Mafia Invictus Redux [Game Over]

[Fey]

Hi.

[Fey]

VOTE: Datisi

Let's build this up for a bit.

[Fey]

OK so, I don't like posts 32 or 34 because I don't like the way they are hopping on to Datisi this early. 39 Is not the same in my mind.

As for Datisi, I think they are pretty good at faking tone as scum, at least at the start of the game, I don't have a read on them right now. I don't consider that to be contradictory to the above because I am not reading them as scum

How do you feel about his lack of reaction to those votes?

Even if early, and even if some aren't serious, they're there. One of them had a... nudge, in Datisi's direction. ("Did you roll scum again?")

And then there's just not an indication that this is a worry in his head. Towny or scummy to you?

[Fey]

One of them had a... nudge, in Datisi's direction. ("Did you roll scum again?")

I think calling that a nudge is being generous

What do they expect Datisi to say in response to that?

I see it as them low-key giving reasoning for their vote (they suspect Datisi)

Maybe, but it's something that has his name in it and even if it's a rhetorical question it could... bait in some interaction? Where I feel in a game with limited posts you might want to take up that... intro, so that you can talk about something like "haha why are you guys all voting me."

I don't expect a reply to that statement specifically but rather a broader acknowledgement or broaching of what's going on.

I dislike you zeroing in on the specific statement when I -feel- the sentiment I was posting about was fairly obvious but meh, for now.

[Fey]

@Dunn, fair enough then. Why do you think that it was towny?

@Datisi, what reply did you have?

[Fey]

I liked that you seemed to have a lot to talk about after my post 50 instead of disappearing from the thread after voting Datisi

And I thought it was reasonable too

I don't really have a reply to this other than "okay, it doesn't make me go hmmm" but it's acknowledged.

(I feel an obligation to keep things neater I guess, with fewer posts, and not trying to like.. lead people down rabbit holes of trying to see if I have replies when I don't).

@Datisi, what reply did you have?

i get wagoned early in the game literally all the time now. i'm awkward at the start of the game because i never know what to do.

i didn't have a response to the votes because nothing good comes from responding to them. why are they voting me? because i'm awkward. no shit. getting into an argument about it now would just make me look desperate, and thus, even more awkward. just play the game normally, they'll either see the error of their ways or they're going to have to justify their vote on me once i have actual content out.

do you think me ignoring the votes on me is scummy? why?

I mean, from my perspective ignoring things that are happening around you/about you is a worse look than making a genuine effort, and it feels... bad, scummy, whatever word, that you are pre-emptively going "well I'm awkward so I can't, or won't" (yes these aren't your exact words but I get that feeling) and you're letting it slide and then everyone wastes the pressure and nothing's gained from it. People might be voting you because they want to read you and the content you provide from that.

Especially in a game where you have to be frugal and can't just spew out endless thoughts, having an in to conversation (why are you all voting me?) is of greater benefit than usual.

(However, if nothing else engaging this sidelines the issue of not responding to the wagon/awkwardness I guess? Maybe?)

[Fey]

@fey, i'll be providing content at my own pace, irregardless of if they're voting me or not. why is the onus on me to have to interact with the naked votes on me rather than on them to give me something to actually respond to within their votes?

It's not an end-all, be-all "you MUST reply or else" situation, because you're not being ran up for anything more than I guess, alleged awkwardness? From people before me. No one can make you do anything, and despite this conversation I am aware that you aren't me and we might view this differently, but... it's just an opportunity I'd think a lot of people would take if they wanted to get into hunting and meaning it, rather than letting it sluice off like water.

~

I think this has potential to be a fundamental disagreement in how we view early wagons/what we might do individually, so I don't have anything else to add on this topic for now; I don't think us going back and forth will do good for either of our post counts either, so I'm going to let this topic die down for now and let you do your thing.

[Fey]

Limitations are so limiting. I love and hate how limiting limits tend to be when it comes to how they limit you. It's very limiting and limit? Post office post limit limit break limit postmodernism, limit limiting limit 125 posts limit limit; maximum ceiling cap limit post restraint brake limit.

Stop limit post 125 curtailment diminution lessening limit post limit post limit. 125 posts limit limiting not more than 125.

Reduction damper upper limit buffer post 125 limitations restrictions tax upper limit dayphase emergency post limit. Vote cap questions limit.
Reserve limit post replace-in 125 posts. Slot dayphase limit!

Entire game keep track limitation post restriction 127 minus 2 game limit.

I like 11, Datisi generally looks good in my eyes. 24 hints at actual scum hunting, which is always nice.

VP's 25 is quite good. It's a jokey statement; but it feels like a joke a townie would come up with more than scum would.

48 has some pretty solid vibes, honestly! 27 reads like having a want to solve. Bit of mindmeld. Overall a bit of a townread on fire.


VOTE: takotsubo syndrome
Definitely want more there

What do you think of the content after your last referenced posts? We disagree on at least one (but how many, I won't say now) read here, so I'm curious on your perspective of what comes after.

~

Also, I'm stopping posting when I hit 18 for the day. I want to mete out what I say so that I have an even number everyday.

[Fey]

@Kovu -- Given our past record in games I might not interact with you a lot; this may seem hypocritical given my criticisms of Datisi but I feel we end up going in circles when we are in games with one another as I cannot understand your logic prior. I am reading your posts though, and if something is genuinely pressing that you need my reply on, please let me know. Otherwise, I feel my posts will be better spent elsewhere lest I end up spiraling out of irritation towards you.

[Fey]

I want to say this is Marci's towngame off the top of my head. Not freezing up, replying/responding to a few different things. Seems out of the scope for her from what I recall.

[Fey]

You think she's town for replying to things?

To this level, yeah.

She's frozen up when called out pretty bad before. I've played a scum game with her since then that I'd need to like... read back over to chart her ~evolution~ as a player but even then I feel her focus was fairly single minded even in how she presented things.

[Fey]

I don't think it's entirely applicable anymore either, but it's still something that I fall back on.

Holiday Dance Party, on a skim, makes me think of her as... timid and unsure, I guess? The format's different than traditional mafia, but even then the energy/mood feels subdued there compared to here.

On that note, I'll return tomorrow morning. Didn't even get up to my limit, yay.

[Fey]

Kovu has a tendency to be self-contradictory and erratic a lot in play. It can be a lot to try to follow sometimes. Give them a few days to see what they do/vote/etc and judge from there.

[Fey]

@Kovu: I think that... it’s hard to change how you think about games entirely. But I’m not mad or angered at you. That’s genuinely how I see your play and I was frank about why I might interact with you less. Similarly, Val asked a question about your play and I answered the way I best think you’re read.

I’ll post more relevant content later tonight.

[Fey]

Beetlejuice.

~

Is there anything in particular I should read or respond to. My enthusiasm for like, trying because Fun Game came and went as it almost always does but I'm around. Otherwise I'll probably read and catchup and then like... not do a lot.

[Fey]

VOTE: Bell

Skimmed Lavar and Bell, Lavar feels... in his own little world sort of deal. Like the read on Dunnstral of all people as potentially shady feels out there in a world where scum!Lavar probably doesn't need to be right now. Is a weird place to fixate. Just seems like he's doing his own thing.

Bell feels on the fringes and like. I dunno. I have an expectation of something "more" as vague as it is, but he feels very shady with the things he's posting and also just like "eh, whatever" to questions, all that. A presence that doesn't really want to be around at all but knows he has to be, and like... throwing out whatever thoughts because he has to, given prior games where he spews out his thoughts and boom everyone reads him right.

@Someone, I think VP asked me about Marci and what she could/couldn't post, compare 213 to like, Holiday Dance Party, where she was a lot more sheepish I feel. Here she's all attitude and bite and I feel that's more of a hallmark of her as town.

[Fey]

VOTE: Fey

Gestures for you to explain.

[Fey]

Squints.

[Fey]

What's popping aha.

[Fey]

Hi.

[Fey]

My brain turns to mush every single time I try to play. So I've been playing TFT instead.

Skimmed and think that Balter could be scum based on reaction, IDK. Doing stuff like calling people ridiculous, hornets nest, etc etc, characterizing himself as just messing around to like, minimize his own behavior and overblow people's reactions?

I just looked at his iso without the context but I am ready to buzz and sting.

I feel like I had a few people a day ago who I was like mentally saying omg townblock but then I didn't post at all so I forgot about them.

Throw whatever you want at me before I go back to video game.

VOTE: VP Balter

[Fey]

r.e. Val I'm unsure if he's scum just based off of having played with him as it previously, I feel like he cast a wide net and was like, all over the place covering every base with what he said where here he feels narrowed down. It's limiting and isolating how he's playing, idk.

[Fey]

It was scum in a newbie like... a good while ago, I repped in and he had laid a lotta groundwork and then we won.

[Fey]

Fey, are you an alt?

Ya.

[Fey]

To save the posts for you of asking/questioning, etc, I'm Ydrasse.

[Fey]

To save the posts for you of asking/questioning, etc, I'm Ydrasse.

now that you've outed - this was my reasoning for suspecting fey. i figured it was ydrasse but her questioning of me felt very boring an unexcited. which is very much not how excited-town!ydrasse plays and instead feels like she's trying to appear solvy in a game she does not want to be playing.

You literally played in this game with me.

Also it's weird to frame this as... an excitement thing, like. What. That doesn't make sense that you have to qualify it as excited = town or whatever you're doing here.

[Fey]

Like I'm actually a little baffled of where the "excitement" thing like... comes into play at all, or why you're zeroed in on that as a reason to suspect me when I think that my

scum

games are far more likely to have energy levels in them at the start versus town where I'm happy for a day and then just don't care.

It feels like a wild misrepresentation or misunderstanding of me as a player. I don't know if that's inherently scummy, honestly, but it's just... baffling.

[Fey]

Also it's weird to frame this as... an excitement thing, like. What. That doesn't make sense that you have to qualify it as excited = town or whatever you're doing here.

the most recent game i played with you is the one i'm using to read your emotional state as that game you linked was six months ago. you were EXTREMELY excited to play town in spring fling and i know you dislike playing wolf.

your argument with me early game felt like you were grasping at something to use to appear as if you're solving when you didn't feel like playing.

Oh, I think I understand part of the disconnect here.

I play radically different on Ydrasse compared to my alts. Even if it's not different... logically I guess, I can't change how I think, I tend towards being... more like this during them. The alts that are obviously me but I don't out and say it but I type fancier.

Ydrasse is me as... Ydrasse, socially. This is me as Me, sort of Ydrasse, sort of not.

Also... I don't dislike playing wolf at all... in fact I enjoy it a lot, maybe more than town, just not when I roll it 10 times in a row.

[Fey]

This is a game I am in.

[Fey]

I have a vague feeling there’s a townblock forming if not today than after a flip tomorrow it’ll be easier to define which is heartening. Go team.

Feel a little less good about... hm, unsure if it’s just lowposters just being mafia this game or like people not remembering lowposters and wanting to keep alive the majority of people they have a better grasp on or... something.

Brain-jello.

[Fey]

You have seen me have literally zero spark in town games before, and have the time of my life in scum ones, so the comparison doesn’t really work.

I have fun sometimes and sometimes I don’t depending on how into mafia I am.

See: Romance, Mare, etc.

[Fey]

Hypothermia for the scum variant of those two.

[Fey]

I’ve jumped around in vote a few times. I’ve given some takes that I think should be more memorable (Lavar town, Marci town). Not a lot but I’m not going to force myself to give a lot.

Just because you don’t remember it doesn’t mean it’s not there though. Shrug.

[Fey]

Maybe I’m washed but I still don’t feel Lavar is really scummy.

[Fey]

Obligatory I still think Lavar is town.

I don’t particularly like the alternative of Marci but I don’t have a great grasp of what else I would do wagonwise. Probably not Luke/Kovu/fire/gorilla and shrug at the rest. My reasons for those names is just memory of goodvibes when I was reading closer than I am now.

VOTE: Marcistar

[Fey]

[Fey]

Meh. Last time I tried to read him I tunneled horribly so I wasn’t here. I’d give him a meh I guess, seems proactive and trying to do things so I’d give him a pass for now.

[Fey]

VOTE: Dwlee

Choo choo.

[Fey]

You should probably explain that.

[Fey]

The info we get from it, the people behind the push and the nature of it being a flashwagon all point to it being a better wagon than Dwlee.

I don't think so. How are any of the factors you mentioned different between my wagon and the dwlee wagon?

(gorilla, Lukewarm, fireisredsir, Val89, Meuh, Dwlee99, Datisi, Bell) are the Lavar voters.
(Kovu, Fey, Lady Lambdadelta, Gammagooey, VP Baltar, SirCakez) are the Dwlee voters.

Now that's from Lukewarm's votecount and it was different at the time you asked, but the general idea stays the same. People I generally townread more and trust their judgement more on Lavar than on Dwlee.

I guess the Dwlee wagon was kind of a flashwagon? Though it seemed less fast, and is less good in response to another flashwagon if that makes any sense

People have more clearly defined their positions regarding you than regarding Dwlee. Thus, it gives more information.

The lack of re-evaluation in the face of a townflip and having said this is an atrocious look. You generally townread and trust them more, and they were wrong. But instead of considering "hm, these people I voted with, we killed a townie, what's going on there..." you instead choose to ignore that and go "yeah I think scum was farming towncred"?

That's the least charitable stance I think you could take; it's logical but in the context of a townflip you're just continuing down the same path you laid out yesterday which so far hasn't went so well.

Why do you think I'm scum on Dwlee's wagon, again? Why is Dwlee even town to begin with?

VOTE: Meuh

[Fey]

Val, I'd like to hear more of your thoughts now that Datisi is dead.

Same for you marci, since you both kind of tunneled there to the exclusion of a lot else yesterday.

Oh ok, you’re scum

Baltar immediately taking advantage of the death to shade other people

Equally I think this is an uncharitable evaluation of VP's post. Datisi is dead, people had takes around Datisi, some strong. It's natural to want to see how these people view things differently now that a slot that took up a lot of their thoughts is dead.

[Fey]

Player	Votes
LavarManos (11)	gorilla (790), Lukewarm (796), fireisredsir (800), Val89 (803), Meuh (822), Dwlee99 (953), Datisi (962), Bell (1014), Dunnstral (1090), VP Baltar (1123), Enchant (1134)
Dwlee99 (5)	Kovu (1009), Fey (1011), Lady Lambdadelta (1013), Gammagooey (1022), SirCakez (1034)
Datisi (2)	LavarManos (950), marcistar (1116)
Not Voting (2)	Malakittens (130), Rhyme and Reason (964)

I'm about here right now, readwise; I feel like a lot of these null ones will go one way or another throughout the day.

Few thoughts:

I don't think Dwlee's posts that you just quoted feel like town, Meuh. It's just justification for the Lavar votes and a bit of reconciliatory posting in 1054, but those don't do anything for me.

I also think LLD dying here means that she was the nightkill who shot Datisi, rather than the other way around. I think that points to what content she did give having been either 1) pointing correctly to Dwlee/Bell or 2) a frame, which... eh? I'm less inclined to think mafia wanted to frame than just kill someone who could exert a great deal of pressure on them when she's town.

Also I do think the Dwlee wagon is probably all pure, at max one scum on it. I'm working off the assumption that there are 4 scum in this game so maybe one on the Dwlee or not voting, the rest on the Lavar wagon to push it through because it really wasn't going anywhere. Probably in Gamma/Cakez if there is one but eh. I don't really feel like Kovu as scum just decides to start an EOD competing wagon to a town one. Just doesn't... feel like her from experience, but this is without a lot of back referencing.

Feels like I am doing some preflipping mentally so I'll sort that out through the day (Meuh scum attacking VP -> point to VP town but this is flimsy).

That's about it right now.

p-edit: I highly disagree with the idea that Lady's posting points to the people she voted being town. That seems backwards to me.

[Fey]

p-edit: I highly disagree with the idea that Lady's posting points to the people she voted being town. That seems backwards to me.

huh in what way? in my mind scum would avoid killing people who scumread them, so they don't die

Despite the Invictus shot being a threat, I don't think that people are going to just say "well, they -might- shoot us, so we can't kill them". It's probably on their minds the same way that catching any PR is, but... you can't just let them float along. Something about Lady's posting has to be threatening enough, I believe, to give them a reason to want her dead beyond just "well she's not gonna Invictus any of us so let's get her."

[Fey]

I’m struggling to word this but I think it’s a dangerous assumption to think a dead person’s scumreads are clearing; there is always the potential to be shot at night the same way you can be tracked/copped/etc, but like.

For LLD specifically I’m willing for now to accept that Bell is cleared for now by virtue of his actions. Sure. Bell was one of the people she suspected and did so with more... interaction? To it. Oomph. I think it is perhaps reasonable to assume she would have shot Bell... a town clearing PR.

But why exactly in this situation would a mafia Dwlee be cleared?? Like everyone’s kind of hand waving it imo. “Cleared because scumread” is such an insane thought process to me even factoring in the mechanics.

Also because “clearing” LLD’s scumreads narrows down the POE for a wagon that flipped town D1 and that is...???

[Fey]

Like to me this is indulging a bit in WIFOM I guess which, nose wrinkle, but everyone is kind of just going “yep they’re alllll cleared” and isn’t that... a risk worth taking for mafia if they can feel confident they won’t get shot, let alone any role that could protect people from a shot/stop it/etc?

[Fey]

Like if anyone has a ~really strong towncase~ or something for Dwlee I’d actually appreciate it versus just giving the pass for reasons I don’t think are strong. Meuh gave some at day start but I didn’t find it compelling.

[Fey]

Also it’s pretty hurtful even though it shouldn’t be to be told that because I don’t come to the same conclusions that I am... not trying to apply my logic even if it goes against the logic being seen as “correct” which is uh, perhaps why I might seem upsetish right now.

[Fey]

(Yes whatever random “AtE” but whether or not people agree with me I think it is just bad to clear on night kills alone and basically just feels like an entire aspect of why people die is being thrown out entirely.)

[Fey]

A Bell one was more telegraphed imho given her final posts which put more meat to the idea she disliked his posting versus a vote on Dwlee. Also that she had voted Bell before.

I do actually think though this might be more emblematic of my mafia game funnily enough because on Ydrasse I’m pretty go with the flow-y and throw thoughts out there but don’t try to do as much as I do here whereas as scum I am almost always doing something.

Maybe this is just a more lowkey FFXIV for me or something. But shrug I do t think that I can offer more than self rambling without back checking my games.

[Fey]

The strength it takes of me to open this game.

[Fey]

VOTE: Dwlee

Avengers assemble.

[Fey]

Arguments about who I'd kill are interesting given I certainly wouldn't be the one making the decision for who to kill given my activity

I've skimmed, ish, will try to be around later.

Idle thought that I had before but this post is weird. Kinda feels like wrong reasons irritation or not even irritation but like. *Hand waves.* Something in that world to me.

[Fey]

Arguments about who I'd kill are interesting given I certainly wouldn't be the one making the decision for who to kill given my activity

I've skimmed, ish, will try to be around later.

Idle thought that I had before but this post is weird. Kinda feels like wrong reasons irritation or not even irritation but like. *Hand waves.* Something in that world to me.

Wrong reasons irritation implies I'm town because the kill spec was all to say I was town

Irritation isn’t the right word but it’s the closest I can find to say this post feels like you’re looking at the town speculating about the night kill you would or wouldn’t make and this quip is like a bit... TMI I guess is better wording, that you know you didn’t have input on a night kill but you were witness to it all.

[Fey]

Sure, that’s a possibility too.

But the vibe I got erred towards it being out of place/weird feeling because it just was like... “Of all the things to comment on?”

[Fey]

Literally anything. You haven’t really given much as to your reads/thoughts/...anything beyond a few fleeting posts that aren’t helpful in terms of like. Solving. (Why am I partnered with/nightkill comments are interesting/the tell thing with Gamma.)

Like you just don’t seem to care... at all about doing so much as voting and I don’t see a reason not to pressure you. I get that you’re busy IRL but even the popins you do throw in are... tepid.

[Fey]

I was Dwlee’s partner in Geriatric, lmao.

Anyways.

Don’t be feely vote for Dwlee.

[Fey]

Dwlee can you now explain how what you post in 1711 relates to this game

So you've pointed out something in another game, but where does it come up in this game? The so-called derisive OMGUS, as it were.

Also I'm interested in what the tonal differences you mentioned in 1660 are

You are being more differential I think. Like posts like these feel very appeasy is the way I would put it, which is also what Noraa has described as being your scum game

What part of these are appeasing...?

[Fey]

Skimmed blah blah still want kill Dwlee. Kinda feel like Meuh has +equity if Dwlee flips maf or whatever the kids say for the back and forth on Dunn and Dwlee but now “reconsidering” and then going to Dwlee at the end where their elim feels a lot more probable. Or maybe Meuh is just a waffle wolf. Whom knows!

[Fey]

Skimmed blah blah still want kill Dwlee. Kinda feel like Meuh has +equity if Dwlee flips maf or whatever the kids say for the back and forth on Dunn and Dwlee but now “reconsidering” and then going to Dwlee at the end where their elim feels a lot more probable. Or maybe Meuh is just a waffle wolf. Whom knows!

Help me bus question mark

Three dots followed by thinking emoji.

I’m pretty tunneled in on you dying today.

[Fey]

If people want to kill Meuh I’ll entertain the wagon.

[Fey]

If people want to kill Meuh I’ll entertain the wagon.

Why do you want it is the question?

I just said on the last page and I haven’t forgotten about their opening today either.

(...because it’s about all I was really here for.)

[Fey]

@Dwlee I’m like half paying attention but I think that your vibes here aren’t what I’m used to from you being town and it did harken a bit to the Geriatric. I disagree with the appeasy characterization and overall Im just eh I guess.

Can give more attention l8r.

[Fey]

Scum me has fun and goes wild.

As it is I'm waiting 'till tomorrow to get into things, yes I have a reason, yes you can ask me about it tomorrow.

[Fey]

I sure did.

[Fey]

Unwnd's my little scrunkly.

[Fey]

Scum me has fun and goes wild.

As it is I'm waiting 'till tomorrow to get into things, yes I have a reason, yes you can ask me about it tomorrow.

I don't actually remember scum you ever having fun. But I'm glad you probably had fun as scum at one point and I hope this is true irregardless.

I'm powerful now and openwolf.

Awoo.

[Fey]

Anyways,

Still voting Dwlee, if that wagon's not a thing then RIP. I don't actually know how to read Dunn.

If Meuh flares up I'll go there. Sure. Why not.

[Fey]

Meh.

I’m a two shot detective. Not outing my results since they’re useless and not entirely clearing so I don’t want people clinging to them later if I’m elimmed.

[Fey]

Yeah, you’re right. I’m fake claiming something while in danger that does nothing to give a reason to keep me alive. Nice catch, Dunn.

[Fey]

Scum me has fun and goes wild.

As it is I'm waiting 'till tomorrow to get into things, yes I have a reason, yes you can ask me about it tomorrow.

[Fey]

I mean I think all the clearing power is fake somewhere but I was disinterested in tackling it until today. Even if it’s less likely to get a guilty overall I wanted to burn through my shots in the event I got killed or Invictus shot.

I investigated Datisi and Dwlee. My Invictus shot was on Datisi most of D1 until I moved to investigate, and Dwlee should be an obvious choice as to why I investigated.

The only thing I get from my results is Dwlee is slightly less likely to be mafia now, but even then I’m leery of dying at some point and this being used somehow as a clear when they might just have a specific person killing FSR.

[Fey]

The fuck.

[Fey]

>____> Okay.

I’ll be useful later tonight, at work right now but with a lot of flipped town VCs seem good.

[Fey]

Tangential note but I’m also proud of marci for improving so much as she’s played. She’s come a long way and she had me fooled.

[Fey]

Eh, didn’t feel as >:( about Datisi and I was more interested in supporting a wagon that wasn’t Lavar than like. Really digging into something.

[Fey]

Oh, and for posterity I changed my Invictus shot from Dwlee yesterday to Enchant when I chose to investigate them.

[Fey]

I mean, a doctor claim is going to have a lot more reason to keep it alive than “I am a detective who has used all of their shots.”

If I cared about preserving myself I would have lied and said I had more available.

[Fey]

I mean, a doctor claim is going to have a lot more reason to keep it alive than “I am a detective who has used all of their shots.”

If I cared about preserving myself I would have lied and said I had more available.

I simple don't believe you.

YOU LITERALLY HAD 1/18 CHANCE TO FIND ATTACKING MAFIA VIA DETECTIVE AND YOU USING IT INSTANTLY?

Fucking why

In the event I get killed or Invictus shot, as I said.

[Fey]

Yeah. I can see whoever tried to kill that night.

[Fey]

Also I can see if Invictus shots try to go off too.

[Fey]

Yep. Normal detective just with Invictus caveats.

[Fey]

Quick glance at EOD VC, I’ll support a Meuh wagon too.

VOTE: SirCakez

[Fey]

His iso seems pretty set in stone on Marci too for like the entire game, bussing probable.

[Fey]

Also this might be mean but I don’t actually think town Enchant cares that much about how I use my role.

[Fey]

Enchant you kind of just sound like this game to me.

So Enchant

What exactly are your thoughts on the game as a whole

We are in ass.

Also, WHY THE FUCK YOU CAN'T EVEN DECIDE WHO TO LIM BUT THEN "WOW ENCHANT THAT WAS WORST PLAY".

Like, i even told you what to do.

[Fey]

Enchant you kind of just sound like this game to me.

So Enchant

What exactly are your thoughts on the game as a whole

We are in ass.

Also, WHY THE FUCK YOU CAN'T EVEN DECIDE WHO TO LIM BUT THEN "WOW ENCHANT THAT WAS WORST PLAY".

Like, i even told you what to do.

How i can sound, you literally reading letters.
Voiceless letters.

My sweet Enchant, why did you role mafia.

[Fey]

Seal of approval.

[Fey]

Yeah looking at EOD when Marci was giving her suspicions she had me/gorilla/Cakez. Just gonna rule of three this and move on assuming Cakez is a hit.

[Fey]

Kinda think Gamma could fit as a partner to Cakez/Marci too. Gave reads that matter one was a scumlean on Marci, toe lean on Cakez. Usual places to slot partners I feel but dunno if Gamma would feel a need to take harsher stances.

[Fey]

And it is true that Meuh’s vote cascaded into the entire flip.

Marci/Gamma/Cakez/Enchant...?

[Fey]

Gamma, do you think that Marci gave three reads in a place of pressure that did not include her partner?

[Fey]

Also I think it’s weird that you said “didn’t I just go on this rant...” In a game that was months ago as if it has a lot of relevancy.

And assuming that I’m not using other info too is... pretty weird and assuming the worst.

[Fey]

Shrug, I kind of like how Dunn is approaching things and get the vibe that Gamma’s showing up here to try and shove me out over Cakez rn.

[Fey]

She was a distancer, he was a biased, can I make it anymoooore obvious.

[Fey]

Autocorrect ruined my song and i had to walk away to help someone AGHHHH.

[Fey]

What’s the list of claims so far?

[Fey]

Menalque you are very funny for suddenly thinking you know how to read me.

[Fey]

Also small thing but Gamma listing off my votes seems like. Contextless because my early vote was sure, pressure, but the rest of them were expressly to not vote Lavar.

Like I guess putting “caveat she doesn’t like the wagon” is... weird to me wrt Marci because I was actively doing something to dismantle a town wagon and I don’t... really need to vote a partner when I could just not at that point and not risk it. Dunno. It seems like a lot of work to just have one pet pocket that I protect.

[Fey]

I think it’s a bad look for you that you tried to keep dwlee in the lim pool after I explained why that didn’t make sense and now he’s flipped town

Like I said, this is all pending discussion with S_S but there’s nothing that particularly sells me on you being town

Also, shutting on my previous reads has never convinced me to not push someone, but scum have tried to use it to discredit me when I’ve been on them before. So while you’re welcome to go for that angle, it’s not helping you here

~Rhyme

It’s more that we’ve played a ton of games together and I’m sad that now’s the time you get confident on me and it’s wrong.

[Fey]

Also in the interest of trying to work with everyone, I’ll self vote and be the lim today if every single townie points their Invictus shot at Cakez.

[Fey]

Kovu’s just town.

[Fey]

I think this game has a big potential to make me upset so I’m gonna check out for a while.

Moving my Invictus shot to Cakez. If you’re town and voting me please do that too if you want to kill me, because you’re wrong. Thanks.

[Fey]

Whatever.

[Fey]

If you’re going to fucking vote me put your Invictus shot on SirCakez.

[Fey]

Like I don’t care what else happens if town doesn’t wanna throw at least aim to kill my counterwagon.

[Fey]

And don’t move it or get cold feet because you’re just going to be throwing I don’t care.

[Fey]

Rhyme you never get to claim you know how to read me ever.

[Fey]

Gamma/Cakez/Enchant/Maybe Dunn.

There’s your team.

I don’t have the energy to fight this elim.

[Fey]

If you’re going to fucking vote me put your Invictus shot on SirCakez.

I will put this on every single page.

[Fey]

Tomato tomato tomato.

[Fey]

Like Christ I am literally begging every townie to shoot Cakez when I die and you think you get the neighborhood of your dreams.

You’re saying how it’s good and townie and helpful and in the same breath saying he’s scumclaiming if he doesn’t but if he’s scum now why would he even bother when I am campaigning for him to die next.

[Fey]

I hate this stupid game.

[Fey]

Literally could just have an ounce of common sense and realize Cakez is scum which is a lot nicer than some selfish plan for the sake of a neighborhood.

[Fey]

Everytime I post in this stupid thread I start crying which is cool. Very cool! Goodbye.

[Fey]

Friendly reminder SirCakez should be shot tonight.

[Fey]

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=87655&user_select%5B%5D=26092

ISO from FFXIV where he was scum. Feel the same stalling moments are here too. People can compare.

[Fey]

Also lol @ his PT posting picking up but not the thread posting because it sure is easier to post privately to a few than to everyone.

[Fey]

Someone said it had picked up or was better or something to that effect. Kovu I think.

[Fey]

Lmao.

We all have private threads but does Gamma need to post that in his notes PT and if so why.

[Fey]

Also one of the links at the end randomly works.

[Fey]

I mean we all know he’s gonna say it was from the personal PT, right?

[Fey]

I just don’t know why some links would be available and some wouldn’t from a notes PT post.

[Fey]

Yeah lmao.

Feels like a post that long is best served to a team asking “this good folks?”

[Fey]

VOTE: Gamma

If this was Gamma playing well and slipping I am So Sorry.

[Fey]

Laaaaaaame.

UNVOTE:

[Fey]

What’s the Dunn case again?

I remember he gave a defense of me in SH that was pretty pocket-y and he has engaged me fairly enough here that I’m curious.

[Fey]

So we should vote Enchant.

[Fey]

Really just feel like ATP it’s Gamma furiously trying to cover for his partners who aren’t like. Doing anything.

[Fey]

VOTE: Enchanr

[Fey]

We should just stop saying blah blah Invictus Enchant he will be taken care of and just kill him.

[Fey]

Kinda think Gamma could fit as a partner to Cakez/Marci too. Gave reads that matter one was a scumlean on Marci, toe lean on Cakez. Usual places to slot partners I feel but dunno if Gamma would feel a need to take harsher stances.

[Fey]

Yeah lmao.

Feels like a post that long is best served to a team asking “this good folks?”

On the subject of scum!gamma, you working theory of a few pages ago is that, while acknowledging the possibility of origination from the notes pt, you thought it was a scum slip because its the type of post best served posted in a team pt if you had access to one, but after mod confirmation it did indeed come from a notes pt, your thought is "still scum though"?

Yes because him using a notes PT isn’t clearing and my belief came before the PT discussion.

The scum PT discussion was something I wanted to be true very much if only because the act of pushing out Gamma right now is impossible for me and it felt like a quick way for everyone to see the truth.

[Fey]

This is true, I’m not likely to listen to anyone that doesn’t do much. The things that make me doubt myself is that your reasoning is terrible (and presumably, you’d be more aware of this as scum and try something better) and the fact you haven’t done anything actively anti-town.

Fey can you unpack why you got so upset this game? I genuinely don’t know if you’re upset or not. Or why you’re upset.

I am an emotional person who is prone to crying. This game is frustrating to me because it feels to me that my claim and how I did it should make sense only from a town POV. I understand however not everyone will feel that way but it’s still upsetting to me when I’m not believed as town.

I’d cry as mafia though too tbh.

[Fey]

OK, but having said specifically that it was the sort of post that is best served in a team pt if you had access to one, finding out that it didn't hasn't made you think that's indicative gamma doesn't have access to team PT, like, at all?

Mm, not really. I equally could buy he just did a big catchup privately with a team that wouldn’t/couldn’t revise that kind of thing.

I don’t think we should talk about this topic further than that though for previously stated reasons. Ultimately it’s just something I’ve thrown away thinking about and I’ve moved my vote away from there for now to someone else who has better odds imo of being mafia.

[Fey]

Most of this game is vibes for me.

Just feels like Enchant is being very noisy and loud. And not contributing too much. Which while I think some people might go “yeah duh” from past experience I’m reminded more the scum!Enchant who repped into PYP and just yelled a lot and did... about the same frankly here as there.

Tangentially he’s also being defended by Gamma. I try not to preflip thoigh even if it’s tempting.

Also r.e SirCakez I think I got more into the idea of him being scum today when I got the sense that he was avoiding the game a bit, hands off, etc. I’ve got my Invictus shot at him still and that probably won’t change but again, echoes of games past. FFXIV was different circumstances in that I had a hard guilty on him so he had to react more aggressively there and here it feels softer so... eh still thinking about that. Willing to cede ground a bit and let him do the neighborize thing.

[Fey]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

[Fey]

I can’t I’m sorry.

UNVOTE:

[Fey]

I just don't have the motivation this game me sorry.

I wasn't pointing my Invictus shot at Cakez last night I will Say That.

[Fey]

I currently have my Invictus pointed squarely at Gamma and have had him in my solve since yesterday so... weird team concept.

[Fey]

Meh.

I think Gamma and Gorilla are probably mafia. The former is actually I think the only mafia on the D1 Dwlee wagon compared to the main wagon having like 2 mafia on it, Gorilla off wagon voted from Marci to Lavar and then Lavar died. Also the night action stuff. IDK the last one.

[Fey]

Vote Count 1.9

FLAVOR

A cheer erupts from the crowd as Elon takes the stage at the Asimov SuperLARP Conference 2022

"Ladies, gentlemen, aspiring androids and cybergoths, today is a big day! I'm here to announce that our new Gigafactory at Selah will be pumping out our first Cybertrucks starting April 2023!"

He sweats nervously, remembering that the Gigafactory hasn't even been built yet. Probably the government's fault.

"I first thought of the Cybertruck while playing Superman 64 and wishing I was in one of the cars. As you can see, behind me is our latest revision with the "Cybertank" tread modification. So stay on the lookout you January 6ers, you might get up to Capitol Hill yet!"

Laughter erupts and the crowd is enamored. Quick to seize the chance, Elon speaks.

"Here's another thing to get excited for: I have a special surprise for you today! Can I get a volunteer from the audience?"

Player	Votes
LavarManos (11)	gorilla (790), Lukewarm (796), fireisredsir (800), Val89 (803), Meuh (822), Dwlee99 (953), Datisi (962), Bell (1014), Dunnstral (1090), VP Baltar (1123), Enchant (1134)
Dwlee99 (5)	Kovu (1009), Fey (1011), Lady Lambdadelta (1013), Gammagooey (1022), SirCakez (1034)
Datisi (2)	LavarManos (950), marcistar (1116)
Not Voting (2)	Malakittens (130), Rhyme and Reason (964)

With 20 players alive, it takes 11 votes to eliminate.

An elimination has been achieved! Day 1 is over, stand by for resolution.

Spoiler: Postcount Tracker

Player	Daystart postcount	Reserves
Bell	0	10
Fey	0	10
fireisredsir	0	10
Lady Lambdadelta	0	10
Malakittens	0	10
Lukewarm	0	10
Dunnstral	0	10
Rhyme and Reason	0	10
Meuh	0	10
Val89	0	10
marcistar	0	10
Dwlee99	0	10
Gammagooey	0	10
Kovu	0	10
VP Baltar	0	10
Datisi	0	10
LavarManos	0	10
Enchant	0	10
SirCakez	0	10
gorilla	0	10

Posts are capped at 125 posts per slot per dayphase. Please see the Ruleset and FAQ for more information and tips on tracking your postcount.

^ Like two VCS before this Marci was at 7 and then Gorilla switched and the votes on Lavar piled up. So mafia probably trying to save marci.

[Fey]

Actually going further if mafia had to pile on to save marci that’s meh for Dunn and Fire.

[Fey]

Because like looking at that VC it’s like. Mostly flipped town. Marci in her own world. And then Kovu (I think is town) me (I know I’m town) and Gamma (meh but possibly town in this world).

[Fey]

Oh yeah Meuh too.

[Fey]

VOTE: Gorilla

[Fey]

I kinda forgot Meuh existed and you just seem angy I said you didn’t look good.

[Fey]

Like I think the sort of weird condescending disappointed tone is just like. “What.”

[Fey]

Gorilla I think should be the vote today. With the night action being blocked despite nothing else being blocked that probably should have like Bell’s it’s just too convenient.

[Fey]

Like I think the sort of weird condescending disappointed tone is just like. “What.”

i don't think i was condescending or disappointed? im saying it doesn't make sense for you to have that thought as town

“You know better than this” is 100% a weirdchamp moment.

[Fey]

...what do I gain from bussing yesterday when I have like a lot of other options.

[Fey]

I mean I lose when it’s like... pointed out I didn’t ~really commit~ and instead just focused on killing town. Like yeah sure this is all things I can just say but generally whenever I bus I bus to death and not like pithy half-measures.

[Fey]

And then it just becomes “she never really tried to kill Gamma!” Because like everything I’ve done this game except my emotions have been limp.

[Fey]

I currently have my Invictus pointed squarely at Gamma and have had him in my solve since yesterday so... weird team concept.

this was your initial response though? you said that it didn't make sense as a team bc you had gamma in your solve since yesterday and you're saying he's your strongest scumread

saying that you would commit fully or not at all, and wouldn't go halfway is a very different response and a more understandable one. i still take issue with your original response tho

Saying “I have my Invictus pointed there” is a non-thing when someone tries to miselim me because they can just say “we can’t prove that.” It’s not compelling when it comes to material things but on instinct yeah I was like “if only they knew what I knewwww.” It’s not something that I think people will put stock into but it matters to me.

[Fey]

This is so fucking tedious. Most of the people post are going to be scum bickering to muddy the waters and the towns are barely around to speak with.

This is a weird complaint.

[Fey]

Also @fire

viewtopic.php?f=54&t=87057

Read this for an example of how bussing with me happens. (Also note the setup in regards to me *choosing* to bus.)

[Fey]

This is so fucking tedious. Most of the people post are going to be scum bickering to muddy the waters and the towns are barely around to speak with.

This is a weird complaint.

Like to expand. Grousing about having to interact with mafia is like... eh? Yes? This happens like every game?

[Fey]

Meh.

I think Gamma and Gorilla are probably mafia. The former is actually I think the only mafia on the D1 Dwlee wagon compared to the main wagon having like 2 mafia on it, Gorilla off wagon voted from Marci to Lavar and then Lavar died. Also the night action stuff. IDK the last one.

Okay, then who's the third?

Did you read the last line there or what.

[Fey]

This is so fucking tedious. Most of the people post are going to be scum bickering to muddy the waters and the towns are barely around to speak with.

This is a weird complaint.

It's been my complaint since yesterday that we have clears that have been generally ineffectual and limp and have allowed scum to run the game. That has not changed. I know for a fact that most of the people posting right now are scum and arguing with them is useless. That's not really weird at all.

It’s weird to complain about like... a core tenet of the game I guess. I’m like mentally noting you as grumpy complaint-scum who uses that sort of thing to be seen as more... valid? “More frustrated because I care.”

[Fey]

Gamma feels super inflexible this game. Maybe I’m just hypersensitive because I’m in there but it doesn’t feel like Slaughter Hour.

[Fey]

Anyways.

I don’t think my effort levels will crest up again but I’ll float around. If I’m the elim just heed what I’ve said. /shrug

[Fey]

Vote Count 1.9

FLAVOR

A cheer erupts from the crowd as Elon takes the stage at the Asimov SuperLARP Conference 2022

"Ladies, gentlemen, aspiring androids and cybergoths, today is a big day! I'm here to announce that our new Gigafactory at Selah will be pumping out our first Cybertrucks starting April 2023!"

He sweats nervously, remembering that the Gigafactory hasn't even been built yet. Probably the government's fault.

"I first thought of the Cybertruck while playing Superman 64 and wishing I was in one of the cars. As you can see, behind me is our latest revision with the "Cybertank" tread modification. So stay on the lookout you January 6ers, you might get up to Capitol Hill yet!"

Laughter erupts and the crowd is enamored. Quick to seize the chance, Elon speaks.

"Here's another thing to get excited for: I have a special surprise for you today! Can I get a volunteer from the audience?"

Player	Votes
LavarManos (11)	gorilla (790), Lukewarm (796), fireisredsir (800), Val89 (803), Meuh (822), Dwlee99 (953), Datisi (962), Bell (1014), Dunnstral (1090), VP Baltar (1123), Enchant (1134)
Dwlee99 (5)	Kovu (1009), Fey (1011), Lady Lambdadelta (1013), Gammagooey (1022), SirCakez (1034)
Datisi (2)	LavarManos (950), marcistar (1116)
Not Voting (2)	Malakittens (130), Rhyme and Reason (964)

With 20 players alive, it takes 11 votes to eliminate.

An elimination has been achieved! Day 1 is over, stand by for resolution.

Spoiler: Postcount Tracker

Player	Daystart postcount	Reserves
Bell	0	10
Fey	0	10
fireisredsir	0	10
Lady Lambdadelta	0	10
Malakittens	0	10
Lukewarm	0	10
Dunnstral	0	10
Rhyme and Reason	0	10
Meuh	0	10
Val89	0	10
marcistar	0	10
Dwlee99	0	10
Gammagooey	0	10
Kovu	0	10
VP Baltar	0	10
Datisi	0	10
LavarManos	0	10
Enchant	0	10
SirCakez	0	10
gorilla	0	10

Posts are capped at 125 posts per slot per dayphase. Please see the Ruleset and FAQ for more information and tips on tracking your postcount.

^ Like two VCS before this Marci was at 7 and then Gorilla switched and the votes on Lavar piled up. So mafia probably trying to save marci.

Actually going further if mafia had to pile on to save marci that’s meh for Dunn and Fire.

Because like looking at that VC it’s like. Mostly flipped town. Marci in her own world. And then Kovu (I think is town) me (I know I’m town) and Gamma (meh but possibly town in this world).

Oh yeah Meuh too.

You are so angwy and ignoring this. For what?

[Fey]

Like I literally outted a theory “hmm what if the mafia tried to save Marci here?” And then point out yeah look at these votes that happened when marci got ran up.

But you’re too busy being loud and upsetti.

[Fey]

Actually I probably shouldn’t try to bait out a worse response here. If you are town that’s just gonna be sour. Peace!

[Fey]

(That is to say sorry for being mocking. But I have attempted to look at other angles here and you like glossed over it so yeah.)

[Fey]

I descend from my throne to say: I town.

[Fey]

Do you think Gorilla gets that mad at me if we’re paired?

And that I react... back that way? Granted you can say I don’t know how to respond but basically uh. Mocking someone’s reaction is... idk. I’m writing it from my perspective but that seems like a weird way to “bus”.

[Fey]

Is there some reason you kept avoiding answering what the blow up was about?
Are you trying to emulate the core of what your town game amounts to?

I am an emotional person and I do not owe you a reason other than I was upset Rhyme was misreading me. My emotions are present as either alignment and if you think that is what defines my play you do not understand the differences.

[Fey]

I have nothing else to offer you. I linked a game earlier where I was emotional as mafia. I have games where I get emotional as town. I was frustrating that Rhyme misread me and it made me cry. That’s probably an overreaction to a game but I couldn’t really help myself. Maybe I should not have posted about it but I did and it is what it is.

[Fey]

I do agree that anger is an easier emotion to fake than other ones for mafia though and have said such before. It’s just... a tiring thing to fight back against. Even if it is fake, it wears me down to battle. If it is real and Gorilla is town I am sorry that their experience has been unpleasant.

[Fey]

Is there some reason you kept avoiding answering what the blow up was about?
Are you trying to emulate the core of what your town game amounts to?

I am an emotional person and I do not owe you a reason other than I was upset Rhyme was misreading me. My emotions are present as either alignment and if you think that is what defines my play you do not understand the differences.

I did not say you owe me a reason. Nobody owes me anything.
I probably don't understand the differences.

You described your play as town as anger at being misunderstood. This has been pretty much the core of what has happened this game in your slot from my pov because nothing else really feels real or solvey.

I’ve been consistently wrong except on Lavar. I couldn’t save Lavar. I wasted my detective shots by being incorrect. A lot of this game feels futile to me. The one thing I’ve suggested lately is that I think mafia had tried to save marci D1. Given most of the unclear people were on that wagon, and the ones that weren’t I either town read or are me sans Gamma.

I understand that at times the things I offer are contradictory and probably seem self serving when it comes to my play/meta but I don’t have better ways to explain the logical contradictions other than me believing them.

[Fey]

I’m already steeling myself to just have the finger pointed at me as this all being ATE but I can’t really post logic-y. I’m not that type of person.

[Fey]

I’ve never experienced that in game afaik but I would be apologetic or angry rather than flippant, knowing myself, if a partner felt that poorly about my play.

[Fey]

I'm not real the type to point at a person and say AtE unless they AtE directly at me and then I aTe back by saying aTe because I'm shook.

Not you explicitly but anyone reading this.

[Fey]

I’ve cooled on my Gamma read somewhat. I think the alternative of 3/3 scum on Lavar D1 is more compelling.

[Fey]

Even if it wasn’t an explicit move off of Marci it’d mean the town numbers needed to flip onto anyone else just weren’t happening given the Dwlee wagon and marci not pushing more herself.

[Fey]

Sure are.

[Fey]

Fey, is meuh maf?

Maybe? IDK.

[Fey]

I’m just vibing until the clears talk about what they wanna talk about. Waiting for a VC too.

[Fey]

I’ve softened on my gorilla read a bit too which is a hm moment. I think the claim thing is pretty counter-intuitive unless gorilla expected to die eventually. Which... eh?

[Fey]

I guess I default to Meuh/Dunn and then like...? Go back to Gamma who was just chilling on the counter wagon D1...???

[Fey]

Doing due diligence on Kovu seems like a lot of work frankly even if I feel I should skim...

[Fey]

Mmmm. All I get from that post is the weird feeling you’re trying to get me on your side which like, duh, but in the way that it’s like “cmon buddy believe me!” Which feels... weird given I’ve been fairly consistently someone you wanted to kill today. Dunno. Will dwell.

[Fey]

Bleh. I'll vote whoever. It feels like everyone is viable and trying to hardline decide who I wouldn't kill for the sake of being alive right now is... difficult, which is also stupid because of how like. Easy it looks, opportunistic.

I guess I'd default to Meuh ATP. I've softened on gorilla and Gamma enough for different reasons.

Feels weird everyone's complaining about Dunnstral but no one's like doing anything about Dunnstral. Maybe I'm missing why though.

[Fey]

VOTE: Meuh

I don't have anything else to offer/claim, wasted my shots I guess but felt the best choice in a game like this. At least I was right on Lavar.

[Fey]

;-; I’m town please give me your blessing come tomorrow to be kept alive over Gamma. I don’t have the strength to fight him and it’s probably going to be me or him.

[Fey]

(Forces myself to wrench open this thread.)

Still think this is Kovu's towngame.

Meuh/Fire's a tempting team tbh.

Kinda don't think it's Gamma/Fire. That feels weird to think about based on interactions but I should backread to check this eventually.

Meuh/Gamma is also possible. Probably just bus-laden right now by virtue of necessity.

Feels like mafia definitely wanted to kill me, probably still do, but R+R's getting in the way of that so there's a lot less that they can work with.

[Fey]

Okay well.
VOTE: Meuh

I don’t have a lot to say because ai physically don’t remember what I thought in this game anymore and trying to go back reaps nothing. I’m at the end of my mafia player lifecycle like a cicada.

I’m of the opinion that Meuh > Gamma > Fire is a winning path right now. Even if Meuh flips town (I don’t feel that, her vibes feel different after spectating her as town in a game that just ended) townies just point their Invictus shots at Gamma.

[Fey]

Means I’ll probably have to go against a scum!fire at the end which is. >_> Because they will outpost me by a mile but oh well.

[Fey]

...the logic's right there. "If Meuh flips town."

If Meuh flips town > shoot you > I 1v1 Fire.

I'm not saying that I think Meuh will flip town, literally in 3267 I said I don't think that's likely. I'm just putting out the world because it's a possible one but it's not a total loss if she is and I'm wrong.

/shrug

[Fey]

Mmm... how to explain this.

On a lighter level/less emotional/etc, Rhyme's misread me before. But when I get... really upset like that, or go more into feelings sort of place, I don't think he's misread me simply because I don't get like that as mafia. I will pretend to be a defeatist and woe is me but he just knows me.

viewtopic.php?f=56&t=84956

Here's a game that is pretty much exemplifies that. We were very annoyingly refusing to listen to anyone's doubt elsewhere. I disagree with how I played in that game now, granted, but it's a good example of why his townread was so strong, I think.

[Fey]

dueling lavar/marci wagons again let's goo!!!

VOTE: marci

idk if lavar is even a wagon anymore but they should be too

I feel like I'm pretty transparent with my reads so far.

i don't really think this is true at all. you townread bell and mentioned it a few times, soft townread marci and mentioned it a few times, townread kovu and mentioned it a few times, and townread luke and mentioned it a few times. those are the only reads i can find. i can't find any mention of a scumread besides your rvs vote on datisi, which you removed. repeating the same townreads (all of them, in fact) several times also kinda makes it look like you're expressing more opinions than you actually are

takotsubo syndrome – ok this one is funny, I initially Town leaned Tako, like “oh, game has a really slow pace, but tako still made an entrance!! That’s good!!” but then that was it, and they jumped on the datisi votes with just “did you roll scum again” like, that’s it? What specific posts made you feel that way? If you wanted the RVS votes to be taken seriously, why not make up a reason at the very least?? So cause of that you lost your town lean - null

For me my vote was more of a reaction test on Datisi. Which obviously has a chance to be skewed, but I'm ok with it for what it produced.

In other news I really like 81. So currently I have a soft townread on that slot as well.

takosubo's entrance (10) felt off to me, especially coming from an alt that from what I can tell has never played with Bell before. Like a level of familiarity with bell to know that he normally is pretty easy to read, but a strange way to approach him if you are familiar. I don't know that it is more likely to come from scum, but it did catch my attention.

I am an alt account. I have also played a bunch of games with the better half of this player list. Bell is probably one of the easiest players to read for me so my post was really in jest in regards to an RVS vote.

On a side note: 94 has also given me a soft townread on that slot.

also knowing who you are now and looking back on this... already didn't like it, but i think its super sus now. you did this same kind of thing as scum in spring fling where you pocketed andante there (viewtopic.php?p=13334438#p13334438). just the taking two posts here that express some suspicion of you and saying that you like the posts and townread the people making them... its ew

why?

I really did not like the way that her scum read on datisi played out, but her reaction to being under pressure/suspicion feels distinctly like town marci imo

hmm. i kinda felt that earlier (like around her response to you 106, and 213 specifically felt like how she posted in newbie 2090), but haven't liked her more recent posting much at all

i haven't played with her before (besides when she was gragas, which i only recently realized while looking at her past games), so maybe you have a better handle on her meta, idk. can you point out specific things that stood out to you that made you think that?

oh HECK yeah let's go

VOTE: Lavar

Yeah, I'm aware I've phoned it in like 90% of the game and have suffered for it.

[Fey]

Oops, going through fire's iso.

(I'm probably not going to entertain you as mafia, frankly. Something something maybe I should but I don't see myself getting there).

Anyways, feel like fire was eager to hop on marci briefly for the credit day one but immediately go off course to Lavar. Feel like they did the sort of gentle distancing thing that scum often do.

[Fey]

Or at least, the way marci interacted/talked about fire felt like HDP marci.

[Fey]

I also think like every scum this game has tried to push me as a miselim which means something.

[Fey]

I mean yeah that's the angle that has to be pushed.

To me it's literally "everyone in the damn game has tried to kill me and scum was at the forefront of that and now here I sit with the weight of everyone's suspicion for my lack of game-energy upon my back."

[Fey]

Also I'm focused on marci/fire because, frankly, I think marci is the weakest scum player and her interactions are the most telling.

(Love you marci.)

[Fey]

(And also I followed day 1 closest.)

[Fey]

and like ok fine you don't have the same meta read as i do thats not scummy, but... i also don't quite get it cause like... you're saying that you think he lacks confidence as town and that you think his mafia game is similar... so why is him not responding to votes more likely to come from scum than town? like whats the difference there that you expect to see?

it sounds like you're saying "you're like this as town" -> "i expect you to be like this as mafia too" -> ??? -> "so the way you acted makes you scum"

and i don't get what the missing step there is

I don't really see why it has to be

so, so, so

hard for you to understand what im seeing... but okay!

datisi being town just seems more unlikely, i think theres more benefits for scum him to ignore the votes on him.. whats so hard to understand about it???

Lukewarm

– I hated this entrance. Like, this feels like textbook maf… where you just feel like you HAVE to enter. Cause, entering going “I’m not gonna be around, give me stuff to come back to tomorrow” like, why even enter at all at that point, why NOT wait till tomorrow? And “give me an interesting thread” feels really awkward to me, like, who says that? Cause normally people start complaining when there’s too many posts. Yes, I’m scum leaning Luke off 1 post, the post is that bad.

I wanted to mention that this one I sort of agree with, like I think that it is pretty weird of him to feel the need to pop in and waste a post like that
He obviously wanted to make his presence known!!!

Val89

– Terrible entrance, I don’t see how voting Datisi with others is vibes… it’s almost like you were waiting for something like that, then your next post is speculating a mafia role, more often than not, I have found maf is more likely to want to discuss the setup than town here at the start, like if it wasn’t your only “content” I wouldn’t be super concerned, but like, you vote Datisi, and just have no comment there, but instead you wish to comment on a post restricted maf, which is clearly just Mena joking around.. – scum lean

I'm conflicted about this

LavarManos

- I really just get awkward scum vibes here, like, you seem scared to take a stance, and you vote someone for “doing too much” like, what? Do you want the thread to be dead?? Why are you squinting your eyes at 50? It was a really good post, you just agree with the terrible 2 votes? Like, seriously, what do you think of Val and Tako. I really want to know, cause if Meuh is scum for doing too much. What about those 2? – definite scum lean

why are these things awkward scum? im sorry i dont really see it

- -

and like ok fine you don't have the same meta read as i do thats not scummy, but... i also don't quite get it cause like... you're saying that you think he lacks confidence as town and that you think his mafia game is similar... so why is him not responding to votes more likely to come from scum than town? like whats the difference there that you expect to see?

it sounds like you're saying "you're like this as town" -> "i expect you to be like this as mafia too" -> ??? -> "so the way you acted makes you scum"

and i don't get what the missing step there is

I don't really see why it has to be

so, so, so

hard for you to understand what im seeing... but okay!

datisi being town just seems more unlikely, i think theres more benefits for scum him to ignore the votes on him.. whats so hard to understand about it???

I think he seems unbothered by the votes which suggests he has no hidden guilt, which would be a reason to feel nervous.

i think thats what mafia would want to look like

I don't really see why it has to be so, so, so hard for you to understand what im seeing... but okay!

datisi being town just seems more unlikely, i think theres more benefits for scum him to ignore the votes on him.. whats so hard to understand about it???

i feel like this doesn't really answer my question at all. you brought it up originally as a meta point. now its just about what would benefit him? like your thought process here is not very clear to me and you're not really explaining it

this is why i dont explain my reads much im always confusing
this wasnt even originally my stuff on him

LIKE I THINK THAT BASED ON THE PERSONALITY I THINK HE HAS, I WOULD THINK HE WOULD THINK NOT REACTING TO THE VOTES WOULD BENEFIT HIM AS SCUM. I THINK THAT IT WOULD BENEFIT HIM AS SCUM BECAUSE HE SEEMS LIKE THE TYPE TO BE A SLIPPERY SNAKE, AND NOT REACTING TO THE VOTES AND NOT MAKING A BIG DEAL ABOUT IT WILL MAKE IT SEEM LIKE HES COOL WITH IT, AND NOT MAKING A BIG DEAL OF IT = LESS SPOTLIGHT = LESS DOUBTING

I am incredibly suspicious of Marci voting on page 1 (19), and even doubling down with 56 - because it is my experience that Marci normally holds her vote forever because she does not want to vote until she is sure of her reads (and constantly second guesses reads)
VOTE: Marci

Spoiler: even though these posts are not as early on as page one, i feel like theyre both fairly early on as well. which shows how this isn't a good point I think, look through the games if you want, but uhh the second one may be embarassing........ so maybe dont talk about it my ego will be shattered..

VOTE: t3

[Progressionless post until MaxTheFox arrives]

VOTE: looker

I would like to point out that Marci voted Datisi in post 19 saying "I THINK HE COULD BE SCUM"

But the reason being presented once he became a real wagon was because he was ignoring votes - which distinctly cannot be the reason why she voted him originally in post 19, because Datisi had zero posts between Baltar casting the first vote on Datisi and Marci voting Datisi

I never said it was my original reason for voting him, so why are you trying to say it as such? I thought ppl knew how i do naked votes unless ppl ask me about it

@Marci why did you think that datisi could be scum as of post 19?

DO U REALLY WANNA KNOW IT FEELS EMBARASSING...

Spoiler:

i thought maybe that 11 couldve been scummy originally... like compared to everyone elses votes..
i thought it looked a bit like he could be subtly trying to buddy fireisredsir by placing his vote on the same person that they did. and i dont really like what else he said in the post, it was just like complainy and it didnt feel good imo

Also @Marci, have you started participating in RVS and/or early voting in recent games?

IDK IF ANY OF MY PROOF WOULD COUNT FOR THIS
but i would say i try to.. but i dont think it happens all the time

ig my question then would be why you didn't mention that original reasoning until now?

because i didnt
idk its just a thing i like doing cuz i like ppl questioning it themselves

- dwlee 118 doesn't really feel like the dwlee im used to but i agree with most of it? so thats cool i guess

I remember dwlee posted like that before, so it just really felt mid imo :/

VOTE: marcistar

bell - scummy because he doesn't feel like he actually wants to be here
dunn - can be slight town for 50, feels nuanced *enough*
dwlee99 - lack of presence and the quickness of 118 is town.
enchant - dead null.
fey - i think slightly scummy because the convo with me felt more like posting for posting's sake but i am not married to this read
fireisredsir - town.
gammagooey - like both of the votes they've made. don't think they're trying to give off an impression that their posts are more useful than they are. slight town.
gorilla - townie for 92.
kovu - slightly townie for 81 because i don't expect scum!them to enter like that but we'll see how this progresses.
lady lambdadelta - null.
lavarmanos - slightly scummy maybe? my eyes are glazing over reading these posts. idk jury's still out.
lukewarm - mostly doesn't make my stomach turn so can be town for now. 101 is slightly sus but otherwise all ok.
marcistar - lol scum
meuh - 63 felt too tryhardy, the points on me in 79 feel off, and the "haha i am glad to be town!! and solving!!" is forced
rhyme and reason - 120 feels kinda townie idk why call it vibes. i wanna see mena freak out that i'm townreading his slot for nonsense ok.
sircakez - slightly SLIGHTLY townie for 13 because i like the tone but it's like. 0,01% more townie than random.
takotsubo syndrome - i feel like voting someone then plain unvoting because hurr durr reaction test is not very likely to come from scum? like scum would have some sorta bigger trajectory there. can be town for now.
val89 - my eyes glazed over 131 so into the scumbin you go
vp baltar - deadass no clue what to think here, ask me later

town (from towniest to least townie): fire, dwlee99, luke, gamma, gorilla, takotsubo, rnr, kovu, dunn, sircakez
void (no order): enchant, ladyld, vpb
scum (from scummiest to least scummy): marci, bell, meuh, val89, fey, lavar

cheers

I do not really like datisis reads!!
i dont think fey seemed scummy, i like what she posted so far she looks like shes trying to solve
i dont think gammagooey is "slight town", i dont think the posts theyve made is really like super helpful yet.
his read on me is i think datisis like the devil rn since hes not really trying to make me see the light of things (if im wrong), and instead hes just saying its scummy. i think hes trying to shut me down because its easy and he doesnt want his haters around.. it seems like more hes trying to convince everyone else instead of trying to collaborate with me...
i also *shocker here* dont agree with meuh feeling off yet, i think she hasnt done much alignment indicative yet and i think ur hating on her for her basic personality
i dont really agree with sircakez being slightly townie either..

^^ dismissing fire for not understanding a point you did not explain well, at best

how was that dismissing i was trying to talk it out

i'm not inviting, no. but i said what i find to be scummy posts from you and it's on you to try to change my view. i don't plan on begging you to explain yourself to me because i don't think you're approaching me in good faith at all.

where have you pointed something of mine out and specifically said "thats scummy"? all I can find is you responding to stuff of mine by asking shading it, but you've never specifically said its suspicious.
i think ur just trying to skirt around the truth that im the most innocent angel to ever grace this planet...

"why arent you trying to point out proof of why i have to be wrong instead?" your reasons for scumreading me are (1) i voted someone fire voted and (2) weird speculation about my personality. i have yno way to respond to (1) because that's not why i voted vpb but i'm obviously going to say that. and there are a shit-ton of other reasons why someone would vote someone in rvs to the point i don't believe that to actually be a genuine read from you. and (2), i asked you why you came to the conclusions you did about my personality and translated it into a scumread? you ignored it?

Are you just trying to make me feel small by outyelling me..? Is that ur goal devil datisi..?
why cant it be a genuine read from me? my vote was like page one, i just explained my reasons later so whats so impossible of those being actual genuine reasons? I think you just want to shade me and get me miselimated because i'm an easy target. (:
whys it impossible for u to just understand that I think that way of ur personality because i just

do

? Do you think I don't have experience talking with liars at all?

before you ask where:

LIKE I THINK THAT BASED ON THE PERSONALITY I THINK HE HAS, I WOULD THINK HE WOULD THINK NOT REACTING TO THE VOTES WOULD BENEFIT HIM AS SCUM. I THINK THAT IT WOULD BENEFIT HIM AS SCUM BECAUSE HE SEEMS LIKE THE TYPE TO BE A SLIPPERY SNAKE, AND NOT REACTING TO THE VOTES AND NOT MAKING A BIG DEAL ABOUT IT WILL MAKE IT SEEM LIKE HES COOL WITH IT, AND NOT MAKING A BIG DEAL OF IT = LESS SPOTLIGHT = LESS DOUBTING

and i would not do this as town... because...? like if you think i as town am insecure and doubting myself, why wouldn't i respond the same way as town? like, this whole explanation goes from how you've seen me as town, making conclusions about my personality, then attributing those conclusions to my scumgame as opposed to my towngame for ??? reasons

like, the confidence and annoyance you're showing about your reads grossly mismatch the actual confidence you should have and the quality of those reads.

I think ur just assuming I have more confidence than i actually do.

ALSO, the post where you criticize my reads

i think ur hating on her for her basic personality

saying i'm "hating" on someone because i said they might be scum 6 pages into a game is a little bit over the top, no?

and a lot of your points against me are "i don't agree here i don't agree there" and it's framed as if i'm scummy but why is having different reads scummy? like, the only instance where you actually explained why i might be scum for my reads is for my read on you, and i already said my problems with it so i don't feel like repeating myself but yeah

I wasn't trying to say "having different reads is scummy" but people keep framing it as so, so I guess we'll just say whenever I reply to anything datisi posts im just pointing out a reason i scumread him :shrug:
what i was trying to do, was say i don't agree and have an ACTUAL DISCUSSION with you but guess not!!
"hating on someone" is just the way i usually phrase things like that, i didn't mean for it to be so deep of a meaning just the dislike meaning.

but what do you think about Bell since they're Datisi's 2nd highest scumread? Also, do you have another player you think is particularly scummy aside from Datisi at this point?

i dont have thoughts on bell rn which is why i dont talk about him (:: i think he is usually just more invisible than other players, i can't really deny that "bell doesnt want to be here" is a pov someone might reasonably have, but i just personally don't think that way. pressure on him rn isn't the

worst

thing, but i think pressure on others is more benefical because bell will prob just come along eventually.
maybe gorilla, i think they're a capable player whos holding back like <92, 104> i think they could easily be going harder and getting more juicy info, but it doesn't really seem like they want to do that, which scum could do that? like scum dont want the game to move forward.
maybe sircakez but thats because i don't like his starting post.

theres like more people that i wouldn't mind more content from, because i don't remember them at all, but I think thats because me and datisi stole the spotlight of the game.
i think

if

datisi is town that scums sitting back and just letting this fight happen. it would explain why i cant remember anyone else

Also, Marci going against a scumread on me? That’s new. I was expecting her to scumread me by now

so selfish....... me scumreading someone is a sign of my friendship with them obviously.... you don't want me to be friends with datisi..?

still sus of marci, a lot of that early stuff about datisi is just... i have a hard time seeing it coming from a town mindset. but also like... no offense marci, but she seems clearly new. sometimes i have a hard time understanding the thought process of newer players. and like, i agree with the points for why she's scummy, but idk, some of the people jumping on her feel a bit opportunistic? and it sketches me out a bit. probably overthinking here but whatever

rude... im not new.... im the best player ever....
who is it who feels opportunistic for "jumping on me" here?

Gonna
UNVOTE: Baltar
VOTE: Marci
Cause it seems it's gaining more steam and I dislike her dislike of Datisi's reads

well what if i dislike your dislike of my dislike of datisis reads
is it all of it that you dont like or only certain spots?

Now, could be Marci is just a townie who decided to over justify a vote and didn't really think a lot about what she was saying, but she also could be scum here. Double downs aren't always easy to read, but I don't think Marci has responded coherently to pressure, and if she is town, she could have just admitted it was kind if a bullshit vote and not actually that serious.

why would i want to keep going as scum though?

So, seeing her suddenly have a page 1 RVS vote, and then double down on it, and then not be able to tell me why she even thinks it in a way that makes sense to me seemed really off.

i dont play large games often, but when i do it sure is a party isnt it?

did u miss that whole ass discussion me and luke had about my voting tendencies

who do you scumread besides datisi?

datisi, datisi, datisi, datisi, and datisi

sircakez

maybe luke idk i feel like even though i have a bad memory, i feel like nothing has really made me go ": O" in his posts

is fireisredsir historically bad with keeping up with hoods as scum?

NOOO WAIT U WERE AMUMUMUMU??? WHY DID IT GET ERASED FROM MY MEMORY.... I REMEMBER I WAS VIBING WITH AMUMUMUMU BUT I DIDNT REMEMBER WHO IT WAS....

yupp i didn't realize you were gragas until this game actually

i kinda ignored that thread after i died cause i was embarrassed by how bad i played lol, so i didn't pay much attention to the reveals of who was who

NOO U DID FINE/? or maybe i just fell for ur charms idk im kinda a dumbass LOL

i was so mad when i got miselimed cuz i was having so much fun calling caitlyn and ashe clowns

@Marci - since you're voting me how do you feel about my not-you reads? Or my votes yesterday after it become clear that you weren't going to get elim'd that game day? Do you think I'm more likely to be scum given the flips, and/or that anyone else is more likely to be town b/c of them?

i think ur playing it safe with ur reads, enchant, dwlee, lavar were ur votes other than me, and all people who aren't making too much noise in the thread

I personally feel like if VPB is scum it isn't because of the reasons Fey+fire are bringing up about picking fights and calling fire's push ridiculous. I think he's being reasonable in his responses and the cheekiness/pushiness/whatever you want to call it is just VPB being VPB. Like I don't think I'm actually good at reading VPB until a couple flips happen and I can see where he was pushing and when/why, but I've played with VPB in enough games over the last decade to get a decent understanding of his posting personality at least.

this reads a bit like ur trying to buddy buddy vip balter.

also also would like to hear more from LLD & Mala before deadline, but I get that they have RL circumstances to deal with atm so they do not get placed in the category with Dunn+Enchant of "would happily throw them off an quickly moving airship"

this seems kinda fake imo since i didnt see u really try to follow up w it?

-Don't reeeeally get why Dunn's coming up now when I think he would have been imo a better counterwagon to Lavar than Dwlee was yesterday but whatever

i think this is pretty convient of u to say, as u didnt really push overly hard in dunns direction, i feel like u were more focused on the bandwagons.

its pretty clear imo that ur just hopping from easy wagon to easy wagon

- -

VOTE: gammagooey

?

hes stinky imo

These posts suck and have vibes of Marci trying to emulate her town game
Her entire day 2 just reads like someone trying to manufacture content out no actual. A bunch of questions to other people and a naked vote.

why r u acting like its abnormal for me to do this when im completly lost? i do this all the time

Oh cool, she just dropped it entirely
Marci's favourite hobby is throwing slight scumreads on her partners and not following through with them...

nah, thats my 2nd fave hobby.

also like lol "snippet from a past game" ur using a game thats over a year old and acting like i couldn't have changed my style at all since then (iirc my first scumgame on site), like maybe i haven't yeah, but why not use a more recent game like holiday dance party to try and make a case on why im scum? i think ur just tunneling on me and trying to justify ur read in any way that you can.

VOTE: gorilla

started okay, mostly fell off, vote on lavar kind of bad, not a lot of scumhunting.

i dont like this post

why was datisi town... i really thought he was scum i feel so useless maybe i shouldnt be so one minded

we all know you're scum Marci you can drop the act

why dont u vote me then if ur so certain? :>
i know for a fact im town so lolol get better reads cakez

ok yea bell is right marci has just been floating for ages

i just feel so bad... im heartbroken at seeing datisi flip town..

i really wanna talk about my reads but i. not so confident anymore.. i dont wanna be wrong a clown myself again

[Fey]

hey whats up

ngl i was kinda convinced overnight that it was kovu and that i had just been pocketed

BUT i kinda think kovu if scum would have been able to convince RR to shoot not her partner?

i just had a really hard time understanding gamma/fey as being the final two. but i guess maybe gamma was just willing to bus his whole team?

idk

i reread most of the hood last night and i don't think it's impossible for kovu to fake but it would be impressive if she kept up that willingness to effort the whole time

The bolded feels like a gross misunderstanding of R+R's angle like, most of the game regarding me, and I feel like you're way... smarter, frankly. To believe something like this and you're kind of going through the motions of like. Pretending to be paranoid.

However, I am aware that I have been wrong most of this game. If you have anything meaningful to present for Kovu scum other than the above, please do so now.

[Fey]

I mean yeah that's the angle that has to be pushed.

To me it's literally "everyone in the damn game has tried to kill me and scum was at the forefront of that and now here I sit with the weight of everyone's suspicion for my lack of game-energy upon my back."

i mean, mena was fighting pretty hard telling us you were town, but umm he never actually explained why he thought that

Uh.. read my iso in the game I linked. Or deleuzional's. We have a lot of history between us.