BooneyToonz UPick: Boon There, Done That [END]

[Venus and Mars]

Why would scum want to NK us, if I was putting them into the Boonus round? That would be completely contrary to their wincon, therefore, if scum NKs us, it makes the Boonus round players, all that much harder to mislynch if town, right?

But if scum can conceivably drive a mislynch on us, it looks a lot less suspicious because then there’s no fingers to point to.

Nah. You already picked scum for the Boonus room on N1.
What's the guarantee that you're picking town for other nights?
What prevents them from simply going "Lol Nancy's picked Titus and she was scum, so her townreads don't matter anyway"?

You’re obviously missing the point. Scum doesn’t want me dead anytime soon, if I’m picking scum for the Boonus rounds. Why would they? But it’s 100% in scum’s interest to subtly or not so subtly shade me and try to get us mislynched before LYLO.

[Venus and Mars]

No, he was noting a similarity between you and Titus. When Titus flipped scum, i.e. post D2 that's when he'd begin to slightly suspect you, so the timing is natural.

Where? I don’t recall seeing that? If Fonz is town here, I don’t know whether to be more insulted that he is wrongly sr my being an obvious pocket or that he seriously thinks I’m that much of an idiot as scum. I’m really not sure which one is more offensive.

[Venus and Mars]

Hm. We shouldn't have outed that N2 was a

debuff

room.

A what?

[Venus and Mars]

Where? I don’t recall seeing that? If Fonz is town here, I don’t know whether to be more insulted that he is wrongly sr my being an obvious pocket or that he seriously thinks I’m that much of an idiot as scum. I’m really not sure which one is more offensive.

You think Titus was an idiot for mentioning multiple times how her role was important and +town?

No, I’m referring to my having her as my top tr.

[Venus and Mars]

Hm. We shouldn't have outed that N2 was a

debuff

room.

A what?

Debuff meaning anti-town. The "prize" was becoming voteless for the day.

These BRs are a helluva lot weirder than the ones I recall from LNT. Well, since both you and KK have already voted, can I assume that Nom lost?

[Venus and Mars]

No, I’m referring to my having her as my top tr.

I wouldn't think that's idiotic at all as scum lol

I can’t count on one hand how many times I’ve seen scum do that. I remember that Dann was slightly paranoid of me for obvtowning scum!Krazy in TM. I think the entire scumteam had pocketed me at one time or another.

[Venus and Mars]

When did I say you were ascetic? I said I got no result.

~Amrun

Then the logical conclusion is roleblocked not guilty, particularly when someone else already has a fake guilty on me. Yet, you jumped to the scum conclusion implying I was ascetic.

When did I say you were ascetic? I said I got no result.

~Amrun

Then the logical conclusion is roleblocked not guilty, particularly when someone else already has a fake guilty on me. Yet, you jumped to the scum conclusion implying I was ascetic.

What?

Why would me being roleblocked mean you were not guilty? How are those related?

I got some strange virus thing that totally mutated my role. I have no idea how that interacts with my results. It is the logical conclusion that my results are unreliable vs nomnom.

~Amrun

Then why are you voting as if your results matter rather than just blocked.

Why aren't you suspecting the guy who claimed the same role as you?

But damn 3 night 1 cops, I am kinda lost in what is going on here.

~Venus

The one cop that got a result is fucked with.

Krazy should claim their prize btw.

@Conspire, none of these read like buddy posts to me.

[Venus and Mars]

Sure but in the universe where you're scum with her, saying you hard townread her isn't an idiotic move. We should move on from The Fonz

If I ever pull that off convincingly as scum, you should nom me for a DC. I think the only way I ever hard tr a buddy, is if they were already viewed as a consensus tr, which Titus obviously wasn’t. That’s also how I knew Sakura was locktown in BP because scum!her would have just hardbussed Wisdom not hard defended him.

[Venus and Mars]

Yeah I'll give pretty good odds of scum!BTE trying to set up a counterwagon to protect scum!RCE

GB is town now

I definitely didn’t like this post. It seemed an extreme over reaction. Plus, I have trouble seeing the MC thing on D2 as being protown.

VOTE: jjh

I also like Conspire’s case.

[Venus and Mars]

I certainly think you're clever enough to do that as scum tho At least after hydra'ing with me as scum.
But that's not the point - it's certainly not idiotic play. I would call it good scumplay. Fonz thinking it's a possibility doesn't mean he thinks you're an idiot.

I very much doubt I could fake that degree of conviction as scum but I’m flattered that you think I’m actually capable of that. So Fonz isn’t being scummy, he honestly is suspicious of me? Seriously? He thinks scum!me townlocks my buddy? I thought he was either trolling me or scum.

[Venus and Mars]

@Fonzie

3878

To help you find it.

I’m definitely not interested in lynching Dave or Conspire today. I strongly tl both slots.

[Venus and Mars]

What's actually compelling about conspire's "case"? They've just grabbed some quotes and literally said they can't say why they make me scum

Why don't you, idk, look at what I have actually been doing? Or would that be too much?

Why did you auto jump to the conclusion that BTE was protecting his buddy? That seemed a major reach, no?

[Venus and Mars]

@Fonzie

3878

To help you find it.

I’m definitely not interested in lynching Dave or Conspire today. I strongly tl both slots.

What about Fonzie?

He’s probably just being bad town. I was tl him until he literally shaded me with Titus on D3 for something he tl me for on D1 but meh.

[Venus and Mars]

Fonz admitting that he hadn’t read me but decided to entertain chkflip’s theory is also kinda bad. It’s like he’s not really reading anyone and looking for credit where he needs it.

This is a misrep. It's very clear that I suspected you for being middle of the pack scum, and was happy to vote there given I had limited time and there was limited momentum or pressure anywhere. Got a day off, spent some time ISOing you, my SR relented when reading everything, especially the relevant parts in context. It's not that I'd never paid any attention to anything you said, or I was sheeping chk. Timeline was:

"I think Chronos is kinda scummy for unmemorable play, maybe she's trying to blend in"
CHK also voices suspicion
"Fuck it let's wagon this and see where it goes"

Next day
"Right let's read Chronos and see how my read develops"

"Hmmmm some of these Titus interactions don't feel S/S, guess I'll look elsewhere."

How is that anything but a natural town progression?

Why are so many people shading me for scumhunting smh

It isn’t “shading”, when you appear to shade someone out of the blue on D3 for pretty much the same exact thing that you tl them on D1 and especially - and honestly no offence but how are you seriously reading mine and Titus’ interactions here as SvS?

[Venus and Mars]

Let's not forget that in digging around in Titus's iso they're effectively copying my homewokr and changing it around a little, except they took the only Titus quote I cared about out.

VOTE: Nancy

If she's town here then I'm the A50 of this game and that's unfortunate but no other lynch measures up to this one.

If you push this, I'll vote you. I'm that confident in Nancy town.

Look at this and don't let it get buried. I can actually articulate the thing that makes it a scum-scum interaction between Titus and RCE. Titus is literally saying to RCE that she will bus him if he continues voting for the slot she has pocketed and invested effort in pocketing.

But he did push and votepark on me but she never made good on that threat. If they’re buddies, can’t she warn him in their scum PT?

[Venus and Mars]

Let's not forget that in digging around in Titus's iso they're effectively copying my homewokr and changing it around a little, except they took the only Titus quote I cared about out.

VOTE: Nancy

If she's town here then I'm the A50 of this game and that's unfortunate but no other lynch measures up to this one.

If you push this, I'll vote you. I'm that confident in Nancy town.

Look at this and don't let it get buried. I can actually articulate the thing that makes it a scum-scum interaction between Titus and RCE. Titus is literally saying to RCE that she will bus him if he continues voting for the slot she has pocketed and invested effort in pocketing.

Oops I buried this on a pagebottom

Again, why would Titus threaten a buddy in the thread when she could inconspicuously do that in their scum PT? Since she never followed up with this, I read it as an empty attempt at getting towncred for pocketting me.

[Venus and Mars]

So far, I like KK, Auro and Nom.

~M

I seriously do not get the Auro love. I think Auro Chronos and chkflip has the foundations of being a strong team.

Honestly, I think all 3 of these are town based on Titus regularly bringing up and using the "Rule of 3" as town.

-Cosmic

Based on mine and Shiro’s reads and how Titus usually treats her buddies, I agree that she was more likely than not, trying to just fuck with us.

[Venus and Mars]

Titus is literally saying to RCE that she will bus him if he continues voting for the slot she has pocketed and invested effort in pocketing.

Wouldn't this be something she would say in the Scum PT?

Spoiler:

Let's not forget that in digging around in Titus's iso they're effectively copying my homewokr and changing it around a little, except they took the only Titus quote I cared about out.

VOTE: Nancy

If she's town here then I'm the A50 of this game and that's unfortunate but no other lynch measures up to this one.

If you push this, I'll vote you. I'm that confident in Nancy town.

Look at this and don't let it get buried. I can actually articulate the thing that makes it a scum-scum interaction between Titus and RCE. Titus is literally saying to RCE that she will bus him if he continues voting for the slot she has pocketed and invested effort in pocketing.

But he did push and votepark on me but she never made good on that threat. If they’re buddies, can’t she warn him in their scum PT?

Let's not forget that in digging around in Titus's iso they're effectively copying my homewokr and changing it around a little, except they took the only Titus quote I cared about out.

VOTE: Nancy

If she's town here then I'm the A50 of this game and that's unfortunate but no other lynch measures up to this one.

If you push this, I'll vote you. I'm that confident in Nancy town.

Look at this and don't let it get buried. I can actually articulate the thing that makes it a scum-scum interaction between Titus and RCE. Titus is literally saying to RCE that she will bus him if he continues voting for the slot she has pocketed and invested effort in pocketing.

Oops I buried this on a pagebottom

Again, why would Titus threaten a buddy in the thread when she could inconspicuously do that in their scum PT? Since she never followed up with this, I read it as an empty attempt at getting towncred for pocketting me.

We are clearly mindmelding here.

[Venus and Mars]

What's your read of him?

Scumlean, his past posts with Titus didn't really age well. The resistance against his wagon is also kind of clear. So that could be the scum team right now.

Titus, RCE and who else?

[Venus and Mars]

No, I’m referring to my having her as my top tr.

I wouldn't think that's idiotic at all as scum lol

I can’t count on one hand how many times I’ve seen scum do that. I remember that Dann was slightly paranoid of me for obvtowning scum!Krazy in TM. I think the entire scumteam had pocketed me at one time or another.

Oh c'mon. You townreading Titus is clearly null. It's not scummy because I'd expect you two to TR each other regardless of alignment. But it's not town, because you know full well everyone else would expect you to TR each other regardless of actual alignment, too. If you want to claim that you, specifically, putting Titus as your top TR is outside your scumrange, then lol. Scum often do things because they think everyone will be expecting them to, and will SR them for going off-meta.

What tf would you expect us to tr each other regardless of alignment? That makes absolutely no sense. Everyone would EXPECT me to do that? Are you on crack? Like seriously dafuq? Why because you think everyone thinks I’m terrible at scumhunting? I nailed scum!Persi in TRO and both SS and GL in Newsroom, so you can quit it with the Nancy only tr pockets and sr everyone who pushes her, if this is the bs angle, you’re trying to push here. I claim that I have literally only seen one game where scum actually did this but hey, keep having fun with this whack shade. I can use the entertainment.

[Venus and Mars]

No, I’m referring to my having her as my top tr.

I wouldn't think that's idiotic at all as scum lol

I can’t count on one hand how many times I’ve seen scum do that. I remember that Dann was slightly paranoid of me for obvtowning scum!Krazy in TM. I think the entire scumteam had pocketed me at one time or another.

Oh c'mon. You townreading Titus is clearly null. It's not scummy because I'd expect you two to TR each other regardless of alignment. But it's not town, because you know full well everyone else would expect you to TR each other regardless of actual alignment, too. If you want to claim that you, specifically, putting Titus as your top TR is outside your scumrange, then lol. Scum often do things because they think everyone will be expecting them to, and will SR them for going off-meta.

What tf would you expect us to tr each other regardless of alignment? That makes absolutely no sense. Everyone would EXPECT me to do that? Are you on crack? Like seriously dafuq? Why because you think everyone thinks I’m terrible at scumhunting? I nailed scum!Persi in TRO and both SS and GL in Newsroom, so you can quit it with the Nancy only tr pockets and sr everyone who pushes her, if this is the bs angle, you’re trying to push here. I claim that I have literally only seen one game where scum actually did this but hey, keep having fun with this whack shade. I can use the entertainment.

I apologize for being salty but I haven’t forgotten you posting on D1 that you didn’t gaf about hurting my feelings. I sincerely did try to clarify things and work it out with you but you just ignored me, so ngl, I’m still pissed at you for that.

[Venus and Mars]

What's actually compelling about conspire's "case"? They've just grabbed some quotes and literally said they can't say why they make me scum

Why don't you, idk, look at what I have actually been doing? Or would that be too much?

Why did you auto jump to the conclusion that BTE was protecting his buddy? That seemed a major reach, no?

When did I do that?

Yeah I'll give pretty good odds of scum!BTE trying to set up a counterwagon to protect scum!RCE

GB is town now

Is the pool of lynches today based on the D1 and D2 wagons. RCE is in this list but JJ, dave or fonzie should be considered before voting RCE.

"Yes I would consider lynching RCE but not before we lynch one or more of these 3 town players."

[Venus and Mars]

Hey Nancy if it's gonna be worth me talking to you you're gonna have to like
read the things
that I say to you

???

I clearly AM reading. What do you think I’m missing?

[Venus and Mars]

@Nancy: Something that may avoid us getting in a pissing match talking about our reads on each other:

What's your read on RCE here? Like, I might well SR him here if I hadn't played with him before, but he does feel totally different to TBONTB here.

Sorry, I’m seriously not doing well. I honestly don’t/didn’t mean to take that out on either you or chk. :/

Can you elaborate on this? He seemed to be just coasting in TBONTB and I don’t see why scum!RCE does a 180 on me as scum and his post about scum killing him, sounds a lot less whack, when you consider the fact that he too claimed to have a N1 one shot invest. I also think that hardpushing me while calling Titus “probably town who’s probably wrong on me”, is a weird gambit to do as scum because had he got me mislynched, he would be auto lynched today right after Titus, so it’s kind of suicidal for him to do as scum.

[Venus and Mars]

What's actually compelling about conspire's "case"? They've just grabbed some quotes and literally said they can't say why they make me scum

Why don't you, idk, look at what I have actually been doing? Or would that be too much?

I am and I don’t understand your confidence on RCE scum or why you thought BTE was protecting him. I also don’t see why wanting an MC on D2 is protown.

I’m back to tl Fonz again for that RCE post.

[Venus and Mars]

HMM why does scum!RCE do a 180 on Nancy after scum!Titus says to stop trying to lynch Nancy

What a mystery

???

Titus literally flipped scum. Why wouldn’t that affect his read?

[Venus and Mars]

I apologize for being salty but I haven’t forgotten you posting on D1 that you didn’t gaf about hurting my feelings. I sincerely did try to clarify things and work it out with you but you just ignored me, so ngl, I’m still pissed at you for that.

Oh, for fuck's sake. All else equal I don't want you hurt. I think I was perfectly clear day one: I feel I'm well within my rights to point out when you're making me super uncomfortable and the game unfun for me, even if you get upset about that. Meanwhile it feels to me like you take criticism much milder than that you dish out to be like we've just said we'd enjoy using your kitten as a soccer ball. You've literally just accused me of being so unreasonable it's comparable to being on crack. I'm doing my damn best to figure stuff out and hunt scum, OK? And yet you act like me saying it's not beyond you as scum to play as you are doing is some huge slight.

So no offense, and like I hope non-mafia shit is going well. Really, I shouldn't talk to you

about you

at all because it doesn't move any votes and just ends with me feeling like shit. But guess what? I'm human and don't like being shit-talked. I've noticed in preview-edit that you have responded to my RCE question - that's potential grounding for more useful interaction. Later though, I do actually have to get some sleep. x

You wrongly misinterpreted an earlier post as my “taking your head off”, I think that in THIS game, 4026 is the only time I’ve come close to doing that and I immediately apologized. I am not lying about being unwell and while it’s obviously not a justification, perhaps you can show me some compassion and understanding?

[Venus and Mars]

And the point of this is ???

[Venus and Mars]

How does Titus flipping scum make someone think you're town?

He thought Titus was “probably town” who was wrongly tr me, so why wouldn’t he flip his read on me post-flip?

[Venus and Mars]

Just, in isolation, I mean


Because the simplest thoughts are the only ones you can really justify attributing to other people without asking them for reasoning
and I don't think this is one of the simplest thoughts

The best way forwards is to ask RCE

I did but in his recent posts, he comes close to pretty much townlocking me for it. I just don’t understand why scum!RC makes that progression on me. He stopped pushing me on D2 actually, which makes me think that he might have actually believed he could be a potential scum target due to the N1 one shot invest thing. I also agree with GB, if Titus and RCE are buddies, she can threaten him in their scum PT and the fact that she never ever made good on that threat, makes me think it was for my benefit, far more than RCE’s.

[Venus and Mars]

Because you don't flip all of your reads when one read turns out to be wrong

His sr on me was manly based on him tr Titus and thinking her read on me was wrong, so why wouldn’t he flip his read on me, after finding put he incorrectly tr Titus? I don’t see why you seem to find this so unbelievable?

[Venus and Mars]

HMM why does scum!RCE do a 180 on Nancy after scum!Titus says to stop trying to lynch Nancy

What a mystery

Hey, jjh! I'm of the belief that scum very rarely tell each other to do things in the main thread, when they have a private chat perfect for that use. Why are you making the assumption Titus would be so transparent as scum in the thread?

-Cosmic

And he didn’t stop deathtunnelling me then either, only on D2, so I think that Titus telling him to stop, had no effect.

[Venus and Mars]

We'll fuckin' do it again.

What? ???

[Venus and Mars]

UNVOTE:

[Venus and Mars]

Nancy would you be offended if I said I townread shiro but scumread you

-K

[Venus and Mars]

Leaves a lynchpool of Sore Feet, BTE, RCE, VaM.

I'd probably remove V&M from the list.
Chk, you think we could remove BTE too?

This presumes that the scumteam is exactly Titus, RCE, SF. Odds aren’t terrible that Fonz is tr one scum here.

But yeah, I don’t see why he has BTE in his POE either.

One thing seems pretty obvious, RCE and jjh aren’t linked. This doesn’t look like scum theatre to me, so if one of them flips scum, the other is probably spewed town.

[Venus and Mars]

Should we lynch the jjh?

I keep changing my selections or rather keep waffling on the third slot. I hope I got it right this time. *fingers crossed*

I don’t understand either chk’s confidence on RCE town nor Fonz’s on jjh town but jjh’s reasoning on RCE/Titus interactions - specifically Titus telling him to stop pushing me, just don’t make sense. RCE only stopped pushing me on D2, so was clearly not influenced by anything Titus said about it but those are the slots I’m most iffy on rn and more on jjh than RCE.

But I obviously have to be wrong somewhere, since I can’t see both of them as the scumteam, so at least one of my tls has to be wrong but I haven’t a clue as to which one.

[Venus and Mars]

My gut says Auro isn't town but no one will tell me why he is. Chronos is an ass.

chronos is a cutiepie wat u talkin bout

<3 chronos

idgaf if auro is scum he's like, being a cool scummbutt and still being proactive and shit

and hey, after all, we can just assume that if scum haven't killed him by day 4 that he's confscum because otherwise the scumbutts would be afraid of him solving the game!!!!!

ezpzpzpzpzpz

-K

KK made this as a joke post and somehow people are misremembering as Auro actually saying this when he never did say anything of the kind.

[Venus and Mars]

And by people she means chkflip who very much did not remember that post at all and is surprised that was so easily found for you.

And SF, who gave that as a reason for voting there. It actually shouldn’t surprise anyone who’s had experienced playing with me. I’m extremely confident that I have one of the best long term memories on the site. I correctly hammered scum in Penguin, once I made the connection between how scum!Shosh deathtunnelled obvtown Robb, was nearly identical to what scum!Thor did to Gamma in YGM and that was what? close to 2 years ago? My brain is literally like a long term memory bank where I store facts.

[Venus and Mars]

Cause you lack context

I was in a hydra with Venus in a game Krazy modded recently where we were killed N4 or so.
Pink Ball in the scum thread said something along the lines of "time to kill this slot, otherwise Auro will solve the game".
I also sortaaaaa had scum in some kind of PoE at that point.

Krazy was simply referencing that as a joke, since Nancy and I were partners there she'd notice and remember

Yeah, that too. That was really funny that he said that.

[Venus and Mars]

No one from my Wagon list is significantly mentioned.

Is this a good or bad sign wrt my list?

I think gooooodddddddddddddddddddddddddddd goooood

Probably good? Scum doesn’t usually go out of their way to interact with their buddies unless they’re trying to distance.

[Venus and Mars]

After searching through Titus' ISO and running the programs here is what I came up with irt associations:

chkflip x62

Vecna x53

Chronos x44
Venus x41 (nancy x39 mars x38)
Auro x37
krazy x36

nom x32

scott x26
conspire x23
jjh x21
fonz x12
georgebailey x11

EDIT: Added jjh and conspire association.... hmmm weird. Might be time to narrow down the list:

Conspire x23
JJH927 x21
The Fonz x12

RCEnigma x10
davesaz x7
sore feet x3

I vibe TR sore.

dave isn't the dave I know.

RCE is RCE is RCE is RCE.

Is it time to vote dave or sore feet?

Is TR= townread, because that obviously doesn’t make sense?

But yeah, it’s occurred to me that both jjh and RCE could be town, because I have to be wrong on at least one or more of my tls.

[Venus and Mars]

But I obviously have to be wrong somewhere, since I can’t see both of them as the scumteam, so at least one of my tls has to be wrong but I haven’t a clue as to which one.

Yeah this is where I am. When you say "Fonz is TR one scum" well of course I am. But like you I haven't a clue who.

I find it slightly amusing that you think I should also eliminate BTE given that since you also think I'm wrong to not eliminate you that means you're implicitly saying I should eliminate everyone but SF and RCE in a game with likely three scum . I think you'll probably be better off trying to pull people into my POE than out of it. Regardless, it's SF I want to lynch and it ain't that close any more, tbh. Reminds me of To Boon where the POE was narrowed down to two roles, both of whom were actually town.

What? Are you actually reading my posts? Where did I ever say, you should eliminate everyone but SF and RCE from your POE? If you’re continuously misinterpreting my posts, that could really explain a lot.

What I actually DID say, was that based off of Auro eliminating me and BTE from your POE, that’s what it would leave and that would mean that had to exactly be the scumteam, which seems unlikely.

[Venus and Mars]

Which I still want to hop into at a later time.

I'd murder any of MS, conspire, George, Krazy in any order. If that doesn't fix it, it's Dave... It's always Dave.

Titus spewed 2 of those not buddies. Also Nom apparently lost the Boonus round and was made voteless. I think scum wouldn’t have killed Nom last night if they were made aware of that, so I’m extremely confident on 2 of those slots.

[Venus and Mars]

One thought and one observation from a question

1 - I do think titus *might* have spewed auro town in the boonus but she is capable of theater. It's not definitive and actually auro could be scum here

2 - the post restrictions *might* have applied to scum pts as well (i.e. Bte, dave, etc)

-K

Post restrictions? Were they another antitown “prize”?

Have you ever seen scum!Titus treat a buddy like she did Auro, before?

[Venus and Mars]

Boon was evasive as ever but it seems like scum cannot inherently post their role pms in the scum pt? And if they had a post restriction they maybe? Might? Have thought it applied to pt as well? Although boon would only modkill if the role explicitly said they could not talk in scum pt

-k

This is so weird but then it’s a Boon game, so why should this surprise me?

I’m not sure I’m completely following you. This is directly connected to last night’s Boonus round, correct?

[Venus and Mars]

Okay so fun fact people can change their fucking meta if they're aware of it and if I have to read "Titus spewed blahblah because meta" ONE more Goddamn time I'm going to fucking lose it.

She had to have switched it up somewhere because it's D3 and we're collectively acting like it's D1 because WeLl MeTa fuck that shit. Your meta is obviously fucking wrong or trash because this shit wouldn't be difficult if it were tried and true.

Jesus Christ.

You don’t know that!

[Venus and Mars]

The only thing she possibly did change was to cause us to wifom the rule of the 3 thing. Changing how she interacts with her buddies, is a far more dramatic switch.

[Venus and Mars]

The Sorcerer’s ABoontice!

Vote Count 3.03

Jjh927 [4]:

GeorgeBailey, BooneyToonzExpert, Krazy Katz, Conspire,

GeorgeBailey [2]:

Chronos, davesaz

RCEnigma [2]:

, Jjh927, Michael Scott

sore feet [2]:

The Fonz, Chkflip

Michael Scott [2]:

sore feet, RCEnigma

Not Voting [1]:

Venus and Mars,

With

13

alive, it takes

7

to execute.

Day 3

ends in (expired on 2020-04-09 21:00:00) on

April 9th

.

Mod Notes:

Don’t be outta pocket.

Pick a fucking wagon. We have two days.

How is it in two weeks your vote has been used once and only by your other head?

Who is the bolded referring to?

[Venus and Mars]

"I don't want to make the wrong decision" == "I don't want to seem scummy"

Shit or get off the pot. Choose a wagon.

I don’t gaf how I “seem”, I want to choose right and we do have 2 days, NOT two hours, so I don’t need to make a snap decision to please you.

[Venus and Mars]

It's jjh or sore feet. Those are your choices.

We don't have time for dumb shit.

We have two days, too freaking early to be locking that in don’t you think?

I’m really tired of your attitude. You don’t like the way I play? Tough.

[Venus and Mars]

@sore feet, now that you know that no one seriously agreed to lynch MS on D4, let alone D3, why are you still voting him and it would really help if you could get duckling to post.

[Venus and Mars]

The Sorcerer’s ABoontice!

Vote Count 3.03

Jjh927 [4]:

GeorgeBailey, BooneyToonzExpert, Krazy Katz, Conspire,

GeorgeBailey [2]:

Chronos, davesaz

RCEnigma [2]:

, Jjh927, Michael Scott

sore feet [2]:

The Fonz, Chkflip

Michael Scott [2]:

sore feet, RCEnigma

Not Voting [1]:

Venus and Mars,

With

13

alive, it takes

7

to execute.

Day 3

ends in (expired on 2020-04-09 21:00:00) on

April 9th

.

Mod Notes:

Don’t be outta pocket.

Pick a fucking wagon. We have two days.

How is it in two weeks your vote has been used once and only by your other head?

Who is the bolded referring to?

You never answered my question, because it obviously isn’t at all the case for us.

[Venus and Mars]

I’m going to wait and see how the wagons form, that may provide some spicy info.

[Venus and Mars]

You've voted one fucking time this phase and it wasn't even your vote. Who the fuck else could I be talking to?

I don't need you to achieve a lynch, so I'm comfortable just writing you off if you want to keep working at the breakfast house. 2 days is not a lot of time given this player list's affinity to active lurking. I can't remember a time in the last two weeks where at least two or three of you weren't over a day out from posting. It's ridiculous. So, yes, we do have many hours, but it doesn't count for shit when people don't post and I'll be damned if I'm just to sit here and watch y'all hurrdurr over slots that we aren't swinging a fucking lynch on.

That is incorrect. Shiro voted RCE, I unvoted and then I voted jjh. Why don’t you get your facts straight before you throw out baseless accusations?

[Venus and Mars]

Speaking of things that got ignored.

Whatever his alignment

What do you know about alignments?

This is not the first time you've worded "I'm null-reading this slot rn" in this way.

As far as I know we've got town and scum.

Why do you keep wording it like this?

I am not allowed to think a particular post scummy without referencing alignment?

[Venus and Mars]

Looney Toons

Vote Count 1.05

Vecna [6]:

Chkflip, BooneyToonzExpert,

Titus

, Davesaz, Krazy Katz, Venus and Mars

Mechanic [3]:

GeorgeBailey, sore feet, Chronos

Davesaz [2]:

The Fonz, Kakeguri Addicts

GeorgeBailey [1]:

Jjh927

BooneyToonzExpert [1]:

Michael Scott

Xtoxm [1]:

Vecna,

Titus [1]:

Conspire

Kakeguri Addicts [1]:

Nomnomnom,

Not Voting [1]:

Mechanic,

With

17

alive, it takes

9

to execute.

Day 1

ends in (expired on 2020-03-25 21:00:00) on

March 25th

.

Mod Notes:

Don’t be outta pocket.

Mechanics hasn’t posted in 4 days, I’m replacing the slot. I got a juicy replacement ready anyways.

Is Vecna wagon spewed town? Scum doesn’t usually like to have more than one scum on a town wagon, if they can help it.

[Venus and Mars]

Whooooptedoooooo

You've still spent most of the phase with your vote on fucking nothing. Good job being tangentially correct though I know how much that means to you.

And you’re making a federal case about this, why?

It does and you’re welcome. Next time, get your facts straight.

[Venus and Mars]

Okay so
I'm gonna vote Sore Feet
and someone is gonna give me a third item so I can do things, preferably before night ends

VOTE: Sore Feet

RCE is the only player who can do this, because KK sent him the stuffed elephant.

[Venus and Mars]

Okay so
I'm gonna vote Sore Feet
and someone is gonna give me a third item so I can do things, preferably before night ends

VOTE: Sore Feet

RCE is the only player who can do this, because KK sent him the stuffed elephant.

And the Boonus round wouldn’t be able to help you with that. I don’t know how I read SF but I don’t think I want to lynch jjh anymore.

[Venus and Mars]

My objective is still being met, look at that.

Crazy how initiative works, right Mars?

Wowzers.

It matters because your vote being on fuck all all phase fucks with VCA. Oh wooooow whodathunktit whoa there's a purpose for a vote? Man that's wild.

It doesn’t with MY VCA.

[Venus and Mars]

Spoiler:

Cool gif!
hows your solve coming along?
we all agreed to bop you if you're still here on d4 and havent solved the game
VOTE: MS

There were like 4 claimed. Or 5 maybe.

9 actually
you're a contender for todays lynch so if you could try to pay attention, that would be great

But I don't remember who it was that conflicted with nom's result.

That's where I would be looking. But I also don't know what's going on.

i have had this thought but theres also daves item going missing even though he got a fruit and should have been ascetic (i did verify with the mod and he said what i received was correct)
and its a very route 1 scum play that im not eager to give merit to

I'd say there is probably scum both on and off the wagon. Titus tried to self hammer which makes me think there is also scum off the wagon.

what if titus knew she was hammered?

My tl on Fonz has decreased slightly due to the out of the blue Titus’ comparison.

his weak ass push on me has obliterated my tl
resisting urge to omgus

I got onto the RCE wagon you're supporting and you didn't bat an eye

i wouldnt either
uncertainty in reads, distancing/bussing etc
the only associatives worth anything at this stage of the game are those with titus

Lol funnily I think I find it harder to build momentum in a game when I'm widely townread.

i find it harder to get reads, but easier to push the lynches i do want

If I reveal my picks, it could potentially get them NK’d, so I obviously don’t want to risk that. I did out two of my picks: Titus D1 and Nom D2, since there’s obviously no reason anymore not to.

we dont want a situation where you die and the last person alive from a room is scum and able to hide it/lie about things
it can wait until the mc (presumably tomorrow at this point)

3631. KK thinks that Titus spewed him town in the Boonus room.

as with any ~magical neighborhood read~
im not putting weight on content i cant see for myself

What is your opinion on both Dave’s and Fonz’s post wrt my role? Both were tr me D1 and 2 but I haven’t selected either one of them so far.

could you link/quote the posts you want me to comment on?

SHUT YOUR WHORE MOUTH KATZ

YEAH SHUT UP KATZ

Wouldn't scum

let me stop you right there.
any "would scum do that?" type question?
yes. scum

would

do that.

How much time do we have left?

4 days apparently
how did that happen? i'll put a sock in the mc stuff i guess, we lack the clock for it today

I'm not actually sure 3496 was a good poe, but I haven't liked any of my poes for more than like 12 hours lately

its bc no one except chk and BTE actually deserve to be outside the poe

this backwards catchup was inspired by creature
trying something different

While I think this vote was bad, I think SF could be town. That’s my problem, I don’t feel confident on any of these wagons.

However, Xtoxm is good at obvtowning under pressure. How he reacts to his wagon will definitely be telling.

[Venus and Mars]

The fact that you don't understand why that's not okay doesn't surprise me in the least.

I would really love to play a game with you where I’m mod confirmed IC. I would so enjoy that.

[Venus and Mars]

But I don't remember who it was that conflicted with nom's result.

That's where I would be looking. But I also don't know what's going on.

i have had this thought but theres also daves item going missing even though he got a fruit and should have been ascetic (i did verify with the mod and he said what i received was correct)
and its a very route 1 scum play that im not eager to give merit to

Can you elaborate on this some more?

[Venus and Mars]

VOTE: Dave

I actually tl any of the existing wagons more than Dave.

[Venus and Mars]

Ok I'm thoroughly ??? at this game and demotivated rn. My other head said he'll be able to do some solving tomorrow though so I would really like to wait for that.

~Esper

pedit: do you disagree with the town!dave arguement that he was the first to claim suicidal cop and therefore likely to be a real one/town?

Oh? I forgot about that.

UNVOTE:

I just don’t think SF is scum and based on what he just posted, jjh’s alignment would be self-resolving?

However, when you take into account BTE’s role, I’m not really sure how much weight we can really put into that.

[Venus and Mars]

I'm also a N1 suicidal cop (can't mention d1 or would die). Got a no result on my target. I'm gonna hold back on ID for a bit to see if conversation reveals why.
Did sore feet receive anything other than a sticky fruit?
I also got a sticky fruit.

Titus are you limited in how many items you can modify a night? How about number of items you can give?

Best move for town is to give all the SF to the same person so that other abilities are allowed to be targeted on everyone else. As it sits now most of us are untargetable by anything but kills, if the sticky fruit is the standard variety.

Someone apparently submitted N-split as a pick, and probably sticky fruit too. If town did this they were not being very smart at all. I'm betting it's scum. Unless Boon just showered us with fruit as a non-ability mechanic or something.

Davez is probably town but he wasn’t the first to claim according to this. @Conspire

[Venus and Mars]

What's interesting it that nobody has ever given a shit about me explaining things in detail before. Because it's kinda dumb to think town!me isn't gonna give a full explanation for something when there os one and there's someone asking for an explanation, and there's no downside to me explaining it. I'd like those who think that post I made was weird to read it with context and explain why they think it's weird outside of this idea that I can explain my thought process.

Dave has played with me before. He doesn't get a free pass.
VOTE: davesaz

Interesting you vote me for something I noticed during catchup, but didn't refer to anyone else who made the same observation about it being a lot of explanation. It's also interesting to note that I specifically said that I didn't remember the context (and still don't). So you'd like to have it looked at in context -- fine, that's part of the plan anyway.

This is not likely S v S. Gut says S v T but not certain.

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

[Venus and Mars]

you didn't misrep chkflip titus he scummy

he scummy scummy scummy

I don'tknow if he flip scum but he is scummy

he's like way more political this game

now that coudl be because he got NANCYDDDDDDD

but hes deffos more political and that means it is wise to be wary

u feel me girrlllllll??>???

-K

I feel you definitely. But that doesn't leave drunk or sober me with a confident lynch choice. My gut says Auro isn't town but no one will tell me why he is. Chronos is an ass.

But then there's the wagon dispersal and threats which suggest one of the wagons is on scum.

So I'm just ahhhhh

Howdy partners. I've arbitrarily decide Michael Scott is town VOTE: BTE

I think he is too, what does that have to do with BTE?

That's where MS is voting and I trust him undoubtedly.

I still have never gotten an answer as to why MS is so trusted.

Ok yeah Vecna's scum. I didn't read that fight in detail but accusing Nancy of lying and saying I should know better is enough for a scumread combined with his role.

I also don't trust the infect back comment. Infect back only works if we never lynch the slots he targets but he refuses to townread Nancy and Auro (I think this is what Vecna meant by pops hydra) who I feel are the most likely obvtown slots.

Lolol, Titus must have forgotten she was pushing Auro and tmi towned him.

[Venus and Mars]

Ok I'm thoroughly ??? at this game and demotivated rn. My other head said he'll be able to do some solving tomorrow though so I would really like to wait for that.

~Esper

pedit:

do you disagree with the town!dave arguement that he was the first to claim suicidal cop and therefore likely to be a real one/town?

@Chk, why would scum!Conspire make this kind of post?

[Venus and Mars]

Easy town points are easy.

You could make that argument about any player in any game.

[Venus and Mars]

>vote parked George all day
>active lurking
>"demotivated" at crunch time to float further
>on KA wagon, not on Titus wagon

Literally anyone could've corrected your trash dave vote, they just happened to be first. I'm not phased.

If you’re once again going to be nasty, you’re entire D1 deathtunnel on me was trash. Do you really want to do this now?

[Venus and Mars]

i dont want ANY of the fucking cop claims written off as town
there are 9 of them and the chances the scum have the ability is high. very high.

Well like I said, given BTE’s role, it’s not necessarily town indicative.

[Venus and Mars]

The most entertaining part about pissing you off is your reaction to it. Brings a smile to my face and a warm feeling to my cold, dead heart every single time.

You gonna keep defending Conspire or are we done here?

I guess you have to take what you can get, right?

[Venus and Mars]

Now kish you two

-K

I would say I think I’d rather get Corona but I’m wayy too superstitious to say that.

[Venus and Mars]

also at this point everyone has 'a reason' not to get lynched don't they? Other than maybe like conspire? Idk

amrun didn't like jjh early. Why did you like him enough to item him when he was a leading wagon day 1?

-K

Chk, are you voting Conspire because they pointed out Dave was the first one after Nom to claim sc or do you want to share your reasons?

[Venus and Mars]

Huh george probably needs to go at some point

We still don't know enough about the sf ro know whether the barb post actually buried titus or if gb knew he was burying titus when he made those posts

Also his tone is like really different from last town game although this game is kinda hard to get pumped for

-K

I dunno, it did look to me like Titus was trying to get GB lynched over her. Do you think she’d hang her buddy out to dry like that? Otoh, she could know she’s toast and set him up as a non-buddy but it really did look more to me like she was flailing.

[Venus and Mars]

Why did you like him enough to item him when he was a leading wagon day 1?

i thought he might be a likely n1kill target, and that seemed like the best i had at the time.
he is also a strong scum player who i have read incorrectly before so he's a good target to learn something about to possibly catch out.
and yes im intentionally vague because revealing diminishes the usefulness of my role pretty much entirely. you can flip me if you want to see exactly what it does. then my choice will make more sense, i think.

You sound super townie now that would be gamethrowing.

[Venus and Mars]

alright well if we don'tlynch rce then he can send the elephant or whatever I g ave him

Or should we throw some sticky fruit on him?

-K

Why?

[Venus and Mars]

alright well if we don'tlynch rce then he can send the elephant or whatever I g ave him

Or should we throw some sticky fruit on him?

-K

Why?

Wait, is “him” referring to RCE or jjh?

I think SF should definitely be off the table and I really don’t see why Conspire is scum, so I guess it’s back to those two.

[Venus and Mars]

For the three item thingy? Idfk

-K

Oh right, you still have no clue what the stuffed elephant does right?

[Venus and Mars]

Page 13:

• George's 303 feels genuine.
  
  
• Vecna's 314 is good.
  
• Mars' solving is good.
  
• Fonz has good vibes.

Page 14:

• Krazy Katz, mind fully explaining how it talks of your miller-status being removable? Does it suggest you need to be targeted by something or imply that it's enabled by something...etc?
  
• Titus talking about teams like this feels off. Why are you lumping in chkflip and Chronos? Chronos hasn't mentioned Auro till this point, so are these just your top scumreads or are there associatives I'm missing?

I need to stop slacking off at work, so be back later. Suspects at this point are: JJH, Chronos, Titus.

-Cosmic

The bolded is what Chk probably misinterpreted as a “votepark”.

[Venus and Mars]

Yeah. But that just seems to cop him

You know what else reveals his role? A lynch lol

I mean I don't love his slot for a lynch due to mechanic. But that's not a great reason to let him off

Well, the thing is we have to lynch someone and the two slots I’m most iffy rn on are RCE and jjh, more so on jjh. \_0_/

[Venus and Mars]

For the three item thingy? Idfk

-K

Oh right, you still have no clue what the stuffed elephant does right?

I'm leaning wither rleblocks recipient or nothing

Well if that’s true then would SF’s action even work on jjh, if RCE sent him that? I mean if it causes a roleblock?

[Venus and Mars]

Yeah that's who I've been on

Think you should join?

-K

VOTE: jjh

Amrun was right on Titus. Sorry SF but unless you have a better case on someone else? Your role wasn’t wasted in any case, since you were very likely to be the lynch, had you not claimed.

[Venus and Mars]

I have no idea

Ask sf lol

-K

@SF, if RCE sends jjh the stuffed elephant and it causes you to be roleblocked, than your role won’t work, right?

[Venus and Mars]

This game is like playing poker when the numbers for the cards are in binary

Well let’s just pray that there’s no governer in this game.

[Venus and Mars]

all good.

I guess we're going jjh? I'm the last to allow a "sElF-rEsOlViNg" slot to live but are we sure about that?

I do have a bit of doubt. The post RCE made about not lynching jjh for being wrong. Scum!eth0s made a very similar post in Penguin wrt to a townie who was sr him.

[Venus and Mars]

all good.

I guess we're going jjh? I'm the last to allow a "sElF-rEsOlViNg" slot to live but are we sure about that?

I do have a bit of doubt. The post RCE made about not lynching jjh for being wrong. Scum!eth0s made a very similar post in Penguin wrt to a townie who was sr him.

I've never been compared to ethos in any other way but k.

Idk why the way he plays scum would have any bearing on how I play scum or in this case town.

It’s just the post you made about not lynchng jjh because he’s wrong, was almost identical to a post he made in Penguin but you’re right, just like my strongly stating my role makes me town has no bearing on Titus doing something similar.

[Venus and Mars]

you didn't misrep chkflip titus he scummy

he scummy scummy scummy

I don'tknow if he flip scum but he is scummy

he's like way more political this game

now that coudl be because he got NANCYDDDDDDD

but hes deffos more political and that means it is wise to be wary

u feel me girrlllllll??>???

-K

I feel you definitely. But that doesn't leave drunk or sober me with a confident lynch choice. My gut says Auro isn't town but no one will tell me why he is. Chronos is an ass.

But then there's the wagon dispersal and threats which suggest one of the wagons is on scum.

So I'm just ahhhhh

Howdy partners. I've arbitrarily decide Michael Scott is town VOTE: BTE

I think he is too, what does that have to do with BTE?

That's where MS is voting and I trust him undoubtedly.

I still have never gotten an answer as to why MS is so trusted.

Ok yeah Vecna's scum. I didn't read that fight in detail but accusing Nancy of lying and saying I should know better is enough for a scumread combined with his role.

I also don't trust the infect back comment. Infect back only works if we never lynch the slots he targets but he refuses to townread Nancy and Auro (I think this is what Vecna meant by pops hydra) who I feel are the most likely obvtown slots.

Lolol, Titus must have forgotten she was pushing Auro and tmi towned him.

Interesting actually. Maybe I'm wrong on auro.

And KK because I think if either were scum here, Nom probably wouldn’t have been last night’s NK, due to being rendered voteless today from the Boonus round.

[Venus and Mars]

Nah it's cool this town fucking loves worthless lurksacks. It's all good.

I’m legit shocked your title isn’t “Mr. Congeniality”, no really.

[Venus and Mars]

WIFOM

Stop being dense. Why would scum kill a voteless player, rather than kill them the following night? Plus, that isn’t how Titus treats her buddies and I really don’t gaf whether or not you agree with that or not.

Re-reading Titus’ iso, I feel really silly not to have noticed the massive contradictions in her posting. Literally, the only thing, she stayed consistent on was me town and you scum.

[Venus and Mars]

I used to pursue a career in stand-up comedy. It's a play on words.

What was that like?

[Venus and Mars]

Right, I'm the one putting way too much stock in three games I played alongside another player. You're right. I'm the one that's wrong here. It's not WIFOM. Carry on.

We will see, who is right and who is wrong, won’t we?

[Venus and Mars]

You're also acting like, Idk, mafia isn't a fucking team of people who made a decision after your hallmark sister was dead. Seems legit.

“hallmark sister”? dafuq?

If I’m scum and Nom was my preferred kill, I’d let her live another day because of that.

[Venus and Mars]

I could join

The Fonz

on

Sore Feet

actually. After ISOing, I see a lot of commenting on things for the sake of commenting on things rather than genuine solving. My other head currently has a better grip on this game though, so gonna discuss with her before changing vote.

I don't agree with the logic that Dave being the second N1 suicidal cop claim makes him town. With 9 of those in the game, scum are definitely going to have at least 1, and there's no harm in claiming it after someone else does I don't think.

P.S: I have no grasp on the mechanical side of things. How concerned should I be about potential rogue elephants?

Chronos is a fine wagon though and IDC who's on it.

What do you think of GeorgeBailey

No strong opinion. Wouldn't fight off a GB Lynch.

Chronos/Nancy/chk/prob jjh/bte all town

Sore feet is in a weird dead zone where nothing they've said is ai to me either way.

MS I still suspect and Krazy is claimed miller but still a suspicious slot that has to be dealt with at some point. Probably not today.

Everyone else I'm indifferent to.

What changed your mind on

Chronos

?

-Cosmic

Interesting. @Conspire, which head made this post?

I tend to agree, no one’s sc claim is town indicative because Nom claimed it first.

[Venus and Mars]

That's not what I'm arguing but cool story bro.

I’m not losing braincells trying to understand exactly what you’re talking about. You either clarify it or you don’t.

[Venus and Mars]

I could join

The Fonz

on

Sore Feet

actually. After ISOing, I see a lot of commenting on things for the sake of commenting on things rather than genuine solving. My other head currently has a better grip on this game though, so gonna discuss with her before changing vote.

I don't agree with the logic that Dave being the second N1 suicidal cop claim makes him town. With 9 of those in the game, scum are definitely going to have at least 1, and there's no harm in claiming it after someone else does I don't think.

P.S: I have no grasp on the mechanical side of things. How concerned should I be about potential rogue elephants?

Chronos is a fine wagon though and IDC who's on it.

What do you think of GeorgeBailey

No strong opinion. Wouldn't fight off a GB Lynch.

Chronos/Nancy/chk/prob jjh/bte all town

Sore feet is in a weird dead zone where nothing they've said is ai to me either way.

MS I still suspect and Krazy is claimed miller but still a suspicious slot that has to be dealt with at some point. Probably not today.

Everyone else I'm indifferent to.

What changed your mind on

Chronos

?

-Cosmic

Interesting. @Conspire, which head made this post?

I tend to agree, no one’s sc claim is town indicative because Nom claimed it first.

I mean because it’s a direct contradiction of what your slot is saying now, so if it’s two different heads, that could explain it.

[Venus and Mars]

What a coincidence, I lose brain cells every time we interact.

Writing anyone off "because scum wouldn't blah blah blah" is, has always been, and will always be WIFOM. Period.

<3

No, it’s common sense but I think they’re both town for other reasons, that just strengthened it for me.

[Venus and Mars]

Wow I was just about to post that basically everyone seems town rn

thanks for reminding me you exist

VOTE: Conspire

I don't like this. You've talked about wanting to lynch us plenty earlier in this day phase.

also at this point everyone has 'a reason' not to get lynched don't they? Other than maybe like conspire? Idk

-K

Why do you think we might not have a reason to not be lynched?

-Cosmic

Iso 16-25 is good dedication for a bus

-K

Can you link/quote any relevant posts? Because I just reread 16-25 and have no clue what you’re referring to?

[Venus and Mars]

Iso 16-25, not posts 16-25, in case you misunderstood that

-K

You mean pages? You are specifically referring to Conspire/Titus’ interactions, I’m assuming? Well, that’s my one concern with jjh, she shaded him a bit, which is making me doubt him being a partner.

[Venus and Mars]

And KK because I think if either were scum here, Nom probably wouldn’t have been last night’s NK, due to being rendered voteless today from the Boonus round.

I'm less interested in this. Nom was pretty much confirmed after guiltying Titus. The boonus room and who won doesn't matter in the context of nom being the night kill.

You’re missing my point, she was voteless. I would think that would be significant enough for scum to possibly rethink having Nom as last night’s NK

[Venus and Mars]

I could join

The Fonz

on

Sore Feet

actually. After ISOing, I see a lot of commenting on things for the sake of commenting on things rather than genuine solving. My other head currently has a better grip on this game though, so gonna discuss with her before changing vote.

I don't agree with the logic that Dave being the second N1 suicidal cop claim makes him town. With 9 of those in the game, scum are definitely going to have at least 1, and there's no harm in claiming it after someone else does I don't think.

P.S: I have no grasp on the mechanical side of things. How concerned should I be about potential rogue elephants?

Chronos is a fine wagon though and IDC who's on it.

What do you think of GeorgeBailey

No strong opinion. Wouldn't fight off a GB Lynch.

Chronos/Nancy/chk/prob jjh/bte all town

Sore feet is in a weird dead zone where nothing they've said is ai to me either way.

MS I still suspect and Krazy is claimed miller but still a suspicious slot that has to be dealt with at some point. Probably not today.

Everyone else I'm indifferent to.

What changed your mind on

Chronos

?

-Cosmic

Interesting. @Conspire, which head made this post?

I tend to agree, no one’s sc claim is town indicative because Nom claimed it first.

Again I don't care about the order of claims. Nom had the only result. Everyone else got wrecked by sticky fruit therefore no result, no info, no reason to out. Plus I don't doubt all the suicidal cops legit have that role. But basing alignment on who checked the thread first is whack.

I agreee, I think who crumbed D1 is more telling: you, me. I’m assuming that was your reasoning behind you thinking scum would kill you, right? For me, it was why I totally expected to be confitown on D2, once I claimed my result.

[Venus and Mars]

Iso 16-25, not posts 16-25, in case you misunderstood that

-K

You mean pages? You are specifically referring to Conspire/Titus’ interactions, I’m assuming? Well, that’s my one concern with jjh, she shaded him a bit, which is making me doubt him being a partner.

Oh nm, I think I misunderstood. KK is referring to Conspire/jjh not Conspire/Titus or am I still not getting this?

[Venus and Mars]

I'm not saying cosmic never ever flips scum, I'm saying she's probably not a good lynch today because this sort of reads list/progression comes from town a whole lot more often than it comes from scum

-K

Oh okay, I think I get it now and agree. In Autobattler, Eve and another player wrongly thought I was scum who had backed myself into a corner by having too many tr but that’s antiwincon for scum. Scum tends to either have too many sr or waffles excessively on tls. In general, the more confident tr a slot has, the less likely they are to be scum, for obvious reasons.

[Venus and Mars]

If I was scum with Titus, why didn't she give me an item

The only items she had were barbs right?

[Venus and Mars]

Hey has anyone else noticed that every now and again in my posts I talked about modifiers that are in the game? Cool stuff right? How do I know about them?

Didn’t Titus mention them in the thread?

[Venus and Mars]

And KK because I think if either were scum here, Nom probably wouldn’t have been last night’s NK, due to being rendered voteless today from the Boonus round.

I'm less interested in this. Nom was pretty much confirmed after guiltying Titus. The boonus room and who won doesn't matter in the context of nom being the night kill.

You’re missing my point, she was voteless. I would think that would be significant enough for scum to possibly rethink having Nom as last night’s NK

I would think not. I literally would not care.

Maybe, it depends on whomever else scum wanted to NK and why I guess. I still think it could have possibly played a role.

[Venus and Mars]

Spoiler:

I could join

The Fonz

on

Sore Feet

actually. After ISOing, I see a lot of commenting on things for the sake of commenting on things rather than genuine solving. My other head currently has a better grip on this game though, so gonna discuss with her before changing vote.

I don't agree with the logic that Dave being the second N1 suicidal cop claim makes him town. With 9 of those in the game, scum are definitely going to have at least 1, and there's no harm in claiming it after someone else does I don't think.

P.S: I have no grasp on the mechanical side of things. How concerned should I be about potential rogue elephants?

Chronos is a fine wagon though and IDC who's on it.

What do you think of GeorgeBailey

No strong opinion. Wouldn't fight off a GB Lynch.

Chronos/Nancy/chk/prob jjh/bte all town

Sore feet is in a weird dead zone where nothing they've said is ai to me either way.

MS I still suspect and Krazy is claimed miller but still a suspicious slot that has to be dealt with at some point. Probably not today.

Everyone else I'm indifferent to.

What changed your mind on

Chronos

?

-Cosmic

Interesting. @Conspire, which head made this post?

I tend to agree, no one’s sc claim is town indicative because Nom claimed it first.

Again I don't care about the order of claims. Nom had the only result. Everyone else got wrecked by sticky fruit therefore no result, no info, no reason to out. Plus I don't doubt all the suicidal cops legit have that role. But basing alignment on who checked the thread first is whack.

I agreee, I think who crumbed D1 is more telling: you, me. I’m assuming that was your reasoning behind you thinking scum would kill you, right? For me, it was why I totally expected to be confitown on D2, once I claimed my result.

Yeah, couldn't mention it but at the time I thought it was a strong enough 1 shot.

So A.) I needed to know what vecna was doing in regards to millerizing. And
2.) If being a basic boon meant my role was simple. I nearly made Dave my check but felt that would be a wasted shot.

Yeah, the only slots that would have yielded results were Titus, GB and Fonz due to barbs cancelling out sticky fruit.

[Venus and Mars]

I wonder if boon would deliberately troll nancy by making all of her 'awards' actually be negative utility while implying it's wins

Maybe like even going back to rooming nero every night in LNT

Maybe she should actually be rooming her lowest reads rather than her highest?

-K

Oh, you think I should do that for today? I was thinking that based on last night’s Brs, even nights are more likely to be negative utility?

[Venus and Mars]

who handed out the barbs in the middle of the day again? Was that bte?

-K

Yeah, Boon could possibly be trolling me, just like it’s probably not a coincidence that BEF is once again, some kind of vendor.

[Venus and Mars]

I kinda think bte has to be town for that because otherwise if scum figured it out its maaaaybe super broken?

At the very least they would decide whether town only gets the chance of townclears with no chance of guilties

@bte can you remind us your reasoning on why you gave who the barbs?

-K

So, my theory is that Boon is probably trying to balance out my role by making even nights antitown, so its probably fine to leave my selections as is, considering this is an odd night.

[Venus and Mars]

I'm not saying cosmic never ever flips scum, I'm saying she's probably not a good lynch today because this sort of reads list/progression comes from town a whole lot more often than it comes from scum

-K

So yes we're coming to the same conclusion with respect to Conspire being probably town.
Why did you put it that way originally, as saying it's not a bus? That's what is confusing to me. I couldn't see anyone saying it was a bus, so focusing on that specifically was weird.
I can't speak for why Nancy was confused...

[Venus and Mars]

If being a basic boon meant my role was simple. I nearly made Dave my check but felt that would be a wasted shot.

No idea what basic boon means. Boon hasn't said anything about it that I can see.

I’m guessing vt?

[Venus and Mars]

If being a basic boon meant my role was simple. I nearly made Dave my check but felt that would be a wasted shot.

No idea what basic boon means. Boon hasn't said anything about it that I can see.

I’m guessing vt?

Actually that can’t be right, since I’m one and obviously not a vt.

[Venus and Mars]

Maybe basic boon is a play on eicn where he was a 'simple' goon LOL

which would make the role like traitor kinda

-K

No, he explains is as when all threats to contestants have been eliminated but yeah, considering Boobeytoonrz gang is scum, that really doesn’t make a lot of sense.

[Venus and Mars]

I think the last several pages of jjh are actually really fucking town.

Also, dave, don't feel bad. I had no idea what they were on about either.

UNVOTE: Conspire

So, who do we lynch then? Who isn’t “really fucking town”?

[Venus and Mars]

I'm the last person to bang on people for activity, and the first one to assume RL intervened.
That said, George disappeared as soon as his wagon did.

When Titus was going down in HW, she began to tunnel Creature, which greatly upset Math and caused him to hardbus her.

[Venus and Mars]

I think focusing too much on Titus interactions will leave us running in circles.
It's too easy for experienced scum to leave false trails and anti-associations to have that be the top consideration in scumhunting.

Maybe but that’s the best thing I’ve literally got to go on rn. There isn’t anyone who’s being obviously scummy.

[Venus and Mars]

I'm the last person to bang on people for activity, and the first one to assume RL intervened.
That said, George disappeared as soon as his wagon did.

When Titus was going down in HW, she began to tunnel Creature, which greatly upset Math and caused him to hardbus her.

Does that go with this comment about George, or about the other comment about using associations too much?
If it goes with George, how does it apply?

Creature was our buddy and and Sakura figured out that she had done the exact same thing to Varsoon, which got him wrongly tr.

So, I dunno if Titus was flailing and latching on to GB as an easy mislynch or if she knew she was going down and trying to antispew him as a buddy.

[Venus and Mars]

We could lynch auro and if he flips green blame volxen :kappa

-K

no. Seriously, I have no clue who to vote for but GB did make that barb post, that was the final nail in Titus’ coffin but it is definitely in her meta to do that to a buddy. \_0_/

[Venus and Mars]

VOTE: fonz

Who wants to tell me why I'm choking on scum wagons and accidentally diverting to a mislynch this game?

-K

Why Fonz - other than his horrible read on me?

[Venus and Mars]

UNVOTE:

Titus’ does shade jjh and defended Nom’s sr on him, so why is this game so hard?

[Venus and Mars]

See thing is I don't think any of my day one town reads are any less townish, and Dave and Chronos over the course of the day have kinda moved out of my "Would lynch" pile. RN it's basically RCE, George, SF in the POE.

I think probably the only slot who's got scummier since day one is VaM.

I would really love to hear the rationale behind this.

[Venus and Mars]

Nancy do you have a read on fonz?

-K

His push on me is hella weird and makes no sense. Otherwise, I’m not really seeing it?

[Venus and Mars]

but do you find hard town in him anywhere?

-K

One thing stuck out at me, when re-isoing Titus, she never once gave a single read on him.

I think his having me in his POE on D3 is suspicious and combining it with his D1 posts, kind of gives me the impression that he is upset that I’m not an easy lynch. However, I like some of his other posts but no, I don’t have that same hardtown read on him here, that I did in TBONTB.

[Venus and Mars]

Like, I don’t understand how he got from, tr both me and Chk but would lynch me over Chk, to having me in his POE. Auro said Fonz accounted for the shift but I couldn’t find it.

[Venus and Mars]

Like, I don’t understand how he got from, tr both me and Chk but would lynch me over Chk, to having me in his POE. Auro said Fonz accounted for the shift but I couldn’t find it.

@Fonz, can you link any scumgames? Thanks.

[Venus and Mars]

The Fonz is my top townread because The Fonz has been one of few people talking sense in a game where I feel almost anyone can be town and therefore anyone can be scum. There are so many dissenting opinions that don't make sense to me. Talking sense is the odd thing out here , and The Fonz is a beacon of sanity

Not on my slot but otherwise, I disagree with KK that his iso doesn’t in general sound townie.

[Venus and Mars]

I still like GB’s iso on reread.

[Venus and Mars]

@Boon, any chance of us getting an extension?

[Venus and Mars]

What's the mechanical case for RCEnigma being scum? Currently, I think him or Sore Feet should be the lynch.

-Cosmic

Why does scum!Sore Feet not want jjh lynched so he can cop him?

[Venus and Mars]

What's the mechanical case for RCEnigma being scum? Currently, I think him or Sore Feet should be the lynch.

-Cosmic

Why does scum!Sore Feet not want jjh lynched so he can cop him?

And what do you mean by “mechanical case”?

[Venus and Mars]

Like, I don’t understand how he got from, tr both me and Chk but would lynch me over Chk, to having me in his POE. Auro said Fonz accounted for the shift but I couldn’t find it.

Dave, can you produce for us a reads list?
Some ordered ranking of players, no need for detail.

???

What does Dave have to do with my post?

[Venus and Mars]

I have medium-strength reasons to townread Fonz apart from his play, which I won't be outing in thread right now.

We have under two days and I still don’t have a clue who to vote for. I gave Chk grief over pushing me for that earlier but now, I’m seriously bothered by this.

[Venus and Mars]

It was an accidental quote.

Oh okay.

[Venus and Mars]

I think I'm stronger in jjh!town as well right now. How about you?

Yeah and Titus did shade him and agreed with Nom’s sr on him, so he doesn’t look like a Titus buddy.

Figuring out who I don’t want to lynch today, is a helluva lot easier than figuring out who I do.

[Venus and Mars]

I mean, one reason the game's this way is that we're not bringing anyone close to lynch range. Yeah I know this game isn't D1 but we seemingly have low info and maybe the consensus PoE isn't much reliable, but doing that could kickstart the game.

Vote RCE?

Do you think scum!RCE hardclaims town as scum?

[Venus and Mars]

Spoiler: Shitty theory and self-meta

So jjh actually did make one correct observation about me this game - that I was being mostly conflict avoidant, and not getting into people's faces. I don't know why he really left that though, considering that I wasn't actively pursuing conflicts (which is almost an opposite from my play in White Flag, which I think jjh is informed by).

I have been experimenting with playstyle changes after White Flag. In the recent Masons and Mafia open, I played a lot more socially than in WF. I was being aggressive, but at the same time, kept it conversational and smooth with players I was scumreading. I had a few conflicts, yeah, but was generally liked in a sense that enabled me to become effectively unlynchable in a game that lacked NKs, and letting me drive lynches (sadly losing the game ) on players I had called "99% town" earlier and still having them townread me. I also somewhat did this in a Mini Normal I replaced into around that time, by focusing energy into a slot or two at a time instead of attacking everywhere.

I also came across a post somewhere (maybe Mafia discussion?) that proffered one method of playing Mafia as developing townreads and lynching from PoE as effective. I decided I'd perhaps give this a shot (at one point I can't resist going aggro but anyway) and letting the game play while being a part of it without polarising things (a contributing reason was also my role). I don't think this really inhibits scumhunting - my previous method of relentless aggression worked >rand maybe, but I feel that this style is equally, if not more effective.

One effect of this seems to be scum disappointment at my getting townread, lol. Popsofctown made a number of posts complaining about how no one wanted to lynch me and that being a demotivating factor to her. Titus incidentally seemed to do the same here from early game - it's like scum expected I would hyperpost and polarize and start fights, and they could capitalize on that. I'm surprised I didn't pick up on what Nancy did about Titus calling me obvtown, good spot!

All that said, although we do have some form of a consensus PoE pool, the majority of activity recently has been a few town slots trying to get somewhere. I feel that given the strength of townreads that this bloc have for each other - in {Chk, Fonzie, V&M, Katz} etc for example, (yeah yeah Chk and Fonzie dislike V&M but still) scum feel comfortable letting the game just go along. I've seen scum lurk out previously but given the relative strength of this playerlist as town and scum, does that make too much sense?

I’m embarrassed I didn’t catch that on D1. If I had, I maybe wouldn’t have been so easily pocketed by her. Contradictory posting is one of the most effective ways of catching scum. That’s how we caught scum!sheep in Forrest Fire.

[Venus and Mars]

I think I'm changing my mind on GeorgeBailey as well.

From what to what?

I think Chk is probably right that she latched on to him as flailing scum to save herself. I don’t think she was trying to antispew him as a buddy. Titus is pretty survivalistic as scum and was probably really upset about the cop guilty on her.

[Venus and Mars]

well do you wanna just sleep then? who the f do we lynch auro? LOL

-K

I wish I knew but unless we get an extension, we currently have no consensus lynch.

[Venus and Mars]

{Conspiracy, JJH420, Fondue, Davy Jones,[b{ Venom and Misery[/b], Krusty Krabz, BooneyTunzNoob}
Apart from Fondue who do you think shouldn't be there

Shiro probably doesn’t have a venomous bone in his entire body.

[Venus and Mars]

Oh add ChkFlip too

Chk is the only one not to get a creative moniker.

[Venus and Mars]

Krazy Katz - reminder -- uncc'd target of titus's n1 debuff
Venus and Mars - mars spewed town by titus
Chkflip - claim bullshit spews not scum kinda? maybe traitor or something worst case scenario?
Chronos -- think the push on titus day 1 town indicative
RCEnigma - liked one post from mechanic
BooneyToonzExpert -- think the role is probably not groupscum, best shot here would be 3p?
Sore feet - [bullshit reasons to townlean]

would lynch today line
____
Michael Scott -- actually concerned about volxen ghosting you, wouldn't not lynch?
Davesaz - wouldn't not lynch, cop claim slightly townie but not enough to full clear; some interactions kinda okay for townish
George Bailey -- not sure the titus interaction really clears him, he kinda vanished recently, would lynch
Conspire - can't remember reasons not to lynch
Jjh927 -- would lynch
The Fonz - top lynch

I guess i'm like.... here

there's a lot of slots I would *eventually* lynch this game

and a lot of slots that for *reasons* are unappealing to lynch today

so what the fuck do we do

I think it's bad to just not lynch here

but I have no idea whatsoever how to get a consensus

-K

MS is town based off of nothing else then the way Titus tmi towned him after pushing him. Volxen ghosting is NAI, remember VG?

I agree and while I don’t share MS, Conspire and other’s confidence, can you tell me why you have Fonz as “top lynch”?

[Venus and Mars]

Caught up, and I've got next to nothing.

Far, far too much "[Person A] did [thing B] to [Person C] in [game D]"

I basically switched off after a few pages, so TBH I don't have much to add. Many of the things that stood out as interesting have been discussed and dealt with already so no point in bringing them up again, except...

@Vecna/chkflip chkflip said he couldn't let Vecna's role live but then doesn't vote Vecna. Vecna doesn't comment on it. What the? It's an odd interaction.

This is blatant misrepresentation of what was said, don't like.

If I missed anything relevant in pages 21 to 25-ish can some please tell me what it was, i decided to skip the dissection of a previous game.

snip...
But if they can stay alive long enough they will give us good info.
...snip

Imagine I don't have the vaguest clue about Nancy and explain why the above is true please.

Reads so far...

Vecna and Chronos are most likely town

KK is (are?) town leaning

Virtually everyone else is null

Titus is slight sumread because of the above post.

I actually tl the bolded.

[Venus and Mars]

I kinda dislike the way fonz skated away the conflicts on day 1 tbh

it certainly would have been townier to be like... at least nominally peacemakery

The only thing bothering - other than of course his horrible read on me - is there seems to be a bit of a disconnect from how he interacted with me in TBORTB and this game. The main reason I townlocked him in that game was practically every post of his oozed sincerity. I know this is really weak but I’m finding it harder to see that here. Definitely agree with you on SF. I feel pretty confident on them being town now.

[Venus and Mars]

krusty krabz is this the point at which we start tunneling each other? :3

Is this going to be like that King Arthur game again? I hope not.

[Venus and Mars]

Ok yeah Vecna's scum. I didn't read that fight in detail but accusing Nancy of lying and saying I should know better is enough for a scumread combined with his role.

I also don't trust the infect back comment. Infect back only works if we never lynch the slots he targets but

he refuses to townread Nancy and Auro

(I think this is what Vecna meant by pops hydra) who I feel are the most likely obvtown slots.

Howdy partners. I've arbitrarily decide Michael Scott is town VOTE: BTE

I think he is too, what does that have to do with BTE?

That's where MS is voting and I trust him undoubtedly.

I still have never gotten an answer as to why MS is so trusted.

Krazy, this is why MS is town. She tmi’d him town in 1492.

[Venus and Mars]

he's not jokey enoiugh to be town

He’s a lot more jokey here than in that game.

[Venus and Mars]

Spoiler:

When did I say you were ascetic? I said I got no result.

~Amrun

Then the logical conclusion is roleblocked not guilty, particularly when someone else already has a fake guilty on me. Yet, you jumped to the scum conclusion implying I was ascetic.

When did I say you were ascetic? I said I got no result.

~Amrun

Then the logical conclusion is roleblocked not guilty, particularly when someone else already has a fake guilty on me. Yet, you jumped to the scum conclusion implying I was ascetic.

What?

Why would me being roleblocked mean you were not guilty? How are those related?

I got some strange virus thing that totally mutated my role. I have no idea how that interacts with my results. It is the logical conclusion that my results are unreliable vs nomnom.

~Amrun

Then why are you voting as if your results matter rather than just blocked.

Why aren't you suspecting the guy who claimed the same role as you?

But damn 3 night 1 cops, I am kinda lost in what is going on here.

~Venus

The one cop that got a result is fucked with.

Krazy should claim their prize btw.

@Conspire, none of these read like buddy posts to me.

@Auro, this is why KK isn’t scum.

[Venus and Mars]

I think the barb sender is probably scum but I can neuter that probably.

BTE also spewed town by this.

[Venus and Mars]

he's not jokey enoiugh to be town

He’s a lot more jokey here than in that game.

Was joking lol, a reference to Excalibur

Yeah that’s it. You were wrongly sr him for not being jokey enough and Maria misvigged you both.

[Venus and Mars]

like if you want to lynch xtoxm you can I just... will only hammer to avoid no lynch basically

-K

No, I don’t want to lynch Xtoxm, I’m pretty sure he’s town because of his cop post stuff.

[Venus and Mars]

like this would be a weird question but Nancy do you have a read on duckling's head specifically?

-K

No, unfortunately I don’t which is unfortunate since Xtoxm is harder to read but I don’t think that slot is scum here. I don’t think Xtoxm does that early AtE as scum, because he would have to know, if he did, I would be powerlynching him in any subsequent game he pulled this, until kingdom come.

[Venus and Mars]

It was Kokichi lol

But he based it on Maria’s reads.

[Venus and Mars]

basically duckling here reminds me of when I hydra'd with him in mastina's game

it's a very soft thing and I could easily be wrong

let's leave it at that

that's not exactly what was on my mind, but it's like, basically very similar to that

-K

I have 0 familarity with that game, so can you please elaborate on that?

[Venus and Mars]

eh, joining the game as a hydra and then doing nothing

not something I can say is 'outside his scum range' but I guess his absence and xtoxm carrying the slot after reminds me of that

-K

Well, duckling did flake on me in CoH but I tl the whole cop thing + that AtE.

[Venus and Mars]

nancy what "cop thing" again? Can you explain?

Spoiler:

nah not 1v1ing jjh
i have an item that i can give out on non consecutive nights
i gave it to jjh n1
dont want to lynch out the only thing ive done with my role
the item has an effect, which will become evident soon enough
it has the potential to trap scum if they dont figure out how to play around it

im feeling pretty done with this game and my role is probably not that important all things considered

krazy
you're voting jjh
do you have any thoughts on my claim?
would you consider voting outside {me, jjh}

Why did you like him enough to item him when he was a leading wagon day 1?

i thought he might be a likely n1kill target, and that seemed like the best i had at the time.
he is also a strong scum player who i have read incorrectly before so he's a good target to learn something about to possibly catch out.
and yes im intentionally vague because revealing diminishes the usefulness of my role pretty much entirely. you can flip me if you want to see exactly what it does. then my choice will make more sense, i think.

I feel pretty good sf is town based on recent posts, plus he was on Nom wagon and I highly doubt any of Titus’ buddies voted there.

[Venus and Mars]

VOTE: fonz

Who wants to tell me why I'm choking on scum wagons and accidentally diverting to a mislynch this game?

-K

Why Fonz - other than his horrible read on me?

Yeah, in a game where you basically agree there's not obvscum and a lot of people are making sense you think that me not having had a reason to locktown you is a "terrible read." Be less egomaniacal, please.

Between you and Chk, this is completely unacceptable. I won’t repond to posts that don’t address me respectfully.

Since when does having me in your PoE=not locktowning me?

[Venus and Mars]

And it objectively IS a terrible read and insulting me won’t change that opinion and I’m referring to your reasoning more than your obvious failure to correctly read me.

[Venus and Mars]

nancy stop being scummy plz

How am I being scummy? I’m supposed to be okay with him calling me “egomaniacal”? I don’t think so.

[Venus and Mars]

I mean he said to be less egoy, he didn't say you were all egoy

Don't overreact its scummy

If you seriously don’t view that word as being extremely provocative, I don’t know what to tell you. There is nothing even remotely “scummy” about my reaction to that.

[Venus and Mars]

VOTE: fonz

Who wants to tell me why I'm choking on scum wagons and accidentally diverting to a mislynch this game?

-K

Why Fonz - other than his horrible read on me?

Yeah, in a game where you basically agree there's not obvscum and a lot of people are making sense you think that me not having had a reason to locktown you is a "terrible read." Be less egomaniacal, please.

Between you and Chk, this is completely unacceptable. I won’t repond to posts that don’t address me respectfully.

Since when does having me in your PoE=not locktowning me?

You literally accuse me of being crack and then turn around and suggest my calling you egomaniacal is disrespectful. Nancy, you consistently operate a double standard as to what is an acceptable level of abrasion, being far more rude than you will accept from anyone else toward you. The way YOU have spoken to ME throughout this game is what is completely unacceptable, not how i've reacted to it.

Having you at the back end of my POE and not locktowning you are basically the same thing, right? Because anyone who I don't have a strong desire not to lynch today is in my POE. Tbf I think you're probably just outside my POE right now, because I think I was wrong to write off Dave from consideration. Anyway I'm writing a more detailed treatment of exactly this in the catchup post I'm writing right now.

You have misinterpreted my early posts, which I’ve already explained, yet you refuse to believe me. I literally apologized more than once, when I actually have been guilty of what you’re accusing me of here. Calling your read on me “horrible”, in no way justifies that “egomaniacal” response and I won’t apologize for my reaction to it.

[Venus and Mars]

Calling a READ “horrible” /=calling a PERSON “egomaniacal”.

[Venus and Mars]

Calling a READ “horrible” /=calling a PERSON “egomaniacal”.

However Krazy does have a point, I shouldn’t continue to allow myself to be so easily baited but I think Fonz was fully aware of the reaction that word would provoke. He could have expressed a similar sentiment in a far less provocative manner, yet he chose not to. He wanted to bait me with that and he obviously gloriously succeeded.

[Venus and Mars]

I think he’s probably town, despite that bad read.

[Venus and Mars]

Like, I don’t understand how he got from, tr both me and Chk but would lynch me over Chk, to having me in his POE. Auro said Fonz accounted for the shift but I couldn’t find it.

@Fonz, can you link any scumgames? Thanks.

viewtopic.php?f=55&t=59293 that's the only scum game since my recent return. I can dig up older meta if you like, but it's like four plus years old at the most recent so I'm not sure how useful it'll be. TL/DR is I replaced in and tunnelled Boon early because he lied about his role and relentlessly attacking people who lie about their role is kind of my thing when I'm town.

I really don't understand why you think there's an inconsistency here. Day one I call you pretty hard null over and over. That's not a scumread. The fact that I didn't want to lynch you was just that you weren't in my bottom four or five. A relevant thing about my reads that I don't think I've mentioned is that day one I kinda scumleant Titus on play, but felt like her boldness around claiming a potentially scummy-sounding role and acting like it was the most obvtown thing in the world was somewhat unlikely to come from scum. Natural psychological aversion to being burned the same way twice. That has a bearing on how I see you behaving kind of similarly.

What changes day three is a couple of things. One is the Titus thing above. The second is that the quick and dirty VCA I did in response to BTE's lacklustre at best VCA flags you up as being in kinda suspect places on both wagons. The third is a lot of other people I looked at as candidates before you started to look more town to me. Noticeably, Chronos after I iso-ed her, and Dave because of the secret cop thing. I'm now kind of buying RCE's argument about that not really being that difficult for scum to fake.

So at the beginning of the day my bottom of the playerlist in towniness probably looked something like this:

Nancy
George
RCE
___________________________
BTE
Dave
Sore Feet
Chronos


Lower players being scummier, the line probably being "Would consider for today's lynch."

Then I re-read Chronos and think her Titus interaction doesn't really look like bussing. Maybe the reason I'm not able to remember any Chronos interaction is that I don't know her, she's kind of uncharismatic, and has an Anime avatar that blurs together with some other people's, rather than that she's actually not doing anything. And someone (I can't remember who) offhand is reasonably persuasive about Dave's handling of the Secret Cop thing, so I'm like yeah, maybe that's enough to not consider him today.

So then it's like:

Chronos


Dave
George
__________________
Nancy
RCE
BTE
Sore Feet

I've quite liked what you've said recently when you're not talking about me and/or yourself, and as noted I was probably wrong to downgrade Dave as a candidate. George I go back and forth on loads. He's probably flipped between being just above and quite a bit below you almost every time I come to the thread.

At the moment I'm probably like

Nancy
____________
RCE
George
Dave
BTE
Sore Feet
faq.php?mode=bbcode
You spent some time in the "Eh, I don't think this is a particularly great lynch, it's OK I guess - if it and one of those I'm actively townreading are the two competing wagons at deadline" kind of slot currently occupied by RCE. I just don't see how having you there is "Objectively terrible." Also, calling my reads "Objectively terrible" is more offensive than calling you egomaniacal, because implying I'm stupid is a worse insult.

It's like when you accused me of saying you're terrible at scumhunting because I expect you to townread Titus. No, I think you have bias towards your friend because you know she's a good person and want to think the best of her, and that you undercompensate for that bias in games. I also think you have bias toward thinking your own opinions are less questionable than they might be to people viewing games through different prisms. I agree with chk that you being aware of your tendencies as town and scum make you able to manipulate them as scum to try to get townread.

If my read is "Objectively horrible" as you claim, which player that I'm essentially eliminating for today (chk, Conspire, Michael, JJH, Katz, and now Chronos) is objectively obviously much scummier than you? Because believe me, I'd really like to know.

I don’t know why you’d think I’d be more likely to tr a slot based on personal feelings. You probably don’t honestly intend that to be an insult but it actually is. I don’t allow how I feel about someone personally to affect my reads. If that were even remotely true, Chk would be my top sr and as you know, he’s one of my strongest tr.

Wrt to your question, I don’t even know what answer you’re expecting, since I know I’m town and also - as I already stated on D1, to be well beyond my scumrange.

[Venus and Mars]

That’s why I called it a horrible read. You suggesting I tr Titus based not on my actually being competent at mafia but based on you thinking my reads are based on how I feel about people outside of the game. It was this and THIS specifically that I reacted so strongly against because that is 100% not the case and only a horrible mafia player would make reads based on how they feel about people irl.

[Venus and Mars]

I need to catch up properly, but it looks like there’s still no town cohesion and that’s :c

Who are we lynching? I’m ok with a pool of RCE/sore feet/BTE

~Esper

I hard tr BTE and strongly tl SF after their recent posts.

[Venus and Mars]

I need to catch up properly, but it looks like there’s still no town cohesion and that’s :c

Who are we lynching? I’m ok with a pool of RCE/sore feet/BTE

~Esper

I hard tr BTE and strongly tl SF after their recent posts.

Also reread Titus’ iso, she spews BTE as not a buddy.

[Venus and Mars]

Nancy. You claim you're objectively town. If you're so obviously town, it should be easy to name one person I have above you who is more scummy than you, from an *objective* perspective, because if it's obvious you're town

I just don't believe anyone who ever claims they're beyond their scumrange, because if they know what they're usually capable of as scum, they can deliberately act differently. I do not for one second understand what is unique about you that makes this different. The only exceptions I know are things like me getting a level of angry as town I'm incapable of faking.

How do you figure this? I should know who is scum here and if I don’t, that in your opinion, somehow makes me any less obvtown?

[Venus and Mars]

I am also not Titus and her play here has no bearing on mine. So, again, another bad argument. You should rather be asking, is this scum indicative for Nancy? and you’d find that out, if you ever took the time to metacheck me.

[Venus and Mars]

Welcome back to the Nancy Show! Where Nancy takes pages of the game and makes it about herself in one way, shape, or another. On today's episode of the Nancy Show, we have returning guest The Fonz bringing yet another objectively factual case that Nancy is once again squiggly about like a floppy disk! Haha 90s references are fun. How will she react? Poorly. How will it further our progress? It won't! But let's see how emotional she gets this time.

Baba da dop bada
Baba da dip boo da
Bippidy boppidy boo
The Nancy Show!

(canned applause)

There is nothing remotely “factual” about any of it. You don’t know my meta and won’t bother to check it out. I’m not rehashing this again because it would be far more productive banging my head against a brick wall. You want to persist in being obtuse, have at it.

[Venus and Mars]

That’s why I called it a horrible read. You suggesting I tr Titus based not on my actually being competent at mafia but based on you thinking my reads are based on how I feel about people outside of the game. It was this and THIS specifically that I reacted so strongly against because that is 100% not the case and only a horrible mafia player would make reads based on how they feel about people irl.

You're just wrong! Literally everyone has hundreds of biases, some they're aware of, some they're not! And we try to compensate as best we can. Like, I know I'm biased toward chkflip because he's a good guy and I enjoy his company. I worry I'm biased towards Auro, just because he's nice and rational and doesn't upset me. Having these biases doesn't make you terrible, it makes you human!

And I'm probably biased against you because you stress me out to a level that is actually physically unpleasant. I got a poor night's sleep Monday night largely because of how amped up I was as a result of how you spoke to me.

I feel constantly torn between calling you out for hurting me, and knowing that you yourself are vulnerable and that your response is either that you'll internalise it and that'll hurt you, or your response will escalate and hurt me worse. I feel like you are unusually unable to distinguish between normal criticism of your play based on imperfect information, and personal attacks. It feels like everything you think is a normal part of criticising other people's play is like a red rag to a bull to me and chkflip, whilst what we think is well within the bounds of civility seems to set you off. In particular, you seem to have a high bar for how offensive you feel you are allowed to be about other people's level of skill, intelligence, or degree of empathy. You seem to have quite a low one for taking offense at anyone suggesting emotion is affecting your play. Me and Chk, the opposite.

This is why I try to read you based on your stated reads on other people, and not directly attack you until I am convinced I want to lynch you. I don't think I misinterpreted your early play. "Biting my head off" is obviously figurative, but it felt like an extremely aggressive overreaction. That was very much unacceptable to me.

I didn’t intentionally do that and I’ve already explained that you misinterpreted my post. All I asked and a fair question, was iirc, how is my play remotely different from TBoNTB, because I’m not seeing it.

Chk is probably driving me to drink and perhaps that’s spilling over onto you? If so, I’m sorry because I honestly do like you and think you’re a really good guy.

I really really don’t want to be fighting with you like this. Chk, I think just flat out hates me, so I won’t even bother with him.

Yes, I am super stressed and I already explained why at the beginning of the game and I think it’s cruel of Chk to be deliberately ignoring that.

I am truly sorry if I upset you and made you uncomfortable and/or hurt your feelings in any way. I legit have nothing but the highest regard for you as a human being, based off what little I know of you from playing two mafia games with you.

[Venus and Mars]

Nancy. You claim you're objectively town. If you're so obviously town, it should be easy to name one person I have above you who is more scummy than you, from an *objective* perspective, because if it's obvious you're town

I just don't believe anyone who ever claims they're beyond their scumrange, because if they know what they're usually capable of as scum, they can deliberately act differently. I do not for one second understand what is unique about you that makes this different. The only exceptions I know are things like me getting a level of angry as town I'm incapable of faking.

How do you figure this? I should know who is scum here and if I don’t, that in your opinion, somehow makes me any less obvtown?

Nancy. If it is *objective* you are town, that means it is *objective* that no more than a couple of people can be more obviously town than you. If more than half the game can reasonably be argued to be more obviously town than you, it is just plainly false that you are objectively obvtown.

It's almost as if scumminess is relative, and that if lots of other people are obvtown, I ought to be relatively wary of people who are simply playing to meta.

The only alignment I’m 100% certain of, is my own. I honestly don’t know what else you expect me to say.

[Venus and Mars]

The Sorcerer’s ABoontice!

Vote Count 3.05

Jjh927 [2]:

GeorgeBailey, BooneyToonzExpert,

GeorgeBailey [2]:

Chronos, davesaz

RCEnigma [2]:

Michael Scott, Conspire

Michael Scott [2]:

sore feet, RCEnigma

sore feet [1]:

The Fonz,

The Fonz [1]:

Krazy Katz

Conspire [1]:

Jjh927,

Not Voting [2]:

Chkflip, Venus and Mars

With

13

alive, it takes

7

to execute.

Day 3

ends in (expired on 2020-04-09 21:00:00) on

April 9th

.

Mod Notes:

Don’t be outta pocket.

I won’t be giving an extension because there hasn’t been an extreme lack of inactivity or any replacements needing to catch up.

I don’t like any of these wagons but the one I hate the least is probably RCE. I really hate feeling this unconfident on D2.

So, unless someone can make a more compelling case? \_0_/

[Venus and Mars]

That’s why I called it a horrible read. You suggesting I tr Titus based not on my actually being competent at mafia but based on you thinking my reads are based on how I feel about people outside of the game. It was this and THIS specifically that I reacted so strongly against because that is 100% not the case and only a horrible mafia player would make reads based on how they feel about people irl.

You're just wrong! Literally everyone has hundreds of biases, some they're aware of, some they're not! And we try to compensate as best we can. Like, I know I'm biased toward chkflip because he's a good guy and I enjoy his company. I worry I'm biased towards Auro, just because he's nice and rational and doesn't upset me. Having these biases doesn't make you terrible, it makes you human!

And I'm probably biased against you because you stress me out to a level that is actually physically unpleasant. I got a poor night's sleep Monday night largely because of how amped up I was as a result of how you spoke to me.

I feel constantly torn between calling you out for hurting me, and knowing that you yourself are vulnerable and that your response is either that you'll internalise it and that'll hurt you, or your response will escalate and hurt me worse. I feel like you are unusually unable to distinguish between normal criticism of your play based on imperfect information, and personal attacks. It feels like everything you think is a normal part of criticising other people's play is like a red rag to a bull to me and chkflip, whilst what we think is well within the bounds of civility seems to set you off. In particular, you seem to have a high bar for how offensive you feel you are allowed to be about other people's level of skill, intelligence, or degree of empathy. You seem to have quite a low one for taking offense at anyone suggesting emotion is affecting your play. Me and Chk, the opposite.

This is why I try to read you based on your stated reads on other people, and not directly attack you until I am convinced I want to lynch you. I don't think I misinterpreted your early play. "Biting my head off" is obviously figurative, but it felt like an extremely aggressive overreaction. That was very much unacceptable to me.

I didn’t intentionally do that and I’ve already explained that you misinterpreted my post. All I asked and a fair question, was iirc, how is my play remotely different from TBoNTB, because I’m not seeing it.

Chk is probably driving me to drink and perhaps that’s spilling over onto you? If so, I’m sorry because I honestly do like you and think you’re a really good guy.

I really really don’t want to be fighting with you like this. Chk, I think just flat out hates me, so I won’t even bother with him.

Yes, I am super stressed and I already explained why at the beginning of the game and I think it’s cruel of Chk to be deliberately ignoring that.

I am truly sorry if I upset you and made you uncomfortable and/or hurt your feelings in any way. I legit have nothing but the highest regard for you as a human being, based off what little I know of you from playing two mafia games with you.

Cool let's virtual hug this out and talk about the actual lynch <3

<3

[Venus and Mars]

ok not exactly, just the hugging part.
@Everyone, just vote George, let's see what happens.

I will have to go on YouTube as it’s apparently not available in my country.

VOTE: GeorgeBailey

I just looked up his posts and he’s posting elsewhere. In MfD, he was way more invested in that game to have put himself into prodge range.

His reads also lack conviction.

[Venus and Mars]

Therefore my conclusion is that she gave the Virus a disloyal modifier, making K/K and potentially Chkflip unable to target any scum with their items.

The virus isnt an item, the sticky fruits are.

Boon confirmed to me in PM just now that the virus is an item

what didnt someone just say tha tit didnt count for them in the item coutner ?

~Venus

Sush, just ignore nom and let's scumhunt.

Talk to me about George.

It is definitely weird that she never even mentioned sr him before this. It is within her meta to try to distance a buddy this way. She has done that with both Varsoon and Creature.

[Venus and Mars]

I think I know what you're trying to do Michael. Sorry, I've just been lost.

I'm having a bit of trouble keeping up with reads but I think Conspire or RC are better choices than JJH.

Why Conspire? How are they scummy?

[Venus and Mars]

@Krazy, I really think Fonz is town now.

[Venus and Mars]

She has done that with both Varsoon and Creature.

Hmm, given all of this, your data becomes invalid @BooneyTunzExpert; can't argue that it's likelier she doesn't mention her buddies.
Agree?

When Titus was being lynched in two of her games she suddenly shaded her buddy. In HW, it was Creature and in I don’t know the game, it was Varsoon, so yes, it is possible.

[Venus and Mars]

Thoughts:

@Chk, never ever sign up for another game of mine. If you could read my mind now, I’d likely get temp banned for those thoughts.

@Krazy, in what world are you still sr Fonz?

MS and SF are very likely both town.

Nothing GB has posted, makes me want to move my vote.

[Venus and Mars]

Thoughts:

@Chk, never ever sign up for another game of mine. If you could read my mind now, I’d likely get temp banned for those thoughts.

@Krazy, in what world are you still sr Fonz?

MS and SF are very likely both town.

Nothing GB has posted, makes me want to move my vote.

I

Nancy, will you be around to move right at deadline if needed?

“move right”?

Deadline I think is 1:00 am. my time, so probably.

If anyone presents a more compelling case or we have to switch to avoid a no lynch? Sure but GB’s posting wrt to Nom is unconvincing, where as Conspire’s is. I knew Nom wasn’t lying, I only questioned her possibly being wrong due to mech reasons and GB literally posted that be trusted Nom, because he apparently got a “no results” on her. Why does getting a “no results” result make anyone town, let alone their claim believable? This is what I meant by his reads lacking conviction. Conspire’s reaction looked townie to me.

[Venus and Mars]

/yawn

Petty threats over jokes. Get over yourself.

I can’t because first, I need to get over YOU.

[Venus and Mars]

I'll fuckin cashapp scum to shoot her just so I don't have to watch another episode of The Nancy Show. Swear to God.

If you honestly feel this way, then you would stop literally going out of your way to continue to antagonize me. Why don’t you try that for a bit? I think the difference in my behaviour will astound you.

[Venus and Mars]

Thoughts:

@Chk, never ever sign up for another game of mine. If you could read my mind now, I’d likely get temp banned for those thoughts.

@Krazy, in what world are you still sr Fonz?

MS and SF are very likely both town.

Nothing GB has posted, makes me want to move my vote.

I

Nancy, will you be around to move right at deadline if needed?

“move right”?

Deadline I think is 1:00 am.

Move, right at deadline. If you're around I think I can turn in.

<3

Well I don’t want to no lynch but I really think GB is scum now. I have no clue wrt to RCE.

[Venus and Mars]

Wait which song by the police is that?

Police song?

[Venus and Mars]

You've reacted to literally every player since the beginning of the game with the same irritating "I'm obvtown you woat" mentality. Literally cased it. But you do youuuu~

Katz, I think it was a Donny Osmund song actually.

Am I actually doing that right this fucking second? No but why should that stop you from trying to gratuitously once again antagonize me?

[Venus and Mars]

Donny Osmond song?

[Venus and Mars]

Why does literally everyone in the lynch pool vanish when the suspicion dies down?

I’m frustrated because I think we might mislynch because of it. I would really be pissed if we lynch RCE and he flips town, because we couldn’t get enough votes on GB.

[Venus and Mars]

You implied I was an anomaly to your transgressions to people calling you out on your bullshit. I'm saying, no, that's not true. You've been acting aggressively to literally every one who dare scum read you. It's a fairly strong tell iirc but people want to write it off. It's not on me anymore.

The cashapp thing was obviously a joke because I've yet to town read you since post one.

And thank freaking God for that! I have told you ad nauseum that a metacheck on me would prove you wrong but I’ll wait until post-game, to throw that in your face.

[Venus and Mars]

Subject: Heroes Wanted! (Game Over)

Sando - VCA says lynch
Toogeloo BBmolla* - Lean town, need to verify if whiteknight
stungun0404 Brandi* NicoRobin* - Hostile, can't get in his head
MathBlade randomidget** - Sibling rivalry blocks read
Kokichi Oma - Lurker
Nancy Drew 39 - Town early now MIA, weaker read
hebichan - Still think this needs pressure to sort
zMuffinMan - Clear by VCA

Creature* Human Sequencer* - Needs to be lynched, scum

Katsuki - Policy
Sakura Hana - Cleared by VCA
Toranaga** - Townish, We did have the interactions I was looking for
Frozen Angel - Town, Needs power tomorrow
123456789 - Dead scum
Shiro - Town by medium
Gamma Emerald - Gun to my head town, no memorable posting but felt town objecting to me saying it
Ankamius brassherald - Dead town
Nosferatu Chickadee - Gun to my head town
Cerberus v666 - Sads
Myloninja13* - Dead
the worst - Opportunistic. Gun to my head scum.
Titus
Drixx* - He reveals himself later but I didn't like his reaction to not getting a power.

Scum!Titus’ last readslist in Heroes Wanted

Her, me, Math, Creature were the scum team. Notice her Creature read.

[Venus and Mars]

Subject: Heroes Wanted! (Game Over)

Sando - VCA says lynch
Toogeloo BBmolla* - Lean town, need to verify if whiteknight
stungun0404 Brandi* NicoRobin* - Hostile, can't get in his head
MathBlade randomidget** - Sibling rivalry blocks read
Kokichi Oma - Lurker
Nancy Drew 39 - Town early now MIA, weaker read
hebichan - Still think this needs pressure to sort
zMuffinMan - Clear by VCA

Creature* Human Sequencer* - Needs to be lynched, scum

Katsuki - Policy
Sakura Hana - Cleared by VCA
Toranaga** - Townish, We did have the interactions I was looking for
Frozen Angel - Town, Needs power tomorrow
123456789 - Dead scum
Shiro - Town by medium
Gamma Emerald - Gun to my head town, no memorable posting but felt town objecting to me saying it
Ankamius brassherald - Dead town
Nosferatu Chickadee - Gun to my head town
Cerberus v666 - Sads
Myloninja13* - Dead
the worst - Opportunistic. Gun to my head scum.
Titus
Drixx* - He reveals himself later but I didn't like his reaction to not getting a power.

Scum!Titus’ last readslist in Heroes Wanted

Her, me, Math, Creature were the scum team. Notice her Creature read.

Subject: Heroes Wanted! (Game Over)

VOTE: Titus

This game became a chore ages ago.

Her self-vote came 9 posts after that.

[Venus and Mars]

Therefore my conclusion is that she gave the Virus a disloyal modifier, making K/K and potentially Chkflip unable to target any scum with their items.

The virus isnt an item, the sticky fruits are.

Boon confirmed to me in PM just now that the virus is an item

what didnt someone just say tha tit didnt count for them in the item coutner ?

~Venus

Sush, just ignore nom and let's scumhunt.

Talk to me about George.

Why suddenly push GB? Titus isn’t stupid, she has to know that with a hard guilty by bleeding obvtown Nom, GB is obviously not getting lynched. She could have picked literally anyone, yet so chose him.

And has anyone confirmed that any neighbourhoods even exist in this game?

[Venus and Mars]

Nomnomnom

has died! They were a...

Spoiler:

Contestant

Welcome,

Nomnomnom

, you are a

Loud Boon Wars Intr

ou

duction

.

Boon Wars was a partner event, that consisted of 3 separate games. One partner would play in The Boondom Menace, One in Attack of the Colognes, and a secret hydra game Revenge of the Jingle.

Abilities

:
• At the beginning of every day, as long as you are alive, numbers will be announced globally.
• You may send in a +1 or -1 to effect these numbers in some fashion, yet you do not know what this means.
• You may target someone at night with an

Antique Gun from the Boon Wars

, and your target will receive “You got a Boonie looking bullet.” Once 2 players have received this, you will create a Boon Wars Museum neighborhood thread. This item can not be blocked by any means.
• Night 1, you have a Suicidal Secret Cop Shot. You may target someone to learn their alignment. If you bring this up at all before Night 1, you will immediately die.
• You are a

Basic Boon

. Whatever does this mean?

Win condition:

You win when all threats to the

Contestants

have been eliminated and there is at least one town player alive.

Game thread is here. Confirm by replying to this PM with your role name.

Picks: 1. BOON WARS banner, cut off for mobile
2. The word "INTROUDUCTION" because that's how you spelled it in the BooneyToonz discussion thread
3. The "Loud" modifier because that's just me

@Davez, where does it say anything about hoods in this?

[Venus and Mars]

Nomnomnom

has died! They were a...

Spoiler:

Contestant

Welcome,

Nomnomnom

, you are a

Loud Boon Wars Intr

ou

duction

.

Boon Wars was a partner event, that consisted of 3 separate games. One partner would play in The Boondom Menace, One in Attack of the Colognes, and a secret hydra game Revenge of the Jingle.

Abilities

:
• At the beginning of every day, as long as you are alive, numbers will be announced globally.
• You may send in a +1 or -1 to effect these numbers in some fashion, yet you do not know what this means.
• You may target someone at night with an

Antique Gun from the Boon Wars

, and your target will receive “You got a Boonie looking bullet.” Once 2 players have received this, you will create a Boon Wars Museum neighborhood thread. This item can not be blocked by any means.
• Night 1, you have a Suicidal Secret Cop Shot. You may target someone to learn their alignment. If you bring this up at all before Night 1, you will immediately die.
• You are a

Basic Boon

. Whatever does this mean?

Win condition:

You win when all threats to the

Contestants

have been eliminated and there is at least one town player alive.

Game thread is here. Confirm by replying to this PM with your role name.

Picks: 1. BOON WARS banner, cut off for mobile
2. The word "INTROUDUCTION" because that's how you spelled it in the BooneyToonz discussion thread
3. The "Loud" modifier because that's just me

@Davez, where does it say anything about hoods in this?

Oh nm, so his role is probably legit then but is it town?

[Venus and Mars]

Thoughts:

@Chk, never ever sign up for another game of mine. If you could read my mind now, I’d likely get temp banned for those thoughts.

@Krazy, in what world are you still sr Fonz?

MS and SF are very likely both town.

Nothing GB has posted, makes me want to move my vote.

@Davez, I said 3 other things that have nothing to do with Chk. Why didn’t you comment on those?

[Venus and Mars]

Once 2 players have received this, you will create a Boon Wars Museum neighborhood thread.

Does this confirm for you GB’s alignment? I already acknowledged that his role is probably what he claimed. Titus’ was as well.

[Venus and Mars]

Thoughts:

@Chk, never ever sign up for another game of mine. If you could read my mind now, I’d likely get temp banned for those thoughts.

@Krazy, in what world are you still sr Fonz?

MS and SF are very likely both town.

Nothing GB has posted, makes me want to move my vote.

@Davez, I said 3 other things that have nothing to do with Chk. Why didn’t you comment on those?

Because those weren't the things I wanted to comment on.

But by just quoting the first word, you made it sound like my post was entirely about Chk, when only 25% was.