Open 714: Tit for Tat [Game Over]
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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Clearly my reputation precedes me.
For those who haven't heard of me, I'm Elsa Jay, currently holding a perfect scum record and self entitled "LyLobility". Nice to meet ya. I also fake claim to save my ass no matter what, so believe me at your own risk.
Let's also thank Dino and Co for garunteeing myself to not get shot by the mafia with how much suspicion they hold on me, but instead baiting the Vigilante to waste their first shot on me. What a "Townie" thing to do.-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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Fun fact: in the game's I've played with Luca and Almost so far, they've each died night one.
Now, if I were to go out of RVS and start a strategy, I know it'll be a while before I can get a true read on Dino so I'll wait a bit on that front, but town-lean for now. His actions are definitely one to watch out for.
Luca voting me for my streak is funny and probably NAI, North as well, so that's fine. But Mutant's entrance and his little story and subsequent self-vote makes me feel like he's going to play off the fact that his last game with like four of us ended in us having a meta on him to townread such crappy behavior from him. I elect to not let that happen.
VOTE: Mutantdevle-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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But that's literally my gimmick Dino! Strat-Shaming me in particular... Rude.In post 37, Mathdino wrote:I mean that secret stuff is aside from obvious shit, like "if anyone fakeclaims vig, just shoot them instead of counterclaiming". I have other plans to deal with fakeclaimers but we'll get to that when we run up scum.
And also "don't fakeclaim just to not get lynched".
Oh and also "if you're a PR who's literally about to get lynched within 30 minutes, don't self-hammer".
._.BRB as Elsa Jay tries to get reliable internet access before joining any other games. Also trying to get gud at Mafia. PS: Sorry for bailing out on ya Dino. Go check out Clownspiricy anyway! Still very fun to read!-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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Well obviously most people explain their reasoning for voting someone in that same post, so linking the post with the vote makes it so you can't really have an excuse to not look back at it.In post 48, Gamma Emerald wrote:
Fact check what?In post 47, JaydragonKing wrote:Oh, Welcome Almost! Your just in time for the fuckery that will be page 3!
Oh, love that the Moderator literally links the post in which the person voted. Makes it much easier to fact check.-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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I hate luls in the game too but it happens. Certain people have yet to try and do ANYTHING either.
Sigh...Well it looks like if this continues, it'll turn into four people continuously talking and no one elsa. I had such an experience with Dino in fact. It's how I won as scum in Monks and Masons. But in my case it was the silent one that was also town so...
If I was mafia, and since they had so much prep time, I think they would DEFINITELY have a cohesive strategy going on, all following the same plan. So would it be fair to assume they at least talked enough to probably talk themselves out of fake claiming in such a situation? At the very least I know they're not letting the Backup Jailkeeper or the RoleCop do such a Gambit, but instead let the Goon do it.
I'd say P-edit since Dino just posted, but I'll just cut to the chase here: Talk Strategy with me Dino. I at the very least can start a steamroller to get this game started with enough information and intent behind it.BRB as Elsa Jay tries to get reliable internet access before joining any other games. Also trying to get gud at Mafia. PS: Sorry for bailing out on ya Dino. Go check out Clownspiricy anyway! Still very fun to read!-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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Fixed that for ya.
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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Because you and I have differing opinions on where to start a wagon, for one. And it's also a non-strategical reason, but I do so far go for people I don't know in the slightest over people I do know. Make with that what you will.
For strategy, I did also see how his presence is kinda like mine in that the entire game will probably in a weird spot the further he gets in. He literally had made the Town AND the Mafia target him for being such a menace to society in your wonderful game, Dino. That goes far in showing if someone like me and him are both here tomorrow when there's 9/10 people left, shit will go down horribly.
I'm also glad you atleast acknowledged my "scum talk" as completely true, showing you also read the rules and saw that part mentioned. Ten point to Griffondor.-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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The very same way I'm Lynch bait but in a slightly different way. Which is why I'd rather not take the risk of having us both be town but be the discussion point of day two in which one of us gets hung and we got into MyLo or even LyLo with me or him as the easy target by process of elimination.
I can trust myself because I got a town alignment PM, but I can't say the same for him. Taking out the fact that all Townies know they're town and there's 12 people and 3 are scum, it's about over a 1\4 or 27% chance of everyone elsa being scum. Your good with Math obviously, Dino, so it's still following along? You tell me the odds when you count yourself as town, and say the probability of me AND Mutant being town together in this situation, WIFOM "me bussing my partner" shenanigans aside.
Now, if we build a wagon on Mutantdevle and he's hung, he'll either flip vanilla townie or scum, so I'll say what will happen if we do that.
If he flips scum: Great, we somehow did that on day one and we give town a huge advantage, especially if he's one of the Powerroles and not just the Goon.
If he flips town: we'll go into the night with the knowledge of who tried to easily push the wagon for different reasons and who opposed it for also different reasons for the Jailkeeper and Vigilante to figure out. Taking themselves out of the equation, they each have a 3/10 shot of hitting a Mafia. Which is good, but Mafia only have to try and shoot 3/8 people left not counting themselves of hitting a PR.
I'm starting to go off topic there so let me reorient myself here: pushing for Mutant as well as seeing the developing counter wagon later on is what I think we need to do.-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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Probably me Creature.
If I HAD roled scum with Mutant this game, I would have told him certain things depending on which one of us is the goon, but let's just say he's the goon in this situation: I will Bus you to save myself if I feel endangered enough to think they'll kill me and play it off as just "being precautous" from a previous experience and getting huge town cred, and distance myself from my other scum partner as much as possible since I'd rather not take them with me should I go down too.
Monk's/Mason's shows what I'd do as a lone scum, so if any of you want to read that, you'll basically see me going Serial Killer and see how I just mingle and forget I'm actually scum and just chat. It's a really effective Strategy too.
Also went off topic again a bit I think but whatever.-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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Right now? Nothing, because I think the rules kinda made it clear that they had the pre-strategy time because they don't have daychat. Feel free to correct me on that but I have no current reason to think otherwise.
If mutant is scum, he'd have to have been listed plans to follow accordingly. He'd have to avoid being put in a horrible situation but will follow any backup plan his teammates left for him.
But when I think of it like that, Mutant being scum makes so much less sense if I don't think he's like me and be Bold as hell with that quick self-vote and bringing all this attention to himself unless his partners specfically made it that way so the two would have no way of being scumread for such a Lynch. Damn WIFOM and my mind and it's infinite, weird thoughts.
Now instead of a read it's a scumlean for Mutant. Good talk Dino.-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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... Fuck.In post 84, Mathdino wrote:Oh I wasn't actually trying to read mutant there.
So at what point did you realise that the worst was actually the guy that got mafiakilled, vigged, and bodyguarded, while mutant was the D1 mislynch?-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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I have not read a newbie game since my own, so no.
And the worst (hah) part about this is I legit have confused names and events before in-game. I really thought it was Mutant who was the guy who we did all that shit too. Man I'm forgetful.
For context: I had claimed watcher and I SOMEHOW saw a NINJA commit a murder, but I also accidentally confused who the mafia and the vigilante killed that game and said the wrong name, in which I was promptly kicked in the ass and the scumteam won by (suprise suprise) taking me to LyLo.
So every point I made about Mutant was actually me talking about Worst, I'm just realizing. Shit.
Officially apologies from Elsa Jay, folks. I will now have to literally correct my entire read because I based this one off the entirety wrong person.-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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That, my dear, is the ravings of a mad man who had two people as the same in their head and decided to ramble on about weird shit. Carry on.
But yeah, now I gotta figure out which of my arguments for Mutant was because I thought he was Worst... Which is all of them. So forget everything I said about Stack the Deck about him because I did forget about him being the day one Lynch.
Now I have to base everything off the fact he was a day one mislynch and decided to be horrible day one again, which still could be scumread but considering he was actually lynched for similar behavior... Dangit I made this hard on myself.
UNVOTE: to think about everything I done wrong.-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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You particularly waited for him to post something to do that to him, Paradox. You naughty boy.
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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Well first of all, welcome! I had my first game a little over three months ago, so I hope your enjoying Mafia too. You never have to look back at the Newbie Queue again, like I did. Well you can, of course. Up to you.In post 112, pinturicchio wrote:Hey guys, this is my first game out of the The Road To Rome, so I'm not used to this pace. I got lost with all the chit chat about older games, and I don't have metareadings of anyone because I haven't played with almost anyone here, with Gamma and TheGoldenParadox as an exception, so I can't help much with that, but I'll do my best! I'll read older games from anyone in my spare time, I promise.
As for the game, I only have a townread on Mathdino for now. I think his question about mafia having daytalk was genuine.
Elsa Jay, I have a question for you:
Maybe I'm missing something, but isn't this true with any wagon we do on this day? Is there any reason that this would be better if we lynch Mutant and not anyone else? I know you and Mathdino were talking about him, maybe that's why you used Mutant as an example, but this called my attention.In post 75, JaydragonKing wrote:Now, if we build a wagon on Mutantdevle and he's hung, he'll either flip vanilla townie or scum, so I'll say what will happen if we do that.
If he flips scum: Great, we somehow did that on day one and we give town a huge advantage, especially if he's one of the Powerroles and not just the Goon.
If he flips town: we'll go into the night with the knowledge of who tried to easily push the wagon for different reasons and who opposed it for also different reasons for the Jailkeeper and Vigilante to figure out. Taking themselves out of the equation, they each have a 3/10 shot of hitting a Mafia. Which is good, but Mafia only have to try and shoot 3/8 people left not counting themselves of hitting a PR.
And your right, it did apply to anyone who got hung, those would have been the odds going into the night. Putting a name to something for an example always makes it easier to understand though.
And a final tip: I also got annoyed when I was a noob and everyone was talking about older games like a month ago yet look at me now! It'll come with experience, I think.
Now if you'll just follow everything I say to a "T", we'll be fine!-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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That newbie game is the start of my perfect scum streak, I'll have you know. Also my first game and stuff. I literally have my wiki mostly updated with links to all my completed games, actually. Been trying to make Dino do the same but he's lazy.In post 128, jmo16mla wrote:
There really wasn't much going on with it, he and mathDino were being weird. I noted my reads and investigated elsewhere. I never even voted Jay.In post 118, Luca Blight wrote:
What is your thought-process behind this; why did you decide to let Jay go here, and what is your read of Jay at this point?In post 66, jmo16mla wrote:I'm willing to let go of Jay right now.
Jay is puzzling. The whole spill about a past game really thew me off of him. I've gone back and tred to read through what looks to be a newbie game he replaced into as scum. I didn't really see anything that stood out to me about his play there. I believe he wasn't very agressive and didn't vote much. I want to do more investigating.
That little wiki button below my name will help your quest! Just a heads up though, my first game is the worst one you can read when it comes to finding a meta of what I am now that I grew into myself, so to speak.-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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I do declare that this is legit his only post. And Almost popped in and sang some lyrics for some reason and yelled at Gamma like a grouchy old man. Almost is stubborn enough to do his own shit to his grave, and unless any of you know Aneninen, then he seems like a good starting place right now for my vote.
VOTE: Aneninen-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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Dino has multiple times waited for other people to chat to figure the game out, even to his detriment before when he should have spoken up. Thinking about this makes his play in a recent game of ours seem so much more obvious he was actually evil, but that's neither here or there. He is doing something that is a town tell of his, as well as something I think particularly tells me something that I'm not mentioning in thread.-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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I do the same thing as either alignment. It's kinda how I've won my scum games. Can't really point you to my town tells because I'm still not really aware of them myself with how little experience I have as town in comparison to scum.In post 190, Aneninen wrote:
But does she fluff that much and produce that little content as town?In post 188, Mathdino wrote:The reason you're getting the cock vibe from Jay is precisely because of his undefeated record as scum. That doesn't, however, encapsulate his town game.
My first and currently only victory as town happened because I avoided being Lynched by fake claiming Vigilante to stop myself from being lynched day one and then taking the Nightkill from the Mafia instead of someone more valuable then me to succeed.BRB as Elsa Jay tries to get reliable internet access before joining any other games. Also trying to get gud at Mafia. PS: Sorry for bailing out on ya Dino. Go check out Clownspiricy anyway! Still very fun to read!-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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Don't forget I also bet my life on a 50-50 bet in your game by claiming Roleblocker. Good times, good times...In post 294, Mathdino wrote:jay fakeclaimed vig as VT in a semi-open to save himself from a lynch (there was a 55% chance there was another vig to counterclaim, IIRC)-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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In response to Dino asking me my lynchool, I'll separate it into piles depending on which will be for different reasons.
Gut Lynches (The ones I think are the most scummy IMO):
Almost50: Of all my games with him this is him at his most passive. Maybe tryingtoo hardin wanting to not die Night one in an Open AGAIN, but I know it contradicts everything he's done that I've seen from him.
Gamma Emerald: I only played on other game with him, but I also remember him being so much more nonchalant about being accused as scum when he was town, yet he's very defensive.
Copout Lynches (one out of fustration or compromise):
Mutantdevle: I did make an entire case against him despite half of it being directed towards a different individuals, but it still stands that it's a possibility should the town be divided.
TheGoldenParadox: looking back made me realize he's only casted what is basically a single post and a "lmao" reaction afterwards. I cannot see him as a power role at this point, so a good middle ground.
JaydragonKing: You can put myself in this catagory as well, really, but that's for you guys to explain and think about, not me.
Informative Lynches (one made out of trying to find a scumteam then for only their own scummy nature):
Luca Blight: The one I want to be hung the least of the group but there's a reason if he is lynched. Should he flip town, I know one of the others who started the push for him is scum.
Aneninen or jmo16mla: I can't see these two being on separate teams atm. I feel like if one flips, we'll know the other's alignment thereafter.BRB as Elsa Jay tries to get reliable internet access before joining any other games. Also trying to get gud at Mafia. PS: Sorry for bailing out on ya Dino. Go check out Clownspiricy anyway! Still very fun to read!-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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It IS different from being NK'd though. I'm saving you the pain. I'm a nice person.In post 316, Almost50 wrote: Snip
Yeah, trying my hardest not to get NK'd on N1 by getting myself lynched on D1. GENIUS!In post 312, JaydragonKing wrote:Almost50: Of all my games with him this is him at his most passive. Maybe trying too hard in wanting to not die Night one in an Open AGAIN, but I know it contradicts everything he's done that I've seen from him.
And I know you don't want to be NK'd again, but more of your opinions and mojo would be nice in this situation.
Spoiler:-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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Yeah, to clarify as to not have any hidden intent: Almost loves to say he can read my crumbs despite making many mistakes in reads about me as town AND scum from said "crumbs", which are usually passing comments I make as a joke and potential lifeline for later. Inside joke taunt thing with random letters and numbers I thought of on the spot.-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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I make a decision based on what is going down. And I did it in a semi-open before, so I had leeway. A clear cut thing like this Open? I won't give you the exact odds, but I will make the right call when it comes.In post 350, TheGoldenParadox wrote:
stop gamethrowingIn post 19, JaydragonKing wrote:I also fake claim to save my ass no matter what, so believe me at your own risk.
Appearantly last night and today is "shit on Jay" day.
Jumped right behind Paradox but your point still stands, and being after him doesn't really matter in this situation cuz I know you'd have said that on your own as well. You continue your own strategy and hope we don't fuck each other up.Mathdino wrote:Jay that literally means I'm going autolynch you without a cc on a PR claim
You will not fakeclaim in a full open, that just draws out the real power roles
Also fuck you if you end up forcing me to check my role pm-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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Yeah, I understand that concept well enough. My failed town games before and my previous experience in ToS taught me that lesson. It's how I improved to fast, really. I learn quick, even if I relapse sometimes.
I'd also like to question on why Paradox waited so long to comment on one of my so-far standard RVS Introductions I make, let alone immediately accuse it of gamethrowing out of the blue. Did you just start too re-read or were you specfically looking for something to accuse me with?-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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That feeling when the Moderator uses the players to get out of making a VC of their own.
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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In post 487, Creature wrote:I am basically left with Almost50, Jaydragon, Luca Blight and Mathdino. These are the four hardest reads.
Though, out of these, I'm more fine townreading Almost50.In post 496, Creature wrote:Still you're gonna have to help me find scum between Jay and Luca.
That feeling when your asked to be vigged over the scum because Dino REALLY wants me not to be in the equation for later.In post 497, Mathdino wrote:i guess it's luca
jay should just be vigged, we're never getting a wagon on him unless it's policy
and doing that will just fuck up the VCA
tbh i dropped luca into town to try to distance my brain from the "SCREW YOU FOR 1V1ING ME" mindset
and because PoE created a scumpool of {NSG, Creature, Anen, mutant}
but yeah that no longer works-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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Also, addressing the idea that I'm never getting lynched unless it's policy- Dino, I'm charismatic but I'm not sure my scum game is so good yet that I can convince an entire town I'm actually good without more then half the people still suspecting me.
How hard is it to admit I'm actually town this game? Too the point where you asked like three times for me to be the Vig target? Elsa Jay isn't going anywhere unless the Mafia decides to kill me, and even then, they still gotta deal with the enevitible Jailkeeper or Vigilante on me. I can really see either going for me, but not both at once. Heck, they may even be checking either my role or Dino's role, I'm 95% sure of that.-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
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I thought this was pretty simple tbh. It's me saying I'm a horrible WIFOM bet from the mafia, and the Vigilante has other things to do, and the Jailkeeper might not trust me enough so they'll jail me.In post 515, Gamma Emerald wrote:
wtf does this mean?In post 504, JaydragonKing wrote:Also, addressing the idea that I'm never getting lynched unless it's policy- Dino, I'm charismatic but I'm not sure my scum game is so good yet that I can convince an entire town I'm actually good without more then half the people still suspecting me.
How hard is it to admit I'm actually town this game? Too the point where you asked like three times for me to be the Vig target?Elsa Jay isn't going anywhere unless the Mafia decides to kill me, and even then, they still gotta deal with the enevitible Jailkeeper or Vigilante on me.I can really see either going for me, but not both at once. Heck, they may even be checking either my role or Dino's role, I'm 95% sure of that.
All possibilities. Unless the scum want to prove me wrong?-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2065
- Joined: November 21, 2017
- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
Maybe... I don't know... Let them do what they think is right with some suggestions from the Majority instead of just you?In post 575, Mathdino wrote:
This is understandable.In post 504, JaydragonKing wrote:Also, addressing the idea that I'm never getting lynched unless it's policy- Dino, I'm charismatic but I'm not sure my scum game is so good yet that I can convince an entire town I'm actually good without more then half the people still suspecting me.
How hard is it to admit I'm actually town this game? Too the point where you asked like three times for me to be the Vig target? Elsa Jay isn't going anywhere unless the Mafia decides to kill me, and even then, they still gotta deal with the enevitible Jailkeeper or Vigilante on me. I can really see either going for me, but not both at once. Heck, they may even be checking either my role or Dino's role, I'm 95% sure of that.
Given that I do think you can be read off motivations, I'll retract "Jay should be vigged".
It's mathematically bad for us if vig does nothing at all, which is the main reason I've been trying to figure out what PRs should do.
Just a thought.-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2065
- Joined: November 21, 2017
- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
It's just kinda scary to not have any real investigative roles until one mafia dies. Maybe the fact that every even game I've had so far, I've lost as well contributes to that scared feeling.
Also think someone mentioned my vote being on Creature now for some reason is strange? To tired to reread yet. But it was funny and I love going off topic.
I have a Large Domino's Pizza ready for my breakfast when I wake up. I gotta go to the store for Soda or something though. Walking is gonna be a pain with the possibility of Snow. Maybe I'll just drink water instead. But then the pizza won't have that extra feeling. It needs a Soda or something. Maybe fruit punch? Maybe milk? No no no, not right. Needs to be soda. Soda Pop. Pop. Pop Pop. Pop goes the weasel. Luca the scum leader. Dino the prison warden. Bah duh ba ba buhhhhhh. I'm loving it.-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2065
- Joined: November 21, 2017
- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2065
- Joined: November 21, 2017
- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2065
- Joined: November 21, 2017
- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2065
- Joined: November 21, 2017
- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2065
- Joined: November 21, 2017
- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2065
- Joined: November 21, 2017
- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2065
- Joined: November 21, 2017
- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2065
- Joined: November 21, 2017
- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2065
- Joined: November 21, 2017
- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2065
- Joined: November 21, 2017
- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
Guessing you mean the "readable" part?
By that, I can easily tell that not only is the second one formatted better then the first, and it has very little fluff. I didn't click the source of the first one, but it just seems more scummy?
Am I looking for the fact that he has grown a lot, a difference in his nature of playing from jokes to serious, or congratulate his improved grammar?-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2065
- Joined: November 21, 2017
- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
Dinosuar with a degree finally remembered his species is supposed to be extinct and spontaneously explodes.In post 756, Mathdino wrote:Queen Elsa found dead in a ditch-
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JaydragonKing Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2065
- Joined: November 21, 2017
- Location: 'Murica. Heck yeah.
In post 770, Mathdino wrote:look i'm just gonna pretend i'm being useful right now
just lost a game, might hit a slump for the IRL day