Mini Theme 2328: Death Note: Second Page. Day 3!

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FIRST

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VOTE: HIGH PRINCESS SCUMRINYS

We've been opposite alignments for 4 games in a row, don't see a reason it would change now.

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Okay bye I'm going to play the marathon NewD3 now.

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Refer to setup to get full list of possible skills.

Where is this?

-Black

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Gimli I hope you are town so we can catch Kira again

-Black

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I don't see how is talking about flavor in the thread is supposed to help on finding Kira.

- A

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VOTE: CUDDLE TIME

I don't see how complaining about RVS banter is supposed to help on finding Kira

So instead you prefer to just talk about flavor? Just wanting to talk about flavor and not solving is scummy.

- A

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I think I have an idea on how Kira will be playing once when I get some reads later in the game.

- A

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VOTE: CUDDLE TIME

I don't see how complaining about RVS banter is supposed to help on finding Kira

So instead you prefer to just talk about flavor? Just wanting to talk about flavor and not solving is scummy.

- A

So what are the "correct" things to talk about during RVS?

Getting the game out of RVS and getting more content that is not fluff. I'm already bored of RVS.

- A

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What are your opinions on Death Note, Adorable? ;3

It's been a long, long time since I have watched the anime. I remember I liked the first season with L and after L died the second season was not good.

- A

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You're correct.

Therefore, T-Bone gets Town-locked so we can avoid this game becoming not good

Can you elaborate on the town lock.

- A

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I just checked the player list again and the flavor names and it says T-Bone is L.

- A

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How's the hydra townie? I think trying to throw shade over Rat's joke is pretty sus actually. It can be harder for scum to pick up on jokes, that really seemed tone deaf.

I fail to understand why you think I was trying to throw shade on Rat's joke just by asking them a question when I never even gave a read.

- A

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You guys will be stuck with me for a while at certain times since my other hydra buddies are sleeping and my time zone is different from theirs so you all will have to get used to talking with me.

- A

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How's the hydra townie? I think trying to throw shade over Rat's joke is pretty sus actually. It can be harder for scum to pick up on jokes, that really seemed tone deaf.

I fail to understand why you think I was trying to throw shade on Rat's joke just by asking them a question when I never even gave a read.

- A

VOTE: CUDDLE TIME

I don't see how complaining about RVS banter is supposed to help on finding Kira

So instead you prefer to just talk about flavor? Just wanting to talk about flavor and not solving is scummy.

- A

This isn't a read, huh? You literally called it scummy. And, one would assume, my flavor banter too.

VOTE: CUDDLE TIME

This is not a read. This was asking a question and afterwards saying why just talking about flavor for a long time is scummy. I clearly said on 43 I didn't have any reads.

- A

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Aureal's aggression kinda reads townie to me

-Black

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How's the hydra townie? I think trying to throw shade over Rat's joke is pretty sus actually. It can be harder for scum to pick up on jokes, that really seemed tone deaf.

I fail to understand why you think I was trying to throw shade on Rat's joke just by asking them a question when I never even gave a read.

- A

VOTE: CUDDLE TIME

I don't see how complaining about RVS banter is supposed to help on finding Kira

So instead you prefer to just talk about flavor? Just wanting to talk about flavor and not solving is scummy.

- A

This isn't a read, huh? You literally called it scummy. And, one would assume, my flavor banter too.

VOTE: CUDDLE TIME

This is not a read. This was asking a question and afterwards saying why just talking about flavor for a long time is scummy. I clearly said on 43 I didn't have any reads.

- A

*head explodes*

How can you say that a behavior about which you are complaining is scummy, and then promptly claim to have no reads?!?

You're introducing a new thought here about it going on for "a long time" to walk back the thought. Do you not actually think the flavor talk was going on for a long time?

Are you for real? That post of mine was talking to RR about in general any player who just talks about flavor is a scummy playstyle. As in whenever I see a player who will just flavor talk for a long time I start to end up suspecting scums will be hiding in the flavor talk once when more hours pass by. I never thought that the flavor talk was going for a long time and I was already bored with just the short early flavor talk.

- A

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Good morning sweethearts

I've read the game so far and I have like one alignment-related thought which Back disagrees on, so for now I'm gonna pretend I don't have it until it develops.

That being said, time to do some fluffpostong (yes, I'm aware of the problem).

First, let's set the mood:

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^ yo can you sign your posts

-Black

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I know it's Dragon but other people might not

-Black

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Hi Black I was planning to make another post and sign it but I guess that's confusing

- Dragon

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Also I'm drunk. Nothing to see here move along

-Black

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I was going to vote HPE but realized one of my other heads already did

-Black

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VOTE: T-Bone

Say it with me now...

I

AM

JUSTICE!!!!

Something Kira would say...LIGHT YAGAMI

Something a great detective who will risk his life to pursue and execute his nemesis would say... L

Oh my god is that Light Yagami??? I'm the second Kira and I'm such a big fan UwU

Wait what do you mean I shouldn't have said that and people are watching?


How good is my Misa Amane impression?

- Dragon

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Aureal trying to figure Adorable out for the first time is pretty funny to watch

-Black

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Hey Lighto Senpai, look at the muaic video I posted for you UwU

- Misa Amane

Pedit: it is lol

- Dragon

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*head explodes*

How can you say that a behavior about which you are complaining is scummy, and then promptly claim to have no reads?!?

You're introducing a new thought here about it going on for "a long time" to walk back the thought. Do you not actually think the flavor talk was going on for a long time?

Are you for real? That post of mine was talking to RR about in general any player who just talks about flavor is a scummy playstyle. As in whenever I see a player who will just flavor talk for a long time I start to end up suspecting scums will be hiding in the flavor talk once when more hours pass by. I never thought that the flavor talk was going for a long time and I was already bored with just the short early flavor talk.

- A

If you didn't think it was going on too long, then why even bring it up? You're trying to have it like a bunch of different ways at once.

Can you be more specific on bringing what up?

- A

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VOTE: T-Bone

Say it with me now...

I

AM

JUSTICE!!!!

Something Kira would say...LIGHT YAGAMI

Something a great detective who will risk his life to pursue and execute his nemesis would say... L

Oh my god is that Light Yagami??? I'm the second Kira and I'm such a big fan UwU

Wait what do you mean I shouldn't have said that and people are watching?


How good is my Misa Amane impression?

- Dragon

Yes, do it Misa! Tell L you want a Baja Blast, and secure my position as god of the new world! Do it! Now!

Wait, can you even get a big mac at Taco Bell?

- Misa

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Also I am officially pocketed by Light

- Misa

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Gimli townreading my slot makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside, like I've just gotten really good pizza and am about to eat it again.

- Dragon

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Also

VOTE: Klick

Serious vote

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I take it to mean you think we're town?

- Dragon

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I mean sure

but what do you think of my vote on you alignment wise?

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It feels like it has no practical bearing on your alignment whatsoever
You could do it as either alignment

Oh my gosh Klick, is it so difficult for you to indulge my attempts at having some fun before things get serious?

VOTE: HPE

Klick is town btw and has been obvtown since his second post.

Not liking AD's shade on him particularly, but I still think HPE is scummier.

- Dragon

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Too many people in the hydra. Want them removed

VOTE: cuddletime

Well, this one generally tries to mix up its approach at least a little every game, but also after tunneling hard on you last time and being wrong its time to see if doing the opposite will make me right.

sure it makes perfect sense

VOTE: HPE

VOTE: HPE

I get a visceral reaction from both Cuddle's name and avatar that makes me want to execute them but they look town to me currently

Why does our slot look town?

I don't see how is talking about flavor in the thread is supposed to help on finding Kira.

- A

That's Adorable

Also on the subject of the hydra

Fuck you all for not at least acknowledging this joke.....was worthy of a sigh at the very least

*sigh*

How's the hydra townie? I think trying to throw shade over Rat's joke is pretty sus actually. It can be harder for scum to pick up on jokes, that really seemed tone deaf.

I don't think it's that sus. I do agree that a large focus on flavor spec/setup spec is easy for scum to do to look like they're town and contributing. Granted it's quite early to be able to tell if Rat is scum doing this, but I do think it was definitely worth pointing out.

VOTE: Cuddle Time
down to clown on this

Do you think our slot is scummy? Why/Why not?

This one doesn't want to like, be a dick about it by driving the point home but it just thinks trying to understand Adorable here is a futile effort and we're gonna wanna wait for the other heads to rear themselves.

Why did you vote our slot before waiting for the other heads to post then, if you claim you needed us to before you are able to properly sort us?

Please put Cuddle Time to L-1 and I will insta-hammer no questions asked.

1) Mean. 2) Why?

- Thomith

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This one doesn't want to like, be a dick about it by driving the point home but it just thinks trying to understand Adorable here is a futile effort and we're gonna wanna wait for the other heads to rear themselves.

And yet you're... voting with me?

This one is a big fan of blowing people up based on game-irrelevant vibes.

Please put Cuddle Time to L-1 and I will insta-hammer no questions asked.

Please put Cuddle Time to L-1 and I will insta-hammer no questions asked.

Agreed. Too much for me

Can we stop advocating for a policy lim? Thanks

-Black

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One of those three may be scum. Feels like a potentially opportunistic stance to take

-Black

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But your slot has made 37 posts and the rest of us have barely got double digits. Couple that with the hydra dissonance you're already showing at best you're a net negative for the town right now. But since your slot has given the most content my honest opinion is that it is pretty anti-town with the hydra dissonance alone.

That's a weird sentiment because what hydra dissonance have we shown???

Unless I'm missing something all of us have been scumreading HPE and that's mostly it?

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But your slot has made 37 posts and the rest of us have barely got double digits. Couple that with the hydra dissonance you're already showing at best you're a net negative for the town right now. But since your slot has given the most content my honest opinion is that it is pretty anti-town with the hydra dissonance alone.

That's a weird sentiment because what hydra dissonance have we shown???

Unless I'm missing something all of us have been scumreading HPE and that's mostly it?

- Dragon

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Like I literally held back from expressing a read that the other heads didn't agree on to prevent dissonance.

- Dragon.

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One of those three may be scum. Feels like a potentially opportunistic stance to take

-Black

This is pretty lazy if your slot is town.

It's not lazy at all. You just don't like the read because it implicates you

-Black

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But your slot has made 37 posts and the rest of us have barely got double digits. Couple that with the hydra dissonance you're already showing at best you're a net negative for the town right now. But since your slot has given the most content my honest opinion is that it is pretty anti-town with the hydra dissonance alone.

We are 4 people. Of course we're going to have more posts than anyone. I can't believe you're actually trying to use that as evidence that we're scum

We are strong players. Even if we disagree on some things there's no shot we're a net negative for the town and I don't think you actually believe this

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I meant to sign that as Black but I instinctively did a laughing emoji instead

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Your slot can quickly make the game unfun if not reigned in

You're not trying to reign us in. You're trying to fade us

-Black

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Black I don't think he is trying to fade us though?

- Dragon

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How about you and Dragon get on the same page for a moment instead of demonstrating the exact thing I just complained is anti-town of your slot to be doing?

Yeah I agree, Black come to the PT please

- Dragon

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Black I don't think he is trying to fade us though?

- Dragon

Please put Cuddle Time to L-1 and I will insta-hammer no questions asked.

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Dragon is trying to take my concerns seriously but Black is dismissing them. That's dissonance my dudes.

How about you and Dragon get on the same page for a moment instead of demonstrating the exact thing I just complained is anti-town of your slot to be doing?

We don't need to be on the same page to post our individual thoughts here. If you don't like it then tough luck I guess

-Black

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But your slot has made 37 posts and the rest of us have barely got double digits. Couple that with the hydra dissonance you're already showing at best you're a net negative for the town right now. But since your slot has given the most content my honest opinion is that it is pretty anti-town with the hydra dissonance alone.

That's a weird sentiment because what hydra dissonance have we shown???

Unless I'm missing something all of us have been scumreading HPE and that's mostly it?

Have to agree here though that the hydra dissonance argument just Doesn't Make Sense right. This one IS kneejerking at Adorable shenanigans but what the hell is everyone else on this slot doing?

We're trying to solve. What are you doing?

-Black

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to also having a Klick read but backing off because one of your heads does not agree

Okay so I should probably clarify what happened because I can see why it looked like hydra dissonance:

Last game I had with Klick, I voted him as a reaction test when I had no read on him, and it helped me form a read on him. This game I tried to do this as well but instead of backing off after one post, I tried to pretend like I did have a scumread on Klick (Which didn't work, he saw through me). Then since it didn't work, I gave up and said that I actually TR him, which was true. This is more along the lines of cognitive dissonance than hydra dissonance, except it was intentional to maybe get a better grasp on his alignment.

- Dragon

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I think it does, I cited when it happened earlier and it's literally happening in real time now, HPE. I can quote the situations better when I'm not mobile posting or you can go back to page 3 or whenever it started and take a look for yourself on the merits of my claim. Or you know, the fact that it's happening now in real time. Dragon even scolded Black in this thread!

There's nothing wrong with us not being on the same page. I'm not going to consult the hydra PT every time I want to share an opinion on someone. That's ridiculous to expect. You're just going to have to deal with it

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-Black

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Anyway I should probably make a case for HPE now since all of us scumread it:

Not sure why Black scumreads it.

Thomith says HPE's play reminds him of scum!HPE from Mini Normal 2322.

I think HPE is scum for several reasons: its approach to Adorable, specifically soft defending it but not really townreading it, feels scum motivated and similar to how I've seen it interact with town (as scum) in Mini Normal 2322. Then there was also the point of HPE pointing out that it did something in a past game as a "defense", except they did it in a scum game:

Spoiler: quotes

This one doesn't want to like, be a dick about it by driving the point home but it just thinks trying to understand Adorable here is a futile effort and we're gonna wanna wait for the other heads to rear themselves.

And yet you're... voting with me?

This one is a big fan of blowing people up based on game-irrelevant vibes.

Just ask cw357!

cs357 was a townie that scum!HPE pushed, so this "defense" of saying it's just something it likes to do and comparing the two situations feels like a scumclaim more than anything else.


Other than HPE, I think Black strongly TRs Aureal for her aggression and vibes, I'm townleaning that but also have a similar viewpoint to AD's 118. Thomith and I both agree that if Aureal is scum, she might be partnered with RR (for me it's mainly RR's vote on Aureal felt like it could be signaling? idk).

Both Black and I dislike Hu Tao's push on our slot, and I also feel like Hu Tao has used the "being overwhelmed with hydra" as an excuse not to engage with the game.

Hopefully this gives you more meat to work with regarding what our reads are, in a way that's less dissonant.

- Dragon

P.S. I don't scumread T-Bone. Haven't fully made up my mind if I'm townleaning him or just null. And as I said earlier I TR Klick.

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I'm going to stop posting for tonight. Good luck!

- Dragon

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For what it's worth if I was just reading dragon I'd probably have a small town lean because he engaged with my criticism instead of deflecting. I'm deciding, and I'm probably not going to decide right now, whether that's because the slot is actually town or dragon realizes how obviously scummy black is and is quickly covering up for it. I suppose that could be true regardless of their alignment. What I read as dragon's genuine attempt to engage with the game quickly turned into an uphill battle for dragon to counter everything black was posting. I'm always going to read dissonance as scummy because it's not something that serves any purpose for the town but easy to kick up the game with if you're scum. I believe scum will always do the easy things when it serves them. I think when you're a hydra you have to be held to a higher standard than an individual player because presumably you can plan out your posts in general, discuss your reads, and be helpful if you're town. It's a higher burden sure, but when the other side of that coin is easy nonsense you can do as scum I think it's a fair burden to ask a hydra slot to meet.

You can treat us like 4 different players if it helps you overcome your adversion to dissonance

Also what posts give you the impression that I'm scummy? Surely not the one where I say the policy lim crowd could have scum in it

-Black

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For what it's worth if I was just reading dragon I'd probably have a small town lean because he engaged with my criticism instead of deflecting. I'm deciding, and I'm probably not going to decide right now, whether that's because the slot is actually town or dragon realizes how obviously scummy black is and is quickly covering up for it. I suppose that could be true regardless of their alignment. What I read as dragon's genuine attempt to engage with the game quickly turned into an uphill battle for dragon to counter everything black was posting. I'm always going to read dissonance as scummy because it's not something that serves any purpose for the town but easy to kick up the game with if you're scum. I believe scum will always do the easy things when it serves them. I think when you're a hydra you have to be held to a higher standard than an individual player because presumably you can plan out your posts in general, discuss your reads, and be helpful if you're town. It's a higher burden sure, but when the other side of that coin is easy nonsense you can do as scum I think it's a fair burden to ask a hydra slot to meet.

You can treat us like 4 different players if it helps you overcome your adversion to dissonance

Also what posts give you the impression that I'm scummy? Surely not the one where I say the policy lim crowd could have scum in it

-Black

I mean, that's pretty scummy by itself. AD did the math but grouping together any three players and saying 'one is scum' is about the most laziest thing you could do to pretend to give a take on the game. I know your protest to this is "but it's not any three players, it's three players pushing a policy lim". But then you also chose to deflect some real criticisms I had of your hydra displaying dissonance while literally disagreeing with Dragon in this thread about how you should respond to those criticisms and making a performance out of it honestly.

Can you stop calling my read lazy? You're the one advocating for a policy lim because it's too hard for you to read 4 people. That's about as lazy as it gets

I genuinely think scum could posture to get on our wagon and it would be very beneficial for them. Disguising their motive as a policy lim because "oh woe is me the hydra is overwhelming" makes sense to me. When we flip town scum can just blend into the 3-4 people wanting to policy lim us. You can call this read "lazy" but it's a real thought I had about the game

-Black

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I appreciate these posts being made right after.

Not you appreciating someone calling my read lazy. You are the Queen of Lazy Reads

I'm sorry my page 6 thought wasn't baked enough for you

-Black

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VOTE: Hu Tao

I'm down to see where this goes. We still support the HPE wagon obv

-Black

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When we flip town

Um

Like, after the game is over?

*confusion*

Ngl I forgot about that mechanic

My memory is so bad

-Black

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*snip*

I've come to the same conclusion. I got what I needed to be able to read both black and dragon. I'm pretty familiar with them and I feel confident in reading them. They both replied in a way that I feel town them would. Do you have familiarity with T-Bone? Is he known as a very strong scum player?

Then why are you still voting us?

Also, do you have any thoughts on anything else in the game except this slot and T-Bone? For exampe do you have a read on HPE? And on Aureal?

Can you send me a scum game of yours please. I tried looking through your threads but you have too many

He was scum in this one:
viewtopic.php?t=90333

You are welcome.

- Dragon

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*snip*

I've come to the same conclusion. I got what I needed to be able to read both black and dragon. I'm pretty familiar with them and I feel confident in reading them. They both replied in a way that I feel town them would. Do you have familiarity with T-Bone? Is he known as a very strong scum player?

Then why are you still voting us?

Also, do you have any thoughts on anything else in the game except this slot and T-Bone? For exampe do you have a read on HPE? And on Aureal?

Can you send me a scum game of yours please. I tried looking through your threads but you have too many

He was scum in this one:
viewtopic.php?t=90333

You are welcome.

- Dragon

Thank you

Could you answer our questions when you get the chance please?

- Thomith

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I've started to write a really long post about reads and solving and so on but I'm really tired and sleepy and gonna go sleep now so I'll post it tomorrow. Yes, I know it's not even 10 PM yet. Goodnight anyway.

- Dragon

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My big question about this is why does it matter if they are follower or Kira? Even if they are follower and not Kira, voting them off is still good (just want to say this is from your point of view not mine, I don't have a read on hpe currently but I'll check after this)

Because HPE might let it slip that ActionDan is Kira

We get no alignment on flip based on the rules. So I think it would just be better to vote the scummy person than voting someone else because the person we think is scummy might have scum slipped them. (If that's not your point then sorry I misunderstood)

Well, this one generally tries to mix up its approach at least a little every game, but also after tunneling hard on you last time and being wrong its time to see if doing the opposite will make me right.

sure it makes perfect sense

VOTE: HPE

ready to die for the cause sir
VOTE: HPE

Those who scumread hpe, why is this not a soft for gimli as Kira?

I'm a little confused with these two posts, because it seems that you were originally stating that it isn't beneficial to look for potential partners, but then later on start trying to start discourse on people that may be partnered? Let me know if I'm misinterpreting this, but it stood out and seemed weird to me.

When we flip town

Um

Like, after the game is over?

*confusion*

Ngl I forgot about that mechanic

My memory is so bad

-Black

I think I am locking Aureal as town

Black I am looking at you with squinty eyes

Lick can hang out in town lead for a bit

I want to scum read Dan, but now that this is just the way he is, so I dunno

Hu I can never figure out D1

Bone I think is town

UNVOTE:

Could you expand on some of these reads? Specifically your TR on T-Bone and Aureal?
Dan, I think based on Mafia Reunion, should spew himself if he is town at some point. Do you think he's playing differently here? Why the slight scumread?

aureal and black/cuddle are towny, black's townread on aureal matches my impressions.

HPE is always hard to grasp but this game it seems to be a bit on edge like nervous?

klick entered the game with a comment I dislike and I tried several times to write out the reasoning but meh maybe later

Could you please elaborate on that reasoning? I don't understand why you dislike Klick's comment, I think he's correctly predicting that there's going to be hydra dissonance with that set of players (yes, I know that's what the next few pages are gonna be about). And that, as he said, he's talking about Drew's post being a non sequitur because there hadn't been hydra dissonance

yet

.

nobody needs to predict a 4 person hydra is gonna have dissonance, so entering the game with that felt awkward like he had to chime into whatever the current conversation was even though it was a pointless one

also about klick, I'm bothered by the fast townreads in a setup that greatly enhances the likelihood players will appear towny, especially kira

I changed my mind I think klick is town

klick, aureal, cuddle is my townpile

If I missed it I apologise, but I don't think you ever expanded on this heel turn? Is attempting to solve by finding townreads over scumreads inherently scummy?

*snip*

I've come to the same conclusion. I got what I needed to be able to read both black and dragon. I'm pretty familiar with them and I feel confident in reading them. They both replied in a way that I feel town them would. Do you have familiarity with T-Bone? Is he known as a very strong scum player?

Then why are you still voting us?

Also, do you have any thoughts on anything else in the game except this slot and T-Bone? For exampe do you have a read on HPE? And on Aureal?

Can you send me a scum game of yours please. I tried looking through your threads but you have too many

He was scum in this one:
viewtopic.php?t=90333

You are welcome.

- Dragon

Thank you

Could you answer our questions when you get the chance please?

- Thomith

This game is different so I don't plan to be too quick with reads. I think scum need to play differently since it is a different dynamic. They all don't know each other and there is a chance a follower is pushing on another follower. I'm only going to post reads I'm confident in. I'm not sure why the vote bothers you. I'm just not sure who to change it to at the moment. And you're not in danger of being eliminated.

I understand your point, but you stated you had enough information from Black and Dragon that you were confident they were townposting. If you Townread our slot because of that, continuing to vote us seems anti-town to me?

- Thomith

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VOTE: Aureal

She is giving me off vibes for some reason

Are you able to expand a bit? Any specific posts that seem off?

- Thomith

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@cuddles : I can't shake that your post 7 and 8 doesn't come from scum. Rest of your hydra's posting is fine.

VOTE: HIGH PRINCESS SCUMRINYS

We've been opposite alignments for 4 games in a row, don't see a reason it would change now.

Okay bye I'm going to play the marathon NewD3 now.

????

The first one totally sounds like something I would say, and I'm always town so maaaaaybe I could kinda see it being towny (but really that's probably just a personal quirk of mine). But I definitely disagree on the second, it feels somewhat pre-emptively defensive to need to announce that you're leaving to do something else.

It's possible Dan meant the ISO numbers?? Which for Cuddle would be 43 and 46 which like. Kinda, but not really, other than being cranky about RVS.

Your posts have been all over the place. Here's a summary on your treatment on our slot that concerned me.

1. You voted us because it is futile effort on trying to understand me.

2. Thomith asked you why did you vote us before waiting for the other heads to post.

3. You said the hydra are a policy elim and you said we are destined to be a confusing clusterfuck.

4. You recently quoted a post of Action when he said our posts I'm assuming from page 1 - page 3 have been fine to him and you picked up 2 of my posts and me being cranky about rvs saying that you could see it coming from town but you voted us anyways.

Since you said you could kind of see my posting being town, then what was even the point of voting us in the first place? Was it because of clusterfuck from all of the heads?

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

@cuddles : I can't shake that your post 7 and 8 doesn't come from scum. Rest of your hydra's posting is fine.

VOTE: HIGH PRINCESS SCUMRINYS

We've been opposite alignments for 4 games in a row, don't see a reason it would change now.

Okay bye I'm going to play the marathon NewD3 now.

????

The first one totally sounds like something I would say, and I'm always town so maaaaaybe I could kinda see it being towny (but really that's probably just a personal quirk of mine). But I definitely disagree on the second, it feels somewhat pre-emptively defensive to need to announce that you're leaving to do something else.

It's possible Dan meant the ISO numbers?? Which for Cuddle would be 43 and 46 which like. Kinda, but not really, other than being cranky about RVS.

Your posts have been all over the place. Here's a summary on your treatment on our slot that concerned me.

1. You voted us because it is futile effort on trying to understand me.

2. Thomith asked you why did you vote us before waiting for the other heads to post.

3. You said the hydra are a policy elim and you said we are destined to be a confusing clusterfuck.

4. You recently quoted a post of Action when he said our posts I'm assuming from page 1 - page 3 have been fine to him and you picked up 2 of my posts and me being cranky about rvs saying that you could see it coming from town but you voted us anyways.

Since you said you could kind of see my posting being town, then what was even the point of voting us in the first place? Was it because of clusterfuck from all of the heads?

- A

This is NOT Adorable talking to me, one way or another.
But moreover, yeah its mostly just a vote on prediction of your presence being a netneg due to dissonance and the associated chaos of 4 heads and yadda yadda yadda no better options yadda yadda yadda, you get it. NO clue what you're talking about with point 4, is the thing. Now that you've made me take a second look, "I can't shake that your post 7 and 8 doesn't come from scum. Rest of your hydra's posting is fine." isn't so clear about what its trying to say, if those posts are scummy or not, but regardless of that me pointing out your ISO 7/8 as opposed to actual 7/8 does not have anything to do with "but you voted us anyways." considering how late to the game my thoughts on the post from AD are compared to voting AND unvoting you. So it's really confusing me.

The post of yours you quoted Action, why did you bring up my post 43, 46, and the post where I got cranky with rvs? The way how I interpreted that post you quoted from Action it looked like you said you could see it coming from town.

On this quote of yours just now where you talk about point 4, instead you talk about being confused.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

I don't think either Kira follower softed in the first iteration of this game. It's extremely risky to try and pull off with so many townies looking for it. If they get caught it's literally game over

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

I don't think we ever should waste an elimination on someone we're confident is a follower, not Kira.

This is mega sus

If we are convinced someone is a follower then we take them out. One less person to use the Real Name ability thing

Kira Followers
Knows which player is Kira, but not each other. At Night can use ability and learn Real Name of living target. If learned Real Name is different from Visible Name of target, it means they are fellow Kira Follower or Detective.

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

Oh right, that's a thing. I guess I didn't pay that much attention because it doesn't even really seem like a very useful thing?

Yeah, maybe I'm overestimating it but I feel like the followers being able to catch the Detective or narrow down the list of possible Detectives is pretty strong. After thinking about it a little more though I think Kira and Co. don't even really have to worry about the killing the Detective if they are positioned to survive 5 days. I can see how fading a follower could seem like a waste when we only have 5 fades total

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

Hey Klick, I've only skimmed so maybe I'm wrong, and it's also possible that my sense of time is all fucked up for real life reasons, but I'm pretty sure it's been more than 36 hours since you accused HPE of being AD's partner and so far neither one has responded to this in any substantial manner and I don't really understand what's the point of holding back your reasoning about this anymore. So could you please make your case for AD being HPE's Kira?

- Dragon

P.S. I am very busy IRL as you can tell by me being in only one game and not 3 and also moddong only one game and not 3 and also only posting in the afternoon rather than immediately when I wake up, so I'm sorry about my meh engagement these last two days and hopefully this evening I can post something substantial.

[CUDDLE TIME]

@cuddles : I can't shake that your post 7 and 8 doesn't come from scum. Rest of your hydra's posting is fine.

VOTE: HIGH PRINCESS SCUMRINYS

We've been opposite alignments for 4 games in a row, don't see a reason it would change now.

Okay bye I'm going to play the marathon NewD3 now.

????

The first one totally sounds like something I would say, and I'm always town so maaaaaybe I could kinda see it being towny (but really that's probably just a personal quirk of mine). But I definitely disagree on the second, it feels somewhat pre-emptively defensive to need to announce that you're leaving to do something else.

It's possible Dan meant the ISO numbers?? Which for Cuddle would be 43 and 46 which like. Kinda, but not really, other than being cranky about RVS.

Your posts have been all over the place. Here's a summary on your treatment on our slot that concerned me.

1. You voted us because it is futile effort on trying to understand me.

2. Thomith asked you why did you vote us before waiting for the other heads to post.

3. You said the hydra are a policy elim and you said we are destined to be a confusing clusterfuck.

4. You recently quoted a post of Action when he said our posts I'm assuming from page 1 - page 3 have been fine to him and you picked up 2 of my posts and me being cranky about rvs saying that you could see it coming from town but you voted us anyways.

Since you said you could kind of see my posting being town, then what was even the point of voting us in the first place? Was it because of clusterfuck from all of the heads?

- A

This is NOT Adorable talking to me, one way or another.
But moreover, yeah its mostly just a vote on prediction of your presence being a netneg due to dissonance and the associated chaos of 4 heads and yadda yadda yadda no better options yadda yadda yadda, you get it. NO clue what you're talking about with point 4, is the thing. Now that you've made me take a second look, "I can't shake that your post 7 and 8 doesn't come from scum. Rest of your hydra's posting is fine." isn't so clear about what its trying to say, if those posts are scummy or not, but regardless of that me pointing out your ISO 7/8 as opposed to actual 7/8 does not have anything to do with "but you voted us anyways." considering how late to the game my thoughts on the post from AD are compared to voting AND unvoting you. So it's really confusing me.

The post of yours you quoted Action, why did you bring up my post 43, 46, and the post where I got cranky with rvs? The way how I interpreted that post you quoted from Action it looked like you said you could see it coming from town.

On this quote of yours just now where you talk about point 4, instead you talk about being confused.

- A

okay THIS is the weird confusing adorable this one is used to

This one quoted Aureal who quoted Dan who said something about your posts, 7 and 8, and offered the alternative interpretation of "iso number 7 and 8???" because the actual literal posts 7 and 8 make even less sense to point out especially when AD isn't clear if he thinks they're from scum or town. All of this is completely and utterly unrelated to my vote on you, and saying "idk why he thinks any of these posts are scummy" doesn't retroactively make it related. If that's even what you're trying to

say here.

I misunderstood you about point 4 earlier and now I get what you're saying.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

I want to remove hu tao from d1 pool and work with (AD, RR, HPE, tbone)

as for HPE: is there any slot defending it? does it have potential followers?

Why hu tao?

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

VOTE: Gimli
HURT: RR

Will elaborate on this later but I wanna see if anyone else is seeing what I'm seeing first

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Quick question to RR (I will be able to post more in a bit I think):

Was your post 321 implying you thought I was a follower of Klick's? How does this scumread add up if you and I both have Gimli in our Kira shortlist?

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Nvm I take that question back because obviously Klick is your bigger Kira read.

But A. Am I correct in my interpretation of that post? And B. Would you be TRing 320 if Klick was recealed right now to be not-Kira?

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Yeah I figured that out, I'm a genius.

I'm just grabbing some food and then I'll explain my process and why it wasn't me overreacting.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Okay, as promised, here's my process:

I've been townreading Klick for a while now (perhaps for bad reasons, but with his posting I feel I'm more likely to be right for the wrong reasons than just wrong). I've also concluded that T-Bone is town and that Drew is not Kira regardless of his alignment. I've thought Hu Tao was scummy but her play makes sense more as scummy town than as Kira IMO (but not letting her off the hook completely). So that leaves a pool of Aureal/Gimli/RR/AD/HPE. This pool doesn't necessarily contain all scum but I do think it contains Kira.

I've been wanting to townread almost every single post that Gimli made this game, because they are (at least on surface level) towny posts, because they look pretty solvy. However I don't really think any of them are posts that couldn't be faked by scum, especially uninformed scum (I.E. Kira). Additionally, Thomith pointed out in the hydra PT and I agree with this, some posts feel like solving for the sake of solving without thought process behind them / fake solving, for example:
in 107/108/109, Gimli is scumreading Klick for posting something irrelevant to what was said (?)
In 246, Gimli is liking "Klick's evaluation of HPE", except at that point Klick has written 0 evaluation of HPE (???) (like I guess he could've meant "I think HPE is follower, not Kira" which is also what I was thinking, and this possibility is also why I didn't really vote Gimli back then or say anything)
And in general I think he puts a lot more effort this game into looking like he has reads than in actually forming reads? Because I just don't see the thought process in his posts all that much (I do see SOME process, I just feel it's lacking)

Well anyway, this explains why Gimli was on my Kira shortlist more than why I voted him. The reason I voted him was this:

I want to remove hu tao from d1 pool and work with (AD, RR, HPE, tbone)

as for HPE: is there any slot defending it? does it have potential followers?

Why hu tao?

- A

I enjoyed the flow of hu tao's latter posting with aureal and agree with the town lean on drew, I can see where both stances are coming from

granted it's thin

scumpool of (RR, AD, hu tao, HPE, tbone) seems fine for d1

@klick: can you elaborate on AD = kira read?

every other slot in my pool seems to be more inviting as a potential kira flip than HPE, from how I expect kira to play

What's made you rule out Klick?

I'm never flipping klick on d1 regardless (no this isn't signaling (neither is this (ad infinitum)))

I feel like his stances are closely aligned with how I feel about players which is good, and his read on HPE has investigative depth that could be harder to think of when scum

You sure you haven't confused Klick with someone else? Because I'm not seeing any of this "investigative depth"

In fact, Klick is on my short list of potential Kiras. I've just been waiting for the right moment to switch my vote, and it seems I've found it.

VOTE: Klick

To me, Gimli's explanation of his reads in posts 309/313/318 felt somewhat off, and I thought that it would make sense for Rat, given their incredulity at Gimli's read of Klick, to go after Gimli actually (because GImli having a weird and from Rat's POV unjustified/completely wrong read should be questioned with more than "are you sure you didn't confuse Klick with someone else?"), instead of using said incredulity as a pivot for suddenly voting Klick. It just struck me as a contrived/unnatural progression and made me think GImli could be Kira with Rat as a follower.

Reading Aureal's post: yes, jarring is exactly the word to describe that pivot.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

In Gimli's case, it's that his assessment of your actions was inconsistent with your own. Like it was a prepared thing he had to say, that didn't actually line up with what was happening.

For Dragon, it's the hypersensitivity. As soon as I voted you, suddenly I must be scum and my prodding at Gimli to determine his relationship with you is actually because he's my buddy. Didn't even try to ask questions and see if there's anything behind my push, just straight to the chainsaw. This is something that scum will frequently do by mistake with their partners in regular games, and is exacerbated here by the importance of keeping Kira specifically alive. It is also something I see scum get away with as "too scummy to be scum," which is never a concept I've been fond of.

When I initially voted you, it was a suspicion. When Dragon jumped on me for it, it was a confirmation.

I don't believe you actually think I'd chainsaw Kira so obviously here and without any reasoning even. I didn't jump on you for the vote on Klick, I "jumped on you" for the lack of vote on Gimli. And actually I jumped on Gimli, I'm not even scumreading you directly. So your presentation is false.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

On me specifically, I feel like ActionDan wants to express skepticism of me without actually committing to something resembling a vote or a scumread:

That's actually something that's pinged me back then, and I'd be willing to consider AD as Kira, but I first want to look at the possibility of Gimli!Kira.

[CUDDLE TIME]

On me specifically, I feel like ActionDan wants to express skepticism of me without actually committing to something resembling a vote or a scumread:

That's actually something that's pinged me back then, and I'd be willing to consider AD as Kira, but I first want to look at the possibility of Gimli!Kira.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Reading Aureal's post: yes, jarring is exactly the word to describe that pivot.

- Dragon

And so was yours, lol

I'll consider your case later, my brain is breaking down at this point since I've been sitting here trying to figure out what people are thinking for way too long, it's giving me a headache and I need lunch and my initial feelings are that we're all just town getting jumpy because things feel too easy.

Understandable, have a good lunch.

Who are the obvious scum in the scenario where the game is "too easy"? I don't really see any "obvious" scum other than HPE who I don't think is Kira.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Well you factually aren't observing me chainsawing because I'm not scum, so belief definitely does factor into it. I don't really get how yoy can claim belief is irrelevant.

What I am asking you is not whether you believe I attacked you/Gimli after you attacked Klick (which is an observable fact), but rather, whether that's something I'd do as Klick's follower (which is not a fact but only your belief).

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

I have definitely complained like that as town when people scumread me for what feels like would be bad play as scum. It's especially obnoxious to me of course, not having even had any proper scumgames that I could even try to point them towards to supplement my argument that really, I wouldn't just be lazy and meme most of day one if I had finally gotten a red PM.

I don't understand why it was called out in the first place, I think there is too much confidence floating around here so far this game

Dragon talked about the scum read on HPE on this post 164. It was HPE approach towards me is what pinged him and Thomith said HPE's play here was reminding him of a completed scum game HPE was in.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

VOTE: Klick

Still haven't liked their interaction with Rat, and Rat does seem pretty towny, so allow me to, ahem......follow them

Which part of the interaction of Klick and RR did you not like? I wasn't able to get a read out of that and I'm null on them. Dragon said he is town reading Klick because of meta.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

have a pretty busy day so I can't be around rn

I read the game before going to bed which served to strenghten my klick and cuddle townreads, especially the latter's scumcase on me is very towny. I did like RR's push on klick on a townposting level, as it came across as genuine.

HPE seems detached from the game and I'm ready to flip it (sorry for always flipping you though, HPE)

Gimliiiiiii

Stop pocketing meeeeee

It's not faaaaaaair!

Must resist pocket!
Can't resist pocket...
UNVOTE:
But what if he's Kira?
VOTE: Gimli
But what if he's not Kira and I am going to mislim him again and feel really bad?
UNVOTE:
But you know you can vote Gimli without limming him, right?
Ugh, fine
VOTE: Gimli
Alright, I will keep this vote until either Gimli posts more towny things or I find a better person to wagon. Or one of my other heads finds a better person to wagon.

Yes, I am aware that this is performative. That's kinda my thing. Doesn't mean it's not a true (albeit somewhat exaggerated) representation of my thoughts.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Reading Aureal's post: yes, jarring is exactly the word to describe that pivot.

- Dragon

And so was yours, lol

I'll consider your case later, my brain is breaking down at this point since I've been sitting here trying to figure out what people are thinking for way too long, it's giving me a headache and I need lunch and my initial feelings are that we're all just town getting jumpy because things feel too easy.

Understandable, have a good lunch.

Who are the obvious scum in the scenario where the game is "too easy"? I don't really see any "obvious" scum other than HPE who I don't think is Kira.

- Dragon

I did not have a good lunch: word of advice, don't make nachos using stale chips. My stomach is not alright.

Hu Tao and Dan as well are my 'game is easy' PoE. HPE seems more likely to be a follower than Kira yeah, but I'm not ruling it out as a "hide in plain sight" attempt.

Do you think Rat is lying here when they act like flipping Gimli after Klick is fine with them?

Well, I actually think Rat kinda HAS to lie here about that if Gimli is indeed Kira, so as not to look obvious as a follower. I will note though that I'm having some doubts on Rat's being scum because they did feel somewhat convinced of the push on Klick (though I'm aware tht there are players out there who are quite good as scum and can fake this kind of conviction). I will also note that I don't have a ton of conviction in Gimli being Kira, I am just not really sure who else to vote.

I mean, look at this:

HighPrincessErinys (2): ActionDan, Gimli
Hu Tao (1): Aureal
Aureal (1): Hu Tao
Klick (1): Radical Rat
Gimli (1): CUDDLE TIME

This VC kinda sucks tbh. I would really like to build a wagon on someone so we can start to see how people react to real pressure. In fact I'd probably be down to wagon almost anyone except Klick or Willow right now (oh hi Willow! Good that you managed to get in the game!), so that I could gather hopefully alignment-indicative reactions to those wagons.



Also, small correction of what Adorable said: I don't TR Klick due to meta. I TR him due to his play this game. I just feel confident about my ability to find him as town since I've done it before. But it isn't a "meta-read" as much as a "meta-adjusted read".

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

I should note that the above two posts were written 24 hours apart which is part of why they might look somewhat out of synch.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Welcome Willow

I've been putting this game on the back burner so I don't really have any new thoughts. I need to do more than just skim at some point

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

Hi I probably won't post much, or at all, until Sunday

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

So if I'm understanding this right, hpe used the incognito skill on gimli and his flavor name will show on day 2 and does both gimli and hpe need to be alive for the name to show up on day 2?

Funnily, me and my hydra partners have talked about our suspicion on both of those players in the hydra chat.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

I don't have any town reads in this game. I'm looking for posts that look like scum won't be able to fake and I haven't seen any here so far.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

From town to scum: Cuddle, Klick, Erinys, Gimli, Aureal, Tao, Dan, Rat, Drew.

Elaborate your reads on Erinys, Drew?

- Dragon

P.S. I'm back, more or less, to being available but also it's midnight so I will post tomorrow morning instead of right now.

[CUDDLE TIME]

The Kira role reminds me of a mafia traitor role who doesn't know their mafia buddies. From my experience playing with a mafia traitor in completed games, I've seen a mafia traitor being town leaned and null read and usually it's the informed scum with tmi who look scummy. Whoever is Kira looks like it could be anyone and it's the Kira Followers with tmi are the ones who will look scummy.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

I don't have any town reads in this game. I'm looking for posts that look like scum won't be able to fake and I haven't seen any here so far.

- A

Gun to your head, who would be the least scummy?

Least scummy means a scummy player who is not the first pick on being voted out. If I had to pick a player who I can guess can be town it would be Klick.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

So heads up, I am kinda feeling like my next few posts are going to unavoidably have cognitive dissonance because I have several competing threads of thought / possible ways of looking at the game. I know this will probably contribute to hydra dissonance etc., so I am going to do my best to sum up my thoughts after that.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Welcome Willow!

I look forward to seeing that reads list rearranged once you've read properly

Drew out of ten Doctors agree: You should vote Klick

Okay first of all, I really hate these posts and they feel more like powerwolfing than town genuinely convinced of their solve, but on the other hand I was slightly wanting to TR Rat earlier. And also the fact that Drew and Klick are TRing Rat (I think? I also saw Klick agreeing with Gimli SRing Rat later so IDK) is giving me pause on that.
So I find myself wanting to scumread Rat

BUT
(see next post)

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

BUT I'm finding myself extremely pocketed by Gimli when he makes posts like these:

you're too cute, DE

Like WTF Gimli how can you do that to me, it's absolutely unfair and I demand that you cease at once!!! [and also thank you Gimli, you are cute too <3 ]

Also I like Gimli's solving energy (e.g. in post 509), it feels so town, and it combined with the pocket makes me want to un-scumread Gimli.

And if Gimli is town then my entire argument for Rat being scum falls apart.

BUT
(see next post)

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

BUT

As someone said (I think Klick but maybe Gimli), Kira would be someone for whom there's not a lot of appetite today. Do you know for whom there's no appetite today? Gimli.

And also,

question for you: if I'm kira, then who are my followers?

The answer to that is easy, Rat and somebody else (Hu Tao/HPE/Aureal probably?)

And I really don't think Rat is town.

And I really don't think Gimli is a bad scum player considering he was nominated twice for Goodfellas last year.

BUT
There are also other people I haven't scrutinized lately which aren't very towny and I cannot just tunnel Gimli the whole day phase because that would be silly and uproductive.

So I am going to untunnel Gimli and unvote him (mainly because he called me cute) and then if I find Aureal and ActionDan and HPE satisfactorily un-Kira-like, I might go back to Gimli later.

UNVOTE:

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

It feels like you're really reaching for something here, and I don't like it.

If you want a wagon so much, why aren't you building one? You're vanity wagoning someone whom you admit you don't actually have much of a scumread on while there are other options you're open to who actually have votes.

In post 435, Hu Tao wrote:
Hi Kira, I am your loyal follower. Please do not kill me at night. Thank you.

Oh. Okay. Thanks for letting me know.

VOTE: Gimli

Aureal do you mind explaining the thought process behind shading me for not building a wagon and then like 2 posts later randomly joining the wagon I'm trying to build? How does that work?

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

I also have other thoughts on Aureal which I've held back for a while because i was under the impression Black had a strong TR on Aureal, but since Black doesn't have a strong TR of Aureal anymore I might as well say them:

I feel Aureal's posting this game, especially early on, is EXTREMELY erratic and nervous, which is something I generally scumread. The thing is, often when I scumread Aureal for that she's town. The OTHER thing is, last game where Aureal was scum she was also like that I think. And I kinda feel like Aureal is forcing her hyper aggressive, towny tone in order to appear towny, which might be a sign of being Kira?

And I just realized that I'd been pinged early by Rat's vote on Aureal and i thought it could've been traitor signaling and now I can finally make sense of TRing Gimli and SRing Rat, if Rat is actually an Aureal follower and am I thinking too fast? Maybe. But I do think I could be on the right track and I promise this is not scum!me sowing chaos even though it's chaotic as fuck

Anyway VOTE: Aurea

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

I think I've been pushed a whole lot this game so I don't know if your feelings about my slot match the material

Can you quote who pushed you except me and Aureal?

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Okay bye I have some other things to do so I'll continue posting later

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

I'm still on page 10. This is much harder than I thought it would be. I need to give my brain a break. For now I'll post what I have.

During this re-read of the game, I'm focusing on getting associetive reads leading from followers to Kira. My top Kira-read using this method is Cuddle. As much as I like their posts (mainly Dragon and Thomith), there's just so many people who could be their followers: Dan, Drew, Erinys, Gimli, Klick, Rat and Tao.

There's no one who's got even close to 7 potential followers. But there's many people with exactly 3 "non-followers". This is my "non-Kira" list:

• Drew (Aureal, Klick, Rat).
  
• Erinys (Cuddle, Dan, Klick).
  
• Gimli (Aureal, Cuddle, Erinys).
  
• Tao (Aureal, Cuddle, Dan).

These four could be of either alignment, but I don't think they are Kira.

Keep in mind that this is only up to page 10. I'll continue with this train of reasoning later.

Can you elaborate on why Drew can't be Kira with Rat as a follower and why Tao can't be Kira with Dan as a follower.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

Hey Dragon, feel free to pursue Aureal, but you can't avoid forever coming up with a better reason to have a town read on Klick. It's obvious you're capable. So again, why?

It's almost midnight (AGAIN, because I am absolutely horrible at time management), so I'm gonna give a very quick answer and elaborate more tomorrow evening (which would be like 24 hours to deadline btw):

I liked Klick's entrance. His vote on HPE felt like a genuine mindmeld with me and Gimli and you, all of which I was townreading at the time. His irrelevant comment about hydra dissonance may have sounded awkward to you and Gimli, and rightly so, but I find early awkwardness to be a towntell for Klick.

Also in general I have liked a lot of his thinking, including his TR of T-Bone, his reaction to my gambit scumread on him, his TR of Gimli and his general approach to finding Kira. I feel they are very in line with how I'd expect town!Klick to think, both on a meta level and on a "those are the correct reads a townperson in this game should have" level.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

I thought the push on HPE was weak, and expressed as much, but what stuck out to me was your insistence on it being a red herring, and your supposition that Action Dan was Kira based on basically nothing. I wanted to wait and see how things developed, and then they just got worse.

Your reaction to HPE claiming a shitpost seemed to indicate you thought it WAS signaling Kira, but that doesn't quite align with your red herring claim earlier. I thought perhaps you might have been a Follower either misdirecting to protect Gimli, perhaps assuming HPE was the other partner and being worried someone else would interpret that as a signal, or potentially Dan's Follower, trying to do a reverse psychology, which would explain why you never actually voted Dan.

But then Gimli's suggestion that Kira won't look scummy combined with you being absent from his PoE pool due to "investigative depth" that doesn't exist, with you yourself describing your reads as vibe-based, made all of the pieces Klick into place.

You jumped at HPE because, as Kira, you're looking for these signals, and having seen something that you think looks like a signal but directed towards someone else, you tried to push that narrative. No matter whether it lands on Gimli or Dan, it's not you. Gimli's oddities would put him as a strong Follower candidate, and then Dragon immediately jumping on me as soon as I suggested I thought you were Kira... well I think he's overplayed the hand now.

So I suppose to answer your question, Klick, what I'm looking for... is justice.

Rereading this, meh I can see your points of Klick being Kira. But I feel annoyed cause I want to have some townreads I'm confident of. And I'm also still reading Rat as scum.

Rat, would you mind untunneling Klick for a bit and pushing elsewhere as if Klick flipped not-Kira (which would helo me read you better if you are town and in fact also help me read Klick better), and then you can go back to pushing him?

I mean you can't be 100% sure he's Kira anyway and your tunnel makes you hard to read and the gamestate pretty annoying yo operate in. If you die then I will seriously consider pushing Klick. If you don't you can resume pushing him tomorrow after we have info from a flip and detective, which will like help, I guess.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

You said he was exposed to you voting him for reactions in another game so I wouldn't put much stock into a reaction test in which he had foresight. I agree that his thinking on you and T-bone and ofc the HPE vote were perfectly reasonable and fine. But not on Gimli and not on me. They are simply not reasonable reads that Klick, being an intelligent mafia player, would have. I've gone over why that is in my previous posts. I don't know if you want a refresher.

---

Considering that deadline is approaching and I do have 4 votes, I feel compelled to claim that I am either Assistant or Detective. If I am not, a theoretical Assistant can CC me.

I missed this

VOTE: Gimli

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Willing to vote Klick maybe

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Argh whatever

VOTE: Klick

[CUDDLE TIME]

Also

I was gonna write a mechpost about how the detective should claim D3 and the assistant should never claim but I think it's maybe, a tiny bit, too late for that.

What I do think is a good idea is that the detective should aim for people he suspects as being followers, not Kira. A detective inno doesn't clear someone of being Kira (since they could've given the death note away), but it does clear someone of being a follower. Also we should massclaim at the start of each day if we got the note or not, and if someone doesn't claim receiving it but does have secrets they are guilty.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Top 2 most likely to be kira?

My thoughts were Gimli and Aureal.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Actually Klick could still be a Gimli follower which is why I voted Gimli earlier.

[CUDDLE TIME]

Hu Tao, could you please TLDR me your reads?

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Sorry I wasn't clear, I meant like give explanation of these reads.

[CUDDLE TIME]

I mean

If Dan is fake claiming, Assistant CC's right now and votes and Detective stays silent and doesn't condemn. Which tbh kinda sucks.

Okay yeah I can see why it's a problem if he doesn't straight up. Claim because this kinda forces the Adsidtant to claim and Assistant is not nightkill proof like detective, and if they die Detective becomes useless.

And tbh if detective claims today they get killed N2 after N1 Shinigami eyes.

Ugh

UNVOTE:

- DE70

[CUDDLE TIME]

Unless Kira can't kill followers. Then that changes things. But I think they can

Kira can't kill followers.

Did you read the setup?

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Kira has to use Assassinate, which is a one time use, and the only way of killing Detective without any outside help from Condemn/Shinigami Eyes.

Oh yeah, forgot that existed bexause it's explictly against the actual lore and I am rewatching Death Note right now and it would be insane if Light could just hire an assassin to hit on L without finding his name.

Anyways ugh I guess Detective shouldn't CC then?

I'm gonna read AD's ISO but I might vote there.

AD, did you crumb?

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Unless Kira can't kill followers. Then that changes things. But I think they can

Kira can't kill followers.

Did you read the setup?

- Dragon

I only looked at what was relevant to me. I'm not Kira so I don't need to know that.

bruh

This

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

bianco jumpscare

Am I allowed to TR this post?

(more seriously, I am actually TRing a lot of HPE's posts last page. Which is atrocious because it means I might be scum and just don't know it)

- Dragon

Pedit: but why?

[CUDDLE TIME]

Okay I'm heading to sleep, gonna sheep whoever out of Klick/HPE/Gimli/Aureal nakes the most sensible posts between now and when I wake up. Yes I do realize I've literally voted everyone on this list but nobody else is even making sense to me.

Anyways, goodnighto.

Oh also I will sheep Black if she remembers this game exists.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Oh also I will sheep Black if she remembers this game exists.

I remember this game exists and in fact I think about it every day and how I don't have time to read it or provide anything useful. Anxiety is cool

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

HPE, what do you think a genuine Assistant/Detective should do in this situation?

Dan certainly shouldn't be telling us which one he is, because then Kira knows how to kill. And while I do share your concern with potentially a gambit to bait a CC, I think we just go with it for now, and Assistant should NOT actually CC yet. If Dan is a follower, Kira can't be certain enough to risk NOT killing imo. If Dan IS Kira he'll obviously live, and real detective can CC after checking for secrets tonight.

So, what would you have him do, if the claim is real?

If the claim is real he should maybe curb the things that got him to a

theoretical

E-2. And maybe stop being insufferably smug all of a sudden.

Though seeing as he just thinks me, Gimli and Klick are all scum, this one thinks he's just going to keep doing what he's doing. Yippee !

I never understood why Dan was being voted in the first place. I didn't see anything scummy from him and he was a null read. I just know that he was suspecting two of the same players just like my slot was earlier.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

I'm not confident on this read and I think Freedom is town.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

VOTE: Gimli

Gut

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Klick why are you clearing Gimli? It makes no snese to me at all

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Willow can you please answer this?

From town to scum: Cuddle, Klick, Erinys, Gimli, Aureal, Tao, Dan, Rat, Drew.

Elaborate your reads on Erinys, Drew?

- Dragon

P.S. I'm back, more or less, to being available but also it's midnight so I will post tomorrow morning instead of right now.

And add Gimli and Hu Tao to this please.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

VOTE: Gimli

Gut

- Dragon

I'm a townie brownie

Then stop pocketing people and start working with me to solve.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Okay but like

Why'd you vote Hu Tao?

[CUDDLE TIME]

I can engage about my read on Gimli in a bit more depth if that's something people want but I'm annoyed by the inevitable partner accusations that will come with that line

The fact that you aren't engaging the read is exactly what makes you look partnered, lol

Just spit it out

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Then stop pocketing people and start working with me to solve.

- Dragon

And this is pretty freaking rich from someone who was last seen throwing his hands up in the air in confusion and leaving things to be sorted by others. You suddenly seem desperate to do something other than what's happening.

I... Wha?

This has got to be the wildest accusation I've been accused of this game. Or actually since the start of the year probably.

I did throw my hands in the air BECAUSE no one I was townreading seemed remotely interested in working with me and they all just did their own thing, namely pushing other people I was townreading and providing very little rationale for that and refusing to consolidate etc.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

if we're flipping hu tao then who are his followers?

its not in (hpe, aureal, klick) cause they're pushing for it.

it had to be in (rr, cuddle, wisp, freedom) at first. I'll try to see if this checks out but I'm also gonna take my few minutes of healthy non painful brain to go grocery shopping, so idk how much of that I could do.

my wagon is cleaner since the now confirmed town is pushing for it, I am not a power role so I think taking me down is reasonable. when my flip does not end the game though, you should note that klick is clear and you should follow his instincts

anyway I'll try to work something out

Gimli it wrecks my heart to push you again and potentially mislim you but it's true that if your flip doesn't end the game we can treat Klick as clear and have a much smaller PoE and also HPE is less suspect I guess.

But on the other hand I just want to elim a follower or Kira Day 1 like in the last game so how bout we do some super deep analysis and solve this?

My thoughts are:

I like HPE's reaction to the PR claim and I think its towny, I think Klick is towny, I believe AD's claim sorta, I need to re-evaluate my read on Willow and on Freedom because I had very vague early reads on their slots and then didn't rethink them.

- Dragon

Pedit: okay good point Gimli

[CUDDLE TIME]

It's a really basic 'I believe his solving has been genuine'

I don't think Gimli's recent posting is oriented towards survival in the short- or long-term

Great

I'm back to TRing both of you

Now let's do something crazy and vote Willow

VOTE: Willow

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Okay but like

Why'd you vote Hu Tao?

Seriously why would you expect him NOT to vote Hu at deadline?

???

Is there ANY reason to vote Hu Tao other than her being a lowposter?

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

I'm down to try something new but we'd likely need specifically ActionDan's explicit approval to make something like that happen and also have it land on Kira

ActionDan is currently voting Gimli so if you're convinced Gimli is town you can basically make that argument for every push ever and Hu Tao is very clearly a compromise lim that I do think scum is fine with and would be very surprised if it ands on Kira

Additionally, experience proves flashwagons are better than not and giving up because "what would a flashwagon achieve" sucks. For example in Open 902: Frienemies Blitz there were like a bunch of people who expressed willingness to flashwagon Black (who was scum) and then didn't because deadline and ended up on town instead.

Also you can always go back to voting Hu Tao or Gimli if there are not enough votes but you should at least TRY.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

I thought she wasn't a bad shot in the dark at Kira?

I think Hu Tao is a very good scum player and the quality of her posting has been pretty bad and while this could get into WIFOM or something I just don't think Kira!Tao plays like this and I also don't really see anyone defending her or even looking for a counterwagon except me, and I am town.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Then stop pocketing people and start working with me to solve.

- Dragon

And this is pretty freaking rich from someone who was last seen throwing his hands up in the air in confusion and leaving things to be sorted by others. You suddenly seem desperate to do something other than what's happening.

I... Wha?

This has got to be the wildest accusation I've been accused of this game. Or actually since the start of the year probably.

I did throw my hands in the air BECAUSE no one I was townreading seemed remotely interested in working with me and they all just did their own thing, namely pushing other people I was townreading and providing very little rationale for that and refusing to consolidate etc.

- Dragon

Cool so you think that's not what

you've

been doing too?? I was somewhat townreading you for a while then you just went all over the place again and it's hard to trust you right now (or anyone really).

I'm really annoyed with this approach from you Aureal because I don't think you've ever been correct in scumreading me for this kind of behavior and you should know better than having this change your read of my slot

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

I agree that in concept this vote is most likely to land on scum with a flashwagon. But if we were going to flashwagon, I'd prefer the target at least be ActionDan-approved to be achievable

ActionDan is scumreading your townreads so like, good luck?

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

The difference between this and Open 902 and who the hell is willing to flash Willow in the first place?

There is like zero pre-existing appetite for a Willow wagon let alone a close-to-deadline Willow flashwagon.

Very perceptive of you

[CUDDLE TIME]

It's more likely that I'm wrong in my reads than that we'll get a good flashwagon elimination without ActionDan on-board

I'll consolidate on anyone except you if I MUST, but I'd rather at least try to flashwagon the PoE and go back to voting whoever Dan wants if it fails.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Also I will be definitely sleeping before the deadline so I'm banking on Thomith/Black/Adorable moving the vote if needed.

[CUDDLE TIME]

gah damn

Wanna join in?

Also

Wanna join in too?

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Not approved.

You get Gimli. You get Hu (already annoyed at this) . You don't get will who was T bone who was town

We could flash HPE who is scum

UNVOTE:

[CUDDLE TIME]

AD was Aureal in your pool?

[CUDDLE TIME]

Anyway assuming HPE is scum, I think we only kill it Day 3? Since currently it's able to spew people (such as Willow) as being not Kira, which it just did if it's scum.

Also this game is giving me so much stress since if Kira uses

assassinate

on the Detective we have only 2 lim attempts? And hitting a follower doesn't even help? Which really sucks.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

So uh, I'm trying to catch up at lunch and you really did this huh? There was a reason I said not to go after Dan's strong reads, which T-Bone was.

Reeeeeally hoping this is a Dan ploy now

OMG can you not be anti-town and say stuff like that?????

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Hu Tao is not Kira so that's a bad wagon

VOTE: Gimli

Just makes the most sense

Assuming Aureal, Dan, Klick, Willow, Cuddle are all town (not really sure why I'm clearing Aureal but I am)

If Rat is scum, Gimli is Kira

If HPE is scum, Hu Tao is not Kira and Gimli is probably Kira (also I'll be mad if HPE/Hu Tao both roll scum 3 games in a row but I don't think it works votes wise).

If Freedom is scum I have 0 idea who Kira is but Gimli works

If Gimli is follower I also have no idea who Kira is.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Oh and if Hu Tao is follower I still think Gimli works but I haven't really looked at outgoing associations?

[CUDDLE TIME]

Klick

The last two games you've townread scum on Day 1 which I was correctly skeptical of (Skygazer in Volcano, fireisred in Pizza Coalition).

Vote Gimli?

[CUDDLE TIME]

That's true but I'm talking about fire, not kyouko

I also did scumread Kyouko for 90% of Day 1.

[CUDDLE TIME]

ANYWAY

Why is Hu Tao scum

[CUDDLE TIME]

I have been pretty lost on not able to figure out who Kira is. From what I noticed was almost all the players were fine with voting Hu Tao and this was a sign that Hu Tao wasn't Kira.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

If someone has knowledge that ActionDan was not the Assistant, I strongly believe they should claim that information now.

I don't think ActionDan was fakeclaiming, but I want to limit scum's ability to go back and say 'oh yeah I'm actually the Assistant'.

No one counter claimed ActionDan and it makes me think his claim was real.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

Okay time to explain my behavior around willow slot yesterday.

I locked T-Bone as town early on because I felt Detective energy from his slot. Citation:

Okay, as promised, here's my process:

I've been townreading Klick for a while now (perhaps for bad reasons, but with his posting I feel I'm more likely to be right for the wrong reasons than just wrong).

I've also concluded that T-Bone is town and that Drew is not Kira

regardless of his alignment. I've thought Hu Tao was scummy but her play makes sense more as scummy town than as Kira IMO (but not letting her off the hook completely). So that leaves a pool of Aureal/Gimli/RR/AD/HPE. This pool doesn't necessarily contain all scum but I do think it contains Kira.
[...]
- Dragon

[...]
This VC kinda sucks tbh. I would really like to build a wagon on someone so we can start to see how people react to real pressure.

In fact I'd probably be down to wagon almost anyone except Klick or Willow right now

(oh hi Willow! Good that you managed to get in the game!), so that I could gather hopefully alignment-indicative reactions to those wagons.

[...]

- Dragon

Also I specifically thought that Drew was softing assistant of T-Bone (though in looking back I am not really sure what made me feel that way, maybe just saying he thought that T-Bone was town early on without giving any reasoning, and I was already thinking T-Bone was the detective at that point). I was intentionally vague about that though since it was anti-town to say that, but I did say I didn't think he was Kira (which was true and I still think the slot is unlikely to be Kira).

When AcrionDan claimed, I kinda assumed that he was just the detective. So that made me "realize" that my assumption that T-Bone/Willow were the detective was "wrong". On looking back I should have probably looked at ActionDan's outgoing associations, but it was pretty close to deadline and I wanted to try and start an alt wagon and see and use people's reactions to get a better read on the game state and on people (that actually did somewhat work, more on that in a bit). At the time Hu Tao was the top wagon and Hu Tao wasn't Kira so it's actually confirmed that I wasn't trying to counterwagon scum (unless the people who think I am Klick's follower think that Hu Tao is Klick's other follower and I found her out IDK. I haven't checked her associations since they are irrelevant since she's town 90% of the time but you guys are welcome to).

This explanation is given because I know I look bad, but I also know that right now the alignment ratio is 3-5 (uness Hu Tao was a follower which I find unlikely) and basically every member of the town has to vote together for us to achieve a Kira lim (or we can have the detective use condemn on Kira or get Kira to bus a follower, I guess). So I do want people to be willing to work together with me.

Right now my solve is is Gimli Kira, and HPE/Klick/Rat/Aureal as followers (ordered most to least likely). This is in part based on the votes on Hu Tao, who was obv!not Kira based on how little resistance her wagon got (only from me, I think? And I was supposedly Klick's follower so I couldn't be her follower). And also Klick and HPE were both happy to compromise on Willow or Hu Tao but not on Gimli and it really feels weird. Aureal is right now casing me as a Klick follower for my bad push (and it was bad) on Willow, but she forgets how these people followed me onto it, and how oppirtunistic they were. I wasn't oppirtunistic, I was trying to shake up a gamestate that I felt was anti town.

Peace out.

VOTE: Gimli

Note: I'd be willing to go for HPE today so that we have a small chance to maybe hit Kira anyway and also less scum votes tomorrow (2/6 votes instead of 3/8), but currently I want Gimli. This setup is actually scumsided though, alignment ratio wise.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Dragon: ugh I'm going to sleep, Klick/HPE/Gimli/Aureal plz tell me what to do
Aureal/Klick/HPE: *vote Hu Tao*
Gimli: *barely exists due to migraines*
Dragon: OMG HOW DARE YOU!!!!!! I'M GONNA GET GIMLI!!!!!
Klick/HPE/Gimli/Aureal: what
Dragon: FINE GIMLI CAN BE TOWN! LET'S GET WILLOW! WAIT WE CAN'T, OK LET'S GET GIMLI!!!

I said I'd sheep the one who made sense

Voting Hu Tao made 0 sense

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

I would like to bring to everybody's attention that unless Hu Tao was a follower (something which I think is unlikely), today is basically Melo. If we mislim a task force memeber, and Kira guesses and kills the detective (which isn't THAT hard), then tomorrow we're going to be 3v3 with no way to kill Kira.

So we MUST hit scum today (because I am not banking on the detective surviving the night and correctly guessing Kira tomorrow), and preferably Kira (but if we hit a follower we do have another shot at hitting Kira tomorrow and a knowledge that either today's lim or Hu Tao was a follower since we weren't endgamed).

If this wasn't Melo I would probably be fine with going for Klick to prove he wasn't Kira and I am not his follower so people can untunnel me, but it is Melo and I think going Klick is too dangerous because he very well could be town (though I guess if he's follower it's a pretty good hit and might actually convince people that Gimli is Kira).

Bleh.

What I do know is that I have 90% certainty HPE is scum because it's literally openwolfing the same way it has been in its last wolfgame and I am getting flashbacks to how I've also been fooled in that game.

My problem is if Gimli is Kira with HPE/Klick and we flip HPE, Gimli probably shoots detective and then there would be a majority in favor of flipping Klick over HPE tomorrow and then Gimli would win so maybe flipping Klick is better, IDK. But that assumes he's scum which I am veey much not sure about.

Would people be fine with flipping Gimli today and Klick tomorrow?

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Dragon's been bending over backwards to keep you alive, and stop me from pushing you, with that single temporary vote being the only move contrary

Can you quote the posts where he does this?

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

My PoE is Gimli, Radical Rat and Freedom. I'm pretty sure Kira is among their number.

Are these three your Kira suspects? On 571 you gave a non-Kira list that had Gimli and Drew(aka Freedom) as a non-Kira and what changed for you to put Gimli and Freedom in the poe of being Kira?

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

I'm also going to check if hpe is an anxious type of player as town.

You said last day you were going to check if HPE is an anxious type of player as town and you never did a follow up on your read on HPE. What's your read on HPE now?

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

Ok I told my hydra pals but I have designated some time on Sunday to read this game and solve it

Kira better watch the fuck out

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

Ok I told my hydra pals but I have designated some time on Sunday to read this game and solve it

Kira better watch the fuck out

-Black

throw the playerlist in random.org and believe it enough to make it real

No. You and I are gonna solve this thing just like the first one

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

I need to see progression on these reads. Your posts from today are not matching on what you were saying from last day.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

I read through Hu Tao's iso and the players that look like who are not Kira are Willow and Aureal.

Freedom, Gimli, HPE, Klick - These 4 are the list of players Hu Tao did not interact much with and I'm leaning on Kira being in one of these 4.

I still don't understand the town reads Klick has on Gimli and HPE. Dragon has been suspecting both of Gimli and HPE at the start of the day.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

Hi gob! Have you read the setup?

[CUDDLE TIME]

I read through Hu Tao's iso and the players that look like who are not Kira are Willow and Aureal.

Freedom, Gimli, HPE, Klick - These 4 are the list of players Hu Tao did not interact much with and I'm leaning on Kira being in one of these 4.

I still don't understand the town reads Klick has on Gimli and HPE. Dragon has been suspecting both of Gimli and HPE at the start of the day.

- A

this one was pretty fine with killing ht for a good portion of the day ?

Kira doesn't know who its followers are and my guess is it will try to be playing like town and will be willing to vote anyone who is not towny. I talked about this earlier about the Kira role reminds of the mafia traitor role who doesn't know who the mafia are and they mainly try to play like town and do the best on not being a mafia night kill and not being a day elimination

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

ATTENTION EVERYONE!

As the detective leading the investigation, I have an announcement to make: Aureal is, without a shadow of a doubt, a follower of Kira.

Thus, it is my "professional" opinion that we should start considering Radical Rat as our prime suspect in the Kira investigation.

Thank you for listening!

This info is really helpful. During the night phase I was suspecting Aureal being Kira for reacting way too much on the town reads on herself and I was comparing her play to my play because I have never reacted so much to the town reads on myself and she looked performative. Dragon told me Aureal is also performative as town and I let the read go.

I will need to do a read through again after seeing this info.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

I thought I read somewhere in the setup saying after the detective dies we only have 1 day left to find Kira or else Kira wins. Shouldn't we try to eliminate Kira?

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

I read through Aureal's iso and my Kira poe in gob, Gimli, HPE, and Klick still remains the same because Aureal did not have any serious interactions with them. This post 936 from Aureal makes HPE look a little bit better but that can easily be faked. Rat's claim when they announced their skill I thought looked towny and I ended up removing them from the poe.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

Why is my slot doomed? I am town so that doesnt bode well for whateber is happening

isk how much time we havw left, but im about to go clubbing so my Analysis will have to waiter till tomorrow.

What happened is it is revealed a follower is already dead which points to Hu Tao being the follower and the detective claimed today and said Aureal is the second follower. Both of the followers interactions towards your predecessors looked like a soft defense which makes it look like you are Kira.

- A

[CUDDLE TIME]

First of all: NO VOTING. Treat this like ELo.

If we put anyone who's not Kira at E-2 then Aureal and Kira could quickhammer and immediately win. Like theoretically it could be harder to coordinate but it's definitely not something I want to happen so yeah.

Second thing, to summarize FACTUAL knowledge: we're confirmed town, Aureal is confirmed follower, one of RR and Hu Tao is also confirmed follower. If anyone has a disagreement on this, DON'T vote but instead ask.

Third thing - absolutely ignore any posts Aureal makes as she's confscum and dabbling in WIFOM is not worth it.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

Willow said that Aureal visited us N1. That confirms her as follower (since if she were Kira we'd be dead and if she were town she couldn't visit). Aureal wouldn't visit someone who's Kira, nor someone she thought was vanilla. Personally I feel like I spewed our slot as not-detective on Day 1, so it's highly possible that Aureal thought we were the second follower actually.

And I think this actually spews Gimli as town and males Klick and Freedom/Drew somewhat more likely to be Kira. Because Day 1 I was pushing Gimli heavily and I doubt Aureal would've thought we were a follower if Gimli was Kira. On the other hand I defended Klick heavily and soft defended Drew.

So I am going to be working under the assumption that Kira is within Drew/Klick 80-90% of the time here.

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

I'll do some more in depth analysis later. I also know that Black did some analysis but I'll let her post that.

[CUDDLE TIME]

I was soooooooooo sick of rolling town, it was great to get to be frigging Light Yagami.

I am SOOOO happy for you Aureal

- Dragon

[CUDDLE TIME]

-- Redacted --

[CUDDLE TIME]

I'll work on reading the second half of the game throughout the week to try and get a definitive solve

[CUDDLE TIME]

TL;DR - It's probably gob or Klick

[CUDDLE TIME]

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

Ok my bad. I need to tweak my analysis post and I'll post it again later when I get off work

[CUDDLE TIME]

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

freedom and gob have been both very lackadaisical and this one doesn't super recall anyone super caring about or defending the slot so we can pppppppppppppppppppprobably remove gob from the kira pool? genuinely seems like he doesn't know what the fuck is going on which would probably not be the case if he repped into scumslot

No shot we remove gob from the Kira pool. I don't think feigning ignorance is outside of his scumrange

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

I actually am leaning toward gob being Kira but I still need to read half the game

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

I liked it better when Aureal wasn't talking

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

[CUDDLE TIME]

And mean. She not only hogs all the scum PMs but tries to shut me down as soon as I can finally enjoy having one? So cold.

ily!

[CUDDLE TIME]

You had your fun. Now it's my turn to have fun making sure you lose the game

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

Black always has it out for me for no reason

Is Cuddle Time clear HPE?

Yes, I'm clear. No, I'm not pushing you for "no reasons". I posted analysis why I think it's you but I'm gonna have to repost it when I get home from work because it was redacted

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

im probably going klick or gimil today. HPE was kind

I think town!gob would be more interested in getting this right and probably wouldn't clear someone just because they were kind to him

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

shhhhhh you're distracting me

[CUDDLE TIME]

i can confirm im town with my role so let me do that here.

I AM NOT KIRA

I'm pretty sure you can still be Kira even with that skill

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

Ngl it would be really funny if Kira randomly rolled that skill

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

I TOTALLY FORGOT ABOUT THAT

No shot that happens twice in a row right...

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

The odds that Kira rolls that skill in back to back games seems ridiculously low but we can't really use this to clear gob since it's still possible

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

Black is such a hater dude SHEESH that or kira follower

I can't be a follower dum dum

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

And I'm not hating. I'm just trying to figure out who Kira is. Idk why you're calling me a hater

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

Black is such a hater dude SHEESH that or kira follower

I can't be a follower dum dum

-Black

so you are either kira or town?
or conf!town?

Sorry for asking for the spoonfeed. easier for me tho

Basically yeah. I can't be a follower. I can be Kira but it's highly unlikely

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

And I'm not hating. I'm just trying to figure out who Kira is. Idk why you're calling me a hater

-Black

you moved the goalpost like crazy when i used my ability, lets keep it real. Anyone else would’ve been cleared from that.

Youve been gunning for me since I repped in. How about you let me play for a bit without the need to defend myself about a game i, unfortunately, do not have a great grasp on all the intricacies, but i am fairly confident in the reads i do have.

Dude

I didn't move the goalpost. That ability doesn't confirm you are town. In fact Kira had that ability in the first installment of the game

Don't whine to me about not being able to play just because people think you might be Kira. Do your thing. We're not stopping you

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

@HPE who do you think Kira is?

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

Little Will o' Wisp

CUDDLE TIME

HighPrincessErinys
Gimli
Klick
gob

Aureal

Aureal's Kira is within {HPE, Gimli, Klick, Gob}
Either Hu Tao or RR was the second follower

HPE

• Early interactions with Gimli make it seem like it could be a follower to Gimli!Kira, but we know that it can't be a follower
  
• The sharpness of HPE's 36 and 41 when talking to Adorable is
  +Town
  . Specifically 41, this tone is believable from a town!HPE perspective because we just finished a game with Adorable and it showed visible exasperation towards Adorable's style of posting in that game. I think Kira is probably less likely to be combative and openly brash this early. 71, 79, and 80 fit into this read too as I continue on.
  
• More bite in 104. Really getting town vibes from HPE early
  
• 145
  +Town
  
  
• The more I read 201 and 284 the less I like them. In 201, Aureal asks Klick why he doesn't think HPE is Kira and it just feels like this question was presented unnaturally. It feels like a weird response to Klick's thought. And then 284 feels a little performative like "oh well I guess HPE might be Kira". At first I was feeling like Aureal wouldn't say this if HPE was her Kira but now I'm not so sure.
  +Kira

Klick

• Klick joins the party and defends my slot. Kinda want to +Kira this but realistically he would probably do this as town too. I just think maybe Klick!Kira would try to pocket some folks and my slot with 4 very capable players is a decent target for this early on. Maybe just a smol
  _+kira
  
  
• I'm not really vibing with Klick's response to his wagon on page 5, specifically 113. I'm getting something between annoyed and nervous energy here. Klick lightens up a bit in 120 after we unvote him and call him town.
  +Kira
  
  
• I like 173 but I feel like it has to be NAI because Klick!Kira would have to be solving here. He wouldn't know who his followers were
  
• Aureal's defense of Klick in 189 feels REALLY bad, like way overblown and unnatural.
  +Kira
  
  
• I don't like the way Aureal comes at Klick in 228. The whole "that distresses me " from Aureal just feels like she's reluctantly pushing Klick. Not even pushing, just politely tapping him on the shoulder here basically. It's the kind of prod I would expect a follower to make against their Kira as a little distancing poke. And it feels worse after Aureal just defended Klick. And yep, Aureal backs away in 242.
  +Kira
  
  
• Aureal defends Klick again in 346. Starting to wonder if this could be a pocket attempt now
  
• Aureal not responding or interacting to the Drew/Klick interactions on pg 16-17 makes me feel like Kira is within {Drew/Klick} and the follower didn't want to get involved
  
• Aureal suggests Rat vote for Drew when Rat says we should vote Klick (426)
  +Kira

Gimli

• Not getting too much from Gimli's entrance. 22 doesn't really feel genuine but that may be because I'm looking for Kira and things are sticking out that maybe shouldn't
  
• 25 feels a bit performative so I will
  +Kira
  that
  
• 228 doesn't really feel like a real solving thought. I don't see how three people giving my slot heat for being a hydra makes us not Kira and I'm having a hard time picturing town!Gimli coming to this conclusion.
  +Kira
  
  
• Aureal actually calls Gimli out for this thought in 243. I feel like if Gimli was her Kira she would probably just not comment on this instead of potentially putting a questionable read in the spotlight?
  +Town
  
  
• I've read 244 over 10 times now trying to figure out if this is Aureal softing to Gimli!Kira. Specifically the "Here I am: Kira" part. I decided probably not, but it's such a weird post
  
• 344 feels bad because essentially Aureal is doing the whole "this is scummy for Gimli, but" thing that scumbuddies often do to divert attention away from their partners.
  +Kira
  
  
• Could be distancing but I don't really think Aureal votes for her Kira in 438.
  +Town

Gob (Freedom/Doctor Drew)

• Starts the game as Drew. Very jokey and loose, probably NAI for Drew
  
• Aureal engages with Drew early but it feels kinda cautious in a way. Like she doesn't want him to seem scummy when she's talking to him. I get that vibe from 67.
  +Kira
  
  
• I don't like that Aureal never remarks on 195 even though she's online and posting about other stuff in the game, but I'm not sure it's Kira indicative
  
• Aureal doesn't respond to 230 either. It's starting to feel like she's deliberately avoiding him now.
  +Kira
  
  
• Aureal playfully accuses Drew of having a fake read in 287 which continues the trend of her acting cautious around him. She doesn't want Drew to look too scummy. Compare this to the way she is handling other slots and it's
  +Kira
  
  
• Aureal not responding or interacting to the Drew/Klick interactions on pg 16-17 makes me feel like Kira is within {Drew/Klick} and the follower didn't want to get involved

~~~


Ok so this is from the first half of the game. I ran out of time so I won't be able to read the second half but this is my analysis so far. I'm pretty confident that Kira is either Klick or Drew (gob). There's a chance it's Gimli. I think HPE is the least likely to be Kira.

I will be trying to analyze the second half of the game this week

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

I think I'm leaning towards it being Klick at the current moment

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

@HPE who do you think Kira is?

-Black

this one has NO fucking clue
if it wasn't elo it'd just say to kill gob and see what happens.

thought u were on my side. What changed

Are you gonna put HPE back in the solve now that it has been mean to you?

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

I think its just gob

What prompted this thought? Like were you reading over my post, gob's ISO, other stuff, what

-Black

[CUDDLE TIME]

I think its just gob

What prompted this thought? Like were you reading over my post, gob's ISO, other stuff, what

-Black

the only reason I have for suspecting this could be wrong is I'm not convinced RR wasn't scum lying last gameday

especially the 'just get gob next' phrase feels weird because he wasn't even really pushing the slot before, I was the one doing that

but if the followers are aureal and hu tao, then its just gob. it was a pure LHF slot that none of kira's followers went after. and d2 before aureal was outed she was doing everything not to go there.

I am also more convinced that HPE is town after reading your post about it and seeing how HPE is interacting in the game in real time.

This feels like a townie post tbh

-Black