Newbie 1927 | Stuff I Found Online Xi | Over

[Lycanfire]

Vote Count

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Lynching

With 7 votes in play, it takes 4 to lynch.

You thought this was a vote count, but it was me, Dio!

Deadline:

(expired on 2019-05-01 08:00:00).

Mod notes:

[Baezu]

sky-

Spoiler:

towny post:

im concerned that NM could be seen as an easy mislynch for scum to pull off w/o catching any flak

i wouldn't go as far to describe him as lynchbait because the people who've played w him tend to know better but i'm p sure none of you have played w him so maybe in this context he has lhf qualities

scummy post:

I'm not splitting the votes intentionally, this is just to see if anything surfaces in the last 10 hours.

This feels like a preemptive defense towards something they're worried others will perceive as scummy

null

[Baezu]

so my top 3 scum reads by POE are froce, NM and SKy

VOTE: froce

[Lycanfire]

Official Vote Count 2.04

This pupper recharging their chi with a crystal bath.

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Lynching

With 7 votes in play, it takes 4 to lynch.

Froce

(3): Skygazer, Not_Mafia, Baezu

Skygazer

(2): PvtUrist, Froce

Gimm1ck

(1): Exilon

Not_Mafia

(1): Gimm1ck

Not Voting

(0):

None.

Deadline:

(expired on 2019-05-01 08:00:00).

Mod notes:

[Exilon]

@baezu could you provide some context on why you found certain things scummy?
Cause reading what you posted I have no idea.

Like, just overall what you think is most relevant

[Baezu]

On regards to your posts specifically or another players posts specifically or in general which posts I find scummy?

[Not_Mafia]

Baezu you broke the thread loser

[Gimm1ck]

I had this feeling you were pretending to fabricate some of your reasoning day 1, and making an effort to appear townie in most of your logic. I didn't want to say anything because I wanted to see if the feeling was going to hold up or not and how Moomn flipped.
Now you PR-fish instead of building a case which town!you I believe was wont to do, and you preempt an N_M lynch by using logic that is at best tenuous and at worst a flat-out lie, because your scum partner couldn't get it going.

Explain how floating around the suggestion of a hypo which a. Never happened, b. I wanted to ask everyone’s opinion of it instead of going ahead and hypoing, is PR-fishing.

By ‘preempting’ a NM lynch, all I want is pressure on them so I can formulate a read. Furthermore, if NM is my so-called ‘lynchbait’, why didn’t I lynch them yesterday? I could have easily shifted onto NM if I wanted an easy lynch.

1. Asking for everyone about hypo is fine, insisting on it happening even though people have said no and not letting go is wasting time for town and it's an attempt at PR-fishing. This however I concede is likely to be NAI (non-alignment indicative).
2. He wasn't lynchbait yesterday (even though some tried), he is lynchbait today. Also, you could have shifted to NM, but why would you when Moomn was right there? Look, pointless arguments!

I mean not only because your scum partner couldn't get it going but I'm pretty sure you both see him as a safe lynch D2.

Very scummy for these reasons;
1. You assume I’m scum and working with a scum partner; if a townsperson were to say this, instead of going all up in arms with claiming ‘he’s scum! He’s scum!’, a townsperson would give an example and read of who my partner actually is, rather than simply claiming ‘oh, he has a partner!’.
2. If I theoretically had a scum partner, we both see him as a safe lynch: no, because I have said and currently say I do not have a strong read on NM yet. I have a scumlean. I want pressure on them. Simple.

Would like to point out the growing bond between NM and Exilon as possible scum partners; he whipped out the classic chainsaw defense.

1. I don't have to at this point, I think it's pretty clear who's the scum partner that I'm reading, even if it's independent and on another wagon. And no they wouldn't, that's a null tell at best (see: N_M's playstyle).

2. The point I made is redundant and hypothetical, obviously, so I don't even know why you as town would feel the need to address it. You as scum, however, I totally get.
2.5. Moreover, the response to the point has nothing to do with the point itself, it's strawmanning it. Instead of saying "actually, if I were scum I wouldn't see him as a safe lynch at all" or "if i were scum I would be going for someone else", which I feel would be very townie to do, you reject the hypothetical from the get go, and that I find to be a scumtell.

3. This is the exact narrative I'm accusing you of building. You clearly understand that most of us think N_M is town and you clearly understand that this is N_M's playstyle. You know he is not going to budge. Yet, you justify a vote by the quote below. In order to make the wagon and lynch appear more credible, you conjure up some extremely weak reasoning - I mentioned this briefly in the other post, let met expand on it:

What I will initially say is

MAJOR fos

on NM for
1. Lurking yesterday
2. Being put on a lynch block w/other people
3. Immediately lynching another person without reasoning

To clarify, he immediately lynched another person

on that list

without giving reasoning, something lazy scum would do over picking a few people to push, fabricate reasoning, and start counterwagon attempts on them

by lynching I'm assuming you mean voting; moving along;
MAJOR FOS doesn't seem like what you mentioned more recently here, which is a lot milder.
It was in addition to this:

I didn't know hypo was a thing until today. I don't think it's useful at this point. I think it's PR fishing atm.
Hard figuring out if that's null or scummy.

Say Gimm, asides from wanting to Hypo, who do you think is scummy and would like to pressure currently?

Will tackle these in two independent posts; my reads when I have more time, but I will shoutout a fact that I want a NM lynch to test one thing.
You claimed multiple times that you could ‘hammer Moomn whenever you needed to’ - you hammered when a NM wagon was being built up. It seems logical that if NM is scum, you are a very potential partner for hammering Moomn out of fear of NM being CWed.
The reason I point out multiple times is that a scum would want to lay out a trail of their thoughts as to not be questioned on your decision: you went ahaid and did that. TLDR; If NM is scum Exilon is major FOS.

About hypoing, I don’t see the problem if everyone says ‘if doc, docced x; if Jailkeeper, jailkept y; if cop, z is town’; to me it only gives us information in case of a town PR death, without outing PRs.

I don't know what game have you been playing but at 2 hours left on the clock (which I noted), which is when I hammered Moomn, N_M's wagon still had only 3 votes and the risk of we getting a no lynch was extremely high, so for you to say that I hammered when a wagon was building up is disingenous at best and outright misleading at worst, and it comes up here very conveniently in order to push for a N_M lynch that you don't find that scum apparently despite the "MAJOR FOS" on him.

The worst part here is, you're FoS'ing people that you don't have as a strong scumread? It's the beginning of day 2 and you're already invoking flips as justification for a lynch?

You know what would help me, if you could post your actual reads as you said you would and we can go from there.

Regarding the whole ‘I want pressure on them’/FOS/whether it is a scumread or not, for me, just assume that when I want prsssure/have a FOS that it is synonymous with a current scumlean.

I sincerely alopigize, I assumed we were playing with plurality mechanisms instead of majority. The way I play on the site I frequent is by plurality, so for some reason I assumed the person with plurality (Moomn) would be lynched, and all it took was for one person on the Moomn wagon to shift to NM to be lynched. This is why I made the read of you being possible scum partners with NM, fearing the Moomn lynch. In retrospect, knowing what and why you hammered, that is now a town tell by hammering Moomn. With plurality mechanisms, anyone could have simply shifted towards NM.

Regarding your comment about targeting the hypothetical question instead of replying with ‘If I was scum, I would not do x, because y reasons’;
-Any scum or town player can easily make up anything at this stage. It relies on self playermeta and general reliability of the statements; metas change, and scumtells do so as well. I, therefore, do not see the point in making these statements.
-Yes, while most of the other Townspeople townread NM, as far as I can tell on the sole basis of ‘oh he’ll be good in endgame situations’, no. I want him to be good (or at least attempt to be good) now. At least pop off some reads or few; it literally is anti town to actively lurk to the extent NM currently is. This, at least to me, warrants pressure, and is scummy.

[Gimm1ck]

In regards to mass claiming/hypoing, I'm against doing so today. With both scum alive and atleast another 2 days to go, it'll hurt more than help town when it comes to hiding our PRs. I'd possible suggest mass claiming Day 3, though, depending on how today progresses.

My reads haven't changed much since yesterday except on N_M and Baezu. I'm not willing to lynch within the town group, and while I'm not sure on N_M's allignment, I do not believe him to be the best Day 2 lynch. My strongest scumread is still Wilky/Skygazer, and the second scum is between N_M/Baezu. The lynch should be between Skygazer/Baezu today.

{Exilon, Gimm1ck, Froce} town
{Not_Mafia} null/lynch-bait
{Baezu} light scumread/PoE
{Skygazer} scum/PoE

This Exilon!Gimm1ck interaction is TvT. I've townread their tone since Day 1 (page 1-3), and it hasn't changed since. I don't believe Exilon is wolfing, and Gimm1ck is genuine with his reactions. I'm not sure on how to solve their tunneling, over than suggest that town does not always come across as town.

Froce is town, and I won't bother to elaborate unless someone disagrees and wants his lynch today.

N_M isn't pinging scum. (Yes, contradicting reads ) he's null/troll and is better off being mech-cleared or saved for D3.

I townread Baezu on Day 1, but I retract that statement after rereading her ISO. Her posts have been bland, passive and unengaging, classic sign of scum feigning activity and flying under the radar.

I'll restate why Skygazer is scum in a bit.

Disagree on two points, and find this post slightly scummy.
Why do you assume Exilon is wolfing? To me, at least, he found something scummy and is going after it. How is that open wolfing? Logs please.

Same thing with Baezu. They have been active and posting reads. They are a townread of mine. Tell us where Baezu is passive/unengaging.

[Gimm1ck]

In regards to mass claiming/hypoing, I'm against doing so today. With both scum alive and atleast another 2 days to go, it'll hurt more than help town when it comes to hiding our PRs. I'd possible suggest mass claiming Day 3, though, depending on how today progresses.

My reads haven't changed much since yesterday except on N_M and Baezu. I'm not willing to lynch within the town group, and while I'm not sure on N_M's allignment, I do not believe him to be the best Day 2 lynch. My strongest scumread is still Wilky/Skygazer, and the second scum is between N_M/Baezu. The lynch should be between Skygazer/Baezu today.

{Exilon, Gimm1ck, Froce} town
{Not_Mafia} null/lynch-bait
{Baezu} light scumread/PoE
{Skygazer} scum/PoE

This Exilon!Gimm1ck interaction is TvT. I've townread their tone since Day 1 (page 1-3), and it hasn't changed since. I don't believe Exilon is wolfing, and Gimm1ck is genuine with his reactions. I'm not sure on how to solve their tunneling, over than suggest that town does not always come across as town.

Froce is town, and I won't bother to elaborate unless someone disagrees and wants his lynch today.

N_M isn't pinging scum. (Yes, contradicting reads ) he's null/troll and is better off being mech-cleared or saved for D3.

I townread Baezu on Day 1, but I retract that statement after rereading her ISO. Her posts have been bland, passive and unengaging, classic sign of scum feigning activity and flying under the radar.

I'll restate why Skygazer is scum in a bit.

Disagree on two points, and find this post slightly scummy.
Why do you assume Exilon is wolfing? To me, at least, he found something scummy and is going after it. How is that open wolfing? Logs please.

Same thing with Baezu. They have been active and posting reads. They are a townread of mine. Tell us where Baezu is passive/unengaging.

Meant to elaborate on this;
I find the first statement slightly scummier than the second, because you assume actively pressuring a townread of yours is synonymous with open wolfing. This seems like a fair and square pocket to me.

Plus, why do you Townread me/Exilon? It’s as important to provide logs of Townreads and scumreads alike.

[Froce]

Holy crap I just realized I'm on L-1

Bazeu take your vote off me. You should also explain more as Exilon said because all you did is say such and such is towny/scummy for no reason. You put 3 people in your scum pool: me, and 2 other players who are voting me. You need to revise because your vote looks pretty bad.

As far as the people who aren't voting me: Pvt, Gimmick and Exilon, so I don't think I'm in danger of getting suddenly hammered thankfully. Still, I need one of the people on me to unvote if you don't have a hard read and are just soft-voting. I'm hoping N_M and Baezu would unvote.

I mean I have 3 votes on me, so I feel like I should respond to criticism? But there isn't any. None that I haven't covered.

[Froce]

Besides Baezu's vote nothing much else happened. I'm hoping at least for some responses from the people voting me and not just carry this to deadline.

To agree with Pvt, I'm definitely leaning towards Gimm and Ex being both town. In that case, perhaps the 4 of us (if nobody has anything to say about Pvt) should be a townblock and carry this day. Let's brainstorm and read the remaining 3.

[Baezu]

UNVOTE:

Sorry, froce, did not realize you were at L-1...that certainly wasn’t my intention

I’ve been kind of out of it today, a woman that I’d known most of my life got killed at that shooting today...

I want to keep playing since I need the distraction but I think my brain is only half screwed on atm

[PvtUrist]

Disagree on two points, and find this post slightly scummy.
Why do you assume Exilon is wolfing? To me, at least, he found something scummy and is going after it. How is that open wolfing? Logs please.

I don't believe Exilon is wolfing

^as in Exilon

isn't

wolfing.

[PvtUrist]

Same thing with Baezu. They have been active and posting reads. They are a townread of mine. Tell us where Baezu is passive/unengaging.

I townread Baezu on Day 1, but I retract that statement after rereading her ISO. Her posts have been bland, passive and unengaging, classic sign of scum feigning activity and flying under the radar.

#351 is accurate.

Here's examples of Baezu's passive unengagements;

I suspect you of being scum, Exilon. Do you know why?

Exilon is town, move on

Hello friends. Down with the other faction, i say!

Let me familiarize myself with the codes and i shall join this random voting stage

Why so vague?

Hello friends. Down with the other faction, i say!

Let me familiarize myself with the codes and i shall join this random voting stage

I claim loved mayor with 2 votes

Not helping town

These posts all pings of scum feigning activity while not actually contributing to solving the game

ok

VOTE: froce

Why are you voting froce?

This post was directed by my RVS vote. Again, not a genuine post that helps solve the game. Moreso, assuming Urist!Froce is TvT.

I’m FoSing moomn, but waiting for his response

Another example.

[PvtUrist]

To clarify, the scumread on Baezu isn't by her activity, but moreso the motivations behind them. Yes, she's active and posts her reads, but that and politeness isn't completely town-indicative. If you look into her ISO, there's plenty of contradicting sayings of her reads. Here's her current readlist from what I can interpret so far;

{Urist} Town #373
{Gimm} Town/Mixed #370
{Exilon} Mixed #367
{N_M} Null/PoE #371
{Froce, Skygazer} Scum #369 #354 #376

From her list, only Froce and Yours Truly didn't receive contradicting reads. This is a bit too much fence-sitting for something I feel to be within town-range, and coupled with her passiveness & PoE, is why I believe her to be scum.

[Skygazer]

Scum are actually more likely to be consistent for appearances.

Baezu, I'm so sorry... I don't think I could begin to understand what you must be going through.

[Froce]

I'm awfully sorry for your loss baezu.

[Exilon]

Skygazer, while I don't disagree with you... wouldn't scum by nature be more easily caught being incosistent, due to the fact that, you know, their reads are mostly fake?

[Exilon]

@baezu: I am so sorry for your loss, I can't imagine what it is like :/

On regards to your posts specifically or another players posts specifically or in general which posts I find scummy?

Just generally, if you had to point your strongest scumreads from what you posted, what stands out the most, and why?

[Exilon]

@Gimm: I am slightly satisfied with your answer. Taking into account the most recent developments and revelations, I'm sure you've changed some of your views on things. What're your scumreads atm besides NM?

[Baezu]

Same thing with Baezu. They have been active and posting reads. They are a townread of mine. Tell us where Baezu is passive/unengaging.

I townread Baezu on Day 1, but I retract that statement after rereading her ISO. Her posts have been bland, passive and unengaging, classic sign of scum feigning activity and flying under the radar.

#351 is accurate.

Here's examples of Baezu's passive unengagements;

I suspect you of being scum, Exilon. Do you know why?

Exilon is town, move on

Hello friends. Down with the other faction, i say!

Let me familiarize myself with the codes and i shall join this random voting stage

Why so vague?

Hello friends. Down with the other faction, i say!

Let me familiarize myself with the codes and i shall join this random voting stage

I claim loved mayor with 2 votes

Not helping town

These posts all pings of scum feigning activity while not actually contributing to solving the game

ok

VOTE: froce

Why are you voting froce?

This post was directed by my RVS vote. Again, not a genuine post that helps solve the game. Moreso, assuming Urist!Froce is TvT.

I’m FoSing moomn, but waiting for his response

Another example.

I absolutely agree with you- that’s how I tend to be D1, especially in the early stages. I have a few recent completed games that you can check out for comparison (the link to my wiki is in my signature)

Now that the game has some content I can actually respond to things...anything in particular you’d like my opinion on?

[Skygazer]

was waiting to say something because their goin through a rough time but baezus unvote seems lamist or somethin in line with that

[Gimm1ck]

Me too, I hope you feel better Baezu
But could you explain why you said you sred Froce, but yet unlynched him when he posted something along the lines of ‘unlynch me I’m on L-1”? If you truly sred him, you would be okay with that.

Townread PVT for spectacular and townie analysis.

[Lycanfire]

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