Mini Theme 2145: The Weakest Link Game over

beeboy · Thu Jun 04, 2020 3:03 am

In post 1629, farside22 wrote:
In post 1627, beeboy wrote:If the theory is scum doesn't have a NK, then the JOAT gave them a kill (no reason to believe scum and town got the same JOAT).
Also scum hands down were able to tamper with the quiz.

pedit: I agree, I don't even think I am peek preforming bboy town this game.

By the way I asked a question. Did you confirm if unwnd's ability would work with your NU?

Sorry I missed the question.
Ya I confirmed it sometime yesterday when I was pressuring unwnd.

beeboy · Thu Jun 04, 2020 3:40 am

Sorry but I am going to continue to assume that scum potentially were off the quiz and play accordingly.

If scum decided to no kill in order to bluff them potentially not being on the quiz then congratulations they got me.
Otherwise I am going to assume a scum counter part to a role we have already seen is a lot more likely then scum being incapable of reading which seems to be the current theory.

beeboy · Thu Jun 04, 2020 3:59 am

Cheetory once modded a game called paint mafia.
Town assumed without night actions the information couldn't be tampered with for the day 1 result and we had a confirmed result of someone being town.
Town lost that game because it was information that could be tampered with during the day as a 1-shot.

I don't see why we would assume that information is definitive when the reward for passing the quiz is so absurdly powerful (conf town + power role), it definitely feels like pass/fail takes priority over the information behind who is in the team from a game design point of view. Are you all just assuming MariaR, the list mod whose been dedicated to this game for years wouldn't realize the quiz creates conf town?

The thought process being it sure would be unreasonable if scum could tamper with this is incredibly wack to me. It makes perfect sense given town can tamper with scums ability to fail the quiz... :/

beeboy · Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:03 am

In post 1649, beeboy wrote:I don't see why we would assume that information is definitive when the reward for passing the quiz is so absurdly powerful (conf town + power role), it definitely feels like pass/fail takes priority over the information behind who is in the team from a game design point of view. Are you all just assuming MariaR, the list mod whose been dedicated to this game for years wouldn't realize the quiz creates conf town?

The thought process being it sure would be unreasonable if scum could tamper with this is incredibly wack to me. It makes perfect sense given town can tamper with scums ability to fail the quiz... :/

I edited my post to account for your criticism. I stand by everything in this post, the reward for passing the quiz is nuts, by passing the quiz a singular time we win the game.

conf town group of 5.
lynch + kill on conf town

quiz group of 4 (still conf town)
lynch + kill on conf town

quiz group of 3 (still conf town)

The game is just won on the back of a successful quiz group round 1 since we create conf towns and power roles all game? What part of this do you guys not see.

beeboy · Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:04 am

I don't get how you can look at this game and actually think its balanced if scum can't tamper with the teams.
The conf town team would decrease at the same rate scum can shoot into it.

Scum _can't_ win if they don't have the ability to tamper with the result.

beeboy · Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:11 am

In post 1656, midwaybear wrote:I'm fine with assuming that scum has the ability to tamper, but I don't like assuming everyone in the quiz group is town just because scum might have that ability.

I am not assuming that because scum can no kill.

beeboy · Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:17 am

But what if it was a group of all town and we kept giving the same town the quiz group powers?
How does scum interact with that? They literally can't and that's the point I am making.

If 1 scum is in the group and decide it's ok to create a single actual conf town each day, then that scum is misplaying and town will continue to put that scum in the group.

From a balance standpoint scum have to be able to interact with the quiz group.

beeboy · Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:18 am

The point is less about a group of conf town and more about how scum can never make a group fail if it succeeds the first time.
Which is just broken game design.

beeboy · Thu Jun 04, 2020 6:55 am

what about the chain can I ask for that?

beeboy · Thu Jun 04, 2020 6:58 am

unwnd can force anyone to say yes.
That someone doesn't need to be me nor do I particularly care about entering the quiz PT.

MariaR just hates me and gave me the unfun role.

beeboy · Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:12 am

In post 1670, unwnd wrote:Yeah but are you gonna speedchain it? You're the easy chainpick for sure. What do you think about the way the chain was passed earlier? Farside I see your point about Me+Beeboy and forcing a pass from beeboy and have thought about doing this

Oh and the first half of your post.
That was a tongue and cheek comment do what you want with the chain. I think spring holding onto the chain had its benefit I wouldn't be offended if you let conversation happen for 48 hours, that was my plan upon getting the chain if I was the chain leader. I think beyond 48 hours you are hurting the game state.

When I get it I am going to likely pass it within 4-6 hours, which may or may not be a speed chain depending on your definition.

beeboy · Thu Jun 04, 2020 3:43 pm

@Dunnstral how quick was the hammer?
Is Raya's "I ignored the pedit" story believable from your perspective of being their?

beeboy · Thu Jun 04, 2020 5:05 pm

In post 1678, Raya36 wrote:But it's much much more likely for scum to be on the quiz team than for the quiz team to be entirely town. The quiz part of the setup is already scumsided in my opinion. Having the ability to tamper with it as well would be very overpowered and very unfair for town.

Do you think the group had scum in it then? If not spring who do you think it is?
Weird perspective relative to your reads.

Not saying to go back and try and agree with me just wondering what your head space is.

beeboy · Thu Jun 04, 2020 5:15 pm

In post 1697, Dunnstral wrote:I've been reading your posts

^

I don't see you dying and I don't want to kill you.
So I am sort of just reading your posts, nodding and moving on.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 4:45 am

I still firmly believe that scum can tamper with the group.
An all town group occurs 20% of the time day 1 and scum just concedes to that. Feels like awful game design.
I think we had an all town group and scum missed their shot tbh.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 4:48 am

idk... the odds of getting a group to pass is low. But I also think MariaR would account for the fact that successful groups easily chain back to back.
And their is no rational explanation for the kill not going through without the group being tampered with.

Outside I guess just scum not reading???

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 4:51 am

But scum have to see thread updates since to look at their own PT they have to go through their ISO, bookmarks or something that shows updates on threads they are following.
IDK I just can't see the world where scum dont have a tampering role.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 4:59 am

In post 1768, farside22 wrote:Someone doesn't want to discuss anything other them them being safe or getting the chain.......i think it starts with a player named albert....last name scum

The funny part is it's fooling half the player base.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:22 am

In post 1774, Raya36 wrote:With the above in mind why don't we make the quiz the exact same 5 people? Then if the quiz passes we know everyone on it is town. If it fails again then we know it's extremely unlikely that the problem was scum tampering and we actually do have scum in the quiz. Making a whole new quiz team likely lands scum in the quiz anyway. I think this is the best strategy from a solving standpoint

I want to run the group back for what I've been preaching but no one in this game wants to listen to me about how scum need to be able to tamper with the groups for the game to be balanced

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:31 am

In post 1790, Raya36 wrote:
In post 1783, beeboy wrote:
In post 1774, Raya36 wrote:With the above in mind why don't we make the quiz the exact same 5 people? Then if the quiz passes we know everyone on it is town. If it fails again then we know it's extremely unlikely that the problem was scum tampering and we actually do have scum in the quiz. Making a whole new quiz team likely lands scum in the quiz anyway. I think this is the best strategy from a solving standpoint
I want to run the group back for what I've been preaching but no one in this game wants to listen to me about how scum need to be able to tamper with the groups for the game to be balanced
I believe you now. Took some consideration because I thought that would be overpowered but you're right that it would be extremely town sided without that.

So you're in agreement about making the quiz group the same but without spring?

Truly doesn't matter who is excluded. I just want to run it back to some degree.
I am even fine excluding 2 people and including unwnd. Isn't a big deal to me.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:33 am

I'll be real if we keep reading into the clap I'll say it.
I didn't clap in my confirmation, I just said I read the rules.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:34 am

In post 1798, Raya36 wrote:If the quiz passes we have 4 basically conftown players. Plus Beeboy who is basically conftown. And unwnd who is such a strong general town read he might as well be conftown too.

If the quiz fails we know scum is within the pool of 4 quiz members. Is only 1 then it's a 25% chance of catching scum.

^^^^^^

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:38 am

In post 1805, midwaybear wrote:I mean scum might not want to pass the quiz if the reward is bad. We can soft conf town if the reward is good like a joat.
pedit: @starbuck interesting

If 1 or even 2 scum want to keep giving us conf towns, I don't particularly care.
Eventually the random power roles are going to land on our suspects and we still win.

Conf towns are largely created through the distribution of the random PRs.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:43 am

I am with Raya, scum has a 1-shot Tamper.
Otherwise town is capable of chaining successful groups back to back.
If scum has too many tampers a failed group never gives us info and we likely never get a passing group since combined with my PR getting a large group of just town is very difficult.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:59 am

In post 1818, springlullaby wrote:3. It also has to be considered that we don't know what is the advantage scum received from last night's fail
- Which means that it is still possible that scum used tampering on N1
- And received a renewed tampering power, to be used at any point in game.

Scum can N1 tamper to recieve a N2 tamper?
I had this thought in my head but I disagree with this being a reasonable outcome.

We run the group back, if it fails, the group has scum in it.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 6:00 am

In post 1817, farside22 wrote:Okay so this is a lot of WIFOM. We could keep discussing this but we are going to keep circling around and around and around. Until we lynch scum we don't know what abilities are had. I get BB's logic, as soon as he said it I could see a mod wanting to make sure there was something to balance constant town in the quiz and add some distention in the group.
This goes back to a simple thing.
Do you scum read any players in the quiz?

Without an ABR town flip I am going to say no, I don't have a good reason to scum read anyone in the group so I don't care if we run the group back.
On ABR scum flip its Starback -> You. As the scum in the group.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 6:00 am

In post 1821, beeboy wrote:
In post 1817, farside22 wrote:Okay so this is a lot of WIFOM. We could keep discussing this but we are going to keep circling around and around and around. Until we lynch scum we don't know what abilities are had. I get BB's logic, as soon as he said it I could see a mod wanting to make sure there was something to balance constant town in the quiz and add some distention in the group.
This goes back to a simple thing.
Do you scum read any players in the quiz?
Without an ABR town flip I am going to say no, I don't have a good reason to scum read anyone in the group so I don't care if we run the group back.
On ABR scum flip its Starback -> You. As the scum in the group.

I meant on ABR town flip.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 6:03 am

In post 1824, springlullaby wrote:
In post 1820, beeboy wrote:
In post 1818, springlullaby wrote:3. It also has to be considered that we don't know what is the advantage scum received from last night's fail
- Which means that it is still possible that scum used tampering on N1
- And received a renewed tampering power, to be used at any point in game.
Scum can N1 tamper to recieve a N2 tamper?
I had this thought in my head but I disagree with this being a reasonable outcome.

We run the group back, if it fails, the group has scum in it.
It is speculative, but it as to be kept in the realm of possible beyond further evidence.

> Do you disagree with the conclusion in my previous post?

We independently came to the same conclusion using slightly different reasoning.
Of course we are on the same page right now

(I thought I came first but I don't care enough to check)

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 6:04 am

I disagree with Raya's conclusion that it creates 4 conf town. Scum can easily just hit the pass button and pretend it got framed night 1.

I just simply don't care if scum do that since town get a power in exchange for scum blending in. It slowly results in a town win.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 6:05 am

In post 1828, beeboy wrote:I disagree with Raya's conclusion that it creates 4 conf town. Scum can easily just hit the pass button and pretend it got framed night 1.

I just simply don't care if scum do that since town get a power in exchange for scum blending in. It slowly results in a town win.

If the group fails the odds of scum having 2 frames is so absurdly low that we now know we have to target inside the group until we flip scum.
Either way running the group back is a huge net positive for us.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 6:51 am

I'd rather run back the group and if that plan does happen me and unwnd pick X and Y, 0 questions asked.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 7:40 am

Imagine replacing into the 75 page game that is barely day 2 start.
Unlucky.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 11:51 am

ABR and NDMath.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 3:04 pm

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 3:50 pm

Deny

booo run back the quiz / keep some old members.
NDmath is asking for a failed attempt.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 3:58 pm

In post 1943, unwnd wrote:So I just asked the mod something and I think this is important to state

Being on the quiz does
NOT
make you immune to being lynched by chain.

You're asking the wrong questions.
Being lynched by not being on the quiz still fails the quiz.

So you're still giving NDMath lynch immunity if we play smart.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 4:09 pm

Good Ones
Raya36
unwnd
beeboy
springlullaby
TrueSoulEnergy

Meh Ones
Dunnstral
Starbuck
Pink Ball
farside22
NDmath
midwaybear

Scum Ones
Albert B. Rampage - (Clears Farside and Starbucks)

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 4:13 pm

In post 1955, midwaybear wrote:is him requesting for replacement NAI then?

Idk it could be alignment indicative but he could be just be upset with a scum team or genuinely feel the inability to vote just fucks over his ability to win the game. Feels like out of game info to read into >_> but it's allowed so do what you want.

beeboy · Fri Jun 05, 2020 4:32 pm

ngl sometimes I feel like I am the only one enjoying this game lmao

beeboy · Sat Jun 06, 2020 6:16 am

In post 1977, farside22 wrote: Why are you adding Raya/Spring as good and Dunn/me/SB as meh?
Can you expand on this?

Meh is more or less a null / POEd area, hence why I have half the playerlist in that section, I have a aching suspicion I could be wrong on ABR and if I am I need to look towards the players that are pushing him.

But onto the town reads, I think Raya is relatively pure in her approach to the game. I think to some capacity you could see her reads mirror the reads or complain about the reasoning behind her reads but neither of those particularly make me feel as though she is scum?

Her general approach towards this day opening up felt kind of legit to me. Between her original assessment of scum needing to be in the pool because the group failed, which is an angle that basically forces Spring/Me to consider her as scum all while not actually hard committing to a scum read on Spring, so it's not she said the group needed scum in order to push an objective.

Spring's entire tyrannical rampage when being chain leader yesterday was incredibly townie for me? She was making enemies with the entire thread and she just kept going at it. I think she believed what she was doing was beneficial to the town. She is making her entire play incredibly vulnerable and I find that to be incredibly townie. Same reason I am TRing TSE he is just playing in a way that makes him very vulnerable. That tends to be my #1 scum tell.

You and SB are meh pile because if I am wrong on ABR I have to look somewhere and that somewhere is going to be the people who were pushing him. I am interested to see what the replacement is going to do tbh.

beeboy · Sat Jun 06, 2020 6:17 am

PB is in meh pile and not town anymore because his reaction test yesterday felt fake and I feel like he is falling back into the background while the chaos unloads on the town.

beeboy · Sat Jun 06, 2020 6:25 am

On review Starbucks can be town even on an ABR town flip.

beeboy · Sat Jun 06, 2020 6:43 am

In post 2000, farside22 wrote:I wouldn't call trolling with shit reads and no reasoning other then to be as ass to people as vulnerable.

Feels like an incredibly shitty way to win a game.

In post 2001, MariaR wrote:
Titus replaces ABR give her a warm welcome!

Hey Titus long time o/

beeboy · Sat Jun 06, 2020 7:32 am

In post 2009, Titus wrote:
In post 2006, farside22 wrote:
In post 2004, Titus wrote:ABR, imo, is actually the type to sub out when not getting his way or losing. It's all about ego with him. That's why we don't play together anymore. I loved this list but refused to play with him.

Anyway, let's get started. Shall we?
Are you going to do a read through or wing it?
Wing it. As always.

I wouldn't read an 80 page game either,

especially with a scum role pm

.

The controversial slot of the day is midwaybear so if you read anyone's ISO it should be his.

beeboy · Sat Jun 06, 2020 8:50 am

Ngl I don't really see the whole one of spring/starbuck has to be scum thing that's been going on.
Can't I just town read them both in peace?

beeboy · Sat Jun 06, 2020 8:53 am

Thanks PB very cool take.

beeboy · Sat Jun 06, 2020 11:10 am

@unwnd bring us chain movement!!!

beeboy · Sat Jun 06, 2020 1:19 pm

@unwnd I think the game is stalling out while Starbucks and Spring go after each others throat. + I am also getting bored.

beeboy · Sat Jun 06, 2020 1:20 pm

In post 1963, MariaR wrote:
Chain Order 2.0
unwnd
(1)
- unwnd >

Chainless:
(11)
- Albert B. Rampage, Dunnstral Raya36, Starbuck, Pink Ball, farside22, , NDmath, TrueSoulEnergy, midwaybear, beeboy

Quiz Team 2.0
Purposed Team
(4)
-
unwnd, NDmath, Pink Ball, TrueSoulEnergy

Approve
(1)
- TrueSoulEnergy

Decline
(1)
- beeboy

Not voting:
(10)
- Albert B. Rampage, Dunnstral Raya36, Starbuck, Pink Ball, farside22, unwnd, NDmath, midwaybear, springlullaby

Deadline is in: (expired on 2020-06-18 00:17:43)[/align]

To speed up the quiz we should all decline this for having a literal lurker in it =)

beeboy · Sat Jun 06, 2020 1:23 pm

Then do that if you'd like.
More my point was we should focus on the game objective at hand rather then us bickering over reads.

pedit: I said that and so did unwnd. It's ok quizlord is on the same page as us so it isn't a big deal.

beeboy · Sat Jun 06, 2020 3:33 pm

In post 2084, Starbuck wrote:beeboy! Are you using your phone? You keep adding an S to my name and it sucks.

Honestly I can't say I haven't typed it on my PC >.>
I'll try harder Starbuck!!

beeboy · Sat Jun 06, 2020 3:33 pm

In post 2084, Starbuck wrote:beeboy! Are you using your phone? You keep adding an S to my name and it sucks.

Honestly I can't say I haven't typed it on my PC >.>
I'll try harder Starbuck!!

beeboy · Sat Jun 06, 2020 4:50 pm

Which one of Raya and Spring are less likely to get the chain.
Into the think tank I go.

beeboy · Sat Jun 06, 2020 5:07 pm

In post 2099, beeboy wrote:Which one of Raya and Spring are less likely to get the chain.
Into the think tank I go.

Uh in general I still town read both of them for the reasons previously mentioned. This game has no universal town reads I feel should immediately get the chain. And I think we are well before the stage in which chain should be passed.

To some degree I should maybe give it to TSE because he is likely on the quiz team today but I also don't particularly want him to instantly pass the chain to midway and have a whole bunch of my town reads be chainless with a bunch of people allegedly having random af town reads on the lurker slot NDMath?

beeboy · Sat Jun 06, 2020 5:07 pm

In post 2100, unwnd wrote:If the result is WIFOM then to what end do the quiz people nominated matter?

Run it back with -1 Players

Fails again: We know it cant be tampered with twice therefore it has scum.
Succeeds: We get an advantage.

That's why I want to run it back when the next quiz team comes up.

beeboy · Sun Jun 07, 2020 3:19 am

VOTE: raya

beeboy · Sun Jun 07, 2020 7:39 am

A vote is a literal act of passing the chain to keep someone once we get a vote count it'll be clear.

Unwnd -> Me -> Raya -> Farside -> Starbucks.

We all have the chain right now.

beeboy · Sun Jun 07, 2020 8:03 am

In post 2121, Titus wrote:
In post 2113, farside22 wrote:
In post 2112, Raya36 wrote:I do have a TR on TSE but you're much higher on the list and I absolutely do not want Midway getting the chain and TSE is just going to immediately pass it to him.
Do you think he is trolling? I guess I'm confused why no one cares that he keeps pretending to vote midway if they think it's a reaction test. If they think it's real why he doesn't get pushed to explain his reason for his vote.
It's probably a waste waiting on NDMath. He literally has 14 post in this entire game.

VOTE: Starbuck
My issue with TSE is that he's not trolling enough. That's meta so it's weak as fuck though.

Wait it goes downhill from outright pretending/actually not reading the game?

beeboy · Sun Jun 07, 2020 8:30 am

In post 2124, Starbuck wrote:He literally didn't understand why I would have talked with farside in the Quiz PT last night. I mean, come on.

ngl I don't think he is scum still... which probably says a lot about my willingness to town read people.
Idk he is just vibing and making enemies, hard pushing people at random the way scum just don't want to play lol.

beeboy · Sun Jun 07, 2020 9:30 am

In post 2128, TrueSoulEnergy wrote:
In post 2118, beeboy wrote:A vote is a literal act of passing the chain to keep someone once we get a vote count it'll be clear.

Unwnd -> Me -> Raya -> Farside -> Starbucks.

We all have the chain right now.
That has 2 scum in it.
Farside and Starbuck.

I still think Starbuck is town, idk. Is you're reason an association with Farside or she independently scum to you?

beeboy · Sun Jun 07, 2020 1:00 pm

In post 2151, farside22 wrote:I see that as no town motive.
He scum read unwnd and that disappears out of the blue?
He holds a scum read with no visible reason on players.
I dont see anything more the trying to get by. I mean he claimed to be a great scum hunter and i dont see it.
Why no pivot after unwnd?
I think your read on him is bad. He looks like he gets to float by while you accept that.

Honestly I find people always say that scum are the ones that commit to tunnels like that but I find that is almost never the case it's usually a town thing and it's more bad play then it is scum play. I don't really want to defend whether or not TSE is playing well because that's his job not mine. And that's what a lot of arguments against TSE feel like "why isn't he just playing better" kind of stuff. I am willing to reevaluate if I ever feel like he is just hiding behind his reads to not play the game.

But for whatever it's worth he is just sitting in the thread and fighting against you and spamming midway is town constantly. Maybe because that's what he believe is the best way to get people to care about his reads? TSE was the only one pushing unwnd with reason and despite that he still was F2 which makes me think he was killed due to scum compliance rather then him being scum pushing it himself which is another reason why I was pushing ABR/Titus. He could just be floating by doing shitty pushes while I just ignore it, that's definitely a possibility. I find scum tend to start tunneling mid d2 / late d3 rather then early game which is when he is doing it.

beeboy · Sun Jun 07, 2020 1:02 pm

Scum just sitting back as we all kill each other B)
What a lovely game of mafia we have here.

beeboy · Sun Jun 07, 2020 1:10 pm

In post 2190, beeboy wrote:Scum just sitting back as we all kill each other B)
What a lovely game of mafia we have here.

PB, Dunnstral, NDMath specifically name, names.

beeboy · Sun Jun 07, 2020 1:12 pm

In post 2192, beeboy wrote:
In post 2190, beeboy wrote:Scum just sitting back as we all kill each other B)
What a lovely game of mafia we have here.
PB, Dunnstral, NDMath specifically name, names.

to name*

beeboy · Sun Jun 07, 2020 2:05 pm

In post 2203, farside22 wrote:Silly question, since I didn't look, but did you look to see when the mod talked about at what point the chainleader becomes BP?
Do you think that comment was put in thread because someone asked? Because I sure do.
And if it was put in thread at some point during the night phase (which I don't know what time at during night it was) but don't you think someone would look at new post from the mod as scum?

I asked the mod, misinterpreted the answer then went into the thread and yelled the opposite was true. I thought I had something to do with it and someone else made it double down to a thread answer. Spring maybe could have asked as well, she cared and strikes me as the type to double check.

As scum you'd see the new post because you're checking your scum PT in your ISO and see an updated post in thread, that's what I strongly believe. It was only like 2 hours into the night which is well before when scum would be done with planning given you have to check if your buddies get a new idea. Not to mention anyone who was checking the quiz team thread would see that update for the same reason as I brought up the scum team.

I assume you're asking me in this manner because you have some level of a conclusion you wanted to bring up?

beeboy · Sun Jun 07, 2020 2:43 pm

Honestly I think the game has the opposite problem. I don't see anyone sheeping really.

This game is composed of a large number of people who would hold the drivers seat in their respective games which is likely why ABR replaced out because he was struggling to get his voice heard.
Appeal to authority just won't work in this player list which is a large reason why I am having a lot of fun this game despite some things that are going on.

Although I find some people are being pushed because of how they are choosing to approach the game even when that isn't alignment indicative. *cough* spring and tse *cough*

beeboy · Sun Jun 07, 2020 2:48 pm

In post 2210, midwaybear wrote:
In post 2208, beeboy wrote:Honestly I think the game has the opposite problem. I don't see anyone sheeping really.
so all of town SR cakez. I don't believe it.

I mean people playing independently is exactly how he died.
A bunch of people town read people went "This person aint going to get the chain without me" which resulted in Cakez being left behind.

beeboy · Sun Jun 07, 2020 2:53 pm

In post 2212, midwaybear wrote:uh no
IIRC cakez/unwnd was being planned to be the final two for a long time, and everyone was just OK with it.

We left players who were agreed to get the chain in the bottom 5, me and PB. Along with TSE who I heavily town read, this lack of team play was my fault I do agree but it adds to my point.

They basically got bottom 2 due to scummy players getting the chain earlier for the reason I brought up.

What player is sheeping what other player right now?
I don't think that list extends beyond 3 people.

beeboy · Sun Jun 07, 2020 3:10 pm

I mean to some degree I think we are going to gravitate towards the loudest bottom 2 of (TSE, You).

But I do prefer ABR/(Dunn,PB,Chess)

cause I feel like we are just letting people get away with coasting right now and I really hate it lol.

beeboy · Sun Jun 07, 2020 3:10 pm

Starbuck what is your headspace on chain movement right now?
The easy targets are mostly gone so I am curious.

beeboy · Sun Jun 07, 2020 3:39 pm

In post 2219, Pink Ball wrote:Like, I haven't coasted at all, said I was going to lay back for a while and you keep saying "this guy is coasting". When did you change your mind about the unwnd's reaction test? How did that got to be a "good one Pink Ball" to "seemed fake as shit"? Fuck off with the paranoia and let me be for a little

I played along with the reaction test because it's fun, I am one who let's people try out their plans because why wouldn't I. I wanted to see how people reacted to that claim and what people would do with it and oh look unwnd got probably got shot over something I thought was kind of stupid at the time so clearly I am right to just let things slide.

Out of the 7 players without the chain I only particularly care about Spring and TSE receiving it.
My specific death order is NDMath -> ABR/Titus -> Midway but I'll be real I only feel strongly about my town reads which is why I am widening my pressure.

You're complaining about the game state but are also complaining that I am drawing attention to the rest of the players so it isn't just the same 1v1s constantly?

Take as long as you want, just don't give me shit for how I am playing this game because everything I am doing is absurdly reasonable.

beeboy · Mon Jun 08, 2020 9:04 am

In post 2228, midwaybear wrote:I agree with beeboy here. My townreads so far are {beeboy, unwnd, spring, TSE, starbuck}. beeboy has been doing a lot to keep us together and it's fine that he changed his reads. unwnd's reaction at EoD was pretty townie and the way he has handled the quiz team proposal today doesn't really feel scum motivated? spring is sorta a gut TR that I believe in. TSE I was really doubtful(if he is scum, I have gotten hard pocketed). However, this seems to be his meta, and I'm fine with it. Starbuck I also had doubts about, but her last few posts seem like she is genuinely trying to understand the game.

This leaves {Titus, ND, farside, PB, Dunn, Raya}. My hot take is that PB, ND, Titus are town, but I'll have to think about it.

So a Raya, Dunn, Farside team?
Very spicy please elaborate.

beeboy · Mon Jun 08, 2020 9:11 am

Ngl I can't understand the Dunnstral chain toss yesterday to this day from Midway which is why I am reluctant to call him town still.
But I don't actually have an issue with any of his day 2 play.

Does anyone pushing on him right now have thoughts on this?

beeboy · Mon Jun 08, 2020 9:26 am

In post 2244, farside22 wrote:I'm just going to assume anyone who gets a strong scum read will be town in your world and ignore you for the remainder of the game.

you do you.

beeboy · Mon Jun 08, 2020 9:53 am

In post 2248, Starbuck wrote:beeboy, did you have anything for me in regards to my response to you in 2222?

Sorry I wanted to sleep on it before I replied and it slipped my mind, thank you for reminding me. I support PB getting the chain, I support Dunnstral slightly less because he running his initial town cred relatively thin even if he hasn't done anything particularly scummy. My rough town pool is below in the spoiler I put you in it because I don't think Titus flipping town would have any bearing on how I'd feel about your posts. I don't think I can town case Spring beyond what I've done and I am not too worried, I think someone will let her live regardless anyway so I don't feel the need to persuade you to do that.

Regarding the other name inside that box TSE involves handing the chain to Midway which is why I am trying to look for the Midway town world because it makes my entire objective of securing my town reads a lot easier. Midway hasn't made up for his day 1 yet and I want to give him the chance to do it but I think the bottom 2 is going to be TSE and Midway so that isn't going to happen. He is on my list but like I previously stated I prefer NDMath and Titus.

Spoiler:

NDMath > Titus > Midway is still my scum pool atm and you don't want to target any of them which is the main thing I want, I can't make everyone see eye to eye with all my reads, that's just part of the game.

beeboy · Mon Jun 08, 2020 9:55 am

In post 2249, Raya36 wrote:Chess?

I meant NDMath was thinking of someone else... Not letting that impact my read I just keep thinking of a person who shared the avatar I played 1 game with.

In post 2251, Starbuck wrote:If everyone's cool, Imma keep holding the chain until this gets sorted.

That's fine.

beeboy · Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:38 am

In post 2256, Titus wrote:
In post 2255, midwaybear wrote:Lets just decide the team after we pass the chain. I’m not entirely comfortable with far side and raya.
Why wouldn't you want them to expose themselves as scum though?

Only way we can expose scum is specifically by running back the old group.
Which I guess is farside and raya assuming unwnd and the 4th are town?

beeboy · Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:59 am

In post 2259, farside22 wrote:I thought you believed scum had something to mess with the quiz?

What Spring, Raya and I were going over towards the start of the day was scum had a 1-shot Tamper in order to prevent town from chain getting successful groups. By having more then 1 tamper it becomes stacked against town since 2 guaranteed failures combined with the low odds of getting an all town group makes the mechanic too scum sided.

By running it back if it fails we know the group has scum because they shouldn't have 2 tampers.
Or the group succeeds, we gain the power role + random conf town (the one who gains the PR).

beeboy · Mon Jun 08, 2020 11:50 am

In post 2262, farside22 wrote:Or scum was in the 1st group. Which is why i think spring is scum still.

We only need to select 3 people given the group is smaller and we have unwnd now.
I am just letting unwnd choose what he thinks is best tbh.

beeboy · Mon Jun 08, 2020 1:36 pm

In post 2250, MariaR wrote:
The Quiz Team has been rejected! A new one must be now be made. It cannot be the same team as the first one.

It is that literal.

beeboy · Mon Jun 08, 2020 6:19 pm

On the topic of the quiz team I shouldn't get chain leader today.

Scum are going to shoot unwnd tonight to finish the deed they failed. If they shoot me tonight instead of unwnd, unwnd's can't be back to back chain leader timer expires which keeps him alive longer.

Basically I think by not giving me chain leader it keeps one of (me/unwnd) alive for a longer period of the game.

beeboy · Mon Jun 08, 2020 6:31 pm

chainleader is bullet proof and picks quiz teams.
It's completely unrelated to my ability to vote as a member of a quiz.

beeboy · Tue Jun 09, 2020 7:46 am

On review the JOAT might contain a role blocker.
Spring isn't the only one to suggest I be on the team so I won't fault her.

But I can only think of strongman, frame and roleblocker for scum JOAT powers.

beeboy · Tue Jun 09, 2020 7:55 am

The main counter argument is it is just counter productive to use unwnds role on me when he can use it on anyone.
I don't think anyone has brought up roleblocking JOAT just yet.

Which is yet another reason its a bad idea.

beeboy · Tue Jun 09, 2020 7:58 am

I guess before I was more neutral/didn't care.

Now I actually just think I am a liability to keep on the quiz team even with unwnd.

beeboy · Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:37 am

I believe spring thought ABR soft claimed. I am not sure why she thought that but I found her post had an "AHA!" moment when she thought ABR claimed and if he couldn't follow up on it he died and flipped scum.

Also asking about how my role interacts with unwnd's is kinda mute, given I already asked the mod and knows that our roles work together.

beeboy · Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:38 am

In post 683, springlullaby wrote:Just to be clear, I'm supposing that was a softclaim of somekind ABR.
No way out of it otherwise.

In post 691, springlullaby wrote:ABR, why do you need to think? You want your lynch on starbuck, go ahead.

In post 692, springlullaby wrote:ABR, you are so confscum.

In post 693, springlullaby wrote:But yeah go ahead.

In post 697, springlullaby wrote:Nah, I'm just sitting looking who scum is going to pass chain to.

In post 700, springlullaby wrote:ABR, you are not making to the team. If you are town, you have zero reason to deny this.

^ This is a town sequence.

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 6:58 am

In post 2462, unwnd wrote:I just realized 2 and 3 sort of intertwine, given that 2 of the chained were on the last quiz and 2 of them were not. The only people who aren't chained right now are Dunn/Spring (from last quiz).

Would still like thoughts.

To summarize (I can find any relevant long posts)

*long post on how easy it is to turn 1 successful group to a game with only successes by picking the same people over and over*
*long post on how a 1 shot tamper makes that fair for scum, 2 tampers is too strong*
*long post on how you being shot despite being BP could imply the above was used*

By using the same people we know scum can''t have 2 tampers so 2 fails = scum in the group.
Or scum is forced to hit pass for us and we win the power role, either outcome is $$$$$

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 6:58 am

^^^ The real GOAT strategy, endorsed by Me, Titus, Raya and Spring.
Look at all those not consensus town read players. :O

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 7:00 am

In post 2470, unwnd wrote:See that's where I see the power in the quiz personally? Especially now. But people don't see it that way. They want me to pick townie players. OK. Who? I want to go into that ambiguous gray I was talking about because then it can be less gray based on results.

This game has no consensus town reads so this just doesn't work.

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 7:02 am

In post 2474, unwnd wrote:
In post 2468, beeboy wrote:
In post 2462, unwnd wrote:I just realized 2 and 3 sort of intertwine, given that 2 of the chained were on the last quiz and 2 of them were not. The only people who aren't chained right now are Dunn/Spring (from last quiz).

Would still like thoughts.
To summarize (I can find any relevant long posts)

*long post on how easy it is to turn 1 successful group to a game with only successes by picking the same people over and over*
*long post on how a 1 shot tamper makes that fair for scum, 2 tampers is too strong*
*long post on how you being shot despite being BP could imply the above was used*

By using the same people we know scum can''t have 2 tampers so 2 fails = scum in the group.
Or scum is forced to hit pass for us and we win the power role, either outcome is $$$$$
I'm stupid and spell a quiz team out for me with this in mind. I don't really want Dunn or Spring, I think I would like to see them down the chain more.

Unwnd, Farside, Starbuck, Raya.
Assuming your town and we ignore Dunn and Spring this is the only group that fits my strat within your requirements.

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 7:02 am

In post 2474, unwnd wrote:
In post 2468, beeboy wrote:
In post 2462, unwnd wrote:I just realized 2 and 3 sort of intertwine, given that 2 of the chained were on the last quiz and 2 of them were not. The only people who aren't chained right now are Dunn/Spring (from last quiz).

Would still like thoughts.
To summarize (I can find any relevant long posts)

*long post on how easy it is to turn 1 successful group to a game with only successes by picking the same people over and over*
*long post on how a 1 shot tamper makes that fair for scum, 2 tampers is too strong*
*long post on how you being shot despite being BP could imply the above was used*

By using the same people we know scum can''t have 2 tampers so 2 fails = scum in the group.
Or scum is forced to hit pass for us and we win the power role, either outcome is $$$$$
I'm stupid and spell a quiz team out for me with this in mind. I don't really want Dunn or Spring, I think I would like to see them down the chain more.

Unwnd, Farside, Starbuck, Raya.
Assuming your town and we ignore Dunn and Spring this is the only group that fits my strat within your requirements.

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 7:05 am

Approve Quiz

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 7:08 am

Keep in mind the scum pool is still {Farside, Spring, Dunn, Raya, Starbuck} if the quiz fails.

Since Dunn/Spring could manually deny the quiz night 1 then tamper night 2. Which makes them scum candidates still if we get chain fails.

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 7:09 am

In post 2488, beeboy wrote:Keep in mind the scum pool is still {Farside, Spring, Dunn, Raya, Starbuck} if the quiz fails.

Since Dunn/Spring could manually deny the quiz night 1 then tamper night 2. Which makes them scum candidates still if we get chain fails.

if the quiz fails***

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 11:59 am

For clarification it narrows us down to a scum pool of 5 not 3.
Cause the people off the wagon could have manually failed it n1 and frame it n2. >_>

@unwnd also you understand why I shouldn't receive a vest tonight right right?

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 12:36 pm

In post 2556, beeboy wrote:@unwnd also you understand why I shouldn't receive a vest tonight right right?

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 1:48 pm

Farside didn't you have the same concern about being framed?
Sorry in advance when you point out the thing I am missing Z_Z

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 3:56 pm

Team: Unwnd, Farside, Starbuck, Raya

Approve - Unwnd, Beeboy, Titus, Farside, Raya, Starbuck (L-1)
Deny - Spring, Dunnstral

@Starbuck I think it's passing so we can go back to moving the chain along.
I want Claire to have an incredibly annoying resolution when she gets back. B)

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 4:34 pm

The chain must move riot!!!

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 4:38 pm

Spring I firmly believe Starbuck rolled town this game and you are wasting your time right now.
I don't think this 1v1 is doing you any favors until much later into the game if you 2 are still left alive.

Our thread lacks clear focus right now because of the incredibly aggressive 1v1s that keep forming every single day phase (unwnd/TSE and now you/starbuck)

Please just step back so we can win this game and catch the other 2 scum if I am wrong?
Yes Yes

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 5:06 pm

In post 2626, Starbuck wrote:beeboy, give me your top 3 to pass out of who is left, please.

I am pretty sure you're against 2 of my options which are TSE and Spring.
Pink Ball is what I suspect you'll end up picking.

Dunnstral I guess is my next best option since Titus and NDMath shouldn't be touching anything that resembles a chain.

pedit: you snooze you lose.

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 5:11 pm

NDMath is less a scum would be lurking thing and more a I don't see him ever hitting end game so I want to solve the problem sooner rather then later.

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 5:15 pm

tbf I took like 30 minutes to reply.

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 5:21 pm

In general I still want Titus flipping today over Midaway, I don't think anyone has been a new opinion due to the Titus slot and the flip helps us out more then the midway flip does.
Although I guess either is fine idk.

I am with PB I want more flip based info in order to solve Dunn I think he'll be easy to solve with a few of those.

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 6:21 pm

In post 2655, farside22 wrote:
In post 2650, beeboy wrote:In general I still want Titus flipping today over Midaway, I don't think anyone has been a new opinion due to the Titus slot and the flip helps us out more then the midway flip does.
Although I guess either is fine idk.

I am with PB I want more flip based info in order to solve Dunn I think he'll be easy to solve with a few of those.
I've changed my mind on titus. I would rather see spring/dunn/TSE/mid any of those 4 as bottom 2. I swear sometimes I just think you really don't care about this game any more or just want to stick with your reads because......??? I don't know i just never meet a player that refused to see or think about what others are saying like you do.

I think we are lacking new relevant information in the form of wagons and even flips because of how slow this game is going. I am not happy about the constant thunderdomes that keep happening this game. But with vote counts and wagon dynamics normally I am capable of making it work? A lack of clear support on pushes makes this game very hard for me to navigate and all these aggressive 1v1s aren't doing a good job persuading me outside town reading Starbuck which is a shit take away from this amount of pages. Mafia has never been a game of rhetoric so these various 1v1s has little bearing on player's alignment in my world.

I think Dunn's recent set of posts where he responded to me indirectly by saying "fuck me so if the group fails you guys lynch me anyway" felt like town frustration to me over anything else. Which is why I put him as my 4th best option which I guess was my most recent read adjustment.

You tin foiling me constantly is also starting to give me better vibes compared to where I was previously at?

Titus is supporting you but I don't think she is doing it in a way that is overly hard to fake? I could maybe see from your POV how her angles and thoughts come from a town POV. But it feels like standard going through motions to me which I'll admit town can do. Lot's of my recent posts are just me going through motions.

Issue with my new Dunnstral read and read on you is that I am now committing to the idea of the n1 quiz group being all town. Which is something I actually believe is highly likely to be possible but the state of the thread makes me not want to actually argue about mechanics to be blunt. Scum had to have seen the update because scum see thread updates when they check their scum topic or the quiz team topic. So I think "scum not noticing" isn't an argument that actually holds up unless scum deliberately gambited shooting unwnd which doesn't make much sense given the quiz failed. I literally just wanted to run the quiz team back because I wanted to validate to myself that it will pass this time and is all town or I prove myself wrong so I am forced to scum read someone in that group.

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 6:26 pm

The only spicy thing going through my head is as follows.

Scum have to see thread updates when checking private topics
Scum must have seen the post stating how the BP works
If any quiz-1 member was scum they don't shoot unwnd
If it was a gambit why fail the group? Tampering being in the game was a day 2 idea, not a day 1 idea.

And ABR replaced out because between me and unwnd. In addition to the 5 quiz members being conf town he thought the game was bullshit.

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 6:29 pm

{PB, Titus, Midway, NDMath, TSE}

You have to assume all 3 scum is in that small group of 3 people though if you believe my theory.
Which is why my scum pool was the way it was.

I am not ready to argue that yet though I want results on the quiz being ran back first.

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 6:30 pm

If you think I am not being consistent, take out my town read on TSE, and townier read on PB and check to see the 3 people I called scum lol.

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 6:52 pm

In post 2659, beeboy wrote:The only spicy thing going through my head is as follows.
Scum have to see thread updates when checking private topics

Scum must have seen the post stating how the BP works

If any quiz-1 member was scum they don't shoot unwnd

If it was a gambit why fail the group? Tampering being in the game was a day 2 idea, not a day 1 idea.
And ABR replaced out because between me and unwnd. In addition to the 5 quiz members being conf town he thought the game was bullshit.

Unwnd was shot night 1, if scum was in the quiz topic they knew he was BP (mod posted 2 hours into the night how the BP worked)
We have a strong reason to believe scum have a tamper power.
Why gambit a shot if you plan on failing the quiz, you're just sacrificing your kill for no reason
Scum wasnt in the quiz group and thought I was getting the BP vest making quiz group 1 and unwnd all town.

beeboy · Wed Jun 10, 2020 6:59 pm

I wanted NDMath dead because if this was somehow negligence then the slot that is least active by a large margin gains massive scum equity.
So NDMath is just always scum. Either by quiz 1 being all scum or by being the one most likely to not submit a kill / see a thread update.

beeboy · Thu Jun 11, 2020 5:46 am

Approve Quiz

beeboy · Thu Jun 11, 2020 1:39 pm

The core issue with this entire situation is Spring is town.

beeboy · Thu Jun 11, 2020 1:48 pm

In post 2758, Titus wrote:
In post 2757, beeboy wrote:The core issue with this entire situation is Spring is town.
Based on what? His AtE that's wrong and offensive AF.

I mean my counter argument is you have the ABR slot.

They aren't playing to end game they are playing to be right which feels townie to me.

beeboy · Thu Jun 11, 2020 3:00 pm

Spring don't let them kill Pinkball.
Why are you doing this to me I keep defending you PepeHands.

beeboy · Thu Jun 11, 2020 4:36 pm

Let's just watch Titus flip scum and move on tbh.

beeboy · Fri Jun 12, 2020 7:08 am

TSE these other guys are lamers but if you are killing PB please talk to me about it ok ok?

beeboy · Fri Jun 12, 2020 12:43 pm

b r u h

beeboy · Fri Jun 12, 2020 12:44 pm

In post 2883, Dunnstral wrote:I'd hate to interrupt whatever you guys are going here, but back to the game: Titus is highly likely to be scum and we should clear out that slot today, vs leaving it alive. The opposite of what PB is saying here.... Titus is worse to leave in the game

^^^^
Idk how Titus could have possibly redeemed ABR in anyone's eyes.
But for some reason you guys think that.

beeboy · Fri Jun 12, 2020 12:45 pm

TSE if I am wrong on Titus I'll give the chain to whoever you want tomorrow no questions asked. (I am one to honor this)
If you think they are both town then you have no reason to not.

beeboy · Fri Jun 12, 2020 12:53 pm

This is a "gun to head, just pull the trigger" kind of game.

beeboy · Fri Jun 12, 2020 1:05 pm

In post 2885, beeboy wrote:TSE if I am wrong on Titus I'll give the chain to whoever you want tomorrow no questions asked. (I am one to honor this)
If you think they are both town then you have no reason to not.

This expires if TSE doesn't do it in his following post.

beeboy · Fri Jun 12, 2020 2:25 pm

It's ok I just got cleared

beeboy · Mon Jun 15, 2020 8:46 am

Oh look, sabotage 4head.

beeboy · Mon Jun 15, 2020 8:46 am

At least one of my reads didn't suck.

beeboy · Mon Jun 15, 2020 8:52 am

HURT: NDMath, Midway, Beeboy

beeboy · Mon Jun 15, 2020 8:55 am

HURT: unwnd, Beeboy, NDMath

Give unwnd a bullet proof vest.
Scum has to kill Math or my negative utility.

This is the best line of play.

beeboy · Mon Jun 15, 2020 10:48 am

In post 2971, Pink Ball wrote:I'm starting to think that I'm wrong in one of Dunn and spring, and that beeboy is the third scum with midway and one of Dunn and spring

bruh I just want scum to shoot me. My NU harms the town so much lmao give me my out.

beeboy · Mon Jun 15, 2020 12:14 pm

@mod vla until the 22nd

am sick this is a made up date.
Will still be on my computer but I don't want to feel obligated to post until I get healthy.

beeboy · Mon Jun 15, 2020 4:33 pm

Hurt: Person We Lynch, Person who gets vest, Me

I am the only one who should die, that benefits town to die and scum won't just abstain their shot.
Idk

beeboy · Mon Jun 15, 2020 4:34 pm

unwnd always gets the vest obviously, so.

We do the hurt vote end of the day.

Me, Unwnd, The one who dies.

beeboy · Mon Jun 15, 2020 4:36 pm

If town can't pass quizzes or control the chain leader vote we are fucked.
I am a straight up late game liability especially if you guys want to be paranoid of me.

The latter part is fine, my read on Raya is the only good thing I've done this game, but just end me to save yourselves the trouble on a wide range of levels.

beeboy · Mon Jun 15, 2020 4:36 pm

Make it someone like Math, scum just no kill and carry on. If Math is town we get paranoid and lynch them anyway idk.

beeboy · Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:39 pm

In post 3030, Pink Ball wrote:I think that beeboy's plan is good but it shouldn't be beeboy in case beeboy is scum and he's proposing what the scumteam wants to go for (like, then nobody dies during the night and then there's the "oh scumteam wants to make you believe that I'm scum and they didn't shoot me!" argument and wifom wifom wifom). Let's wait for the mod to confirm what would happen if we lynch between the three first, Dunn anticipated that

This mentality would hold for all my scum buddies as well... >_> You want to kill a townie here who you aren't sure of which I am pretty sure is exactly me who fits that description.

Not to mention I am just the best townie to kill as I am a NU. If we can literally only kill a town this way the NU that is being sussed should die.

beeboy · Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:44 pm

Then make sure the chain doesn't get to me so I die today, but don't just tiptoe around making a judgement call because I am not having that when the cleanest way of dealing with me just arrived on our doorstep.

pedit: no its me who dies ur stuck in this game.

beeboy · Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:52 pm

Tbh this is an end of day discussion because our plan does involve adding the person we lynch to the pool... >_>

I think quiz team size is 50% of living townies rounded down (I am guessing tbh) so leaving me alive eventually harms town even if it doesn't at this exact moment in time. I am laying this down on the table now as I don't think I am dying via night kill anymore so I might as well explain why I should die here.

If scum no kill because they think they can lynch me A) they won't be able to and B) it forces us to go back to odds which means they are gambling A LOT on their ability to get me lynched. Since 2 blocked kills basically just gives us another day phase. 1 blocked kill is just a meme.

pedit: nope its official I cased my own death very well in this post.

beeboy · Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:53 pm

Anyway, this is an end of day discussion, this thread gives me mental pain in addition to my physical pain.
Ciao friends.

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:33 am

what is farsides concern?
I haven't read the thread.

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:11 am

uh who is the agreed bottom 2 right now and why I am I being assumed to pass them the chain?

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:12 am

1 sec I guess I guess I'll just read the thread.

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:16 am

Who did Farside protect night 1?

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:22 am

If Dunnstral/NDMath agree I'll do it.

Otherwise I still think Midway should die, since I think that flips scum the most often?

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:28 am

In post 3250, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 3247, beeboy wrote:Who did Farside protect night 1?
You

Unlucky....

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:29 am

In post 3251, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 3248, beeboy wrote:If Dunnstral/NDMath agree I'll do it.

Otherwise I still think Midway should die, since I think that flips scum the most often?
You should decline the current quiz to speed things up if you haven't already

@Math What do you think about Tse? Bottom 3 or do we sub somebody else in there?

decline quiz

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:29 am

Basically I am totally fine listening to the majority, it isn't a big deal to me.
It's just the 2 masons are a relatively vital part of said majority lol.

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:37 am

See I am with Dunn, I want to strongarm save spring.
But the nature of this setup requires us to be the bigger people and let her die.

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:38 am

that's the reason this setup is scum sided.

Midway and Spring are both still alive for basically no reasonable reason if this was a normal game of mafia.
I don't want to just add to that issue because I think I am some elite scum hunter lol.

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:40 am

Actually this setup isn't scum sided bad choice of words, it's the chain mechanic that's scum sided.
The quiz mechanic even with frames for scum feels very town sided.

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 1:14 pm

See my issue is Midway knows he is the next lynch regardless, same for spring... :/
I feel like the one we want to save should get the chain early (if that's midway today), because at least if they fuck us we know well in advance.

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 1:43 pm

Was Raya actually a uni town read?
It's hard to remember because I spent the entire game giving her the chain lol.

Spring pushed on Raya hard which could skew my memory of the events.

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 1:46 pm

Farside isn't fake claiming though, I don't see the point in arguing against that.
I can find the specific interaction but she basically prepped for this early day 2.

When I was pushing the notion of the quiz group potentially being all town my idea hinged on scum shooting unwnd. She kept attacking that idea from kind of odd angles that basically confirm her claim to me. Far above the soft claim actually, the soft claim was kinda meh to me.

Like idk, I think she committed to the claim well before right now, and it also reflects in how she has been trying to solve the game.

If I don't believe any claim it's unwnds in particular because he specifically avoided solving the game using his role in mind with how he spoke about my role.

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 4:06 pm

I am going to be real, people keep shitting on Farside and Starbuck like unwnd deserves to be universally town read lmao.

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 4:15 pm

If scum shot me they knew we had a power role to stop a kill.
The only person pushing that notion while shitting on unwnd was ABR. Who is currently flipped town.

I just find that very hard to believe scum would just let that happen lol.

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 4:22 pm

See I want to go back and reread day 1, since the last 2 days have been shitty auto pilot days.
But given today is another auto pilot day I know reading now won't change anything lol.

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 4:59 pm

please free me PB, push me to death.

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 5:00 pm

include me in the hurt list at the very least T_T

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 5:14 pm

In post 3364, Pink Ball wrote:Come oooooon beeboy we'll have fun!!

I mean if I am town and the town bloc has scum who do you really think it is?

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 5:18 pm

In post 3369, Pink Ball wrote:
In post 3366, beeboy wrote:
In post 3364, Pink Ball wrote:Come oooooon beeboy we'll have fun!!
I mean if I am town and the town bloc has scum who do you really think it is?
Do you think there's scum in our town bloc?

I honestly just don't think the game is solved right now with (Spring, TSE, Midway) given that's the only town bloc = correct world.

Unless the Masons are fake claiming but meh.

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 5:20 pm

That would also involve spring manually failing the first quiz group.
And despite manually failing the quiz group and Rayas role confirming scum can tamper.
They let the 2nd quiz group pass.

The game being solved right now doesn't actually make sense.
I just think we need a wrong flip to prove it and Midway is still just scum who is forced to suffer in this game.

VOTE: Dunnstral

beeboy · Thu Jun 18, 2020 5:32 pm

I mean my head space is basically in the same spot, I don't consider it solved because we don't actually know who the last scum is. But if we are on the same page on the if all else fails do X then I guess I am worried for nothing?

I think we have to be wrong on one of them. Since the 2nd group passing to me confirms one of unwnd/starbuck has to be scum that wanted the group to pass. I still don't think it's farside and raya was on the group and is currently dead.

beeboy · Fri Jun 19, 2020 4:32 pm

approve team

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 11:56 am

^ Me this game.

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:28 pm

In post 3452, Dunnstral wrote:HURT: Starbuck, TSE, midwaybear

Midway, if you're going rogue, tell us before you lock it in and we'll switch the hurt vote so it doesn't random somebody

Basically this, I don't care what you do just tell us first.

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:29 pm

HURT: Starbuck, TSE, midwaybear

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:29 pm

I still think Spring is flipping town but what do I know weeeeeeeeeee

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:30 pm

Spring has to flip neighbor otherwise PB is just outed.
They wouldn't be scum neighbors that's slightly questionable, although I've seen it once before 6 years ago.

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:37 pm

In post 3466, midwaybear wrote:my paranoia is sorta getting to me because this could be really close to being a scum sweep, and whoever is scum might have fake-claimed to propel them over the finish line.

guys consider this: Why would spring as scum vote for beeboy to be chain leader if scum were planning on killing beeboy?
I'm probably killing tse because of this.

4head, it's because she is town and we are wasting time right now.
It's just TSE is also town so who gives a shit just please the crowd so we can lynch unwnd tomorrow.

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:39 pm

Christ I am starting to town read midway more and more.

Fuck me....

I quit playing this game.

I hope the masons are just gambiting and unwnd is scum.

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:41 pm

Riddle me this midway, why do you want to kill TSE specifically? Do you just think Spring is flipping town or do you have 2 reasons.

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:45 pm

In post 3472, midwaybear wrote:why is unwnd scum?
I just think spring has more town equity. TSE flipping green gives me lots of town cred, but I probably die tonight if I am still in the group of three.

I am asking about TSE which is why I am asking why you want to flip him.

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:46 pm

unwnd is wolf for the way he ignored his role relative to mine at the start of the game. Meaning he wasn't always planning to claim that role. Then he started to fly under the radar when we let go of the pressure on him.

Contrast that to Dunnstral who tossed the chain to his Mason buddy.
Farside who was prodding me when I kept saying unwnd got shot.
Me who isn't getting put on quiz teams.

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:52 pm

HURT: Starbuck, SpringLullaby, midwaybear

I have enough foresight to know what he is going to do lol.

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:57 pm

Ok midway, pick what you want in 1 hour.
PB you have 1 hour to convince midway you're wrong.

This game needs to progress so and I don't care who dies anymore.

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:58 pm

In post 3499, beeboy wrote:Ok midway, pick what you want in 1 hour.
PB you have 1 hour to convince midway you're right.

This game needs to progress so and I don't care who dies anymore.

I meant right but whatever.
I just want the game moving forward and I really don't care who lives and who dies in this bottom pair.

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 3:01 pm

In post 3502, midwaybear wrote:but if I end up choosing spring, the other townies need to change their hurt votes

You figured out why to avoid everyone sitting around doing nothing for many real life days you should choose tonight!
I am not even saying to agree with PB, just pick something.

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 3:02 pm

This game is comprised of me once every 7 irl days to just pass the chain to some obv town lol.

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 3:05 pm

ngl I just want to know if I am right or wrong on spring LOL.
At least if I am wrong I can just give up.

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 3:46 pm

please be scum so I can give up pls pls pls

beeboy · Sat Jun 20, 2020 3:47 pm

I took a 2 year break.
So yes.

beeboy · Tue Jun 23, 2020 2:06 pm

Growing apathetic last phase was basically game throwing on my part. I should have pushed harder to save spring and get unwnd ded. But being wrong on Titus really fucked up my motivation. My bad I didn't consider how unwinnable lylo was.

I doubted the masons but I probably wasn't pushing them until I caught the 3rd scum which means they did their job.

beeboy · Tue Jun 23, 2020 2:13 pm

In post 3590, SirCakez wrote:My reads were really bad I fuckin sacrificed myself to save scum unwnd UGHHHHHH

Ngl I regretted that near instantly >___>
I got distracted pushing Titus in particular who couldn't be scum with unwnd then I gave up after that flip instead of adjusting and moving forward.

Also I didn't push Math nearly as hard as I was supposed to.

I think my reads this game were ok, but my execution was the most god awful thing ever. Killing my bad reads and letting my good reads live the way mafia was intended to be played.

beeboy · Tue Jun 23, 2020 2:21 pm

In post 3594, Nahdia wrote:well, as soon as they flipped town you started townreading them (:

That quote is specifically talking about Cakez which only makes it better.

beeboy · Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:15 am

I'd play the setup again simply to see if new knowledge would help me out. But I agree with the point that "large amount of time spent sitting on your hands doing nothing." point ABR made and I am not sure if anything would be able to help that out. I actually did have fun in this game until the final day phase and I wouldn't say I am upset with the result I don't think I deserve to win.

I think we didn't' have a reliable way of tracking town thoughts, this game really brought out the aspect of mafia of "the loudest voice wins" which resulted in midway kind of getting dunked on the entire game. The result of so many people not being able to actively push their ideas just resulted in people being toxic to each other which was a bit rough.

beeboy · Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:26 am

I agreed with PB to kill Cakez, and I also did nothing in the final day phase. Along with being a key element to killing Titus.
I did play like garbage and I think the blame is universal across the entire town. No one was playing particularly well, and I think we all have something to take away from this game. Given this game was about the many elements of mafia outside reads and good votes which is what usually matters.

I was pushing NDMath all game but I wasn't pushing him through the mason claim which was planned by the scum so it's not like any of that really matters. I was pushing unwnd very late but I do much about it, and midway was pushing Dunnstral but didn't have a case. The rest if my read and the rest of town reads were just on town.

A lot of this post-game bickering feels like "you were mislynching the wrong town xD" but there isn't really ever a right town to mislynch we played badly and that's that. I had fun and I did learn from this game which is really all you can hope for in any game of mafia.

beeboy · Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:36 am

In post 3663, springlullaby wrote:
In post 3658, beeboy wrote:I think we didn't' have a reliable way of tracking town thoughts, this game really brought out the aspect of mafia of "the loudest voice wins" which resulted in midway kind of getting dunked on the entire game. The result of so many people not being able to actively push their ideas just resulted in people being toxic to each other which was a bit rough.
Nah, I see it as difficulty to adjust to the setup, which is effectively more kingmaker than traditional mafia.
People were trying to reproduce traditional mafia strategy and voting scheme instead of considering it as a different game.
That was what really annoyed me all game.

And anytime real talk about the game happened you had the suck brigade intervention of blablabla because it's too big for their brain.

I think not flipping scum day 1 literally lost us the game with how we chose to play.
No one fought the masons outside random tin foil comments, which means anytime they touched the chain they could simply secure the scum team by passing to unwnd since NDMath had such low presence he could get away with anything.

And without breaking that apart we literally could have never won the game.
Not a single townie was pushing to break that apart so I don't think any of us really deserved to win.

We were pushing unwnd on the last day phase but at that point it was too late because scum was the one who was securing his safety.

beeboy · Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:37 am

I don't mean to come across as pessimistic I am more saying I don't think the blame game gets us anywhere because we were all really just pushing different townies as far as this game is concerned as long as we weren't fighting the masons.

beeboy · Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:58 am

Mislynching PB over you just makes us lose differently, it's not like Far/SB/PB costed the town a foreseeable win sheeping you.
None of the scum reads placed on Dunnstral/NDMath matter if we let them get away with a mason claim.

You have to push a mason claim very hard to see traction which wasn't happening by anyone. Dunn/Math could always secure their 3rd team member so they had to be pegged before unwnd reads really mattered. I don't think we realized the pacing of this game which made us trip up.

A day 1 scum lynch might have changed the momentum but day 2/3 we all were really digging our own graves just in different ways.

beeboy · Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:00 am

We are just arguing which one of us was digging said grave the fastest right now but I don't think that matters.

beeboy · Wed Jun 24, 2020 12:34 pm

In post 3671, beeboy wrote:We are just arguing which one of us was digging said grave the fastest right now but I don't think that matters.

This is going to be my new quote for all post games when town loses.