Newbie 1979 | Good Jams | (Game Over)

[IMASPY]

dont get offended by th

this is some good stuff... sorry i havent gotten an avatar yet

[IMASPY]

so far im liking the enchantress' leads

[IMASPY]

Oh hi my name is Ima Spy. Nice to meet you all. Please dont get any funny ideas about my name like this dawoodle guy. I am loving this town. The jams in the town square are hella dope.

[IMASPY]

ctually read it fairly towni

I agree with most of this post aside from luca being inno.

[IMASPY]

This is not my first mafia game. I have been playing it on other sites and in person for about a year now.

[IMASPY]

For the record my first post was liking Blatant Scums first post

[IMASPY]

How long do you all wanna make this day last? Are we trying to squeeze the juice out of this motha... or are we looking to shoot first and ask questions later?

[IMASPY]

these jams got me thinking im ready to hammer now... am i right guys? I think we probably have all scum but 1 targeted right now..i am not quite sure how many scum is in this damn town.

[IMASPY]

moods change as easy as the wind blows though

[IMASPY]

for dawoodle about post #87. It is early in the day. I dont know anyone on this site, and I am looking for reactions to mafia claims without pointing fingers at anyone.

[IMASPY]

To Billy Pilgrim about his opening post #81. I thought meta gaming like pulling from previous games was frowned upon in this set up?

[IMASPY]

if that is not the case i will take your information into alittle more consideration

[IMASPY]

im wanting to get a couple more post from Luca and dsjstr

[IMASPY]

im hoping Iconeum responds and we dont have to keep getting replacements

[IMASPY]

billy is the most town in the game to me right now

[IMASPY]

Ima, #107, do you feel like you got any informative reactions from it?

Yes i got a few reactions that gave me some inklings about who might be town. Did not serve up any info on who might be mafia.

[IMASPY]

djstr and luca aren't team mates.

Why?

Bumping this because it is a fair question considering that Luca had posted twice at this point.

Im assuming it was a read derived from djstr's post on the end of page 1.

[IMASPY]

What about that post indicates that they're not partners though?

i think its pretty clear where that assumption could come from. If its a good read or not isnt what we are talking about.

[IMASPY]

So who are the scum for you, dawoodle?

I think at least one of Blatant and Billy are scum. Dsjstr is suspect, and Luca is null but leaning scum. I can go into my reasoning if anyone is interested.

yes i would like you to go into more detail about Luca leaning scum and why dsjstr is suspect.

[IMASPY]

I should clarify that when I say "since the first day," I mean everything after the first day, not every single one of Blatant's posts.

Im assuming you are just misspeaking because this is still the first day.

[IMASPY]

Im starting to see my post are not nearly as long as others so far. Id like to give me sus list from least(top) to most(bot).

Billy Pilgrim
Iconeum
insomnia
dawoodle
Poyzin
Blatant Scum
Luca Blight
dsjstr

[IMASPY]

i havent commited to anything yet because im still waiting for some interaction from luca and dsjstr that isnt filler.

[IMASPY]

Actually yea i have committed to it now. VOTE: dsjstr I think if we have to get rid of someone today it should be dsjstr or Luca.

[IMASPY]

The interaction around Billy's vote for Blatant was strange. The evolution of explanation for Billy's vote was suspect. On the other hand, since the first day, most of Blatant's posts have either been defensive or just general process. I have not seen what I would consider scum hunting from him and the aggressive push against Billy's vote is one piece of that.

For dsjstr, he put a vote on me to "get some activity" (#77) and in the day since, his only activity has been confirming that it was an L-2 vote (#79) and justifying his lack of posts by saying it was comparable to Ima's number of posts (#122). If he actually wanted some activity, I would expect him to post.

For luca, his lack of activity concerns me. As Billy pointed out, he was supposedly catching up in "a few hours" a day ago, and has been silent ever since. If he starts posting and interacting, I will reevaluate based on his behavior.

Most of these reads are made under the assumption that I am a villager. As a townie, the wolves should be happy that suspicion is on me and would avoid scumhunting for the easy mislynch. Regardless of whether I am town or not though, villagers should still be looking for the second scum which seems to be lacking.

It was to get other people to be active, getting someone closer to a lynch allows for the game to progress and for knowledge and information to be shared.

Good point

Actually yea i have committed to it now. VOTE: dsjstr I think if we have to get rid of someone today it should be dsjstr or Luca.

How would lynching me help town D2? Do you think I am associated with someone? Can you provide some more context to your vote when you wanted to hear more from me then proceeded to not prob me and then immediately jump on the BW to vote for me.

It is D1 still. I dont think i need to know both mafia on day 1 half way through. I absolutely did not BW you. There are two other people in this town with 3 votes on them. I asked you to say stuff earlier, however, all you said was i havent post much more than you. Thats a filler defense imo especially since you have already used it twice in day 1.

[IMASPY]

Also, you have only posted semi non filler when address directly. Look how attentive youve become after the vote.

[IMASPY]

VOTE: Unvote

[IMASPY]

So dsjstr i will give you one more chance to defend yourself. Why are you still voting for dawoodle after you voted him to get information out of him? What has dawoodle done or said to convince you he is mafia?

[IMASPY]

I dont see it scumming to unvote in the middle of day 1. I do see it as scumming to vote someone to L-2 just to get them to talk some more then never unvoting after they do what the voter ask. You should unvote now if you dont see dawoodle as mafia.

[IMASPY]

VOTE: dsjstr

[IMASPY]

That should be L-2 on dsjstr again

[IMASPY]

i havent commited to anything yet because im still waiting for some interaction from luca and dsjstr that isnt filler.

Actually yea i have committed to it now. VOTE: dsjstr I think if we have to get rid of someone today it should be dsjstr or Luca.

What made you commit to something that 20 minutes ago you weren't willing to commit to?[/quote]

I think what really sent me over was on page 4 when he put dawoodle at L-2 and disguised this by diminishing the post count of everyone by comparing it to the mod. Which made absolutely no sense to me since the mod made 12 post on page 1 before the thread became unlocked.

[IMASPY]

how about you come up with real reasons why anyone else is scum... how about you start by telling me why dawoodle is scum? You are voting for him and i have already asked you this question with no answer coming from you. So far you have give 2 easy reactionary reads with no follow up probing of those people you gave those reads on.

[IMASPY]

You are fundamentally wrong if you think i am calling you scum just for voting dawoodle. This is now the third time im gonna ask you

WHY YOU

think dawoodle is scum. I havent seen any real reasons that i agree with. Can you maybe quote a reason you think i would be convinced by or maybe even just type up a couple loose reasons

why you

think he is mafia.

[IMASPY]

So dsjstr i will give you one more chance to defend yourself. Why are you still voting for dawoodle after you voted him to get information out of him? What has dawoodle done or said to convince you he is mafia?

Who are you to be the judge, jury, and executioner? I’m sorry that I don’t have all of the relevant quotes, but you asked dsjstr to defend himself, and then after he does, you decide it isn’t sufficient so you revote. Why would you unvote if you only planned on putting your vote back into dsjstr? I know that you could easily say “I wouldn’t have put my vote back I liked his defense” but that clearly isn’t the case based on this quote. Your vote isn’t worth more than any of the other players, and I’m sure that you didn’t need to unvote to make your point. You really just wanted to leverage your voting power, which as I stated doesn’t account for much.

Actually the reason i revoted is the same reason im still grilling him. I simply asked him to give a reason why he is voting for dawoodle still after pointing out that his L-2 vote on page 4 was scummy. He has dodged it 2 times so far and i have justed asked him a 3rd time. Its unfair for you to dismiss the possibility that i would have not revoted him if he answered my question.

[IMASPY]

Enchantress how do you feel about dsjstr still using your reads from 200 post ago. Do you have any new reads? Are you still 99% dawoodle is mafia?

[IMASPY]

In post 83 insomnia even said he thinks daw should be pushed.

Everyone voting for dawoodle is using the same posts I was the last to join the wagon, and my thoughts on him are the same. Try finding better evidence if you are going to tunnel on me.

Blatant Scum voted for dawoodle before 2 of these post even happened. RVS
You voted for dawoodle before the magic post #83.

You have went from voting for dawoodle for more activity to voting for dawoodle because enchantress convinced you he was the most scummy in the 3 post before you voted.

[IMASPY]

I will admit I am struggling to get reads right now so I would not be productive for the town.

So stop asking.

If you are telling me to stop asking you to have some responsibility as town by trying to find mafia then id rather vote you out. Either you are a town that will not contribute or you are mafia trying to avoid making enemies of too many town.

[IMASPY]

I can get reads if you give me time. But I did what you asked why are you selective with what you are saying. Only taking the parts that help your vision. I gave you my reasoning about why daw is scum how can you say I am not trying to help?

[IMASPY]

Opps didnt mean to hit submit. ignore that quote. I am gonna let some other people read and catch up before i respond to this.

[IMASPY]

He’s actually gonna get locked if dawoodle flips scum so I don’t want to focus that

I think your attention should be on the two wagons. Dawoodle has done nothing but ask me questions, his town read, and didn’t sort any of the other people.

Town look for scum, not town.

If he says otherwise, refer back to his wall where he gave the equivalent of 3 scum reads in proportion to 2 town reads.

Well if town look for scum, not town wouldnt that put dawoodle more on the town side considering he gave 3 scum reads opposed to 2 town reads.
Also dawoodle has not only asked you questions. He ask me questions and he addressed billy in an individual post not connected to you at all.
He has reacted alot to you, but i forgive that since you tunneled so hard in the first 100 post.

[IMASPY]

I refuse to hop on the 2 bandwagons that started under 100 post without more reasons are given. Both Mafia scum and dsjstr hopped on your bandwagon with no quotes or reasons why they voted them aside from pushing activity.

[IMASPY]

And, by the way, me making a read before the 100 post mark doesn't change it's accuracy in any way. You don't need tons of information to find scum. Actually, it was demonstrated that you get more confused when presented with tons of information, rather than with a low amount of information. It helps you keep a clear head.

Scum lynches do exist on day one, town lynches are more likely on day one. But scum lynches also do exist.

Ima and literally everyone that's not voting dawoodle, what reasons do you actually have for defending dawoodle here? Anything deep / nuanced? If you call it a tunnel, prove me wrong and try to work with me. If the only reason you have for not voting him is "insomnia's read was made too early, no way it's scum" then lol you. Not even considering this option as a scum is faulty. Please let me know your concerns about my read, I think it's quite good.

Also, the inconsistency in dawoodle's reactions is also glaring. Remember when I first called him out on his first wall? Read his reaction there and his reaction in this wall and see the difference. He's calming himself down and is trying not to flail. It's just not town consistency.

Again, if your reason for not voting dawoodle is because it was a post-whatever-under-100-read then you're not having an actual town read, you're just doubting my capabilities. If you're doubting them, then read him for yourself and debate with me. Why is he town???

Im not clearing dawoodle as town. Infact i gave a list of my sus list and stated i see him as more sus than you. However, i havent see anything from him that has made me think he is scum totally.

He asked me a question on post #87 and after i answered that he gave me a follow up question in post #149. I am in no way saying that makes him town but you are giving him less credit for his post than i am.

[IMASPY]

I will admit I am struggling to get reads right now so I would not be productive for the town.

So stop asking.

If you are telling me to stop asking you to have some responsibility as town by trying to find mafia then id rather vote you out. Either you are a town that will not contribute or you are mafia trying to avoid making enemies of too many town.

Well if town look for scum, not town wouldnt that put dawoodle more on the town side considering he gave 3 scum reads opposed to 2 town reads.

Ok, I misspoke there. What I meant was that, town look for scum, as in they probe their scum reads, as opposed to looking to validate their town read on someone. You don't come back to your most confident town read. You have nothing to sort there. Dawoodle would just keep coming back at me with questions for no reasons, what's he looking to achieve, he already has a scum read on me?

This point is in connection with the "asking questions" point thing I made in the massive wall. He's not even ACTUALLY looking for scum which is even worse. Hope you understood what I meant now.

If you ask me dsjstr has done far far less in

actually]/b] looking for scum. I do know what you mean by that last sentence because i just made that case against dsjstr.

[IMASPY]

You are fundamentally wrong if you think i am calling you scum just for voting dawoodle. This is now the third time im gonna ask you

WHY YOU

think dawoodle is scum. I havent seen any real reasons that i agree with. Can you maybe quote a reason you think i would be convinced by or maybe even just type up a couple loose reasons

why you

think he is mafia.

I posted a response to it 12 post later.

Dsjstr response to this post was quoting 4 post from you. And used those 4 post to justify his and scums vote on dawoodle. Two post were done after Blatent Scum voted for activity. One post was done after dsjstr voted dawoodle for activity.

However 100 post later dsjstr uses these 4 post to claim those are the reasons for believing dawoodle is mafia.
If that is the case why didnt dsjstr use one of those post as a reason for voting dawoodle at the time?
Probably because i pushed him for reasons and since you are the only one 100% convinced dawoodle is mafia you are the only person he can quote with scum reads on dawoodle.

[IMASPY]

dsjstr and BS have both joined your BW without providing or contributing to your case.

[IMASPY]

That’s not the answer I was looking for, but here’s why I town read it.

What scum, knowing that he’s voting a town, would ever use that excuse in order to call someone else out?

It proves two things, one, he actually believes that dawoodle is scum, even if it’s based on my reasoning

And two, he doesn’t have TMI on dawoodle.

Man its pretty dangerous claiming proof of someones inner thoughts with something so flimsy.

Its weird to me now that you are trying to clear dsjstr to me as town after your whole town reads scum, not town post.

[IMASPY]

So dsjstr i will give you one more chance to defend yourself. Why are you still voting for dawoodle after you voted him to get information out of him? What has dawoodle done or said to convince you he is mafia?

Who are you to be the judge, jury, and executioner? I’m sorry that I don’t have all of the relevant quotes, but you asked dsjstr to defend himself, and then after he does, you decide it isn’t sufficient so you revote. Why would you unvote if you only planned on putting your vote back into dsjstr? I know that you could easily say “I wouldn’t have put my vote back I liked his defense” but that clearly isn’t the case based on this quote. Your vote isn’t worth more than any of the other players, and I’m sure that you didn’t need to unvote to make your point. You really just wanted to leverage your voting power, which as I stated doesn’t account for much.

\

I am all three in this game.... that is exactly what this game is... all townies are all three of those things. I have already replied to this post, but I was looking through poyzins post and i forgot to make this point the first time.

[IMASPY]

And, by the way, me making a read before the 100 post mark doesn't change it's accuracy in any way. You don't need tons of information to find scum. Actually, it was demonstrated that you get more confused when presented with tons of information, rather than with a low amount of information. It helps you keep a clear head.

Scum lynches do exist on day one, town lynches are more likely on day one. But scum lynches also do exist.

Ima and literally everyone that's not voting dawoodle, what reasons do you actually have for defending dawoodle here? Anything deep / nuanced? If you call it a tunnel, prove me wrong and try to work with me. If the only reason you have for not voting him is "insomnia's read was made too early, no way it's scum" then lol you. Not even considering this option as a scum is faulty. Please let me know your concerns about my read, I think it's quite good.

Also, the inconsistency in dawoodle's reactions is also glaring. Remember when I first called him out on his first wall? Read his reaction there and his reaction in this wall and see the difference. He's calming himself down and is trying not to flail. It's just not town consistency.

Again, if your reason for not voting dawoodle is because it was a post-whatever-under-100-read then you're not having an actual town read, you're just doubting my capabilities. If you're doubting them, then read him for yourself and debate with me. Why is he town???

Im not clearing dawoodle as town. Infact i gave a list of my sus list and stated i see him as more sus than you. However, i havent see anything from him that has made me think he is scum totally.

He asked me a question on post #87 and after i answered that he gave me a follow up question in post #149. I am in no way saying that makes him town but you are giving him less credit for his post than i am.

weird how you ignore my very first sentence in this post when you were setting up your quotes

[IMASPY]

Im starting to see my post are not nearly as long as others so far. Id like to give me sus list from least(top) to most(bot).

Billy Pilgrim
Iconeum
insomnia
dawoodle
Poyzin
Blatant Scum
Luca Blight
dsjstr

Could you explain your reasoning for this list? The most obvious one is why Billy is at the top while several people, myself included, have pointed out some of his scummy posts. Is your reasoning for the ones near the bottom similar to mine or do you have further insights you would like to add?

Sure, I read Billy Pilgrim as a town late to the party trying to figure everything out.
Iconeum insomnia and dawoodle were all basically at the same sus level for me at the time. You happened to be at the bottom because of insomnias post about you.
Poyzin has gone lower on my list since this post, however, at the time nor he, luca, or blatant scum had posted enough townie content for me to even consider them as town.
dsjstr has been my scum read from the moment i voted him. I did not believe totally at the time i posted the list that he was mafia but now i do. This does not mean im closed off from talking to dsjstr as i have demonstrated since that post.

Luca has gained the most townie rep from me since that post but we was second from the bottom so it wasnt hard for him to move up in my rankings.

[IMASPY]

To Billy Pilgrim about his opening post #81. I thought meta gaming like pulling from previous games was frowned upon in this set up?

As you can see i did make notice of his first post. I thought it was scummy to rely on meta data from previous games. However, not scummy as he was mafia, scummy as in poor sportsmanship.

Once i was told meta gaming is accepted in this forum i applied some meta gaming to this game myself.

My meta game read is someone is only gonna need a replacement if they are town. I have not brought this up nor will i be voting totally based on this. But from my perspective people only need a replacement because they are town and was hoping to be mafia. Luca came into this game with knowledge he was gonna be afk for most of the time, but instead of getting a replacement he just let people know about the afk. Partly why luca was so low on my list from the start because i figured going afk is an easy way for mafia to avoid being probed.

[IMASPY]

Am I correct in assuming that Poyzin dropped because he defended dsjstr or was there something else that bothered you?

Yes the dynamic between dsjstr and poyzin has part to do with it. Along with the lack of townie content provided by both of them. It took me voting on dsjstr to get some serious post out of him, and all of sudden poyzin comes out of smoke to defend dsjstr. Along with FoS on me early for a post that i made about hammering when no one was even L-2 nor had i put a vote in.

[IMASPY]

To Billy Pilgrim about his opening post #81. I thought meta gaming like pulling from previous games was frowned upon in this set up?

As you can see i did make notice of his first post. I thought it was scummy to rely on meta data from previous games. However, not scummy as he was mafia, scummy as in poor sportsmanship.

Once i was told meta gaming is accepted in this forum i applied some meta gaming to this game myself.

My meta game read is someone is only gonna need a replacement if they are town. I have not brought this up nor will i be voting totally based on this. But from my perspective people only need a replacement because they are town and was hoping to be mafia. Luca came into this game with knowledge he was gonna be afk for most of the time, but instead of getting a replacement he just let people know about the afk. Partly why luca was so low on my list from the start because i figured going afk is an easy way for mafia to avoid being probed.

The reason i would not use this meta data is because this is my first game in any type of mafia on a forum. I simply do not have enough experience to draw conclusions based on this type of meta data.

[IMASPY]

I am thoroughly re-reading the messages from #258. If I don't get to somebody's reply between the time that this reply is posted and the time that I'm done replying to past messages, then please don't worry; I'm not ignoring you, I just would like to read the last couple pages in chronological order.

So dsjstr i will give you one more chance to defend yourself. Why are you still voting for dawoodle after you voted him to get information out of him? What has dawoodle done or said to convince you he is mafia?

Who are you to be the judge, jury, and executioner? I’m sorry that I don’t have all of the relevant quotes, but you asked dsjstr to defend himself, and then after he does, you decide it isn’t sufficient so you revote. Why would you unvote if you only planned on putting your vote back into dsjstr? I know that you could easily say “I wouldn’t have put my vote back I liked his defense” but that clearly isn’t the case based on this quote. Your vote isn’t worth more than any of the other players, and I’m sure that you didn’t need to unvote to make your point. You really just wanted to leverage your voting power, which as I stated doesn’t account for much.

Actually the reason i revoted is the same reason im still grilling him. I simply asked him to give a reason why he is voting for dawoodle still after pointing out that his L-2 vote on page 4 was scummy. He has dodged it 2 times so far and i have justed asked him a 3rd time. Its unfair for you to dismiss the possibility that i would have not revoted him if he answered my question.

This was not my point. While I truly don't believe that you intended to keep your vote off of dsjstr after your unvote, there is no evidence to say so. After all, every cause has an effect, and I cannot see into your head to determine what options were considered and what was not. It is just my opinion that you had no intention of sparing dsjstr, as it would be impossible for me to know the truth beyond speculation.

However, the evidence that I DO have is this: you DID unvote before you placed your revote. I cannot find a comprehensible reason for doing so, other than to assert your voting power over dsjstr, which isn't worth more than anybody else's. Do you have an explanation for this action?

Yes i dont have a reason for unvoting at that moment. You were on him from RVS and i was forced to believe your vote was not true. I was voting dsjstr in order to have him be more active since my previous attempt was responded with filler. When luca seen the scumread that i seen and voted for dsjstr. I did not want him to be on L-2 because I wasnt convinced either of you were mafia at the time. So that mean two mafia could have came around and double voted dsjstr if i was wrong about him. I was truely attempting to give dsjstr another chance to become more active and do something i seen as townie. From what i see to me he is mafia or a bad townie. I have no better read than that. Im not gonna kill someone else that i do not see as guilty.

[IMASPY]

yes i do*

[IMASPY]

I am thoroughly re-reading the messages from #258. If I don't get to somebody's reply between the time that this reply is posted and the time that I'm done replying to past messages, then please don't worry; I'm not ignoring you, I just would like to read the last couple pages in chronological order.

So dsjstr i will give you one more chance to defend yourself. Why are you still voting for dawoodle after you voted him to get information out of him? What has dawoodle done or said to convince you he is mafia?

Who are you to be the judge, jury, and executioner? I’m sorry that I don’t have all of the relevant quotes, but you asked dsjstr to defend himself, and then after he does, you decide it isn’t sufficient so you revote. Why would you unvote if you only planned on putting your vote back into dsjstr? I know that you could easily say “I wouldn’t have put my vote back I liked his defense” but that clearly isn’t the case based on this quote. Your vote isn’t worth more than any of the other players, and I’m sure that you didn’t need to unvote to make your point. You really just wanted to leverage your voting power, which as I stated doesn’t account for much.

Actually the reason i revoted is the same reason im still grilling him. I simply asked him to give a reason why he is voting for dawoodle still after pointing out that his L-2 vote on page 4 was scummy. He has dodged it 2 times so far and i have justed asked him a 3rd time. Its unfair for you to dismiss the possibility that i would have not revoted him if he answered my question.

This was not my point. While I truly don't believe that you intended to keep your vote off of dsjstr after your unvote, there is no evidence to say so. After all, every cause has an effect, and I cannot see into your head to determine what options were considered and what was not. It is just my opinion that you had no intention of sparing dsjstr, as it would be impossible for me to know the truth beyond speculation.

However, the evidence that I DO have is this: you DID unvote before you placed your revote. I cannot find a comprehensible reason for doing so, other than to assert your voting power over dsjstr, which isn't worth more than anybody else's. Do you have an explanation for this action?

Yes i dont have a reason for unvoting at that moment. You were on him from RVS and i was forced to believe your vote was not true. I was voting dsjstr in order to have him be more active since my previous attempt was responded with filler. When luca seen the scumread that i seen and voted for dsjstr. I did not want him to be on L-2 because I wasnt convinced either of you were mafia at the time. So that mean two mafia could have came around and double voted dsjstr if i was wrong about him. I was truely attempting to give dsjstr another chance to become more active and do something i seen as townie. From what i see to me he is mafia or a bad townie. I have no better read than that. Im not gonna kill someone else that i do not see as guilty.

yes i do*

[IMASPY]

The only thing I didn’t like about djstr is that he said he doesn’t trust SE’s but he’s following the lead of an SE right now, as well as his reasoning. But he did mention he town reads me, despite knowing I’m an SE.

Dsjstr ALSO said in post #229 that "[he] still believe that Luca is town even though [he] just said [he doesn't] trust SE's". Very strange to say the least, given that Blatant Scum is the only other SE.

Speaking of which, can we seriously get a prod on Blatant scum? It's been over two days and I'm itching for more information on that end.

I think he did a prod on the last vote count.

[IMASPY]

Luca has gained the most townie rep from me since that post but we was second from the bottom so it wasnt hard for him to move up in my rankings.

Actually, it WOULD be hard for Luca to gain the most townie points. Luca was your second highest scumread at the time you originally posted that list, so it would seem that you had some conviction to put him there. This is clear when you talk about your confidence in your dsjstr scumread, which has been unwavering to put it in different words. You even say that it is easy for players near the bottom to move up, yet that doesn't seem to be the case for dsjstr, who you are committed to lynching. To finish the thought, it would be easiest for null reads to shift around, as you wouldn't have much conviction about their placement.

Once again, I'm just postulating, but I'm pretty sure Luca moved up only because you agreed on dsjstr "definitely" being scum. While I agree that this is a good possibility, as I do heavily sus dsjstr, I am even more suspicious of you because of your use of underhanded tactics to push the scum!Dsjstr envelope that I have previously described. I have high confidence that at least one of the two of you are scum. If you are scum, I'd say dsjstr is cleared. (And vice versa for that matter, because I can't picture any scenario where the two of you are mafioso based on both of your demonstrated convictions throughout the last few pages).

VOTE: IMASPY

Don't say that I'm defending dsjstr; I'm not. I'm just trying to find flaws in the argument for dsjstr. There is a large difference, as the former implies that he's a townread for me; he's not.

What you left out of this quote.
"Poyzin has gone lower on my list since this post, however, at the time nor he, luca, or blatant scum had posted enough townie content for me to even consider them as town."

you luca and BS were in three way tie for 2nd to last as i said in that very same post you just clipped from. When three people are tied and two of those 3 people have the least post i would say the person that posted the most out of the three has the best chance to gain townie points. Along with the best chance to let off a scum read. just so happens i read luca as a town.

[IMASPY]

these jams got me thinking im ready to hammer now... am i right guys? I think we probably have all scum but 1 targeted right now..i am not quite sure how many scum is in this damn town.

Oh god this is scary. Please dont hammer already. We've got no information yet. Noting this post because I wanna check who was L-1 at the moment.

This post and the post he asked enchantress about lylo were the two post that made me feel he was town. His first post didnt give me much information because he was using meta data for most of them.

[IMASPY]

caught up now.

VOTE: emperor

Yea I really dont like 1 of his 2 post.

Are you factoring in any of Billy's post that you can link me?

I still think dsjstr is mafia. He has gotten alittle more crafty with his post since I pushed him, however, he hasnt convinced me he is town at all. I seen that you were considering voting him. Any townie post he made that you could link me?

[IMASPY]

Actually I guess you don't have to do everyone, I don't see why Icon is so high on your list. Also, was I that low on your list when you defended me?

Wow dude j just got done saying you haven't convinced me and you go and post the most townie post I have seen from you this game

[IMASPY]

So yea i do agree i could have misinterpreted billy as town with the #103 post. I was thinking hey a town would want to take note as who was L-1 when i posted that, however, could be that he seen that as the situation and attempted to counter play with that. And #182 does look a bit scummy.

The only thing keeping me from voting flippy rn is im still on this dsjstr kick. I happen to think he is partnered with poyzin tho....

[IMASPY]

i said in the post why im willing to vote for him now....

on top of my change of perspective of a couple of billys post i think flippy is clearly not committed to playing the game or cant find the words to be confident in posting without coming across as mafia.

One of the same reasons i sused you out as mafia in my mind. Yes you have began to post more, but i havent seen many post i would consider townie. You posted a townie post and when i told you i thought it was townie you posted something i seen as scummy. So it kinda took my hope back out of you. I am less sure about you as i said earlier you did change your posting style, but to me the town quality of the post have barely gone up.

[IMASPY]

Another reason is after i revealed my meta data analysis the majority of people that responded to it kinda debunked the mafia wouldnt get replaced theory. Maybe this is partially the reason i see scumminess in a couple of billys post now.

[IMASPY]

sorry for the lack of punctuation on that last post

[IMASPY]

i said in the post why im willing to vote for him now....

on top of my change of perspective of a couple of billys post i think flippy is clearly not committed to playing the game or cant find the words to be confident in posting without coming across as mafia.

One of the same reasons i sused you out as mafia in my mind. Yes you have began to post more, but i havent seen many post i would consider townie. You posted a townie post and when i told you i thought it was townie you posted something i seen as scummy. So it kinda took my hope back out of you. I am less sure about you as i said earlier you did change your posting style, but to me the town quality of the post have barely gone up.

Was it scummy because I said I wasn't trying to appease you?

I dont think its important to tell you right now why i thought it was scummy. It cant be explained with just clicking a quote on one sentence at this point. Im factoring in everyones post by this point in the day. Day 1 is a team game so no one persons post is in a vacuum. Mafia can talk to each other privately during day 1 according to the sample role PM's.

[IMASPY]

I mean i can understand people voting for billy now because really only the mafia know at this point. Same reason i understood why people were bwing on dawoodle. I dont think anyone is scum for jumping on a BW. It would be scum to sneak in a hammer. However, if someone has jumped on a BW and done no probing or scum reading of that person at all the whole game then i have alittle bit of a problem. No one has come out and told me if they think not killing on the first day can be good but it seems like everyone wants to kill for the most part. So i cant put too much stock in votes for scum reads.

[IMASPY]

Probably gonna drop my vote on Luca but I wants to iso him & Icon first

ill give you half of today to do something before i put my vote on you. Should only take you like 30 minutes to read the rest of what you havent already read. Then maybe 30 minutes or less of posting something to contribute to the game.

[IMASPY]

@luca- are you feeling like icon is scum still?

Can you give me some reads on who is scummy and who is towny between everyone?

[IMASPY]

VOTE: Flippynips okay lets go to day 2 and start actually playing the game please

[IMASPY]

Thats L-1 btw

[IMASPY]

@luca- are you feeling like icon is scum still?

Can you give me some reads on who is scummy and who is towny between everyone?

You asked for his reads

Now you are not interacting with those but only a vote

Why not play the game now instead of tomorrow

I asked for his reads and he said I dont really have leads and on top of that hes going afk for a week. If you think my vote was scummy vote on me and convince everyone I'd be a better lynch.

[IMASPY]

He had over 3 days to at least read the thread.

[IMASPY]

Are we suppose to give replacements 6 full days to read the thread before considering to vote them out?

[IMASPY]

If you voted on Flippy because he was not being active and said he was busy that would be a reason to sus you. The fact that you are being defensive without anyone questioning you strikes me as feeling guilty for your vote.

Who is being defensive without being questioned?

If a scum says they are too busy to read and post does that absolve them of being scum? He not only would get a free pass on today's lynch but excuse himself from really contributing for the first 3 days of day 2.

[IMASPY]

I would like to get rid of poy as well for being a non contributor/scummy. But his replacement might be someone that wants to play and contribute to helping town find maf.

[IMASPY]

I think if we have a medic they should save icon tonight. Icon has become my leading town lock. If flippy flips green my 3 most sus are dsjstr/poy/l blight.

[IMASPY]

L blight is far less sus than poy but still below everyone else for me.

[IMASPY]

I would love them to save me if we have one, but I am just plain villy i'm trying to preserve some town PRs. And since I only really see icon as town right now I'm playing the odds.

[IMASPY]

Plus idk if I'm gonna be targeted tonight. I will know much more after the flip but I dont think we get to have anymore interaction after that do we?

[IMASPY]

VOTE: dsjstr

[IMASPY]

yea i agree.. we need to get down to 1 mafia before we start talking about final 3. Im calling dsjstr and poyzin maf this game.. if im wrong ill never play here again

[IMASPY]

empty threat scum read inc

[IMASPY]

how in the world am i being better by voting the person i have been scum reading the whole game.

[IMASPY]

petty*

[IMASPY]

Im just playing the game. I dont know you or have any hard feelings or negative thoughts towards you. Thats fine you can address me in one sentence and then follow up the next sentence by saying we will be better if we are not being petty. Why even say anything about town being petty if you werent talking about me. Has anyone been petty in this game that has prompted you to make that statement?

[IMASPY]

I want to play the game too, but you avoided giving a real reason why you scum read me. You have been scum reading me since our confrontation but have not given another reason why you scum read me. I don't want to offend you I do genuinely like everyone in this game. I just think the only reason you are voting for me is because of what happened.

VOTE: ds

To me this seems like the only way past this. idk I'm tired and kind of unmotivated rn

what happened? Can you tell me or quote the one thing that happened that changed everything?

[IMASPY]

tbh I'd be fine with that lynch just because they are just going to keep us alive until final 3, might as well get it over with

Quite a confident statement to make 6 post into day 2. Final 3 isnt even an option right now. Are you saying we will kill a mafia for sure? Do you know who is mafia? You say i am not mafia. So who of the other 5 players in the game do you see as mafia?

[IMASPY]

See, this is some townie shit and good reads and thoughts. This is what I'm looking for.

I am willing to vote Billy man, I don't give a damn if he subbed out, that slot is cursed, like 3 people changed it. Let's give the mod an easy time and stop looking for replacement. Put that slot in the grave.

VOTE: Billy slot

This vote on Billy seems a little odd, at least the reasoning behind it. His previous vote was on someone who he though that getting lynched would have provided useful information for other slots. I would still like to hear from poyzin it looked like he just posted a read list for the sake of having one. I realize that voting for people because of their activity is actually not good reasoning, I would say these are my top two scum reads currently.

In this post who are you saying are your top two scum reads? It is not clear to me that you are calling anyone scum or naming anyone as scum.

[IMASPY]

@clidd have you not reach Lucca's portion of post yet?

[IMASPY]

That is a fair point clidd VOTE: Unvote

[IMASPY]

Insomnia, my 4th iso post I mentioned my experience.

[IMASPY]

For the record I called Spy town, and said that I was scum reading poyzin

If we lynch town today then before we get to night 3 we will be in lylo, since you have a lot of control on who gets lynched if you are scum then you can easily position yourself to win.

Can you explain why you think insomnia has alot of control of who is lynched? Also, explain why now that you are being srd by more people you are worried about a day 3 lylo? Couldn't you have said something about this the first page of the day instead of saying you'd rather be lynched to get it over with? Also if you were town and worried about lylo scenario why put the vote on yourself right away? It looked like an easy "look I'll take one for the team right now" when you know you are not really in danger since your maf partner isn't gonna l-1 or hammer you before you get a chance to unvote. You have posted several "when I flip town" which is scummy to me.

[IMASPY]

Probably gonna drop my vote on Luca but I wants to iso him & Icon first

ill give you half of today to do something before i put my vote on you. Should only take you like 30 minutes to read the rest of what you havent already read. Then maybe 30 minutes or less of posting something to contribute to the game.

VOTE: Flippynips okay lets go to day 2 and start actually playing the game please

@luca- are you feeling like icon is scum still?

Can you give me some reads on who is scummy and who is towny between everyone?

You asked for his reads

Now you are not interacting with those but only a vote

Why not play the game now instead of tomorrow

I asked for his reads and he said I dont really have leads and on top of that hes going afk for a week. If you think my vote was scummy vote on me and convince everyone I'd be a better lynch.

He had over 3 days to at least read the thread.

Are we suppose to give replacements 6 full days to read the thread before considering to vote them out?

I was saying Spy lynched for that reasoning.

Also spy claimed bv in twilight if there was a doc I think they would try to save a PR especially considering the fact that mafia might not have even attacked Spy. Now we know they didn't but we wouldn't have known that.

I did not lynch for someone being busy. I voted him for lack of activity and simply not caring about the game in general. I did not vote him and suggest we should kill him for being not here. He posted about catching up several times and then never came through.

The only reason I voted to kill flippy is because there was less than a day left in the phase and I was told "its good to kill on day 1". I made a point to ask about not killing day 1 twice. I would have never took my vote off of you if I thought there was a chance of lynching you.

[IMASPY]

yea i agree.. we need to get down to 1 mafia before we start talking about final 3. Im calling dsjstr and poyzin maf this game.. if im wrong ill never play here again

What warrants the level of confidence in this post? Do you have any compelling evidence?

I went into some detail as to why in my last couple post.

I have read each person's iso a couple times by now. I seen the least contributing from dsjstr and poyzin as far as progression goes. This was the original reason why I voted dsjstr day 1. I used the vote to pressure him into doing some kind of sorting. After I did so he claimed the number of post a person has is equal to the amount of contributing each person has done.

[IMASPY]

You don't think that being busy and a lack of activity are the same thing? The goal should always be to try and get mafia, looking back if you are mafia then we can see your vote as just an excuse to get rid of a town. I'll answer your other question in a second.

No I do not see them as the same. He claimed to be here trying to catch up and then didnt post substance. He was not busy. He did not care enough to play the game.

[IMASPY]

Even as he was about to die he joked about being mafia instead of really scum hunting for us at the end. If I am town and I'm about to die I am gonna make all my reads very apparent. He did not do that because

he did not care about this game

. Someone that doesnt care is just as bad as mafia on day 1. If I'm gonna kill anyone besides mafia day 1 its gonna be a shitty town.

[IMASPY]

Towards EoD I saw people just placing votes on Flippy even though they didn't give greats reasons, voting Flippy was just the easy option at the time. Icon took his vote off of him because he agreed that it seemed like the wagon filled fast and since he was town shows that mafia was more than fine with that lynch. Wouldn't that also mean that more than likely mafia were on that wagon, I'm not sure why Insom wants to take the attention off of the people on the wagon and go for poyzin. Since more people are scum reading me which I don't think there are tbh, I am worried about being in a Day 3 lylo because I am town. About the self lynch, to my understanding I saw you as town and I know I am town, I figured anyone else who tried joining the wagon would most likely be mafia aligned. I don't understand the "take one for the team" comment. Wouldn't my mafia partner want to bus to look town? Also, I just wanted you to not just see me in a negative light and by getting lynched it would have allowed the town to put all the pieces together.

I kind of went off on a tangent, there probably needs to be some clarifications so just ask. For example when I say he was town shows that mafia was more than fine with that lynch, I was talking about Flippy being town.

Okay so who is the 2 mafia out of the 4 others that voted for flippy? You have stated I am town a couple times today already(something you started doing after 2 other people had already said the same thing about me) so that leaves 2 mafia out of 4 votes assuming you are going back on your poyzin "scum read".

[IMASPY]

"Wouldn't my mafia partner want to bus to look town" can you explain this sentence to me. I'm unfamiliar with bus as a mafia term.

[IMASPY]

VOTE: dsjstr this is not a random vote.

[IMASPY]

For the record poyzin RVS was on dsjstr and it was left there until he got to L-2.

[IMASPY]

Which then lead to a vote on the one person actually voting for him outside of RVS.

[IMASPY]

Which then lead to a vote on the one person actually voting for him outside of RVS.

Yooo we got mad shapeshifters in this town. Weirdly enough they are not the mafia.

[IMASPY]

I didnt mean to have a quote.

[IMASPY]

I got insomnia and icon as both town right now.

My scum reads are dsjstr and poyzin.

[IMASPY]

Shit load of replacements so this game is semi fucked imo. Idk what the replacement average is. This is my first long form game.

[IMASPY]

No i'm straight villy. No prs have showed a sign to me yet. Could be the replacements I suppose. But that's some flimsy meta game shit.

[IMASPY]

Yea 5 left.

[IMASPY]

But right now I am unsure, right before the lynch I was sussing Insom and poyzin, I still want to hear from poyzin but why reads are starting to change. Spy I can give you my two later but you're right I shouldn't be sussing poyzin any more because there is new info and I think that mafia were on that wagon. I'm no longer sussing poyzin I guess.

I mean this post is hella scummy to me.

[IMASPY]

Towards EoD I saw people just placing votes on Flippy even though they didn't give greats reasons, voting Flippy was just the easy option at the time. Icon took his vote off of him because he agreed that it seemed like the wagon filled fast and since he was town shows that mafia was more than fine with that lynch. Wouldn't that also mean that more than likely mafia were on that wagon, I'm not sure why Insom wants to take the attention off of the people on the wagon and go for poyzin. Since more people are scum reading me which I don't think there are tbh, I am worried about being in a Day 3 lylo because I am town. About the self lynch, to my understanding I saw you as town and I know I am town, I figured anyone else who tried joining the wagon would most likely be mafia aligned. I don't understand the "take one for the team" comment. Wouldn't my mafia partner want to bus to look town? Also, I just wanted you to not just see me in a negative light and by getting lynched it would have allowed the town to put all the pieces together.

I kind of went off on a tangent, there probably needs to be some clarifications so just ask. For example when I say he was town shows that mafia was more than fine with that lynch, I was talking about Flippy being town.

Okay so who is the 2 mafia out of the 4 others that voted for flippy? You have stated I am town a couple times today already(something you started doing after 2 other people had already said the same thing about me) so that leaves 2 mafia out of 4 votes assuming you are going back on your poyzin "scum read".

This is the thread that post was a response too.

[IMASPY]

How do you rectify me sussing poy as dsjstr partner about 400 post in? No one was voting him?

[IMASPY]

Im starting to see my post are not nearly as long as others so far. Id like to give me sus list from least(top) to most(bot).

Billy Pilgrim
Iconeum
insomnia
dawoodle
Poyzin
Blatant Scum
Luca Blight
dsjstr

Could you explain your reasoning for this list? The most obvious one is why Billy is at the top while several people, myself included, have pointed out some of his scummy posts. Is your reasoning for the ones near the bottom similar to mine or do you have further insights you would like to add?

Sure, I read Billy Pilgrim as a town late to the party trying to figure everything out.
Iconeum insomnia and dawoodle were all basically at the same sus level for me at the time. You happened to be at the bottom because of insomnias post about you.
Poyzin has gone lower on my list since this post, however, at the time nor he, luca, or blatant scum had posted enough townie content for me to even consider them as town.
dsjstr has been my scum read from the moment i voted him. I did not believe totally at the time i posted the list that he was mafia but now i do. This does not mean im closed off from talking to dsjstr as i have demonstrated since that post.

Luca has gained the most townie rep from me since that post but we was second from the bottom so it wasnt hard for him to move up in my rankings.

One example of me starting to sus poy as dsjstr's partner.

[IMASPY]

Am I correct in assuming that Poyzin dropped because he defended dsjstr or was there something else that bothered you?

Yes the dynamic between dsjstr and poyzin has part to do with it. Along with the lack of townie content provided by both of them. It took me voting on dsjstr to get some serious post out of him, and all of sudden poyzin comes out of smoke to defend dsjstr. Along with FoS on me early for a post that i made about hammering when no one was even L-2 nor had i put a vote in.

Another post if mine.

[IMASPY]

I believe dsjstr and poyzin left me alive last night because it would be too obvious killing the one person that SRd them day 1.

[IMASPY]

Poy has far less posting I am not as sure.

[IMASPY]

More meta theory inc. Poyzin was prodded and never responded in thread. Make assumptions with that as you will.

[IMASPY]

I believe dsjstr and poyzin left me alive last night because it would be too obvious killing the one person that SRd them day 1.

What makes you a good Night Kill?

I believe I was because I felt as if I was gaining supporters with my SRs. I was called town by many players. One of which I believe is a maf.

[IMASPY]

It was unfortunate that the replacement slot was BW from RVS almost. I ended up voting for him being an uncaring town. In retrospect I should have just attempted a no kill day. I asked a couple times about killing and dsjstr was the only one that responded. I believe he said it was good for mafia to not lynch.

[IMASPY]

That’s not meta and that’s angle shooting, you should almost never based that for your reads lol

I would consider angle shooting as cheating. I'm sincerely not attempting that.

[IMASPY]

It was unfortunate that the replacement slot was BW from RVS almost. I ended up voting for him being an uncaring town. In retrospect I should have just attempted a no kill day. I asked a couple times about killing and dsjstr was the only one that responded. I believe he said it was good for mafia to not lynch.

And that makes him scummy?

No this post wasn't pointing to dsjstr being scummy. He was always the one to hop in with filler post to my "ignorant" post in the RVS. That kinda was why I first voted him to get more content from him. The kill day 1 question came after I was already sussing him.

[IMASPY]

That’s not meta and that’s angle shooting, you should almost never based that for your reads lol

I would consider angle shooting as cheating. I'm sincerely not attempting that.

.
No?
Angle Shooting is taking something like not responding or “their online but not posting” and using it as a reason to scum read someone.
While Meta is how someone plays via their past games.

Oh sorry I was thinking meta data meant using data that isn't necessary part of the game

[IMASPY]

Is it bad to factor that in then? I did think it was weird he never responded to the prod and then someone else was replace at night.

[IMASPY]

Either way really that doesnt matter as i have been scum reading him since long before that. I am not voting poy yet because i already was not as sure about him with of his lack of post. If dsjstr flips town(which i really do not see happening) then i would have to seriously reread everything because as of now those are my only 2 scum reads.

[IMASPY]

if he flips town im lost and you go from townie to scummy real quick. maybe dawoodle and you played me with early game play?

[IMASPY]

i seen it as tunnel townie vs reactive townie

[IMASPY]

basically like i said i would seriously go through iso's again. All my reads go out the window if dsjstr flips green

[IMASPY]

Poy would def still be at towards the top of the list as of now. I mean really im like 95% sure it is them though. Maybe dsjstr flips town and poy is still the most likely because of his defense of dsjstr and scum read on me being like a "oops" i was just being reasonable and countering your tunnel of dsjstr.

[IMASPY]

Dsjstr was never in danger of being lynched. No one was even looking at him till the very end when it was too late. If there was a chance of him even making it to L-1 I would have never voted flippy. On top of that I have learned a valuable lesson about no kill on day one of these long forum games.

[IMASPY]

So my concern right now is that we lynch poyzin, SPY would in no way shape or form be killed tonight. 1. he claimed bv 2. He want's me dead which will help mafia tomorrow

That means that the two other mafia just quickhammer me, unless poyzin is mafia

SPY if poyzin flips town plz do not quickhammer me, it only takes 3 votes

Dude can you stop defending yourself with hypothetical flips and start using reads to scum hunt instead.

You are not placing your very first true vote and it happens to be on the only other person scum reading you.

[IMASPY]

Hold on, you're saying that just because dsjstr wasn't lynched, the possibility of imaspy bussing is discredited???

Definitely not, and this is a giant leap from what I have said. I was saying that because Ima withdrew from the tunnel that I decided to assume good faith from Ima, because I was initially skeptical of Ima’s intentions.

When have I withdrew from saying dsjstr is scum? Even when I voted flippy I said I was not at all letting dsjstr off from being mafia.

[IMASPY]

Town

VOTE: Poyzin

I call your bluff!

VOTE: Insomnia

I call... something.

VOTE: dsjstr

Now the votes have come full circle, and I may rest satisfied.


Regardless, hey everybody! This is my first game on mafiascum, and I'm glad to be here! Do we want to ask questions right now or no? I'd be happy to answer either way.

That's towny post.

I like this post from Blatant. Noticed it got scumread for it, but what does scum have to gain from calling this out?

VOTE: Blatant Scum

I dislike his opening the most.

Btw I've lost my phone so will be

V/LA

for the next week or so, as I can only post when on a computer.

Why? What's scummy about it?

Enchantress likes dsjstr's probing thus far.

She also says that she's willing to accept that if Poyzin is telling the truth, then he'll be hard to found as town because his posts go through a pre-filter, which would come off as scummy to whoever's tone reading.

In fact, she says we should probably probe into Blatant Scum for town reading Poyzin's entrance, because I think that might be a TMI read. Poyzin's post should've felt weird to most towns. It didn't to Blatant Scum, he actually read it fairly townie.

I like the dude that liked my questioning. IMASPY dude.

VOTE: Blatant Scum

This is L-2

. Proceed carefully.

Town core of djstr - IMASPY - me - luca blight

who next

I could see the townread. I like the callout. You think I'm scum too now?

Hey Dragon, you town? Kinda wanna get a read on you before you go V/LA for a few days.

Right.

@mod, I have a standing Saturday-Sunday VLA

I'm town

billy is the most town in the game to me right now

Why, what has billy done to convince you of this?

His opening post was solid town leaning imo. I will be continuing to post townie post from him I noticed.

[IMASPY]

So who are the scum for you, dawoodle?

I think at least one of Blatant and Billy are scum. Dsjstr is suspect, and Luca is null but leaning scum. I can go into my reasoning if anyone is interested.

so you are scumreading 4 out of 8 players, but I don't really see you trying to engage/sort with those scumreads?

So who are the scum for you, dawoodle?

I think at least one of Blatant and Billy are scum. Dsjstr is suspect, and Luca is null but leaning scum. I can go into my reasoning if anyone is interested.

yes i would like you to go into more detail about Luca leaning scum and why dsjstr is suspect.

Good post. +town.

i havent commited to anything yet because im still waiting for some interaction from luca and dsjstr that isnt filler.

Actually yea i have committed to it now. VOTE: dsjstr I think if we have to get rid of someone today it should be dsjstr or Luca.

What made you commit to something that 20 minutes ago you weren't willing to commit to?

I liked this post from him. I know he did give me townie points but he did not just give me free reign as he wanted to know why I was pushing dsjstr. I believe my vote was the 2nd real vote made this game aside from insomnia on dawoodle.

[IMASPY]

I'm also strongly opposing a lynch of the Flippy slot - it has specifically requested time to catchup yesterday

there's time left

This also is a towie post. He was reasonable of this and still voted flippy at the end I believe for the same reasons I voted him. Icon are with this flippy vote on assuming you just believe it's good to always lynch day 1?

[IMASPY]

I'm saying this because he waited to vote on him till the last 10 hours of day 1.

[IMASPY]

Yeah well whatever. I'm done for today anyway.

If ya'll decide Luca is right you can just outright lynch me, and go for Luca tomorrow. There's no way this dude is town this game.

Hi Luca

thanks for openwolfing

If we don't lynch you today, we will do so tomorrow.

I suppose now in retro after Luca being town icon does look a tad bit scummier but it could just have been a misread into a tunnel.

[IMASPY]

This also is a towie post. He was reasonable of this and still voted flippy at the end I believe for the same reasons I voted him. Icon are with this flippy vote on assuming you just believe it's good to always lynch day 1?

Sorry this question was very poorly crafted.

Icon why did you vote flippy at the end of the day?

[IMASPY]

Spy was the only one trying to lynch me, if I was going to kill someone to make me look scum I would have just gone for my biggest fan. I was also scum reading poyzin and was trying to get information to try and start a counter wagon but you had to rush the vote. Poyzin I'd still like and answer Luca even asked once, and then later I asked if we could wait untill we heard from poyzin but once again insomnia wanted to rush the lynch.

For the record I called Spy town, and said that I was scum reading poyzin

If we lynch town today then before we get to night 3 we will be in lylo, since you have a lot of control on who gets lynched if you are scum then you can easily position yourself to win.

But right now I am unsure, right before the lynch I was sussing Insom and poyzin, I still want to hear from poyzin but why reads are starting to change. Spy I can give you my two later but you're right I shouldn't be sussing poyzin any more because there is new info and I think that mafia were on that wagon. I'm no longer sussing poyzin I guess.

You can think what you want, but lynch me not poyzin, like I said earlier you will never stop tunneling me until I am dead. By then we should have enough info from the two lynches.

VOTE: poyzin

L-1

Lets get a rr buddy

I noticed Insomnia has started misreading other peoples reads. It just makes me suspicious of what he is really trying to attempt. He did it with me, and now he did it with poyzin. Divide and concur, creating fights that are not necessary and planting ideas that turn town against each other. I am still confused why the wagon has not really been used as a way to position players.

VOTE: Insomnia

Honestly this game is a huge mess. Lots of fighting and replacements. We all need to simmer down and put our heads together. It could very well be Icon and dawoodle watching from the stands and laughing at us. I know I keep bringing up the votes on Emperor but what was the point of lynching emporer if we are not going to use that information and just go for hypothetical pairs, we could have done that D1. I might be wrong about Insomnia instigating conflicts between players, it could very well just be that we have different perspectives and we are doing it to ourselves. BUT we won't be able to solve anything if we just argue about shit. I could be wrong about that idk this game has been full of miscommunication.

[IMASPY]

Poyzin you listed me low on your read list, I had asked if you thought I was that low when you defended me, I'd still like an answer. Think Insom didn't like my post because I figured out his plan

Please stop saying I defended you. I did nothing of the sort. You were that low; I was just highly skeptical of Ima’s line of questioning that I was confident that there was a mafiosi between one of you.

Why did you make a full 180 on spy?

Full 180? Please don’t misconstrue my posts. I said I was more fine with Ima now; they moved out of the null-scum and are now in an easy null. I just realized that my tunnel on D1 probably was not warranted as much as I thought it was, due to Ima’s attitude towards my vote on them, as well as their overall change in demeanor from what I can tell towards dsjstr, even if dsjstr is still considered scum to Ima.

Apart from the bolded being exact opposites

You see, I don’t believe these to be exact opposites, and I will tell you why. For all tenses and purposes, let’s consider dsjstr and Ima to be a scum team. Now, if a wagon starts to form on dsjstr, which it did, Ima would naturally take advantage of it and create a line of questioning towards dsjstr to show that Ima is town and dsjstr is scum, when they would both hypothetically be scum here. I was just suspicious of Ima from this, because the questions were definitely loaded as far as I recall, and even when dsjstr defended himself, Ima wouldn’t let go of his scum read on dsjstr because the whole point of the questioning was to make Ima look townie by scumreading his mafia partner. Does this make any sense?

More meta theory inc. Poyzin was prodded and never responded in thread. Make assumptions with that as you will.

That's a loaded question that doesn't help poyzin serve towards figuring spy, it just helps him look good in the process. Because there's no way there's an explanation behind spy's perception of an angle shoot. It was tied to his belief that Poyzin was scum, it doesn't constitute a reason for scum reading him, necessarily.

The quotes posts was me saying that the act of me getting prodded is non sequitur and doesn’t put me in either alignment.

Exactly my point, you just make him look bad, and make yourself look good in the process. How does that question help you sort spy there?

I don’t want to make ANYBODY look bad. Why are you attempting to villainize me based on false interpretations? I was confused why Ima would ask for people to make assumptions about me being prodded, so made a post asking why it matters. Then, YOU make a post about “why does it matter why it matters?” Why would you try to flip the bill that I’m scum when you literally did the same thing? That question helps me sort just as much as your question helps you sort! Please, I ask of you to stop your hypocrisy for the sole reason of justifying your narrative that I’m scum. I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again: I’m fine with you being suspicious of me. But when you try to spin the script by accusing me of being scum through the use of the same type of questioning that you first labeled as scummy, I do take issue with this, and leads me to believe that you may have malicious intent behind your posts.

For this last quote insomnia was one of the people that told me not to give a scum read based on you being prodded and not responding. If anything insomnia was being fair to you when i brought this afk stuff to the town.
I had already said i wasnt trying to cheat and that the prodding didnt play that much into my scumread on you.

[IMASPY]

Honestly this game is a huge mess. Lots of fighting and replacements. We all need to simmer down and put our heads together. It could very well be Icon and dawoodle watching from the stands and laughing at us. I know I keep bringing up the votes on Emperor but what was the point of lynching emporer if we are not going to use that information and just go for hypothetical pairs, we could have done that D1. I might be wrong about Insomnia instigating conflicts between players, it could very well just be that we have different perspectives and we are doing it to ourselves. BUT we won't be able to solve anything if we just argue about shit. I could be wrong about that idk this game has been full of miscommunication.

With this post dsjstr's day 2 consist of scum reading poyzin insomnia dawoodle and icon. While also saying he doesnt scum read poyzin, and then voting him before unvoting him 2 hours later for the insomnia vote.

All this erratic voting from someone that wants us to simmer down and put our heads together.

He is asking whats the point of lynching emporer when

he is the one

that said lynching day 1 was the best overall strat for town. Not giving anyone context about it being less than 10 hours left in the day. We did not rush any vote. I gave a couple day warning to emporer that his slot was in danger based on his lack of caring/activity.

[IMASPY]

Not only did emporer slack on his contributing, but his slot was already getting BW'd before he entered the game. Maybe his lack of caring was telling that he was town, however, i can only vote for myself.

If we are gonna kill anyone

i want it to be mafia or a bad town.

[IMASPY]

@DS
@Poy

What’s your guys Reads on Icon?

Please remember that you will receive no response about reads until it is pressed by more than one person.

[IMASPY]

Honestly this game is a huge mess. Lots of fighting and replacements. We all need to simmer down and put our heads together. It could very well be Icon and dawoodle watching from the stands and laughing at us. I know I keep bringing up the votes on Emperor but what was the point of lynching emporer if we are not going to use that information and just go for hypothetical pairs, we could have done that D1. I might be wrong about Insomnia instigating conflicts between players, it could very well just be that we have different perspectives and we are doing it to ourselves. BUT we won't be able to solve anything if we just argue about shit. I could be wrong about that idk this game has been full of miscommunication.

With this post dsjstr's day 2 consist of scum reading poyzin insomnia dawoodle and icon. While also saying he doesnt scum read poyzin, and then voting him before unvoting him 2 hours later for the insomnia vote.

All this erratic voting from someone that wants us to simmer down and put our heads together.

He is asking whats the point of lynching emporer when

he is the one

that said lynching day 1 was the best overall strat for town. Not giving anyone context about it being less than 10 hours left in the day. We did not rush any vote. I gave a couple day warning to emporer that his slot was in danger based on his lack of caring/activity.

Exactly,don't want town to be divided. We need to work together not against each other and I think mafia is doing a good job.

If I am the only one that sees this post as an easy scum filler reply I will unvote dsjstr for now.

How is this his reply to what I posted

[IMASPY]

Alrighty. Maybe I am being too biased against dsjstr and he is also just not great at being town. VOTE: unvote I dont feep great about this unvote yet. I'd l like others to weigh in on #903.

[IMASPY]

he said lynching D1 is the best, I agree. Now he's calling to use the information from that lynch. It makes sense. He's not actually doing that himself, but that in itself isn't scum indicative

He said d1 lynching was the best while also vilifying those that voted him in the last 10 hours of the day.

[IMASPY]

Voted flippy that is.

[IMASPY]

Why is a newish player trying to tell another new player the optimal strat is killing day one. I suppose he could not care if his assumptions are right. I also suppose he could be mafia seeing that his partner is not getting BWd and decided to tell me killing is optimal as a way to almost guarantee a day 1 mislynch.

[IMASPY]

So assuming Icon is indeed Mafia.
Who do you think his partner is?
Let’s start with DS, Insomnia, Spy then Poy.
Well I suppose Icon can choose too! :p

Notice this is the second time you have asked dsjstr to contribute to town and he has ignored it to post basically filler responses to other post.

[IMASPY]

Wait Dawoodle is still alive?
I thought Icon Misslynched them?
Are they confirm Town?
They PR claim?

Only plain villy has been claimed so far. I am slightly sus of you trying to make pr claims so apparent to the group, butI understand you dont want to read phase 1 so I figured I'd just settle that question now so you only have to pay attention from here on out to that.

[IMASPY]

I'm feeling really fucking uneasy about TSE's push on Iconeum here. I find his reasoning to be too shallow in order to present such conviction. I feel like he literally ISO'd him and pulled out the easiest posts to accuse and that's it, bam. Easy vote.

And I feel like he'd only do that if he wanted to split votes and deflect attention from Poyzin, tbh... They need Poyzin alive, because, if TSE and Poyzin are alive, they literally have to make us mislynch in dawoodle - dsjstr - iconeum

Kill probably me.

And then go into the next day letting spy and dsjstr / iconeum and dawoodle go at each other. Lynching Iconeum here makes the most sense from TSE - poyzin scum PoV, because, they kill a good town, they kill me in the night and then you guys just eat each other (spy and djstr)

What has poyzin done this game?

He has defended himself, voted and sussed me, and defended dsjstr(the 1 person sussing dsjstr).

Are you saying poyzin come out of no where without me sussing him to defend dsjstr against me in Hope's we lynched dsjstr and he flips green to further himself as town?

[IMASPY]

I'm feeling really fucking uneasy about TSE's push on Iconeum here. I find his reasoning to be too shallow in order to present such conviction. I feel like he literally ISO'd him and pulled out the easiest posts to accuse and that's it, bam. Easy vote.

And I feel like he'd only do that if he wanted to split votes and deflect attention from Poyzin, tbh... They need Poyzin alive, because, if TSE and Poyzin are alive, they literally have to make us mislynch in dawoodle - dsjstr - iconeum

Kill probably me.

And then go into the next day letting spy and dsjstr / iconeum and dawoodle go at each other. Lynching Iconeum here makes the most sense from TSE - poyzin scum PoV, because, they kill a good town, they kill me in the night and then you guys just eat each other (spy and djstr)

What has poyzin done this game?

He has defended himself, voted and sussed me, and defended dsjstr(the 1 person sussing dsjstr).

Are you saying poyzin come out of no where without me sussing him to defend dsjstr against me in Hope's we lynched dsjstr and he flips green to further himself as town?

Ding ding ding. He defends dsjstr, lynches you, then uses your reasoning to push dsjstr. Also, he explicitly said "Don't say i'm defending dsjstr here". So he wasn't even town reading him. He actually thought you're both scum.

Read my comments on him, please. A town doesn't just respond to questioning and doesn't solve the people pushing him. Not once has he called me scum, but he's treating me like I'm town. He's not taking the extra townie step of world building around him, he just wants to escape the lynch.

I know this. Dsjstr is doing the exact same thing!

Hence my question from #903.

Poyzin has continued to be on the defensive on dsjstr behalf. It was not just one post. I suggest you read his iso and see if has defended anyone but dsjstr. The thinking we were both mafia came in a post much later.

You think he defended dsjstr to lynch me? I was considered the most townie in the game so far. I was in no danger of being lynched. There is no pay off in that situation. The only payoff would have been dsjstr flipping green and him saying "see now we should obviously kill spy".

[IMASPY]

I mean I agree with you that poyzin is scum but I am even more positive dsjstr is scum. Until dsjstr does consistent townie stuff he is not cleared for me. VOTE: poyzin

[IMASPY]

But right now I am unsure, right before the lynch I was sussing Insom and poyzin, I still want to hear from poyzin but why reads are starting to change. Spy I can give you my two later but you're right I shouldn't be sussing poyzin any more because there is new info and I think that mafia were on that wagon. I'm no longer sussing poyzin I guess.

You can think what you want, but lynch me not poyzin, like I said earlier you will never stop tunneling me until I am dead. By then we should have enough info from the two lynches.

I mean look at these two post. Does this not look like partner defense to anyone else?

[IMASPY]

I won't

Let me help you understand what townie content might be to help your mafia game.

You can start by ignoring me and engaging the other people posting questions to you.

[IMASPY]

Constantly being on the defense towards the one person pushing you doesnt help the town figure out who scum is.

Stop worrying so much about my opinion when it takes much more than me to lynch.

[IMASPY]

I agree with you that he is most likely mafia. We disagree on who his partner is. He said this is his first game on this site. Considering that I think he made a misstep defending dsjstr(his partner). Not only because of his post, I also see dsjstr posting as if poyzin is his partner. My #925 was an example of where I see that.

[IMASPY]

You have already told me to not read too much into replacements as mafia and now you are going back on that to further your scumteam read. I haven't percieved scumminess from TSE the same way I have from dsjstr. To me TSE is attempting to sort many players. Can you think of a time dsjstr has attempted to sort anyone that wasn't talking about him.

[IMASPY]

I see town as those that will engage with everyone not just the people addressing them directly.

[IMASPY]

Spy, each player is very different. This is dsjstr's first game. If I scum read people for not solving, I'd be losing the game almost all the time. It's about trying to see how a player would think, and try to see if there's enough townie reasoning for them. The core of every good read is TMI (too much information). Scum are the informed minority, town are the uninformed majority. That's the key difference. Try applying this in each and every one of your reads. See if someone town reads someone else for bad / lazy reasoning -> that could mean that they're TMIng them (clearing them based on the information that they're town, not because the sum of the things they've done is townie). Vice versa, if someone is scum reading someone else for shallow reasoning, those are scum that have the information they're pushing a town and don't need much thought, just to sound really convincing / find some hypocrisy, something that can easily be distorted in order to further an agenda.

I'll give an example, from other games I had and this specific game, so maybe I can make you understand better about what I mean by making a direct comparison.

re : I lied, I can't find anything concrete because I mostly post fluff and the actual deduction goes inside my head and when I often push, it isn't anything solid with examples. I will still look for something though, I am surely gonna find it.

Just read back my case on Poyzin, that's pure TMI analysis. You can start by asking yourself the question "If I were in Poyzin's shoes there, and I didn't know anyone's alignment, would I react like that to myself voting and then revoting and using that as a reasoning for a scum read?"

try to use that template for anyone, I will try and use it on other people in this game, mainly on Billy / flippy.

This is dsjstrs 3rd game on this site. It is poyzins first game.

[IMASPY]

Ontop of that look at dsjstrs 2nd game on this site when he was town tracker. He was sorting people throughout that game.

[IMASPY]

I mean that's fine and i seen that, but why say this is dsjstrs first game?

[IMASPY]

Spy, each player is very different. This is dsjstr's first game. If I scum read people for not solving, I'd be losing the game almost all the time. It's about trying to see how a player would think, and try to see if there's enough townie reasoning for them. The core of every good read is TMI (too much information). Scum are the informed minority, town are the uninformed majority. That's the key difference. Try applying this in each and every one of your reads. See if someone town reads someone else for bad / lazy reasoning -> that could mean that they're TMIng them (clearing them based on the information that they're town, not because the sum of the things they've done is townie). Vice versa, if someone is scum reading someone else for shallow reasoning, those are scum that have the information they're pushing a town and don't need much thought, just to sound really convincing / find some hypocrisy, something that can easily be distorted in order to further an agenda.

I'll give an example, from other games I had and this specific game, so maybe I can make you understand better about what I mean by making a direct comparison.

re : I lied, I can't find anything concrete because I mostly post fluff and the actual deduction goes inside my head and when I often push, it isn't anything solid with examples. I will still look for something though, I am surely gonna find it.

Just read back my case on Poyzin, that's pure TMI analysis. You can start by asking yourself the question "If I were in Poyzin's shoes there, and I didn't know anyone's alignment, would I react like that to myself voting and then revoting and using that as a reasoning for a scum read?"

try to use that template for anyone, I will try and use it on other people in this game, mainly on Billy / flippy.

Dude you made this big post about why experience doest play a roll. Dont act like im suppose to know you think experience doesnt matter. You made this post assuming not only dsjstr but also my experience. At least that is sure how it seemed to me thats what this post was about.

[IMASPY]

does play a roll*

[IMASPY]

Why else say this is dsjstrs first game then follow up with explaining a basic concept of mafia to what it look like

me

[IMASPY]

Insomnia i do think you are town and i do believe poyzin is most likely mafia but i think you are overconfident in your own abilities and not confident enough in anyone else abilities.

[IMASPY]

You did the same thing when you were tunneling dawoodle. You werent listening to anyone else opinion about the subject and you weren't even willing to talk to dawoodle. Now you are tunneling poyzin, and you are so convinced of who his partner is that you wont even consider you could be wrong.

[IMASPY]

Poyzin was pushed into L-2 when i voted him on just so everyone knows the deal. I believe everyone else that has votes on them is L-3.

[IMASPY]

You can think what you want, but lynch me not poyzin, like I said earlier you will never stop tunneling me until I am dead. By then we should have enough info from the two lynches.

So if we lynch poyzin and he is red what does this thread mean to you?

[IMASPY]

Is it that dsjstr is town because he was so confident poyzin was town but wrong?
Is it that dsjstr is mafia because he doesnt want his partner lynched?
Is it that dsjstr is town because he is willing to sacrifice himself?

[IMASPY]

And you know why Poyzin and djstrs makes no sense? Because he used him to push you. Scum would never defend a partner in order to find a reasoning for voting someone.

He used him to push you. If they were partners, he would've pushed someone else instead, without using his partner. He TMI'd djstrs town in order to push you, lol. He didn't have a town read on djstrs, but he still pushed you for pushing djstrs.

This is exactly why im saying you are overconfident in your abilities.

You think it is some great secret that if you defend your partner it looks scummy? It only looks scummy after that person is confirmed mafia. To say someone would never defend their partner day 1 is a losing assumption to make. You are assuming poyzin is day 1 playing with basic strategy.

That shows me that experience does really matter to you. More than you are willing to accept.

[IMASPY]

Like, just try to imagine inside your head. Let's say you are scum!Poyzin (Poyzin that's scum). Try and

actually

think if you'd ever push someone for pushing your partner, and at the same time, say this :

Don't say that I'm defending dsjstr; I'm not. I'm just trying to find flaws in the argument for dsjstr. There is a large difference, as the former implies that he's a townread for me; he's not.

Again, imagine you are scum!Poyzin partnered with scum!dsjstr here. Would you ever make a comment like this, knowing that he'd eventually flip red and people, when looking for re-evaluations, will see this in your ISO?

Great exercise and food for thought. Try and always use this template for posts : "If I were in x shoes and I'd not know anyone's alignment, is this something I'd think?"

Don't say that I'm defending dsjstr; I'm not. I'm just trying to find flaws in the argument for dsjstr. There is a large difference, as the former implies that he's a townread for me; he's not.

This sentence is exactly what someone would say if they are looking like they are NOT trying to defend their scum partner.

I am claiming that he is defending his partner. His post is claiming he is not defending his partner.

[IMASPY]

This is exactly why im saying you are overconfident in your abilities.

Spy, you've been on djstr for two dayphases without reconsidering at all. You're falling victim to the thing you're accusing me for. Tunneling. Try and take a breath, step back, and then try and read my posts. But like, actually read them. As in, take in the information and use it for yourself.

I may be tunnely, I may be wrong from time to time, but I still do catch scum and know how to hunt them. It isn't bad if you'd listen to someone else's advice. Listen, apply, and if you disagree / don't get it, then drop it, but at least try.

What advice have I not took in? I already knew about TMI from the first time i played mafia and was told mafia can see all of town in the night stage.

I defended TSE as not seeing scumming post from him. How did i even know to defend TSE if i wasnt reading your post?

You have already told me to not read too much into replacements as mafia and now you are going back on that to further your scumteam read. I haven't percieved scumminess from TSE the same way I have from dsjstr. To me TSE is attempting to sort many players. Can you think of a time dsjstr has attempted to sort anyone that wasn't talking about him.

Why not just answer my question about dsjstr in this post? It seems like you arent reading MY post.

Ontop of that i asked if anyone seen scum in the 902 post from dsjstr and when icon made a good point about him maybe being a new player and not being capable i unvoted him.

[IMASPY]

Ok, assuming you're actually willing to debate it and not just never change your stance at all, I will answer why I disagree.

What you're claiming is that Poyzin had a plan, starting from Day 1, to never let his scum partner die. That's surreal. Nobody ever does that, they evaluate based on situations.

He wouldn't need to defend dsjstr here, because he literally had only one vote, and that was you, at the time Poyzin made that push on you. Nobody was paying attention to dsjstr and we were all town reading him.

Dude he said in his own words HE WAS NOT DEFENDING HIM.

I have claimed he is defending him.

You are taking my claim and applying it to poyzin's intent.

[IMASPY]

My point is, you're saying Poyzin had the confidence to say from the start "Man I'm never lynching you, so I'll just defend you if you get pushed". He had confidence in his abilities to fool the whole town for at least 3 day phases, which is like a month or something crazy like that. That's just never a point. He would've much more likely bussed him if he wanted the credit. Defending him, if he's scum partner, doesn't help him at all. If one of them dies, the other dies instantly.

And you're telling me, Poyzin, walking in, knowing that doing that kills them both if one dies, decided "yeah, fuck it, we'll win with this"?

"You're saying Poyzin had the confidence to say from the start "Man I'm never lynching you, so I'll just defend you if you get pushed"

I hope this third attempt will get through to you.... HE NEVER DEFENDED HIM.

I said he defended him. You apparently agree he defended him... however HE NEVER DEFENDED HIM!!!!!

[IMASPY]

In post 322, Poyzin wrote:
Don't say that I'm defending dsjstr; I'm not. I'm just trying to find flaws in the argument for dsjstr. There is a large difference, as the former implies that he's a townread for me; he's not.

is this a defense or is it someone saying they are not defending them.

[IMASPY]

In my opinion it is a defense of their partner while

trying

to make it seem like it is not.

[IMASPY]

I’m not reading dsjtrs for his attempt at sorting people. You are taking your preconceived idea of what a town would do and applying it as a metric for reading dsjstr, and this is something I fundamentally disagree with.

This is the same type of post you made towards me when i said something about poyzin being afk for the prod.

You are framing my scumread on dsjstr as something that can all be lumped into one thing im doing.

I never said dsjstr is scum BECAUSE he isnt sorting people. It PLAYS INTO why i still think he is scum.

I never said i thought poyzin was scum because he didnt respond to the prod. It was another thing i was considering in my scum read.

[IMASPY]

Do you wish me to go through everyones iso and do a mutli quote for every person for every moment i make a judgement on if that was townie or scum?

[IMASPY]

I see what you’re getting at.

Except that you think it was scum defending a scum partner, I think it was scum trying to pre-emptively defend himself against something that he realized would make him look scummy, when his whole point was to accuse you.

To simplify it, you are saying that he voted you as a result of him defending his partner.

I am saying that he defended him IN ORDER to vote for you.

The whole point was that he was trying to push you, and in doing so, he ended up in an indirect defense.

Finally we have some understanding. We both have reads on poyzin being scum. However we disagree on who is his partner. The goal now is to find out who is partner is. I think its dsjstr and you think its TSE. I have already said i think it is not TSE.

Im willing to go through all of TSE's and his predecessor's ISOs to post quotes on why i think he is not scum.

Are you willing to do the same with dsjstr?

[IMASPY]

Okay then we have no more reason to discuss who is his partner today if you arent will doing to the iso dive on dsjstr to prove him not being scum to you. Like i said i would do the same for TSE but im not gonna waste my time clipping quotes that wont even be considered anyways.

[IMASPY]

im wanting to get a couple more post from Luca and dsjstr

I've posted a similar amount as you, but what would you like to hear from me? Any questions or just unsure of where I stand because most of my posts have been neutral.

This feels like appeasement.

dsjstr's Town game was nothing like this in the previous game - he was forthright in his opinions. I'm considering putting my vote here.

Also, its a bit convenient that even though you got your phone back you wait until now to start accusing someone.

So what was this about?

Sounds like you SR me here for the same reason you're now TR'ing me.

Actually yea i have committed to it now. VOTE: dsjstr I think if we have to get rid of someone today it should be dsjstr or Luca.

How would lynching me help town D2? Do you think I am associated with someone? Can you provide some more context to your vote when you wanted to hear more from me then proceeded to not prob me and then immediately jump on the BW to vote for me.

I don't like this reaction. Again it seems like you're subtly shading the person who is attacking you, and the

'do you think I'm associated with someone'

is a really weak line of defence on D1 and has no purpose other than to muddy the waters.

I really dislike BS still but I'm happy to join this for now.

VOTE: dsjstr

dsjstr's recent posts show he is entirely self-conscious of how his actions might be perceived, and his focus is on this rather than on finding scum.

He wasn't like this at all as Town in his previous game with me. I feel pretty good about this read.

[IMASPY]

Why would the cop have check dsjstr. We are the only 2 people

alive

that has even said dsjstr is scummy(which you didnt agree with day 1). And now that you are saying he is not scummy the only people left to check dsjstr tonight would be if you or i are cop.

[IMASPY]

I’m getting a townie vibe from 331.

UNVOTE:

VOTE: Blatant Scum

I really think Spy is Town; his thoughts on Dawoodle and dsjstr have reflected my own, and I like his line of questioning towards dsjstr.

I don't particularly like the Flippy slot, but both Lucca and dsjstr look a lot worse from where I'm standing.

I'm getting bad vibes from dsjstr in his recent interaction with Spy - the way he questions him but then quickly reassures Spy that he doesn't SR him, it's like he's trying to be on his good side while looking productive.

Dsjstr isn't being productive at all, however - it seems as though he's waiting to see what cards are lain before he commits himself.

Luca why are you hesitant to place your vote on me?

Because I strongly SR you and Icon, and to a slightly lesser extent lucca, and need to review Poyzin. I'm figuring out which way I'm leaning.

[IMASPY]

I just a 300 post span in which he did not change his mind on you. He only instead voted the other person he was scumreading.

Can you go through Luca's iso and find 1 post that he shows changing his mind about you being scum.

[IMASPY]

Why would the cop have check dsjstr. We are the only 2 people

alive

that has even said dsjstr is scummy(which you didnt agree with day 1). And now that you are saying he is not scummy the only people left to check dsjstr tonight would be if you or i are cop.

Luca changed his mind btw

Did i say it was indicative of dsjstrs alignment?

I was posting the quotes as a response to you and dsjstrs post.

[IMASPY]

Why would the cop have check dsjstr. We are the only 2 people

alive

that has even said dsjstr is scummy(which you didnt agree with day 1). And now that you are saying he is not scummy the only people left to check dsjstr tonight would be if you or i are cop.

Luca changed his mind btw

I just a 300 post span in which he did not change his mind on you. He only instead voted the other person he was scumreading.

Can you go through Luca's iso and find 1 post that he shows changing his mind about you being scum.

You did say “Go through Luca’s posts and show me one post where he changes his mind of you”

I believe asking that question was a good way to show dsjstr is just saying stuff to clear himself instead of actually thinking about what was said in the game.

[IMASPY]

After i easily refuted his throw away "luca changed his mind" post he instead of attempting to clear this up he simply says
"Okay

What does that prove?"

It proves that you are just saying whatever you can without attempting to use the resources available to you to clear your name.

[IMASPY]

If i say luca claimed cop... would you not all jump on me for saying something that was never said?

If you contest me by saying can you prove luca claimed cop i can just say Okay, what does that prove?

[IMASPY]

Obviously if you say something happened then you should be able to back it up.

[IMASPY]

or at the VERY LEAST retract your statement and say oops sorry i think i was wrong about this.

[IMASPY]

Are you trying to lynch anyone for any reason whats so ever?

[IMASPY]

Okay, feel free to ignore this post as you have with many others that have questioned what you have said.

How is me pointing out that one of the two people that voted for you day 1 not some kind of evidence towards you being scummy?
How is me pointing out that you are saying things without evidence to back them up not some kind of evidence towards you being scummy?
How is me showing your inconsistencies in your stance on poyzin not some kind of evidence towards you being scummy?
How is me pointing out that your only true vote has been made on insomnia day 2 after they started to really sus you not some kind of evidence towards you being scummy?

[IMASPY]

How is me pointing out that one of the two people that voted for you day 1 was killed not some kind of evidence towards you being scummy?

Sorry this question was incomplete

[IMASPY]

You keep on saying i have put forth no cases and im treating you with some kind of personal ill will.
If you are town i will say sorry for being wrong and making you feel as if you cant play this game.
But if you are scum i will truely never want to play with you again for trying to use some kind of sympathy angle to avoid actually contributing.

[IMASPY]

Its okay for you to play how ever you see fit. You are free to get a replacement if you truely wish to no longer play this game. As far as i can tell there is no penalty on this site for withdrawing from the game.

[IMASPY]

Furthermore, Id hope if the mod perceived my playing as some type of personal attack they would warn me or something.

[IMASPY]

I meant other players in the game. Whether they see your reasoning as AI/NAI and if it makes me scum.

Why cant you respond to the post? Im not saying it makes you scum to not respond to it.. but what reason do you have to not respond? It was directed at you. It was in a direct response to you claiming i have made post with reasons as why i think you are scum.

[IMASPY]

So when you say i give no evidence, and then i give 4 of the times i have gave evidence that would suggest you are scum.

Your response to that is "I am not scum"

[IMASPY]

Insomnia who are you looking to hear more from before we hammer him?

I mean i suppose we should wait for a final defense or something. Mod doesnt give anything like that right maybe a PM i havent experienced yet?

[IMASPY]

Why not just give it a shot?

[IMASPY]

also 3 people have flipped VT so PR is likely to have a gamesolve by now i would hope?
or at least a near gamesolve. at this point even if its just masons i would hazad to say that at minimum we get 1 claer on each day minimum which helps immensely for town direction imho

Yeah might as well Hard Claim PR Now.
Won’t reveal which one, to see if I can catch scum in a lie in case they are trying to fake PR.

This post really seems like what a scum would say if he is gonna cc the PR that comes out...

[IMASPY]

It is a post that would completely clear you as town for today's lynch without actually offering any benefits that comes with a PR claim