Infernal Affairs - Game Over!

[hellbooks]

im gonna pretend this is youtube:
first

mary oliver

VOTE: andante
just looking to fill my hot take quota for the day

[hellbooks]

kinda of a lack of self consciousness

[hellbooks]

does that mean you have opinions fermenting rn or are you just checking in

[hellbooks]

That’s a spicy take!!! Sounds like you have a reason for it, and I’d LOVE to hear it

ok ! ! !
let me just share it to u in secret... (i dont want the randos to hear!)

whisper whisper whisper whisper

pretty good right?!?!?

[hellbooks]

wow… so spicy!! love it tbh!!!

i feel like im being strongarmed into wanting to townread you from you being likeable

[hellbooks]

What cause do you have to hide it from the town at this stage of the game?

going to wickedly dodge this question and say that you are also a Person of Interest so I would like to get to know u better. for examples: how are you doing rn? can you return to your state of mind from when you made this statement?

I don't need free town points.

what feelings and thoughts were running through your head? did you think about how it would have been read when you wrote it or did you just think-and-send?

feel free to wickedly dodge these questions back! fair is fair!

[hellbooks]

okay : )

[feels free to]

[hellbooks]

think i am going to tentatively think of you as bein town..... relative to the neutral feelings i have about many others you seem earnest.... thats all from me tonight

[hellbooks]

I'd say buddying usually implies some actual content / read that carries some impact rather than an obvious joke

[hellbooks]

The tone dissonance, yeah first post sounds like hell is messing around with /annoyed sarcasm then the next post sounds not all aligned with that. Especially with previous ones. It’s big mood shifts

i'm gathering evidence! if you act at someone they'll act right back!

[hellbooks]

is there any chance i can interest you in not keeping this gimmick up for the whole game

[hellbooks]

wow 4 posts from DW in less than 20 minutes.. easy there hoss.. Town DW

As much depth as a kiddie pool

-snip-

Okay you're town I understand tyvm

im interested in where you're going with both of these things

[hellbooks]

That could be said of every interaction, and says nothing at all about the tonal shift.

it should be clear that my post was not on-its-face genuine given that it didnt come with an unvote. im still invested in pushing andante but i'm not scumhunting

super

seriously right now because im still identifying people im interested in poking at, i've only meaningfully chatted with a few people, and we're still at a stage where reads change pretty quickly ! did my post stand out to you before or after firebringer brought it up?

[hellbooks]

Scorpius' read on me is weird and shortsighted and doesn't make much sense unless a tell that easy works on me (which I don't think it does)

itsa bad read but i dont think its bad to point it out
pedit: fun fact i was actually about to ask you whether u thought it was scummy and now i guess i got that question answered

[hellbooks]

what evidence did u gather

im still sort of thinking which is why i havent been presenting it. its hard to gather conclusions from just a few one-liner back and forths:

That’s not a bad thing!!! I’m town! Feel free to TR me

a statement such as this has like a kaleidoscopic amount of psychology behind it though. if i were to try and pinpoint... it felt kind of like putting up a wall a little bit. but as i said. WIP

[hellbooks]

Your plan is just to push me? I'd love to hear more on how this plan plays out... like, you want to push me to get reads on... me? or reads on others? cause pushing me doesn't give reads on the others, and how do you identify which people you want to poke at?

ya you. by push i guess i mean more like poke at so i think i used the wrong word. as far as identifying what ppl im interested in sorting, its mostly just if someone says something that makes me go "oh, interesting, hm." i would consider myself more of a micro player so as far as large playerlists go, for me its just sort of a gradual process of getting everyone figured out in my head. so right now im prioritizing based on gut

[hellbooks]

Why are you already proposing day1/day 2 passes?? like, just read people, propose a lim, go from there... like you can BET I'll be pushing a SR, and if someone is towny, they're getting a "pass" but it's not like I'm announcing official passes..

VOTE: Tejate Raichu
I think I'm putting my vote here for a while, he's not getting away that easily, probably my strongest SR here right now.

IDK who morph the cat is but this actually rings slightly town to me. it seems like he picked up some cool new Scumhunting Idea from someone else in a game and is looking to try it out. maybe we're just picking up on different things about it. i can understand your other points on fabriacated read though

287, subtle shade without actually trying to engage my slot. I don't think asking for thoughts on other players is very unusual or particularly scummy, but the way it's phrased in this post just has some ineffable bad energy about it for me. It feels agenda driven rather than earnest.

it felt fine to me ㅠㅠㅠㅠ but maybe i just like being talked to ㅠㅠㅠㅠㅠㅠ
i'm interested in why frogsterking decides to create a magikhorse vanity wagon while also scumreading tejate when there are existing people wanting to wagon tejate who he could link up with. is it for maximum spice?

[hellbooks]

Spicy vote by going against the grain of townreads on Magik. Maybe town.

contrarily i think this is a fairly safe and desirable thing for scum to do

Yes I have done a lot of the work already and I keep procrastinating because of my perfectionism.

additionally, i dont like this

VOTE: frogster

wanna hay this wagon?

[hellbooks]

additionally, i dont like this

reads to me like "i dont want to be yelled at for not having a case but im also anxious about posting a case"

[hellbooks]

i also liked that on a pure enjoyment level

[hellbooks]

hellbrooks did u find anything interesting yet

about what? the game in general?

[hellbooks]

yeah i think the guy im voting should get voted

[hellbooks]

also fos cat scratch fever. giving andante an epic morph the cat style pass for now lol!

[hellbooks]

ty for that info
i don't think ur vote is bad so u got that going for u.
now where is the movie reviews i was promised in signups

one request per day max
ask me tomorrow

[hellbooks]

sorry its a global request system so i cant do the thing nero asked either. everyone has one collective request a la "brain cell"

[hellbooks]

andante what do you think about galron and in particular raichu "locktowning" galron for doing his scum roleplay bit

I legit have been thinking it was called InTernal Affairs.

also literally thought this

Having said that, my vote goes to Nero because jumping in to chainsaw Keeper over a pretty tame and reasonable push is much scummier, and a flip there is likely to shed light on Keeper themself.

also thought that fire's push is fine / even good. pushes dont have to be logically perfect to yield results

I claim Reverse Traitor. I know a scum team exists, but wasn't informed of their identities. I win when I expose them all and remove them. I can be alive or dead to achieve this win condition.

literally laughed

Tejate wagon obv not going, and I'm not as sure about him as I was. Voting Frozen Angel was a decent thought when I was falling asleep, but not feeling it now. UNVOTE: Voting Keepter as a PL, meh. I could go either way I guess. I don't like 340 and would like to see a better answer there.

I dunno. Tejate still seems scummy to me.

i actively disliked every sentence here

[hellbooks]

Tejate wagon obv not going, and I'm not as sure about him as I was. Voting Frozen Angel was a decent thought when I was falling asleep, but not feeling it now. UNVOTE: Voting Keepter as a PL, meh. I could go either way I guess. I don't like 340 and would like to see a better answer there.

I dunno. Tejate still seems scummy to me.

reads like a bunch of self-conscious justification about wagon jumping + clumsy pivot into raichu

[hellbooks]

POOKY you are running out of cliips FAST!!! save your vote counts dear, you only have 6 left!!!!!

[hellbooks]

This game is weird, it has like zero flow

You sure we're reading the same game? I've definitely seen progression happening, and there's multiple 1v1's going on, so does zero flow mean... not reading?

havent played in a hot min so i dont have the cutting edge data on this... but statements complaining about game state always move the needle slightly scumward for me

ooh not liking the exact same thing as me!!! I think that's a good look!! Like that post from frogster is just so bad... "I have most of it done, it just has to be perfect" that literally sounds like me as maf going "yeah I'll have reads sometime, not yet though!" in hopes people forget and move on

I was thinking about hopping over to galron but if people wanna vote frog then im just gonna put it in park

So if you have passion for a Tejate lim.. why have I seen 0 conviction for it in your lines? instead you're all "haha I'm maf" like, do you wonder why no one is listening to you? cause I think it's very obvious... go ISO yourself, and look at what we're dealing with

omg?

[hellbooks]

Sheeping STD

VOTE: Frogsterking

curious about this

[hellbooks]

ok fine
i dont have problems with that actually

[hellbooks]

Andante's recent posts are interesting, and I'll do some reconsidering of the slot.

elaborate (super important) (please put it at the top of your in-game to do list) (not clickbait)

[hellbooks]

Catch up tonight apologies its been super busy

[hellbooks]

I think I'm coming around on a null read for now. Null as in, I feel like I'm getting mixed signals rather than there's nothing there at all. Early posts (shortly after RVS) as I have already made apparent gave me scumvibes and I was not particularly fond of them. Their wallposts (particularly 553 and 555) gave me much more of an impression that they're actually trying to sort, even if I don't necessarily agree with every point presented in these posts. Disagreeing doesn't automatically make someone maf, and agreement doesn't automatically make someone town either. That being said, their earlier posts do still trouble me a bit and I think it might be easier to read the slot a bit later when there's more to be said. I came away from my re-read of Andante's ISO feeling conflicted more than anything.

the reason I asked you is because I thought that fact that you OMGUSed her when she was pushing you. and then, once the heat got taken off you, you decided to back away from that 1v1 without elaborating at all. you just said maybe i have to reevaluate her or something. i found that blatantly awkward and honestly a bit of a smoking gun

Since when does N_M come with an item pool?!

ok i did laugh at this

No problems with the above post? you sure? or is this the move where you go "I don't want conflict so I'm not pushing further"

i think sheeping someone whose reads you think are good is genuinely not bad on like D1
wagons need large amount of support to get going in a big playerlist and a cohesive town has leaders & followers IMO
not that save the dragons is necessarily my leader of choice but i think the reasoning is valid. I dont think i've been conflict avoidant. you're right, he doesn't look good if frog flips town but considering frogs the person i want to lim currently, my focus is elsewhere. his naked vote is not the most importnat part of his iso to me

[hellbooks]

now if you're actually saying "wow frogster's wagon grew super fast" maybe that IS a discussion worth having and something i also thought independently. the thing is, in my experience i dont think fast-growing wagons are necessarily indicative of scum vultures descending upon the kill. sometimes people are just like yea lets just get him outta here and move forward and scum is happy to park outside of it (e.g. random vanity wagon) and let it unfold.

[hellbooks]

ok can we just discuss something else? like something actually relevant? If not galron/frogs today, then who?

did your passion for the tej push flicker out at some point?

Okay so I have a mess of four cases now, my original unfinished Magik scum case, a second Magik scum case I started working on after Magik's reaction to my push, the unfinished scum case for TR and the unfinished case showing the partner tells between Magik and TR. I need to get something out here so I tried combining the first and second case not allowing myself to start any more cases until I got something posted. That became a mess too so I'm posting this as it is.

honestly at this point i respect your iron will to hold out until you were ready to drop the case LOL
youre were just like "itll be ready when its ready... the public can WAIT"
ok so lets see what this is about....

[hellbooks]

I like your initial scumping via setup spec. i think thats the sort of interesting psychological reading level that always appeals to me.
that being said I think that some of this is you having an end result and trying to come up with as much stuff as possible to fit it by looking at magik's ISO. When I asked about the "I don't need free town points" post, that was my attempt to gauge whether it was his playstyle personality that would move him to make such a post or an actual LAMIST situation, and I think it fits personality-wise with some other posts he made. in any case (by which i mean for this case) i'm interested to see if magik defends.

[hellbooks]

is this a playstyle thing from frog? to sort of play the game retroactively by accumulating a large backlog of info and then pushing it out all at once?

[hellbooks]

i said i was interested to see if magik defends but then theres all this text and..... well maybe its just better to see whats happening in more recent pages....... i'll SKIM it at least

[hellbooks]

I'm hard skimming so maybe its been answered already but Feog why did you vote magic when there was a TR wagon already going? (at least at the time of your vote)

i asked this back when they did it and they said this:

@hell 350

There are enough days left to move the execution onto MagikHorse. I think it's pessimistic to assume Magik is a vanity wagon.

I'm more afraid of scum!Magik running away with the game compared to scum!Tejate.

and ofc as we know, then displayed no initiative to actually create a wagon on magik at all (and i would argue that even now it feels slightly like frogster is not actually meaningfully trying to create a magik wagon)

[hellbooks]

cosigned

[hellbooks]

Morning. Insanely busy day. Will be here tomorrow/tonight!

[hellbooks]

sheep me Scorp

but I think Tej is Town..

Tejate is definitely town yes

are you inclined to say more about this?

[hellbooks]

or point me to somewhere you've already done so?

[hellbooks]

VOTE: tejate raichu

[hellbooks]

UNVOTE:
willbe here tonight

[hellbooks]

Giving support for this. As promised, I'll support hellbooks (and Magik) votes.

That's my elaboration.

do you not have any confidence in your own reads? do you have opinions about who is scum ?? whats with this?

[hellbooks]

i am not interested in voting andante today

[hellbooks]

By the way, @mod can we get a VC please?

i told him... he should have saved the clips

who r u interested in hellbooks

this question is actually like hard as heck because i feel like im in the upside down world but here is one answer
VOTE: save the dragons

i also want andante to elaborate on what she thinks about other slots than tejate.
toog seems to be looking to give up independent scumhunting.
galron is literally going joker mode and i have no idea how to sort this sort of limbait.
scorpious could be scum for sure
i think the keeper's only thing that made me lean either way was some gimmick frustration that i read as town but still null (big part of this is that i tend to skip faer posts)
i still feel like tej is scum. frog picking him as a partner and then steering totally clear of him stinks. but idk what to make of the double magikhorse/andante chainsaw there
i think you are town with your d2 play

[hellbooks]

i meant that andante and magikhorse are both insisting that youre town. sorry about the confusion

[hellbooks]

UNVOTE:
holding off on this until i figure something out

[hellbooks]

VOTE: save the dragons
never mind i was reading too much into things

[hellbooks]

i also want andante to elaborate on what she thinks about other slots than tejate.

uh what? I'm voting momo and explained why momo is maf. Tejate town, Magik maf.

so magik maf momo maf tejate town, and no one else is memorable

sorry i actually think i remember you saying this and literally forgot it will keep it in mind

I have written this post over the years. Mostly as scum. Reasons to not have any cases or any real accountability on anything.

decent observation and i find it towny

1137 is a diamond in the rough from them, and even that's a bit shaky.

you know what they say about my posting... even a broken clock is right twice a day

sounds good to me
VOTE: Dragons

doubt this is a bus. if it were she has less towncred to gain from it seeing as though its sort of a proxy

[hellbooks]

now today they're just sort of coasting with Nero.

you're not wrong. im getting complacent and demotivated due to the game state, which is intersecting with life kind of blowing up this week. im starting to focus more on solving outside of the people ive been talking about though.

i also want andante to elaborate on what she thinks about other slots than tejate.

uh what? I'm voting momo and explained why momo is maf. Tejate town, Magik maf.

so magik maf momo maf tejate town, and no one else is memorable

okay reading this I think you are overstating how much you elaborated on these reads... i guess if you're disavowing them then it doesnt matter as much and i read that as town sort of getting demotivated with the weird pace of the game. but you sort of created a dichotomy between magik and tej and then deemed tej to be town and so... magik is scum by poe? i find it way more scummy that frog threw out tej as a partner and then basically never elaborated on it or committed to it.

[hellbooks]

Andante/Galron/Keeper are the ones I'm actively scumreading the most at this time

curious: what do you think of this interaction:

I still think frog v galron was maf v maf.... there's no way this is town galron.. all game galron has been "pretending to be maf" or whatever he's doing...

andante says this.

Couple of things, I think Andante scum reads me

then later, galron reminds me that andante scumreads him for.... what reason exactly? idk what to make of it so would like ur input -- how does it fit in your solve?
and then after that, andante doesnt bring up galron again.

IDK, andante reads town to me. i feel like theres environmental storytelling of her sort of thinking about the game and working through a solve. thats genuinely the best way i can explain it, like it seems like something thats hard to fake. but its weird af that galron was like "dont forget, she scumreads me!" like, "im being helpful so can i be town?" idk

[hellbooks]

to be clear i dont need you to make any preflip associatives

If you think there's something in particular I should look for, please feel free to drop it in the thread and I'll take a good look.

yeah I'll figure out how to put it into words later ty

[hellbooks]

wait actually....

I think that if you thought this:

I didn't like Hell's D1, they kinda half supported the Frog push without looking like they were willing to commit to it

It doesn't make sense that you would say this:

The only reason I'm not scumreading them is that they started the wagon on Frog.

so.... whats up with that?

[hellbooks]

IDK, andante reads town to me. i feel like theres environmental storytelling of her sort of thinking about the game and working through a solve

reading through Andante's ISO a second time, I dont feel as confident as I did in this yesterday but I said I would elaborate...

one thing that caught my eye yesterday was how she constructed this "one scum in tej/magik" dichotomy D1, then on D2, declared tej to be town and then later, magik to be scum (which she provided very little justification towards). I feel like that's a conclusion that town has a good chance of coming to based on like, operative bias of not having the hidden info and only working inside one's own logic palace. I think thats the best way I can describe what I was thinking yesterday. but the reason I'm not as confident about this is that theres a thin line between town being in a tunnel and scum coming up with post hoc justifications for a mislim.

that being said... I think scum doesn't try and go for a magikhorse mislim today... there's low hanging fruit that would be more up scum's alley. which brings me to:

I see a potential for Andante's galron push to be in bad faith. I think that frog/galron wagon movement D1 isnt indicative of alignment and could just fall from general circumstances. At least *I* dont find it that convincing because I dont think scum has that much broad influence on wagon movements in big games as people think (i dont have the stats to back it up obv i havent played big games in so long). thats just my intuition though. But I think the fact that Andante stopped commiting to this push and even straight up FORGOT about it in her reads summary in 1161 is definitely interesting and not behavior i would expect from scu pushing a miselim

[hellbooks]

also anyone who scumreads magikhorse should probably have an answer to frog/magikhorse D1 interaction because EVEN if it was this weird kamikaze one-track bus plan, it was executed with WAY less effort and consistency than anyone who came up with that plan would put into it

[hellbooks]

omw home prepare for posts
i think "i am scum" is supposed to refer to firebringer but idk why scorpios would switch up the order

[hellbooks]

I'm really not loving Keeper's posts today. They said they would be careful with their vote, and yet they're insisting that Magik was "the correct mechanical vote" when it's pretty obviously never going to be anything more than a vanity wagon today. First of all, no, second of all, why is that the correct mechanical play?

actually good post I agree

[hellbooks]

Reading this made me like Dragons's vote here. there is no way saying this about me doesn't stem from TMI knowing I'm town. "galron push is probably bad faith" uh excuse me?? Galron spent all of day 1 pretending to be maf, how is that even bad faith??

i didnt say it was probably bad faith i mean if you're scum and galron is town then it would be a good target for a mislim from your pov
but the evidence doesnt necessarily support that theory because you inexplicably backed off from that push

[hellbooks]

I'm like super happy right now sooo if anyone needs me for something you have 5 minutes

good!!!!!!! hope ur paper went well!

[hellbooks]

A vote is only usless is nothing is gained from it. And I have gained, therefore it was not usless.

Magiks reaction wasn't as revealing as anticipated. This can be a good thing in fairness. Despite being to me an optimal mechanical vote that vote was never intended to stay. The vibe of the vote post is good, the vibe of the initial response to my vote is good.
oh and theres this.

these two posts read like "my magik vote did something i promise... ok now to figure out what it did... well i guess not that much"

Andante is town yes. Can I interest anyone in a wagon here?
VOTE: Not_Mafia

what is the purpose here

and you want my claim? lmao vote me and find out

does this mean youre gonna claim or youre not gonna claim

i don't think "i am scum" is a good characterization of my vote?

comment on the andante wagon?

[hellbooks]

given that youve been softing PR i'm confused as to why you're so reluctant to claim

[hellbooks]

what in the damn hell am i supposed to make of that statement

[hellbooks]

and by hell i mean me

[hellbooks]

Why don't you want to vote NM or momo right now?

I think momo is town. NM isnt my favorite but yeah I mean Id be fine with him dying
here is a qusetion for you: why not keeper? I did a Ctrl F in your ISO and the last time you mentioned Keeper was Feb 26, where you said they were in your elim pool. You've basically had a radio silecne about them today. Your BFF tejate raichu is constructing a bit of a push there. why start a new wagon from scratch?

[hellbooks]

I'm literally not even ATEing?

idk what I did to make you hate me... but sorry I guess?

hall of fame posts
i have literally been speechless at my desk for like a full minute

[hellbooks]

ok whatever if dragons wants the claim, I'm just VT was trying to soft venge to scare maf off of voting me, but whatever. now I never die. woooooo

what da heck... and here i was convinced you were cop with an inno on tej LOL yeah ok VOTE: andante

[hellbooks]

kinda really didnt want to claim but i guess we dont really have a choice
i'm a doctor and i protected andante D1 and magik D2

-> keeper next

[hellbooks]

rough day today so i'll see u tmrw.
hbd magik & cbd raichu

[hellbooks]

i thought andante was a pr and i still thought there was a good chance of that on D2, u can go through my iso
i voted her after she responded super weirdly to pressure and then claimed vt who was "fake softing pr"

[hellbooks]

U know what screw it. Not gonna solve this with role claim shenanigans.

u were the one who asked for the massclaim though

[hellbooks]

I say we take a vote. If you think this this is a Mafia game, vote Mafia. If you think it's not a Mafia game, vote Not Mafia.

VOTE: Not Mafia

another banger tweet from you

[hellbooks]

Like really, is it really that unlikely that I'd survive two nights when one of those nights was after a rapidly cutoff day with many people still left alive and when the other night had a Doctor claim on me and high chances of them going after Nero instead?

fwiw i dont think scum shot you. looking at the kill count: on N1 4 people died and on N2 4 people died with one less vig alive
which suggests to me the protection didnt go thru
although who knows

[hellbooks]

Thinking from work, it feels like such a strange thing to include a role block as part of a fake claim. It could be the most clever of ruses, but the odds are too low for that.

Need to check on something else real quick, because something has caught my eye among the VT claims. Undoubtedly our remaining scum are in there. 3/5 odds of a good scum elim in there.

also fwiw: I think scum MIGHT have some natural motivation to include a role block as part of a fake claim to prevent less info from leaking out (even if fake results are wifom) but I def sympathize with that point and felt it myself
i'm curious about what you meant by the VT thing

[hellbooks]

I miss nero. This game would be more lively if he were here.

did i life the game enough can i go now??? may i be excused???
i need to run some errands so i'll be back tonight

[hellbooks]

actually one more thing i remembere which is that fb, if you think its tej/magik that means that frog double bussed D1 which i will say is NOT like impossible (like it could have just been a kamikaze opening gambit from the scum team to bank up a ton of town cred) but i think it feels too convoluted for me to easily accept it as the truth

[hellbooks]

this speculation of me being in neighborhood is silly. don't u think nero would shoot me if i was in a vigi hood night 1 if i was in a hood? and that i would out the hood?
Nero was scumreading me all game, if i was in a hood with him and the neighborhood all panicked on each other last night, i would be the one he shot instead i think he shot STD over paranoia.

wait a second -- why did you think that there was another vig though? are you making some deduction there?

[hellbooks]

how is it a kamikaze openning gambit to push two of ur teammates in the way Frog was pushing tej/magik
i don't see how that is convoluted at all, when weaker scum players are in game they tend try to force situations of distance with partners that they don't need to which if its magik/tej and both of them are super active. Frog needs to interact with them in some way or else he looks weird. So why not force a distance by pushing em?

im not up to date with "bussing meta" but i just have a hard time believing that frog would go about it in the way that he did. like he would just have randomly decided to name two of his partners and hyperfocus on them and ignore EVERYONE else. all the while lurking and drawing suspicion to himself
im not saying its impossible like esp with tej, i could see frog/tej because tej was a secondary partner. i could even hypothetically see frog/magik but i think magik is town outside of that interaction. but both just seems like weridly blatant and improbable

[hellbooks]

Game seems dead. Many of those of the town faction must be feeling defeated already.

blatant coast post tbh

[hellbooks]

scorpious what are your reads

[hellbooks]

Reread my posts. I was speculating Fire of being in the Vigi hood over one of his posts, and he's explaining why he likely wasn't in this response. Nobody currently is saying anything about there actually being an additional Vig, only suspicion that there was potentially a Mafia in the hood. I'm starting to think that assumption of Mafia being in the hood is likely incorrect.

fire said something about the "last vig claiming their target" earlier today

[hellbooks]

Even if its just one of them being his partner its still safer.

yeah I guess I do agree with this... like I said I can see it being one scum in the two

Like hell (the word in speech, not the player)

same thing

Currently I would prefer to vote Keeper or Toogeloo, neither have been doing much this entire game and could easily be coasting (in this order, Keeper's responses to being poked about their general lack of content has been worse between the two). No I don't have a lock on scum #3 yet, nor many clues on who that would be as of this time.

Feeling exactly the same here. Keeper seems like scum trying to coast while Toog seems like demotivated town with his little quips. I don't think it's both.

At the time, this sort of weird dancing around Toog struck me as pretty distinctly informed. My theory is that, maybe it was. I think it's possible that Nero was townreading Toog off of posts in the neighbor PT rather than posts in the main thread. If there is a scum neighbor, I'm starting to feel like Toog was actually most likely it.

Again, this is a gamble and I don't expect anyone to follow, but at least consider this before you throw it out.

++++town IMO....

[hellbooks]

calculus for paranoia reasons (aka answering the question: is keeper being set up to be a limbait target?)

People who said they would vote keeper
tejate
scorpious
magikhorse

So if keeper is scum
and we think its LYLO
either the scum team is in NM / Fire / Toog ... (NM / Fire / Keeper???)
or there's scum bussing in LYLO...

does scum bus in LYLO these days??? idfk

[hellbooks]

this speculation of me being in neighborhood is silly. don't u think nero would shoot me if i was in a vigi hood night 1 if i was in a hood? and that i would out the hood?
Nero was scumreading me all game, if i was in a hood with him and the neighborhood all panicked on each other last night, i would be the one he shot instead i think he shot STD over paranoia.

wait a second -- why did you think that there was another vig though? are you making some deduction there?

i miscounted number of shots and dead vigis in beginning of day.

What did you count it as

[hellbooks]

at least I can be confident that toog and tej are not scum together

[hellbooks]

calculus for paranoia reasons (aka answering the question: is keeper being set up to be a limbait target?)

People who said they would vote keeper
tejate
scorpious
magikhorse

So if keeper is scum
and we think its LYLO
either the scum team is in NM / Fire / Toog ... (NM / Fire / Keeper???)
or there's scum bussing in LYLO...

does scum bus in LYLO these days??? idfk

sorry -- i was double wrong. MILO

[hellbooks]

and here i was thinking radical rat was scum.
i guess im wrong again.

at least my gut on frog was right.

but my point is that you didn't talk about Rat being scum or Frog being scum and you come into today talking about how your gut was right about Frog but you weren't even here while he was getting ran up.

I have no intention in arguing with u cause ur just gonna misrepresent everything i say. Just like you did yesterday.
Just keep calling me scum.

~~

I would take out Magikhorse also form this wagon being scum. Frogster interactions with him tells me no way they are aligned.

^But the thing is, if he were scum trying to push an miselim why would he choose the hardest target to read-pivot on

~~

hellbrooks/keeper for last slot of scum.
I lean on hellbrooks a bit here.

*could* point to fire/keeper buddies...

[hellbooks]

Tej do you think there's scum in Magik/Fire or is it TvT

[hellbooks]

Be my guiding light

[hellbooks]

I'm in a similar boat

[hellbooks]

I think tej and fire have scummy things from earlier days and townier things now
I wouldn't say they're partners but I could see one of them being scum and trying to take the reins today

[hellbooks]

I got what I asked for, with a fair response as well..

UNVOTE:

did you think it was a town response

[hellbooks]

uaghhghhhhhhhh

[hellbooks]

Based on votes you two are a hard PoE currently because of the misyeet to lose situation. There is no case.

May the Serpents Kiss bite you firmly on your Bumbo.

i think this is ridiculous and survivalist but maybe town plays like that on MILO. its utterly omgus

[hellbooks]

keeper what is your read on Firebringer

[hellbooks]

scorpious what is your read on tej

[hellbooks]

NM / Fire / Keeper???

i like this the more i think about it

[hellbooks]

I'd rather vote Keeper than Toog

[hellbooks]

keeper what is your read on Firebringer

unless i missed it keeper completely ignored this

[hellbooks]

if magikhorse will vote FB, i want to wagon FB.
otherwise I will vote keeper

[hellbooks]

VOTE: Keeper
Trusting . . . I will be here later too. If this is roleblocker by any chance, you should investigate fb (imo)

[hellbooks]

yeah thats not good

[hellbooks]

I think there are a couple of things that make fire scum plausible.

- trying to grab credit for frog wagon he distanced himself from
- taking the reins on d3 and then vanishing closer to deadline
- saying there was another vig

i know there's a town explanation for these things too but thats basically all scumhunting evidence aside from slips. But i just see a lot of plausible solves in which fire is scumbuddies with the lurkers hes reluctant to vote because there's not enough to go on to commit to them, while he comes up with a weird hoop-jumping theory to justify his push on magik

[hellbooks]

Its honestly morenthan i have to go off on than i have for literally anyone else so

[hellbooks]

yeah thatbwas rly bad

[hellbooks]

Look at my iso recent quote on fire (or see his post at start of d2). Then look at his iso and ctrl frog
Sorry to givenyou assignments but im stuck on phone and working off lf memory(atthe house of my paramour)

[hellbooks]

a no elim isnt rhe end of the world but id rather aboid that so i dont be dead
Not that im being an incredible help now so maybe its Really not the end of the world

[hellbooks]

and here i was thinking radical rat was scum.
i guess im wrong again.

at least my gut on frog was right.

but my point is that you didn't talk about Rat being scum or Frog being scum and you come into today talking about how your gut was right about Frog but you weren't even here while he was getting ran up.

I have no intention in arguing with u cause ur just gonna misrepresent everything i say. Just like you did yesterday.
Just keep calling me scum.

~~

I would take out Magikhorse also form this wagon being scum. Frogster interactions with him tells me no way they are aligned.

^But the thing is, if he were scum trying to push an miselim why would he choose the hardest target to read-pivot on

~~

hellbrooks/keeper for last slot of scum.
I lean on hellbrooks a bit here.

*could* point to fire/keeper buddies...

[hellbooks]

Ok in fact deep within my heart i was like terrified of you being scum

[hellbooks]

MOMO SHOOTING WHO

[hellbooks]

I think ultimately all of the swing, of which there was quite a bit, went our way... Idk if I truly played brilliantly but FB there was in very solid position to deepwolf. If we no elimed I would have shot Keeper which would have resulted in scumwin too, I think, despite me having been utterly fooled by the Scorpious bus.

Me shooting the scumkiller dwlee was just blind luck. Although I would only later appreciate how joker-like it was to just backstab a fellow vig without hesitation on N1. Like there is just almost no scenario where that doesn't collapse to a 1v1 like it did between me and dragons.

And then of course the big climax... when all of the people who knew the secret of my treachery were killed in one fell swoop. That was so electrifying. Total movie moment. I could see it playing out in the theaters before my eyes. I knew Nero would successfully kill Dragons, and I was somewhat convinced of the scum killing Nero because it felt like he tipped his hand with having some hidden knowledge. So I decided to shoot Momo in case the best-case scenario happened, where Dragons's shot would fail and Nero Cain would die. Which of course happened, but little did I know that the truth was even more sinister!

As for the D3 claims, the reason I claimed doctor was because I felt that I had some ammo to back it up and given that Dragons flipped town, I was certain that I needed something big to keep me out of trouble because I thought the town might have caught on to his scumread being mechanical certainty. Ultimately I think given how D3 went in reality I could have weaseled my way out of being the elim without it. Scorpious's cop claim was wild but I was extremely grateful to be able to lock down one partner identity. But good grief!!!! Fb you had me so fooled!!! That was scary...

Anyway, I had a lot of fun. I don't play mafia very often so this was a special experience for me, especially to play in such an immersive, "main character" kind of role... thank you!

[hellbooks]

Not scorpious vote parking firebringer and then going to sleep right before the deadline
that is ice cold