Open 670: Near Vanilla (Over)

[Toto]

Pedit: I agree with Toto here. How about you BBT??

[Toto]

Good point here, actually. Wasn't sure you had it in ya.

[Toto]

Soft-claims mean jack-shit.

I'd lynch a soft-claim in a heartbeat.

[Music Box]

Why the delayed response to that?

I thought it was a joke the first time.

What changed your mind? The way you came out with that exclamation looked like you were seeing the comment for the first time, which I didn't think you could have been. It felt false.

See I would buy that if it wasn't for your word choice.

I don't get it.


I don't want to lynch nebula toDay.

VOTE: Sesq

[Toto]

this isn't actually half bad

[Toto]

Why the delayed response to that?

I thought it was a joke the first time.

What changed your mind? The way you came out with that exclamation looked like you were seeing the comment for the first time, which I didn't think you could have been. It felt false.

See I would buy that if it wasn't for your word choice.

I don't get it.


I don't want to lynch nebula toDay.

VOTE: Sesq

Why are you voting Sesq if you felt my push on him was fake?

[Music Box]

Because I think he's scum.

[Toto]

So why remark on my 'fake' push on him?

[Hiraki]

Pedit: I agree with Toto here. How about you BBT??

Do you have any concern that you and Hawk have almost all of the same opinions?

Good point here, actually. Wasn't sure you had it in ya.

The counter-wagon is not a great source.

Soft-claims mean jack-shit.

I'd lynch a soft-claim in a heartbeat.

And BBT is voting...the counter wagon.

this isn't actually half bad

And Elena is focusing on...BBT and Lowell.

Agreement in word doesn't mean agreement in action.

[Toto]

Do you have any concern that you and Hawk have almost all of the same opinions?

Yes. But you can never sure about these things.

[Hiraki]

What am I supposed to take away from that?

Here's your answer by a shy takeaway that it's just coincidence?

[Toto]

Either he town reads me too, or he is scum pocketing me. I can't be certain of which until he flips. My read on him was town, but I think Sesq or Nebula need to die today. Nebula flipping green would make me reconsider hawk.

[Music Box]

So why remark on my 'fake' push on him?

Why not? There's more than one scum.

[Toto]

It's kind of a perspective slip. If you are scum reading nebula why do you not expect town to be jumping on the wagon instead?

If that doesn't clear me from being his hypothetical scumpartner IDK what will.

[Music Box]

Yet half a day later you were voting alongside him again.

[Toto]

That would be too obvious for me to do as scum!me. If Sesq flips red and you guys want to lynch me I'm ok with that, as long as you also lynch Nebbie when I flip green. I think THAT could be SvS.

You can lynch me today too if you want if you promise to lynch Neb tomorrow when I flip green.

[Lil Uzi Vert]

Why the delayed response to that?

I thought it was a joke the first time.

What changed your mind? The way you came out with that exclamation looked like you were seeing the comment for the first time, which I didn't think you could have been. It felt false.

See I would buy that if it wasn't for your word choice.

I don't get it.


I don't want to lynch nebula toDay.

VOTE: Sesq

The word obliging. It completely changed the tone, voice, attitude, and imagery of your statement. It also made me think you thought Hawk was asking for a wagon.

[Toto]

Also are you guys even suggesting scum like to vote together? I can see this from MB but Hikaro, really?

[MagnaofIllusion]

You are a much better player than to take this bait.

So your stance is scum never lurker hunt? Since we to my mind have never crossed paths in game (unless you are yet another Alt … I so grow tired of them) I’d like clarity on that issue.

That's convenient.

Your point? I’m curious again about what this comment is supposed to convey since it is clear as mud.

I can understand the point you're coming from but I don't think it's necessarily scummy. Just self-motivated. I'm very concerned that you're implying that you don't understand the difference when you're asking Riley if she's an alt in your next post with the same status as Nebula was.

Please explain how it isn’t scummy given exactly what I said – no-one knowing the slot is a hidden alt matters on lick to the effect using an alt is meant to achieve. Yet instead he chose to specifically go out of his way to make it appear that he was not an Alt. That’s potentially seeking to specifically look to gain the “Newb Halo” when it isn’t warranted which is scummy play.

--

I'm saying that if he flips PR, the conversation you had with him about claiming was essentially noise.

This is not a Town take on how to read Toto if Nebula was to flip Town PR. Not even close. It’s coming from the standpoint that Toto was absolutely Town making the thread clogged with nose. Not even a hint of a thought that Toto could be scum making sure his partners didn’t miss PR crumbs.

--

P-edit i did not like his forced tone and also the fact he lied about being a alt.

Ok, thanks for the info.

Question for you regarding soft-claiming … have you never seen VT players trying to draw Nightkills in this manner? I mean it is bad play but it happens. Hell – I can link you to a recent game where a VT claimed Mason to attempt to draw a kill when protecting the Mason was mostly pointless. So it happens. I just wanted to be sure you are not putting all your eggs on Nebula-as-scum based on something that can realistically come from a Town player.

That said I don’t think that his reaction to your putting what you think were soft-claims out in the spotlight (basically calling it dumb) is that of a gambiting VT.

--

Meh. I cbd'f to respond to all this nonsense. Magna is prob!scum because he should know better than to argue NAI points and he's twisting things to make them scummy instead of addressing them on face value.

So basically what you are doing is just handwaving as fast as you can. Noted.

--

[Riley Cake]

VT.

Grrrrr!!! It's suspicious that yer claiming so early!!!

And those are arguments!!!! Tell me where ya tried to catch scum!! It's nowhere!!

[Hiraki]

Since we to my mind have never crossed paths in game (unless you are yet another Alt … I so grow tired of them) I’d like clarity on that issue.

We've definitely crossed paths - I took a hiatus for the end of 2015 and most of 2016. Most of our games are from 2012.

Your point? I’m curious again about what this comment is supposed to convey since it is clear as mud.

"I can't read this person for a few days"

Yet instead he chose to specifically go out of his way to make it appear that he was not an Alt. That’s potentially seeking to specifically look to gain the “Newb Halo” when it isn’t warranted which is scummy play.

Why can't he just not be trying to sound like a player with a past meta? There are so many reasons that could be rather than what you're implying.

[Sesq]

He seemed to be the only person who was really fitting that role at the time. Would be glad to hear who you think also qualifies.

I think Riley and BBT both would have easily fit that profile at the time you originally posted that. Both have been posting more effectively since then but at that point I was curious why neither twigged you.

Sometimes I really don't know what was going through my mind then.

Meh. I cbd'f to respond to all this nonsense. Magna is prob!scum because he should know better than to argue NAI points and he's twisting things to make them scummy instead of addressing them on face value.

Toto is probs just bad town. I think he thinks he caught scum and now he's in a death tunnel.

VOTE: Magna

"I couldn't be fucked" is not acceptable here, and your magna points are shallow, empty rhetoric. I would agree that Toto is perhaps tunneling a bit too hard on you, though.

Meh. I cbd'f to respond to all this nonsense. Magna is prob!scum because he should know better than to argue NAI points and he's twisting things to make them scummy instead of addressing them on face value.

Toto is probs just bad town. I think he thinks he caught scum and now he's in a death tunnel.

VOTE: Magna

Yeah I thought Magna was trolling at one point but he might actually be serious.

"Trolling" how? This really feels like a forced wagon with LUV going like "yeah you go".

If nebula flips scum LUV is probably going to be my next object of scrutiny.

@Hiraki, your reads of me are actually worse than nebula somehow. First of all, you quote my sarcastic response to Lowell, who had provided reads on people without backing up, and been like "yeah this guy is my scumread unless something changes", which could also possibly be confirmation bias, I wouldn't necessarily place bets. Post 129 has already been debated before, and for Post 144 he was asking for more elaboration only on my townreads, which I wasn't giving him until he actually debated my points. I'll redo a readlist pretty soon here, but other than this you just apply "goodposting" to some pro-neb, anti-me stuff. I feel like in this original post (I'm responding to 366) you accidentally messed up some of the ordering on quotes, because there's a bunch of stuff out of place and that just makes zero sense, notably your response to my 104 and Magna's 107. You're really not posting any strong arguments for your vote on me here. Better play, please.

VT.

Grrrrr!!! It's suspicious that yer claiming so early!!!

And those are arguments!!!! Tell me where ya tried to catch scum!! It's nowhere!!

By process of posting? Not much more to say.

I claimed early because you asked if I'm scum. I suppose a VT claim wasn't necessary to answer your question, but oh well, it's done.

[Toto]

Question for you regarding soft-claiming … have you never seen VT players trying to draw Nightkills in this manner? I mean it is bad play but it happens. Hell – I can link you to a recent game where a VT claimed Mason to attempt to draw a kill when protecting the Mason was mostly pointless. So it happens. I just wanted to be sure you are not putting all your eggs on Nebula-as-scum based on something that can realistically come from a Town player.

That said I don’t think that his reaction to your putting what you think were soft-claims out in the spotlight (basically calling it dumb) is that of a gambiting VT.

What's the point of this wall of text?

[Hiraki]

you accidentally messed up some of the ordering on quotes, because there's a bunch of stuff out of place and that just makes zero sense, notably your response to my 104 and Magna's 107.

Well, if you read what I wrote...

I kind of skipped the LUV posts (on accident) and since MoI is about to start a wall about this, here are my comments:

So yes, I did go out of order but it's not like you're implying.

But that says a lot about what I wrote because your arguments against it is that it's bad, not why - just that it's bad.

Let me take this very slowly:

First of all, you quote my sarcastic response to Lowell

Correct - I did. Your response to nothing was something - that's a big scumread of mine and considering that my read didn't change, it's proven to be correct.

Post 129 has already been debated before

Does this preclude me from giving my own thoughts about it?

and for Post 144 he was asking for more elaboration only on my townreads, which I wasn't giving him until he actually debated my points.

I love being a baby too, I guess.

I'll redo a readlist pretty soon here, but other than this you just apply "goodposting" to some pro-neb, anti-me stuff.

It's almost like I TR people who make good arguments! What should I do? TR people for making bad posts?

You're really not posting any strong arguments for your vote on me here. Better play, please.

This the annoyance. Instead of refuting my arguments, you just say they're bad. I have no intentions of "playing better" if I have to meet your crappy standards.

[Toto]

Instead of refuting my arguments, you just say they're bad.

sounds familiar.