Mini Normal 1996: Floral Mafia [Endgame!]

[Tchill13]

Of course, it's possible someone could have bussed, although less likely in this case given how tight the lynch was.

I will analyse when I get to a computer.

IF YOU'RE TOWN... There's absolutely no reason to bus there seeing how close a townie lynch was to getting through.

I think even apart from my claim, my interactions with implosion and the makeup of the two wagons certainly give me considerable towncred, even if not clearing me entirely.

People keep throwing around the cleared word. You're not cleared unless an investigative clears you. Yeah you're probably town. You're not cleared though. Nobody knows for sure until a flip.

[Tchill13]

Tchill is on my list also. I just feel asuka is scummier and looking at how they mentioned each other especially asuka caking mumble stupid or whatever for voting implosion, I like asuka for scum better.

After looking at your vca I believe your ausuka tchill scum reads are associations are they not?

Implosion and ausuka are the only wagons I weren't on. So let's say I or ausuka flip town. Does that automatically clear the other in your opinion?

Cedrick did you answer this?

[Tchill13]

I think it's odd you were reluctant to mention Katherine.

[Tchill13]

Ausuka
brassherald
Mumble
katherine
Luca Blight
implosion
tring the people not in this list

I feel like if Maria is scum this means her partner isn't katherine. It's still possible MariaR and Tchill could be scum together but tbh if Tchill is scum he's just completely duped me. His tone feels really genuine this game.

If you're not buddying and you're actually town then I'd like to have a chat with you on how to read tone post game.

[Tchill13]

Tchill is on my list also. I just feel asuka is scummier and looking at how they mentioned each other especially asuka caking mumble stupid or whatever for voting implosion, I like asuka for scum better.

After looking at your vca I believe your ausuka tchill scum reads are associations are they not?

Implosion and ausuka are the only wagons I weren't on. So let's say I or ausuka flip town. Does that automatically clear the other in your opinion?

Cedrick did you answer this?

Need an answer eventually.

[Tchill13]

I think it's odd you were reluctant to mention Katherine.

Odd in an AI way?

Is it odd that the lowest poster in this game wasn't the one who jumped to the forefront of my mind when making that comment?

If you consider you were Comparing a player to the 2nd lowest poster in the game and it wasn't Katherine. Yes it is odd.

[Tchill13]

Tchill is on my list also. I just feel asuka is scummier and looking at how they mentioned each other especially asuka caking mumble stupid or whatever for voting implosion, I like asuka for scum better.

After looking at your vca I believe your ausuka tchill scum reads are associations are they not?

Implosion and ausuka are the only wagons I weren't on. So let's say I or ausuka flip town. Does that automatically clear the other in your opinion?

I can’t really answer that. I need an actual flip. I’ll need to see who was on and off the wagon, I’ll need to see who dies. Lots of things factor in to me reevaluating

I'm assuming I'll flip town at some point seeing as I'm scummy af rn and I have a hard time believing people being able to reevaluate that read.

That DOES NOT clear ausuka.

[Tchill13]

Need an answer eventually.

You can chill the fuck out and let me get around to it.

Tsk Tsk. You already answered and you know that. Going out of your way to slander someone in an already handled situation isn't quite the "grown up" thing to do. If you want to use grown up words why not try grown up attitudes with them?

[Tchill13]

Hopkirk did your question to ausuka come with cedricks VCA in mind?

[Tchill13]

Nobody else thinks anything of Luca not mentioningKatherine?

[Tchill13]

I think if we know Luca is town and we know implosions wagon is made up of all townies (due to the fact scum didn't have to bus there and there's no reason why they would with a townie lynch being that close) it's our best bet to win. We'd have to KNOW though so a Luca flip would be vital. I'm not opposed to a Luca lynch. Of course if Luca flipped scum I could see maybe Katherine being the partner but that's a very weak case.

[Tchill13]

Well good. riddance. Also thanks mafia. You kind of confirmed me as town. Time to re-evaluate

@hopkirk once he posts something like this. Something that makes him think he's conftown or cleared then he will not play with people having to read him in mind because in his head he should be cleared.

At least I'm pretty sure that's what is going on here.

[Tchill13]

my only issue with luca is she said she didn't pm the mod to commute. I don't see why a player wouldn't use their action that THEY think is the most important role.

That and the survival lynch on implosion at the end. Sure it lynched scum. If I'm playing with Luca being scum a possibility though then Luca just lynched scum for town cred.

I usually play by odds so it's highly unlikely both wagons were on scum. If we can get a Luca flip and give a justifiable hard TR to half the player base though I think it'll be an easy win.

[Tchill13]

Luca, Katherine, Maria, ausuka

Luca is a slight SR but what his flip confirms is pretty valuable.

Katherine is my biggest outright SR because of the wagon he was on and low content.

Maria pretty much the same.

Ausuka only because of his position on the wagon. I feel that cedrick is town and I'm glad to see ausuka stated that also.

[Tchill13]

Consider my vote on implosion - I don't want to put him on L-1 in case of derp hammer.

Actions speak louder than words. You totally could have lynched your scum partner with that phrasing.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: Tchill

I don't trust his motives here - he doesn't believe I'm scum, but wants me lynched for information's sake.

Basically it's just getting rid of a nuisance - someone scum won't be able to get rid of themselves. The info gained would have to be taken with a pinch of salt just like the info we have now; me being killed confirms no-one.

You flipping town confirms 6 people. You flipping scum is Katherines death sentence.

[Tchill13]

Consider my vote on implosion - I don't want to put him on L-1 in case of derp hammer.

Actions speak louder than words. You totally could have lynched your scum partner with that phrasing.

What about the action of hammering scum?

Or do you ignore the parts that don't fit your narrative?

I explained the scum motivation behind that. Why did you wait till you were run up?

[Tchill13]

Tchill you townread me most of D1 but then suddenly hard-pushed my lynch when implosion was on the brink.

My day 1 play is trash. It's terrible due to a lack of motivation and game style. I said this multiple times.

[Tchill13]

You flipping town confirms 6 people.

If anyone else disagrees I'll explain it but you could be arguing from a biased perspective and I won't waste my breath.

If I'm scum here and we lynch Luca, he flips town. I'm funneling myself into a Katherine, Maria and ausuka lynch for the rest of the game.

[Tchill13]

Yeah ausuka would be the last person I lynched off Lucas wagon. I'll be Blatant about it.

[Tchill13]

I've seen scum do a lot to avoid interactions with each other. That's all I'm getting at with the Katherine thing. Very, very odd you chose to leave him out of that comparison.

[Tchill13]

Do yall really not see where I'm getting my confirm 6 townies thing?

OK OK I may have tunneled scum Luca idea too hard. I agree.

If I'm operating under the idea that Luca is town and therefore the other 6 are already confirmed in my mind.

Then Maria and ausuka is the scum team in my eyes.

[Tchill13]

I've seen scum do a lot to avoid interactions with each other. That's all I'm getting at with the Katherine thing. Very, very odd you chose to leave him out of that comparison.

Fucking hell, are you ignoring the part where I voted Katherine, and she later voted me and left it there for the rest of the day? And the part where I called out her bullshit scumread of me?

You only see what you want to see.

Yeah I gotta work on that lol. I just realized what I was doing.

[Tchill13]

Do yall really not see where I'm getting my confirm 6 townies thing?

I know I don't

Why would scum bus implosion if a townie was that close to being lynched? What are the odds scum bus there? Very very small. So everyone on the implosion wagon should be town.

[Tchill13]

Idk man. If scum bus they're choosing town cred over one less day phase they have to survive in THAT particular situation.

One vote was pretty much the deciding factor.

[Tchill13]

Like if we all just pretend that bussing doesn't exist and nobody would bus a buddy (especially one who didn't seem that into the game) we're probably going to end up off-track.

Immediate resistance to my idea already. I'm not saying it doesn't exist. I'm saying there's no need for it in that particular situation on a claimed PR that close to lynch.

[Tchill13]

Do yall really not see where I'm getting my confirm 6 townies thing?

I know I don't

Why would scum bus implosion if a townie was that close to being lynched? What are the odds scum bus there? Very very small. So everyone on the implosion wagon should be town.

If you believed that then you wouldn’t be suspicious of him to begin with.

I'm not sure if he's town or not. That's the point.

[Tchill13]

I'm not sure if he's town or not. That's the point.

So you think implosion/Luca were a team? That’s literally the only way you can be suspicious of Luca.

The urge to be sarcastic here is very high. Yes they're obviously a team if Luca is scum.

[Tchill13]

@hopkirk you're gonna want to get back with cedrick in about 10 pages. He's already made his mind up.

Cedrick is town though I'm pretty sure about that.

I'm playing under two views. Either Luca is town or he isn't. All reads then fall underneath those categories.

It's more likely Luca is town which would mean I'd think Maria and ausuka are scum.

If Luca is scum then Katherine is probably the partner.

If I'm completely wrong about scum not bussing I'm sure I'll be left alive long enough to wallow in my ignorance.

[Tchill13]

I'm not sure if he's town or not. That's the point.

So you think implosion/Luca were a team? That’s literally the only way you can be suspicious of Luca.

The urge to be sarcastic here is very high. Yes they're obviously a team if Luca is scum.

see most people would come in and think luca is town, but you don't. You are also on the short list of possible scum so it would make sense for you as scum to push that agenda, it doesn't make sense for you as town to do that though.

Any read that starts with "most people, town would never, scum always..." Isn't a good basis.

Let's say I'm scum. I lynch Luca. He flips town so I'm gonna push Katherine. Katherine flips town. Guess who's lynched next? Me. It's a stupid road to go down if I'm scum. One with limited possibilities. If you're scum you want as many possibilities as possible at all times.

[Tchill13]

I feel very confident in my hopkirk TR. He sorted a ton day 1. He's asking people the motivations behind their reads. His progressions make sense. Great example of being able to show themselves as town through effort.

[Tchill13]

Either Luca is town or he isn't.

and we won't know that anytime soon, and we aren't lynching him day 2 as he was the counter the a POWERFUL mafia role. move on

Either

Luca scum bussed the PR for town cred or

Scum tried to lynch Luca because he was the counter wagon to their strongest PR.

The game is pretty simple after that.

[Tchill13]

Let's say I'm scum. I lynch Luca. He flips town so I'm gonna push Katherine. Katherine flips town. Guess who's lynched next? Me. It's a stupid road to go down if I'm scum. One with limited possibilities. If you're scum you want as many possibilities as possible at all times.

you know luca isn't going to really get lynched today though. So you as scum could push luca and be written off as a dumb townie.

Or from an analytical standpoint it's the most efficient way to go about things. Keep in mind I'm operating from the view that if Luca is town iplosion s wagon is confirmed town. If you disagree with that point then fine. I don't think I'm wrong though about scum not bussing their strongest PR when they don't have to.

[Tchill13]

yeah, sorry I don't really see that as being likely and since I already sr you day 1, you just keep doing things that look like scum.

i'm good with you or a hop wagon today

Dang. Man cedrick I was playing for your affirmation and yours alone. I'm sorry I've failed you.

[Tchill13]

I feel very confident in my hopkirk TR. He sorted a ton day 1. He's asking people the motivations behind their reads. His progressions make sense. Great example of being able to show themselves as town through effort.

he had 30 posts day 1 and I don't see much sorting. He didn't even really try to sort implosion. He vote parked on implosion and did nothing to make a lynch happen. If there is scum on the wagon, he could be it. he isn't really trying to sort anyone today either, he's asking me questions that don't help sort me, they are questions that just look like he's trying to appear busy.

If anyone asked you questions about your alignment you'd say their not sorting you because you're already confirmed town in your opinion.

[Tchill13]

I've seen scum do a lot to avoid interactions with each other. That's all I'm getting at with the Katherine thing. Very, very odd you chose to leave him out of that comparison.

Fucking hell, are you ignoring the part where I voted Katherine, and she later voted me and left it there for the rest of the day? And the part where I called out her bullshit scumread of me?

You only see what you want to see.

Do yall really not see where I'm getting my confirm 6 townies thing?

OK OK I may have tunneled scum Luca idea too hard. I agree.

If I'm operating under the idea that Luca is town and therefore the other 6 are already confirmed in my mind.

Then Maria and ausuka is the scum team in my eyes.

Yeah I was pushing scum Luca. II'm leaning town Luca now.

I understand we can't lynch him even though from my pov his alignment is the most important to know.

VOTE: maria

[Tchill13]

Honestly I'm enjoying hopkirks addition (I gave reason to TR though) to the game and I'm hoping ausuka is town. Two enjoyable players imo.

Cedric assuming I'm town and Luca is also wouldn't a Maria/ausuka scum team make sense?

[Tchill13]

@Gamma.

Right now who’s your top scum read?
If you don’t mind saying.

TChill I think, I was having doubts when he said he was scumreading Ausuka but thinking about his possible scum motives for that I realized it would benefit him rather than hurt him bsed on the logic that was making that a concern for me, which was TChill seeming to want to get cleared off an Ausuka townflip.
VOTE: TChill

why would i be worried about an ausuka town flip? as ausuka ever passed more than 3 votes?

[Tchill13]

KTS kill is pretty weird.

I guess I won't oppose Tchill's death.

both valid thoughts. I'll be rereading KTS iso soon.

[Tchill13]

These are all factors that matter on who the scum team is
what role the scum team have
and how they think the gamestate is going
All stuff we don't have and I think is dumb to think on tbh

so basically we shouldn't speculate on pretty much anything at all? We know KTS was killed. Where's the speculation there?

[Tchill13]

VOTE: tchill

this has got to die. i rolled village btw glgl me

i understand, man, and i'm cognizant of that now that i realize you truly had no idea what you were doing (and i mean that in the nicest way possible) with no ulterior scum agenda. i would like to know still how much experience you have with mafia in general though because from your join date, i thought you'd have a lot more.

VOTE: Mumble
this almost always hits a wolf.

btw iirc mariar has played a game where we were both wolves, but that was a while ago.

VOTE: implosion

this guy cant make a solid read on anyone not being aggressive and not being scummy looool. shuld probably get him out of here.

VOTE: Mumble

VOTE: Havo

VOTE: Luca

VOTE: implosion
luca has good content at the very least.

[Tchill13]

I was the only player voted that was on the luca wagon.

So tell me why if i know Implosion's wagon is one vote away from being pushed through I make a big spectacle of staying on Luca? Thats a huge risk Day 1 isn't it?

[Tchill13]

These are all factors that matter on who the scum team is
what role the scum team have
and how they think the gamestate is going
All stuff we don't have and I think is dumb to think on tbh

so basically we shouldn't speculate on pretty much anything at all? We know KTS was killed. Where's the speculation there?

NKA is shit

Well it falls under "stuff we have". seeing how limited that is i plan on using it.

[Tchill13]

wtf...now you guys come around on implosion?

VOTE: implosion

That's l-1 and Luca's "derphammer" shit was bad. Vote your scum read or don't...

You've definitely implied and if you don't care that's exactly what's wrong with townies on site. I'd rather you care badly than not to care at all. Idc what you think my opinion is of you. Just play the game.

I literally have no reads with firm reasoning anymore. I just want a lynch.

VOTE: luca

I'd rather vote Luca than implosion though.

VOTE: implosion
luca has good content at the very least.

Welp.

Spent today moving into apartment. Still have work to do.

VOTE: Luca

Can claim if I need to but would rather not and might only be checking game sporadically for the next ~24h and would rather just lynch Luca.

UNVOTE:

VOTE: implosion

this is pretty much the key events that led to the lynch

I'll be honest i'd lynch me too. Hopefully yall don't think im that bad as scum. I won't give up due to the fact i don't think a townie should rollover. I literally just went to luca just to say "screw it" and see what happens. Earlier both were my Top TR's. My only TR's really. So from my perspective there was no reason for me to even choose a side. Unfortunately i chose wrong and it looks like scum trying to avoid his partners lynch. Im very aware of that.

My gut says Luca is town. The KTS kill makes me feel like either scum bussed or Luca is scum. Had mafia wanted a low info kill why not kill katherine or creature? They chose KTS for a reason.

[Tchill13]

A lynch has been achieved!

VC 1.FINAL

votes

implosion

(7): Hopkirk, Creature, Gamma Emerald, Havo, Mumble, Killthestory, Luca Blight

Mumble

(1): Cedrick

Luca Blight

(5): Ausuka, MariaR, katherine, Tchill13, implosion

Not Voting

(0):

With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch

The day 1 deadline is in

: (expired on 2018-03-22 19:42:59)

Mod Notes

: Cedrick is V/LA until Monday.
Luca Blight is V/LA until Wednesday

gamma and havo pushed the implosion lynch to a legitamite threat. If scum bussed i'd say it was creature. That 2nd vote is pretty early.

Mumble and Hopkirk are practically lock town imo.

It's also worth noting that Cedrick voted off the wagons. Due to the sizes of both.

[Tchill13]

gamma i need to know why me being worried about an ausuka town flip is your tipping point to vote me.

[Tchill13]

practically lock Town: Mumble, Hopkirk, Gamma, Havo

Null: Luca, Katherine

Scum lean: Cedrick, Creature, MariaR, Katherine (mostly due to PoE)

(i have to read ausuka's iso more seeing how i haven't seen many of their post)

[Tchill13]

have read the thread, these are just what sticks out from memory

Town of center: gamma (more of the same, +the way he engaged with tchill about me just felt super good), KTS (not much changed since way back when, I mean he is now generally posting pretty differently but nothing stuck out as defying expectation, he did what he said he was gonna do and his journey to not giving a shit made sense to me), creature (I am familiar with creature), maria (concise in a way that is helpful to me and also doesn't lend itself to being townread; she mentioned something about the way she played scum that made me think she would be more effortful in that way), hopkirk/herald (replace out seemed genuine lol)

center: Implo (he has a good bit of towny level 2-type reasoning but also some conclusions I disliked. KTS has been dead set on him more than I think anyone has been dead set on anyone), Ausuka (I saw the common readlist thing so forget that I guess. Hasn't done much that sticks out in memory, townread me based on himself being town which is a bit of a towny thought), Mumble (early dump of vote on me and like refusing to do stuff was kinda garbage at face value but I liked what Maria said, that there's stuff he probably wouldn't let hit the thread if scum), Cedrick (also don't remember much from him? He seemed engaged emotionally from something and a bunch of people were confident town on him but also I remember thinking some of his stuff was unproductive), Havo (He has been a bit pushy but hasn't given any especially compelling reasoning stuff that I remember. He said he doesn't like D1s so that's whatever)

scum of center: Tchill (Seems more intent on making stances than sorting. With me he went from strongly scumreading to not scumreading but wanting to lynch anyway, while also arguing I hadn't given any way to read me (355 seemed to be enough for a lot of people), and talks a lot of talk about needing to sort me and but doesn't take any initiative with that that I can remember. Don't get the Creature vote either), Luca (a few things have rubbed me the wrong way - 589 he says the case he opened with on Tchill wasn't very hard but it was like very strongly worded and it just doesn't seem to me like he would see me point it out and think "nah it wasn't a hard case"; also a bunch of his stuff seems functional and not difficult to come up with, e.g. in 896, 2 just reads to me as "I should say something to that")

VOTE: Luca

Katherine seems to think 355, one posts, was good enough to be transparently town because ppl let him. I'll be expecting more of the low activity due to the fact the majority is ok with it as long as he makes a long post.

Katherine didn't take a stance on implosion. The only 2 SR's were Mee and Luca.

Katherine was also correct about KTS. Could have been a good read, could have been because he knew.

[Tchill13]

Creature has been handed a TR from about half the player list due to familiarity aka activity i do believe.

[Tchill13]

I don't think Luca should take his claim back
I also don't think we should lynch him for now even if I think he could be scum.

Let's say I'm scum. I lynch Luca. He flips town so I'm gonna push Katherine. Katherine flips town. Guess who's lynched next? Me. It's a stupid road to go down if I'm scum. One with limited possibilities. If you're scum you want as many possibilities as possible at all times.

you know luca isn't going to really get lynched today though. So you as scum could push luca and be written off as a dumb townie.

So heres two people majorly opposed to the luca lynch today.

I need to know why luca is town and why an unkillable PR, where thats his main power, is important to town if it's true. Wouldn't that suggest a vig or something?

It seems more important to scum fake claiming imo. Of course im dead null on Luca. I'm just viewing it as a possibility.

[Tchill13]

I agree scum are less likely to have bussed here, purely because of how tight the lynch was, and also because I claimed an unkillable pr - I'm sure scum would have loved to have offed me D1. implosion was also a pr we must remember.

If scum were on implosion it will have been one of the first on it imo.

Ironically your pr is more likely in the hands of scum then it is town

but I can just assume you're fake claiming and you're this super strong town pr for now *shrug*

Let me get this straight - are you saying commuter is more likely to be a scum role than a town one?

unlimited? Yes

Tell me what you're basing this on.

Well someone who can't be nightkilled is basically someone who cannot be targeted by anything and if they so choose make it so they stay alive for good that seems really unfair for scum to not be able to deal with a player not all in anyway unless said player lets them do it
Where as if it was scum they can use that without complaint until they're the last scum and then that power is gone feels fairer

This post feels like scum complaining to me -

"it isn't fair"

lol.

Surely whether or not it's 'fair' depends on what other roles are in the game - we already know Mafia had a strongman which is a decent role.

I agree with this actually.

Maria and Ausuka both think Luca's role is more likely to be had by scum. They don't seem to push for this lynch today though unless i missed something.

[Tchill13]

Extra-Special Townbloc of Happy Friends

Ausuka, Creature, Tchill13

Candidates For Promotion

Cedrick,

Katherine

, killthestory, MariaR

Watchlist For Meaniness

implosion

, Havo, brassherald, Gamma Emerald

Wanted for Bullying and General Sad Crimes

Luca Blight

, Mumble

(If I tried to explain all these at once it would be a really long post and it'd also take a really long time to make, but I'll try and explain any read if someone wants me to.)

What about the bolded names?

Sure.
For katherine, I gave my reasoning in 366 but it wasn't clear I was talking about Katherine I guess. "I don't think scum would vote me in the current climate, plenty of players have come out townreading me and I feel like the general consesus here is that I'm town. I don't think scum would vote me, at least not with weak reasoning like in 355."

Implo could go either way. His reads make sense but like they're not something a scum couldn't fake at this point.

Luca was in 366 too- "Luca's 331 is bad in particular- the momentum on Tchill dies down and now he's jumping on Katherine, who he hasn't scumread before that post, because the wagon "seems like a decent bet.""

Here's ausuka taking a neutral stance on implosion.

REreadinng her iso she also vote parked luca day 1 and i honestly didn't feel like a crazy amount of sorting was done after that. Someone may want to check me though.

[Tchill13]

A lynch has been achieved!

VC 1.FINAL

votes

implosion

(7): Hopkirk, Creature, Gamma Emerald, Havo, Mumble, Killthestory, Luca Blight

Mumble

(1): Cedrick

Luca Blight

(5): Ausuka, MariaR, katherine, Tchill13, implosion

Not Voting

(0):

With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch

The day 1 deadline is in

: (expired on 2018-03-22 19:42:59)

Mod Notes

: Cedrick is V/LA until Monday.
Luca Blight is V/LA until Wednesday

Katherine and ausuka BOTH took neutral stances on Implosion day 1 and BOTH were on the Luca wagon.

pretty important imo. I'm getting pretty close to wanting to see a lynch there.

[Tchill13]

they were also BOTH right about KTS...

[Tchill13]

VOTE: katherine

Only leaned more so to this than Ausuka due to activity. I think i've laid out a legitimate case for both though.

Gamma i need to know why an Ausuka town flip being my concern was what pushed you to vote me.

I'll answer any other questions people want to ask me before my lynch is pushed through hopefully.

I've tried my best to explain my play, take stances on each player and leave with at least a decent case on someone. MY day 1 play is geared towards the fact it's hard to lynch scum day 1. So, as amusing as it is, when i'm a part of a town that lynches scum day 1 i come out looking scummy af. First time it's happened i do believe.

I understand if i need to be lynched because i'll be a part of the majority of players lynch pool from now till lylo.

[Tchill13]

These are all factors that matter on who the scum team is
what role the scum team have
and how they think the gamestate is going
All stuff we don't have and I think is dumb to think on tbh

so basically we shouldn't speculate on pretty much anything at all? We know KTS was killed. Where's the speculation there?

NKA is shit

I do suggest someone that knows what they are doing try it. I don't.

Katherine was left alive so i doubt it was low info. Unless katherine is scum then maybe KTS is next in line on the low info block. I'd assume that would be generally TR'd creature though.

Luca and Mumble were left alive after claiming PR's.

there's DEFINITELY a reason KTS died.

[Tchill13]

gamma i need to know why me being worried about an ausuka town flip is your tipping point to vote me.

I thought you were aiming for it to clear yourself in Cedrick's eyes. How are you worried about it?

im not worried about it? im not worried about cedricks read of me. he almost began to tunnel hopkirk when i was actually worth tunneling instead. Cedrick is gonna do whatever he wants and his opinion of me is the least important to me.

[Tchill13]

my issue with tchill is him using activity again when it didn't work out for him the first time. you'd think he'd learn from his mistake. lack of activity isn't a scumtell

asukua would be a good vote, I don't see PL people past day 1 a good idea.

activity? ACTIVITY!?!? You people said we had enough info from katherine based on 1 long post. Well its doubled people. WE have TWO long post from katherine now. I made a case on katherine based off his content. It's not an activity case. Activity maybe the reason I voted katherine over ausuka but i doubt BOTH are scum. That would be too easy. Of the two Ausuka is more likely to be town. So that plus I want to see more from katherine means I vote katherine first.

[Tchill13]

I don't think Luca should take his claim back
I also don't think we should lynch him for now even if I think he could be scum.

Let's say I'm scum. I lynch Luca. He flips town so I'm gonna push Katherine. Katherine flips town. Guess who's lynched next? Me. It's a stupid road to go down if I'm scum. One with limited possibilities. If you're scum you want as many possibilities as possible at all times.

you know luca isn't going to really get lynched today though. So you as scum could push luca and be written off as a dumb townie.

So heres two people majorly opposed to the luca lynch today.

I need to know why luca is town and why an unkillable PR, where thats his main power, is important to town if it's true. Wouldn't that suggest a vig or something?

It seems more important to scum fake claiming imo. Of course im dead null on Luca. I'm just viewing it as a possibility.

I think this is really the only thing i said about Maria. She's a scum lean due to some PoE. Due to the fact she's sitting back and picking her spots.

[Tchill13]

MariaR wanting KTS makes sense.

please explain this when you can.

[Tchill13]

my issue with tchill is him using activity again when it didn't work out for him the first time. you'd think he'd learn from his mistake. lack of activity isn't a scumtell

asukua would be a good vote, I don't see PL people past day 1 a good idea.

Hop/asuka/tchill still hasn’t changed and all look viable.

I get the Maria and Katherine pushes, but don’t agree with them.

see this is why idc about cedricks opinion. It's almost as if the lack of activity clears katherine as town for this guy. Of course when you get a player that really shouldn't be scumread (Hopkirk) he's all in on that. Makes no sense to TR Katherine and SR Hopkirk at this point.

[Tchill13]

Alright someone else please ask questions about my catch up.

[Tchill13]

Tchill. You mentioned Katherine didn’t take a hard stance on implosion but did you?

You hopped on when gamma and havo voted there but as soon as mumbles did you hopped off. You didn’t give a reason for it.

That hop off given the flip is prett damning imo

I actually only TR'D Luca and implosion but since they were the lynch candidates It didn't matter to me really who got voted out. I pretty much said screw it. Made a hard stance for future analysis and it was the worst possible thing I could have done.

[Tchill13]

if I was scum with this playerlist I feel like it'd be the easiest win of my life considering a few tactics I wanted to try. Oh well another day.
Anyway I'm talking to scum anyway so that's fine and dandy
Pedit: That's a risk you're suppose to take bringing it up yourself as scum makes it look like you planned it and ruins all credit for said action duh.

Well this player list lynched scum day 1. I'd say it's a decent player list.

[Tchill13]

once i flip town make sure to look at the fact cedrick decided to tunnel hopkirk before tunneling me early day 2.

He also was the only one off both main wagons.

[Tchill13]

cedrick, maria, auskuka, katherine, luca. 2 scum is in there. I'll just take your words that since creature is posting he's locktown.

[Tchill13]

Reading the way the wagon developed again. Tchill has to be scum off. He joined it for no reason as it was growing, hopped off when imp was at l-1. It would explain the Luca push also. I really don’t think anyone expected a lynch to happen that fast, especially his partners.

VOTE: tchill

Now I know others tr him based of meta but tchill’s main pushes d1 were mumble and Katherine for basically lurking. Gave no reason for his implosion vote and hops off and votes Luca.

Notes. Post 735 - Luca and imp are strong town reads
Posts 995 - when given the options of imp or me, he chooses me and says he mentioned earlier he tr imp and Luca
Post - 1054 he says he’ll kynch mumble or Luca. No explanation for the Luca 180 (VC had imp at 3, mumble 4, Luca 5)

Luca tr wasn’t serious. Imp was growing support.

Yeah I feel good with this

Also. You're pretty much calling me the worst scum player on site if you vote me. I understand though. TBH I'd probably tunnel me.

[Tchill13]

kts admitted to half ass reading the beginning of one game.

My scum meta points to me being town here. I'm not an idiot when I play scum.

[Tchill13]

once i flip town make sure to look at the fact cedrick decided to tunnel hopkirk before tunneling me early day 2.

He also was the only one off both main wagons.

I haven’t tunneled anyone day 2. I don’t really appreciate you discreding me like this. I took time to read the entire series of pages and you stood out the most.

ok ok. Almost. The tunnel was in site but you veered off the path. I'll admit that.

[Tchill13]

wait nvm read the game maria linked. he's scum here LOL.

i've nailed like 2 wolves already, but there might be a wolf eluding me. depends on tchill's flip.

deepwolf: maria or gamma (this depends on flips), implosion, mumble, tchill wolves.

ausoka, katherine gotta be sorted.

i think that's sorta gamesolving, but a wolf might be eluding me.

don't need to push you, and didn't need to read the entire game.

yeah here is the "meta" thing.

[Tchill13]

I don’t tr you. Your pushes this game have been weak and for not good reasons. If I’m wrong I apologize but it’s you or asuka and given the wagon progression it looks like you.

i'm not mad? you just said you're lynching me because its easier.

[Tchill13]

vig shoot implosion

vig shoot implosion

this is my cover for when i shoot implosion

so mafia knew there was probably a vig in the game im assuming. (this would mean luca is probably scum wouldn't it?)

and this is probably why KTS was NK'd over Mumble, Luca or katherine.

[Tchill13]

Also. You're pretty much calling me the worst scum player on site

No I’m not.

and i mean if im scum here have you seen scum play a worse game before? honest question.

[Tchill13]

I don’t tr you. Your pushes this game have been weak and for not good reasons. If I’m wrong I apologize but it’s you or asuka and given the wagon progression it looks like you.

i'm not mad? you just said you're lynching me because its easier.

That isn’t even remotely close to what i said. I said you make the most sense given the way the wagons developed.

I misread. I thought you meant the progression of my wagon and the lack of progression of Ausuka's wagon is why you're voting me.

[Tchill13]

Yes I’ve seen way worse. You have had people defend you. That’s signs of good scum play.

Getting caught by poe isn’t that bad.

I have no clue why im being defended tbh. I feel like it's buddying.

[Tchill13]

well i will say this.

i think its either Luca/cedrick

or a mixture of Maria/Ausuka/Katherine.

[Tchill13]

Also we're totally cool with letting katherine slide to day 3? yeah nothing alarming there.

[Tchill13]

Those 2 posts kind of contradict each other.

“I think I’m being buddied”

“I scum read people who aren’t buddying me”

If you think you are buddying, why not pressure those people?

If you aren’t even trying to do that, that buddying comment comes off as fake to me.

Ausuka TR's me and i scumread her. I'm in no position to pressure anyone. It's best i give my thoughts on the game state rn and if it seems like I may not be the lynch today I will gladly pressure and push lynches on people. Those people being either Ausuka or Katherine.

[Tchill13]

Reading the way the wagon developed again. Tchill has to be scum off. He joined it for no reason as it was growing, hopped off when imp was at l-1. It would explain the Luca push also. I really don’t think anyone expected a lynch to happen that fast, especially his partners.

VOTE: tchill

Now I know others tr him based of meta but tchill’s main pushes d1 were mumble and Katherine for basically lurking. Gave no reason for his implosion vote and hops off and votes Luca.

Notes. Post 735 - Luca and imp are strong town reads
Posts 995 - when given the options of imp or me, he chooses me and says he mentioned earlier he tr imp and Luca
Post - 1054 he says he’ll kynch mumble or Luca. No explanation for the Luca 180 (VC had imp at 3, mumble 4, Luca 5)

Luca tr wasn’t serious. Imp was growing support.

Yeah I feel good with this

i checked the VC. I'm at L-1. Yeah I should definitely be pushing people rn... lol.

[Tchill13]

Gamma and havo should probably never be lynched due to placement on the Implosion wagon. Hopkirk just bleeds town.

Towns best thing to do is figure out for sure what alignment Luca is. After that this game will be a cake walk. If luca is town then scum is on then Implosion wagon SHOULD be all town.

If luca is scum Cedrick is probably the partner. If i think his main is who i think it is he's too good of a player not to open the day pushing me. He instead opened pushing Hopkirk. I TR'd him hard because i've seen him be stubborn but I'm as scummy as can be rn, Hopkirk never was scummy.

Of course if Luca is town then cedrick is town and i can totally see why He's doing this as town.

[Tchill13]

Also nobody ever explained why lynching an unnkillable PR is a bad idea. Luca didn't spearhead the wagon. It was a survivalistic hammer. I don't see why he's untouchable. If luca is scum obviously scum are gonna fight his lynch because that leaves one scum left. If luca is town scum will fight that lynch because after we know for certain luca's alignment the game is MUCH, MUCH easier.

So i'm not sure why we are avoiding a lynch that would hurt scum either way.

I'll go to my grave saying Luca should be lynched until i'm given a good reason as to why he shouldn't be.

[Tchill13]

vig shoot implosion

vig shoot implosion

this is my cover for when i shoot implosion

so mafia knew there was probably a vig in the game im assuming. (this would mean luca is probably scum wouldn't it?)

and this is probably why KTS was NK'd over Mumble, Luca or katherine.

I'm telling you rn Scum thought there was a vig due to their Night roles, aka unkillable scum in the night phase, seen one player mention a vig. Then killed him because of it. This would mean Luca is almost definitely scum.

It explains why Mumble wasn't killed after a full tracker claim. It gives a reason for the KTS kill.

So if luca flips scum then the last one is either Maria or Cedrick. (both have said that luca lynch will not happen today)

If he flips town it leaves us with the strongest Wagon Analysis possible due to the whole player list (except Cedrick) being on a scum lynch or a town lynch.

And IF luca flips town I specifically (if i'm still alive) am left with Maria/Ausuka/Katherine as my scum pool.

[Tchill13]

well im trying. Yeah i knew it was sarcasm but as scum i've been openly sarcastic about discussing things in the scum thread and pulled it off. You never REALLY know.

[Tchill13]

thanks for that VC idk how i was so off.

[Tchill13]

and WHY THE HELL would i bring attention to my own NK choice? You're viewing this from the perspective of scum wiggling out of a lynch.

try viewing this from a perspective of a stupid townie trying to figure things out.

[Tchill13]

So you think scum bussed implosion? Who.

Both scenarios make sense if you believe scum didn't bus implosion.

[Tchill13]

Well I will say if Luca is scum then pretty much anyone else can be scum. It doesn't have to be cdrick . Cedrick just stuck out to me because he wasn't on either wagon.

Technically Maria could be scum no matter Luca's alignment (according to my own line of thought)

I'll iso Implosion tomorrow to see if I can find anything.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: maria

[Tchill13]

UNVOTE:

Actually I haven't gotten around to reading implosions iso and I find it alarming how many people are hard defending Katherine on little to nothing.

[Tchill13]

And ftr, I mentioned those people because they were the people I either had solid reads on, or wanted to float ideas about. I want more input on gamma and on KTS from other people.

Luca pinged town at one point but idr where and am not in a big rush to sort that slot. Also need to sort brass and havo. Creature I don't have a read on yet but he's the kind of slot where if everyone else calls him town I'm probably willing to defer to consensus; afaik he's gotten this recent meta of contributing iff he's town, and I don't think that meta existed last time that I played with him.

So gamma, once again, is probably lock town.

also implosion is just sheeping the creature read.

[Tchill13]

Man he talks about luca a lot. He seemed to TR Ausuka hard. Wondered why there was a wagon on her at all to begin with and didn't mention katherine hardly at all.

I wasn't sure what to make of his interactions/comments of maria. Didn't SEEM SvS to me.

[Tchill13]

Can we lynch in me and Aus? Leave Kath/Tchi out of it ty

Why are you arguing to lynch yourself

*shrug* Idm if I get lynched or not I'm lynchbait as town so I'm used to coming under pressure it's no big deal to me. I rather we lynch in my and my top sr though cause if I get lynched Aus is next and that nails a scum so works for me ^_~

but you dont necesarrily think its aus and katherine?

[Tchill13]

idk, players are hard to sort.

so no thoughts on events since your last post?

Is creature lock scum since he got prodded now?

[Tchill13]

Well I hate my catch up didn't change anything for you. I'm not surprised though.

[Tchill13]

This is another reason I suspect tchill. I can't believe he has never seen somebody make that kind of comment before. It's so common on this site now, almost every game somebody tells the "vig" to shoot somebody. Tchill actually thinking mafia took that as a vig claim is weird to me.

im saying mafia didn't have a particular reason to kill anyone and thought "might as well take a chance on this". Sarcasm isn't always sarcasm on here. Very easy to fake sarcasm and get away with it.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: implosion

Votes implosion to put him L-2 with no reasoning attached.

What about KTS prodding implosion then switching back to mumble after a few votes were built up?

Soon after starts to shade KTS over his vote-switching.

VOTE: mumble

I don't even care if There's no real evidence to suggest he isn't town at this point. I'm OK with lynching dead weight that'll more than likely always be in my lynch pool day 1. A few ppl have made a strong stance on him so this will be good.

Switches to Mumble despite implosion not having even posted between these posts.

Tchill wanted to have it on record that he voted implosion, but was itching for a reason to jump off the wagon. This resembles his later actions where he voted implosion but quickly switched to my wagon.

i vote anyone and everyone every day 1 lol.

[Tchill13]

I don’t understand why Maria is saying to lynch her. It’s really weird. I don’t have an issue with a havo lynch but the evidence points to tchill and there’s resistance to it which means something to me. If tchill was town and being treated like a scapegoat he’d be lynched already.

I’m staying with a tchill wagon. Hopefully others come around on it. I don’t trust havo’s and maria’s meta town read on tchill because game related evidence trumps meta.

this is why cedrick is probably town.

[Tchill13]

The fact everyone has this same lynch pool should be a giant red sign and maybe I'm blind but considering I have big tr's on 2/3 of the lynch pool minus myself this is a big "uh oh this is gonna go bad"
So go on and lynch me if it will wake everyone up and say "hey look you're incorrect focus else where"

Hell maybe not even Auska is scum because if everyone is agreeing with the same lynch pool it means scum are content with said lynch pool
VOTE: Havo
I'll vote here for now
This ced maybe Luca aus for scum

Or maybe it means that lynch pool is correct.

So basically by switching your vote, you’re now saying you have no idea who scum is?
After you were begging for town to vote for you or Ausuka.
Well, that’s what town started doing. You should be happy instead of revolting.

It's never that easy. And considering I tr 2 of the players in said lynch pool no. I wasn't begging anyone it was a suggestion and then I re thought my suggestion people rethink sometimes it happens.

what about ackhams razor? or whatever its called.

[Tchill13]

I feel like its probably best to reread at this point. I've thrown out about 3 or 4 different scenarios that could be playing out that revolve around scum not bussing.

If scum bussed i think it was creature. His "Activity" has been slim.

And cedrick, my "easy" pushes come from an analytical standpoint of what either brings us the most info or lynches someone that could always be in the lynch pool. So at least im being consistent in that. I always thought you wanted the most efficient lynches possible. Info and eliminating from your lynch pool is as efficient as it gets.

[Tchill13]

What's the reason we're suspecting Maria currently? Is it just her redirecting the lynch, cos that feels like a bad reason if it's by itself

she was on the Luca wagon, her saying "lynch me" (its great to say if your scum when you have no attention on you at that point) and I haven't seen great reasoning from her HARD stances.

[Tchill13]

Like she’s trying to discourage kts from using meta on tchill

She's buddied me hard the whole game.

[Tchill13]

Hard TR: Havo, Gamma, Hopkirk

Almost hard TR: Cedrick, Luca

Null: Katherine, mumble ( could very well still be scum)

Scum lean: Ausuka, Maria

[Tchill13]

Or y’all are scum together

Dang it cedrick, you sly devil. Can't get anything past you.

[Tchill13]

a few of us have 200+ post... Katherine has 12 but we ABSOLUTELY can't scum read him. laughable.

Look if im scum i want my slot and katherine in here till lylo. Thats for sure.

So look at who's advocating against those lynches and ask yourself why that's town motivated.

[Tchill13]

The accusation that you're keeping someone and their constant suspect to lylo

thats not it. Its the slot with the most confusion and the most uncertainty around them.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if maria flipped scum here? This seems like experienced scum play to me. Of course It could just be different style of town.

[Tchill13]

I tr the slot I don't really give a fuck what someones number of posts are that's not AI it's the actions that are. And quite frankly I haven't seen anything that points to scum Kath they're just in this "poe" and it's easy to push that because they're a lurker slot it's basically what everyone did to mumble before he claimed

neutral stance on implosion, on the luca wagon and was right about KTS alignment which is very similar to Ausuka.... Yeah. Kath is definitely locktown lol.

[Tchill13]

you dont have good reasons for defending suspicious slots.

you claim you're ok with getting lynched when you didn't have much attention (red flag).

and ik how to make terrible post too thank you very much. not just sarcastic.

[Tchill13]

"good enough compared" yeah thats good to know that's your standard.

How many votes did you have on you at that point? idc how many ppl say you should be lynched. Its all about where the actual votes are.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: katherine

maria's reasoning is solid. Also dislike tchill's 41. Also skeptical of cedrick's opening.

so the scumteam of me kath/impo thought
"Oh let's make a scumcase on kath and buss within the first 50 posts"
You gotta see how that logic is a...yeah

this is hardly a case and um... quite the overreaction.

[Tchill13]

VC 2.3

votes

Ausuka

(1): MariaR

Tchill13

(3): Luca Blight, Gamma Emerald, Cedrick

katherine

(1): Tchill13

MariaR

(2): Hopkirk, Ausuka

Not Voting

(4): Creature, Havo, Mumble, katherine

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch

The day 2 deadline is in

: (expired on 2018-04-01 12:33:59)

Mod Notes

:
If you notice an error in the votecount please let me know.

Can we lynch in me and Aus? Leave Kath/Tchi out of it ty

Why even mention katherine? i was the only person voting him here? Did you expect me to hop on Ausuka after that statement and tr yo get a push there?

You only had 2 votes at the time you stated it. Not even halfway to being lynched.

[Tchill13]

wheres the case? thats the overreaction. I've also seen scum bus early before. A lot actually.

[Tchill13]

Yes. To see how many votes she had when she declared she or ausuka should be lynched and u stumbled upon that.

[Tchill13]

Or I should have stopped posting at post 10 and been lock town this entire game

[Tchill13]

I immediately like Maria more because supernatural references are awesome.

[Tchill13]

no surprise there

[Tchill13]

Man he talks about luca a lot.

So does that make me more likely town or scum?

You never answered this, Tchill.

more likely town

[Tchill13]

Luca I see that you liked my end of day 1 play. Mimicking is the highest form of flattery.

[Tchill13]

So um. I still think Maria is the lynch. Not sure why you're voting Katherine cedrick. The odds of a replace in pushing me are pretty high. You'll get your tchill lynch soon.

[Tchill13]

Stahp
Maria is town

How?

She didn't really give an answer to the fact that she's hard defending the two slots that would help scum the most in lylo.

[Tchill13]

Stahp
Maria is town

How?

She didn't really give an answer to the fact that she's hard defending the two slots that would help scum the most in lylo.

Maybe you're right maybe you're wrong but I can't help that I townread said slots my man.

Gamma I doubt you seen this but Maria literally just said she didn't really have a reason.

[Tchill13]

How many "feels" reads are there gonna be this game?

[Tchill13]

Oh my lord...

You're way off my man. Of course the game has gotten so stagnant that that theory doesn't surprise me.

Flavor maybe able to revitalize it. I'm looking forward to it.

[Tchill13]

which is what i meant when i said just because kts vig thing came off as sarcastic doesn't mean scum KNEW it was sarcasm for sure.

[Tchill13]

The game was dead before that lol. Just chill out a bit. Give them time to form opinions.

Are you and Maria scum together? That's the scum team isn't it?

[Tchill13]

Everybody has the same town pool and scum pool but nobody wants to commit to anything because all reads are "feels right" reads for the most part.

[Tchill13]

So Luca and gamma,while we're waiting, you're dead set on lynching me and there's nothing that can change your mind?

[Tchill13]

Luca what's your scum pool besides me?

[Tchill13]

I think I've made that pretty clear already.

I don't remember any of the others. It takes you more effort to say that than it does list a few names.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: maria

[Tchill13]

Yeah almost as towny as you've been creature.

[Tchill13]

I can't provide factual evidence. All I can do is tell you why I played the end of day 1 the way I did.

Also I'm better than this as scum. You can meta me if you want. If not fine. Flavor should be able to confirm this though.

If I was scum a claim would have been killed. Either mumble or Luca. No way a hard claim doesn't get NK'D over a sarcastic KTS vig comment.

[Tchill13]

Well. This is not your 25 percent kookoo. Of course I can't blame anyone for mislynching me at this point.

[Tchill13]

Why wouldn't you kill a tracker?

[Tchill13]

Also Tchill hopped off implosion when he was l-1, pretty bad look for Teech if I do say so myself

Its's literally the only reason I understand being so heavily scum read at this point. I don't have a justifiable explanation for that.

[Tchill13]

Can you claim, Tchill?

If iI claim VT I'll be insta lynched. If I claim PR I'll be called a liar and lynched. There's no oint .

[Tchill13]

What if I have a result that could be an innocent depending on your claim?

I'm a VT.

[Tchill13]

And we're gonna assume scum though to kill the guy who mentioned vig, a PR that is worth protecting, over the guy who claimed tracker?

[Tchill13]

And we're gonna assume scum though to kill the guy who mentioned vig, a PR that is worth protecting, over the guy who claimed tracker?

Excuse me? How is an offhand mention of vig important? He didn't flip vig or scum so it's irrelevant.

Is it? Tell me why scum killed him. Give me a better reason than that.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: ausuka

If ausuka flips scum and I'm auto lynched because of it that's fine. It's worth trading one scum for one town.

[Tchill13]

1) he was powertown
2) no one really wanted to lynch him outside of Cedrick
3) Mumble was the only claimed PR that would need protection, therefore it wasn't wise to shoot there

These are OK.

[Tchill13]

I was townreading him for activity because that's his meta but I looked at it and he hasn't been all that active. I have more posts than him as do most people. He's probably busy irl rn though but if this keeps up he could definitely be mafia.

I was townreading him for activity because that's his meta but I looked at it and he hasn't been all that active. I have more posts than him as do most people. He's probably busy irl rn though but if this keeps up he could definitely be mafia.

He's been posting consistently though, even though he hasn't posted much

Consistent activity isn't alignment indicative though? Or creature is just the special occasion?

I thought content mattered. Apparently that's on a pick and choose basis.

[Tchill13]

Me, Katherine, Maria and creature. There's no real reason to TR any of us imo.

[Tchill13]

No. I'm not gonna give up on how stupid you're creature tr is. You just said he's lock town no matter what happens the rest of the game lol.

You're credibility should be questioned if your reads are that ridiculous.

I can't look any worse than hopping off implosion at L-1. I'm not afraid of how bad I look. Ik I need to be lynched and ik I probably will be.

[Tchill13]

Me, Katherine, Maria and creature. There's no real reason to TR any of us imo.

Keep prying my friend it just makes you look worse

You also provided a great reason to TR just one of us.

[Tchill13]

Why do you think he got NK'D?

[Tchill13]

Because he caught and tunnelled 1 scum, and was undeniably the most competent player here.

That's worth using your NK over a claimed tracker?

[Tchill13]

Only thing I'm gonna argue is that there's only 2 scum alive so of course it's a little more powerful.

I honestly think it was the vig mention but yall can hold hands and laugh at me post game when I'm wrong.

[Tchill13]

Man. What should I say...

So why didn't I get lynched earlier? Why did it take this long?

[Tchill13]

Maria/FL play just makes a lot more sense than Tchill play as scum IMO. Maria's read on Kath slot still feels like S/S and I still don't get why Scum!Tchill is literally scumreading anyone who starts townreading him. Why is that scum play?

He has to townread/scumread someone. Scum-Tchill (applies to others too) can't afford too townread too many people who are alternative viable lynches.
If he townreads people in the potential lynch pool then 1.) it's harder for him to lynch them later, 2.) he loses flexibility, 3.) depending on who his partners are, it might force him to scumread them or at least increase the likelihood of them being lynched, 4.) he's more likely to get lynched- especially if he tries to push generally townread people who aren't viable lynches.
This doesn't just apply to Tchill, but more generally.

No. I scum read them because it's stupid to TR me at this point. It's that simple.

[Tchill13]

I'm not looking for "viable lynches". I've already got a scum pool of 3, maybe 4.

If my play is centered around viable lynches explain why I pushed Luca so had at the beginning of day 2. In what world does scum actually think that lynch is gonna go through?

[Tchill13]

Man. What should I say...

So why didn't I get lynched earlier? Why did it take this long?

What?

Well scum would know I'd be an easy lynch day 2. I think they tried to lynch someone else, keep me around, then decided to just go ahead and lynch me because of how slow the game became.

The fact that the majority of townies didn't insta lynch me is honestly alarming.

[Tchill13]

Guess Flavor Leaf is town.

VOTE: Tchill

L-2

Creature calls flavor town because flavor called creature town. Proceeds to vote another flavor town read.

[Tchill13]

So hopkirk doesn't realize that I'm not playing with longevity in mind at all.

I knew I was gonna be the day 2 lynched. I was doomed when I hopped off implosion at L-1.

My best bet if scum didn't bus is Maria and Katherine.

Worth noting that hopkirk clearly intended to vote me.the whole day phase but didn't lay one down on me that's threatening till now.

[Tchill13]

After I flip town, the fact that Maria rose to a higher wagon than me, but was still not lynched should tell you something.

Scum kept this day open to find another lynch that wasn't me. There was opportunity for one but it wasn't taken. Probably because Maria is scum.

[Tchill13]

As long as I'm in this game I'm a minimal threat to scum due to past actions. They'd keep me around if they could. They were clearly able with a Maria lynch and it didn't happen. That's all I'm saying.

[Tchill13]

I've thrown out about... 4 or 5 different outcomes because I simply don't know what's going on. My day 1 play is geared towards a mislynch day 1. So of course when we actually lynch then I'm in uncommon territory.

If scum didn't bus. Maria/katherine (maybe ausuka but I doubt it.)

If scum did bus then it's Luca/???

Only issue I have is lynching me doesn't lead to anything. If I flip town then what? Because I can assure you I won't flip scum which means that town flip needs to lead to something decent.

[Tchill13]

Luca, Katherine and Maria should be the top suspects going into day 3.

[Tchill13]

You'll have to give me a bit of time but sure. Not see why you wouldn't be able if we're on page 75ish.

I just remember looking at implosion associations between the two. I'll have to reread isos.

Ik that Katherine took a neutral stance on implosion and that Luca was heavily talked about by implosion.

[Tchill13]

@Tchill: Can you lay out your thoughts on Katherine('s slot). Preferably both scum/town views since you seem uncertain on him.
Any thoughts on Luca potential or unlikely partners too?

If you're lynched and flip town, they will be likely scum day 3.

I've been pushing Katherine scum the whole time.

Just because I've laid out multiple situations of what scum could be doing doesn't mean the one I'm most sure in involves Katherine being scum.

[Tchill13]

Cedrick/Luca is still really concerning.

you dont say?

I think that was my original push.

Scum bussed: Cedrick/ luca

scum didn't bus: Maria/ katherine.

So had i been viewed widely as town i would demand to ssee a flip from one of those 4. sadly that isn't the case.

[Tchill13]

@Tchill: you had him at null at a point recently.

Looking at Luca/Cedrick, Luca/Ausuka, Luca/Katherine. Don't really see Luca/Tchill or Luca/MariaR and Creature/Mumble/Havo/GE are locktown.

I kept going back and forth on him because every time i pushed for activit (some conent) it never held due to "Activit is NAI blah blah" voices i kept hearing. Putting him at null was a mistake.

[Tchill13]

Creature needs to do more if he wants to be town. A simple meta dive shows he's a rare player that can literally be sorted by the activity overview page.

all i wanted to see is someone else say it.

Gamma, creature can fight his own battles hes a big boy. What would you say to someone LOCK towning me at this point because they "know me". It'd be pretty stupid wouldn't it?

[Tchill13]

Cedrick got crazily defensive when I suggested Luca/him. Luca didn't comment.

Don't care about that, what makes you think scum bussed their strongman over Luca?

implosion would have been lynched eventually. Had way too much heat on him.

[Tchill13]

half the player base honed in on implosion EARLY. That's why you bus him over luca. Luca gets major town cred. Days 2 and 3 should be easy for scum at that point.

Implosion busses luca then half the player base still scum reads implosion due to day 1 play.

[Tchill13]

you can argue the suspicion still staying on implosion but nobody wanted to lynch luca today. Nobody.

[Tchill13]

Either Luca is town or he isn't.

and we won't know that anytime soon, and we aren't lynching him day 2 as he was the counter the a POWERFUL mafia role. move on

this is what made me have the cedrick/luca associative.

[Tchill13]

I'm not sure if he's town or not. That's the point.

So you think implosion/Luca were a team? That’s literally the only way you can be suspicious of Luca.

this one kinda sticks out to. He's saying "do you know how stupid that sounds"

[Tchill13]

No. I scum read them because it's stupid to TR me at this point. It's that simple.

So hopkirk doesn't realize that I'm not playing with longevity in mind at all.

So you're calling people stupid because they defended you but you still think defending you is the smart move?

No. I was mad i was about to get lynched an pitched a fit

in all seriousness i still have hopkirk as lock town.

Hopkirks doing pretty damn good imo and if town win it'll be in large part due to him. I was just irritated ausuka can see me as town but hopkirk can't. It's fine though i can't really blame him.

[Tchill13]

I'd probably vote Luca a day before lylo if it got to that point as a safety measure, will also peruse the logic presented here

You CANT do this. the game changes. Things pop up. Then all of a sudden you have to make a difficult choice. If you know, like REALLY KNOW they can't make it to lylo you lynch them ASAP.

[Tchill13]

Gamma you're a strong TR as well. My issue with defending creature for activity readable play is he'll never change because of that. He'll never progress as a player. I guess that's ok with him though so im not sure why im worried about it.

I just don't like lazy/ bad play being hard defended.

[Tchill13]

No ausuka there's a legit possibility you're still scum.

There's a very minute possibility hopkirk is.

that's the difference.

[Tchill13]

you realize it's as much of my job not to be lynched as a VT as it is to figure out what's going on right ausuka? So of course i have to dance a thin line in surviving and solving. If it seems like i can survuve i play with that in mind. I did have a glimpse of hope for a little bit. So during that time im willing to look the other way on the LEAST likely scum in my scum pool. Now im back to where i should be.

Death is certain.

So honestly In order id guess: Luca, cedrick, Katherine, Maria, ausuka.

I believe the luca bus situation is the one thats playing out. Luca was genuinely upset mumble and katherine were TR'd at the end of day 1 because Luca was scum.

If its not luca and cedrick i'd lynch katherine first because she could be scum with either ausuka or maria but i don't see ausuka and maria being the team.

[Tchill13]

@Tchill: I can see you as town. Luca/Cedrick is a serious concern for me.

Despite so many posts saying Luca is town, Cedrick never actually says why. Examples:
1141- Puts Luca as town (based on the vote?) without reason. Says he doesn't think my vote makes me look town. Should explain why Luca's was better when it was a hammer when Luca was the opposing wagon. Never considers scum-Luca in thread.
1158/1248- Gets ridiculously aggressive when I suggest Luca/Cedrick.
1348- 'Most people will think Luca is town' - why?

KTS kill makes sense with Luca scum if I remember right.

Come to think of it, after claiming, Luca's role isn't any more useful than a VT if there's not solid reason to hard townread him.

i'd throw roses at your feet if i had any. I tried to say this earlier i just didn't lay it out in this manner.

[Tchill13]

That's the hammer btw.

I'm just gonna adopt a mumble/Maria kind of playstyle for the rest of this game - that's about the level of effort this game deserves.

clear frustraition he was run up while others lurked.

My D1 wagon is lookin pretty fucking bad right now. Wouldn't surprise me if all the scum were on it.

then immediately sets multiple targets for day 2.

[Tchill13]

Cedrick/Luca is still really concerning.

you dont say?

I think that was my original push.

Scum bussed: Cedrick/ luca

scum didn't bus: Maria/ katherine.

So had i been viewed widely as town i would demand to ssee a flip from one of those 4. sadly that isn't the case.

I doubt these 4 will be NK'd. So if you must lynch me then fine. I'd get to work on these players though right after.

[Tchill13]

and cedrick was the only one voting off the wagons. Which makes sense if both wagons are on scum.

[Tchill13]

A lynch has been achieved!

VC 1.FINAL

votes

implosion

(7): Hopkirk, Creature, Gamma Emerald, Havo, Mumble, Killthestory, Luca Blight

Mumble

(1): Cedrick

Luca Blight

(5): Ausuka, MariaR, katherine, Tchill13, implosion

Not Voting

(0):

With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch

The day 1 deadline is in

: (expired on 2018-03-22 19:42:59)

Mod Notes

: Cedrick is V/LA until Monday.
Luca Blight is V/LA until Wednesday

[Tchill13]

I personally think the game is a cakewalk after we know luca's alignment for sure.

If he's town scum probably didn't bus implosion, probably their strongest pr when another townie was that close to lynch.

If he's scum Cedrick is the last one.

[Tchill13]

well thats a good point too.

hi kookoo. Just easier to refer to your slot as cedrick due to talking about past play.

[Tchill13]

You think they knew they were doomed and said screw it one of us will get town cred here?

[Tchill13]

VOTE: luca

[Tchill13]

Logically, if people are saying I can only be scum with the Cedrick slot, how about we lynch that slot instead of a claimed PR?

That's not the case at all. It's just the most likely partner if your scum. You could be scum with anybody.

[Tchill13]

That's the hammer btw.

I'm just gonna adopt a mumble/Maria kind of playstyle for the rest of this game - that's about the level of effort this game deserves.

Mumble and Maria.

[Tchill13]

It's based on the fact that you hammered and claimed. Which would clear you full game as scum. You've not sorted anyone or pushed anyone except me this whole day phase. You just pushed my lynch. I don't even remember association ideas from you. You thought you'd just lynch me and go to the next day phse . Sounds like scum to me.

Cedricks case for being scum is associative with you. Not the other way around.

[Tchill13]

That's the hammer btw.

I'm just gonna adopt a mumble/Maria kind of playstyle for the rest of this game - that's about the level of effort this game deserves.

Mumble and Maria.

Where is that me being upset that they are townread?

As I have told you several times already, I was talking about

playstyle

, not

alignment.

That play style led to them not being ran up while you were ran up while playing. Sounds pretty agitated to me.

And I'd think you WOULD be upset mumble was TR'd seeing how that was your vote earlier with implosion and Cedric.

[Tchill13]

Do you think scum bussed?

If so who bussed?

[Tchill13]

Do you think scum bussed?

If so who bussed?

I already said no...

So i think the only reason Town should be ok with dying is if town gain a ton of info from that death.

Town gains little to none on my flip.

Town gains everything on luca's. It almost confirms his and my theory that scum didn't bus if luca flips town. A theory i agree with. A theory that puts more pressure on my scummy slot if true. A theory that shortens the scum list to 3-4 people if correct including me.

So my question is why wouldn't you be ok with dying as town in that situation? I certainly would. It would almost certainly lead to my death, your target, if you flip scum. A town pr's death that isn't protective or investigative is worth one scum right? Luca's death makes the game way too easy if he really believes scum didn't bus and he is ACTUALLY town.

Luca's death makes it way too easy if he's scum.

AND CEDRICKS SLOT AND LUCA ARE LAST MINUTE FIGHTING WITH EACH OTHER TO DISTANCE. more than likely.

[Tchill13]

if you flip town.

[Tchill13]

so you're discrediting the info we get if you flip town?

[Tchill13]

i played a shit game. im not scum.

[Tchill13]

So you're saying me flipping town means everyone on the implosion wagon is conf town?

You're either scum or incredibly naive.

It literally gives us the strongest possible VCA if you flip. That's quite the amount of info.

njotice the cedricks slot flip. Scum can't afford not to hard defend here.

[Tchill13]

i played a shit game. im not scum.

And yet you think you suddenly have all the answers...

yeah because im the greatest to ever play...

No, but i'vee laid the groundwork for a lot more scenarios than you have. I've clearly put in more effort. Can it be scum trying to survive? of course.

IF im capable of this amout off effort though im not obv scumming it up at the end of day 1.

I'll happily say im a better player than that.

[Tchill13]

It is unfortunate I townread the wagon outside of Tchill and Luca could be scum on play, but Tchill is much scummier and people are only pushing Luca and Cedrick as a scum team which they aren't. I am not interested in lynching Luca anymore. Hopkirk, Havo, come on guys you're better than this. Apparently Mumble's voting which is news to me, I didn't know he's posted this day phase.

It's not ONLY luca and Cedrick. It's MOST LIKELY.

Luca if scum could be partners with anyone.

[Tchill13]

So you're saying me flipping town means everyone on the implosion wagon is conf town?

You're either scum or incredibly naive.

It literally gives us the strongest possible VCA if you flip. That's quite the amount of info.

njotice the cedricks slot flip. Scum can't afford not to hard defend here.

What if the Cedrick slot is scum that wants to bask in the glory of my townflip?

It's unlikely everyone will suddenly switch back to you at this point.

why bring up the possibility of cedrick being scum now? have you thought of that possibility before? have you sorted or pushed Cedrick much at all?

[Tchill13]

So you're saying me flipping town means everyone on the implosion wagon is conf town?

You're either scum or incredibly naive.

It literally gives us the strongest possible VCA if you flip. That's quite the amount of info.

njotice the cedricks slot flip. Scum can't afford not to hard defend here.

What if the Cedrick slot is scum that wants to bask in the glory of my townflip?

It's unlikely everyone will suddenly switch back to you at this point.

Nobody has said I'm town if you flip town. It is just that nobody has said that I'm scum unless its with you. As far as I know, most people have me as relatively null individually.

I know at least Tchill said you're town if I flip town.

yeah im pretty sure i knew whos alt that was and im very comfortable with my ability to read them. I could see their play as town but the associations are pretty strong here.

Its the only association i need if luca flips scum until cedrick flips, and IF he flips thats a big IF, town. It's too obvious.

[Tchill13]

So you're saying me flipping town means everyone on the implosion wagon is conf town?

You're either scum or incredibly naive.

It literally gives us the strongest possible VCA if you flip. That's quite the amount of info.

njotice the cedricks slot flip. Scum can't afford not to hard defend here.

What if the Cedrick slot is scum that wants to bask in the glory of my townflip?

It's unlikely everyone will suddenly switch back to you at this point.

why bring up the possibility of cedrick being scum now? have you thought of that possibility before? have you sorted or pushed Cedrick much at all?

Because I don't want to die and then everyone think me being town automatically means the Cedrick slot is town.

I'm the only one that said that you just admitted it.

[Tchill13]

It is unfortunate I townread the wagon outside of Tchill and Luca could be scum on play, but Tchill is much scummier and people are only pushing Luca and Cedrick as a scum team which they aren't. I am not interested in lynching Luca anymore. Hopkirk, Havo, come on guys you're better than this. Apparently Mumble's voting which is news to me, I didn't know he's posted this day phase.

It's not ONLY luca and Cedrick. It's MOST LIKELY.

Luca if scum could be partners with anyone.

Your case is us as partners, and your push is us as partners. I know that is not the case, and if you're wrong on that front you're wrong overall. I am not interested in lynching Luca before you. If you want to talk to me about Ausuka or Maria, I'm all ears. I am okay getting mislynched if Luca gets lynched today and flips scum, its fair. I will do my VCA before I am mislynched tomorrow though. We have 2 scum lynches in a row. That said, I am not interested in voting him because you have not proposed a single possible partner besides my slot and your entire case revolves around us being a scum team. Also, he was the counterwagon to the day 1 scum lynch which is town points.

My case on YOUR slot has yall being a team. my case on lucas slot has nothing at all to do with that.

[Tchill13]

Anyways, Tchill, who's his partner if I'm not? Because I'm not, and I really don't see the scum case, but limitless non-compulsive commuter is not a townie role.

idk. Flat out idk. There's no reason to need to know. That's a lot of speculation about a flip that is still uncertain. You treat it pretty certain though.

[Tchill13]

I've thrown out about... 4 or 5 different outcomes because I simply don't know what's going on. My day 1 play is geared towards a mislynch day 1. So of course when we actually lynch then I'm in uncommon territory.

If scum didn't bus. Maria/katherine (maybe ausuka but I doubt it.)

If scum did bus then it's Luca/???

Only issue I have is lynching me doesn't lead to anything. If I flip town then what? Because I can assure you I won't flip scum which means that town flip needs to lead to something decent.

Your bussing team is stupid. Why would they flip to their strongman over whatever Luca is?

Luca switched to voting Implosion on L1. If it's bussing, it's last second bussing to avoid autolosing on the lynch on Implosion.

If anyone else switched (lets say Tchill which is plausible for scum there), then this votecount really doesn't make them look good.

implosion (7): Hopkirk, Creature, Gamma Emerald, Havo, Mumble, Killthestory, Tchill
Mumble (2): Cedrick, Luca Blight
Luca Blight (5): Ausuka, MariaR, katherine, Tchill13, implosion
(Implosion switched to Luca 10 minutes before Luca hammered (signal/consent to bus?) as well. If Tchill hammered before that then it'd be Cedrick/Luca/Implosion on Mumble.)

You'd also bus Implosion over Luca because Luca's claimed commuter which has implications for how valuable he is to the scumteam there, and because Implosion didn't have the opportunity to hammer Luca, but Luca had the opportunity to hammer Implosion.

If people buy Luca's claim/bus, he makes it to lylo/endgame without having to explain why he hasn't been killed. There's no threat to him. If people completely buy his claim then scum autowin.
Luca's play today is a lot lazier/conservative than his role should suggest.

@Tchill: I can see you as town. Luca/Cedrick is a serious concern for me.

Despite so many posts saying Luca is town, Cedrick never actually says why. Examples:
1141- Puts Luca as town (based on the vote?) without reason. Says he doesn't think my vote makes me look town. Should explain why Luca's was better when it was a hammer when Luca was the opposing wagon. Never considers scum-Luca in thread.
1158/1248- Gets ridiculously aggressive when I suggest Luca/Cedrick.
1348- 'Most people will think Luca is town' - why?

KTS kill makes sense with Luca scum if I remember right.

Come to think of it, after claiming, Luca's role isn't any more useful than a VT if there's not solid reason to hard townread him.

luca feels like a powerwolf, but it depends on what havo flips. i think i only lynch one of havo or luca.

luca wagon is super pure and super ok.

LOL.

glad i didn't hammer you senior mumble. you want to take out luca now?

Yeah, I could see Luca wanting this dead. Makes more sense than Tchill killing KTS too.
I feel like KTS would go into the day promoting the townblock (Hopkirk/GE/KTS/Creature/Havo/Mumble), but still wanting Luca lynched.

Previous VC is useful too. Luca/Implosion also left the Mumble wagon to vote each other.

i can't give you specific interaction. I'll leave you with this though. Hopkirk put MUCH more effort into explanation than i ever thought about doing.

[Tchill13]

Anyways, Tchill, who's his partner if I'm not? Because I'm not, and I really don't see the scum case, but limitless non-compulsive commuter is not a townie role.

idk. Flat out idk. There's no reason to need to know. That's a lot of speculation about a flip that is still uncertain. You treat it pretty certain though.

Well, if you have no guesses then it sounds like you're just pushing it as a team and not an individual scumread which doesn't work with me being town.

nice avi.

Me having no other guesses shows my emphasis is on lynching Luca. One scum at a time. For things his play. I haven't mentioned why he is scum due to CEDRICKS play.

I've mentioned why CEDRICK is scum due to luca's play. you're trying to discredit my luca push through an association read that has nothing to do with luca and everything to do with you. You're obviously worried about what happens if he flips scum (which YOU shouldn't know for certain yet unless scum with him). This is self preservation at it's finest.