noticed this as well. I guess Rob can be crossed off my original list for now. BBMolla is spot on about Rob. He's town and his Elyse vote sucks.
Cmit might just be misguided newbtown. The "everyone is confirmed scum" reads list might not be something newbscum would do.
Vedith's reaction to Hoopla's town bloc is town. I'm left with two weak scum reads (Wake and Hoopla) and no strong ones yet.
I'm only through the first two pages. Will finish this evening.-
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Meh, those reasons were weak and easily explained by "meh, he's new". Like maybe he's just not aware that voting Hoopla is pretty standard if he thinks she's scummy on Page 1. Or maybe he just wasn't sure of himself. It probably makes more sense than saying he's scum who doesn't want to vote because it might look bad.
Also want to point out that I'm not "writing off" him or anyone else. Just saying it makes more sense for him to be newbtown than newbscum so far.-
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Ok, picking back up on Page 3.
Cmit saying he has some mafia experience makes that voting hesitance an issue again. Massclaim question is also weird, but not necessarily scummy. Could be scum trying to figure out when he needs a claim. Could be town whose offsite experience revolved more around roles than day play.Cmit, what site did you play on before here?<- Answered. Never heard of it... His later posts seem to suggest it's that kind of site though. I'm still on the fence but leaning town.
Hoopla, why was Cmit's question "incredibly town"?
Hmm. These BBMolla votes (Rob and Elyse) look like wrong town. Scum might jump on though so I'm watching for that as I read more. If they don't, maybe BBMolla actually is scum, but not for supposedly suggesting massclaim because that's not what he was doing. His frustrated reaction surprisingly is reading town to me though so...yeah.
Meh, probably useless but I like answering stuff.Grendel wrote:1) Do you prefer to play as Town, Mafia, or Independent?
2) What is your favorite role?
3) What are your strengths as a player?
4) What are your weaknesses as a player?
5) Do your strengths and weaknesses change with your alignment?
6) Do you believe in having a D1 trust/buddy? If “yes” who here would be your D1 trust/buddy?
7) What is the story behind your current avatar picture?
1) I like being town power roles or self aligned. I kind of suck at not giving off associative tells as scum, but I'm good at looking town.
2) Either a town investigative (Cop or Tracker probably) or SK.
3) Looking town and I think I make good choices with night actions.
4) Keeping active when RL is busy and being read as scum as a result. I also get emotional when people scum read me.
5) Ummm. No, I don't think so.
6) No. There are players who are hard to read and are good players (House, Hoopla, and BBMolla fit into that category in this game) and I don't think I'd pursue their lynch Day 1 unless I'm really confident in that read. I mean, I might, but I'm less likely to.
7) It's an egg.
The RQS refusals are interesting. Here are my thoughts on them:
-Rob seems to have a very strong opinion against answering. I remember someone saying scum don't like to answer because it could give them away or something. (Found it. Mini 1620. Thesp said people who aggressively refuse are scum. He tunneled my scumbuddy for this) I've found it more likely before though that scum go along with the cool thing to do which tends to be answering although maybe their answers are short "yes" and "no" types. I'll keep Rob in mind at least.
-BBMolla seems to have a mindset about RQS that was established long before this game. That makes his reaction pretty null.
-And I'm back to cmit again. It's interesting because we got refusals right away rather than the typical answers and Cmit came right in asking how it was useful and seemed to be acting like it was an original thought. He also quoted Rob though which I'm not sure if that was intentional or not but it shows he had Rob's refusal in mind before stating his own. Not a fan.
Grendel, BBMolla is right. RVS votes usually aren't truly random. I personally don't RVS very often though so what do I know?
Through Page 5. Phone battery is low. I'll finish when it charges some.-
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Masquarade, you said that what followed Grendel's RQS was boring. What do you think of those who refused to answer? I also noticed you didn't list any strengths. Do you really not know of any? Because you said you prefer playing scum and "sort of" change strengths and weknesses with alignment and it kind of feels like you had scum strengths in mind that you didn't want to share. How do you know your strengths and weaknesses change without knowing what your strengths are?
I want to make America great again though. What made you go from the "RQS is stupid and distracting" mentality to answering the questions? For someone preaching about distractions, you seem pretty ok with them now. And that includes some of the fluff posting before answering the RQS. Asking your own questions seems weird too after calling it a stupid distraction when someone else did it.Rob wrote:Except this year. Even if you hate Hillary you have to vote her or we get stuck with chump.
BBMolla's 170 hit very close to home for me fyi.
Chaos, any thoughts that aren't about Masquarade?
House, when you said "write them off", yeah I thought you meant writing cmit off as town. I actually had to go back and read more than once to see that that's not what you meant. But yeah I'm back and forth on cmit unfortunately. He's doing things that I'd consider scummy if an experienced player did them, but new players are different to read and he hasn't committed any of my classic newbscum tells. As for why I had page 1 stuff and page 2 stuff in the same post, *shrug*. It's gonna happen any time I'm not fully caught up. Things change as I read and the more ground I cover in one post, the more likely it is that I change my mind in one sitting. It's not "conflicting thoughts". It's an old thought being replaced by a new thought.
Grendel, can you elaborate on your previous "good result" with RQS?
5. Meh. I don't personally think my alignment affects my play. I know that sounds cocky, but my game changes much more from other influences such as availible free time, playerlist, and mood than alignment. Maybe it's because I've played like 300 games so I'm over any nervousness about harder roles to play and I know what people look for when making their reads. I try to be open and genuine as both town and scum which is something that gets me townread whether I'm actually town or not. You'll remember I listed that as a strength. As for my weaknesses, I'm going to be too busy when RL happens. RL doesn't happen based on my role in a mafia game. I don't go to work more as scum. I don't take time off as town. These things seem obvious, but that's really a key factor in how people read me whether they know it or not. It's the same with my emotions. It's about whether people are making sense or not rather than my alignment.Grendel wrote: 5) Elaborate?
6) Hmm, Say that Hypothec ally House, Hoopla, and BBmolla are conftown, who would you work most closely with to win the game?
6. Hmm. Good question. My first instinct is to say House just because I've had more experience with him than BBMolla or Hoopla and I feel like I interact better with him. But, as he will tell you himself, he's a much stronger scum player than town. I'd probably trust a confirmed town Hoopla's reads the most. So I'll say Hoopla.
Ohhhhhh. Cmit is a town of salem guy. Never saw that abbreviated that way before. Ok, yeah, that explains basically every issue I had with him. Still would like to know why he was comfortable voting after not seeming that way with Hoopla though.
Now that I'm caught up,
Vote Masquarade
Believe it or not, Grendel's RQS may have actually led to something. As I outlined above, Masquarade's answers didn't sit right with me.-
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Summary is more valuable than a link. I don't read games I'm not in.In post 211, House wrote:
While I agree with you on principle, you should check my play in this game.In post 208, Egg wrote:6. Hmm. Good question. My first instinct is to say House just because I've had more experience with him than BBMolla or Hoopla and I feel like I interact better with him. But, as he will tell you himself, he's a much stronger scum player than town. I'd probably trust a confirmed town Hoopla's reads the most. So I'll say Hoopla.
Hmm. Didn't miss it, just hoped there was more to it I guess. So distractions from the game are ok if you're bored?In post 212, Robbnva wrote:
Kind of hard to miss imo.In post 147, Robbnva wrote:Ugh I'm bored so here goes.-
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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*shrug*. Beck was scum so it's hard to say he was completely wrong. You'll notice I chose not to vote you for it though so that should say something about my confidence in that tell.In post 223, Robbnva wrote:Like that game you mentioned earlier. The assertion that people refusing to answer was an incorrect assertion. That game also showed it was a pointless activity because beck proved rqs didn't help the person find scum in previous games.
1)I disagreeIn post 224, Robbnva wrote:
Ok? There's motive for town to keep their scum meta secret.In post 222, Egg wrote:Masquarade answered. His answers surrounding scum play felt guarded though.
2)He didn't say that though.
3)What is your read on Masquarade?-
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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1. Not worried about that. This game is an island. If I can be easier to read here, it's a good thing. I'll worry about changing my scum game later if I need to. Like I said though, I don't know of any differences in my town and scum game.
2. Again, he DID answer. Also, I prefer to vote when something stands out. If I change my mind, I can unvote later. Anyway, my point in this one was that you assumed he was hiding his scum meta for town reasons. You put those words in his mouth.
3. Interesting. You're acting like you have a strong town read on him.-
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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You're acting on principle rather than reading the words Masquarade and I posted then. People can say and do scummy things regardless of what is said prior to their post. For example, if my answer to the first question was "This is my first time as scum so we'll see how it goes", I don't think people would be wrong to use that against me. Now, Masquarade's answer wasn't quite THAT damning, but I'm using extremes to make my point.
What opinion are you referring to here?Rob wrote: Personal opinions aren't alignment indicative unless you can prove they lied which I don't think you can. I don't even think it's even possible because lying about your own opinions is stupid. People do like to lie on this site though so I guess it's possible but I don't know how you can prove it.-
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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If you're town, this is actually constructive though. You're ignoring information and I'm trying to show you that.In post 229, Robbnva wrote:I won't say anything else cause I'm really not trying to be the shit starter anymore and I'm afraid I'll resort to insults which is my fall back.
I'm trying to change my image for the better so let's just agree to disagree. Just want to be on record that I think this is a bad push regardless what masq' alignment is.-
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Rob, because we don't just have different views on a player. You are acting on principle. Like, most of what we say in a mafia game is opinions yet people form reads all the time. The fact that a post was responding to RQS doesn't make it 100% null. You're not even trying to understand my point just because Grendel asked some questions you didn't like, and even called a stupid distraction, but answered anyway.
House, holy shit. lol
Cmit, from what I've heard it's a very different game there. Everything is based on your role, not what you say in thread. So your wondering about massclaim and stuff like that is pretty normal. Here, it's more like "OMG HE TALKED ABOUT ROLES. HE'S SCUM". But I notice you didn't answer my question. Any reason for that?-
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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He used RQS as town, felt successful with it (whether he actually WAS or not is irrelevent) and brought it here. Then he did a good job of outlining why. It feels genuine. He really believes he is doing a good thing for town.
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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I would but there really isn't more.In post 262, Wake1 wrote:
I'm honestly curious, and would really like you to go on on this please.In post 261, Egg wrote:Ehh, it was probably just that three posts in a four post block were yours right at the start of the game and then the smilie and the way I read your tone.-
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Nope, I usually don't like RQS. I think this is the first time I've townread someone for it. That's why I questioned him about doing it in the past. He just happened to have a very genuine answer. Usually, I get "I do it every game" which is obnoxious because you can't get a read from it. But the whole trying it once and liking the result as town, then doing it here. Like I said, he genuinely believes he's doing something that helps town. And whether he's right or not, that's a town mindset.-
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Huh?
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Catching up:
Page 13:
I don't like BBMolla's using defending himself as an excuse not to scum hunt (Post 306).
Post 314 is a good example of why I'm shocked that Rob was a Jake From State Farm alt. Jake was actually a good player. Rob is obnoxiously sarcastic and intentionally dense. It's like he came here just to troll the game. Not really relevant now but it's shocking to me.
Page 14-15:
Pretty sure House was town. He seems convinced Rob is actually scum. He's also trying to advance the game despite the personal BS. I'm looking specifically at where he tells Blankface that it's useless to call the whole thing anti town without giving reads. BBMolla basically echos that, so I guess he gets town points too. Hoopla is probably right about Bbmolla not being able to fake emotions anyway.
Page 16:
Ok, I find myself agreeing with Elyse's Blankface case. He feels like scum who isn't sure what to say because he can't genuinely scum hunt. He's been on site for over a year though. I might need to do a quick scan of his meta to see if he's been scum before. I should also mention I have a weak gut scum read on Wake. Not sure why. It's there though.
Not sure how Blankface thought I had yet to vote at that point. There was a vote count on the top of the page. His reaction to Elyse's vote sucks too.
Pages 17-21:
Sorry, not gonna comment on House vs Rob any more than I have already.
Battery is dying on my phone and it's almost 2AM anyway. I intend to finish tomorrow-
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Page 22:
Grendel, not sure where you got the impression that I felt bad for you or anything. Just anything anyone was saying about "OMG HE DID RQS. SCUM!" is so plain wrong and your motivation for doing it looked so town. I don't want to lynch town for shit reasons so I spoke up. it's not about you specifically. It's about the big picture. That said, I have too many town reads so I'll have to go back and see who is fooling me at some point.
Page 23:
Fully agree with Elyse's continued accusations against Blankface for playing referee instead of scumhunting. And even saying that that's the only thing going on wouldn't work because there is no attempt to read House or Rob's alignment and Blank hadn't shared opinions before any of the BS either.
Not sure if I said it already, but I have a strong meta town read on House.
Page 24:
Grendel, can you explain why Wake's interactions with House and Rob are town rather than just someone who wants to keep the game civil? Also, I don't think House failed RQS. I think he did a typical House thing and answered just to humor you, see what you did with it, and evaluate. I know he didn't really follow up aton, but I think that's why he didn't take it seriously. The thing with Rob probably distracted him from it.
Blankface/hoopla probably isn't a team because Hoopla would probably be more likely to come it with a "let's end the day and lynch vedith" rather than switching up wagons. If Blankface is town, the whole thing is null as it relates to Hoopla.
Page 25:
Wonderful. More BS.
Page 26:
Blatant rolefishing by cmit. I know town of salem is supposed to be more role based than here, but really? Cmit, why did you want to know Rob's role?
Page 27:
Hoopla, I notice five people in the vote count at 2 votes. You said you wanted to see Vedith vs Blank today. Why them specifically? And if low activity is the reason, why not Masquarade?
Fuck. I have too many townreads and Blankface hasn't been one of them but post 665 looks town. He still hasn't given reads and has ignored requests to do so though. He implies he's reading along and just not interested, but I don't see many people uninterested in giving reads so meh. Maybe I'm just trying to justify scumreading him to myself but I dunno. The whole "this game sucks" mentality and wanting to replace out felt town. Scum could sit back and let the game blow up. Which I guess to an extent he's done so meh. He might still be scum, but Masquarade and Cmit are probably better lynches.
Gotta charge my phone before I finish.-
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Page 28:
So I haven't figured out why Chaos died unless it was to frame Masquarade, but these were some of his reads, so maybe I've been on the right track:
Grendel, I'm writing this before reading any response from Elyse or your reaction to it (I type as I read), but if you weren't satisfied with her answer, I can definitely go through House's stuff with Rob and show a bunch of townish stuff from him.In post 687, ChaosOmega wrote:Not interested in voting Hoopla today.
You have any sort of read on Masquerade, Wake, or BlankFace?
Pages 29/30
I'm not ticklish.Wake wrote:I feel like tickling Egg
Really though, at first glance, Wake's push to avoid no lynch feels town at first. Only thing is, if he's scum, he wants a mislynch. We already know Vedith was town. If Blankface was also town, scumWake would hate a mislynch just as much as townWake. I almost have to call it null. I'm also noting Hoopla doing the same.
House makes a good point about Hoopla and Wake being on the same page and avoiding interaction. Wake not being in Hoopla's so called town bloc is interesting with that in mind. Throw in the fact that Hoopla seemed to randomly exclude Masquarade from the Blank vs Vedith wagon thing earlier, then again on this Page (Post 729), and this very well could be the scum team (Hoopla/Wake/Masquarade). As much as I don't like Blankface's refusal to give any reads, that's probably my best guess at this point. Oh, I keep forgetting cmit too because he hasn't said much lately. Guess my "too many town reads" problem isn't such a big deal anymore. Strong town reads on Grendel, House, and Elyse is probably a good thing then.
Page 31:
I don't like Masquarade's reasoning for voting Vedith. He was scumreading Vedith earlier, so why not just point to that? Saying he wants momentum on the wagon and something to talk about rubs me the wrong way there.
Two issues with Wake on this page:
1) The reaction to Rob being JK feels fake. It's an unnecessary "oh man we lost a power role" type post and it reeks of trying to seem upset. The "?" to House gets lumped in with this reaction because of the "what did I do" feel it has to it. Like he knows he slipped up but doesn't know where.
2) The hesitance on voting after pushing everyone else to vote Vedith or Blankface feels like avoiding responsibility. It pushes both lynches, but doesn't show up on a VCA.
Page 32:
Hoopla's 780 might be scum hoping to wagon Blankface because the Vedith wagon didn't out a power role. Like she wants a second attempt. I'm not speculating on Blankface's role in any way here, but Hoopla could just be looking for claims in general.
So Cmit missed Grendel's question 3 times, has no update on that reads list, and thought BBMolla was modkilled. What the fuck. Definitely not paying attention. The question is whether he's lost scum or lost town...
Page 33:
I remember Masquarade catching flak for the Vedith vote. My issue there wasn't the vote itself, but the later explanation. Masquarade had Vedith as a scum read earlier. But why the switch to Blankface for being "an ok lynch"? I'd expect strong preference towards Vedith based on Masquarade's earlier posting. It's not consistent and the indifference is yet another reason to think that Masquarade is scum and Blankface is town.
Cmit, why unvote Vedith without voting Blankface?
Elyse's 824 is obvtown.
Page 34:
Wake, if you didn't want Vedith and Blankface pressured today, why were you encouraging people to pick one or the other to vote earlier?
Hmm. Cmit's 831 might be town with a genuine town read on Blankface. This guy is so hard to read, but I think I'm sticking with my Hoopla/Wake/Masquarade team for now.
Vote Masquarade
^I'm most confident here.-
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Please tell me someone else sees how fake this is.In post 880, Masquerade wrote:Oh you're voting me. I see.-
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Have you missed almost every vote count this game?In post 884, Masquerade wrote:It's not. I tend to miss votes in walls when they're merely bolded (what is it with people not just putting a v instead of a b?) and that vc wasn't actually there yet when I opened this page (curse of a small screen and refreshing)
Elyse, what do you think about Hoopla not even mentioning Masquarade when about five people had 2-3 votes and she suddenly decided it's Blankface vs Vedith?
Cmit, any reads on the remaining living players not named Grendel?
Grendel, I think Wake is someone who wants a fun game regardless of alignment. I don't think he'd encourage a shit fest as scum, or even just let it happen, just because it might help him win the game. I'll go into House at some point, but if you're not pushing his slot right now there probably isn't any point in rushing to it. I'm a busy person.-
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Here's what I mean regarding Hoopla/Masquarade:
Mod wrote: VOTE COUNT 1.08
Vedith (5): BBmolla, cmitc1, House, Hoopla, Wake88
Masquerade (2): ChaosOmega, Egg
Elyse (1): BlankFace
BlankFace (1): Elyse
In that case, a Masquarade vote makes more sense. Masq had two votes. Blank had one. Both were low content slots. Yet Masq is never mentioned.Hoopla wrote: I am mostly waiting for the non-contributors to contribute and over-contributors to stop.
lets switch up the vedith/blankface wagons:
UNVOTE: VOTE: blankface
Then:MOD wrote: VOTE COUNT 1.09
Vedith (2): BBmolla, cmitc1
Masquerade (2): ChaosOmega, Egg
BlankFace (2): Elyse, Hoopla
Robbnva (2): Masquerade, House
House (2): Grendel, Robbnva
I get that she specifically removed Rob and House. Molla had no votes so whatever. But why Vedith and Blank with no mention, yet again, of Masq who had the same two votes and Vedith and Blank?Hoopla wrote:House, Rob, Molla aren't being lynched today. There simply isn't enough support. If there had been, we definitely would have seen it after these last few days.
Vedith and Blankface are good choices that most people seem open to.-
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Hoopla could be bussingIn post 914, Killthestory wrote:Haven't even looked at a single Masq post, but this wagon looks incredibly scum driven.-
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Still waiting for this to be answered:In post 945, Egg wrote:Grendel, how surprised would you be to see cmit flip town?-
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Why wouldn't there?In post 1016, BBmolla wrote:why would there be a fucking 1-shot vig in this game-
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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Nah, I'm wondering how 3 flips, 2 of which are VTs, tell Molla that Masq's claimed role can't exist.Hoopla wrote:Why would you doubt molla's confidence about the lack of vig, when your stance on Masq is this:
I'm definitely skeptical, but you make sense when you say that I can be proven wrong with a two kill night or a dead scum. I'm open to lynching cmit instead. May even do it in this post. Lemme finish reading first.Hoopla wrote:When you say that^ the view you're implicitly espousing is you don't believe the vig claim
I've played way too much mafia to still think I'm always right, especially when my reads in my last two completed games were shit (I was right on exactly one scum between the two games. They were larges). I'm more than willing to give a confirmable claim a chance. You yourself voted Masq and switched after the claim, so I think you understand the mentality.Hoopla wrote:This sort of fencesitty wishy-washy under the radar posting is exactly what I was talking about with regards to Egg
Why is tomorrow better than today?Masq wrote:I really really don't want to say whether I shot N1 or didn't. If I am still alive tomorrow, I'll explain why. I have good reason and you can either trust me or go ahead and lynch me.-
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Egg Jack of All Trades
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So Masq's action failed and Cmit's action failed. Hmm... Possible, but not likely but both roles are confirmable. Ugh.
Cmit, you probably need to tell us who you're targeting because if you die, we lose that info. Problem is, if you say you're targeting scum, you get blocked but meh, better than you dying if your claim is true.
I want to hear some thoughts because I'm at a loss for a compromise now. Hell, I don't mind being the lynch myself. I wouldn't mind having one less game to play. I want Grendel's input on Cmit's claim though.-
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Maybe Masq and Cmit should both target each other?
Let me work this out.
If Masq is scum, Cmit either dies, near-confirming Masq as scum or is blocked.
If Cmit is scum, Masq either kills him or is blocked.
Honestly, that probably becomes a stalemate until we get the scum RB if there is one.
But if Cmit is scum who is lying about being blocked and Masq's kill failed for another reason, Masq killing Cmit is still possible.
Is it worth trying?-
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