Mini 2039: uPicketyPicketyPick Mafia Endgame

[RadiantCowbells]

do you not think I care more about solidifying my reputation as the best townie we had than getting some sort of policy lynch on varsoon

[RadiantCowbells]

i will vote off of varsoon if you agree that as a town we ignore anything he has to say until d3 and if (when) he's not conftown by then we instalynch him

Don't let RC talk you out of lynching them.
They'll say and do anything to wiggle out of being held responsible for wanting to lynch the IC.

lolololol

[RadiantCowbells]

he claims that he has 6 abilities one of which is an ic

so the real answer is "by day 7" at which point the game is already long over.

[RadiantCowbells]

and the role is total bullshit in and of itself, there is never going to be an IC roulette role because it defeats the purpose of the IC role.

[RadiantCowbells]

BY LYLO

[RadiantCowbells]

varsoon in lylo: sorry guys i guess i hit all the wrong buttons but if you lynch me town loses!!!

[RadiantCowbells]

i mean
there's other powers to hit
there's also, like, the option of making it like any other ic where you can ic at any point of your choosing

but DEFINITELY the correct play is to make this uberstrong role that has an IC as well as 5 other roles as only one of your 3 roles because we need to concentrate all the town power in varsoon's hands

[RadiantCowbells]

I was about to call that role bs but I can't die so I guess it's not out of the realm of possibility

the role is bs lynch it

[RadiantCowbells]

at worst we're saying that varsoon is the lynch d3 no matter what if he's not conftown. noting that varsoon didn't jump on the opportunity to live to D3, which if he's town and has a "pretty good idea" that one of two roles is gonna conftown him AND gives him essentially immunity from me because if I bring it up and then change my mind it looks really bad, he pushed the agreement even further to lylo because he knows he won't be confirmed on D3 and at least at lylo it's easier to defend himself by saying it's autolose if he gets lynched

RC also keeps acting like all my other abilities that I can roll aren't negative utility because he feels threatened by my role.

This is the same as someone saying that another guy feels threatened because their pants determination is 27 inches long. i'm not threatened, just amused by the claim.

[RadiantCowbells]

mlem

[RadiantCowbells]

mlem

RC, why don't you unvote? What's the harm with waiting one night for Varsoon when there is someone - MariaR - who is not only "100%" scum to you but also a player that is good in not getting lynched?

because one night turns into a lot of nights. i've seen it before and i know for a fact the role doesn't exist and he's scum.

[RadiantCowbells]

i'm just waiting for the minigame to end at this point so mutant and others will vote.

[RadiantCowbells]

if we got a massive contingent of the game to agree "okay we will powerlynch varsoon on day 3 if he is not confirmed town at that point" i would consider voting elsewhere. no other reason to vote elsewhere.
but the fact that Varsoon isn't even trying to get that for himself makes it even more certain that he's scum than it already was. he's just trying to take me down with him.

[RadiantCowbells]

again: varsoon knows that he's never going to be conftown so the best he can attain is dragging me down with him. if he was going to become conftown at some date or if he expected to be nightkilled either of those guarantee my death.

[RadiantCowbells]

???

it exactly applies to him

it doesn't apply to me whatsoever.

[RadiantCowbells]

or at least, it applied to him before he realized that no one was going to actually let him live to endgame under the pretense that he would eventually be confirmed town
now the best thing his slot is dead in the water and all he can do is all in on taking me down to avoid spewing his partners and bring down town's strongest member

[RadiantCowbells]

knowing that I'm gonna be instalynched if he gets nightkilled or confirmed the best possible outcome for him is town!him getting two nights to confirm himself with his 'pretty good odds'. why isn't that what he wants? because he can't confirm himself. so let's kill him and stop wasting time treating an obvscum slot like it could conceivably be town.

[RadiantCowbells]

I haven't actually submitted my answers yet

i should do that so we can end the day

[RadiantCowbells]

but you're not tho. You WERE. now you're trying to lynch me. you're not trying to encourage people to go with my "day 3" which if you were 'pretty sure' you knew how to be conftown you would do
you're just trying to do something useful for scum before you go down at this point.

[RadiantCowbells]

varsoon: rc is 100% scum!
also varsoon: I'm gonna randomly vote Nico and distract people from the RC wagon because I don't actually want the wagon to go through
RC: ok so varsoon never does that as town, lets lynch him
Varsoon: hey look how protown I am I'm focusing on someone else instead of lynching the strongest scum player in site history when I perceive them as obvscum!
everyone: wow that is really scummy of varsoon
Varsoon: OH OK SO I'LL GO VOTE RC AGAIN
RC: ok so varsoon never does that as town, lets lynch him
Varsoon: BUT IM PRETTY SURE I KNOW HOW TO BECOME IC BEFORE DAY 3
RC: ok lets lynch him and failing that lets agree to policy lynch him on D3 if he's not confirmed
Varsoon: NO DAY 3 ISNT LONG ENOUGH YOU HAVE TO WAIT TIL LYLO SO THAT ITS NOT AS EASY TO JUST LYNCH ME ON PRINCIPLE
RC: no you can die

like we're just wasting our time at this point, he's repeatedly made the scum play every time he's had the opportunity to make a scum play

[RadiantCowbells]

yes there is a third player in the NSG hood

[RadiantCowbells]

either way we'll see what happens when she starts posting.

[RadiantCowbells]

also what I said as not!me doesn't count as what's said by me.

but fine.

i still have the best reads in this town either way and at this point its like lock

[RadiantCowbells]

what do you think about both you and Radiant leaving each other throat until day 2 or day 3?

stop encouraging this. so many fucking people have acknowledged that the claim is bullshit and he's not playing like a person with that claim would make.

BUT YOU CONTINUE TO TRY TO FIND EXCUSES TO NOT FUCKING LYNCH IT

[RadiantCowbells]

idc you're dead before endgame either way elbirn and I doubt you can actually get my lynch through. i don't think town is actually so fucking bad that it's possible to lynch me this game.

[RadiantCowbells]

like damn everyone keeps coming in, acknowledging that varsoon is obvious scum in some aspect of his game this game, and then trying to make excuses to vote somewhere fucking else.

HOW ABOUT LYNCHING THE OBVIOUS FUCKING SCUM INSTEAD OF STALLING AND WATING OUR TIME

[RadiantCowbells]

i don't care. i don't care if people resisting a lynch on someone is obvscum as you are not having fun. you are obviously, transparently, undeniably scum. anyone who doesn't see it doesn't deserve any consideration from me.

[RadiantCowbells]

"wow you sound like chesskid" someone might say. damn straight. no one faulted chesskid for his play in team mafia, I took all the shit for it. because chesskid won. so fuck it.
if history vindicates the winners I'm damn well going to win this game cuz fuck yall. i'm the best, get dunked.

[RadiantCowbells]

See I cant see a world where you hear "I promise to carry out the death of your sworn adversary and top 100% scumread" and your reaction is a bunch of bluster about how great you are and not agreement

But no I guess that's how you are and I'll just fuck off then

yup, that's how I am. or at least, that's how I was made to be.

[RadiantCowbells]

and frankly your promise is meaningless. varsoon will die tomorrow wherever your vote goes. i'm not going to dignify your worthless offer to vote and treat it like you aren't high being willing to vote me in the first place.

[RadiantCowbells]

(in a universe where I somehow manage to get lynched)

[RadiantCowbells]

like too little too late bud. you can't be voting me here and expect me to give a fuck about anything else you do in this mafia game except ensuring you die.

[RadiantCowbells]

there'll be time to be polite and play mafia in the sense everyone wants to play mafia when varsoon is dead. maybe. given the resistance to varsoon, not sure i trust anyone on town.

[RadiantCowbells]

yes, you were going to die tomorrow anyway in the universe that I get lynched so might as well consent to it in the hopes that it convinces someone that you're town.

[RadiantCowbells]

I used to but it turns out that my winrate is higher if I derptunnel any of my reads that are higher than 50%. my read on varsoon was 75% until he claimed then it became 100%.

[RadiantCowbells]

dunno why you think you're entitled to some respect for you as a mafia player when you don't earn it. i have nothing against you personally but in this mafia game you deserve nothing from me.

[RadiantCowbells]

you're not trading for me.

[RadiantCowbells]

you're just dying.

[RadiantCowbells]

i have plenty of respect for elbirn as a person. i am not obligated to have respect for him as a mafia player.

[RadiantCowbells]

don't apologize for wolfreading a wolf nibbui

I mean Varsoon, you could just ignore Radiant, wait until you're confirmed and when you get confirmed we would hipothetically lynch Radiant

precisely and I even set up that scenario for him because in the off chance that he was town at that point I could kill other scum and force scum to nightkill me and deal with the situation that way
but he didn't pursue that option because there's not actually a point in the game he gets confirmed so he has to lynch me by force, and that's easiest on D1.
it's also very helpful for scum him to be stuck in this 1v1 because his slot is dead in the water and he doesn't spew his partners if all he does is talk about me being scum.

Nibbui what do you want me to answer about hoods

[RadiantCowbells]

also: do you really think that a person who thinks they have a 'pretty good' chance of hitting IC by day 3 agrees to be lynched on D2? If it was probably between those 2 roles, it would be D3, right?
but if he's scum and his main goal is to just try to look town based on his willingness to die and there's no point he actually gets confirmed, bam makes a lot of sense.

[RadiantCowbells]

just another thing he has done that makes no sense as town and makes a ton of sense as scum. half of the people in this game have pointed out at least one glaring inconsistency, but most of those people haven't voted him.

[RadiantCowbells]

it's funny because NO ONE can actually articulate a reason to scumread me that makes any sense. Elbirn is policy voting me, Chibi IDEK what her beef is, NK15 scumread me for blatantly NAI playstyle reasons
All of those exist for Varsoon but ON TOP OF THAT we have none of his actions making sense based on his claims reads and role, we have him claiming a role that doesn't make sense, making the most scum motivated decisions he can possibly make at every single point that he's forced to make a decision and all of that just keeps piling up and piling up and still everyone's like EHH I DONT REALLY WANNA VOTE VARSOON.

Why?

[RadiantCowbells]

Do I piss you off that much that you would rather throw the game not voting for scum than give me what I want?

[RadiantCowbells]

Is that what this is about? You hate me so much that despite everyone taking turns pointing out that Varsoon's play doesn't make sense as town you're still not willing to vote him?

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm curious, I could really use an explanation here. Because that's what it seems like to me.

[RadiantCowbells]

What does Varsoon have to do short of literally hardclaiming scum in thread for people to be willing to vote him at this point?

[RadiantCowbells]

If he posted his role PM would you vote him? jw

[RadiantCowbells]

Remember when I as scum made that exact post to Chesskid and he refused every time? I sure do. Remember when I was villified for the game being toxic and Chesskid was lauded for winning a game he never would have won if I didn't decide to throw it for the sake of other players? I sure do. I expect you to be villified after this game Varsoon for it turning toxic, hope you enjoy it.

No, I can see him saying "lynch RC now and me if not confirmed on D2" as town for two reasons:

- He has become just a tunneled/focused on lynching Radiant as Radiant is with lynching him
- He is frustated so he is a bit desperate, biased and tunneling therefore wants to get RC lynched any possible way

In my opinion it can't be helped I'm going to find it scummy though, the overall explanation for his behavior if town would be frustation, and when you give in to frustation although sometimes (and in this case specifically) it would be understadable, it wouldn't be fair to blame town for reading such behavior negatively.

WHen you're an IC and can become literally confirmed town you treat things differently. This is one of those things.
You're basically assuming that Varsoon is making the most irrational decisions as town for him to be town while also having a role that doesn't make sense and play that doesn't make sense

just because there is a hypothetical explanation doesn't mean someone's town, I feel like you're looking for any reason, literally any reason to not scumread him

[RadiantCowbells]

idc if you post or not varsoon the single best thing that I can do for this town is finish this cleanly.

[RadiantCowbells]

Like if he hardclaimed scum there'd be a contingent of people saying maybe he actually just thinks he's a wolf but is town, and if he posted his role PM people would try to say he posted a role PM from a diff game

[RadiantCowbells]

town don't describe their top scumreads play as 'a bit weak'.

RC what do you think of this post?

I think that his phrasing is scummy and I think that it's NAI for NSG because if he was scum with NSG he certainly is capable of manufacturing a fake townspew on her.

[RadiantCowbells]

ok let's see

1) your role is bullshit and never exists

fact

2) you claimed an obscenely strong scumread and then never really tried to get me through and voted other people, even when others (nk15) were expressing support

fact

3) when i called you out for it, and hard, you reverted and voted me instead and committed to the 1v1 but not when you weren't actually forced into it

fact

4) said ridiculously BS claim has a lot of scum value in the sense that it claims IC (the only thing that keeps you alive through today) but doesn't require you to actually be conftown by endgame

fact

5) when I offered you the single best contingency plan for town!you, lynching you d3 ('pretty good' odds of being conftown by then in your words), you refused and tried to commit to bringing me down to extract some value from a dead slot

fact

6) it is never, ever, ever this hard for me to get a lynch on someone who is not scum

fact



anything else?

[RadiantCowbells]

aka, most of his modifiers are ones that only have equity for scum and he doesn't want to be making up claims and potentially CCing a bunch of people.

[RadiantCowbells]

i support that.

[RadiantCowbells]

and varsoon here's the thing about saying I'm the toxic one.

you know full well that you could never have won this 1v1 against me. there was never another outcome for you.

so you created this day phase for absolutely nothing.

[RadiantCowbells]

keep him on L-2 until the minigame goes out.

[RadiantCowbells]

don't look a gift horse in the mouth. i'm pretty sure he's town for

reasons

anyway.

[RadiantCowbells]

mutant/nibbui is 7 so we don't really need to appeal to anyone else anymore, just wait for the minigame I guess.

[RadiantCowbells]

i need serious decompression time from this game. i can't just play like this whenever i need to anymore, it takes a chunk out of me.

[RadiantCowbells]

i'll selfvote if he flips town. wouldn't want to put the game through another today tomorrow.

[RadiantCowbells]

and varsoon here's the thing about saying I'm the toxic one.

you know full well that you could never have won this 1v1 against me. there was never another outcome for you.

so you created this day phase for absolutely nothing.

Fuck you.

Hate me for it, but it's true.

[RadiantCowbells]

wouldn't have been liked this if you were more interested in lynching scum than protecting your friend, assuming you're town. but the assumption that you're town isn't one I can afford to make.

[RadiantCowbells]

Gamma when you show a record of consistently not lynching people who hard defend scum you encourage scum to hard defend each other and that hurts towns that you're in.
I don't think Elbirn would be like super mod confirmed scum or anything but his slot definitely needs to die.

[RadiantCowbells]

in case I need to add more wood to the bonfire, does varsoon's reaction here at all resemble someone who knows that I'm going to get instalynched as scum tomorrow for lynching IC? doesn't seem to to me.

[RadiantCowbells]

Elbirn's voting me if he's town because Varsoon is his friend and he doesn't like the idea of someone strongarming a lynch on said friend when he doesn't like it.
No one else is defending Varsoon, a shit ton of people have pointed out that individual things are scummy, but they generally just haven't voted him because..................?

[RadiantCowbells]

pretty sure it's literally just elbirn

maria voted me at one point but unvoted

[RadiantCowbells]

...so do you think I'm bussing or what? do you think I just flip town varsoon and waltz into tomorrow and lead another lynch?

[RadiantCowbells]

also 1) I never claimed infallibility and 2) like I said I'm straight up judging you by the quality of your votes. if the quality of your votes was too low for me to be willing to keep you alive, that's not my fault.

[RadiantCowbells]

ah, but he didn't say that he was going to be IC tomorrow. he said he was going to be IC by day 7. he refused a binary lynch if not conftown by day 3 and suggested that we keep him to lylo, at which point if town its gg if we lynch him.
feels like these things are really scummy and really out of line with the role he claimed, on top of the role he claimed being a load of crock, and I feel like you should recognize that if you were genuinely trying to sort him.

[RadiantCowbells]

i mean

that's nai

[RadiantCowbells]

From what I've read, what you're saying here is hyperbole. He claimed a load of abilities..But has confidence it's one of two roles. Unless my reading comprehension took a shit and died he did not suggest being kept till day 7, and everything in this post is conclusions you've deduced on a fault premise.

I'm also not dumb enough to keep a fakeclaim-IC in game and neither is the rest of town so really this should not be a worry of yours

Do you remember when I brought up the possibility of him shutting the fuck up until either he conftowns himself or Day 3 (the confidence it's two roles) and he was like NO I SHOULDNT BE LYNCHED UNTIL LYLO?

[RadiantCowbells]

And Day 7 is the point which every single ability is exhausted so he can keep making excuses until then without literally falsifying his role.

[RadiantCowbells]

His response to that was to me the point at which he became 100% scum. if his role was legit it served every purpose he needed from it. his flip would confscum me, his being conftowned lets him lynch me. but he didn't go for that, he all-inned on trying to lynch me D1. if it's gonna happen anyway when he's conftown why do it? answer: because he's never conftown and he's trying to extract value.

[RadiantCowbells]

[RadiantCowbells]

okay
and i said several times that if that was a universally agreed upon standard we could go fuck off and do something else not because I thought he was ever town but because it would save my energy
but varsoon did not pursue that option despite it being the best possible thing for town him so i'm ready to just kill him and killing him is really easy right now so.

[RadiantCowbells]

why do you feel guilty about scumreading varsoon when you clearly wouldn't feel guilty about scumreading me?

[RadiantCowbells]

ooh are you saying i'm lying about that?

[RadiantCowbells]

i will vote off of varsoon if you agree that as a town we ignore anything he has to say until d3 and if (when) he's not conftown by then we instalynch him

Don't let RC talk you out of lynching them.
They'll say and do anything to wiggle out of being held responsible for wanting to lynch the IC.

lolololol

said this several times.

you know, at the point when this was actually the discussion.

not 250 posts before when you hadn't even claimed

[RadiantCowbells]

'scrambling to survive'

[RadiantCowbells]

who here thinks "probably conftown before day 3" varsoon decides to self destruct and get lynched trying to kill me day 1 instead of agreeing to survive to day 3 and become mod confirmed town. Nobody? Thanks. And the difference between 'hey this guy is mod confirmed scum but I want to randomly vote this other person and I'm also not gonna encourage anyone to vote with me' and 'OK if you are "confirmable town" you can have the two days you said would prove it because fighting with you and fighting with others to lynch you is tiring' is massive, but carry on disingenuously conflating the two.

[RadiantCowbells]

because Varsoon doesn't believe in shit. He doesn't believe in his scumread on me enough to push it apparently, certainly, even though he seems to think I'm obvious scum and am good enough to autowin if not dealt with. but what he does believe in doing is... being reasonable and protown.

Yawn.
So when I try to do anything else I'm scum
When I try to get you lynched I'm scum
But when you drag the game into a 20 page 1v1 you're town
And when you try to do anything else you're town.

Got it.

well yes, because I have a town role PM and you don't. that's... kind of how mafia works. and wow I didn't know mafia was as simple as that, those sound like some very convenient sound bytes.

[RadiantCowbells]

or: you're scum and you know you're never going to be confirmed so you might as well make a go at taking me down with you instead of being lynched D3.

[RadiantCowbells]

i'll get right on that.

[RadiantCowbells]

You keep ignoring the fact that my whole point is that you've made this game unbearable and, as scum, every day you survive is poison to the game state.
You keep ignoring that you're my highest confidence scumread.

You keep ignoring the fact that my whole point is that you've made this game unbearable and, as scum, every day you survive is poison to the game state.You keep ignoring that you're my highest confidence scumread.

oh and this is scum talking about me 'ignoring' things as opposed to directly misrepresenting them.

[RadiantCowbells]

also unless you think Varsoon has a very tenuous grasp on reality his talking about me getting lynched today with crap like 'die' or 'eat the lynch' doesn't make sense.
you would expect him to be more focused on ensuring I eat the lynch tomorrow since there's already enough people who have said they'll vote him, but there's been next to no mention of lynching me after his flip

but if I'm not getting lynched after his flip and he only has until his flip today, he doesn't really have much to throw at me besides bravado.

[RadiantCowbells]

If it's been this hard to get him lynched playing like I have, can you imagine how much of a pointless slog trying to get him lynched being a Nice Guy (TM) would have been?

[RadiantCowbells]

I can't fathom why RC is so opposed to playing with some modicum of civility.
Seriously; you shouldn't want to lynch me here anyway, you should want to come to an accurate conclusion about my alignment.
Only scum cares about strongarming lynches.
Town cares about solving the game and coming to an unanimous decision on who scum is.

not something that someone says about someone that they have repeatedly declared is 100% scum. definitely something scum says when they want to make themselves look reasonable and pro-town.

[RadiantCowbells]

I'd like to convince everyone here that RC is scum, to see what I see, but if his play here alone doesn't do that for you, nothing I say will.
/shrugs.

what about your supposed town IC flip? You would think that you would be trying to leverage that into my lynch tomorrow. Dunno, seems like a pretty powerful token to have against me.

[RadiantCowbells]

Also in a broader sense: fuck town unanimous decisions. When town unanimously agrees on something it's DEFINITELY gonna flip town.

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean. Town don't talk about scum not reading their posts first off. Second off, yeah, that's what you said. But it really doesn't make sense, as I've pointed out, and it ends up being an extremely convenient position for scum to take.

[RadiantCowbells]

You keep accusing me of 'not making the effort to read you' and similar stuff that suggests that you think I'm town tunneling you while simultaneously asserting that I'm 100% scum.
Which is another good reason that you're scum, in case my list insofar hasn't done it for anyone.

[RadiantCowbells]

he's scum and he will die fairly soon and this won't have to be an issue anymore.

[RadiantCowbells]

i, too, was down with backing off from the game thread in team mafia. y'know, when I was the scum in this situation.

[RadiantCowbells]

varsoon is at L-2 and is only alive because the minigame is incomplete. I can give this hard effort and keep momentum for 1 day and lynch him or I can let him live a few days and have to play another several days, possibly even into another day phase, of this kind of back and forth. one of them is healthier for both myself and the other players.

[RadiantCowbells]

I should have been Firebringers guardian angel

[RadiantCowbells]

As long as you're bussing Varsoon

[RadiantCowbells]

Only if you make waffles tomorrow morning

[RadiantCowbells]

30 minutes and we can kill varsoon

[RadiantCowbells]

that is an unfortunate set of 15s and a fortunate set of 15s

if we hammer varsoon really quickly does it go to elbirn by default

[RadiantCowbells]

why would you not claim the only reason you're still alive as scum

hmmmmmmmm

[RadiantCowbells]

lol

u mad bro?

[RadiantCowbells]

thank you for your opinions

[RadiantCowbells]

???

you got me banned by antagonizing me

why shouldn't I do the same

oh wait you won't get banned no matter what you say

[RadiantCowbells]

I apologize for ruining the game for you: read lynching a shitty scum player.

[RadiantCowbells]

dunno if lynching you as scum ruins the game for you I can't imagine you have much fun in mafia when you roll scum.

[RadiantCowbells]

maybe if playing as scum isn't fun for you you shouldn't go so far as a last ditch IC claim to try to trade 1 for 1 with one townie and never make it even a single day later.

idk

like you didn't have to do that. you could have just gone down peacefully. but no you decided to throw everything into this game and you get everything in return.

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm not trying to bait you into incurring a ban. I'm trying to lynch you. If that baits you into incurring a ban, how are you different from me?

No. Not until you're dead, see?

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm not abusing you. I'm trying to lynch you.

[RadiantCowbells]

I don't care if I have personally offended you. I really don't care. You didn't care if you personally offended me. I have scum to lynch and I am going to lynch said scum.

[RadiantCowbells]

It's literally that simple. You can AtE, act like I'm being a horrible person, whatever you want to do. It's not going to change anything. If you want to speed this up, selfvote and stop trying to get something from it.

[RadiantCowbells]

I will not make personal attacks against you (read: I will continue not making personal attacks against you because this isn't personal. even saying you're bad scum isn't personal. it's just a fact. you aren't good scum)

[RadiantCowbells]

"sullied by my abuses"

I'm not taunting you. I'm simply trying to lynch you. Everything is directed towards that end.

I literally don't give a fuck about you Varsoon. I don't hate you, I don't like you, I don't feel anything. You are absolutely _nothing_ to me except a person that I want to lynch.

[RadiantCowbells]

Oh I'm sorry you won your last scumgame, therefore you are good scum. My bad for not realizing that, I'll stop posting now.

[RadiantCowbells]

/reevaluate

ok we should still lynch varsoon

[RadiantCowbells]

I gave town!you with whatever ridiculous role town!you claims to have an out for the sake of reducing the bloodshed. You chose to ignore it and try to lynch me. This discussion has been over from that moment.
I don't believe you would make that decision as town ever, you can cite your being an 'abnormal' player but that's simply not something that I would believe anyone would ever choose to do as town.

We're done, see? Your AtE doesn't mean anything because I would expect you to get pissed as fuck as scum. I'll take the lynch if I'm wrong here tomorrow.

There's really nothing else to say besides that everyone needs to hurry up and hammer you so I can interact with you less when you're being abusive towards me.
And make no mistake: throughout this game you have been the abusive one. I'm just playing my game.

[RadiantCowbells]

His slot has been antagonizing me since the beginning of the game and you've done nothing. You've chosen to step in now and act like it's a mutual thing because... why?

[RadiantCowbells]

You don't talk to me like you talk to your top scumread though. People don't convince their top scumread that they're town and tell them to look at X different section of the game though. So again, nah.

[RadiantCowbells]

Every single time you get salty about some sort of caught for the wrong reason thing I'm doing to you you spew knowledge that I'm town by trying to convince me to see things otherwise.
People don't tell their 'top scumread', when they've been crossvoting each other for days, to read other sections of the game or what not.

So again. Actions don't align with your claimed points of view. Actions don't align with your claimed role. Difficulty getting momentum against you doesn't mesh with you being town.

All you have is AtE based on emotions I'm not even sure you'd be feeling as town right now

[RadiantCowbells]

Why would this even bother you as town? The best scum player on the site has totally fucked their slot over to bring you down. They are gonna get lynched the next day. Congratulations!
Unless you think you are a literal god of townplay there is nothing you can do to up towns of winning more than trading 1 for 1 with me. You should be goddamn rejoicing based on your claimed POV.

[RadiantCowbells]

So yes. I think that you are scum. I think that you are getting so pissed off by me insulting your scum play because you're scum because I don't think it would bother you if you were town.
I think you feel helpless, I think that you feel like I'm policy voting you when I'm not, I think that you're telling yourself that I would do this regardless of your alignment because I'm a gigantic asshole who hates you
And I think that riles you up, I think that gets you to the point you're randomly calling me a shitty excuse for a human being. I don't see this level of frustration coming from town you.

Your problem is that you don't respect my play enough to think that I legitimately caught you for legitimate reasons.

[RadiantCowbells]

And that "I'll be lynched tomorrow if we lynch him today" coming from IC? Never. Coming from scum who desperately wants to get back at me for lynching them and take someone down for the team to prove that they're not a bad scum player Yeah, that's pretty much the perfect thing to say to look like you're just genuinely tunneling me, but coming from a slot who has me on a timer it makes no sense at all.

[RadiantCowbells]

At no point have I implied you don't genuinely believe the emotions you claim to feel. I simply don't believe that it's my problem and I don't think that it makes you town.

[RadiantCowbells]

I don't think this is what 1 and 2 look like.

[RadiantCowbells]

Alright, but can you understand why posts like

I don't see this level of frustration coming from town you.

Make me feel that way?

If you think that I'm scum, I can't see why they make you feel anything at all. If I'm scum, I'm saying it strategically, no?

[RadiantCowbells]

If you weren't intermittently flying in and calling me 100% confirmed scum and going on random rants against me I would infer from the rest of your ISO that you're townreading me.

[RadiantCowbells]

I don't see anything that I have said towards you this game as an egregious offense or an offense at all. I'm unhappy about one or two posts I made towards Elbirn and Maria.
You have been taking potshots at me since the very beginning of the game and taking the moral high ground about it so I don't particularly care about your feelings beyond analyzing them for what they say about your alignment.

And what you're doing now is essentially trying to convince me that your scumread on me is legit, which, well.

[RadiantCowbells]

I don't even doubt your feelings! I believe they're true! You're just scum. Even if you're somehow town I don't believe you're making up your feelings. I just don't believe they're town feelings.

There's a hard difference between taking a moral highground and apologizing and trying to move beyond what I have admitted are insulting and inflammatory posts.
Once again, I apologize for my behavior earlier this game. It was unwarranted, unprofessionally, and even if I was frustrated by anything you did, I should not have taken out my frustration on you.

I'm sorry.

"even if I was frustrated by anything you did"

that's not an apology and you went off at me long before I had even mentioned your name.

[RadiantCowbells]

I just want you dead. I don't want an apology, because I don't take scumposts personally. I don't want to talk to you about it, because every time we discuss you continue to exhibit the same scumtells and nothing changes.
You're not fooling me, or from your point of view, you're not convincing me to not lynch you as scum (and you wouldn't try if you were town, but), the bids are down so let's deal.

I know, I specifically mentioned you and my perceptions of you both seriously and in jest at the start of the game, but I had not considered that it would be taken personally. I was hoping to prod you to be more active in the game thread, as you had been largely absent, which was something that I had never seen you do in a game before. It was not my intention for those posts to be anything but a prod to get you engaged.

also varsoon

Any further conversation on that point can slide into PMs.
You taking this personally and making a scene is exactly the kind of shit I can't stand about you, for the record.

so, uh, given you have a track record of attacking me and having it taken personally and hating me for taking it personally the idea that you didn't expect me to take it personally is lol

[RadiantCowbells]

Varsoon it's okay you can just admit what you were doing. People aren't going to hate you because you're antagonizing me. The mods don't even care. You're literally going to face no repercussions.

[RadiantCowbells]

That's a strange statement

This kind of interaction with you I think is a waste of time, like I said before. I'm having it because you threw a tantrum.

Lynching scum is mandatory to win the game.

[RadiantCowbells]

It's really simple: if he was town raging he wouldn't be treating me like I'm town and trying to convince me to townread him.

[RadiantCowbells]

"hey I know that you're

scum

and as

scum

it is to your role PM to lie but please stop lying!!!"

[RadiantCowbells]

I know that the idea of someone playing like I am beating you is offensive to you but i'm not gonna change for you babe

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm not being incendiary and marginalizing. You just aren't used to being treated without respect, and I don't mean respect in the sense of basic common courtesy, I mean in the sense of being looked up to.

I don't look up to you.

[RadiantCowbells]

My role gives Firebringer a double vote if he's on the same target as me and says it tsunderey enough

Varsoon describes his role as delayed IC here

He actually claimed it as one of

six

roles is an IC

So he's really claiming that he's IC for day 7, after the game is over

He initially claimed he had pretty good idea that it'd be before day 3

But then when I said ok so we ignore you til day 3 and if you're not confirmed by then, he went absolutely all in on me.

Doesn't make sense with the role, conftown would be more interested in proving themselves than fighting me. But even in the face of being lynched he refuses because he's not confirmed. Also the odds that Varsoon whose only shot at surviving day 1 is to claim IC and that he ALSO suggested me and Fire were best friends? (Hint: conftown don't assume others are also conftown)

So yeah just Lynch him he's always scum

[RadiantCowbells]

Hey Varsoon

Would it be prudent to maybe back off RC until your IC triggers? Cuz I dont think you're going to win this 1v1 with a triple vote against you. What other scumreads do you have?

We gave him his shit, he's scum, were not sparing him today

If you're town you are playing incredibly pro scum

[RadiantCowbells]

You say that this isn't about him being your friend

But don't lie to yourself and say that after all of this, you wouldn't be defending him if you didn't like him more than me.

And liking him more than me is fine! Everyone chooses your friends

But in mafia you don't choose your teammates

[RadiantCowbells]

He's scumclaimed over and over but we're still trying to give him chances

[RadiantCowbells]

If we give him forever to keep posting and continue ignoring that his past actions make him obvscum hell eventually make a set of posts that looks town enough that people start doubting it. You add up the equity of his relentlessly making the most scum motivated play in every situation he's been in and he's just obvscum. We're long past the point where we just kill him

[RadiantCowbells]

Not lynching people that have proven themselves scum in the interest of some bullshit idea that it's protown to not Lynch scum is stupid

This is how games devolve into consecutively lynching the most awkward, most lurky, or least socially skilled player every day. Varsoon has done scummy shit stop giving him chances to talk his way into me having to post more

[RadiantCowbells]

Gamma stop even talking to him

He doesn't exist

[RadiantCowbells]

What else is he going to claim when not claiming IC means he just dies and claiming day 2 ic means he just dies on D2

[RadiantCowbells]

And no Elbirn, in your own phrasing you've been sing varsoons D the hardest all game.

[RadiantCowbells]

Don't claim IC? Die instantly.

Claim IC with some specific date? Die that day.

Bait town with the idea of being conftown over the next few days but not actually getting disproven until the game is over? Success

[RadiantCowbells]

Lelelelel

[RadiantCowbells]

"we've been over"

[RadiantCowbells]

Ok let's just Lynch nk15 at some point that is disgusting

[RadiantCowbells]

But you proved yourself scum when you didn't go for it so why would I bother giving you til day 3??

[RadiantCowbells]

Chibi played the minigame but hasn't posted for several days despite vote parking me. Wonder if that's a buddy

[RadiantCowbells]

NSG completely flaked when Varsoon got wagoned

Dunno how anyone thinks this is the gamestate in a town Varsoon world

[RadiantCowbells]

Do you think nk15 is scum with anyone besides Varsoon?

[RadiantCowbells]

Oh yeah I have to keep posting to make sure momentum against Varsoon stays huh

[RadiantCowbells]

hold off for a bit fire plspls

This is indicator that RC was ready to hard-push a lynch with only 1/3 support instead of 1/2 and claim it's a town thing to do.

The fact that the extra votes were played as some secret but it's clear from here that RC knew is indicator that he's scum.

It's an indicator that one of my hoodmates (your scumbuddy) asked me to hold up on lynching you till more content was made. But you already know that!

[RadiantCowbells]

I don't think it's all that beyond the scope of town to go
"Oh that guy claimed IC, I'll take it at face value and unvote for now."
That's the play I'd make if someone at L-1 on D1 claimed delayed IC.

It's literally something that sorts itself.
/shrug

See here's the thing it could

But you're trying to hide behind your "IC" status and leverage it not to keep yourself alive but to try to mislynch the strongest town player in the game. Cuz, y'know, if you'd shut the fuck up and die on day 3 when you're not confirmed or (hypothetically) lynch me when you're confirmed via role or nightkill, this wouldn't be necessary. But you're not playing to activate your "IC", you're playing to do as much damage and disruption to town as you possibly can before everyone lynches you for not being conftown

[RadiantCowbells]

My assumption, though, is that Firebringer really actually did not know and that RC has kept it a secret and was intending to use FB's vote to force a quick hammer that would then reflect poorly on FB.

Mmm.
And RC didn't tell you anything about the vote in your PT and didn't try to co-ordinate anything there regarding it?

ITT Varsoon claims that I deceived Firebringer about a role to get a quicklynch on an "IC" and that was supposed to reflect badly on Firebringer and not me. It's almost like he's literally just looking for any reason to call me scum whether or not it makes sense or not. What is Varsoons scum case on me again aside from the fact that I'm lynching a clearly fake "IC before day 7" claim

[RadiantCowbells]

No serious question Elbirn

You've recognized now that from an objective PoV what Varsoon is doing right now is somewhere between fucking stupid and gamethrowing if he's town right

Do you think that Varsoon is fucking stupid

Or do you think that he is scum?

[RadiantCowbells]

"hi my role is LITERALLY CONFIRMABLE, but instead of trying to avoid my mislynch and confirm my role I'm going to self destruct on someone who without the aid of additional scum votes I would literally never get close to lynching because... disruption and setting my partners up?

[RadiantCowbells]

Pls don’t accuse of gamthrowing

I mean he's not gamethorwing he is just scum

[RadiantCowbells]

You are trying to leverage your IC claim

You would have literally no credibility in this game minus the IC claim and you know that as well as I do so ???

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean I would go on the record and say that if Varsoon is town he's both incredibly terrible at mafia and gamethrowing here because those are the conditions required to be fulfilled for him to be town, but there's the a lot easier answer that choosing the scum motivated answer at every crossroad is something he did because, you know, his role pm said to

[RadiantCowbells]

But I mean even if we ESTABLISHED

that being Varsoon by definition meant both of those things

Doesn't explain him trying to convince his scumread that he's town
Doesn't explain his awful tone, doesn't explain his strange emotionality
Doesn't explain all the bizarre and scummy phrases that he's used

Cool, guess I'm incredible terrible at mafia and gamethrowing because I want to get my top scumread lynched

Like town would never ever say this here

Town would say that I'm just scum and ignore everything else I said, town doesn't justify themselves to someone who they have claimed is 100% confirmed scum

[RadiantCowbells]

Fire understand that me getting mad and powering through this now will save everyone a lot more pain in the long run

[RadiantCowbells]

I am literally the fucking god of pushing lynches

As scum I have lynched mod confirmed town under the rationale that the cop lied about their target

As town I have the same pushing powet. For good or ill when I scumread someone unless scum resists hard as fuck they die


In the last fucking year

I have not failed to Lynch any town that I have been misreading

In fact the only times I failed to get a Lynch through on a scumread

Thor in you got mail
Wisdom in DND upick
Nibbul in 1 vig mafia townies game

Want to know what every single one of them had in common?

They were scum and scum were hard pushing counterwagons

Let's look at the gamestate. What are the townie people doing?

Gamma: voting Varsoon
Fire: voting Varsoon
RC: ymmv but voting Varsoon
Nibbul: will vote Varsoon
Mutant: also agreed to vote Varsoon

Every single goddamn universal townread is in the Varsoon scum camp

[RadiantCowbells]

Now what else is going on?

NK15: shitvoting random people but refusing to vote Varsoon
Elbirn: idek what he's up to
NR: avoiding thread
NSG: avoiding thread, did the game though, no posts hood or game. Exactly hat she did last time she was scum with town me, hard lurk
ChibiBear: also avoiding thread, also did the minigame, vote parking me but not posting so they don't have to defend their actions

Wow! Seems pretty one sided here

[RadiantCowbells]

You've said far worse to me and what I've said doesn't even apply to you because it was conditional on your alignment.

[RadiantCowbells]

Never, as town or scum, would Varsoon be alive right now if even a single scum aligned player was willing to vote him. And that's a statement of fact.

[RadiantCowbells]

If Varsoon weren't scum scum would just lynch him to get this situation over with

They are digging in their heels because they want him to at least bring down a townie with him

[RadiantCowbells]

NSG posted in MD again. Not in game.

[RadiantCowbells]

In micro 816-I RC was scum and made it to the end-game through literally ghosting when pressure wasn't there, being VERY direct with engagement, verbose rather than ambling abrasive one-liners. Several of you were in that game. Do you see similarities between RC's play between these two games

Also I want to point out that by Varsoons own meta of me which NSG gave him I have 0 efforted as scum consistently this year. I don't enjoy playing scum at all right now and I just try to suffer through it. Varsoon said that I was scum for lurking but when I did the opposite of that meta I'm still scum because ???

[RadiantCowbells]

Like he transparently just says whatever he needs to in whatever given situation, so...

[RadiantCowbells]

This fight isn't at all fun for me anymore and hasn't been for game days

Can we please just kill scum fucking Varsoon and I'll get shot and we all move on with our damn lives

[RadiantCowbells]

"every horrible awful thing that I've done"

Read: I repeatedly made potshots against someone who I knew was pissed off by then and tried to claim the moral high ground

[RadiantCowbells]

And no: you didn't ask to live to D3

As long as you weren't at L2 you weren't trying to survive at all. You even offered to be lynched D2 when I flipped town which town in the position of being likely IC never would. Now that you're at L1 and you're clearly not surviving the day by self destructing on me, you're shifting gears to omg let me live for 2 days... but still let me push lynches on strong townies, right?

[RadiantCowbells]

Threadly reminder that the one time Varsoon tried to focus attention anywhere but at RC he ate a shitstorm for it

But why?
Answer: because he had already said I was like 100% scum
Town in the position of having an 100% scumread doesn't randomly try to bait one post out of NicoRobin

[RadiantCowbells]

Like real talk, I've had a VERY STRICT no blacklist policy in every game that I've moderated, but if RC flips town here, I'm never allowing him in another game of mine.

Why would I want to be in your games

[RadiantCowbells]

You attacked me in the post game of xyzzy's game
You attacked me AND shoshin in the queue for a game neither of us were in because someone had the

audacity

to say something positive about an objectively good player.
Your entered this game and made bait after bait trying to piss me off into throwing a fit (and given you specifically called me out for throwing fits whenever people bait me you can't pretend you didn't know.)

Then you come here and call me a shitty excuse for a human being and accuse me of doing terrible and awful things when my crime against humanity is trying to lynch you, then despite you clearly being in the wrong here hold out for mod action in the hope that their continued bias against me wins our over the fact that you have not gone 5 posts without trying to antagonize me?

Stop fucking pretending you're a good person Varsoon. You're a manipulative scumbag. I'm an asshole to win games when necessary but at least when those games finish I go back to being a decent human being. I pity you.

[RadiantCowbells]

Jjh would have force replaced you in your first 100 posts if you were town

[RadiantCowbells]

hey Varsoon is still attacking me then claiming the high ground. If you're going to act the time is long past

[RadiantCowbells]

there you go you finally got the rise out of me that you were looking for. Do you feel better, Varsoon? Does it make you feel like a real man when you piss people off to the point that they finally react?

[RadiantCowbells]

Why would Varsoon care? Varsoon has diplomatic immunity and the mods would jump at any opportunity to make my ban worse, Varsoon has nothing to lose and everything to gain by seeking to provoke me.

[RadiantCowbells]

I take back my gun shot earlier. I'd shoot you now.
But, nah, really, waiting for you to WOW US ALL with your PERFECT READS, you GOLDEN GOD OF MAFIA.
You're off to a GREAT START that I couldn't possibly levy any valid criticism against, and even if I tried, it'd just be me being a HATER.
Wouldn't be surprised if you picked yourself, you narcissist.

The RC I know would re-evaluate and come to a proper read on actual scum instead of insisting on a contentless death-tunnel on town.
Unless maybe
You're just bad at mafia
If you're just bad at mafia
And you'll admit it right here, right now
I'd accept that you might be town.

Is it a vendetta to proclaim that garbage stinks?

You know what is really surprising though?
RC is intimately familiar with how much I OMGUS under even slight pressure, how critical I can be of other people's scumreads of me, and of my own issues with temper.
RC, before the game begins, catches a ban that has to do with posting abusively towards me.
And, knowing that, RC still put me as their top scumread without a justification for why.
And that all happens BEFORE I even begin to make anything close to a 'personal attack'--unless you think that my sarcasm in the first wall was enough to merit this?
Really gets the noggin joggin.

Did anyone else even come close to 31 mins? That's a pretty insane time.

Not counting my commute and shit, it took me about 50 minutes from the moment I saw the PM.
I was trying to be cute and thorough about my answers.
Anyway, fuck RC.

VOTE: RC

Like I'm going to be real
RC really pisses me off
But I'm not going all in on this because there's other fish to fry.
RC probably sorts itself.
Never let that cheater anywhere near LYLO.

Like if a hundred girls break up with you and you keep going, "Oh jeeze girls nowadays! I'm so tired of them thinking the worst of me! It'll never get them anywhere!" and not realizing, like, maybe the fault is with yourself, you're not gonna do well with relationships moving forward.

Hey, Gamma, wanna policy lynch RC?
VOTE: RC

My thought is that they only wheel this out after their wounded pride in order to make some huge point about them being a great player.
I think it'd be cool if we lynched him anyway, on principle.
Also he's kinda scummy for largely dipping out of the game, I've got an OMGUS read there, and I don't think town gets a day-neighborizer on D1 in this setup.
But uh it's clearly 'cus of personality stuff.
Let's bag 'em?

Also, Nibbui, check the scumgame I linked of RC's. They're just as capable of being an arrogant, hubris-ridden egotist as scum as they are as town.
His go-to rhetoric is hyperbole. Don't confuse that for confidence.

You keep insisting that I'm making this personal, when literally I have not.

Anyway, we need to lynch RC here for a few reasons:
1. Their toxicity and approach will literally run this game into the ground. It's going to make it less fun to play and, regardless of RC's alignment, town loses.
2. RC has been aggressively pushing me and even willing to give credence to a Scum v Scum outlook on our 1v1--but I can confirm as town, so this just shows that RC is trying to make contingencies to get me lynched if they're the first to eat rope here.
3. RC's neighborhoods are highly scum-motivated and it's clear from voting record and activity that he's used them in a way that best fits his own agenda rather than figuring out the game. His flip confirms the nature of these hoods and gives town information in regards to them.
4. RC's been playing to their scum meta to a T and I've thoroughly scumcased them but they're outright dodging that.
5. RC won the minigame, which, if they are scum, is a huge issue for us.

There's probably more but yeah screw that guy.

I wanna see what the modifiers are btw

I also wanna see what my role gets because I can get 6 upgrades AND THEN ALSO my minigame and quest modifiers
It's a hell of a role
So I'm probably dead meat for claiming it
shrugs and hugs
The faster I don't have to play with RC anymore, the better, though.
I can't stand that dude's play.

You wanna know how to play with RC?
You work with him, not against him. That’s how I’ve learned to handle RC.

Nah, fuck that. I'm not going to be strongarmed into his shit.
I'm sick of that dude's attitude and approach to games.
Acts like he's some how shit when he's just an arrogant guy who's wrong more often than not.
He's loud and petulant and whines when he doesn't get his way.
He'll make any excuse for being wrong, too.
Watch, if ya'll lynch me before him, watch him try to squirm out of being wrong about me.
Dude's such a force of negativity and anti-town rhetoric on a fundamental level and he sees nothing wrong with his play.
That's what makes it hard to separate his town game from his scum game, because he's awful regardless.
That said, I am fairly certain this is his scum play in this game.

Apologies, I did get carried away,
though that's what RC wanted.
Hm.

RC,
I challenge you to something that I am fairly certain you can't do.
I bet that you can't shut the heck up and stop posting.
I'll stop posting, too, and we'll let everything said up until now speak for itself.
I ensure you do not win such a bet
You loud
Petulant
Child

Like I get that your goal is to flood the thread and piss me off into responding to you over and over
but damn dude
Shut
the fuck
up

that is an unfortunate set of 15s and a fortunate set of 15s

if we hammer varsoon really quickly does it go to elbirn by default

FUCK YOU
EAT SHIT\
I AM FUCKING LIVID YOU GARBAGE +EXCUSE FOR A FUCKING HUMAMN BEING

I know that I haven't been civil in the past in this game thread,
but I won't accept your abuse anymore.

what Varsoon is doing right now is somewhere between fucking stupid

Varsoon is fucking stupid

You've been asked, directly, by the moderator to stop.

Please stop.

I'm not going to post in this game thread any more until this is resolved.
Interacting with you further is detrimental to the game-state, both for the game itself and for town.

I also don't know what you're referring to about considering something before now--do you mean the possibility that RC, as town, is actually this toxic?
If so, I considered it, but I still think he's far more likely to be scum.
I've also largely banished the thought because the dude would've caught a permaban a long time ago if that were the case.

Like real talk, I've had a VERY STRICT no blacklist policy in every game that I've moderated, but if RC flips town here, I'm never allowing him in another game of mine.

[RadiantCowbells]

like fuck this dude I don't want to deal with his shit if we end up not lynching him D1 he's going to spend the entire game pushing on me and making the game unplayable for me anyway

this situations 100% needs resolution. and for all varsoon's attempts to claim the moral high ground he is absolutely the one who has been instigating it the entire game.

[RadiantCowbells]

Whatever

[RadiantCowbells]

I'll be back when varsoon and rc stop going back and forth

The ride never ends

Literally the game is held hostage until one of them is dead

If you have anything game related to say I promise I'll engage because I really would like to actually play mafia

i offered if varsoon fucks off to give him the chance to prove his role and stop doing what he's doing until then. he refused. i don't want this situation.

[RadiantCowbells]

it's not in my personality to back down but I am so fucking done with this. I'm at the point where I'm not sure this game is worth it anymore.
I'd replcae out but I don't want to reward Varsoon for all the attacks hes made against me by giving him what he wants.

[RadiantCowbells]

NSG being likely scum is the absolute death knell of me wanting to play this game

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm the one getting shit for it but I'm only interested in this insofar as I think that Varsoon's playing doesn't align with his stated views. Varsoon's the one making this about my mom and my family and my myriad of character flaws. I don't think that calling him bad scum is provocation in the same way that anything he has said towards me is provocation. If I'm wrong on that, fine.

[RadiantCowbells]

And I'd still be willing to kick the entire varsoon situation off until a later date if he leaves me alone. But he'd never agree to that and I don't have an option besides what I'm doing.

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm not even mad anymore. I'm just tired.

[RadiantCowbells]

Elbirn, who do you think is non-Varsoon scum?

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: NR

She's been far more active elsewhere on site and the actual content that she has made leans towards scum for me

[RadiantCowbells]

there you go. if this fight is gonna end without moderator resolution or a lynch now is the time. ball is in your court varsoon.

I think NK15 reads tonally fucky and I actually don't like his implication that you and Varsoon is SvS. Because while I could absolutely see you agreeing to cross bus if you rolled scum together, I just...the way yall have been you'd have to both be literal sociopaths to keep this up for so long. So uh basically he postured into a position where he could easily take either side? His unvote off varsoon kinda sucked.

ftr Chibibear held the exact same position and I could have totally seen it at the time. It continuing this long, yeah but I honestly don't know if I expect better from him.

[RadiantCowbells]

not sure

im town
i think you're town
when it comes down to it i think chibis town
nibbul's town

leantown mutant
leantown firebringer
leantown gamma

? Kokichi
? NK15

sliiight leanscum MariaR

nico scummy

varsoon excluded
nsg excluded unless she comes back or gets replaced with a strong preference for the former

[RadiantCowbells]

wouldn't exactly have a strong pick for a second scum so i'm hoping that this in fact flips scum

[RadiantCowbells]

it's possible my reasons for scumreading NSG were bad
it's possible my reasons for townleaning gamma/fire are bad

so i guess mostly just maria's vote on me feeling a little off but even that i dunno if it makes her scum honestly

[RadiantCowbells]

i think if nk15 is scum his mariar read is pretty much always tmi scum
i think that nico scum doesn't really point to anyone

[RadiantCowbells]

but yea i guess that's the shape of things, that readslist

[RadiantCowbells]

I have no reason to scumread Gamma and making a hood between NSG/myself where they are both scum seems really questionable from a scum PoV and making one where NSG is town and he is scum also seems very questionable. he's not literally never scum but I don't have any reason to think he's scum

[RadiantCowbells]

regarding nicorobin she's posted a solid amount elsewhere on site during the time frame and isn't usually the kind of person to avoid a thread because toxic.