Mini Normal 2313: I am sitting in a room (game over)

[Andante]

lol I love how yall had the exact same reaction to that post as me, and by Charles not having it, and ignoring it completely, slightly sus of Charles for a partner

VOTE: AnimatedWiz

[Andante]

My first game featured a quickhammer D1, so I’m a bit reluctant to throw out a vote super early (since I was the first to vote for that person). I respect the suspicion, though.

I mean, my issue is more your post reads as nervous scum to post, like, no thoughts on anything else posted?
it's like, your post just feels a lot more like an awkward scum entrance than towny one, I understand not wanting to vote, but like, you're putting more focus on why you're not voting, implying you wanna wait forever to vote, and based on your posts so far, you're putting more focus on "I don't wanna vote" than "I think my reads are this"

which is why I think you're scum, idk what charles is doing, but it feels like scum trying to pull attention away from a partner, so that's how I SR you both (you're the stronger sr) and the 2 voting you are my town leans cause that was honestly my reaction

[Andante]

I want the protective role to aim elsewhere.

Wifom mafia scum, wifom…

Do you think the scum would go for you and risk not getting a nightkill off, or do you think they’d go for someone unexpected and hope they get a power role? Obviously, lots of WIFOM here, but I’ve never played with an Innocent Child before and I’m not sure what the meta is around them.

This post?? I know you said you were newer here, do you mean new as in like, having never played mafia before? Us discussing what the nightkill will be does nothing for us, ideally we find mafia, and I have yet to see you try to do that

[Andante]

What I don’t know about is the “don’t like Charles gpt post, not good!!” stuff followed by no votes there, like… no votes??

idk i’m on phone and have spent most of today sleeping

[Andante]

dann’s playstyle this game seems too chill/laid back, I also don’t know what I think of it

bug’s early readslist is probably a good sign for bug, time shall tell, but that’s definitely not the kind of effort scum would likely give this slow paced game

[Andante]

Charles/Animated/dann are my early leaders for where I’m looking, obv they’re not the scumteam, Shrek had a weak post if I remember? a lot of the player list just isn’t doing much and idk how I feel about it, cause one possibility would be in a town!animated world, scum is trying to stay out of it, let us town take charge there then tomorrow they’d be “off the hook”

[Andante]

dann’s playstyle this game seems too chill/laid back, I also don’t know what I think of it

bug’s early readslist is probably a good sign for bug, time shall tell, but that’s definitely not the kind of effort scum would likely give this slow paced game

Why can't scum give that effort?

scum can? why do you think I literally said what I said…

VOTE: hu tao

[Andante]

Am I reading wrong..? You literally said that's not the kind of effort scum would give? And I'm asking why that's the case

“time shall tell”

[Andante]

What I don’t know about is the “don’t like Charles gpt post, not good!!” stuff followed by no votes there, like… no votes??

idk i’m on phone and have spent most of today sleeping

Thinking that the Chat GPT stuff is weird isn't the same thing as thinking that it's inherently scummy

dann’s playstyle this game seems too chill/laid back, I also don’t know what I think of it

bug’s early readslist is probably a good sign for bug, time shall tell, but that’s definitely not the kind of effort scum would likely give this slow paced game

Why do you think that this game is slow-paced? It seems like everyone is already firing on all syllables and trying to find anything to latch onto.

I agree that brrightbluebug's read list feels townie

it feels like nothing is happening, thus feels slow, idk my days are stupid fast paced these days lol cause the stuff I can comment on are essentially just replies to stuff people say about my posts and mehhh

readwise, not a whole lot to go off of, but like today was my day off, so obviously I wish it were faster..


also I kinda love what seems to be polar opposite reqctions to my thoughts on bug’s list lol

[Andante]

are we serious? I’m the one here posting filler just to post?

TIME SHALL TELL LITERALLY MEANS IM NOT LOCKING IN THE READ AND PLAN ON REEVALUATING IT, All i did was comment on that being a good look and I’ll stand by it, and I’m used to fast paced maf lol so this is very slow to me but whatever…

Hu Tao, you wanna talk about posting just to post? 1 look at your iso…

[Andante]

ok, no more ChatGPT posts, I promise to be me.

brightbluebug, please set up an avatar picture ASAP. That is one of my pet peeves.

I only know one thing, Generic is town. I will sheep wherever he goes. For that reason I am placing my vote on
VOTE: AnimatedWiz

very bad vote

So your saying you arnt trying to solve the game as thats what it looks like. Out side of conf town voting there dont you want to atleast sort that player. As what makes you think gen is even right.

it's hard to explain, but this post feels like scum taking advantage of a bad post from town, gives me flashbacks to me as scum where I'll jump on a bad town post like this...

not saying I TR Charles at all, but that's legit what bob's post here is reminding me of.

[Andante]

Looking at the PL, I can't recall anything from these 5

- Gumiguy
- Afrayed Knott
- BlackStar
- Shrek
- Black

[Andante]

bob feels town. I like his point re: Andante. Making associations this early kinda feels like they are trying to do too much? Like "hey I'm solving I'm so town"

I could see a Black and bob team tbh, bob is the only one Black has made a point to go "I think X is town BECAUSE of this reason" and then the 3rd is likely in shrek/gumi/afrayed or something like that

[Andante]

idk, I read 84 and just really didn't like it

[Andante]

It's like you wanted to rush out of RVS the second it started and you're throwing shade at everyone who isn't trying to move as quickly as you

* I don't do rvs
* I'm just giving my thoughts on stuff as I read it, knowing full well I'm going to fall behind

like, I'm literally just trying my best here with what yall are giving me to work with, I'm off of work right now, thus I have the time to give this my all, thus I am here. not entirely sure the issue? If you wanna take charge/get people to start playing, be my guest!! but hey, I literally have to start somewhere to get reads, and as time moves on, my reads evolve

[Andante]

VOTE: bob3141

[Andante]

Be honest what you have done heere just looks like your trying to pocket charles by white knighting them

why am I pocketing charles? I don't care to sort a slot doing nothing, your post looked more like scum quoting town/finding bad logic town says and going there than this actual thought you had

you said:
~~~~~~~~~~`
very bad vote

So your saying you arnt trying to solve the game as thats what it looks like. Out side of conf town voting there dont you want to atleast sort that player. As what makes you think gen is even right.
~~~~~~~~`

That doesn't look like you going "I SR this person" it looks like you're trying to say just wnough for someone else to go "yeah!! charles scummy!!!" when you KNOW there were like 5 people who just called charles scummy the other page

yet I'm over here white knighting charles??

[Andante]

Gumiguy is town. that's my strongest tr

[Andante]

I liked 102, that seemed like it comes from town

[Andante]

i agree with 66 that bug's readslist is a good sign. bug is probably town

I feel like calling town for only the readslist is dangerous though, like yes good look, but we've had nothing since, so ehhh

[Andante]

am i the only one who hated bug's reads list

I mean, I said I wanted more, just that list isn't enough for a tr from me

[Andante]

i agree with 66 that bug's readslist is a good sign. bug is probably town

I feel like calling town for only the readslist is dangerous though, like yes good look, but we've had nothing since, so ehhh

true, but the day is only two IRL days long. the fact that bug hasn't posted more hasn't pinged me yet. and yeah posting a readslist isn't inherently townie but i tend to townread it when a newbie does it for some reason

the list is kinda all bug has done... like where's the live interaction with anyone?

[Andante]

ok so do you scum read adante?

I'm choosing to give them the benefit of the doubt for now and say that they're probably just overeager town. But there's a chance that they're scum trying to look busy. I guess I'll say that I'm 70% sure they're town right now

How was anything I said “trying to look busy”??

[Andante]

oooh lots of words!

[Andante]

I think Andante seems a bit forced at the moment.

ok so do you scum read adante?

I'm choosing to give them the benefit of the doubt for now and say that they're probably just overeager town. But there's a chance that they're scum trying to look busy. I guess I'll say that I'm 70% sure they're town right now

While I scumread Andante, I feel this reason for your Andante read seems like you're tiptoe-ing this and makes me want to scumread you too.

VOTE: BlackStar

out for blood... or so it seems, then you move on, and I wanna say I saw you calling me maf again recently, I have no votes on me currently, so like all you're gonna do is just sit there and call me maf?

[Andante]

At this point multiple people have said that Andante’s posts felt a bit unnatural but that they ultimately town read her. Which is the same thing that I said. I’m not sure what the problem is

I don't Town read her, but besides that. Your post kinda felt like you didn't want to take a stance. So in my point of view you look like partners

I mean, it's really feeling like you're trying not to take many stance here, so calling someone else out for not taking stances??
I wanna say our playstyles kept clashing in another game we played together, I could be wrong though

[Andante]

Oh, thanks for reminding me! Uh, let’s see… he seems shrewd, and like he’s making a decent readlist in his head. I personally would like to hear it, but I get the feeling that it’ll come later D1 or D2 (and will probably be great then but need that time to be completed). I townread him personally, but it’s only at a moderate strength right now.

There's no way Dann is not your scum partner... reading this post...

[Andante]

I’m also not a fan of how short Charles’s answers are—just going to put this here to document my feelings for now.

VOTE: Charles510

I’m going to keep my vote on Charles for now—I admit that reaction wasn’t what I expected, but I feel like I should just keep my eye on him anyway.

voting charles now? not earlier?? really feels like you're just trying to play it safe here

[Andante]

Team is probably like bob/dann/animated

VOTE: animated

[Andante]

Andante if im right and ypur town you need to stop making these reads that depend on partnerships its going to be impossible to spot correctly and then spend the rest of same twisting what you read to match your conf bias

how has anything I said "twisting what I read to match my thoughts" I know I'll do that, but like, I haven't been locked into any set team

[Andante]

So yeah, I think I'm good with an animated vote. I don't like 178 at all, and the was we talk about dann there just... nah it's not town talking about a genuine read. I could be wrong on partners, but I'm not wrong on animated being scum, cause that flip to the charles stuff too, just has terrible timing, there's no chance animated is town

[Andante]

hmmmm
UNVOTE:

[Andante]

I don't know if I love the person just coasting... agreeing with me

[Andante]

Honestly, I feel like Annie's posts just don't come from a townie. He seems apprehensive about making any non-town reads on anyone and when he does it feels... superficial. The scum read on Charles for answering a question is just odd, and his first post not including a vote during RVS felt overly safe as well.

VOTE: AnimatedWiz

this feels like... idk.. "let me hop on this wagon andante seems passionate about!!!"

[Andante]

I think I like Animated... at least enough for a d1 pass

[Andante]

[Hu Tau, Charles, Andante]
[Bob, BlackStar]
[Shrek, bug, Afrayed Knott]
[Gumiguy, Dannflor]
[Annie]

What makes charles so high on your list?

[Andante]

Whoa, hold up, wait. Let me read and come up with some things.

Charles, did this ever happen? What have you come up with

[Andante]

Look at the people he’s voting and scum reading

Not exactly unpopular or hard slots to push

He only posted a big reads list after he got pressure for not providing many real stances

I think he’s much closer to passive and careful in terms of how he’s responding to people and handling the thread

I’d be much more impressed if he pushed someone like, say, me, instead of going after the LHF and accusing me of doing the same to discredit me

you keep calling charles lhf, but quite honestly, has charles even done anything to be TRed? Black over here has charles in the top rank of TRs... off of that ISO?? you're as confident in your read on charles as you are as hu tao/me??

black is definitely becoming a sr of mine, but I want something of value from charles or im perfectly fine yeeting charles d1

[Andante]

Whoa, hold up, wait. Let me read and come up with some things.

that doesn't come from new scum??

[Andante]

UNVOTE:

I kind of expected a different response from Charles here if he's a new player that rolled scum. I feel like it's more likely he would ask for advice in the scum PT rather than quickly posting that he'll read and "come up with some stuff"

Thank you for that. I'm pretty new to mafia and don't know what to say.

and that too??

[Andante]

I don't feel like we're reading the same game

[Andante]

so if someone is new and scum, they'd be posting more?? like, I'm not getting what you're saying here, charles is the textbook coasting new scum right now.

there's literally 3 in the scum team, with good partners charles really doesn't have to do much

[Andante]

if charles is scum, dann is a partner for sure, all dann keeps doing is yelling about how charles is lhf, which like, yeah sure. but if charles flips scum, that "defense" is just "mehhh lhf slot" if charles!town it's "told yall lhf"

[Andante]

I’m not confident charles is town, I could be wrong

But i don’t like most of the slots scum reading him which makes me think of him as more likely to be town

basically no one is SRing him, and you didn't bat an eye at how he's one of black's top TRs??
what are your thoughts on black's reasoning for the tr on charles

[Andante]

Whoa, hold up, wait. Let me read and come up with some things.

that doesn't come from new scum??

UNVOTE:

I kind of expected a different response from Charles here if he's a new player that rolled scum. I feel like it's more likely he would ask for advice in the scum PT rather than quickly posting that he'll read and "come up with some stuff"

Thank you for that. I'm pretty new to mafia and don't know what to say.

and that too??

I already explained this but I think newscum is more likely to go to the PT for advice here instead of frantically posting that they'll find something of substance after a couple of votes pile onto them

And yeah I don't think scum would thank me for townreading them lol

you think the guy talking about chat gpt would go to the PT and go "what do i do??"
cause I seriously doubt that's how that would ever play out, and I'm not even sure you believe what you just said...

[Andante]

Andante what are your current thoughts on Annie?

I already said I'm giving Animated a d1 pass, I'm limming in you/charles/ possibly dann

[Andante]

there's literally 3 in the scum team, with good partners charles really doesn't have to do much

To be fair, with how many new and returning players there are this game, it’s not impossible for there to be multiple inexperienced people on the scumteam, or even for all of them to be.

Means we can’t only assume a newscum would be coached.

So hang on here, I don't even believe charles is actually new, but this post is like... basically saying someone is coaching in the scum pt... and there's only 3 people here with access to it

[Andante]

I’m not confident charles is town, I could be wrong

But i don’t like most of the slots scum reading him which makes me think of him as more likely to be town

basically no one is SRing him, and you didn't bat an eye at how he's one of black's top TRs??
what are your thoughts on black's reasoning for the tr on charles

Maybe he didn't bat an eye because he actually saw my reasoning and you skipped over it?

I think what's happening is someone is TMIing Charles town, cause that slot has nothing towny in that iso... and uhhh what I said earlier about a d1 pass... I take that comment back...

[Andante]

Andante what are your current thoughts on Annie?

I already said I'm giving Animated a d1 pass, I'm limming in you/charles/ possibly dann

I'm down to go Dann tbh but I'd rather go Annie first

I just have some doubts with Animated, and it's like, they keep talking... Gumi? Charles? basically no where to be found.
And a part of me like really SRs dann lol, his play is like.. idk feels scummy, but my reads have been changing too much I don't wanna commit to a lim yet

[Andante]

where's shrek?

[Andante]

I just hate the huge gap we have between top posters and people not posting... literally a reason I wanna lim in the lower posters

[Andante]

actually.... bug.. has done NOTHING since that readslist... yeah I'll put bug as the #1 person I wanna yeet here

[Andante]

this is out of place in the current conversation but while adante’s activeness and making associations so quickly puts me off a bit, if they were scum they likely would have stopped pushing rather than making the partnership read and reaffirming their confidence in animated being scum.

Post #102 just still does not sit right in my mind. And lack of content is a burning star right now. Eyes still on Dann, want to see what he brings to the table now.

gumiguy’s post 102 doesn’t seem suspicious or indicative of anything, afrayed could you tell me more about your reasoning

also feels like tmi knowing I'm town, tmi that gumi is town? afrayed might be a partner, I know afrayed has been posting, its been a lot and I haven't read much of it..

[Andante]

but 229 feels a lot like trying to interact with partner afrayed...which goes along with the coaching whatever since bug hasn't tried to interact with anyone else

[Andante]

but 229 feels a lot like trying to interact with partner afrayed...which goes along with the coaching whatever since bug hasn't tried to interact with anyone else

I did think this was a possible partner interaction

yeah like, based on afrayed's posts (not that I'm really reading them) it's really feeling like afrayed would be a coaching type person, I saw your reads near that and I wanna say I might be on the same page as you with like, bug/afrayed/BlackStar

I hated BlackStar's reads list which is also around there

[Andante]

actually.... bug.. has done NOTHING since that readslist... yeah I'll put bug as the #1 person I wanna yeet here

Is it possible that any of them will get more active during the weekend due to having free time then?

I mean yeah sure, but like if you look at activity... it's 30+ posters and under 10 posters... meaning they'll spend their "free time" catching up.. like I won't be here this weekend much, so I don't care what they decide to do, I work with the info I have now.

VOTE: bug

I think this is a solid vote

[Andante]

also like, a bunch of us were all "yeah!! bug towny for the reads list!!" then bug simply dissapeared... as if to go "ok my job here is done" which like, is much more likely to come from scum, since a lot of time town doesn't care how they're looked at, town's job is to find scum, and scum's main focus is to look towny... so yeah I'm definitely thinking a bug lim here is good

[Andante]

I think scum would feel relieved too

What do you make of BlackStar doing the same thing after you said you town read that

I do not tr blackstar at all lol

[Andante]

That’s rather possible, but I think Shrek is the most suspicious out of that group. Their only “real” posts (43 and 95) seem to have analysis, but ultimately both just say certain people

could

be town and in doing so try to take heat off certain people (me, Andante, Charles, and Bob). It comes off as rather weak and wishy-washy, even in my opinion.

VOTE: Shrek

I'm a tad confused on this... like, you saw shrek was getting prodded, and at that point you just wait for them to return and go from there??

[Andante]

Why are you asking questions and being present when you still have many pages to read? Just curious

Do you think it's more likely to be scum indicative or town indicative for someone to try to interact in live time before catching up on many pages?

[Andante]

Why are you asking questions and being present when you still have many pages to read? Just curious

I'm just trying to figure out who I think is scummy. Please be patient with me.

I'm very patient. Do you think asking people who they think are scummy is a better way to find scum than reading and trying to find things yourself?

In a word, yes.

It is easier for me to have a conversatiion in the moment than to wade through 16 pages of stuff. I am more interested in what people think *right now* than what they might have been thinking in the past.

I honestly agree with this and this feels like such a townie mindset, with the focus on right now versus past thoughts

[Andante]

I'm not sure I like how Black has been interacting with Charles here, doesn't feel like it's this good faith/honest way of interacting?? idk how to explain it, I'm curious if anyone else feels the same way, it feels like Black is trying to paint something charles says in a negative way? to get someone else to jump on it??

I'm bad at explaining stuff that I'm like "feels sus" but literally none of this feels like "I'm trying to sort Charles" or "What is your stance on the game charles?"

[Andante]

UNVOTE:
just so no hammer happens while I'm at work

cause I want to sort people more than I have before we lim anyone, but consider my vote on bug for now, bug/Afrayed are looking like a good option, I need to read Afrayed more, I need to get Black/BlackStar sorted in my head, neither really are making me tr them and obviously if it's bug and Afrayed, it can't be both them (I also don't think it's both them based on an interaction they had)

[Andante]

hi!!! I didn't forget about yall, just was busy with work lol

[Andante]

bob's interactions with bug feel very partnery

[Andante]

Afrayed/bob/bug as the team? could it be that simple...
honestly, I think bug still seems like a fine lim

[Andante]

like, for someone who was able to produce a readslist, I don't get why bug can't do much in terms of posting, cause I'm not impressed by these posts

VOTE: bug

[Andante]

I’m also fine just burning a ml on charles cause all this chatgpt stuff is annoying

call me anti town all you want for being ok limming outside my scumteam solve, but if town chatgpt charles is just gonna be a liability, and I’d rather deal with it now versus later, i do think bug is the better lim here though, at the very least yall need to pressure bug

hey bug, can we get an updated readslist?

[Andante]

i do think bug is the better lim here though, at the very least yall need to pressure bug

hey bug, can we get an updated readslist?

Quoted for attention.

“for attention”
I don’t get it?

[Andante]

after a quick skim

VOTE: brightbluebug

really hasnt done anythign since their read wall. A read wall doesnt match with the level of activity they have as you usualy expect more reads to go around it. But their case the read wall has every mention of a read in it

Also dont like their last post. Always a bit of flag when some ask about a player but doesnt give any extra on that slot

Bright what is your read on blackstar?

i don't have any thoughts honestly? blackstar hasn't stood out to me at all compared to some others like adante or charles, thus my previous question

cause if you’re trying to tell me that’s an updated readslist…
like ok charles and I stand out… I really don’t feel like charles and I are posting the same, what about us stands out?

It’s not hard to go “andante stands out cause she has the most posts and charles posting style stands out” I don’t even see this post as a genuine attempt at making a read, and bug flat out isn’t posting, so what is bug doing in this game? other than only trying to appear towny, this isn’t even scumhunting

[Andante]

I also note that I didn’t give my feel on Gumi, which is probably because he’s been anway from the game more than in it.

"Gumi, really hasn't said much that sticks out to me other than post 102" was my original read for me after joining the game. I see that the level of time in thread is still sparse and when he comes in he is treading water in my opinion. doesnt say much and doesnt really challenge anyone. Im going to have to lean scum on him, again I feel he may well be lurking.

so based on my current reads, notwithstanding the possible answers to my question in 601, for me the scum team is probably Charles/Andante/Bluebug or Charles/Andante/Gumi or Charles/Bluebug/Gumi. Right now I can't see a scum team without Charles in it.

how on earth am i in 2/3 of your scumteams yet I think you have mentioned me once before…

[Andante]

like yeah I’ve called you scum with blue (I think) but you haven’t commented on that once?? so by you throwing me in 2/3 of your teams, it shows you’re aware of that, and an easy scum strat is to just go after the ones that are sus of you…

cause if I’m truly in 2/3 of your teams, I really feel like town!you would have actually said something about why you sr me

[Andante]

new thought I just had…
VOTE: BlackStar

[Andante]

I think someone else may have seen what I see/had that same realization after recent posts

[Andante]

hey bug, why do you have a lack of effort this game?

[Andante]

hey bug, why do you have a lack of effort this game?

i simply don’t know what to discuss

but you just said you skimmed and that's your reads, implying you are not following along/reading everything, is there a reason you simply don't care about this game?

cause not caring and not talking are kinda different

[Andante]

I also note that I didn’t give my feel on Gumi, which is probably because he’s been anway from the game more than in it.

"Gumi, really hasn't said much that sticks out to me other than post 102" was my original read for me after joining the game. I see that the level of time in thread is still sparse and when he comes in he is treading water in my opinion. doesnt say much and doesnt really challenge anyone. Im going to have to lean scum on him, again I feel he may well be lurking.

so based on my current reads, notwithstanding the possible answers to my question in 601, for me the scum team is probably Charles/Andante/Bluebug or Charles/Andante/Gumi or Charles/Bluebug/Gumi. Right now I can't see a scum team without Charles in it.

how on earth am i in 2/3 of your scumteams yet I think you have mentioned me once before…

becasue you are,

ndante, A lot of content and much of it reads to me like someone who is hyperactive, if you are Andante then great that you can portrait that in your text, if not I appologise for getting it wrong and mean you no ill. So for the content - well a lot is page filler and ties in with my comment on hyperactivity, but there is a lot of pepperpotting going on, Has anyone else noticed how regular she posts her suspected scum team, and it generally changes with different suspects in most lists. Ok that maybe because she is genuinely reacting to what is going on in the thread at the time, or it might be that she is picking up on scum reads or bad vibes from others and is trying to steer votes in this way. Surely that would be a scum tactic, to muddy the waters? It couold of course be argued that is a thin connectin to make, and yet its a connection, its all I have. So I will lean Scum on Andante.

oh yeah I did read that and thought "lol I'm literally hyperactive at work too"
and idk what pepperpotting meant and that was that

and like yeah, don't get me wrong when I'm scum my strat is definitely to derail, but I feel like my SRs have been very valid? you're saying I can't change them that much? like obviously when the game starts there's essentially nothing to go off of, how do I get the game state out of rvs? I start pushing whoever, have to get content somehow

I don't like how the entire "case" you're making against me is muddying the waters, and like you're still sticking with it??

I was as active as I was cause I knew I was about to be very busy with work (given by my lack of participation lately) so I was trying my absolute best to solve this early, and like to me, that alone seems real towny to me... I could've just played the "oh I haven't read... just skimmed... idk" card

~~~~~~~~~~~

also, no one is really pushing me... it feels odd, like everyone else has had some sort of valid case there or whatever... do I scare scum? and like I've been TMI'd as town? cause that would be pretty cool....

[Andante]

like yeah I’ve called you scum with blue (I think) but you haven’t commented on that once?? so by you throwing me in 2/3 of your teams, it shows you’re aware of that, and an easy scum strat is to just go after the ones that are sus of you…

cause if I’m truly in 2/3 of your teams, I really feel like town!you would have actually said something about why you sr me

I did, and its clear you havent read what I said or you would have reacted to it. so this is rather reactive, and sus in its own right

There are a lot of things I have read and wanted to react to, but I was on my phone and on a 15 minute break so I opted not to...

[Andante]

hey bug, why do you have a lack of effort this game?

i simply don’t know what to discuss

but you just said you skimmed and that's your reads, implying you are not following along/reading everything, is there a reason you simply don't care about this game?

cause not caring and not talking are kinda different

those on my read list are just ones who have made posts that really stuck out to me/ones i managed to interpret. i don’t have time / can’t read through the entire thread several times and take notes to get specific reads on everybody, and without specific reads on everybody/anybody i’m not confident enough in anything to accuse any particular person as scum or engage in discussion about someone i don’t have enough opinions on

what about looking up the ISO of people you have 0 thoughts on? so you see all of their posts, and only their posts, if you tried that could you get some thoughts on a few of those you have no opinions on?

[Andante]

Dann's recent activity is starting to smell like his play in the scum games he has quoted. maybe its hard to maintain that veil and eventually the guard drops?

I was leaning null on Merlyn, but honestly I now feel they are sitting with scum. Its not just that they have been pushing me and helped my wagon build, primarily by selective quoting and misrepping. It is also to do with the slots initial game play before the sub. So yes my opinion is changing and I would agree with Bob's reasoning concerning my wagon.

There's definitely at least one in Dann/Merlyn

[Andante]

also can yall stop self voting

[Andante]

im so confused by that, and uhh no one ever said I have good tactics?
I'm not skimming, I'm reading all, I do not always have the time to post. And yes I forget my mental notes sometimes, but sorry not sorry when you work late, clopen, then open for 3 shifts in a row, that alone pretty much erases memory, and I'm literally trying my best here

[Andante]

I told you, I was so active at the start because I knew I would basically drop off the world, it is not my fault you were not here actively playing the game when I was trying to solve initially

[Andante]

also, no one is really pushing me... it feels odd, like everyone else has had some sort of valid case there or whatever... do I scare scum? and like I've been TMI'd as town? cause that would be pretty cool....

what should you be pushed on?

idk I’m like death tunneled every game, it’s kinda odd here

[Andante]

well

im not just gonna town read anyone who self votes

it doesn't work like that

this being the 2nd person to self vote? yeah nah.

but like to self and then do all those posts?? idk i’m not gonna be mad if we hammer afrayed

and i’m honestly tempted to do it, cause again, why on earth would you self and THEN go into tryhard mode, makes no sense

[Andante]

did afrayed claim yet

no, saw someone else selfvote this game, then also decided to self, and then went into this super tryhard mode or whatever??

[Andante]

Has it really been that long since I've posted? I notice I'm playing too passively and then immediately proceed to shut my trap so long I get prodded... eugh.

care to share any reads?

[Andante]

no thoughts on any of afrayed’s acrual posts?? literally just repeating what I said?

[Andante]

VOTE: gumi

[Andante]

trying to read this gamestate is wld

[Andante]

like, it's so close to eod and feels so dead

[Andante]

I do not like how gumi answered the prod, said nothing, and disappeared. Like, I can not see any town motivation in that, it feels like gumi is trying to be similar to bug, but I like bug more than gumi right now.

And then there's the self voter on e-1...

Afrayed/bug/gumi - if that has 2 or more town in it (which is likely true) like, how are we supposed to lim scum here...

[Andante]

idk, it's just frustrating. a part of me really just wants to yeet gumi for the prod response then doing nothing...
but a part of me is also like "just end the day and hammer the e-1 voter"

[Andante]

@ someone else who is also town here
Can I get your thoughts on this gamestate?

[Andante]

good talk people... good talk

[Andante]

know what, I'm ending the day, maybe yall can think about this game overnight or something. if this flips scum like I think it will, bob's reaction to hammering this was scummy

VOTE: Afrayed

[Andante]

alright, so going forward, if you're town, can you please not self. thanks

[Andante]

Afrayed Knott be warned i might end up hammering if your still self voting by the end of teh day

I'm still on this, even though it was a town flip, it's like, this post feels SO SCUMMY

[Andante]

VOTE: Andante

wanna explain? was it my hammer? right, cause scum me does that.

[Andante]

VOTE: bob

[Andante]

bob is one for sure, I have no idea where the ones outside bob is, but I wanna flip bob first, then go read. bob doesn't bus, so anything before now is probably useful for finding partners

[Andante]

wild guess hu tao is gonna be one, blaming me for the hammer? pshhh yall left afrayed on e-1 forever, and sorry not sorry, the guy self voted then decided to tryhard, and was the 2nd person to self vote. no way I was TRing that

[Andante]

can we not? like I'm the only one actually trying to play this game

[Andante]

yall are the ones refusing to talk to me, ignoring anything I do say, I bring up legit points and you're like "VOTE ANDANTE"

[Andante]

... can we fucking not

[Andante]

I wanna lim bob here

[Andante]

yall going "yeah bob scum" but voting elsewhere just makes me wanna vote there even more

[Andante]

brightbluebug, gumiguy, and bob3141

there's genuinely no way that is the entire team... I'd only believe it if I saw it

[Andante]

brightbluebug, gumiguy, and bob3141

there's genuinely no way that is the entire team... I'd only believe it if I saw it

Why is this so hard to believe?

I've never seen a team of just the lhf like that before, like bob is scared scum right now, he doesn't know what to post, so I understand that one, the other 2? just doing nothing?? there's like always a scum partner that'll like take charge or whatever. and of that trio, I'm not seeing a leader.

bug is likely just town, that partner interaction with afrayed thing... ehh probably just means town, and like I was talking about before I yeeted afrayed, we are in trouble because we have town doing absolutely nothing/not caring...

I want to yeet bob first because I know this is scum!bob

[Andante]

but that doesn't mean we're just sitting on our asses.

no, not all of you, but I'm referring to the self voting town we limmed day 1, the probable town in our no posters/people doing nothing.

It's not ALL of you, but it's basically half this PL, like we had a self voting town day 1... who in their right mind selfs then proceeds to tryhard.... like excuse me?? I'm still angry about that one

[Andante]

Everybody has their own way of doing things.

you don't actually seem mad afrayed flipped town there...

[Andante]

VOTE: blackstar

[Andante]

I'm gonna revisit you later, but yeah those posts make me feel like you genuinely don't care that afrayed flipped town, I can't be the only town here heavily annoyed we had a town self vote then proceed to tryhard... like in what world is that something TOWN would do...

VOTE: bob [/b]

I gotta go, so I'll leave my vote on the conf scum, but I wanna look at blackstar later

[Andante]

lol formatting XD

VOTE: bob

[Andante]

I've played with bob before, he's 100% scared scum right now

[Andante]

and he's not posting to probably avoid giving his partners away tbh

[Andante]

yep, if i feel impatient at the time and a bit annoyed i hammer even if i expect it to more likely town than scum.

again, he KNEW afrayed was town, I can't look at these lasts posts in his ISO without going "that is scum that knew it was gonna be a town flip"

[Andante]

sure, he can post what he wants, but that ISO, is so scummy... it can't be town, his entire approach to afrayed at eod there... scum

[Andante]

These were bob's final 3 posts for day 1...

Afrayed Knott be warned i might end up hammering if your still self voting by the end of teh day

Bob your eagerness to hammer anyone that self votes is interesting. Has this always been a thing with you?

I find it irritating. If there town they are playign against their wincon and if there scum they are just doing aTe

yep, if i feel impatient at the time and a bit annoyed i hammer even if i expect it to more likely town than scum.

[Andante]

if anyone wants to give the towny reasoning for them, I'm happy to listen, but I can not unsee it as scum that knew afrayed was town and about to flip town. cause especially on hammers, scum get nervous being the final person to hammer a town...

[Andante]

From the afraye wagon velocity i would say they are most likely town and that maybe 2 scum are involved.

This wouldnt of happened if they were scum as i for this to happen scum would have to be double bussing. And why would they when there is no real heat there.

like, here you're going "Afrayed town" doing nothing to stop it... and just a general "yeah probably 2 scum there"

[Andante]

fact this happened with the bug slot empty points that slot being statisticaly likely town

if bob is scum, bug is NOT a partner

[Andante]

From the afraye wagon velocity i would say they are most likely town and that maybe 2 scum are involved.

This wouldnt of happened if they were scum as i for this to happen scum would have to be double bussing. And why would they when there is no real heat there.

like, here you're going "Afrayed town" doing nothing to stop it... and just a general "yeah probably 2 scum there"

but in the ISO, it essentially was just this post, "bug likely town" then the 3 I quoted above...


so if you are town, and you're going "I think afrayed is town cause of the velocity of the wagon" you do not instantly go to "ok I'm hammering afrayed"

[Andante]

Andante feels way too confident in what she is saying lol

Maybe that's just a playstyle clash

who cares what I'm saying, just look at those posts, there's no way you don't reach the same conclusions

[Andante]

like, I'm not crazy... look at bob's final ISO posts... and just tell me how town even takes that pov??

[Andante]

From the afraye wagon velocity i would say they are most likely town and that maybe 2 scum are involved.

This wouldnt of happened if they were scum as i for this to happen scum would have to be double bussing. And why would they when there is no real heat there.

Merlyn, Black, dann, ami, hut tao

fact this happened with the bug slot empty points that slot being statisticaly likely town

Afrayed Knott be warned i might end up hammering if your still self voting by the end of teh day

Bob your eagerness to hammer anyone that self votes is interesting. Has this always been a thing with you?

I find it irritating. If there town they are playign against their wincon and if there scum they are just doing aTe

yep, if i feel impatient at the time and a bit annoyed i hammer even if i expect it to more likely town than scum.

[Andante]

^ That's the iso... just read that progression, and literally anyone (even bob if you want) just tell me how this is a towny progression of posts

[Andante]

how am I not being reasonable? I've explained it so many different ways

[Andante]

bob. is. scum.

[Andante]

and judging by all this resistance, likely a good pr

[Andante]

can we get bob first then?

[Andante]

plz

[Andante]

says the guy who hammered an obvous townie

if they were so obvious why didn't you do more to save afrayed?

[Andante]

I've played with bob before, he's 100% scared scum right now

quite curious when did you last play with me. as i cant remember you.

weren't we scum together?

[Andante]

I've played with bob before, he's 100% scared scum right now

quite curious when did you last play with me. as i cant remember you.

weren't we scum together?

oh jk I think I found what I was thinking of, I repped into a game you were scum, but I'm trying to recall who it even was then that I'm remembering... so long ago, either way, I still think you're scum here

[Andante]

says the guy who hammered an obvous townie

if they were so obvious why didn't you do more to save afrayed?

dont have time and thats not my style.

right, not your style, but you wanna yell at me for hammering. got it

[Andante]

even though you said you were gonna hammer it.... but since I did, you can yell at me for hammering the obv town.. cause yeah.. town selfs then tries hard... it's totally not scum going "oh woe is me!!!" like, Afrayed was the 2nd person to self vote....

[Andante]

Bob your eagerness to hammer anyone that self votes is interesting. Has this always been a thing with you?

I find it irritating. If there town they are playign against their wincon and if there scum they are just doing aTe

"They were obv town"

[Andante]

Bob your eagerness to hammer anyone that self votes is interesting. Has this always been a thing with you?

I find it irritating. If there town they are playign against their wincon and if there scum they are just doing aTe

"They were obv town"

I really don't think that's a statement Town!you truly believes...

[Andante]

Afrayed Knott be warned i might end up hammering if your still self voting by the end of teh day

"I never had any intent to hammer"
I feel like you should read your own ISO...

[Andante]

bob not even having an explanation for d1 thoughts, and just flat out denying feels so scummy. I'm even more convinced bob is not town

[Andante]

Bob your eagerness to hammer anyone that self votes is interesting. Has this always been a thing with you?

I find it irritating. If there town they are playign against their wincon and if there scum they are just doing aTe

"They were obv town"

yep, wagons only appear like that out of no where when there scum motivated. Town just isnt that organized especialy on some outside of the current pushes

I'm just saying, what you're saying NOW, does not line up with what you said on d1

[Andante]

bob... I think you're missing what I'm saying.

Here, you're all "Afrayed was obv town"

but your d1 posts show you were angling to hammer afrayed... but since I did it, now you're like "pshhh obv town"

[Andante]

Bob your eagerness to hammer anyone that self votes is interesting. Has this always been a thing with you?

I find it irritating. If there town they are playign against their wincon and if there scum they are just doing aTe

if you truly believe someone is OBV town, you do not go "if town this, but if scum that"

[Andante]

bug, you just made me laugh

[Andante]

bob... I think you're missing what I'm saying.

Here, you're all "Afrayed was obv town"

but your d1 posts show you were angling to hammer afrayed... but since I did it, now you're like "pshhh obv town"

again your splitting hairs. So far ive not ever missolved mini since returning

i don't get this, like I'm telling you, your posts I read. they show you were setting up to hammer, and giving yourself that "benefit of doubt" for after it flipped town. You enter today... AFRAYED WAS OBV TOWN!!!
like, so what if you have perfect solves in games? if afrayed was so obvious day 1, you should have done something to move the lim elsewhere, instead of "yeah I'll hammer the obv town!"


idk, I don't understand this logic, but don't think this makes bob town

[Andante]

From the afraye wagon velocity i would say they are most likely town and that maybe 2 scum are involved.

This wouldnt of happened if they were scum as i for this to happen scum would have to be double bussing. And why would they when there is no real heat there.

I feel like it was a slow burn that blew up suddenly rather than a sudden pivot.

I also like this Day 1 post

that post happened, and then it was "oh.. could be scum... I'll hammer"

[Andante]

Ask Hu Tao. they were in teh game i hammered flav even though i though they were obvous town

Today it would be de ja vu Hu Tao

there's no world in which hammering your top tr is optimal... and judging how you've done it before and you're the one bringing it up, shows you're aware of it and can mimic it as scum

[Andante]

I do

[Andante]

This feels like setting up to hammer

Afrayed Knott be warned i might end up hammering if your still self voting by the end of teh day

Bob your eagerness to hammer anyone that self votes is interesting. Has this always been a thing with you?

I find it irritating. If there town they are playign against their wincon and if there scum they are just doing aTe

yep, if i feel impatient at the time and a bit annoyed i hammer even if i expect it to more likely town than scum.

[Andante]

This feels like setting up to hammer

Afrayed Knott be warned i might end up hammering if your still self voting by the end of teh day

Bob your eagerness to hammer anyone that self votes is interesting. Has this always been a thing with you?

I find it irritating. If there town they are playign against their wincon and if there scum they are just doing aTe

yep, if i feel impatient at the time and a bit annoyed i hammer even if i expect it to more likely town than scum.

and it feels like bob KNEW afrayed was flipping town, that's the thing, and since I said it already, I think bob read it and is really playing into this "yeah I thought afrayed was obv town" card cause I feel like even if you truly believed afrayed was town there, you don't say it as much as bob has here

[Andante]

I really am townreading you, Andante, but I feel like you’re barking up the wrong tree again. Sure, Bob had some scummy stuff going on at the end of D1, but I don’t feel like the evidence is as damming for him as it is for other people.

Are we still going to ignore that fact that multiple people flip-flopped on their votes immediately on D2? I feel like Blackstar is still the better elimination here due to both that and D1.

VOTE: Blackstar

I'm not opposed to going to blackstar... I just need to read there, but I'm about to have to head out to work, and life is gonna be wild so it'll be... a bit before I'm back

[Andante]

I probably need to take more of a backseat tbh, I wanna get some solid TRs cause I have 1 of yall that's like a half tr, a lot of null, 1 strong sr, 1 scum lean, and 1 sxum possibility lol

[Andante]

oooh this distraction to blackstar... is cause bob is a strong scum pr...

[Andante]

the fact bob is abandoning all his d1 line of thinking

and like denying everything he said... "afrayed was obv town" uhhh no... your d1 posts say otherwise... bob ONLY mentioned afrayed at the end.. and it comes from having tmi.. so the only way to cover that up is the classic "oh that was obviously town..."

if afrayed was so obv town, there wouldn't have been a "if scum..."

[Andante]

I definitely think I can see a connection between the two yeah...

[Andante]

oooh this distraction to blackstar... is cause bob is a strong scum pr...

No what i am is pain in the ass for scum in any game. As if they dont execute me im near certain to solve the game.

uhhh you just said you hammer obv town? how is that a threat to scum?

[Andante]

bob. is. scum.

says the guy who hammered an obvous townie. Even if they might have been a liability with that tantrum after they got run up,

How can you call Afrayed an obvious townie now if you were willing to hammer him?

lol ok blackstar is town

[Andante]

UNVOTE:
we ain't going to night beofre I'm back!

[Andante]

I've played with bob before, he's 100% scared scum right now

Can you send a link of the game so I can read it?

i lied, was thinking of someone else

[Andante]

hi, kinda just prod dodging right now, will be back like monday to figure stuff out, honestly, I don't want charles and bug in a lylo situation, probably better off limming there today, I'm sure we'll wind up limming town again, but those 2.... as long as they do nothing, I want one limmed

[Andante]

VOTE: bug

[Andante]

If I can't catch up today I'll be back tomorrow morning

there's like nothing to catch up on...

[Andante]

I don't like 1160...

[Andante]

there's so much you could pop in with... but like we barely have any posts for d2 here, that's super easy to notice.. I hate the "If I can't catch up" it implies a lot happened in the game, why not just say "sorry I'm busy today, might not catch up till tomorrow" but the "if I can't catch up" feels wolfy

[Andante]

I think we should lim Bug today

[Andante]

I’m glad Afrayed is in your poe… it’s really feeling like your reads are real…

[Andante]

lol yeah no

VOTE: gob

[Andante]

can we just lim the claimed scum then talk tomorrow?

[Andante]

can we just lim the claimed scum then talk tomorrow?

This post is really really weird

weird?

[Andante]

can we not? like I'm the only one actually trying to play this game

yall are the ones refusing to talk to me, ignoring anything I do say, I bring up legit points and you're like "VOTE ANDANTE"

This frustration feels kinda fake. Now that other people are talking and trying to solve the game Andante wants us to stop talking and fade someone?

you realize 809 was posted on september 28th, it is now october 4th... yeah I was frustrated with gumi/charles/bug doing exactly nothing, cause I KNOW there's a town in that and town that doesn't even try to do anything is frustrating.

now this conversation is like "OMG IT'S DAN" and I don't really care to go down that path right now, would rather just lim gob, then bug, then think about dan

[Andante]

I'm not suggesting yall rush the day, but I have no interest discussing anything else right now

[Andante]

like black I think you're town, but "andante sounds different now than on september 28th" is like, why are you reaching that much? of course I'm different, life has changed a lot in a week

[Andante]

you want us to stop talking and fade someone

it's more the discussion is no longer gob/bug are scum but "MUST GET THE DEEPWOLF" and I mean whatever not like I'm actively stopping that convo, but again, it's just annoying. gob is so not town

[Andante]

Now you act like you don't want to rush the day but you don't want to talk about anything except players that aren't here and have barely been here all game?

it's almost like I think majority (2/3) of the scum are in those slots

[Andante]

And like the only person you want to engage with here is a semi cleared player that you think is town? Yeah I don't get it

it's almost like you were the only one talking to me... I don't understand the hatred for me here/what you want from me?? whatever, I'll go back to doing nothing

[Andante]

I just think your behavior seems off and I wanted to engage with you about it

yeah, and I'm explaining best I can, this whole line of "DAN MAF!!" truly isn't worth discussing today when dann won't be the lim, maybe I read those pages wrong, but that's all I got from all the talking, nothing has changed my mind to even come close to thinking gob town, so here we are

[Andante]

LOL why are there 3 people with "Black" in their name.

Dannflor, I 3-2-1 type wagons usually means mafia resistance on one of the top wagons.

Merlyn, Black, Dannflor, AnimatedWiz, Hu Tao, Afrayed Knott, Andante, BlackStar

This is my PoE for today. All the people who were on Knott.

VOTE: Merlyn

Again, back when gob was "giving genuine thoughts" putting Afrayed in the poe... all you did was copy and paste the names from that wagon, but changed the order since I hammered and was definitely last. like idk about yall but my gut reaction to a town lim like that is to look outside the wagon, cause if town is taking down town, scum is hiding in the shadows letting town push town over for no blood on their hands...

but again, literally putting the person we limmed in your poe shows level 0 solving, and in my books is more likely scum motivated than town motivated

[Andante]

VC 1.22 /// FINAL

Afrayed Knott

(7): Merlyn, Black, Dannflor, AnimatedWiz, Hu Tao, Afrayed Knott, Andante

BlackStar

(1): pisskop

AnimatedWiz

(1): Gumiguy

Hu Tao

(1): BlackStar

Not Voting

(3): brightbluebug, bob3141, Charles510

With 13 alive, it took 7 votes to scuttle a player. Day 1 has ended (countdown: (expired on 2023-09-28 06:30:00)).

mod notes: Tussling, failing

so along that thought I just had, and taking gob's idea,

poe would be pisskop/gumi(gob)/blackstar/bug/bob/charles(JV)

remove the IC, and charles who screams town- annoying but town, and you have a poe here of
and I'll take bob out for now with his claim

leaves:
gumi(gob)/blackstar/bug

and that is honestly not a bad pool to look in. like, it lines up with pretty much everything we're saying, but I'm not sure I'd believe the wagon was 100% town, but of these 3 I'd confidently believe it's at least a 2/3, based on how most town lim wagons work

[Andante]

that enough "caring" for yall? cool, all that did was convince me gob/bug are the next 2 lims

[Andante]

that enough "caring" for yall? cool, all that did was convince me gob/bug are the next 2 lims

If gob/bug both flip town, what would your solve be?

that's not happening

[Andante]

by you wanting me to make that assumption, that gives:

- brightbluebug

- gob

- Andante

- pisskop <-- this player is town-aligned!

semi clears
- Black
- bob3141
- Hu Tao
- JacksonVirgo


and remaining
- Dannflor
- AnimatedWiz
- BlackStar
- Merlyn

there's not 3 scum in the remaining, nor is that a path im going down today

[Andante]

that enough "caring" for yall? cool, all that did was convince me gob/bug are the next 2 lims

If gob/bug both flip town, what would your solve be?

that's not happening

Consider it for a second, then tell me what you think the solve might be in that scenario. Surely you've been this confident before and were wrong? Put yourself in those shoes

you want me to waste my limited time I do have, and chase this path down, when it's guaranteed gob/bug are 2 scum, literally not happening, vote me out I don't care, but that's such a waste of time. no I haven't been that dead wrong before

[Andante]

I'm sorry I even bothered tbh. Jesus Christ

I literally tried....

[Andante]

BlackStar had 5 votes day 1 and then the wagon ultimately failed.

cause they self voted, that tends to kill wagons... what a concept

[Andante]

thus afrayed copied that move....

[Andante]

VOTE: bug
fine gob can live till tomorrow, I'm not going outside these 2 though

[Andante]

see my only hesitation with voting blackstar here is, if town, I'm not deciding between gob/bug later... bug still has 0 interest in playing the game, so I wanna deal with this before lylo

[Andante]

VOTE: bug
fine gob can live till tomorrow, I'm not going outside these 2 though

What?
Jumping on it the second I stop voting em? How do you think me and bug being partners btw?

it's more, I'm fine with you living another day

[Andante]

hey animated, that post makes me think merlyn is your partner... how accurate is that thought?

[Andante]

I'm confused by that lol, I do have an ani!scum world, but like, I'm yeeting bug here, all other thoughts can wait another day

[Andante]

like the ani/merlyn/X world has 3rd scum being like dann or someone, I'm not going down that till tomorrow, cause scum tried to kill black last night, I don't see a charles/bug/X team doing that.. hmmm

[Andante]

means bug lim wouldn't be optimal here, but like, bug literally isn't doing anything,,,,

[Andante]

yeah thinking more about the kill on you, I'm like, that would HAVE to be like not the lurkers lol, cause you're really good at scumhunting, I'll follow you today, we don't have to go for bug/gob

[Andante]

ooh nice perfect

[Andante]

but my gut has been saying like ani/dann/merlyn is a good pool to look in... part of me feels like scum TMId charles town

[Andante]

yeah thinking more about the kill on you, I'm like, that would HAVE to be like not the lurkers lol, cause you're really good at scumhunting, I'll follow you today, we don't have to go for bug/gob

I wouldn't say I'm great at scum hunting but I do appreciate the sentiment lol

Since you're willing to cooperate with me I'll consider helping you push someone D3 if I'm wrong here

I mean, I won't blindly sheep, but like, I'm open to listening and will likely agree and am fine going with you here, not blaming you if wrong

[Andante]

but my gut has been saying like ani/dann/merlyn is a good pool to look in... part of me feels like scum TMId charles town

Can you expand on that last part, Andante?

I was trying to push charles d1 and got so much "HE MUST BE TOWN!!!" from people

[Andante]

VOTE: Animated

[Andante]

ok sure VOTE: merlyn