Open 579: Pick Your (Chocolate) Power -- Game Over
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droog Jack of All Trades
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In post 12, Romitelli wrote:I went for the YOLO 1 draft but my plans were foiled.
2 was a pretty popular option lol.
dont remind me <<
so do you not like rvs?-
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In post 14, Romitelli wrote:Not particularly, but why do you ask?
you were the first player to not rvs vote
wondered why-
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im pussed you use 2-
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In post 24, davesaz wrote:In post 20, droog wrote:In post 14, Romitelli wrote:Not particularly, but why do you ask?
you were the first player to not rvs vote
wondered why
What was that vote right before yours?
i cant read appaently-
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In post 24, davesaz wrote:In post 20, droog wrote:In post 14, Romitelli wrote:Not particularly, but why do you ask?
you were the first player to not rvs vote
wondered why
What was that vote right before yours?
In post 25, insanity018 wrote:Mine!
i like this unintentional order-
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In post 45, farside22 wrote:In post 30, Mathdino wrote:I wouldn't put it past clever scum to double up and have the 3rd scum pick a separate number. It might be something I'd do out of audacity. Agree on everything else though.
I want to note however that there are definitely picks that scum would find very lucrative. Among them:
1-shot Vig
Roleblocker (just block everyone at the top of the draft)
Jailkeeper
Vengeful/Night3Vig
Since JK and RB are paired up with Tracker and Doc, not much alignment indicative in that. However, 1-shot Vig/1-shot PGO, along with Vengeful/Night3Vig are HIGHLY useful scum roles.
What this means is if you were near the top and you went for either of the above slots and you DIDN'T get them, there is likely scum above you. Be sure to factor this in.
I think you and I think of things differently. I had thought of taking vig to keep it out of scum hands. But on the other side if scum didn't get the first pick and I had first pick I'd think of choosing pGo because scum may kill me and I could kill them back.
Vengeful I imagine IAM when he was scum and targeted the most useful role for the town to die.
In post 41, Mathdino wrote:PGO is a terrible role because you can't predict for sure when you'll get targeted, so let's get that off the table. 1-shot vig has a much higher chance of hitting town than not.
I'd actually be totally cool with lynching a claimed vengeful if we all vote on who they shoot if they end up being town. Vengeful and vig by themselves are much more likely to hit town than not and if anything are a detriment to town.
When it comes to vig, if the vig agreed to shoot someone the crowd decides on, sure I'd be fine with keeping them alive.
Basically my point is, something like Cop is 10x more useful to town than any killing roles are, and I have a problem with any uncontrolled vigs because if they're scum it's a free pass to kill off a townie they happened to be 'scumreading'.
Out of curiosity with the research done did you or hayate look to see if the vig when town did shoot?
This is where I personally love to wifom scum with the role out there.
See the player picked vig or pGo may or may not be scum. You might say the player waits to shot for a night. Hypothetically he really picked pGo and may or may not activate the ability tonight.
What I have done proposing the above is, if the player is town, give the player an extra day to maybe live because the scum now have to decide is it worth shooting that player and although i don't practice it myself, more info can be had after more then one game day.
You have people that are dead and flipped (should be more then 1).
If the player is scum I forced him from holding back the shot for more analysis. PGo in scum hands is unpredictable though.
Droog: do you think an rvs wagon gives more information? If so what?
RVS tells me who likes wagons
Who's comfortable with sheeting
Which is more useful than not-
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In post 58, farside22 wrote:droog wrote:RVS tells me who likes wagons
Who's comfortable with sheeting
Which is more useful than not
Sheeping is null. I've seen it from town and scum. Zor's game you just played should tell you that.
Why do you think it's useful?
I'm not interested in predicting alignment based on sheeting
I'm interested in learning how the other players think
The more I know about a perso
The more I catch the lies
This is all that really matters for scumhunting-
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In post 67, Amy Farrah Fowler wrote:
Did I miss someone asking for your scum history or are you just throwing this out here?
Because if this is out of the blue then saying 'I'm always scumread' is sure a great way to get people off your back for a while.
it is also suge a great way to get people off your back for a while
if youre town-
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In post 78, Mathdino wrote:You know Siveure, if you're scum, sheeping me is a pretty good excuse to mislynch someone without accountability
thank you for providing the definition of sheepinc-
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In post 98, Aneninen wrote:Conclusion. Amy is most probably scum. She speculates about "what would be useful for the scum?" things all the time, especially during that Vigilante/Vengeful/Idunnowhat part of the chat. Other reasons are shown in my catch-up.
scum have daytalk-
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In post 91, Mathdino wrote:@davesaz: Also, as trust tells are banned, you might wanna read up to make sure and contact the mod and not us.
@farside: It's an extra lynch if we lynch town. Lynches are good, especially since leashing the vengeful essentially gives us a redo if they flip town. 2 town COULD be dead but we face that danger with any lynch.
And if the venge is scum then it's just a waste of time.
If we L-1 someone and they claim vengeful, we agree to lynch that person no matter what because leaving them alive puts them in the scum's hands and we don't want to get into a NK WIFOM discussion of why they're alive the next day. At that point, we start voting on who they should vengekill. If you're a town vengeful, you need to know that giving town discussion on kills is absolutely best for town.Here's my idea:
@Alchemist: Pressure vote is meh, wgeurts could just not be online. Don't like it.
something about this screams scum to me
the helpful "trust tells are banned contact the mod"
the explication on setup theory
'wgeurts could just not be online'
your vengeful proposal
all things that scum would perform to say
'look at how much im helping town'-
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all things that scum would perform to say
'look at how much im helping town'
do you disagree with my premise
(("scum do things to say 'look at how much im helping town"))
that im applying it to math dino in this instance
or that im scum reading him at all-
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In post 102, Aneninen wrote:In post 100, droog wrote:In post 98, Aneninen wrote:Conclusion. Amy is most probably scum. She speculates about "what would be useful for the scum?" things all the time, especially during that Vigilante/Vengeful/Idunnowhat part of the chat. Other reasons are shown in my catch-up.
scum have daytalk
That's true. However, what really disturbed me was eg. her 40. She tried to explained that those roles are not scummy. That may be true – but, she just ignored the possibility that towns could take those roles too just for hindering the scums.
i dont understand
surely not every possibility occurs to everyone
whats scummy about it?-
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In post 109, Mathdino wrote:'too townish to be town'
no, thats not it
its that your behavior is filled with moments scum would love to point at
"im discussing the setup in a really good way that's definitely pro-town"
etc. i went through a few of those already
so to reverse my point:
in all your posts i havent seen anything that convinces me of town-motivation-
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In post 110, Mathdino wrote:If I DON'T respond to people constantly and get input, I'm liable to forget things.
we're alike
when im not posting in the thread its hard for me to keep up-
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In post 113, Mathdino wrote:Fair enough droog.You should know that trying to point at ANYTHING I wrote and trying to tell you all it's town would be scummy in itself.
So would your read on me be more accurately described as null then if nothing convinces you I'm town so far?
In other news, it's kind of refreshing to see someone who doesn't just townread or scumread me solely for effort, haha.
mafiascum has such weird standards
this is the only website i play on where bolded is a common belief-
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In post 114, davesaz wrote:I have mixed feelings on the setup speculation. Past results don't necessarily predict the future, for several reasons.I think hunting scum by behavior is much more accurate than hunting by setup.And when people claim I think it would be a big mistake to read alignment solely from the claimed role. But general discussion of strategies can be useful at times. I can occasionally read scum from the options they leave out of strategy discussions.
Mathdino, was there anything specific which led you to respond the way you did to my comment regarding the possible trust tell?
Aneninen, is there any particular reason you mangle people's names? I have found it disconcerting.
Flubber's RVS is not out of character for him, IMO. I think there will be a lot more to read from his 2nd round of comments.
i agree, hence why i stepped out of setup speculation
((although i would be very interested still
to know if scum in other iterations of this setup
placed a high priority on that jailkeeper/tracker slot))
however it did get us out of rvs effectively-
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In post 120, Aneninen wrote:Huh?
dino is saying that he talking about his own behavior as town would be scummy
unrelated to the game, i think this is only something taht ever happens on ms
on poin though, when i say scum like to say 'look at how pro-town i am'
i guess that's really imprecise of me
scum don't actually say 'im so pro-town go me'
but this is how they often project themselves
and how they arrange their posts
it's decent scumplay to only make actions that could be interpreted as townie-
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In post 202, Amy Farrah Fowler wrote:In post 100, droog wrote:In post 98, Aneninen wrote:Conclusion. Amy is most probably scum. She speculates about "what would be useful for the scum?" things all the time, especially during that Vigilante/Vengeful/Idunnowhat part of the chat. Other reasons are shown in my catch-up.
scum have daytalk
Y'know, it's funny you noticed that. I'm assuming that most games here don't have daytalk, or in any case I didn't know this one did. It usually takes scum to know of something that scum has. Do you play this setup a lot?
this one's backstory
in this game i made the same point you're making now
((though i was scum, i was bussing my partner))
since then i've paid more attention to daytalk
when you were accused of info phishing, easiest counterexample was knowing if scum could've asked partners or not-
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In post 159, Romitelli wrote:Fake speculation? Adding to an ongoing discussion just to appear active?
not sure what the first means
honestly hadnt considered the latter
mostly because, as scum, thats something that would never occur to me
since amy is and was contributing to other discussions
this doesnt seem like a great scumtell regardless-
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In post 222, Aneninen wrote:Your readlist in 206 is WTF?! It looks as if you had chosen three players randomly so as to post something about them.
amy admitted such
In post 206, Amy Farrah Fowler wrote:While I can be assed to do this, let's make a small reads list,right now of the people who have posted within the last houras of typing this line up.-
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i was going to unvote amy because i dont have a strong scumread there
then i realized i dont have any stronger scumreads
now im not sure how i like the anem io
something about this post sets me off
In post 182, Aneninen wrote:
In post 174, Mathdino wrote:In post 161, wgeurts wrote:Ah, anen responded.
Could you consider the possibility of her being scared as noob with her being vigilante or something. That's my paranoia, if we lynch her she could be a legit town vig. What draft was she again?
Okay, so on one hand, we have legit and somewhat helpful setup spec with regards to what roles scum tend to pick, what to look out for, what the plan is if someone claims vig/vengeful...
and on the other hand, we have wgeurts directly speculating the role of someone based on something they said.
MathDino, you've got a point.
Wgeurts, I posted before that I doubt that Amy would be town-Vig or town-Vengeful. As a noob, she'd hard-claim that or she wouldn't talk about that at all.
In post 175, davesaz wrote:Sorry about that.
Moving right along, is there an actual case against Amy? Or we're shaking the trees to see what falls out? I'm not necessarily against that, but would like to know what the wagon is about.
I posted my case, eg. in 118...
In post 177, Alchemist21 wrote:I'm more concerned with how he attacked Ane for sheeping Dino on Amy, yet Droog openly admitted to sheeping someone on the wagon, and Wgeurts is calling him town. The double standard there doesn't sit well with me.
Hmmm... that's a good question.
i honestly dont know what
something about how each of these responses is agreeable
to the person anem's responding to-
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In post 262, wgeurts wrote:I'll take a look at all three their ISO's when I have time.
why not dino's?
it would be very clever for scum
to unvote a wagon
and then say it's so fishy
it probably has scum on it-
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In post 352, Aneninen wrote:Druuge, calling me scum because you think Amy is town and because you like her responds is bad logic. We can simply misread each other, that's very common, especially on Day1. By the way, I'm not voting for her right now.
this is definitely not it
i remember pointing out something i thought was scummy first
kind of forgot what it was but still-
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In post 236, droog wrote:In post 222, Aneninen wrote:Your readlist in 206 is WTF?! It looks as if you had chosen three players randomly so as to post something about them.
amy admitted such
In post 206, Amy Farrah Fowler wrote:While I can be assed to do this, let's make a small reads list,right now of the people who have posted within the last houras of typing this line up.
In post 238, droog wrote:i was going to unvote amy because i dont have a strong scumread there
then i realized i dont have any stronger scumreads
now im not sure how i like the anem io
something about this post sets me off
In post 182, Aneninen wrote:
In post 174, Mathdino wrote:In post 161, wgeurts wrote:Ah, anen responded.
Could you consider the possibility of her being scared as noob with her being vigilante or something. That's my paranoia, if we lynch her she could be a legit town vig. What draft was she again?
Okay, so on one hand, we have legit and somewhat helpful setup spec with regards to what roles scum tend to pick, what to look out for, what the plan is if someone claims vig/vengeful...
and on the other hand, we have wgeurts directly speculating the role of someone based on something they said.
MathDino, you've got a point.
Wgeurts, I posted before that I doubt that Amy would be town-Vig or town-Vengeful. As a noob, she'd hard-claim that or she wouldn't talk about that at all.
In post 175, davesaz wrote:Sorry about that.
Moving right along, is there an actual case against Amy? Or we're shaking the trees to see what falls out? I'm not necessarily against that, but would like to know what the wagon is about.
I posted my case, eg. in 118...
In post 177, Alchemist21 wrote:I'm more concerned with how he attacked Ane for sheeping Dino on Amy, yet Droog openly admitted to sheeping someone on the wagon, and Wgeurts is calling him town. The double standard there doesn't sit well with me.
Hmmm... that's a good question.
i honestly dont know what
something about how each of these responses is agreeable
to the person anem's responding to
ok my premise is wrong i didnt ask anything
i just stated vague enimgatic things
ill fix that but the above is also in my basis for voting-
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In post 102, Aneninen wrote:In post 100, droog wrote:In post 98, Aneninen wrote:Conclusion. Amy is most probably scum. She speculates about "what would be useful for the scum?" things all the time, especially during that Vigilante/Vengeful/Idunnowhat part of the chat. Other reasons are shown in my catch-up.
scum have daytalk
That's true. However, what really disturbed me was eg. her 40. She tried to explained that those roles are not scummy. That may be true – but, she just ignored the possibility that towns could take those roles too just for hindering the scums.
rereading this i have no idea what you mean
amy proposes that certain roles aren't scummy choices
to which you object because... town could choose those not-scummy roles?-
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In post 406, farside22 wrote:Did he join any wagon? Did you check all his scum games?
Also he was town in a game I played. Most of the time he lurked like a fiend but towards the end tried to figure things out. He did not jump from wagon to wagon and that game a player played his town meta and was scum that game. One of the reasons I no longer take stock in meta.
if you dont take stock in meta, why are you asking?
i did not look at all of flubber's scum games
the vast majority were town games
anyways, is...there something scummy about the wagon switching?
i could imagine scum motive
but i dont see anyone making a case that flubber's behavior is motivated by scum motive-
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In post 497, Mathdino wrote:I want to scumread you for misrepping me in like everything, but that doesn't have much scum motivation, so I'm still going with derptown with a couple projection issues. Don't read someone based off playstyle, davesaz. Especially don't read someone by comparing to yourself as town/scum.
oh man
i havent looked through this argument too carefully
and will reread tonight
but 'your argument is bad but you're still probably town'
is a classic scum defense
it is the best way to neutralize an attack on you without appearing scummy yourself-
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In post 19, Mathdino wrote:UNVOTE: whoever
VOTE: Flubbernugget
"genuinely fucking pissed"
The 'genuinely' isn't really necessary if you're pissed, ya know.
this was a really odd rvs vote
dino what's going on-
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In post 29, Hayate Yagami wrote:So, my opinion in terms of numbers:
1. Scum are probably not going to double up so we can assume that there is one scum per number.2. Aside from that number choices are going to be pretty WIFOMy and player dependent.
And
Vote: Flubbernugget
The anger feels fake to me.
In post 30, Mathdino wrote:I wouldn't put it past clever scum to double up and have the 3rd scum pick a separate number. It might be something I'd do out of audacity. Agree on everything else though.
i bolded the part of hayate's comment dino disagrees with
something about that really doest justify 'agree on everything else'
also, depending on how dino chooses to reinvent the past
was that earlier flubber vote serious?
id be really curious as to why/not-
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