Micro Normal 1104 - Postgame

[JacksonVirgo]

Spoiler: My extremely townie introduction

[JacksonVirgo]

1.00

Votecount 1.00

Not Voting (9):

FancyPants

, KayJayQueue, Overcat, Luka, ceejayvinoya, JacksonVirgo, Eiralox, Umlaut, Hu Tao

With 9 players alive, it takes 5 votes to secure an execution.

The day deadline is in (expired on 2024-04-23 12:49:04).

Guys, this "Not Voting" fella has like NO resistance! What are we even doing?!

[JacksonVirgo]

VOTE: Umlaut
Ty!
Entrance was awkward

Can you elaborate on this?

[JacksonVirgo]

FancyPants / Luka
KayJayQueue
----
CeeJayvinoya

Is this your read list? If so, why omit Umlaut?

[JacksonVirgo]

Smh

[JacksonVirgo]

Not even 2 pages in 8 hours? This is a new experience for me. I’m used to being much more annoying by now.

Let's instead make RVS the most important part of the day instead, the last few hours of the day or even better, ELO itself

[JacksonVirgo]

Being voted as soon as I join my first game. Anxiety inducing. Anyway, I'm going to give a rundown of my aim here:

I played a lot of mafia on non-forum sites, and was pretty good. I want to see to what extent those skills transfer to forum mafia, where you get more information (because people type more before each day ends) but also people have more time to come up with convincing lies (because they have literally hours if they want to to craft each message). So, I'm excited to see how this goes.

I massively prefer playing on a forum for text-based mafia, the other I've played was in discord which is too fast for my personal taste. I hope you enjoy playing here

[JacksonVirgo]

I like overcat so far. Even though they suspiciously chose a dog for an avatar as a cat

their reads reek of TMI but they're new so w/e

What part of what they're saying reeks of TMI?

[JacksonVirgo]

Okay, so, in terms of this question:
@Overcat
Elaborate on what "Effort" Jackson has put in please.

I'll say that questions normally have a question mark on the end, and don't include quotation marks alongside any of the words to indicate deep skepticism. I will answer your question, but you have to remove the quotation marks if you want that.

The next point I'll make is that one of the scumreads I learnt from my experience on mafia websites is that town tend to ask questions and try to ascertain people's reasons for things quite strongly, and scum tend to ask questions but be disinterested in the answers, and are generally asking them in a way that's for social posturing. Luka has indicated they are mafia quite strongly to me in this instance (not definitely, but I'm like 70% sure), as their question wasn't actually a question, and the quotation marks indicated a lack of interest in my answer.

The second point I'll make as a more minor fos is that scum tend to be more interested in the way things 'look' and town tend to be more interested in more definite things. Luka stating that "Them liking the doggy is wolfy /srs", is a social putdown along the lines of 'oh, so you associate with him?' sometimes that valid reasoning, in this case it's not. I don't want to make my post too long, and take up too much of the conversation space, though if anyone's curious I have one more read or two I can out.

Anyway, I normally don't vote and make decisions so early on, but I think this is mafia

VOTE: Luka

I can already tell I'm gonna have a lot of fun playing with you

[JacksonVirgo]

Luka is being quite antagonistic which inherently makes me want to vote them, I don't think they're actually scummy though. This could be overcorrection but I don't think scum!luka would be this aggressive this early. Especially when immediately discounting your words like he had. It's not nice, but I don't think it's scummy

[JacksonVirgo]

Actually no, the TMI comment is wack

VOTE: Luka

[JacksonVirgo]

Luka is being quite antagonistic which inherently makes me want to vote them, I don't think they're actually scummy though. This could be overcorrection but I don't think scum!luka would be this aggressive this early. Especially when immediately discounting your words like he had. It's not nice, but I don't think it's scummy

You’re definitely scum this time. I won’t be fooled by your “towny” posts you dirty liar!

Give innnn

[JacksonVirgo]

Anyway, I'll out some reads that you shouldn't take too seriously because it's been, like, 5 minutes:

I very mildly townread kay. I also very mildly townread Jackson for the effort he has put in so far.

I like overcat so far. Even though they suspiciously chose a dog for an avatar as a cat

their reads reek of TMI but they're new so w/e

What part of what they're saying reeks of TMI?

I was more asking what specific part feels like TMI and why

[JacksonVirgo]

I'll wait for Luka to comment on my questions, but for right now I'm liking Cat and I'm liking Eira (based on that last post). I think FancyPants is a wolf

[JacksonVirgo]

Goodnight everyone

[JacksonVirgo]

VOTE: Umlaut
Ty!
Entrance was awkward

Why? Seems like a joke post like mostly everyone's

It was an akaward joke, nothing more
the reason why theyre not on my reads list @JacksonVirgo is cause I dont really believe in the vote / the slot being wolfy, it was just an early vote to generate discussion and their entrance is the one I liked the least

Back to this, why is ceejay so low?

[JacksonVirgo]

I like overcat so far. Even though they suspiciously chose a dog for an avatar as a cat

their reads reek of TMI but they're new so w/e

What part of what they're saying reeks of TMI?

towning you for effort despite 0 effort being put in from your end

In comparison to everybody else in the game, I did put effort in. The comparison to others (and to the game itself, it was page 1) is the important part, I don't think he was anywhere near town-reading me to a super confident degree hence their wording. I feel TMI is more than a stretch, do you think he's not allowed to state where his reads are?

[JacksonVirgo]

I'll wait for Luka to comment on my questions, but for right now I'm liking Cat and I'm liking Eira (based on that last post). I think FancyPants is a wolf

Why do you think FancyPants is a wolf but you're not voting their, and instead voting me whomst you in your post don't dictate a wolf on? Infact, in one of your earlier posts voting me you never called me wolf either, and you provided reasons to town me in the post before that. What's your gameplan here exactly?

I have a red-check on FancyPants, he is incredibly suspicious but even a red-check isn't strong enough reasoning to vote the INNOCENT CHILD. Silly

[JacksonVirgo]

Back to this, why is ceejay so low?

Not really so low, I just have a gut read on the entrance that felt wolfy.

Can you try and put the gut read into words for me?

[JacksonVirgo]

Infact, in one of your earlier posts voting me you never called me wolf either, and you provided reasons to town me in the post before that. What's your gameplan here exactly?

Gameplan is to pressure and find scum. I think your aggression doesn't likely come from scum but that doesn't mean I don't think other things you're doing isn't scummy.

[JacksonVirgo]

Smh

Spoiler: My extremely townie introduction

Guys, this "Not Voting" fella has like NO resistance! What are we even doing?!

Can you elaborate on this?

Is this your read list? If so, why omit Umlaut?

You asked 2 questions and had 3 other unrelated things, I would hardly classify this as effort. Especially when you contrast it with this post:

Avatar gotten. As for Luka's effort, what they're basically doing is interacting in order to create more information and reads, which I appreciate because it makes my job easier. However, I've seen enough of both town and mafia do that to know it's not particularly towny at this point. You should reserve judgement on Luka for now.

When, to my knowledge; you were doing the exact same thing. It creates a incongruity between the two and inconsistency. Nobody pointing this out and people towning you for reasons beyond me is what I don't like, and Hu Tao's reaction to my FoS wasn't very good either. They jump on the bandwagon to say they don't like my slot, but once again they never directly state a read on it and they aren't even voting their.

You raise a good point here actually, @Cat what's the difference?

[JacksonVirgo]

I have a red-check on FancyPants, he is incredibly suspicious but even a red-check isn't strong enough reasoning to vote the INNOCENT CHILD. Silly

Fun fact, I am stupid.

Ahahaha, I love it

[JacksonVirgo]

VOTE: JacksonVirgo

Its a random RVS vote that I disagree w/ based on content so far, I don't know what it achieves on a strong player like you and cjv isn't a cute name.
Once again though, it's mostly gut; it's a low confidence read.

(I don't know if ceejay knows my range, shhh I want an easier game)

[JacksonVirgo]

Gameplan is to pressure and find scum. I think your aggression doesn't likely come from scum but that doesn't mean I don't think other things you're doing isn't scummy.

And what do you think I'm doing that's exactly scummy? "your aggression doesn't likely come from scum" should theoretically outweigh or mitigate other reads to some extent, in addition to that, I notice this still isn't directly stating a read on me.

UNVOTE:

I was voting you to smooth out the TMI shit, which I want to wait for Overcat to respond to my question before I comment much further on that in particular. Maybe this is a philosophical difference but my aggression read on you is a single argument, I don't care how strong an argument is really. If it's singular, there's a chance it could be NAI with me not knowing how to differentiate it so I want to cover many different bases.

[JacksonVirgo]

I'm not stating a read because I'm not sure where I stand with you rn

[JacksonVirgo]

(I don't know if ceejay knows my range, shhh I want an easier game)

^ This person has a very large scum range! >:3

nuh uh!

[JacksonVirgo]

If we were still in RVS, I’d be voting Luka for calling Jack “Mel” ugh I hate it lol

That's what he knows me by lmao

[JacksonVirgo]

ah, I was looking forward to messing with him

LMFAO same!

[JacksonVirgo]

I feel good about you and Hu Tao so far, as inferred by a prior post. Beyond that Jackson is probably towniest just for effort and the best opening post.

Mel still isn't putting effort in idgi why are people towning them based off of this

Let people townread me goddamn it!!!!

[JacksonVirgo]

In retrospect I don't know if I really like catdog's posting

[JacksonVirgo]

Maybe I'm looking too far into the superiority complex I was getting from him

[JacksonVirgo]

Mel?

Jackson
Sorry

Yeah he just feels chill is all

You town-read me for being chill yet say its because of my effort?

[JacksonVirgo]

Mel?

Jackson
Sorry

Yeah he just feels chill is all

You town-read me for being chill yet say its because of my effort?

You put in a lot of work to appear so chill!

Being chill is a difficult thing!!

[JacksonVirgo]

You town-read me for being chill yet say its because of my effort?

effort = amount of content, engagement with others
chill = your amiable demeanor

When Luka said he was unsure why people were town-reading my effort, you responded to that by saying I was chill. I don't see the connection there, are those two thinks deeply linked to you?

[JacksonVirgo]

Mel?

Jackson
Sorry

Yeah he just feels chill is all

You town-read me for being chill yet say its because of my effort?

This pushback on a townread is +town, a little

Don’t fall for it, this is how he pockets you.

Lmfao, one scum game of mine and your trust for me is forever kablooey

[JacksonVirgo]

When Luka said he was unsure why people were town-reading my effort, you responded to that by saying I was chill. I don't see the connection there, are those two thinks deeply linked to you?

It was just a casual "Jackson's chill m8" >.>

Mmmm, I see

[JacksonVirgo]

On a side note, Eiralox is so transparently wolfy its killing me so they're like, >rand town

Eh, he’s a little aggressive but could just be trying to move the game forward. We shall see.

You're seeing them as aggressive?

[JacksonVirgo]

2/10 in townieness. Not very high on my to yeet list yet.

VOTE: Jacksonvirgo

What happened between these two parts

[JacksonVirgo]

I'll wait for Luka to comment on my questions, but for right now I'm liking Cat and I'm liking Eira (based on that last post). I think FancyPants is a wolf

How can u not like Luka. This is just blasphemy
ur right about my slot alignment at least

Because just like he's the person who knows my scumrange the best, I know his so I'm naturally cautious

[JacksonVirgo]

jackson asking me that question feels pretty weird as well.
i mean i did sort of naked vote but it still seems weird to ask

You naked voted, I was curious why. Hence my asking

[JacksonVirgo]

yeah thats why i said "well it was a naked vote"
but if i was in ur shoes i wouldn't be asking that at all. I would just go good vote or something.
why would u care what thoughts i have on ur slot are

Well, turns out. I'm not you

[JacksonVirgo]

I care because I'd rather be on the same page with someone I know is town and is not manipulating me

[JacksonVirgo]

Eh

[JacksonVirgo]

yeah thats why i said "well it was a naked vote"
but if i was in ur shoes i wouldn't be asking that at all. I would just go good vote or something.
why would u care what thoughts i have on ur slot are

Well, turns out. I'm not you

Is this a blessing or a curse.

ill go with blessing for now, congrats

How could you be unique if I was you, of course it's a blessing

[JacksonVirgo]

I have CJ slot (so that would be humaneatingmonkey), Luka, Umalot as all p strong town. With Fancy being confirmed town, I only have 1 slot left to enter my town pool.

I still have those two scumreads but they are about to not matter soon.

Can I ask for your reasonings for all of these?

[JacksonVirgo]

the reason why theyre not on my reads list @JacksonVirgo is cause I dont really believe in the vote / the slot being wolfy, it was just an early vote to generate discussion and their entrance is the one I liked the least

Did you get much from this? If anything, can I ask what?

[JacksonVirgo]

Me when I forget a mafia game is ongoing then remember its MS so need no fear!
I love this sites cycles istg..

What does this mean? lol

MS cycle lenght is lovely

It's so convenient! I can take my time with things, it's lovely

[JacksonVirgo]

Although I'm serious about my Luka read and I will monitor that slot carefully throughout the game.

Can you elaborate on this? If you already have and I forgot, forgive me as I will see it soon

[JacksonVirgo]

My random rambles is brought to you by my sponsor, "new song I just found and have playing on repeat"

Spoiler:

[JacksonVirgo]

Only actual read I have is cat town here

No updated stance on Luka after all your interactions?

[JacksonVirgo]

Spoiler: A few small shower thoughts, no biggie

KayJayQueue

Spoiler:

I really like Kay's entrance (9), to me it shows that she's not stiff going into a game with town JV. I know how highly she thinks of my play so her not being stiff shows a lot, this is shown especially paired with 28, where she is showing "aggression" towards me for a recently closed game where I was wolf in.

31 and 45 both inherently give me a little pause, but upon thinking a bit deeper I think these are natural posts to come from her given how she's treated RVS in all the games I've played with her in so far.

I don't think wolf!kay votes without reason, her 54 shows that she is

still

loose socially, I don't feel she'd vote for a non-serious reason especially given that the game "skipped RVS" according to her own words, so she isn't hiding behind RVS either.

143 is the first post I really don't like, while what she said was factually true (she works god awful hours on weekends), dropping this feels awfully defensive when typically she has been fairly loose and relaxed this entire game so far but I do know she gets defensive so this is going to be a "back of my head" thought for a while.

272 is Kay's first content"ful" post, at #30 in their ISO. This is concerning to me that I was town-reading somebody this far into the game without any semblance of content so I'm somewhat concerned what I'm reading into is her as a person (very possible) or she's directly appealing to me directly or otherwise. The first contentful post of hers is also incredibly withdrawn, it feels like it's trying to negate Luka's townread of Eiralox to keep the wagon in its place without trying to push it actively herself. Although she says that she meant to be talking about Umlaut which, if true, would remove this fear of mine so maybe I'm trying to justify a rogue feeling of paranoia that started forming midway through reading the game.

Spoiler: Possible Pocket Attempts (5)

Behold, I doth void my bladder and expel feces hither and thither without constraint.

I really appreciate that, although the same in spirit, you change up the vocabulary in your entrance post (:

2. Toxic and harmful behaviour will not be tolerated. This includes, but is not limited to:
- flaming, insulting, or directing personal attacks at other players
- use of slurs or derogatory language
- spamming
- excessive AtE
- excessive discussion of real life issues (a mention is fine, but please don't derail the game or use this thread as a place to vent)
- otherwise being a jerk or making the game unenjoyable for others

I was planning on using slurs and derogatory language, but I will respect the rule henceforth.

Okay you take the bad language, I’ll do the excessive AtE. (I know, I know, totally out of character for me)

I’m seeing a back-to-back vote on my declared townread on page 5 and that is no bueno.

That’s okay just get a new townread. I’m available!

And no, it’s not Hu Tao.

It’s me!

Hu Tao hasn’t tried to pocket me nearly enough for my liking. This is sus behavior.

And neither has Jack. I hate this timeline.


Hu/Jack scum team and my entire world would shatter.

As of page 14, I think Kay is town. I think they need to start posting more content or this will start to slip off as the primary driver of this read is her behaviour more than content which arguably is probably stronger to use in the early game but I do want to hear more from her.

GuyInFreezer

Spoiler:

Spoiler: Overcat

Their opening (32) seems pretty decent to me, their acclamation that a vote them was inducing anxiety is townie as it shows that he's not afraid to express negative thoughts/feelings about people "pushing" him. I'm cautious reading into anything else in this post as it insinuates a townie mindset but given how much he's posted proving he "knows his stuff" I'm sure this is extremely capable of being faked to a certain degree.

I inherently like 33 but I am unsure if that's much beyond having the same read on Kay that I do, the town-read on mine also feels good so I'm sure that's also influencing it. I don't usually like to look into the timing of posts but 7 minutes to write up this post when nothing happened between, and he acknowledged reading the thread is an interesting thing to note as he appears to be very headstrong, but this to me seems to hint he was waiting on people to start carrying the game beyond him which doesn't really fully line up to me.

At the time of reading 36 naturally, I did town-read this like most others (that I recall commenting on this) did but is this really saying much? Paired with the fact they were town-reading me for asking questions, and scum-reading Luka for asking questions. I don't really see how our questions are all that different, which I know is what they went to me and asked me later for but even reading this back I'm not sure I see this. Reserving judgement on Luka specifically is a weird line to draw, this is essentially saying "I don't think we should be reading Luka because what they did could come from either alignment" which is incredibly silly. I may update my thoughts on this as I read their ISO further, if so I'll try to refer back to this but if you use your noggin' you should be able to know what I'm referring to if I forget.

52 I really like how they're not taking the explicit shading from Luka here, although given what input they've shown this is likely to come from their character more than anything to do with their alignment but I do think Luka/Overcat aren't both wolves at the very least. (also writing this, I see a thread of reading me by my effort with overcat and now Eiralox, with Luka being the main push against that. If I remember I will do some more thinking about this interaction on its own soon, if I forget and you're reading this please remind me).

Their first point feels almost entirely like padding to make their argument seem stronger, there is no reasonable way he's attributing this read to town-read me, and scum-read Luka when I personally do not remember doing much with any question I've asked thus far in a public manner. I've internalised the responses but did not act upon them, yet he's using this argument to scum-read Luka. The second point I feel is what they actually have on Luka that they wanted padded, they say that X thing is scummy and that Y thing is townie. Their definition of what Y is was incredibly weak so I don't feel that Y was thought out

at all

and just wanted the comparison apparent, to push it. They also say that X can sometimes valid, but this time it isn't without clarifying why on either end of this. What he did do was give an excuse to not complete his thought by "this post is too long". I wish I had this view back when he was still in the game, because then I could have asked him to clarify further.

His confidence about a Luka vote in 73 seems to be a little misplaced as he's done many things to insinuate he could be wrong (not explicitly, but he's posted shit like "I normally dont vote and make decisions early on but I think this is mafia" and also making his point but adding a "sometimes this is valid reasoning", but this confidence does not seem to fit with that. He seems to be unintentionally showing his lack of confidence yet saying he is.

He also tried shutting down my Eiralox read in that same post (73) that they weren't showing emotional investment or taken a firm stance even though they shown and expressed a townread on Kay who inarguably is the exact same. I feel this is trying to control the gamestate more than genuine discourse between towns. He isn't using any arguments for anybody, Umlaut called this out (which immediately gives him huge townpoints).

122 I really want to know what type of questions they're considering one way or the other. Because reading this back now I do think I recall Luka acting more politician-like, especially given the question framed to Overcat that had the quotations in it. Felt like positioning more than a genuine question but I don't think Luka acted predominantly like that, I'll have to check when I get back through his ISO.

125 circles back to their post which I called out the comparison between Kay and Eiralox which actually voids that point of mine as this shows his standards is consistent which is a good +town.

I also like how they attempted to get on my level and make sure I understand where his read is coming from in 136 which I don't think scum would likely do with somebody who seemed to otherwise reject that part of their argument.

Generally, I feel this slot is town by the consistency and behaviour surrounding me in particular (disregarding GIF, who I am ISOing next). The one thing I actively dislike is them making some arguments without doing anything but flapping his mouth which i would like to add that Umlaut looks extremely good for catching and calling out in realtime which I will take note of, especially for if Overcat's slot flips red.

Spoiler: GuyInFreezer

159 is a great "first" post, as I tend to agree with them. If you do read this GIF, can you elaborate as to why you town-read them (especially this post) as I want to know if it's for the same reason that I am.

171 & 172 I like quite a lot, explicitly in combination with one another. I don't see a direct reason scum would delay revealing information, if not to see what happens and form their thoughts later but 172 shows they've got some thought as to who they're thinking so ruling out Hu Tao doesn't seem like a super useful thing for scum to do (if 171's intent was to delay giving their thoughts) and thus not generally something they'd

think

of doing. So unless this is an attempt to mimic their town meta, I really like these posts.

Reached 279 and they haven't explained a single one of these thoughts yet, so I'm gonna ask them in thread and come back to this later but stating here that I am wanting this resolved pretty urgently. Especially as through this I've got Umlaut as a town without even getting to their ISO left so I'm curious if it's the same thing that I've stated already or if it's something new. Same with the CJ read they commented on (read up).

That's all they've got so far. I'm pretty confident to put them as a town-lean but they're closer to a full town-read. I just want my questions resolved before I can feel comfortable moving them up.

Luka

Spoiler:

12 inherently agreeing with a read I initially had made so that's a good start to get into my good graces early for very cheap

I still don't like how they voted Umlaut (15) but hadn't placed them in their readlist at all (20), if they wanted to get something of substance from it (as stated in 24) I feel they'd commit to it a bit longer than they did but it's been dropped without almost any time in between (5 total posts later, and it's their direct next post) so I'll ask them directly and hope they respond before I finish writing this post. I can't really get the taste of this out of my mouth.

33 and 43 are the posts that I believe Overcat is referring to when they're saying they're asking questions like a politician, and honestly I feel their assessment of those questions is lacklustre as it's clear Luka is asking because they're rejecting the concept and wants confirmation that Overcat's words are truly thought out. Luka's mindset can be corroborated with 42 where they directly think Overcat's thoughts are TMI. The link between Luka's posts exists and their mindset isn't asking questions in the same way I was asking them, it was almost entirely a different way but not a manipulative way.

83 I guess it's worth asking you what you consider effort? You were/are under the belief I put in little effort (you explictly said 0 here but I know I did) yet Eiralox and Overcat both considered me having to. Do you genuinely feel I've done nothing and these people are fake or seeing something that isn't there, or do you just have a different definition of it?

85 reading back I don't think you were being mean either, a little combative/aggressive but that's normal and not an issue. I don't know why I was seeing what you were doing as not nice. I also don't see how the read by the doggy was all that bad, I think all three of us were on a very different wavelength and I'd like to get on the same one (at least us both as doggy is gone now).

What's your gameplan here exactly?

Gauge things first, analyse it deeper later and express it after that.

228 "Mel still isn't putting effort in idgi why are people towning them based off of this" awaiting your response to my above question because I'm fairly sure we're on the wrong footing with this type of thing. Or maybe it's because I've been reluctant to make a stance on too many people (accidentally as I was meaning to think more and write this up, so me not making a strong stance was a direct consequence of the gameplan I was coming into this game with).

You made the same assessment about twtbw Eira in 236 as you did in 211. Did you come to this conclusion twice individually, or awkwardly rehashing the same read to make a point?

Appending to that above paragraph, you did also in 270 which you used "on a side note" insinuating this is the first time you're saying this (it was not even the second lul)

Overall, town-lean but cautious because I know how good you can be (even though every time I tell you, you seem to deny it)

humaneatingmonkey

Spoiler:

Spoiler: ceejayvinoya

As I said in GIF's ISO-dive, I really like ceejay's 46. I don't think scum!ceejay would go against the grain like this, especially on somebody as vocal and combative as Luka.

117 is also a really good post (at least on the surface) as it seems they're genuinely trying to understand Eira but at the same time that last question does seem like it's a pretty high chance if they're scum this is just for positioning, I'll have to see if they follow up with this.

They didn't follow up with it, and they replaced out so I won't get the chance to ask more about it. They feel very laid back and calm this game, but they've been reluctant to make a stance on somebody. They did make one on Kay but it took three posts to do it and it was pretty substantially vague reasoning. Their entrance was strong but it died down.

Spoiler: humaneatingmonkey

Ignoring 156 which I'm not convinced is a genuine read, a lot of their posts until 18 posts into the ISO were pretty lightweight so not much to comment on but 201 feels like a genuine post. I'm not sure much can be discerned from it because I'm sure he's capable of seeing a shitty push on his slot and calling it out as a wolf.

Additionally, I think their vote in 223 is perfectly justified. Confirmation that the Luka read was genuine is interesting too, I missed that the first time around. Can you elaborate on that somewhat? Actually as I'm writing this I feel I should quote reply it instead of asking it twenty bajillion words into a post.

I feel their vote (placed to get answers) and their 238 has strong progression, I feel it's somewhat a tunnel (regardless of accuracy) and I don't recall a single stated read (outside of Luka) let alone explanations so this could be opportunistic voting by scum.

243 is actually a really interesting catch that I don't recall reading a response to in his ISO. Let me double check that.

They did respond but that was pretty lacklustre, no wonder I overlooked it. I don't see why HEM wouldn't respond back to this, is there a reason for this?

This slot is by far the hardest to place for me, there isn't much they have and HEM is inarguably a difficult person for me to read so this is gonna be fun.

Eiralox

Spoiler:

Personal dislike for cat wallpost

Oh boy, here we go.

This post feels like it's full of content but it really contains nothing but them stating a dislike for wallposts which they admit is more of an emotional response. I like them settling for a slow game but why write this whole post saying nothing just to say you want to take things slow?

Not explaining the ceejay read even when they voted, asked (responded later), unvoted and then responded to the question asking what the read was from, they seriously just dodged the question entirely. They've been incredibly sidelined up to this point, not making any stance and not committing to the one they did make. I didn't realise how little they did until seeing it in an ISO.

191 what an insane stance to make. The burden of proof is initially on the accuser. Innocent until proven guilty and all that. You expecting to naked vote and expect somebody to defend that is literally insane. You can't honestly believe that? In this interaction between HEM and Eiralox, Eiralox looks awful. Why didn't I see this reading it in realtime?

I know I responded to 256 and relevant posts in that string of conversation, but I really don't like how they reacted to this all. They say the town-read is because of my effort, walk it back and say it's predominately me being chill, I ask for elaboration and they say the two reads are seperate, I call that out and then they throw effort/chill into the same bucket again. This feels like textbook defensive behaviour, I do not like this slot.

Umlaut

Spoiler:

I like the transparency in 76 that would otherwise be an ignored push (based on RVS, and my assumption of Umlaut's skill level). Them being transparent about what their mindset was behind the post being "called out" is pretty substantially +town in my eyes.

112 is a strong post. They had the same thoughts about Overcats 32 that I did, though they're assuming they're newb scum which they are very clearly not new to mafia as a whole so that part I would adamantly disagree on. Responding to Luka's claim of TMI sounds good to me as well, I do not remember if this was before or after I commented on it but it doesn't matter as this isn't really a revolutionary idea to call out but I do like it. Ending on a ceejay vote seems decent to me as well.

120 I like how he calls out Overcat for lacking a persuasive force, I think this was more him not pushing him for not having an argument but genuinely telling him what he's doing doesn't hold weight. Which is what I caught too, but we are seemingly having different insight into what it actually means. Which to me is an even better sign than me retrospectively having the same read, he isn't abusing the fact it otherwise looks pretty bad.

Calling out Kay for seeing Eiralax for what they're not is good, they even put the effort in to come with receipts (275) is also a good look, but for this post in particular I think I'm combining me liking the effort more than anything town but who gives a shit, this is townie as far as I care

Hu Tao

Spoiler:

38 (and 39) they seem to be TRing both OC and Kay which is a good sign to me as those are the reads I came to, which writing this and recalling the amount of times I've stated this exact thing in the past is making me painfully aware that this is probably a really stupid reason to town-read somebody early on. Eh, whatever

53 is a good look. It's inherently not jumping to a conclusion which I feel scum!tao would be doing here. They're actively trying to reach out and get on the same level as Luka albeit the "or trying to force a bad read" is quite antagonistic so that post depending on how it was intended could also be read poorly but I'm an opportunist. I feel if scum wanted to shade them, they wouldn't have reached out an olive branch first. Actually... their next post insinuates I am wrong, so I'll check the context that they're in now.

They didn't wait for a response and decided to assume it was in bad faith. Not sure how much I like that, but they did still state they're waiting for the response (and adds another question). Maybe I'm misunderstanding where her head is at.

99 (and ig 108) following up on the misunderstanding and updating is actually a good look. They didn't remove their vote so I'm not understanding their position at this point in the game so I'm hoping that comes clear soon. I know they pivoted eventually but I forget the context for that.

Nvm in the next post they show intent to move vote.

I like this slot for now, but I want them to have more stances overall. They feel like they're almost playing it safe so I definitely want to pick her brain more.

[JacksonVirgo]

Spoiler: Made this cool table, it looks pretty

LT	Firebringer
TR	KayJayQueue, Umlaut
TL	GuyInFreezer, Luka, Hu Tao
NR	-
SL	humaneatingmonkey
SR	Eiralox

VOTE: Eiralox

[JacksonVirgo]

I wonder if anybody quoted in that post got the notif for it lmfao. Let me know, I'm curious if they show under spoilers

[JacksonVirgo]

Like that seems way too confident of a GIF post to make as town

Seems pretty in line with what I'm used to them having (sample size: one game)

[JacksonVirgo]

I feel I got a lot out of 14 pages, so I'm pretty happy with this vote. I'm off to try and sleep, tried before and failed

[JacksonVirgo]

(I don't recommend doing it yourself, fuck that was exhausting)

[JacksonVirgo]

Although I'm serious about my Luka read and I will monitor that slot carefully throughout the game.

Can you elaborate on this? If you already have and I forgot, forgive me as I will see it soon

You didn't, so can I have this?

[JacksonVirgo]

There's a few parts that in retrospect I feel was a bit shitty of me to consider (most notably the time-part with Overcat) but I did, oh well. Usually I curate my thoughts before sending them

[JacksonVirgo]

I do gotta say though, I really like how Eiralox articulates themselves, super fun. Just popping in to say I appreciate you, made me look up a word or two I am going to try using lel

[JacksonVirgo]

And no, it's not "onus"

[JacksonVirgo]

Spoiler: Here's another song, ignore that it has the COMPLETE opposite vibe. I really mean opposite

[JacksonVirgo]

I went back over the ISO's and did a second runthrough, this is what I've got so far

Spoiler:

Fuck that, gif time babyyy

[JacksonVirgo]

I needed a wind-down after all that effort lmfao. This was fun, alright sleep time properly now. I got like uh~ 2 hours until I gotta be up

[JacksonVirgo]

I hope to wake to nobody ever doing anything with what I did

[JacksonVirgo]

I distinctly remember them putting FancyPants as strong town

I will check this

[JacksonVirgo]

FancyPants / Luka
KayJayQueue
----
CeeJayvinoya

I'll wait for Luka to comment on my questions, but for right now I'm liking Cat and I'm liking Eira (based on that last post). I think FancyPants is a wolf

Why do you think FancyPants is a wolf but you're not voting their, and instead voting me whomst you in your post don't dictate a wolf on? Infact, in one of your earlier posts voting me you never called me wolf either, and you provided reasons to town me in the post before that. What's your gameplan here exactly?

Oh you're right. Do you think this comes from a wolf more than it comes from a town just overlooking it?

[JacksonVirgo]

Oh you're right. Do you think this comes from a wolf more than it comes from a town just overlooking it?

How can you overlook something that you already have been informed by? If you're working on a solve, you should have internalized it at that point - and even before grilling someone else about it. It's still possible they did, but I think it leans scum.

I was gonna comment further but I'm going to wait for Luka to respond personally before adding more

[JacksonVirgo]

That feels like you're starting to position yourself against me

[JacksonVirgo]

That's also a weird post to quote to comment your reads on. Could very well be conf-bias, but it really feels almost exactly like you realise you can't OMGUS vote me without looking bad, so you're easing your way into it. Had to squeeze it somewhere so you commented on a post (in a sequence of votes) that is pushing me somewhat.

I'll need external feedback on this as I'm very aware I tend to tunnel.

[JacksonVirgo]

That feels like you're starting to position yourself against me

I am yes because you're voting me and not monkey.

You objectively look worse, much worse

[JacksonVirgo]

If you say so love

I do say so, I explained as much in my ISO-dive

[JacksonVirgo]

Didn't you say to HEM it was his responsibility to defend against nothing but a naked vote? Where's your defense here?

[JacksonVirgo]

That was a little sassy, but I couldn't help myself

[JacksonVirgo]

before I've even drunk my monster

Which flavour? I may unvote if you pick correctly

[JacksonVirgo]

Wait, you were trying to position yourself against me without even knowing what my case even was?

[JacksonVirgo]

before I've even drunk my monster

Which flavour? I may unvote if you pick correctly

It's pacific punch but I prefer mariposa or watermelon. aussie lemonade is okay.

Pacific punch is good. Why tf haven’t I heard of aussie lemonade when Im a gosh darn tootin aussie.

[JacksonVirgo]

Not as such, real talk my vote will probably be very static today and not touch you at all, but you hurt my feelings so much by voting me after seeming to like me earlier that I feel I JUST have to form a towncore with Luka, Umlaut and KayJay, who all seem such splendid folk.

I don’t mean to hurt your feelings, I do feel you’re the most likely to flip wolf out of everybody, a lot of that is your lack of making any proper stances against people. You make them but there’s no weight behind it.

Do you feel the need to make a towncore just based from my recent vote on you? Or am I misunderstanding that?

[JacksonVirgo]

Spoiler: A few small shower thoughts, no biggie

KayJayQueue

Spoiler:

I really like Kay's entrance (9), to me it shows that she's not stiff going into a game with town JV. I know how highly she thinks of my play so her not being stiff shows a lot, this is shown especially paired with 28, where she is showing "aggression" towards me for a recently closed game where I was wolf in.

31 and 45 both inherently give me a little pause, but upon thinking a bit deeper I think these are natural posts to come from her given how she's treated RVS in all the games I've played with her in so far.

I don't think wolf!kay votes without reason, her 54 shows that she is

still

loose socially, I don't feel she'd vote for a non-serious reason especially given that the game "skipped RVS" according to her own words, so she isn't hiding behind RVS either.

143 is the first post I really don't like, while what she said was factually true (she works god awful hours on weekends), dropping this feels awfully defensive when typically she has been fairly loose and relaxed this entire game so far but I do know she gets defensive so this is going to be a "back of my head" thought for a while.

272 is Kay's first content"ful" post, at #30 in their ISO. This is concerning to me that I was town-reading somebody this far into the game without any semblance of content so I'm somewhat concerned what I'm reading into is her as a person (very possible) or she's directly appealing to me directly or otherwise. The first contentful post of hers is also incredibly withdrawn, it feels like it's trying to negate Luka's townread of Eiralox to keep the wagon in its place without trying to push it actively herself. Although she says that she meant to be talking about Umlaut which, if true, would remove this fear of mine so maybe I'm trying to justify a rogue feeling of paranoia that started forming midway through reading the game.

Spoiler: Possible Pocket Attempts (5)

Behold, I doth void my bladder and expel feces hither and thither without constraint.

I really appreciate that, although the same in spirit, you change up the vocabulary in your entrance post (:

2. Toxic and harmful behaviour will not be tolerated. This includes, but is not limited to:
- flaming, insulting, or directing personal attacks at other players
- use of slurs or derogatory language
- spamming
- excessive AtE
- excessive discussion of real life issues (a mention is fine, but please don't derail the game or use this thread as a place to vent)
- otherwise being a jerk or making the game unenjoyable for others

I was planning on using slurs and derogatory language, but I will respect the rule henceforth.

Okay you take the bad language, I’ll do the excessive AtE. (I know, I know, totally out of character for me)

I’m seeing a back-to-back vote on my declared townread on page 5 and that is no bueno.

That’s okay just get a new townread. I’m available!

And no, it’s not Hu Tao.

It’s me!

Hu Tao hasn’t tried to pocket me nearly enough for my liking. This is sus behavior.

And neither has Jack. I hate this timeline.


Hu/Jack scum team and my entire world would shatter.

As of page 14, I think Kay is town. I think they need to start posting more content or this will start to slip off as the primary driver of this read is her behaviour more than content which arguably is probably stronger to use in the early game but I do want to hear more from her.

GuyInFreezer

Spoiler:

Spoiler: Overcat

Their opening (32) seems pretty decent to me, their acclamation that a vote them was inducing anxiety is townie as it shows that he's not afraid to express negative thoughts/feelings about people "pushing" him. I'm cautious reading into anything else in this post as it insinuates a townie mindset but given how much he's posted proving he "knows his stuff" I'm sure this is extremely capable of being faked to a certain degree.

I inherently like 33 but I am unsure if that's much beyond having the same read on Kay that I do, the town-read on mine also feels good so I'm sure that's also influencing it. I don't usually like to look into the timing of posts but 7 minutes to write up this post when nothing happened between, and he acknowledged reading the thread is an interesting thing to note as he appears to be very headstrong, but this to me seems to hint he was waiting on people to start carrying the game beyond him which doesn't really fully line up to me.

At the time of reading 36 naturally, I did town-read this like most others (that I recall commenting on this) did but is this really saying much? Paired with the fact they were town-reading me for asking questions, and scum-reading Luka for asking questions. I don't really see how our questions are all that different, which I know is what they went to me and asked me later for but even reading this back I'm not sure I see this. Reserving judgement on Luka specifically is a weird line to draw, this is essentially saying "I don't think we should be reading Luka because what they did could come from either alignment" which is incredibly silly. I may update my thoughts on this as I read their ISO further, if so I'll try to refer back to this but if you use your noggin' you should be able to know what I'm referring to if I forget.

52 I really like how they're not taking the explicit shading from Luka here, although given what input they've shown this is likely to come from their character more than anything to do with their alignment but I do think Luka/Overcat aren't both wolves at the very least. (also writing this, I see a thread of reading me by my effort with overcat and now Eiralox, with Luka being the main push against that. If I remember I will do some more thinking about this interaction on its own soon, if I forget and you're reading this please remind me).

Their first point feels almost entirely like padding to make their argument seem stronger, there is no reasonable way he's attributing this read to town-read me, and scum-read Luka when I personally do not remember doing much with any question I've asked thus far in a public manner. I've internalised the responses but did not act upon them, yet he's using this argument to scum-read Luka. The second point I feel is what they actually have on Luka that they wanted padded, they say that X thing is scummy and that Y thing is townie. Their definition of what Y is was incredibly weak so I don't feel that Y was thought out

at all

and just wanted the comparison apparent, to push it. They also say that X can sometimes valid, but this time it isn't without clarifying why on either end of this. What he did do was give an excuse to not complete his thought by "this post is too long". I wish I had this view back when he was still in the game, because then I could have asked him to clarify further.

His confidence about a Luka vote in 73 seems to be a little misplaced as he's done many things to insinuate he could be wrong (not explicitly, but he's posted shit like "I normally dont vote and make decisions early on but I think this is mafia" and also making his point but adding a "sometimes this is valid reasoning", but this confidence does not seem to fit with that. He seems to be unintentionally showing his lack of confidence yet saying he is.

He also tried shutting down my Eiralox read in that same post (73) that they weren't showing emotional investment or taken a firm stance even though they shown and expressed a townread on Kay who inarguably is the exact same. I feel this is trying to control the gamestate more than genuine discourse between towns. He isn't using any arguments for anybody, Umlaut called this out (which immediately gives him huge townpoints).

122 I really want to know what type of questions they're considering one way or the other. Because reading this back now I do think I recall Luka acting more politician-like, especially given the question framed to Overcat that had the quotations in it. Felt like positioning more than a genuine question but I don't think Luka acted predominantly like that, I'll have to check when I get back through his ISO.

125 circles back to their post which I called out the comparison between Kay and Eiralox which actually voids that point of mine as this shows his standards is consistent which is a good +town.

I also like how they attempted to get on my level and make sure I understand where his read is coming from in 136 which I don't think scum would likely do with somebody who seemed to otherwise reject that part of their argument.

Generally, I feel this slot is town by the consistency and behaviour surrounding me in particular (disregarding GIF, who I am ISOing next). The one thing I actively dislike is them making some arguments without doing anything but flapping his mouth which i would like to add that Umlaut looks extremely good for catching and calling out in realtime which I will take note of, especially for if Overcat's slot flips red.

Spoiler: GuyInFreezer

159 is a great "first" post, as I tend to agree with them. If you do read this GIF, can you elaborate as to why you town-read them (especially this post) as I want to know if it's for the same reason that I am.

171 & 172 I like quite a lot, explicitly in combination with one another. I don't see a direct reason scum would delay revealing information, if not to see what happens and form their thoughts later but 172 shows they've got some thought as to who they're thinking so ruling out Hu Tao doesn't seem like a super useful thing for scum to do (if 171's intent was to delay giving their thoughts) and thus not generally something they'd

think

of doing. So unless this is an attempt to mimic their town meta, I really like these posts.

Reached 279 and they haven't explained a single one of these thoughts yet, so I'm gonna ask them in thread and come back to this later but stating here that I am wanting this resolved pretty urgently. Especially as through this I've got Umlaut as a town without even getting to their ISO left so I'm curious if it's the same thing that I've stated already or if it's something new. Same with the CJ read they commented on (read up).

That's all they've got so far. I'm pretty confident to put them as a town-lean but they're closer to a full town-read. I just want my questions resolved before I can feel comfortable moving them up.

Luka

Spoiler:

12 inherently agreeing with a read I initially had made so that's a good start to get into my good graces early for very cheap

I still don't like how they voted Umlaut (15) but hadn't placed them in their readlist at all (20), if they wanted to get something of substance from it (as stated in 24) I feel they'd commit to it a bit longer than they did but it's been dropped without almost any time in between (5 total posts later, and it's their direct next post) so I'll ask them directly and hope they respond before I finish writing this post. I can't really get the taste of this out of my mouth.

33 and 43 are the posts that I believe Overcat is referring to when they're saying they're asking questions like a politician, and honestly I feel their assessment of those questions is lacklustre as it's clear Luka is asking because they're rejecting the concept and wants confirmation that Overcat's words are truly thought out. Luka's mindset can be corroborated with 42 where they directly think Overcat's thoughts are TMI. The link between Luka's posts exists and their mindset isn't asking questions in the same way I was asking them, it was almost entirely a different way but not a manipulative way.

83 I guess it's worth asking you what you consider effort? You were/are under the belief I put in little effort (you explictly said 0 here but I know I did) yet Eiralox and Overcat both considered me having to. Do you genuinely feel I've done nothing and these people are fake or seeing something that isn't there, or do you just have a different definition of it?

85 reading back I don't think you were being mean either, a little combative/aggressive but that's normal and not an issue. I don't know why I was seeing what you were doing as not nice. I also don't see how the read by the doggy was all that bad, I think all three of us were on a very different wavelength and I'd like to get on the same one (at least us both as doggy is gone now).

What's your gameplan here exactly?

Gauge things first, analyse it deeper later and express it after that.

228 "Mel still isn't putting effort in idgi why are people towning them based off of this" awaiting your response to my above question because I'm fairly sure we're on the wrong footing with this type of thing. Or maybe it's because I've been reluctant to make a stance on too many people (accidentally as I was meaning to think more and write this up, so me not making a strong stance was a direct consequence of the gameplan I was coming into this game with).

You made the same assessment about twtbw Eira in 236 as you did in 211. Did you come to this conclusion twice individually, or awkwardly rehashing the same read to make a point?

Appending to that above paragraph, you did also in 270 which you used "on a side note" insinuating this is the first time you're saying this (it was not even the second lul)

Overall, town-lean but cautious because I know how good you can be (even though every time I tell you, you seem to deny it)

humaneatingmonkey

Spoiler:

Spoiler: ceejayvinoya

As I said in GIF's ISO-dive, I really like ceejay's 46. I don't think scum!ceejay would go against the grain like this, especially on somebody as vocal and combative as Luka.

117 is also a really good post (at least on the surface) as it seems they're genuinely trying to understand Eira but at the same time that last question does seem like it's a pretty high chance if they're scum this is just for positioning, I'll have to see if they follow up with this.

They didn't follow up with it, and they replaced out so I won't get the chance to ask more about it. They feel very laid back and calm this game, but they've been reluctant to make a stance on somebody. They did make one on Kay but it took three posts to do it and it was pretty substantially vague reasoning. Their entrance was strong but it died down.

Spoiler: humaneatingmonkey

Ignoring 156 which I'm not convinced is a genuine read, a lot of their posts until 18 posts into the ISO were pretty lightweight so not much to comment on but 201 feels like a genuine post. I'm not sure much can be discerned from it because I'm sure he's capable of seeing a shitty push on his slot and calling it out as a wolf.

Additionally, I think their vote in 223 is perfectly justified. Confirmation that the Luka read was genuine is interesting too, I missed that the first time around. Can you elaborate on that somewhat? Actually as I'm writing this I feel I should quote reply it instead of asking it twenty bajillion words into a post.

I feel their vote (placed to get answers) and their 238 has strong progression, I feel it's somewhat a tunnel (regardless of accuracy) and I don't recall a single stated read (outside of Luka) let alone explanations so this could be opportunistic voting by scum.

243 is actually a really interesting catch that I don't recall reading a response to in his ISO. Let me double check that.

They did respond but that was pretty lacklustre, no wonder I overlooked it. I don't see why HEM wouldn't respond back to this, is there a reason for this?

This slot is by far the hardest to place for me, there isn't much they have and HEM is inarguably a difficult person for me to read so this is gonna be fun.

Eiralox

Spoiler:

Personal dislike for cat wallpost

Oh boy, here we go.

This post feels like it's full of content but it really contains nothing but them stating a dislike for wallposts which they admit is more of an emotional response. I like them settling for a slow game but why write this whole post saying nothing just to say you want to take things slow?

Not explaining the ceejay read even when they voted, asked (responded later), unvoted and then responded to the question asking what the read was from, they seriously just dodged the question entirely. They've been incredibly sidelined up to this point, not making any stance and not committing to the one they did make. I didn't realise how little they did until seeing it in an ISO.

191 what an insane stance to make. The burden of proof is initially on the accuser. Innocent until proven guilty and all that. You expecting to naked vote and expect somebody to defend that is literally insane. You can't honestly believe that? In this interaction between HEM and Eiralox, Eiralox looks awful. Why didn't I see this reading it in realtime?

I know I responded to 256 and relevant posts in that string of conversation, but I really don't like how they reacted to this all. They say the town-read is because of my effort, walk it back and say it's predominately me being chill, I ask for elaboration and they say the two reads are seperate, I call that out and then they throw effort/chill into the same bucket again. This feels like textbook defensive behaviour, I do not like this slot.

Umlaut

Spoiler:

I like the transparency in 76 that would otherwise be an ignored push (based on RVS, and my assumption of Umlaut's skill level). Them being transparent about what their mindset was behind the post being "called out" is pretty substantially +town in my eyes.

112 is a strong post. They had the same thoughts about Overcats 32 that I did, though they're assuming they're newb scum which they are very clearly not new to mafia as a whole so that part I would adamantly disagree on. Responding to Luka's claim of TMI sounds good to me as well, I do not remember if this was before or after I commented on it but it doesn't matter as this isn't really a revolutionary idea to call out but I do like it. Ending on a ceejay vote seems decent to me as well.

120 I like how he calls out Overcat for lacking a persuasive force, I think this was more him not pushing him for not having an argument but genuinely telling him what he's doing doesn't hold weight. Which is what I caught too, but we are seemingly having different insight into what it actually means. Which to me is an even better sign than me retrospectively having the same read, he isn't abusing the fact it otherwise looks pretty bad.

Calling out Kay for seeing Eiralax for what they're not is good, they even put the effort in to come with receipts (275) is also a good look, but for this post in particular I think I'm combining me liking the effort more than anything town but who gives a shit, this is townie as far as I care

Hu Tao

Spoiler:

38 (and 39) they seem to be TRing both OC and Kay which is a good sign to me as those are the reads I came to, which writing this and recalling the amount of times I've stated this exact thing in the past is making me painfully aware that this is probably a really stupid reason to town-read somebody early on. Eh, whatever

53 is a good look. It's inherently not jumping to a conclusion which I feel scum!tao would be doing here. They're actively trying to reach out and get on the same level as Luka albeit the "or trying to force a bad read" is quite antagonistic so that post depending on how it was intended could also be read poorly but I'm an opportunist. I feel if scum wanted to shade them, they wouldn't have reached out an olive branch first. Actually... their next post insinuates I am wrong, so I'll check the context that they're in now.

They didn't wait for a response and decided to assume it was in bad faith. Not sure how much I like that, but they did still state they're waiting for the response (and adds another question). Maybe I'm misunderstanding where her head is at.

99 (and ig 108) following up on the misunderstanding and updating is actually a good look. They didn't remove their vote so I'm not understanding their position at this point in the game so I'm hoping that comes clear soon. I know they pivoted eventually but I forget the context for that.

Nvm in the next post they show intent to move vote.

I like this slot for now, but I want them to have more stances overall. They feel like they're almost playing it safe so I definitely want to pick her brain more.

Ugh ok this is it you went hard I'll read it and try and talk with you when I get time

I sunk multiple hours into that it feels like lmao, I don’t actually know how long it took me

[JacksonVirgo]

If it wasn’t clear the purpose of my iso dive was to find all things I find scummy and all things I find townie and make an analysis after I’ve finished each account and then each slot as a whole. I’m not going to iso dive to confirm my previous beliefs. I don’t know your scum range and the one time I guessed when reading the game, I was wrong. What are you basing your confidence in my ability to read you from?

[JacksonVirgo]

Are you wolf? This feels unnatural

[JacksonVirgo]

If it wasn’t clear the purpose of my iso dive was to find all things I find scummy and all things I find townie and make an analysis after I’ve finished each account and then each slot as a whole. I’m not going to iso dive to confirm my previous beliefs. I don’t know your scum range and the one time I guessed when reading the game, I was wrong. What are you basing your confidence in my ability to read you from?

Every game we’ve been in together?

I’ve townread you universally, you just happened to be town every time we played. I don’t know how you play as wolf, you say are obvious but that’s your own assessment of yourself. I have no way of knowing and the one time I could have read you right, I was wrong as I once again townread you. Albeit I was not actively playing the game so I have literally a sample size of all town games. I don’t know your range and Im not going to pretend that I do. You scare me, a lot of it is based on how much I like you as a person so I’m always paranoid that controls a lot of my TRs on you so I’m cautious and trying to play as objectively as possible regarding you. Perhaps that is what you saw

[JacksonVirgo]

Are you wolf? This feels unnatural

No, I just can’t trust you after you absolutely misted me and made me think you’re town and then made me feel like a complete idiot. Now I have no confidence in being able to read you and everything you do feels weird because this isn’t how you acted in our recent town games.

I switch up my play every time at least somewhat, that’s how I play. And it’s why metareading me seldom works against me

[JacksonVirgo]

What made you decide that this is the right playstyle to switch to in this game?

I wanted to try a gauge/analyse/post in the early fame type of gameplay cycle to see if it was effective as ydrasse and yourself seemed to think a slow consistent game was beneficial so I wanted to take a step back from my general straight wammy bammy until it felt like it was the right time

[JacksonVirgo]

This is just such a weird post from you. You’ve never been scared of me before but now you are? I don’t buy it. I said I’m obvious because you always town read me when I’m town. And since I’m town in this game, I once again assumed you’d be able to read me. This pushback from you scares the shit out of me and I’m not enjoying it at all. This isn’t normal for you and it’s not towny at all.

VOTE: JacksonVirgo

Are you joking? You know how highly I think of you, it was an exaggerated word to use to make my point clear but the feeling was always there

[JacksonVirgo]

Accidental emoji but once again fits my mood

[JacksonVirgo]

Why are you so butthurt that I’m not townreading you like ”normal” games aren’t consistent

[JacksonVirgo]

What about the time was right?

Combination of luka claiming I wasn’t putting in effort, but mostly Firebringer not clicking well with my current schtick. As I said, I want to be on the same page as him so felt it was the time to do it. I wasn’t expecting to go as in depth as I did, but had the time cuz I couldn’t sleep.

I did mention this was my plan for the game in Lukas iso dive if you wanted to take a peek.

[JacksonVirgo]

No I'm not joking. You made a mistake with the way you decided to play this game if you’re town. You should know that I wouldn’t react well to this at all. You wouldn’t do that to me as town, but you know exactly how to make me look bad and that’s to immediately get me defensive.

You don’t think I’d know how you react if I were a wolf, you think I wanted you to get you fully against me? A scum game, where my literal strength lies? I don’t care how you react really (I do literally care of course), I’m trying to find wolves and thus trying to analyse you as you are. Sorry if that’s upset you to any degree.

[JacksonVirgo]

What doesn’t mesh with you specifically?

[JacksonVirgo]

What doesn’t mesh with you specifically?

I feel like I’ve explained that.

I’m different. Great, what part?

[JacksonVirgo]

I guess I don’t understand why you’re pushing against me for trying to read you. It’s not like I’m singling you out or even pushing you. I stated a townread on you. I also just noted what’s giving me pause and why.

[JacksonVirgo]

You said I was digging in deep, and I’m motivated early in the game. Is this what you don’t like about my iso on you?

[JacksonVirgo]

I didn’t know you’d get defensive, it was an instinctive response because I felt what you just said was incredibly off to me

[JacksonVirgo]

I still think it’s off. I just don’t understand it. It genuinely feels like you think its scummy when I’m not locktowning you. Exaggerated but that’s what it seems like. Which is just not a good place to spring from, I haven’t scumread you as town in past games, correct. That doesnt mean I know exactly how to read you and I feel it’s unreasonable to expect that I can, in fact that’s insulting to YOU as you’re almost assuming I can inherently outplay you in every single game which is not the footing I want us to be on. I think highly of you

I do feel a little awkward defending this if this is what you’re saying cuz I don’t even know if you’re town this game

[JacksonVirgo]

You said I was digging in deep, and I’m motivated early in the game. Is this what you don’t like about my iso on you?

I found the things that “gave you pause” and “worried you” as extremely reach-y. It felt like you were pushing yourself extremely hard to find something that could be scummy in my iso just to have something to post on me. Usually, you wouldn’t mind being seen as town-reading me but this time it seems like you didn’t way to seem too eager. That and the amount of effort you put into this ISO-dive this early is different than you in other games. In our town games, you seemed way less invested. So my conclusion is that you have a reason to be invested in this game.

Can you give me examples of what I said and point put what you feel is reach-y. I got a spring of motivation as I couldn’t sleep, I was motivated to do much more than this game which you should know about from me spamming you in dms when you were sleeping lol. Unsure if that’s legal to say? Idfk

[JacksonVirgo]

I didn’t know you’d get defensive, it was an instinctive response because I felt what you just said was incredibly off to me

I call bs on this. You knew I would get defensive and to say otherwise is pretty ridiculous. You know me too well to say this and I think you’re doing so just for the benefit of having other people believe you, not to convince me.

I didn’t know, it was an instinctive response. I wasn’t thinking, I just spoke the thought as soon as I had it

[JacksonVirgo]

To clarify I DO know you get defensive, but it wasn’t anywhere near my mind when I said it.

[JacksonVirgo]

Be back soon, maybe half an hour

[JacksonVirgo]

JV, are you townreading Kay?

I am, and I think this response makes the read stronger. I don’t think I have to clarify why, but if so let me know.

[JacksonVirgo]

Did you not even read my 20 bajillion word essay on everyone??? Smhhh!!

[JacksonVirgo]

It felt like an unnatural response directed at me in particular so yeah my initial response was with skepticism, which faded as I tried to understand her more (I still don’t think I fully do)

[JacksonVirgo]

Be back sorry am busy, bad timing

[JacksonVirgo]

I'm just not sure where this came from:

Are you wolf? This feels unnatural

I didn't think Kay being suspicious of you after (picking up from context) a scum game where you pocketed her was unnatural. So I'm surprised why you felt that it was, and why you immediately jumped to thinking it's wolf behavior.

I genuinely felt a lot of the suspicion she’s shown was mostly banter, I knew there was distrust but I didn’t care to think about it. It hitting me felt way out of left field, hence my reaction but as the situation settled I came to my logical part of my brain. Shit happens

[JacksonVirgo]

You said I was digging in deep, and I’m motivated early in the game. Is this what you don’t like about my iso on you?

I found the things that “gave you pause” and “worried you” as extremely reach-y. It felt like you were pushing yourself extremely hard to find something that could be scummy in my iso just to have something to post on me. Usually, you wouldn’t mind being seen as town-reading me but this time it seems like you didn’t way to seem too eager. That and the amount of effort you put into this ISO-dive this early is different than you in other games. In our town games, you seemed way less invested. So my conclusion is that you have a reason to be invested in this game.

Can you give me examples of what I said and point put what you feel is reach-y. I got a spring of motivation as I couldn’t sleep, I was motivated to do much more than this game which you should know about from me spamming you in dms when you were sleeping lol. Unsure if that’s legal to say? Idfk

I honestly don’t think you know how to act as scum re:me and this is the result. The last game we were in together where I was town and you were scum didn’t have a normal thread to just talk in, so it was easier for you to maneuver around me and pocket me at the same time. Because this is a normal game with normal mechanics, I think you are unsure of how to deal with me in game. If you’re scum, you had to decide between trying to pocket me (you obviously decided against that) and to lay groundwork to use against me later. The only problem is, the groundwork you laid in your deep dive post was just reaching especially because town!Jack wouldn’t have been worried about the things you said you were worried about in that post. And then subsequently you try to say you can’t read me which is just weird because you’ve never been worried in previous games that you are reading me wrong. But this game has you worried? I don’t get why.

I know how to play scum re:you because I did it. I know you react good to pockets, I know you react well to positive affirmation and backing you up. I know you more than anybody in this game, and I’m good as a wolf you don’t think I’d know how to get my best chances with you? I can lean into what most people think I play regarding you anyway, locktown you and move on. I didn’t. I treated you like a player I had to solve, because that’s what you are.

I read you confidently in previous games yes, I also read you confidently here but you know what I didn’t do this game unlike usual? I didn’t bolster my reads, I didn’t fake my confidence. I expressed both sides of my thoughts with every single person in my dives, commented on what I saw, when I saw. These types of reads happened before, they always happened. I’m not stupid. I’m not going to blindly townread you just cuz it’s you, never did and never will.

[JacksonVirgo]

I’ve expressed that explicitly in the dead PT in the first scum!halfasleep game we played if you wanted proof.

[JacksonVirgo]

So you admit to playing this game completely different to all other games I’ve been in with you yet you seem to be reacting oddly to me picking up on you playing differently.

I already told you I like to iterate over different ways of playing, I like experimenting with what works and what doesn’t. It’s a strong point of pride for me

[JacksonVirgo]

I’m a little a shocked because once again I assumed you knew this about me but was not considering it so it felt off

[JacksonVirgo]

It’s not like I actively hide it. I bring it up every game almost

[JacksonVirgo]

Most things stay the same, I don’t change everything up at once. That removes my ability to see what is affecting things

[JacksonVirgo]

Moving on I guess

[JacksonVirgo]

Most things stay the same, I don’t change everything up at once. That removes my ability to see what is affecting things

Which means I stand by my actions and responses in this game.

Is this so?

[JacksonVirgo]

This is just such a weird post from you. You’ve never been scared of me before but now you are? I don’t buy it. I said I’m obvious because you always town read me when I’m town. And since I’m town in this game, I once again assumed you’d be able to read me. This pushback from you scares the shit out of me and I’m not enjoying it at all. This isn’t normal for you and it’s not towny at all.

VOTE: JacksonVirgo

Has Jackson scumread you when you were scum before?

Never played with her as scum

[JacksonVirgo]

In retrospect. I believe I’m in the wrong here. I assumed Kay would know how I’m thinking this game more than is at all reasonable

I’m sorry

[JacksonVirgo]

I did explain how I could apply it here and get away with it.

[JacksonVirgo]

Which is to say to do what I did there, here. Not “deal” with you.

[JacksonVirgo]

Okie dokie

[JacksonVirgo]

Okie dokie

I mean the only other option than you being scum is that you’re just being really arrogant and that just doesn’t seem like you. Especially with dismissive/passive-aggressive posts like this - I’m very confused by you this game.

Alrighty

[JacksonVirgo]

Tbf Jackson could be scum. I don't Townread him

Mhm, I am

[JacksonVirgo]

Might as well be

[JacksonVirgo]

I’m aware

[JacksonVirgo]

Going to ignore Jackson RN for effort, if they don't have any scum chopped by LYLO / LYLO-1 just look into it.

Lmfao the only metric that matters

[JacksonVirgo]

Okie dokie

I mean the only other option than you being scum is that you’re just being really arrogant and that just doesn’t seem like you. Especially with dismissive/passive-aggressive posts like this - I’m very confused by you this game.

Alrighty

This isn’t helping at all

I’m aware

Why sustain the belligerence, JV? It's clear to me that you're townreading Kay anyway, so why keep her alienated? If you're town who thinks Kay is town, then I've been expecting for you to seek a stronger game position and form a town duo. But what you're doing right now isn't making sense to me? The only thing that's making sense for me is that scum!you wanted to do a reverse psychology on Kay and everyone else that you wouldn't be acting like this if you are scum (because you'd know how to pocket Kay and this isn't how you do it). Or that both of you are scum wanting to distance so you organize this theater. This entire interaction is coming off as really awkward and forced because both of you have a good rapport outside of the game. And I'm not sure if it's just from your side or both of you.

I was overstimulated, had an overwhelming day and when I tried settling things they kept pushing it when I didn’t have time to think at work so I “shut down” and didn’t care anymore. At that point in time anyway

[JacksonVirgo]

me spamming you in dms when you were sleeping lol. Unsure if that’s legal to say? Idfk

You're bringing some meta outside the game into the game, and I'm not against it. Frankly, I don't want to solicit more because I want to respect boundaries. But if there's more context that will explain some stuff and read your slots better, I'm okay with you bringing in more.

Couldn’t sleep, had “3am motivation” and smashed out a bunch of shit including this iso dive.

[JacksonVirgo]

The fucking emoji man lmfao

[JacksonVirgo]

Oh, I forgot to say I liked 346 a lot and it put Jackson at the top of my town list.

Holy shit, someone actually read it :O

[JacksonVirgo]

I read back over my ISO-dive on Kay and I think I understand where her dislike for it stems from

[JacksonVirgo]

I did no such thing

[JacksonVirgo]

Not a huge fan of people making a stance on me while willingly ignoring what I've written

[JacksonVirgo]

the strongest stance one can take in a game is one's vote.

And by flopping it around with no reason (as that's what it reads from someone that isn't yourself), you degrade the power of your vote.

[JacksonVirgo]

In certain legal systems maybe. Here I just follow the rules Alianna posted on p1.

The main problem I'm having with your pushes is that I think there's a very stark difference between how you think you're behaving and how you're being perceived. The fact you're not elaborating much (if at all) on a push throws the weight of your words and actions into the dirt and from how you're behaving I'm gathering you think it's doing the exact opposite. I glossed over literally everything you've said this game, and only on a second round through when I explicitly wanted to comment on any rogue thought I had on what you've done is when I had proper thoughts about you beyond a few rogue statements you've made that hadn't had anything to do with any of your reads.

I'm falling into the behaviour of caring less and less about what you're saying. I don't want to do that. Can you please start elaborating on your thoughts, cuz if you don't I'm going to assume you don't have any because that is what you're showing me.

[JacksonVirgo]

From what I've seen on this site so far, when someone is an IC day 1 they don't do much. Probably since they don't have anything to prove, unsure

I need pushback or I don't work super effectively. IC's often just end up as dead weight, this game doesn't seem to be any different

[JacksonVirgo]

-_-

[JacksonVirgo]

You know this is a team game, yes?

[JacksonVirgo]

-_- x2

[JacksonVirgo]

Not a huge fan of people making a stance on me while willingly ignoring what I've written

I'll read it later

No you won't

[JacksonVirgo]

Yeah for mafia

For everybody. Nobody gives a shit if you go 2/2 if you aren't able to convince people to follow you!

My MAN

[JacksonVirgo]

Luka is more townie than the IC now

Idgaf, fuck you

[JacksonVirgo]

Results oriented thinking is bad in that sense. You can have all of the correct reads in the world but with no thread pull, no leverage; no convincing done it amounts to nothing. Good town players can quite literally fake cases on other players in order to get people to follow them, specifically thinking of Achromatic here. Which is why going "this is a gut read!" and expecting people to follow genuinly isn't a good premise. Even if you are corect, you can't go "I played so good!"

Reads are important, don't get me wrong. If you consistently are correct every game than chances are people will start to notice that more and more, and pay attention to you more and more. But if you aren't consistently correct, then this is a team game; your main goals should be town telling, generating content, or creating a healthy gamestate, ect. Mafia is only a solo game for the players who can make it a solo game, which; judging from what I've seen, is nobody here.

Mhm, accuracy is useless if you can't convince people. You can gloat all you want, but you're still bad at the game. Maximise global information babyyy

[JacksonVirgo]

The problem with Eiralox is that they seem to have no actual thought process behind their reads, their just going with the seemingly "easiest to push" in thread, or at least the most subpar in thread from what I've seen. I also can't see a scum agenda for doing this; unless they're known for being a really bad wolf player this rings more as a "wolfy town" just off of that basis.

I don't think it's as black and white in order to slap the TWTBW label on them and go about our day. I think it's a >rand chance of having scum motivation behind their actions, especially if the remaining wolf (assuming 2 here) is better positioned in the Town but I will humour your thoughts on it more I definitely see what they're doing as strange whether it's coming from a wolf or a town so occam's razor would dictate that it's town. I did have this thought a few times but each time I'm not as convinced by it as much as I wanted to be. I want them to post genuine thoughts and analysis before I see myself

ever

removing my vote from them (except for consolidation wagons near day end ofc)

[JacksonVirgo]

Hu Tao

I read your case here, it mostly comes down to mindmelds which I don't think are very towny in it's own right without meta. My case on the slot is that they seem self entitled in a way that no matter the alignment produces an unproductive gamestate, and when questioned on their reads, reads which they say come down to a slot being "lock town" they overlay it with the premise if a gut read. I also think that they should be pushed out of their comfort zone if their town and forced to actually do things; they're playing safe to the point where it seems icky (as mentioned in your post).

I do tend to town-read mindmelds more than I should. The whole locking town point is one of my major gripes with players like her. I don't like this type of playstyle as it doesn't mesh well with mine, I can't reciprocate them and the confidence absolutely feels shit when trying to actually talk with them about things

[JacksonVirgo]

Spoiler: Possible Pocket Attempts (5)

This is unironically both funny and villagery.

I didn't mean to have that in the final version, I was keeping track of the posts to later comment on if I felt it was worth it lmao. It is good to have though!

[JacksonVirgo]

HEM is up here cause I liked CJVs posts, the only thing I don't like is the WOAT push on my slot but I want to know some meta knowledge before changed. I think the top 3 are relatively spewed town at this point, Umlaut I want more from before solidiying. Don't take this as a legacy or anything, just a few thoughts to get ideas from the thread.

You saying the top three is spewed town is a little awkward when you're only referring to a single person (Kay). You can't reasonably say this about yourself, and the last is a mech IC.

[JacksonVirgo]

Unless you mean Kay, HEM and myself. Which I don't believe you were

[JacksonVirgo]

You saying the top three is spewed town is a little awkward when you're only referring to a single person (Kay). You can't reasonably say this about yourself, and the last is a mech IC.

I can say it refering to myself though, the push on me P2 regarding the Doge slot made me incredibly blatent town if any of them are wolf, and given it was 4 players ocrams razor dictates that they are wolf. I also think that I never ever take the stance I've taken on Eiralox if I'm a wolf, unless we're exactly w/w, in which case I probably push it more.

The bar for clearing someone you'd know is town (yourself) is low. I also don't even know what you're referring to regarding P2. Why would you not take the stance you'd made on Eiralox (who I am scum-reading, mind you )

[JacksonVirgo]

The bar for clearing someone you'd know is town (yourself) is low. I also don't even know what you're referring to regarding P2. Why would you not take the stance you'd made on Eiralox (who I am scum-reading, mind you )

If we were TvS and I was the scum I would just bury them, their posts are bad to the point where I think Howism could case them.
I know the bar for clearing myself is slow, I'm talking about when I said the Doge wasn't towny and 4 people jumped on me. That's never a SvS interaction in the slightest heir, and I think that chances are a scum is among the people who interacted with it in the slightest.

Oh no, not howism

I don't know and cannot know the direction wolf!you would take. It could take many forms, depending on so many things. These arguments are incredibly flimsy, you should realistically know that. Even if that's never an SvS interaction (I don't care about these types of things until flips actually happen), that doesn't clear you.

[JacksonVirgo]

I don't really care about this topic though, this is just discussing for the sake of it as far as productive discussions go

[JacksonVirgo]

I did another ISO-dive on Luka to see if I missed anything.

Spoiler:

I lied.

[JacksonVirgo]

I'm not voting any of these today: Alianna, Doctor Drew, Gypyx, Noah Sebastian from the best band in the world Bad Omens, and finally... Umlaut

[JacksonVirgo]

Firebringer is fair game

[JacksonVirgo]

VOTE: Luka

[JacksonVirgo]

VOTE: Eiralox

[JacksonVirgo]

Gottem

[JacksonVirgo]

TWTBAW

Help
please and thank you!

Are you asking what it means? Too wolfy to be a wolf.

Can be worded like twtbw and tstbs (too scummy to be scum)

[JacksonVirgo]

Too wicked to be a wallaby

[JacksonVirgo]

Jackson u gonna ignore my questions or what

What questions? The dumb joke one?

[JacksonVirgo]

U seem to be under heavy assumption that Kay is town, why aren't u considering she is scum pushing u here?

I don’t believe she’s scum, I’ve given my reasonings why

[JacksonVirgo]

Do u think that post was only one of urs worth reading and inform ur alignment?

No, but it’s important nonetheless

[JacksonVirgo]

Maybe if you read the game you'd know a lot of the confidence comes from her coming at me like she did

[JacksonVirgo]

I don't treat her like lock-town, I treat her like a town-read can you not inject thoughts into my head

[JacksonVirgo]

Sorry I'm a little quick to anger at the moment, those comments just made me gwadjaw9d

[JacksonVirgo]

I'm a little shocked GIF is tied for the top wagon rn

[JacksonVirgo]

That's my prodge, see y'all later

[JacksonVirgo]

That's my prodge, see y'all later

You’re what

My prodge. Dodging getting prodded. Prod-dodge. prodge.

I'm a pro gamer girl

[JacksonVirgo]

That's my prodge, see y'all later

You’re what

My prodge. Dodging getting prodded. Prod-dodge. prodge.

I'm a pro gamer girl

I feel like you should’ve disclosed that personal information to me much earlier. This changes everything.

Yeah, you're into women now. You're welcome.

[JacksonVirgo]

Are we voting cute aussies now? Sounds good to me

[JacksonVirgo]

Jackson parking their votes on vanity wagons

This couldn't feel

more

disingenuous considering you were tied for first not all that long ago

[JacksonVirgo]

And that I haven't been around to catch back up

[JacksonVirgo]

It wasn't me who caught them, it was Luka and Umlaut.

Shifting blame to others if it flips green

[JacksonVirgo]

Can this become a wagon again, thanks

[JacksonVirgo]

I'll be around to consolidate my vote otherwise, even if that's a hammer on myself

[JacksonVirgo]

I am pretty substantially convinced the wolf is Eiralox, their recent behaviour is incredibly telling to me. Especially them pushing HEM/GIF

hard

but shifted the blame onto Umlaut/Luka for if it flips green, which wasn't what they explicitly had said but like c'mon are you serious? Lmfao

[JacksonVirgo]

I town-read Umlaut the most, I don't want to die and given how little time we have before day end and shifting to a more consolidating mood I am realising how uncomfortable I am with voting HEM at the moment even though he's the only one I would be voting if not Eiralox. I don't have the time to really look inwards at this read but from what I can gather I assume that's because voting HEM feels like a direct inverse of my push on Eiralox and as I am confident there it just feels like it's a terrible vote as a direct consequence. It could also be him and I being on a similar wavelength (not necessarily because of our reads, although the interactions between him and Eira I did like a lot, at least in comparison with Eira and I'm not sure I have the ability to discern if that difference is townie yet)

[JacksonVirgo]

So I am uncomfortable consolidating, even if that does mean I am the one to go. I'm not stupid though, I will.

[JacksonVirgo]

Good for you

[JacksonVirgo]

Best boy JV is here

[JacksonVirgo]

You wanna do anything else that isn't antagonising me, Eiralox?

[JacksonVirgo]

At this point I think umlaut is the only viable hammer potential. Only one at e2

You say that as if you can't also pivot to HEM and they'd be at E-2

[JacksonVirgo]

Umlaut is such a goofy wagon, I don't understand how that even formed

[JacksonVirgo]

I'm telling you to back off, I know you don't like how I play. I don't care, do something productive

[JacksonVirgo]

You don't respond to a single thing I say that isn't focused directly on you, and then say I don't bring value because you don't like it. Piss off with this manipulative bullshit

[JacksonVirgo]

We've played together before?

[JacksonVirgo]

I feel I would remember trying to spell your name correctly, cuz I'm always like "is it Eirolax or Eiralox" every time I say it

[JacksonVirgo]

Temporalich's Grand Idea Mafia. And I think one other game. IIRc you replaced in and out and didnt say much but cant remember exactly on the 2nd one.

Ah yeah, I posted like 3 times and then repped out

[JacksonVirgo]

So I'll humor you, once in this game. Let's say you're town. I know you're sharp. Naturally, scum have to be Umlaut and GuyInFreezer, yes?

There's a bunch of unspoken assumptions here, what's gotten you to this point?

[JacksonVirgo]

Scum are monkey and Freezer. I don't have anything more to say. Sort it for yourself.

No, you

do

have more to say. You're positioning a question against HEM that is incredibly off-base, there is no reason as to why scum has to be Umlaut/GIF if it isn't HEM. There's none at all, and you are even refusing to elaborate on why you believe that. Are you just pulling shit out of your ass and sticking by it to sound confident?

[JacksonVirgo]

I'm ignoring that PR claim until it's fleshed out more

[JacksonVirgo]

Scum are monkey and Freezer. I don't have anything more to say. Sort it for yourself.

No, you

do

have more to say. You're positioning a question against HEM that is incredibly off-base, there is no reason as to why scum has to be Umlaut/GIF if it isn't HEM. There's none at all, and you are even refusing to elaborate on why you believe that. Are you just pulling shit out of your ass and sticking by it to sound confident?

You are seemingly trying to put him in a cage, and then by extension force his actions

[JacksonVirgo]

I'm explicitly against an Umlaut wagon

[JacksonVirgo]

Though I don't really see the scum benefit in Eira defending me here. It could be white knighting but I don't feel like I'm the kind of player that happens to.

I was thinking the same as it felt weird defending the same person alongside the person I'm most actively SRing but I don't see why scum wouldn't defend you either

[JacksonVirgo]

If you're that afraid of being eliminated that you pivot to a town-read of yours, why are you keeping your claim as vague as you're keeping it? They don't align

[JacksonVirgo]

my mind is absolutely breaking and at this point i don't know how to eliminate

Same brother

[JacksonVirgo]

What even is this

[JacksonVirgo]

Eiralox: Respect my space, stop playing the game

[JacksonVirgo]

I'm at a complete loss, this is such a strange day end

[JacksonVirgo]

Committing to my vote. Umlaut, I don't think Hu Tao is going to kick off the ground for D1

[JacksonVirgo]

I can't shake how Eiralox is behaving. They're trying to shut me down from discussing anything. They vote the person they're town-reading as soon as that's the only way to protect themselves instead of just like... claiming normally. It's giving me a sour taste in my mouth, although I am aware this could also be conf-bias

[JacksonVirgo]

I'm glad it's not just me

[JacksonVirgo]

About to watch a fashion show thing, but I am here periodically

[JacksonVirgo]

HEM's one post today is kinda ass FTR, going to widen my view from Hu Tao since I think they could just be weird town.

I agree with you on HEM, but I want to reassess my reads. Go back over the interactions HEM and I had considering how it went down

[JacksonVirgo]

also lack meta on nearly any of you

You got me
Except not really cuz I play massively different than I do on DM