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Mulch Gotta Go Fast
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Mulch Gotta Go Fast
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Mulch Gotta Go Fast
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Llama is fine except for this one post which dropped them in my reads like a tier alone: 714In post 817, WhyMafia wrote:Can someone tell me why Llama and Awesome are scum? I TR'ed both of em ;-;-
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Give me your reasons.In post 821, LlamaFluff wrote:
lol no... like massively no.In post 812, Mulch wrote:First things first: I joined this game partly because Io was obvious town, and I expect to be treated as such.
Not with those flips. Vedith was an excellent borderline policy lynch I would do again in an instant but with the scum flip it makes things interesting since those were the top wagons.
Need to reread a bit. Probably in AUN/Io but want to make sure.-
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In post 166, Carcalilly wrote:
TownIn post 164, Io wrote:UNVOTE:
Well thank you for calling me logical, but I don't really know if I would fall myself concise, I will make large posts if I need to get a point across.In post 144, alban wrote:I remember playing with Io. She will give long winding explanations about game mechanics and why and who is scum. I believe (but not sure) that she is logical, terse and concise when town.
Also I think the game mechanic talk was unique to that game if I recall because people weren't quite understanding them.
Frankly, I'm not really sure what the point in going over how people typically play helps. Like for example, I try to keep consistent play across whatever alignment I am and I'm pretty sure most people do that as to avoid scum slipping every time they are scum due to their meta.
Plus, the rules forbid Trust Tells and going over people's meta as town vs scum seems to be encroaching on breaking that rule.
Reguardless I've only played a full game with Alban, and maybe LUV and I am Innocent but I don't remember those games. Alban I remember does this kind of thing in all games if not most that I've played with him where he wants to talk about people's behavior.
This should confirm me as town btw. THis is pocketing 101.-
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It's one of the most classic scum partners in a 1v1 posts. It's not neccecarily scummy in the traditional sense but by experience it's super hard for a scum partner to take a side when it's TvS wagons, and even for scum to take a side, so asking each to provide a bulletproof list is like super LAMIST in the sense: look at me, I'm so town, I'm gonna take all the arguements and weigh them against each other, AND it allows the scum to make a decision later so they don't need to commit, which is extra bad now that carc flipped scum.In post 827, WhyMafia wrote:
What's wrong with that post though?In post 819, Mulch wrote:
Llama is fine except for this one post which dropped them in my reads like a tier alone: 714In post 817, WhyMafia wrote:Can someone tell me why Llama and Awesome are scum? I TR'ed both of em ;-;
Do you feel me?-
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Why do you think WhyMafia?In post 828, WhyMafia wrote:
That's just WIFOM. Why are you so interested in proving yourself town? I believed that slot to be town .. but now I have my reservationsIn post 826, Mulch wrote:In post 166, Carcalilly wrote:
TownIn post 164, Io wrote:UNVOTE:
Well thank you for calling me logical, but I don't really know if I would fall myself concise, I will make large posts if I need to get a point across.In post 144, alban wrote:I remember playing with Io. She will give long winding explanations about game mechanics and why and who is scum. I believe (but not sure) that she is logical, terse and concise when town.
Also I think the game mechanic talk was unique to that game if I recall because people weren't quite understanding them.
Frankly, I'm not really sure what the point in going over how people typically play helps. Like for example, I try to keep consistent play across whatever alignment I am and I'm pretty sure most people do that as to avoid scum slipping every time they are scum due to their meta.
Plus, the rules forbid Trust Tells and going over people's meta as town vs scum seems to be encroaching on breaking that rule.
Reguardless I've only played a full game with Alban, and maybe LUV and I am Innocent but I don't remember those games. Alban I remember does this kind of thing in all games if not most that I've played with him where he wants to talk about people's behavior.
This should confirm me as town btw. THis is pocketing 101.-
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Agreed.In post 829, WhyMafia wrote:I'm still convinced Alban is scum-
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Per awesome: what do you think about the heding at the scummyness at EoD?In post 830, WhyMafia wrote:And not at all on Awesome. Can see Scorpius though-
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I can see this coming from villa because usually villa first reaction to me declaring myself conftown is to push back even though it's NAI/towny for me.In post 821, LlamaFluff wrote:
lol no... like massively no.In post 812, Mulch wrote:First things first: I joined this game partly because Io was obvious town, and I expect to be treated as such.
Not with those flips. Vedith was an excellent borderline policy lynch I would do again in an instant but with the scum flip it makes things interesting since those were the top wagons.
Need to reread a bit. Probably in AUN/Io but want to make sure.
The part about the policy lynch is a little scummy imo because it's already looking like you are subtly trying to give an excuse for your behavior on Vedith. nobody really brought it up, or gave you heat, so why are you already trying to rationalize it?-
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This post in particular from Scorpious to rationalize the vote on vedith is really badIn post 587, Scorpious wrote:In post 559, Vedith wrote:How about Scorpios.
We can do a day where I pick the lynch, then you get to pick the lynch the next day?
You fake claim and have the gall to start lining up lynches?
VOTE: Vedith-
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In post 840, awesomeusername wrote:I feel like the Carca flip more or less clears Llama, which is good because I didn't townread him before. Also notable: Llama's logic about Scorpious in 612 holds, so I'm inclined to think he's town as well. This leaves me leaning town on everyone. :/ My weakest tier of town reads has Scorpious, alban, and Why Mafia, so I guess I'll start here.
@WM: I would also like to know why you town-read me, especially after these flips.
@Mulch: What do you think of Scorpious's reaction to Vedith's claim?
I agree that we should be looking at the wagons yesterday. IMO the worst ones on Vedith were WhyMafia's and Scorpious's, just in terms of lame reasoning/sheeping, and none of the votes on Carca ping me except for maybe Why Mafia again. But that doesn't particularly feel like a bus, although I guess I could see it. The RVS vote on Vedith from alban is just... I don't even know what to make of that. He was pretty upset after Vedith got lynched, which felt genuine to me. Io's was a strange interaction too, but I thought the rage quit was kinda town. I might be confbiasing there, though.Llama I felt was the driving force behind the Vedith lynch, although I also feel that he helped catch Carca? Like at one point I was scum reading Llama for attacking Carca badly, which doesn't make any sense if they're both scum.
First, I would like to ask why you are clearing llama? I don't get it there. I thought his heding was atrocious, both in that post and especially in 714, and really typical of scum in TvS wagons. I sort of liked his tone and his thought process otherwise in the game though, but why are you clearing llama for the scummiest thing imo they have done in the game?
Can you point me to the reaction from Scorpious- I just know that his vote was horrible, I don't remember the reaction.
I am townreading the bolded part. I think that it would take guts and is unlikely for carca!scumbuddy to say nonchalantly that they were scumreading Llama for attacking Carca.
One thing I would be wary of is townreading Llama for "catching" carca when they didn't push him in the first place. Again, it's near level one scum to scumread your partner and the other person but push the other and just let your partner be.-
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In post 214, alban wrote:Something about my behaviour as scum and town.
People who have played with me know this: I am a very proactive town, and a very laidback scum. Partial reason for this is coz I guess I am a transparent person irl, and my laidback game as a scum is to overcompensate the guilt and fear of getting caught. I try extra hard to not get in arguments, make excessive statements, or even try to take the game fwd.
As opposed to what Io and what a lot of other players say regarding maintaining a more even game, I have not done that coz I don't have and care for that sort of long-term vision for the game. I have more immediate concerns in a game as a town. And they are usually apparent in the way I wanna take charge and take the game fwd. I definitely don't have logical skills that help me see through, hence I rely a lot on my instinct, and they are usually not wrong. But then once the instinct tells something, I try to dissect that instinct and see if that stands the test of logic. And if it does, I go ahead with my suspicion in the form of a vote. There are certain games of me as a town which are exception to that. Where I begin as what I described, but then somewhere in the middle either I lose my interest, or I lose my centre and get confused. But the only way it works for me is if I proceed with my own reads and ways of playing the game rather than emulating someone else or going with the majority.
This post from Alban is pretty towny, but I'm struggling to find other towny things in his entire ISO. I see reads list and mechanics talk but not a lot of solving, and some of the conclusions he maks read fake.-
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This stuff in particular is really bad. "His tone appeared most natural" is something that is valid but also something that is REALLY easy for scum to fake. Same with reads overlapping, it's a crappy, scummy reason to townread someone, same as all the other points.In post 801, alban wrote:
There was a substantial overlap between his reads and mine.In post 796, awesomeusername wrote:@alban: Why are you sure he's town? And what are your thoughts on Carca?
His tone appeared the most natural.
His claim was obviously a joke.
Plus, a scum would confuse people, not clear them up, even as a joke. Even if they give tr on a few people, clearing 3 people at once, especially in the early D1 stage is less likely to be scum.
But no, I can't be sure. For the town's sake, let's hope I am wrong.-
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To your first point- I noticed that they made the big case, which obviously looks good in retrospect, but I think it means little to none because they didn't back it up with a vote on them at the end. In fact, it makes it look almost in a negative light that they felt so strongly but were still willing to policy lynch Vedith over a theoretical strong scumread.
Let me pull up the hedging.-
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I've read day 1, (skimmed at least), I've done some Isos. I don't actually like VCA (or maybe I'm just bad at using it lol) because I think because of a lack of a standard conclusions on what is scummy or not it's easily manipulatiable by scum.In post 849, alban wrote:Mulch, have you read D1? Or your reads are based off VCA?-
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Alban- explain to me why your ISO has a lack of scumhunting in it.
I'd also like you to explain more your almost ragequit. It's typically perceived as a town move but I've been seeing scum do it lately as well. What was going through your mind when you decided to leave and come back? Why were you prompted to make so much of a drastic decision?-
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This is bothering me, like a lot. This is a flat out strawman, 100%. No dispute. This is not my question at all.In post 855, LlamaFluff wrote:
I have zero problem saying Vedith was in part a policy lynch. If a player is publicly going to be a nuisance and toe the line of being useless in a game I will always be on board to lynch them unless they are blindly obvious town. Worst case you lose a liability, best case scum dies. Statement is essentially a "see this is why we don't troll, lets play the game" comment.The part about the policy lynch is a little scummy imo because it's already looking like you are subtly trying to give an excuse for your behavior on Vedith. nobody really brought it up, or gave you heat, so why are you already trying to rationalize it?
I-
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I do think your point about IO saying Carca and VEdith are scumscum or towntown is a pretty good point and could come from a town mentality. I can't really defend against it except to say that it's so obviously scummy that there is little chance Io would say that as actual scum partners. I mean, it's like such a blatant pre flip analysis, which is something scummy in itself, and the ramifiactions get even more scummier from Io's theoreotical PoV if Carca were ever to flip. It's like something that's scummy in theory but in practice is TWTBAW-
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The reason I say this is because in my experience it's actaulyl been a super towny thing and a powerful thing for people to use. Scum have a lot more trouble doing self meta.In post 856, Mulch wrote:First: A serious question. Do you scumread self meta, or are you just saying that as a buzzword?-
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@Alban- I'm going to say right now I don't really think that "I sleepwalk through day 1" will cut is in terms of you having little motiviation to sort, because it sort of appears like you are TRYING to sort day 1 but just more floating while also trying to give the appearance that you aren't. Do you understand what I'm saying?
I understand your answer to the question regarding the ragequit, but I want to know why you were SO posesses to do it based on that. Do you usually get this angry in games?-
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And on a similar point @llama- basically, you've reiterated that you had scumreads on Vedith/policy on Vedith and Carca too, etc, but my point is mostly that you made this big stuff on Carca and then your vote basically wasn't there when it mattered and instead you opted for your policy, and that in my experience it's very often for scum to try and hedge and try to seem like they are weighing all options then choose to vote the person not their partners in the end. There's very little you can say to try to change my mind about this, although I would like to continue to hear your thoughts. (And the strawman dosen't help)-
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I guess I can see that your policy lynch would take preference over a scumread on Carca, etc. But I just think it's a major red flag. Again, there is not much you can say here to try and convince me of your actions, except maybe go into a little more into your mindset? It's happened in the past and nothing can really defend against it. I get what you are saying and I can understand how it could be natural thoughts to think of two scumreads and try and pit them against each other, point out each, then make the bad vote when it matterd, but it's still there.In post 863, LlamaFluff wrote:
I am very pro-policy lynch. That is not at all a secret. The site needs to me more willing to policy lynch players who act like Vedith did this game.In post 862, Mulch wrote:And on a similar point @llama- basically, you've reiterated that you had scumreads on Vedith/policy on Vedith and Carca too, etc, but my point is mostly that you made this big stuff on Carca and then your vote basically wasn't there when it mattered and instead you opted for your policy, and that in my experience it's very often for scum to try and hedge and try to seem like they are weighing all options then choose to vote the person not their partners in the end. There's very little you can say to try to change my mind about this, although I would like to continue to hear your thoughts. (And the strawman dosen't help)
Not even sure what you want me to say. I made my case on Vedith as what little content he had was scummy. I defended attacks on my reads that Carcalilly was scum independently of Vedith and worked even better as a artner. I got my top scum read lynched when he outwardly refused to start giving reads or doing anything else productive.
Unprompted and used defensively, self-meta is a scum tell. Its funny especially in this game since we already saw scum using it as a defense. If its theory discussion its null.Mulch wrote:First: A serious question. Do you scumread self meta, or are you just saying that as a buzzword?
In terms of the self meta, I just disagree. Flat out. I barely see scum doing it (yeah, Carca was an exception here).-
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Alban I hear you loud and clear about your playstyle. Trust me, I've been there (i barely try day 1 either at least half the games). But my problem isn't really the fact you aren't trying but more the fact you seemed to try to appear like you were solving, but in fact you really weren't. Do you get what I'm saying?-
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Speaking of that, Vedith read Io as one of his top 4 townreadsIn post 865, MarioManiac4 wrote:hello i'm probably going to look at vedith's reads now on people that arent tchill and carca and check if they are good
also tchill's i guess-
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That's actually a really good point and something I didn't even consider when I was scumreading Alban before.In post 866, WhyMafia wrote:@Alban that's why there's something called UNVOTE
If you were so angry that Vedith was obvious town you should've unvoted and pushed for someone else's lynch. I don't buy you, not one bit. Sure, you were formulating cases against everyone, but you just needed one person that you believed to be scum. The fact that the voting was progressing that quickly should've alarmed you. And you hardly did anything early game to be warranted any form of town cred. And before I get called out for giving shade, I already explained his early game posts. His current posts are doing nothing to convince me otherwise. In hindsight, yes lynching him was a mistake. I'll admit that.-
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I would go through all the Vedith votes and see which ones are the shittiestIn post 873, MarioManiac4 wrote:wasnt scorpious online like 5 minutes ago i am 99% sure he was
also i'm still thinking of what productive things to do because i am fairly lost right now everything i knew of this game was proven to be a lie n1-
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It's not fake, cause it's realIn post 886, Scorpious wrote:In post 851, Mulch wrote:I'd also loosely followed the game before I replaced IO- again, one of the reasons I came in was beacuse I knew IO was obvious town and I wasn't in the mood for a scum game atm lol
This looks so fake..-
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This is horrible self conciousness right now. Scummy.In post 889, WhyMafia wrote:I'm sorry if I'm coming off as annoying .. I'm just really jittery right now XD-
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In post 888, WhyMafia wrote:
It does ..In post 886, Scorpious wrote:In post 851, Mulch wrote:I'd also loosely followed the game before I replaced IO- again, one of the reasons I came in was beacuse I knew IO was obvious town and I wasn't in the mood for a scum game atm lol
This looks so fake..but by PoE I town read Mulch
Keep trying, and make a better case!
explain-
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In post 900, Mulch wrote:So far two people have called me out for IO being obvious town and that's why I replaced in. Behold:
Spoiler:Spoiler: some added thoughts-
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In post 865, MarioManiac4 wrote:hello i'm probably going to look at vedith's reads now on people that arent tchill and carca and check if they are good
also tchill's i guessIn post 873, MarioManiac4 wrote:wasnt scorpious online like 5 minutes ago i am 99% sure he was
also i'm still thinking of what productive things to do because i am fairly lost right noweverything i knew of this game was proven to be a lie n1
one of the reasons I'm townreading Mario right now is because of absolutely fantastic tone. I think it's relatively towny to come in here and just say that fuck it I'm lost because it shows honesty when the scum would want to act gamesolvy. On the other hand, the fact that he has to justify it is really scummy. The bolded part is a subtle way of saying "yeah, I'm moping because I was bad day 1"= I pushed a mislynch day 1, and I was wrong day 1. It's like he is trying to highlight the persona of Mario that is devastated because he wasIn post 877, MarioManiac4 wrote:I'll do that!sowrong day 1, except instead of doing it naturally he has to manually say, wow, it's having such a big effect on me that I'm going to just be moping.-
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Say IO had not existed. Would you be townreading my slot right now? Do you agree with what I am saying? Do you think it's coming naturally intead of me fabricating? And also: you know my meta, why do you think that thing about seeing IO and not wanting a scum game is fake? Don't you think that would be a Mulch thing to do?In post 904, WhyMafia wrote:
Your slot is nowhere close to as scummy as other slots have been. Therefore I PoE town read lots of this games playersIn post 899, Mulch wrote:In post 888, WhyMafia wrote:
It does ..In post 886, Scorpious wrote:In post 851, Mulch wrote:I'd also loosely followed the game before I replaced IO- again, one of the reasons I came in was beacuse I knew IO was obvious town and I wasn't in the mood for a scum game atm lol
This looks so fake..but by PoE I town read Mulch
Keep trying, and make a better case!
explain
Barrage of questions, but, well, you wanted to get into the game more (towny btw) so here you are lol-
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We need a little spark in this game. Tchill bailed us the fuck out but this game is stagnant and nobody is trying.
One note that I mentioned ealier but I think that there is a possibiliy of 3 scum just because Carca was a mafia goon. I'm not an expert balancer at all lmao but I feel like 9 town and 2 scum is really townsided, and we already have a decently powerful power role in the vig, and carca was only a mafia goon. Unless the last scum is something like a mafia dayvig or something insanely powerful I think that it might be 8 town 3 scum and we have decent firepower.-
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If it helps, I do that basically every single game as every allignment. When I'm scum it's a neat trick because usually town do it because I gain towncred, but this time if you actually look at IO and their analysitical in their posts it's actually clear they are obvious town lol.In post 914, WhyMafia wrote:Basically any post saying that your slot is obv town. I guess it's also instinct after seeing you complain how you're obvious town when you were scum in the large normal
Also, I'm a pretty good scum player, and I'm not that much of an idiot to try and do the same trick twice on you WhyMaf lol-
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VOTE: Alban
Fine vote for now. I've been trying as of late to not vote as much in games, mostly because it's actually developed as a scumtell that I don't change votes when I am scum and I want to eliminate that weakness in my game, and also because it makes townies for some reason scumread me for switching votes? even though it should be the opposites lmao and not just for me either-
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To be honest you pretty much nailed me as scum the entire game, so you have nothing to be ashamed of. You also nailed me in the newbie game when I was being consensus locked town too.In post 917, WhyMafia wrote:I know, but that game mentally scarred me hrkejcjejxbc-
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Mulch Gotta Go Fast
- Gotta Go Fast
- Gotta Go Fast
- Posts: 16940
- Joined: April 23, 2017
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Mulch Gotta Go Fast
- Gotta Go Fast
- Gotta Go Fast
- Posts: 16940
- Joined: April 23, 2017
There's no point to it lol I was just ranting. It dosen't even apply to this game.In post 920, WhyMafia wrote:
What's the point of this? Like stuff like this just pings me ..In post 918, Mulch wrote:I've been trying as of late to not vote as much in games, mostly because it's actually developed as a scumtell that I don't change votes when I am scum and I want to eliminate that weakness in my game, and also because it makes townies for some reason scumread me for switching votes? even though it should be the opposites lmao and not just for me either
plz mulch don't do another betrayal-
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Mulch Gotta Go Fast
- Gotta Go Fast
- Gotta Go Fast
- Posts: 16940
- Joined: April 23, 2017
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Mulch Gotta Go Fast
- Gotta Go Fast
- Gotta Go Fast
- Posts: 16940
- Joined: April 23, 2017
Disagree. The only reason why I brought it up in the first place was because tmrw, if we lynch wrong and assuming nightkill goes through, there will be 6 players alive, which could be MYLO if there are 2 scum leftIn post 924, WhyMafia wrote:
If this game doesn't get traction within 2 IRL days, I propose we do it this day phaseIn post 921, Mulch wrote:I think we should massclaim tmrw assuming the game is still going on. Thoughts?-
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Mulch Gotta Go Fast
- Gotta Go Fast
- Gotta Go Fast
- Posts: 16940
- Joined: April 23, 2017