Open 588 Pick Your Poison -- Game Over
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VOTE: acryon
Choo choo!-
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In post 24, deathfisaro wrote:Okay someone who is not Drezi, Victor, or croboss give me a good town reason to build a half lynch wagon on the first page.
I can see how scum can benefit from such actions but hard to find a reason for me join in.
Then don't.
Just watch what happens and analyze.
Duh.-
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Do you think people will townread you for asking dumb questions?-
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VOTE: pisskop
Not so much.-
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Not in a way that draws unnecessary attention right out the gate, I'd wager.-
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In post 51, Drezi wrote:In post 24, deathfisaro wrote:Okay someone who is not Drezi, Victor, or croboss give me a good town reason to build a half lynch wagon on the first page.
I can see how scum can benefit from such actions but hard to find a reason for me join in.
What do you all think of this post? It feels like dropping by only to say "hi, im not scum".
In post 35, deathfisaro wrote:usually a quickbuilt wagon lacks a good case with valid reasons attached to the votes, thus not only can scums lynch town but vote analysis post flip would give little clues as to which of them were opportunistic scums
+ taking the chance to contribute to a non-existant case.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: deathfisaro
You're jumping on the easy read.
Easy reads are often wrong reads.-
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In post 54, Riabi wrote:
Yes, but, early on in the game, when we don't have a lot to go on, shouldn't people be pressuring the easy reads to what comes of them?
I don't like this post, I really don't like this post. Someone who has played as many games as you have House should know this, so why try to dissuade Drezi here?
VOTE: House
Because, as I stated, easy reads are often the wrong reads.
When you see scummy shit right off the bat, 9 times out of 10, it's coming from town. Scum are too busy being careful and trying to blend in. For scum to slip this hard right out the gate, they'd have to be pretty stupid.
Do you always assume your adversary is an idiot? Because if so, you're simply projecting.-
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In post 57, pisskop wrote:Not sure if House is actually a 'jerk', role playing a jerk, or pretending to be a jerk. :\
We can ask questions, which elicit responses. Its just this forum seems to frown upon that sort of proactiveness.
It's a simple task to ISO me and get that answer for yourself.-
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In post 60, Riabi wrote:
To me it feels like House is trying to talk Drezi out of voting for deathfisario. While I don't necessarily buy Drezi's case in 51, I also don't feel like there's any reason to say "nope, you're wrong, and you should change your vote" which is what it feels like House is saying.
Yeah, because Depi is so likely to be lynched this early in D1 that I'm scared my scum buddy is about to be lynched.
Thattotallymakes sense.-
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In post 71, SIR CYANIDE wrote:In post 68, House wrote:In post 60, Riabi wrote:
To me it feels like House is trying to talk Drezi out of voting for deathfisario. While I don't necessarily buy Drezi's case in 51, I also don't feel like there's any reason to say "nope, you're wrong, and you should change your vote" which is what it feels like House is saying.
Yeah, because Depi is so likely to be lynched this early in D1 that I'm scared my scum buddy is about to be lynched.
Thattotallymakes sense.
Who is Depi? Do you mean Drezi?
No, we're discussing deathfisaro. Depi is his preferred nickname.-
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In post 76, Count Dooku wrote:
First part: okay, I am sorry, I misunderstood you.In post 70, deathfisaro wrote:In post 48, Count Dooku wrote:@deathfisaro
Why would a vig shoot two times right in the first night? Crazy talk.
3 deaths in 1 day because
1 mislynch D1
1 scum shoot town N1
1 Vig shoot town N1
D2 opens
7-3 = 4 town
3-0 = 3 scum
Welcome to LyLo. Vig can't shoot twice in a night. Can only shoot up to twice over minimum two nights.
Second part: you forgot about the 3 PRs. There's 10 town players, not 7.
IRT second part: This could be a townslip.-
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In post 80, pisskop wrote:The even number of people suggests that you don't play 'basic games'. And that leads me to wonder where you came; I would imagine a quick-mafia site.
-How much mafia have you played total?
In post 66, House wrote:In post 57, pisskop wrote:Not sure if House is actually a 'jerk', role playing a jerk, or pretending to be a jerk. :\
We can ask questions, which elicit responses. Its just this forum seems to frown upon that sort of proactiveness.
It's a simple task to ISO me and get that answer for yourself.
A quick glance would suggest a light witty humor, and that was as scum.
An actual look would give you the true answer, but if you're scum I'm sure you have no interest in actually getting to that answer.-
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I like SIR CYANIDE's read on Riabi.
He can be town for now.-
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VOTE: Lalendra
She seems to know there is an IC and is trying to push Cyanide based on her knowledge.-
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In post 97, VictorDeAngelo wrote:
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Sir Cyanie
The last bit is obviously meant to be:
I don't like House's vote in 93. Ton's of people have been speculating and I don't see why Lal should be singled out.
Scumread me for it all you want. I have good reason for that vote and I'm sticking to it.-
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In post 112, SIR CYANIDE wrote:
There's no direct impact but I think we should devote some posts to discuss what optimal IC strategy is. The IC may not directly know what his/her optimal play is, so I feel we should discuss the protocol for the IC's claim. Why are people against this?
This is ridiculous. It's not like the IC has any actual abilities outside of becoming confirmed town.
The strategy for IC is pants-shittingly obvious. Play a town game and don't claim unless run up, because an IC is instant NK bait & nothing more than a named townie once outed.
You harping on about something so simplistic makes me think you're just trying to look invested without actually being productive at all.-
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In post 114, SIR CYANIDE wrote:The strategy for IC is pants-shittingly obvious.
Not really. When you're IC, you're at L-1 and someone has the intent to hammer and asks you to claim, what do you do? There are multiple things you can do. Without the discussion I'm trying to incite, this is how it will likely go down:
Hammerer: claim
IC: I'm IC
Hammerer: pm to mods so we know you are IC
Wagonners: yeah go pm the mod
IC: alright
Mod: IC is IC
Hammerer: well I'll be damned
Wagonners: unvote: IC, vote: other person
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IT IS NOW NIGHT 1
IC has been found dead
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Now it doesn't have to be like this. It can also be like this:
Hammerer: claim
IC: I'm IC
Hammerer: pm to mods so we know you are IC
Wagonners: yeah go pm the mods
IC: no, I'll do it first thing next day
Hammerer: no, you have to pm the mod or you're getting a hammer
IC: I'll do it the first thing next day, we're not in LyLo, if I don't do it the next day you can still lynch me, blahblahblah
Hammerer&Wagonners: *more discussion ensues*
Wagonners: unvote: IC
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IT IS NOW NIGHT 1
IC, who was not actually IC but vanilla town, has been found dead
~~
Gratz, we got +value. The issue here is if theIC would have counterclaimed. Then the 'IC' in this example could have been scum, gone down and gotten a PR with him. It may seem silly to counterclaim, but if the fake IC pulls something like I just described in example 2, people may play incorrectly and counterclaim him just to get the lynch in. I've seen lots of stupid shit in my mafia career. This is one of those games where we actually have a fair amount of information (compared to other mafia games) and I think we should use that information to the best of our ability, this includes some probability work and speculation about mafia tendencies and what we should do if situation [x] or [y] arises.real
On the one hand, that's actually not terrible.
On the other, you could have simply posted it in the first place without fishing. I'd have felt better about your slot if you had.-
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In post 117, Drezi wrote:In post 114, SIR CYANIDE wrote:Hammerer: claim
IC: I'm IC
Hammerer: pm to mods so we know you are IC
Wagonners: yeah go pm the mods
IC: no, I'll do it first thing next day
Hammerer: no, you have to pm the mod or you're getting a hammer
IC: I'll do it the first thing next day, we're not in LyLo, if I don't do it the next day you can still lynch me, blahblahblah
Hammerer&Wagonners: *more discussion ensues*
Wagonners: unvote: IC
Wagonners: vote Player2 (L-1)
Player2: actually I'm IC
...
Player3: no, actually I'm IC
Back to square one.
OR
NL
random townie (not ic claim) found dead.
Lynch IC claim, when he can't confirm.
Repeat.
And imagine this situation when we don't even have an IC. Scum knows if that's the case.
Where's the +value?
You clearly don't know how IC works.-
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In post 121, Drezi wrote:In post 118, House wrote:You clearly don't know how IC works.
You clearly don't understand what I'm saying.
No, I totally understand what you're saying.
Fact of the matter is, there's never any reason to counterclaim an IC. The mod not confirming an IC is proof of fakeclaim.
Your theory is invalid.-
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... resisting... urge... to vote... stupid.-
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In post 134, Drezi wrote:It makes no difference, if one can be spared because of an IC claim without actually proving it, then why would anyone go down willingly?
Stop posting stupidity or I WILL vote you.-
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In post 136, deathfisaro wrote:Also mod claims the IC. People fakeclaiming and counterclaiming IC is ridiculous. If you fake it as VT and you get busted by real IC, you go down and that's super anti-town + proscum.
Now you're posting stupidity too?
The real IC would not have to counterclaim a fake IC. The mod provides the counter by refusing to confirm the fakeclaim.-
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In post 135, deathfisaro wrote:
I don't know why you have to milk value out of IC. A town will get shot every night. If IC gets shot N1, other 2 PRs can safely do their night actions. If I were IC, I'd just ROFLclaim right out of gate and draw the nightkill so that other more scary (from scum POV) town PRs can do their night actions safely. If the other 2 PR are Cop and Vig, then some value has been lost but that's still better than staying silent and risking a JK/Tracker/Cop get shot at 2/N-4 chance which is quite a bit higher than town PRs chance of successful night action landing. AFAIK, if Vig gets shot and Vig shot someone, both will die. But that's just me, turning IC into a sacrificial lamb instead.
Fish harder.
VOTE: deathfisaro-
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In post 137, deathfisaro wrote:Sorry for triple posting but I'm on the verge of voting Sir Cyanide for his laughable scenarios in his theorycrafting, trying to mimic me in not knowing how many town are in this game when he previously stated that this is a 13 player game himself, and wasting all these days worth of discussion (wasting time = giving IC and mod less time for IC PR to work and people to respond). We're not super-close to deadline so that was the saving grace.
And this post is all kinds of tryhard.
Depi needs to eat rope.-
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In post 142, deathfisaro wrote:Oh wait it takes 7 to lynch, so it's still like L-3. Never mind still haven't got the whole 13 player game embedded in my brain.
Push that fake ass townslip more.
Depi is scum and I has a sad.-
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In post 146, deathfisaro wrote:You're breadcrumbing yourself fakeclaiming IC, so I'd gladly push you to 6 votes to get that out of the way if that's what it takes to catch scum.
And from what I read, both Drezi and House are actually disagreeing with your theorycraft. What they are saying is, there is no need for IC to counterclaim, because mod does the confirmation for the IC and if a fakeclaimer can't get that post out of a mod, that's enough evidence of a fakeclaim.
While I disagree that IC should hold off mod confirmation (!= claim) because I'd personally play IC as a sacrificial lamb to let the other 2 guaranteed existing night acting town PRs to do their job, doesn't mean I agree with you at all.
On the other hand you misrep multiple people to throw the idea that real IC shouldn't counterclaim to setup your fakeclaiming IC. That's hella scummy and you say I'm opportunistic.
Shitposting.-
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In post 151, deathfisaro wrote:Okay if people are so experienced and good at this game, tell me why IC getting confirmed D1 and eating NK is bad. If Tracker/JK/Cop eats NK, the information they could have gotten is lost. And look at 135 for how much more likely scum will be able to shoot PR than PR night action landing. I don't know why you'd risk trading 1~2 conf town + 1 conf scum with 1 conf town. I posted this idea more than once and you keep avoiding it.
You're being overly obsessed with IC when there's no reason to. I'm sorry if there's IC in this game that I find IC the most disposable PR out of all 5.
pedit: You list people for not contributing, but your existence hasn't benefited me at all at finding scum besides making yourself look bad.
Wow, rolefishing like a champ, depi!-
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I think SIR CYANIDE's contributions have helped tremendously.
I've found scum. Cyanide can be town when you flip red.-
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In post 161, deathfisaro wrote:@SC
I'm not totally against theorycrafting, it's just you spent 3 pages to state the obvious
@House
You scumread me when I'm town. I scumread you when you're town. We have zero chemistry together (unless you're scum this game looking for an easy target). Hope next time we meet, we are of opposite alignment so both of us feel good voting each other =P
So if I flip green, does that make Cyanide red? Then my "shitposting" was actually scumhunting.
No, because I'm not reeding you based on his posts, or him based on yours.
You're scum because you're making scummy posts.
Rolefishing. Misrepping. Opportunistic voting.
You're scum, period.-
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In post 168, deathfisaro wrote:Multiple White Knights. Does this make me a Disney Princess?
I won't lie... this post made me laugh.-
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In post 172, Drezi wrote:In post 153, House wrote:In post 134, Drezi wrote:It makes no difference, if one can be spared because of an IC claim without actually proving it, then why would anyone go down willingly?
Stop posting stupidity or I WILL vote you.
...
In post 133, SIR CYANIDE wrote:I did not necessarily recommend people claiming IC, I just recommended people not counterclaiming IC.
He wanted to make sure, that real IC does not counterclaim. That is correct, noone is arguing that.
What I demonstrated in my examples, is that there's no value to be gain from letting an IC claim pass for a day without proof like Cyanide has shown in his examples,the one and only answer to the IC claim is "prove it right now, or get rekt"so the real IC will have no reed to counterclaim in order to get the lynch through anyway.
You pointed out an obvious fact?GO YOU!
What I took from Cyanide's use of the word day was r/l day, not game Day.
By holding off on confirming for one real life day, it allows for observation of movement on the wagon, and analysis of said movement, as well as posturing both on and off the wagon.
His remarks had intelligence behind them. Yours consisted ofNUH-UH!
In post 172, Drezi wrote:
You're not as smart as you think you are, so do us all a favor and stop acting like a condescending jerk (or I WILL vote you ), this game is meant to be recreational and fun.
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In post 187, acryon wrote:
For the love of all that is good, can we stop talking about the setup? If scum hasn't figured out who the PRs are already, then they will if people don't shut up.
I don't see scum!acryon making this post.
He'd be too conscious of the fact that scumdecideswhat the setup is.-
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In post 188, Count Dooku wrote:@acryon That's all you can say about the last 8 pages?
Your weak doubtcasting in this post & post 186 in general makes me want to
VOTE: Count Dooku-
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Of those voting me, croboss is by far the scummiest.
All that ad hom to try to force my wagon reeks.-
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In post 192, Count Dooku wrote:In post 190, House wrote:In post 188, Count Dooku wrote:@acryon That's all you can say about the last 8 pages?
Your weak doubtcasting in this post & post 186 in general makes me want to
VOTE: Count Dooku
Oh House, it was a pretty good reasoning, I nearly bought it. (sarcasm)
Yeah, I'm trying to avoid outing my daycop guilty on you because I don't want scum to NK me.-
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In post 195, Count Dooku wrote:In post 186, Count Dooku wrote:About this IC counterclaim-fakeclaim thing:
@SIR CN^- (that is a - in the top right index). Maybe I am just too stupid, but I don't understand you. You say that an IC shouldn't counterclaim, so the IC won't get NKed. But then a scum at L-1 can claim IC too. Please show me where did I make a mistake, what did I miss! (I think I just cannot see something obvious, but I don't know what is that, so please tell me)
If you don't want to talk about IC anymore, just ignore it.
What a silly thing to tell yourself.-
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In post 197, pisskop wrote:What the hell are you two doing? This isn't content.
Neither was that, and yours is even worse.-
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In post 204, Lalendra wrote:
I don't think he's that condescending IRL, it's just part of the online persona.
Time out... were you at TitusMeet?-
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In post 213, SIR CYANIDE wrote:It was just to convince house that there was more to IC than he thought. The actual examples are meaningless.
It was a wasted post.-
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In post 232, VictorDeAngelo wrote:
Nothing here is actually rolefishing, just speculating like a ton of people are doing. But House seems to want on the Deathfisaro wagon.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: House
This is a shitty reason to jump on a wagon.
Disagreeing with someone doesn't make the other person scum. Does kinda make you look scummy for the reach, though.-
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In post 234, Riabi wrote:
My vote stays where it is right now, because I've not seen anything I found necessarily town from House. That said, House does make a good point in 233. FOS on Victor because I agree with House.
Let me give you an inside track.
You're wrong about me. I'm not wrong about Victor.
Vote him instead.-
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In post 236, Riabi wrote:In post 235, House wrote:
Let me give you an inside track.
You're wrong about me. I'm not wrong about Victor.
Vote him instead.
I gotta be honest, this doesn't really make me feel any better about you. Now it feels like you're trying to jump up and down, wave your arms around and scream "LOOK! SEE! I'M TOWN!!" If you were confident in your town status, it seems odd that you would be so explicit about it, especially this early.
I can be as scummy as I want to be, actually.
There's nothing that you or anyone else can do about it.-
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In post 237, Riabi wrote:I also find it interesting that you seem to have completely ignored the question I asked you, House.
I love how people whine about me ignoring shit when the fact is I'm just missing posts.
What do you want to know?-
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In post 243, Riabi wrote:You read the post, I know this because you commented on it. What I asked was:
In post 234, Riabi wrote:
I'm curious about what people think of Lalendra's play. Specifically Dooku, House and NJAC. I know she states that it's common for her posts to contain a lot of WIFOM, but, am I the only one who sees this as scummy?
Eh, your question is too generic.
I'm still deciding.-
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You can call it whatever you want to call it.
I call it a statement of the fact that you're not going to lynch me today regardless of what I do.-
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This post reads like scum, btw.
If Riabi was town, he'd suspect if I was admitting to being scum. But he knows I'm not scum, so he's asking if I'm admitting to being scummy.
VOTE: Riabi-
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In post 250, Count Dooku wrote:
I don't agrre with 41. Why didn't I state it right then? Becasue somebody (I think SC) already told her why would a quickhammer be good for the town: the quickhammer is a scumclaim. And 1 townie for 1 scum is a good exchange.
Not always. It depends not only on the two roles involved, but also the two players.-
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In post 266, Riabi wrote:
Wait... what? I *DO* think you're scum, that's why I'm voting you.
To answer Cynide's post, my reasons for the above are that in post 52,I felt like he was trying to talk Drezi out of voting for deathfisario. That feels like buddying.1
Now, more recently, 235 is just odd. As I said, it feels like he's trying to convince everyone that he's town, and it seem odd that someone who actually *IS* town would feel the need to do that.2
Then his OMGUS vote in 251 sort of seals the deal for me.3
1) Talking somebody out of voting for someone else isn't buddying, it's white knighting. Get your buzz words right.
2) How is telling somebody that I am town without giving any sort of town case an attempt to convince them I'm town? That shit happens all the time across all the games from many different players. This is reachy as fuck.
3) Learn what OMGUS means. A vote with a case is not OMGUS.-
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In post 285, pisskop wrote:In post 281, acryon wrote:It's your job to prove why I should lynch him, not mine to prove why we shouldn't (especially when my view is "I don't think he's scum" which is different from "I think he's town").
This is my stance on Croboss, atm. He's done things that I would call scummy in other people,
-like only voting for people with a wagon
-Fail to give out reads or show involvement, and justifying his failure via 'I'm bad' or 'The burden doesn't fall upon me to be town'
-Discusses theory in an oddly blunt and undetailed fashion.
. .Its as if he is mature (older than a kid) and intelligent enough to grasp the basic theories, but doesn't quite get the social aspect of the game. This is a game of logic, but also about the minds of others. Its literally half a popularity contest.
I've seen newbscum do this before, which is why I'm concerned.
So why isn't your vote on him?-
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House Survivor
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In post 302, Riabi wrote:In post 299, pisskop wrote:
What did you mean when you said this? If you were going to be translated for somebody who had never played mafia before, what would you say
Is my meaning so hard to understand? I'm asking him if he's admitting to being scum.
No you're not. You're asking if I'm admitting to being scummy.
Duh, of course I am. Doesn't make me scum.-
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House Survivor
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In post 304, Riabi wrote:In post 303, House wrote:
No you're not. You're asking if I'm admitting to being scummy.
Duh, of course I am. Doesn't make me scum.
No, I was asking you if you were admitting to being scum. But, for the sake of argument, why would someone who is town be scummy? Wouldn't that be playing against one's win condition?
Not always, and I'm not going to point out why because thatwouldbe playing against my win condition.
if you're town, move the fuck along.-
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House Survivor
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In post 309, VictorDeAngelo wrote:In post 233, House wrote:In post 232, VictorDeAngelo wrote:
Nothing here is actually rolefishing, just speculating like a ton of people are doing. But House seems to want on the Deathfisaro wagon.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: House
This is a shitty reason to jump on a wagon.
Disagreeing with someone doesn't make the other person scum. Does kinda make you look scummy for the reach, though.
It's not the only reason I'm voting you. I'm one good reason to vote you though. Scum are likely to take a post with no rolefishing, claim it was rolefishing and then try and get a wagon going off it. Town... not so much.
So you say that's not the reason you vote me, then reword your argument that says the exact same thing and doesn't invalidate my argument on you at all.
Yeah... lynch this.
VOTE: Victor-
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House Survivor
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In post 238, SIR CYANIDE wrote:I literally at the point where I was yesterday, where I have stopped wanted to read this game. If that was the plan, then good job.
I'm bored now, and it's late. Next time I'm on someone remind me to read pages 9-???. Night.
How about you either play the game and stop whining like a little bitch or replace out? Nobody's forcing you to play this game.
I think I love you.-
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House Survivor
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In post 315, pisskop wrote:I'm really going to have to do some research and see if that kind of talk tends to come from a scumie or townie.
Since I came back to this site, I've seen that kind of line at least 8 times now.
Yeah, this is super forced.
VOTE: pisskop-
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House Survivor
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In post 321, acryon wrote:In post 319, House wrote:In post 315, pisskop wrote:I'm really going to have to do some research and see if that kind of talk tends to come from a scumie or townie.
Since I came back to this site, I've seen that kind of line at least 8 times now.
Yeah, this is super forced.
VOTE: pisskop
Would you say your playstyle is relatively consistent?
Of course not.-
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House Survivor
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In post 342, NJAC wrote:In post 338, Lalendra wrote:This makes me feel icky. Why next time you meet? Why couldn’t you be of opposite alignments this game? It’s almost like you know who your teammates are or something…
This is a nice catch, you know? Maybe even a scumslip. It's worth pursuing. When we finish with croboss, let's vote fisaro. Alright?
This pings.-
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House Survivor
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In post 345, acryon wrote:In post 344, House wrote:In post 342, NJAC wrote:In post 338, Lalendra wrote:This makes me feel icky. Why next time you meet? Why couldn’t you be of opposite alignments this game? It’s almost like you know who your teammates are or something…
This is a nice catch, you know? Maybe even a scumslip. It's worth pursuing. When we finish with croboss, let's vote fisaro. Alright?
This pings.
It does read disingenuous, but I think I agree with the sentiment. Ihategoing after "scumslips", but that one does look like it actually could be.
Are you actually defending NJAC?
*paranoid*-
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House Survivor
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pisskop & Count Dooku scumteam.
Check.-
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House Survivor
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Oh look, scum is voting acryon.-
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