Mini Normal 2275: Roguelikes - Day 3: Endgame!

[Eiralox]

hi I'm eiralox and i'm here for the goo

VOTE: Malakittens with a +3 polymorph mace.

[Eiralox]

the brave eira, after morphing a nest of the critters into lungfish, is ambushed from behind!

[Eiralox]

eira, fleeing, slips on a toffee, and crawls away. eira now has a fever

[Eiralox]

this bird makes no sense

[Eiralox]

VOTE: Loftwing with a wand of gravity

[Eiralox]

VOTE: kennyk the beings of fate have whispered it in my ear

[Eiralox]

flying orange pants be no match for daring eira

[Eiralox]

for a bell tolls in the distance

[Eiralox]

For reference can we get some general info from everyone like:

hi I'm eiralox and i'm here for the goo

[Eiralox]

is there an elephant in this room?

[Eiralox]

you are lost wanderer

[Eiralox]

simple answer: too early to speculate.

[Eiralox]

I mean true but why not just speculate? It's not like I can "gotcha!" you on page 2 by holding you to the read forever

if you give me a pebble i can't describe the mountain

[Eiralox]

i have many pebbles and right now they're all pretty to look at

[Eiralox]

VOTE: Lowell

[Eiralox]

@kennyk i don't like ur post as well but i'm not voting on it yet.

[Eiralox]

can be town. they're not here. Lowell more sus 2 me. Mooo.

[Eiralox]

one of those u forgot to mention is me. i'll be studying who the others are, if any. might be significant, might not.

UNVOTE: Lowell cos readz

[Eiralox]

okfor reference all those not mentioned by loweel and 'all scum proabably" are : (slow clap for da lucky winners folks)


BlueBloodedToffee
Eiralox
Loftwing
Confidently Wrong
Shoshin
Fredrick A Campbell

[Eiralox]

oh ok toffe was townread my bad. 5 scum then.

[Eiralox]

Three folks voted lowell at timeof readlist. Only one L mentions is toffee, prob. Town by iso. Other 2 not mentioned, so classed as prob scum. Wouldnt town lowell be more sus and attentive off thosevoting on em?

[Eiralox]

other feel i got rn is L0oftwing. there's a disconnect, feels too light on the feet

[Eiralox]

hmmmm a laden african swallow mayhap?

[Eiralox]

Wowmuch observe fred im impressed u noticed that subtle fact.

[Eiralox]

fancypants iso: feels town. throws a broad net.

scum! arguments that they tunnel on loftwing and kenny, but that's not strong enough a theme for eira to be concerned about atm.

out of the 12 players in my null pile, pants is greenish.

[Eiralox]

kenny... null. imma not comfortable voiting there atm. i can see uber-defensiveness but this can also be town sign day one. i'm wary of toffee/lowell in an abstract manner so imma giving kenny some rope.

[Eiralox]

Mala ISO: full null. they're sleepies

[Eiralox]

Irrelphant: Seems solvey. greenish 4 naow.

[Eiralox]

Freddy AC: I can say this or that but full null. like the pushy nature, wont townread for it.

[Eiralox]

MAlcolm Tuck: Well so far the most greenish one in my null dungeon. if MT i scum they're playing a grand game, made quick scan and seems most tentacly player here thus far, reaching into all da nooks n crannies.


i think thats it 4 now mayb tommorow ill be more comprehensive.

[Eiralox]

Depends, hav u found urself?

[Eiralox]

To find oneself is to reach inner peace

[Eiralox]

Falling stonks mean little if one has reached inner peace.

[Eiralox]

Eh dumb that down to human I dont speak moonnese. Anyway confidently wrong why my stonks falling? U think I havent reached inner peace?

[Eiralox]

kenny is greener. this post good. eira no vote kenny 2day.

[Eiralox]

what about that post is towny to you, Eira?

i feel it in the force

[Eiralox]

VOTE: confidently wrong with a ten foot pole.

lowell i'm ok with. you don't xpand tho. fact that u have mala on scum list trips me. mala straight null, ill vote there cos inactive but i don't see how u can form any reads. there's nothing. so having mala in a team with lowell/eira..... i mean CF maybe ur trolling here but D1 if I name three ppl scum i do so with reasons. meh.


me, well, bring your case. tell me why and how eira is scummy.

[Eiralox]

and out of all the teams that's the one you see? possible deflection here. imma see what yer aboot

[Eiralox]

quick iso Wrong
'
44

v pants

----tofffeee banter---

---focus on irrel poss scum read on pants, by interpreting q irrel asks eira---

#108 reaffirms pants focus

#111 Agrees with Lowell re: pants, votes Cat Scratch. no reasons given. (fancy defended panys just b4)

#127 "Wtf what about me" after elepohNT vote

Shosh and pants doing a “let’s performatively say opposite things on a thing that doesn’t matter” gambit. Love it.

Cats still, though. Someone hammer

didnt you literally call pants town like 2 pages ago

lowell doesnt scumread pants here, not directly anayway. Wrong wants to mob cats still, no reason.

#157 votes Fred. non-indicative, yet wuick switch after lowell/cats?

#200 mala pressure vote

#274 townread Irrell

#275 townread Irrel and Shoshin to Malcom

#286 lockstown cats

#287 express intent to continue tunneling mala'''

#295 townread loftwing

I guess CW has town vibes

CW, there's a major wagon on kenny, the second-quietest player. Who are you giving advice to?

i saw people start voting Lowell/Loftwing

I would argue Lowell, tied for third-quietest, is also in your category of quiet players. But point taken I guess

#371 Vote Kenny. 'yolo'

#385 votes Lowell

Loftwing is town, unvote them and vote scumclaimed lowell

@CW, This is the part where I ask you why Loftwing is town - you ignore me and I don't change my mind.

The claimed mafia lowell spewed them town

Mala/Lowell/eiralox is a team I'd lock in rn gth

Its probably wrong but i am confident of at least 2

[Eiralox]

i have reasons to townread every other slot and an inactive mala who doesnt post anything game related at all is not null - it leans scum.

ah but here's the thing: u were team forming. three, at least two. aaaand how can u from teams with mala?


the only interaction mala has is with bbt/irrelphant basically. sooooooooo............ if u said straight up mala inactivem that seems scummy, include on list, yeah. u forming mala into teams? mala who has zero info thus far in game? yeah mala doing nothing is scummy. but sum ppl are inactive so imma not scumread that slot.


u paring mala with me and lowell however, this after your lowell vote...


and this after your first shade on me when you talked of eira stonks, then u had no case, now u have no case. best case i see from u all day is on loweel, and even thats washy to me atm but i gotta study.

ur way wuick to hop on votes and form both scum and town reads but your reasons are...... lacking.


my vote stays here for now.

[Eiralox]

your reads you posted earlier feel very half hearted and ingenuine


and your treatment of lowell felt very distancy - in the sense that you are even currently willing to vote me over lowell after never expressing an actual townread there - and also stated you were basing scumreads off that slot.


all in all it seems you are trying to flip townies while positioning yourself as having your partner Lowell in your scumreads to later try to claim you pushed them all along.

lol.. '


alll 12 of ya are in my null pile. i got feels but dont expect me to stay on d1 votes. and i'm not gonna defend myself against this, i have no concern about this line of reasoning bearing fruition.

you woulda done better by saying i was protecting my scum partner mala, there's more playroom for an attack for you there.

[Eiralox]

VOTE: eiralox

u gonna back this up? i'm leaning green on you but Wrong's quick townread of u rang some soft bells.

[Eiralox]

Whats your lowell read


please explain your read progression from the first moment you mentioned my slot - that would be the point where you unvoted Lowell.

dont have time for that kinda shite. Lowell is in my bottom pile. don;t have more concrete view rn.

[Eiralox]

and how has your read on my slot evolved since you mentioned my name? what reasoning was there?[/quote]


early D1 u were straight null. u got a gimmick and i'm okay with gimmicks. mid day one i wasnt focusing on this game. im backreading bit by bit. rn im voting for u and after going thru iso my vote stays. no more n that.

[Eiralox]

qoute goofy its 458

[Eiralox]

VOTE: Eiralox

Have it your way. I offered the easy way, let's do the hard way.

lol

[Eiralox]

i luv how u switch off lowell(ur main scumread) and onto me after irrell shifted onto me. your case on me is iffy at best so your vote can be framed as either defensive or opportunistic. i'm not scumreading u yet. but rn im happiest with my vote riiiight here.

im out 4 now enjoy walkin' the hard path.

[Eiralox]

I purely shifted off you because one of my townreads (irrelephant) voted you and I saw an opportunity to amp up the pressure.

And I don't think you can really try to frame me as defensive - even though that isn't an actual tell, considering your entire reasoning for voting me, regardless of what alignment you are, is obviously that I listed you in a solve.

still here before i become a dwarf.


point 1: ok

point 2: i framed u as defensive or opportunistic, if scum!

point3: Noooooooo u havnet been reading, and my vote stays after i went thru yer iso.

the thing that triggered me is using Mala in a solve. say therye inactive and say ull vote there ok, but there's no data in mala to use for any poss team solving unless theyre trolling 100% and toffee is their scum buddy.

and then the early shade on me takjen into account..... i joke about u finding scum by looking at urself(sorta) u immediately find this scummy. later add me in scum triad. then only after i press give any reasons.

my general feeling off u is ur too loose and poss. scum trying to find a possible nook to crawl into to affect wagons but not enough to draw attention.

i'm still to go over portions of this game, my vote stays 4 now.

[Eiralox]

I'm sure its totally towny that you voted and now are making up reasons to justify it that are not what it obviously was.

yeah me reading trhough yiour iso and studying various interactions u had is alighnment-indicative.

grow a bigger tree if u wanna cast shade on me.

if u wanna be evasive, cool. im out.

[Eiralox]

What interactions are scum indicative? please share with the class

none. im'm not sumreading u yet.


here's the thing; vote lowell.

eira/mala/lowell names cum.

u only provide brief reasons for why lowell. say nothing on eira or mala of substance, all interaction u had with me was an exchange of one-liners where in joke-named u scum.


u only expoand on ur scumread on me after i vote u.



so..... im thinking town would immediately and clearly state why they feel mala and eira are scummy. u did not. it toook my vote on you to get any actual reasoning.

[Eiralox]

those are not logical reasons

what a response. you haven't offered anything of note imo. i think the lloyd attack is the only thing of substance, imma yet to study that. you are way to bouncy with your votes and townreads and they don't correlate. questioning my logic is one thing, not directly addressing my points is another.

and i'm not feeling so good about @Irrelephant now. maybe they're offline, maybe not, but if u vote someone be there to back it up. i hope they can weigh in on their reasoning in their own time.

[Eiralox]

those are not logical reasons

what a response. you haven't offered anything of note imo. i think the lloyd attack is the only thing of substance, imma yet to study that. you are way to bouncy with your votes and townreads and they don't correlate. questioning my logic is one thing, not directly addressing my points is another.

and i'm not feeling so good about @Irrelephant now. maybe they're offline, maybe not, but if u vote someone be there to back it up. i hope they can weigh in on their reasoning in their own time.

i could do my usual and go on and mock your reasons with examples of what youve listed from confirmed townies in other games to show how ridiculous the reasoning is but I decided to save the trouble and simply call them out for what they are: illogical reasons.

i dont give a fuck about other games. they dint exist if im in one. do as you please. and sure continue to be evasive. rn im feeling worse and worse about you.

[Eiralox]

strange that youre only now typing longer than single or double sentences CW >.<


i got mah eyes in u

[Eiralox]

i mean i've affirmed my willingnes to vote mala and ive said lowell is in the bottom of my pile so this entire reasoning here(along with mala inactive total null) for a team is... what? just the three u find most scummy?



game solved well played bravo

[Eiralox]

And to ellaborate more on Eira - when reading their posts it comes off as someone trying to seem confident about their push on me while trying to hide any evidence of how they reached that read - the confidence comes off as completely fraudulent and the reasoning comes off as amended after the fact.

Eira likely decided they need to push me for wincon probably because I am correct in my reads to some degree IMO and this is why we see this mad dash to try to case me in such a way after OMGUSing me.

Frankly it is shocking that no one else sees what I see in that Eira is basically howling in the way they have been caught in a very poorly spun web of lies.

I implore people to begin at Eira's posts about lowell and see how they progressed into pushing me - I think you can find there is a strong agenda feel to it.

no u

[Eiralox]

strange that youre only now typing longer than single or double sentences CW >.<


i got mah eyes in u

You made the mistake of flipping my WIM switch, which turns on as soon as anyone makes a shitpush at me.

i dont know what that swithc is. i flip switches.


uuuuuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhh?????? your shitty push at me? naming me scum for no reason and only expanding read after i vote u and only voting after irrelpant votes? You've been hiding this entire game. only now do you 'solve' everything.... i mean???? in what world do you pair me with lowell and mara? i'm happy to flip either of 'em if that'kll stroke your switches or whatever you use



suck on another one.

[Eiralox]

i mean i've affirmed my willingnes to vote mala and ive said lowell is in the bottom of my pile so this entire reasoning here(along with mala inactive total null) for a team is... what? just the three u find most scummy?



game solved well played bravo

You say that but you did not vote Mala with me when I was voting there for pressure nor did you maintain your vote on lowell. you jumped to this uncharitable assumption that I must be scum *merely for including you alongside 2 other people you claim to also find not town*

i never scumread u dolt!


read and remeber everything my ass i said im not scumreading u and alll 12 are still null, nut im feeling way worse about u now then i did back then.

[Eiralox]

i mean i've affirmed my willingnes to vote mala and ive said lowell is in the bottom of my pile so this entire reasoning here(along with mala inactive total null) for a team is... what? just the three u find most scummy?



game solved well played bravo

You say that but you did not vote Mala with me when I was voting there for pressure nor did you maintain your vote on lowell. you jumped to this uncharitable assumption that I must be scum *merely for including you alongside 2 other people you claim to also find not town*

i had no reason to stay on mala.

ur not my leader so ill vote where i please, i unvoted llloyed becasue they gave reads, thus far i havent seen much from them and they felt scummy but them giving reads made me decide to unvote and sit back with my vote until i have reason to use it.

[Eiralox]

I don't think Eira's thought process was towny but I understand that it can be difficult to see what I'm seeing since it is deeper than surface level in that you have to cross examine multiple points from them to see it and that the independent parts can seem towny.

Let's not allow people to refuge in audacity.

qwow big brain long words lemme trasblate:


'my case one Eiralox is so gossamer-flimsy and speculative that i can not rightly convince any rational being of it and therefore i sulk and elevate myself above the unthinking sheeple, for how can they not see what I see? how dare they townread Eiralox! The evidence is absolute.'


I mean c'mon. Your case against lloyd are a few sentences but at least it i understand sorta, but you've written paraprgahs bout me and im still not getting what our getting at.

[Eiralox]

like when I'm looking at this old newbie game you seem to show much more confidence in stating reads early on, even with less players.

It has been 6 years, I cede so I am not taking this strongly - but when put into contrast with this game and how I interpret your play - it does make me want to confbias it as evidence, if you understand.

i told u i don't give a fuck about games that are not the current one. no further comment, spare urself sum time in da future.

[Eiralox]

Eira, do you have mafia games elsewhere I could peruse, particularly ones where you are of the mafia alignment? You have a striking lack of games on this site and it would help me to compare your mindset in other games to this one.

see above. i dont backread, i dont meta, i dont bullshit. i focus on whats here and now.

[Eiralox]

A classic tactic for less experienced mafia is to try to mimic towniness by trying to loudly proclaim how unsure they are of people's alignments to LAMIST their way into seeming uninformed. That is what I take away from Eira's play this game so far and when compared to previous times they were town it is a contrast that I doubt would exist if they randed town here.

I ask those that have stated they found Eira's play townie to reconsider with the statements I've presented. At the very least, be open to increasing pressure on the slot to make more solidified stances.

fuck no. i rarely townread anyone without a flip. i prefer to keep things grey. thats it. if that doesnt make u happy 2 bad.

[Eiralox]

like when I'm looking at this old newbie game you seem to show much more confidence in stating reads early on, even with less players.

It has been 6 years, I cede so I am not taking this strongly - but when put into contrast with this game and how I interpret your play - it does make me want to confbias it as evidence, if you understand.

i told u i don't give a fuck about games that are not the current one. no further comment, spare urself sum time in da future.

I care because this game is about analyzing patterns and those from previous games matter.

Tell me, why should I find you towny?

i'm not here to convince u about me. im not gonna, ive explained what i am. i'm here to find scum. right now i'm not liking you. i've made my points, tommorow imma expand my reading and take a closer look at elephant, lloyd, loftwing.

i honestly dont care what you think about me. quote old games all u like ill never respond. if others wanna use shite that aint happenin right now as data fonts theyre free to do so. just dont waste my time with it.

[Eiralox]

I've never seen a townie so insistant on saying "everyone is null!!"

but the issue is.. you treated mala as someone to defend by using it as reasoning to vote me. so they aren't truly null, theyre someone you wish to defend no matter how soft the defense might be.

so forgive me if I do not believe you.

well first times the charm einstein.

Now you are outright lying.

And again not reading and remembering.

I never defended Mala, I questioned how you can fit them into a scum pair with so little data.
Mala is no info. Good lynch D1 but there's still time so i want to hear from that slot before swinging either way.

And idc if u believe me, imma sus u if i wanna sus u.

[Eiralox]

Ok then die.

lol good luck with that

[Eiralox]

Your posting in your previous play showed a lot more depth and actual thought that is absent here. I refuse to believe you regressed since then. You refuse to discuss meta likely because you are scum and it incriminates you.

read my other current game. i fucking hate meta. right now im just tuning you out tbh, not gonna waste my time further here with a repeating record. tommorow ill come back and see what other folk think.

[Eiralox]

VOTE: confidently wrong

with a ten foot pole.

lowell i'm ok with. you don't xpand tho. fact that u have mala on scum list trips me. mala straight null, ill vote there cos inactive but i don't see how u can form any reads. there's nothing. so having mala in a team with lowell/eira..... i mean CF maybe ur trolling here but D1 if I name three ppl scum i do so with reasons. meh.


me, well, bring your case. tell me why and how eira is scummy.

When you said you were voting Confidently Wrong "with a ten foot pole", it really seemed like you were seriously scumreading them. Why did you phrase it like that if you weren't scumreading CW at the time?

dungeons and dragons

[Eiralox]

I will say that my read will not change unless you start showing the depth I expect to see that you as town would show.

good luck that fuhrer

[Eiralox]

im saying ur forcing ur will on me. i dint care who u are out of game thats irrelavant data. bye.

[Eiralox]

I guess Eira wasn't scumreading you. Idk his posts are hard to grok

I still think he has a towny tone

Just look at how shallow their thought process is, and compare it to their newbie games, that even though they were years ago, there shouldnt be suddenly shallowness here.

sorry we cant all be as deep as you. bye.

[Eiralox]

@CW

Stop complaining about surface things if ur gonna dredge up what i did 6 fucking years ago. get an actual case on me or stop strutting around like a big-balled baboon in a yard.


u comment on tone, in what i did as town 6 years back, say im shallow, well, time will tell i guess. time will tell >.<


i'll interact with you again if i see any value in it. at this point i doubt that will be soon.

[Eiralox]

oh wow lol y'all more suggestible than i thought.

irrelphant and catscratch vote... meh, i can, live with it. don't have a take on cats atm but from what ive seen they look better 'n a lot of others.


loftwing and fred? loftwing who i susssed earlier, fred who despite all the content reads pretty null 2 me... well now. my eyes are def gonna ber turning there.


And if y'all mob me Imma lol hard at ur trust in Con Wrong ; )

I'm not reading their posts dont care what they blurt so if yall wanna form actual reasons fro voting in the meantime that'd'b great.

[Eiralox]

VOTE: Eiralox

Dearest Eiralox,

I hope this vote finda you in good health
and in a prosperous position to put wealth
into the pockets of people like me, down on their luck
you see, your readlist is not something to fuck.

I can understand nullreading everyone around you, to keep your options cleared and your paths open. However, it feels rather contradictory when you state that CW and CSF, two users whom's initialisms start with C, are both indistinguishably equal. Please answer the the following charge that I am putting against you now:

You say that CW is null to you, however in your own posts, you say that they feel worse and worse to you as well. How can you read them as being the same as Kenny, a user whom you have greenlit while also keeping them inside the nightmarishly thin grouping of null? This is a charge of nonsensical behaviour, and should this remain unresolved, the punishment shall be death.

Yours Truly,

Daker, Loftwing.

this is word salad wow. i mean i can see Con Wriong being town in a very obsessive ego driven authoritarian kind of way. thinking atm by guts that if i shift my vote off Con Wrong it's gonna land on Loftwing.



this post is just........ what are you saying?


at this point i'm thinking folk are taking offense at my playstayle, and perhaps even Con Wrong wanna solve me cos i don't care for METAaaaaaaaaahhhhh(echo). well too bad.

[Eiralox]

575 has good points. But on the other hand sometimes scum get defensive and flustered when pressured. Loftwing’s vote is the worst on the wagon so far, for sure, if Eira is town.

i mean i find it funny that Con Wrong is so 100% sure that scumteam is found just cos someone took issue with their read methodology XD

and me continually stating i havenbt read lowell or Mala one way or another and Con wrong keeping saying i'm defending there? and that it's the team? i mean in what world does..... COn's vaunted 'logic' support this setup? just say its ur three scummiest players and leave it at that.

first Con pairs me with loyyd, i make it pretty clear i wasnbt for loyyd today and straight up tell Con that a eira/mala paiating woyuld give more room for attack. later they do launch this line of reasoning >.<


Con Wrong pairing me with them and telling me i shoulda voted this way or that way at the start of this game...


whether COn Wronf is scum or town right jow well, all i'm feeling is they being way too forceful and bullying regarding their belief in what a town player should be doing.



if some1 attacks me cos im not voting the way they want me to vote? so forceful and arrogant?

im not taking that shit lying down.

[Eiralox]

i can totally see town! Con wrong, same as Malcolm/Irrelphant says about me: why would scum! con spas out like this and not instead pursue a more subtle attack on lloyd/eira/mala?

i'll be going through things and probs gonna change my vote cos i don't see Con Wrong the Arbitoor of Playstyle's wagon going anywhere anytime soon.

imma prob switch my vote to loftwing or Malakittens. I never trust my day one reads, ive misread and misguillotined way too many townies day one in my time. I've found that going with my gut produces better results than logical and rational analysis this early. I will be studying what wagons were shifted off by those with their vote on me. if there isn't at least 1 scum voting me rn i'd be surprised.


Lloyd/Mala silence over this worries me. I know mala is basically AWOL, and don't know whether Lloyd is VLA or whatever? but at this point Mala/Lloyd input

[Eiralox]

Who’s Lloyd?

my bad all instances of lloyd>llowel.

[Eiralox]

Eira it seems like part of your scumread of CW is he put you in a three-person team prematurely. But as he pointed out, you’ve shown suspicion on the other two slots. Why was your response to scumread CW? It seems like “great PoE, though I’m town” would make more sense as a response if you’re town who agrees with 2/3 of his stated scum team

ok im not understanding all of this(i havent had coffee in like a week or more so maybe i should re-addict myself there)

anyway briefly cos at this point im at -2 so i dont see point in being vague:

my vote on Con Wrong was mostly experimental, my scumleans at that time were lloyd and loftwing, with me considering joining a mala vote cos that slot has done f-all that seems town, i know they might be inactive but at this point even if they flip town its better than other options. so my immediate reaction was, ok this is strange i dont feel groovy about mala and lloyd, so how do i fit in with them? esp as i've had eraly reason to sus lloyd for..... incomplete view among just a general scummy vibe(wanting everyone 2 hammer so early, think iv seen one other player suggest that? cant recall who)

so i mean it was sorta clear that these were the thre most scummy 2 Con Wrong but i wanted to push those reads, and then went through iso and decided Con Wrong's input has been way too watery for my taste. They can be town rn and them hangung back at start and trhwoing switches or whatever is their way, just like my vot n em is my way. who cares, im not going into that rn.

to further explain vote on Con Wrong. Cat Fever asked me why, i replied dungeons and dragons. this is meme, like my oyther votes(except llowel ione i forgot to do it i was tired).

This is a roguelike after all : 3


"When you suspect a trap, you can put the end of your 10-foot pole through that hole in the wall instead of reaching in with your hand."

[Eiralox]

soory again lloyd> llowel.

mixing username of some1 on writing forum for some reason.

[Eiralox]

oh wow fancy now im feeling way worse about u. i don't do meta, peroid, ever, if ya'll wanna be pricks about that go ahead.

and between Loftwing, Lloyd, and Mala, i'm your pick? cos you can't read me?

well Fancy Pants has shifted full null for me again.

only players i'm greenish ion atm are Malcolm, Irrelphant, Cat Scratch.

[Eiralox]

@FancyPants u havent read yo. i said i was leaning scum on llowel and considering joining mala vote at time of Con Wrong poling. u got no input on this?

cos right now i've seen a lot of egomaniacal vapidity from Con, an utter mess of a scummish post from Loftwing, and u basically saying u wanna vote me cos me not joining the meta club is confusing ur reads and that im either drunk/high and therefore sunhuman to defend myself against Con Wrongs blatant self-assertiveness.

Irrel and Cat are the only ones voting me who are keeping cool heads imo, and that's points for them.

[Eiralox]

I

did

say that if you are town I don't mind eliminating you anyway, because I find your posts too confusing, and your thought process impenetrable - so we're never going to be able to effectively work together.

yeah again i'm right "Fancy is confused so want Eira dead." what a farce. In what world do you wanna elim an active player who's forming reads and getting things going over Mala, whose done jack squat, or Loft, who's vapid air?

I'm not feeling good about your reasoning here Pants. You're nearing my scumleans.

[Eiralox]

@FancyPants u havent read yo. i said i was leaning scum on llowel and considering joining mala vote at time of Con Wrong poling. u got no input on this?

cos right now i've seen a lot of egomaniacal vapidity from Con, an utter mess of a scummish post from Loftwing, and u basically saying u wanna vote me cos me not joining the meta club is confusing ur reads and that im either drunk/high and therefore sunhuman to defend myself against Con Wrongs blatant self-assertiveness.

Irrel and Cat are the only ones voting me who are keeping cool heads imo, and that's points for them.

It's true you've been inconsistent in your suspicions of Lowell.

Can you ISo yourself and show me where you were suspicious of Malakittens? I must have missed that.

use your brain, just because im not posting anything doesnt mean im not thinking it. if u can read kinds good for u. i';ve been way focused on my other current's game day end two-four days back so didn't follow this thread as much as i wanted to. anyway.............


if i confuse you, if my way of doing things wearies you, well too bad. get better reasons for wanting to put me at -1 over other choices.

[Eiralox]

In what world do you wanna elim an active player who's forming reads and getting things going over Mala, whose done jack squat, or Loft, who's vapid air?

You see you continually say things I think are scummy.
Even the above quote.

You're basically saying you should be kept around because you're active and we should elim a lurker, but YOU were a lurker until pressure was mounted on you. Also scum players can be active. "No we should vote them instead" is not a defense.

uuuuuhhhhhh no lol there was no pressure. no on asked Con Wrong to expand on Eira read, i'm the one who took the pole and jammed it in the hole to get clarity. well ur another person im sorta gonna tune out rn(not as much as COn Wrong but still i'm getting nowhere with u, imma rest and come back and look at where i wanna look. don't become too confused in the meantime >.<)

[Eiralox]

uuuuuhhhhhh no lol there was no pressure. no on asked Con Wrong to expand on Eira read, i'm the one who took the pole and jammed it in the hole to get clarity. well ur another person im sorta gonna tune out rn(not as much as COn Wrong but still i'm getting nowhere with u, imma rest and come back and look at where i wanna look. don't become too confused in the meantime >.<)

You must understand that Con Wrong scum reading you, and you "taking the pole and jamming it in the whole" is exactly what I mean when I say "you responded to pressure".

then you and i define pressure as different things. i was in a very amused frame of mind when i voted con wrong.

-fin-

[Eiralox]

Lol I dont think u know what experiment means. Ive already explained why I was inactive here. If lurking gives u scum boner thenapply that selfsame brush to cw, I accused them of exactly what ur saying here.


If I was a dumb scum I wouldve piled onto con wrong like. If I was a meek eira I wouldve taken con wrongs bullyish manner. But if u wanna pile in with that sorta player go for it. At this point ur mind is urs to make up, imma do my thing u do urs. Just dint say id dint warn ya.

[Eiralox]

Can I specifically get clarity from Kenny and Loftwing, exactly what they think of Eira and why, I know Loftwing gave reasoning when he voted, but can you clarify why her behaviour is scummy in your eyes.
Please don't say you have no opinion.

@Loftwing, nice Hamilton reference.

My reasoning for voting Eira is that they see CW, someone who they have fought and who they have said they think worsely of, and Kenny, who they have stated a greenlighting towards, are both equal in terms of scum equity, as that is what null means.

In other words, despite saying that they like Kenny and hate CW, they still say that they are equal and are both null.

Whoooopy ride man wtf is going on here. Ive felt better about kenny. Cw I wanted to expand. Theyve been one sentencing this game. Loftwing is my prob vote target atm. Ill go through what they did then come back with conclusion.

[Eiralox]

Loftwing now you straight up lie. If you have paid any attention youda seen I lean green on malcolm, elephant, cat.

Kenny and cw null. Ive felt better about kenny and worse about cw.

VOTE: Loftwing

Scummiest one on me. Ill come back later in day with analysis. Peace.

[Eiralox]

Fred I seldom townread ppl. I lean. I feel. Later in game once I have data and a feel for whats what im more likely to put trust in others. Im not going to adress ur posts at all. If yall wanna mob me at this point go for it. Im on mobile when power comes back ill offer deeper insight.on loftwing. As a start ; )

[Eiralox]

Also, do you really mean you are going to ignore every post I made regarding you?

I mean im done trying to see others reasons for something that isnt there. Look at my iso, look at me sussin llowell, and then look at cw pairing me with lowell. Thats all im adressing abt it all at this point, rn theres a chance I might be elim so ill be focusing on expanding and posting my thinking on first my red leans then others if theres time.

[Eiralox]

575 has good points. But on the other hand sometimes scum get defensive and flustered when pressured. Loftwing’s vote is the worst on the wagon so far, for sure, if Eira is town.

i mean i find it funny that Con Wrong is so 100% sure that scumteam is found just cos someone took issue with their read methodology XD
...

Confidently Wrong clearly didn't think the scumteam is found because someone took issue with their read methodology.

Well cw did say in a post that mala/llowell must be panicking after the... chaos,? Puke? Of eira, released by eira or sumthin. Cant remember what they said. The post with picture I think, thats where this idea comes from.

[Eiralox]

Spoiler: Post 619

575 has good points. But on the other hand sometimes scum get defensive and flustered when pressured. Loftwing’s vote is the worst on the wagon so far, for sure, if Eira is town.

i mean i find it funny that Con Wrong is so 100% sure that scumteam is found just cos someone took issue with their read methodology XD
...

Confidently Wrong clearly didn't think the scumteam is found because someone took issue with their read methodology.

Well cw did say in a post that mala/llowell must be panicking after the... chaos,? Puke? Of eira, released by eira or sumthin. Cant remember what they said. The post with picture I think, thats where this idea comes from.

How did you conclude how Confidently Wrong was sure about the scumteam from that post?

Im not reading back cw stuff but from my interaction with them they seemed pretty darned sure. Stated they solved the game on a few occasions iirc

[Eiralox]

[url=viewtopic.php?f=2&t=89627&start=624]post 624[/post]
Technically that doesn't answer my question, but that may have been my fault.

How did you conclude that Confidently Wrong thought the scumteam is found because someone took issue with their read methodology?

Simple: where the data for pairing me with llowel/mala. Cw reads given only reason for llowel scum but out of three prob 2. So I want ed to understand how eira/mala eira/lowell fits into that.any reasonable study will show little joint ng to such a pairing. Then cw went wild and started telling me how w I should play.

And cw was certain af due to my questioning of them that theyve hit scum. So basically what im saying is my vote is a confirmation bias for cw. But I have no more to say about cw.their behavior irks me. They are bossy.

[Eiralox]

EBWOP: Confidently Wrong thinks you were defending Malakittens from the fact you voted them for scumreading Malakittens.

They didnt read. I asked how they can fit mala into teams. Theres only toffee data on mala. Mala has done nothing town but by what they have done im in no way comfortable in teamforming them, theres no data. Scumread, ok. Theyre still null but that slot is zero info so acceptable. But pairing mala makes no sense data wise, and that was the gist of my pole vote.

I also openly stated I was ok with cw's scumread on lowell.
Also openly stated my willingness to vote mala. All of this inmy vote post. And still cw's main reasoning was regarding pairngs.

Thats why I find it so laughable that so many ppl are springing onto this wagon.

[Eiralox]

Keep an open mind cw. Computer back up ill start with Loft soon.

[Eiralox]

Loftwing.

first part up to page 9. no conclusion as of yet.

Spoiler:

#12 Lofwtwing Votes Fancy Pants. Non-indicative.

#15 Eira votes Loftwing

#17 Eira votes kennyk

#20 Fred votes Fancy pants.

#44 Confidently Wrong votes Fancy Pants

#49 Irrelphant votes Fancy Pants

#66 "" SQUAAAAK!

What is Crackalackin' y'all? ""

no opinion given on Fancy Pants wagon here.

#67 Toffee>Loftwing "We're elimming Confidently Wrong"

#117 "" maladauptive kittens is drunk ""

#118 Toffee Votes CSF

#119 CSF: Why?

#120 Toffee: you disliked my push

#121 CFS: "And that's scummy because..."

#122 Loftwing>CSF: "It was a way to extort a read out of CW, which reflects bad on anyone not wishing to do the same on someone else."

#124 CW>CSF Because

#137 Fancy Pants: "As opposed to the randomly vote without explaining things gambit.

@Kenny, still looking for input.
@Loftwing, same from you please."

#139 Loftwing>Fancy Pants: "RVS. There isn't really an explanation other than "Hey, I've never seen this person before! Lets vote em.""

#146 CSF>Loftwing: "This assumes I'm not making a push to get a better read on BBT."

#148 Kennyk readlist, Loftwing included under "Everyone else is just a blank card for me right now."

#155 Loftwing>CSF: "Were you making a push on BBT to get a read on them?"

#161 Loftwing>Fred: "I don't particularly have any reads."

Take into consideration here some portions of Loftwing's current eira argument.

#162 Fred>Loftwing: "Seen everyone's post? Select a few posts that are most alignment indicative for you now and get yourself a few."

#166 Loftwing>Fred: "I have read the entire game, and nothing is particularly notable.

I do think that CSF and BBT show a genuine interest in pushing the game forward, rather than a fabricated reason to go after their respective targets."

considering some earlier behavior and the pants/cats wagons this is interesting. might come back later with better analysis.

#167: Toffee: "Fred could be scum, too.

So Fred/Kenny/???"

#168: "Loftwing: Now that you mention it, kenny hasn't said anything of substance despite saying many things.

VOTE kennyk"

#169: Toffee: VOTE kennyk

#170: Fred: VOTE Kennyk

#171: Eira: "@kennyk i don't like ur post as well but i'm not voting on it yet."

#198: Loftwing: "UNVOTE: Kennyk

I like their recent posting, it feels a lot better than before."

Loftwing is screwing into me for feeling better about kenny. Here they do it themselves.

#201: Malcolm: "@ Fancy Pants - you've suspected Kenny for being a bit too on the fence/not having any notable reads, do you find it suspect at all that Loftwing is pretty much taking an identical approach, just much more openly?

I guess the fact they're happy to admit they don't have much to say at the moment isn't something self-conscious scum would do, but I disagree with the idea there isn't much to comment on at the moment...there's plenty of content, even if it's early on.

I also think the vote/unvote for Kenny could read as quite opportunistic potentially once Loftwing saw pressure on the slot was starting to die down a bit."

Hmmm. I might single this post out later and playtest it.

#203: Conbfidenty Wrong>Malcom: "it definitely wasn't the fact that he cited kenny's post that happened between then and there that you can freely read, malcom, right."

RE: Loftwing

#204: Loftwing>Maclom: "I feel like it was a resolution to my misgivings about them, which was mainly "There's a lot of nothing here" "

#205 Malcolm>Confidently Wrong:

"I'm aware of why they've changed their mind on Kenny, and I don't disagree with what they're necessarily saying since I also don't particularly suspect Kenny right now, but then one of the jobs is scum to convincingly make town believe they're on their side, and this felt like a very easy and convenient switch for Loftwing to make after a few other players had either backed off or offered up a defence of Kenny. The fact they've done this while admitting they have no other reads of note is interesting to me."

#206 Fancy Pants>Loftwing: RE: kenny

"
Which implies his recent posts aren't 'nothing' anymore, can you take a look at the posts and tell me wha you think makes them 'something'.
In other words - you had an opinion, that opinion has now changed - I'm asking you to please explain why it's changed."

#207: Loftwing>Pants:
"
This post explained why kenny felt out of place and why it felt like nothing, it was nothing but only if you were looking for reads.

Once I was satisfied, I relieved the pressure."

#219: irrelphant: "Loftwing what do you think about Confidently Wrong?"

[Eiralox]

Loftwing Part 2

Spoiler:

Also for reference I'm liking scum in:
{Loftwing/Kenny/Lowell/Malakittens}

Increasing the net would add {BBT, and maybe Eira}

i like this post from pants, these are good seeking reads.

@Loftwing, I'm having trouble following you.

Is this a fair characterization of your behaviour:
- You voted Kenny because he "didn't say anything of substance despite saying many things." 168
- You unvote once Kenny admit's that he wasn't saying anything of substance and was just making random comments about the game (207), this was enough to put your mind at ease and unvote him.

If I am incorrectly interpreting your posts, please treat me like I'm stupid and explain your thought process clearly.

@Kennyk, I'd still like you to follow up on post 190 please.

My Quarrel was that they were trying to decieve us into believing that they had something to say regarding their reads, when it was apparent they didn't. While I still may have my suspicions of Kenny, I feel like they are at a similar baseline that everyone else is at. They don't appear to have a bias or an agenda that they are attempting to push.

uhhh i'm nor sure waht's being said here. kenny's fooling us with the reads? kenny way more green for me than loftwing so what they're saying here and what kenny has said up to this point doesnt mesh for me.

Loftwing what do you think about Confidently Wrong?

Currently they have little credibility in my eyes, and I don't trust a word that comes from their fingers. I would be willing to throw a vote down on them should the current wagons cease to prevail.

I'm caught up. Kenny, Cats, malcolm fine for lynch. fancy begrudgingly town, mala town, irrelephant town, toffee town I guess.

This is basically a scumlean from someone saying they have no hard reads atm. I'll see how this comment playing out in context of CW voting me and Loftwing joining the wagon.

[Eiralox]

I'm caught up. Kenny, Cats, malcolm fine for lynch. fancy begrudgingly town, mala town, irrelephant town, toffee town I guess.

in contrast to pants' readlist on page 10 these reads dont make me feel good at all. mala town? how? Macolm fine for lynch? cats? kenny?

makes me feel way worse about llowel. after loftwing im probs gonna focus on lowell then fred.

[Eiralox]

Eiralox, why did you say your reads were all null?

ive explained this already. i seldom townread. if i don't fully trust you you're null, simple as that.

[Eiralox]

Irrelphant: Seems solvey. greenish 4 naow.

Was your read on Irrelephant null by your definition?

definitely. chances are none of ya'll are gonna be townread by me d1. me feeling better about someone isnt me assuming their alignment is a determined thing. i have townleans, ive stated who they are, u can interpret those as reads as you wish but they're merely an expression of my current inclinations considering the situation as a whole. i don't like having a mind fettered by absolutes.

[Eiralox]

And one of the largest reasons I was scumreading you is gone, just as I predicted once I noticed that you're probably using null differently and not lying about your reads.

cool.

[Eiralox]

I

did

say that if you are town I don't mind eliminating you anyway, because I find your posts too confusing, and your thought process impenetrable - so we're never going to be able to effectively work together.

yeah again i'm right "Fancy is confused so want Eira dead." what a farce. In what world do you wanna elim an active player who's forming reads and getting things going over Mala, whose done jack squat, or Loft, who's vapid air?

I'm not feeling good about your reasoning here Pants. You're nearing my scumleans.

Just catching up but I don't like this post at all. Inactive/quiet players should not be given a free ride but simply being active and posting a lot is not a valid argument for avoiding suspicion: good mafia players can win by being active and either choking the gamestate or trying to drive it in a direction beneficial to them.

tru. i coulda phrased that better. my feeling then was that theres scummier stuff than CW's case on me going on so Fancy Pants having problems with my playstyle and being willing to me at -1 mainly for that doesnt look good either way you cut it.


since starting Loftwing dive i feel way better about Fancy pants from a single post. Fred i'm liking for the mala vote and their overall interaction for me.

im continuing loftwing iso, there's scummy vibes, will expoand when can. can also see town! loftwing tho, arguments both ways. right now my thinking is i'm going to vote MalaKittens.

This shift from Loft for one simple reason: I don't like llowel being on Loft. from one post lowell doesnt look good to me at all, and here i add that they were my first gut scum read this game.

[Eiralox]

or scum feel. eh i mix this shit up. either way loweel wanting to hammer early was the first thing that ticked me off.

[Eiralox]

Fred I seldom townread ppl. I lean. I feel. Later in game once I have data and a feel for whats what im more likely to put trust in others. Im not going to adress ur posts at all. If yall wanna mob me at this point go for it. Im on mobile when power comes back ill offer deeper insight.on loftwing. As a start ; )

Didn't mind the start of this post, I get not TR'ing players too strongly early on, I'm often the same, but the bit about not addressing Fredrick's posts is incredibly scummy. It's the height of scumminess to the point where it just doubly makes me doubt Eiralox actually being scum, because I'm not sure scum approach the game in a way like this.

i was tired bandying words about with people to little effect, i think ive since adressed fred's points, you can ascertain what they think about my response.

[Eiralox]

Loftwing part 3

Spoiler:

I'll go first then

FancyPants
BBT, Frederick, Malcolm
Shoshin, Malakittens, Lowell, Eiralox
Confidently Wrong, Cat Scratch Fever --- null
Loftwing
kenny

Hmmm I have too many townreads probably

Loftwing/Kunny scumleans by irrel.

I'm caught up. Kenny, Cats, malcolm fine for lynch. fancy begrudgingly town, mala town, irrelephant town, toffee town I guess.

Do you, uh, have any actual reasons for your thoughts?

Offhand, Cats' reaction to getting votes gives me "waah i'm caught for bullshit reasons this is so unfair" vibes. Kenny seems a little too polished with his unfrozen-caveman "i'm a newbie" gimmick. Malcolm seems overly careful and like he's hiding.

fancy gave off "town captain" scum vibes, but now I think maybe that's just who he is--that he hasn't backed off from his pedantry and wordiness is probably a good sign. mala I can't remember, just a vibe. Irrelephant mostly asking good questions, toffee I forget why but in ISO I have town read.

mala gets town read for a vibe. malcolm at least substantiates a reason for such a hunch.

fred and shosh lean scum, CW lean town, and no opinion on the others

here loftwing is included under 'no opinion'

OK.

Still down to lynch Kenny, I could probably be convinced to switch to Loft, we have a week left but my two main suspects basically refuse to make any reads so I'm basically down to just hang them now. I might do a reread and some meta diving when I'm more motivated.

hmmm less green. kenny formed reads, as did loft in a limited way (doesnt trust CW). can be playstyle thing. i get it more from loft than kenny tbh.

[Eiralox]

Spoiler:

LW 4

---

Frederick seems town

Kenny's first post was bad, but the rest of his interactions with FancyPants feels TvT. In particular, I feel like pushing FancyPants, who I think several people have said are town, feels like going against the grain in a way that I don't think new scum would do.

Nothing Loftwing has written seems that difficult to fake but he pings me as genuine town anyway

Shoshin is probably town (before you ask, yes this is meta)

Loftwing townread By Cat

You don't have to be like "this person is DEFINITELY SCUM" to have helpful reads. You can just compare, say, kenny and fancypants, who are voting each other, and pick a side. Voila, you've got a townread. You can figure out who's done the least that's towny to you. Voila, you've got a scumread. Nothing so far??

Can't decide if town being stubborn or scum trying to seem towny by audacity

161
Correct link, I messed up something with the link above.

I've remained unimpressed with what I've seen so far. Off the top of my head, I don't have any particularly strong reads on anyone, and I'd have to re-read the game again for analysis.

Wild that you can read this very thread and walk away without reads

This post explained why kenny felt out of place and why it felt like nothing, it was nothing but only if you were looking for reads.

Once I was satisfied, I relieved the pressure.

How did Kenny's explanation satisfy your concern about a lack of substance in his posts?

It explained why there was nothing of substance in terms of reads, because there was nothing in terms of reads. In terms of general thoughts, there is substance in their earlier posts.

ok a bit circular and nothin-burger here? might be town saying they like poants and kenny earlier more than now.

loftwing/kenny/lowell feels way too easy, but I would also be shocked if it had 0 mafia in it

loft is town

lets sort by post count

there is substance in their earlier posts.

please do point out the substance, I keep stirring my soup trying to find even a single noodle stuck at the bottom of the bowl but my spoon keeps coming up with just broth

How... did I quote all of those posts?

@CW, I know you don't like explaining usually but I'm trying to figure the game, would you do me a favour and explain why you think Loft is town?

Anyway, a reads list so far.



Loftwing - Not sure I like the "I don't have reads" approach. Could quite easily be lazy scum trying to coast by. Especially given the sudden vote and unvote on Kenny. Felt opportunistic, as if they were aware coasting by wasn't going to work.

So here are my thoughts about the game so far.

There is Eiralox who voted and changed votes twice very early in the game.

I made a (in my eyes) fun comment about this. I know it is RVS, so those vote changes are very likely a thing of trying to beating around the bush in hope of someone reacting to being voted.

FancyPants tries to push me for this comment. This feels wierd. But maybe it is because they are torn pants (thanks Irrelephant for that pun).

The most fascinating thing about Irrelephant is, that Shoshin is probably town. Not that I think Shoshin is scum, but I don't see how he should have gained the towncred.

ConfidentlyWrongs selfvote in the early RVS is NAI for me. As mentioned by someone else earlier (too lazy to look it up again) this seems to be a humoristic approach (haha).

BlueBloodedToffee pushing CW for the selfvote and then, when the waggon didn't get on track too well, hopping on the CSF waggon seems fishy.

I don't see why CSF deserves the waggon that's now going on.

Everyone else is just a blank card for me right now.

This is a window into what Kenny was thinking, and it shows that they wish to contribute to the gamestate even if they have little to no reads. It highlights what they consider to be important events up to this point, and it would be wise to study it in depth to catch a glimpse of Kenny's pov

hmmm UNVOTE: Loftwing for now.

i'll continue analysis in my own time.


VOTE: Lowell you have been mentioned way too much over these past few pages not to be active at this time.

[Eiralox]

that actually counts for toffee and mala as well. shosh has been prodded. i havent studied toffee yet tbh, hard to form a feel for them so far.

[Eiralox]

@KittyTacky my vote is on lowell not loftwing.

[Eiralox]

@loftwing your play right now is really making me consider switching the vote back. Im not done studying ur dynamic so I got no hard reason for it but by feels alone youre not seeming groovy. If explained how I form townreads so if ur still voting me only on that factor, well it looks bad.

[Eiralox]

@lowell u've surfaced and I can frame you as low effort town, but what you have said so far has given me no reason to shift my vote. Get engaged.

My view of CW is simple: earlier they said lets class by votecount and I think thats partly what theyve been doing with the exception of shoshin. They still seem certain theyve pretty much solved this. Toffee and lowell I havent felt too hot about this entire game so im giving cw the benefit of the doubt at this point regarding that pairing. Mala greeen... no. Dont see that latest input does that, malcolm saying they are posstown tho stayed my vote from that slot.

[Eiralox]

Cw seems to like mala input enough to switch to eira/llowel/toffee but mala is townreading toffee.

Summary of loftwing these past few pages: they basically state theyre not gonna hunt scum and only do effort to darken folk who already git wagons. They only focus on eira, pushing fred, asking why the shift of eira? Nothing looks good here.

Kenyy vote on me.... 50/50 on that. Im feeling sum ppl are seeing cw as a townleader or whatever for sum absurd reason(and find them logical while I am not xD)

Pants im feeling good for the latest post. Seems level and open headed.

[Eiralox]

VOTE: Loftwing

welp at least now vc is accu. I see no solving from loftwing. I see no relish for the hunt. The fact that kenny and loft are now voting together should be noted.

Dont expect much more from me today.

[Eiralox]

Kenny

-Vote Mala

-Joke after Eira vote, can be construed as light shade.

-------
#148

-Mentions Eira RVs. Mentions Fancy push for jokey comment(after saying they understand nature of RVS)

-Questions Irell greening shoshin

-Shade on Toffee for pushing CW self-vote then jumping onto CSF

-CSF doesnt deserve wagon

----------

-Vote FancyPants for sus, doesn't say much of note.

-pushes Shoshin for townreading them, asks why shoshin is pushing for Malcolm vote.

-#228 explanation why fancy posh on them feels weird. i agree, fancy doesnt have much of a reason here, but it's kenny lengthy exposition on a defense that can be kept very short and basic that i note. not indicative.

-Asks for Toffee for elaboration on scumreading them.

-Questions Toffee';s kenny scumread and sudden Llowell switch.

-----------
#338 readlist

Toffee: null
Lowell: Scumlean
Loftwing: Scumlean
CW: townlean(gut)
Malcolm: townlean
Shoshin: scumlean for townreads
Fred: nothing bad to say, few solid posts, townlean
Cat: town
Mala: null, open to policy elim
Fancy: Scumlean
Irrel: townlean
Eira:null

---------------------

-seems to feel more green on pants

#669: Entrance, will do small posts before comment on Eira/cw

#670: asks cw to expand reads, asks if kenny/bbt still null, and why cw isn't paring kenny with lowell?

#675: sees my point of view but takes offense with one of my comments, eira downgraded.

#676: Asks BBT if they want a wagon of their own.

#677: Asks why CSF is shifting off Eira

#687: Sees Eira as the better option over policy elim(i'm assuming mala here). Didn't want to vote for me earlier cos didn't want to have fast elim, but now that fred has shifted to mala kenny is ok voting Eira.

Taking this in concert with #675 makes me feel worse about the kenny vote. 675 is emphatic and i appreciate that, but ultimately takes offense with me asking Pants why they want to put me at -1. Kenny said in Eira vote they didnt want a fast elim so them using this single comment of mine as their main point of offense doesn't read good to me. I can see one possible scumteam in kenny iso. wont expand on that atm.

They have voted Mala/Pants/Eira thus far. Mala rvs, Pants basically for pant's analysis of early kenny statement and Eira for... i'm not going to put words in ppls mouths. kenny has to expand their vote on me in their own time.

[Eiralox]

aand another thing: in #338 kenny has Lowell, Loftwing, Shoshin and Fancy as scumleans. Mala null but ok with policy elim.

Between #338 and #687 Kennyk has only publicly felt better about Pants.

So I want to know: what changed? #687 Kenny only talks about Eira and policy vote, which I assume means MalaKittens.

And kenny questions CatScratchFever for switching off Eira and onto Lowell.

So yeah maybe reads changed, they do, sure, but I wanna know what happened on the scumleans on Lowell, Shoshin and Loftwing?

Why does Kennyk only seems to be considering Eira and I'm assuming Mala in #687?

there are wagons on both loftwing and llowel at this point. Do kenny still scumlean on them? Because they sure don't seem to be considering those two wagons as viable despite earlier scumleaning both.

[Eiralox]

But no one is saying that is scummy on its own.

That's all I've really seen so far

i'm liking this

[Eiralox]

But no one is saying that is scummy on its own.

That's all I've really seen so far

i'm liking this

Really?

I mean BBT says like 2 posts later that he hasn't read the 6 pages of back and forth between you and CW.

What is there to like about it.

the fact that the same piss-poor argument was being used by mutliple people(and still used by loftwing) and that toffee is pointing this out to cw, who is so stuck in their tunnel boner on me that things like that seems to pass them by. i can feel good about player's posts stop sniping me.

[Eiralox]

I understand CW completely when he says Eira's reads are post hoc justified.

Eira decides someone is scum and then "finds" reasons for them to be scummy or townie based on reasoning which often makes no sense.

The only question is - Is Eira making these "after the fact reads" because:
- They are scum and know all the alignments but without any of the scum hunting or
- They are totally emotionally driven and anyone on their side is good, and anyone against them is bad, which they then justify to themselves in some convoluted way.

yeah i don't know what you're saying here. i stated i was inactive and why. if that doesnt do for you regarding...whatever bullshit theory cw is currently on well thats a you problem. i'll expand on reads if and when i please, i'm not afd0-hoccing antyhing i just now have time to be invested in this game. didn't have that before. i'm not totally emotionally driven, and what youre saying here about good and bad doesnt ad up.

you don't know me, dont assume you do.

and anyone against me bad? c'mon pants. now youre lying. cats and ireel i was ok with. fred i enjoyed interacting with. kenny and loft have some summy stuff regarding them. cw i cant stand at all, they are bossy, i pushed back against that.

and you i'm feeling good about even tho i absolutely struggle communicating with you and don't agree with your reasoning(like in above post, i'm not liking your analysis of me at all, u really think i play wholly emotionally? anyway, i don;t like talking to u but that doesnt mean imma call scum on u.)

OK I'll stop interacting with you for now.

no problem.

[Eiralox]

This is a reply to Eira's double post. I won't quote the other, as it makes me wonder, why I am the one who was accused off a too lengthy post.

I said you're long pants post in non-indicative. I merely noted it for posterity.

This might sound a bit harsh, but I sometimes have the feeling, Eira is deliberately trying to misread things. There were some occasions in his infight with CW, which led me to this conclusion. And now there is this double post.

i'm deliberately trying 2 find scum

What on earth makes you think, I only have one single comment of you as my main point for voting you?

that's what i got from a careful reading.

You obviously read post 675 as you named it. There are at least three arguments in that post of why I think you are at least worthy of a scumlean.

again i only saw 1, unless ur counting going with cw as an argument.

On the other hand I never said, I changed my reads on Lowell, Loftwing an Shoshin, because at the point of my vote, they still all were in the same scumlean range (Shoshin was upgraded by now, if you wanna know it).

never said u did change ur reads. said that at time of voting me u only seemed to be considering mala as an alternative. and the fact that ur asking CSF why they switch of me to lowell(your scumlean) ran all kinda warning bells 2 me. Loftwing has done this exact same thing with fred, and cw with a few others.

And if you have more than one player on your list, at one point you must decide, where to place your vote. You were the most likely scum for me at that time. Combined with the fact, that there really was no wagon on Shoshin and Lowell at that time and the wagon on Loftwing was small, I decided it was best to go with the most scummiest on my personal readlist who incidentally had the highest chance of going through. But just because I didn't mention them, doesn't mean I didn't find them viable.

hmmmmmm. the wagon on loftwing wasn't small. was biggest one besides mine at time of your vote and prior to me testing cw.



-------------


well ok imma just go on and say it: poss scum team i'm seeing rn is loftwing/kenny/confidently wrong. there are patterns, not something i'm betting the farm on rn but bleh might as well share.

i have no particular case against kenny and cw as of now, cw doesnt offer me much as of yet tbh and most prob. town among those three for now.


kennny......there's one thing i'll say about it. this might just be me being whoopy but kenny's vote on eira, their progression to that point... idk it feels as if a scum chat is involved with that. kenny comes in and mentions lowell before adressing my posts calling 'em for not having a say on lowell wagon at time of voting for me. that's very convenient in my eyes, adding the fact that Kenny didn't seem happy with CSF voting lowell above me. so i'm feeling kenny is wary forming a hard opinion on loftwing atm? and very wary of jumping on that wagon.

Agree with irrelphant about Loftwing being a good flip atm, chances are I won't be changing my vote today.

[Eiralox]

@eira, loft/kenny/CW would be a hilariously clumsy scumteam so I doubt it. But loft with one of those two seems possible, with the third person being the duped town player along for the ride.

yeah it would be way too easy an solve. it's just an out there thing for me with patterns supporting it atm. as i said, not a pairing imma put money on today. i've made the mistake of calling scumteams out on D1 before and being way wrong. and kenny's latest input has slightly raised them in my estimation.

[Eiralox]

@kenny thanks. i'm still saying u only brought one relevant argument there before your vote, the other seems more analysis to me. but i'm not gonna split hairs about this atm, don't see that it's all that important a matter.

Ok thanks for expanding on CSF thing. I like your response here.

Was my wagon bigger than Loftwing's when u voted tho? a few people unvoted me before u voted, im not going to to backread now(im done with this 4 the day) but in my memory at the time u voted Loftwing wagon was either equal or bigger than eira wagon.

(screw it imma check)

Ok

#687 kenny votes

Here's the VC for the moment just before kenny voted Eira:

Eiralox (3): Confidently Wrong, Irrelephant11, Loftwing
Loftwing (3): FancyPants, Lowell, MalcolmTucker,
kennyk (1): BlueBloodedToffee
MalcolmTucker (1): Shoshin
BlueBloodedTofee (1): Malakittens
FancyPants (1): kennyk
Malakittens (1): Fredrick A. Campbell
Lowell (2): Eiralox, Cat Scratch fever

Forth: I try it in other words: If your number one suspect for scum has the longest wagon and your number two suspect the second longest, where would you vote?

so yeah at this point I have to blatantly state that both my and Loftwing's wagons were of equal length.

[Eiralox]

UNVOTE: Loftwing

Loftwing has offered us nothing. they've been.... openly non-committal. Seeing as it's at -1 im unvoting to give Loft time, some1 might go on and hammer anyway at this point and i don't see the value in that. at least.... try.



but in a twisted way loftwing can still flip town so idk..... will i vote there again? lowell wagon... no. fred? i can totally see scum fred, but the fact that they thoroughly asked me to share my viewpoint then shifted to mala is.... something which makes me wary of mobbing fred 2day.

So loftwing idk i mean i guess my vote can shift back to u at this point, i'm not having options atm. but i wann at least give you time... if u do nothing impressive in the interim well meh.

[Eiralox]

Like pulling teeth around here. Let’s all call a guy useless and scummy and do nothing.

loftwing is at -1 and hasnt said anyhting yet. i want to hear from them. i unvote cos i dont want a hammer without at least a response. not liking your take here llowel.

[Eiralox]

i think lowell is saying at this point why not stick with my guns, it's prob gonna be loftwing elim so why dont we get this over with? that's the tone im getting at least, dont quote me on it. aaaand imma go smoke and maybe be back in.... 3-5 hrs for a check-in.

[Eiralox]

Malcolm dont get me wrong I can still totally see scum loftwing. Just might be me bein loony but you feel way to certain about alignments in above post. Ur still a townlean for me, just need to voice my instincts I guess.

[Eiralox]

Hmmm I mean the toffee sus of malcolm and fred and the general interaction after that... fred didnt really respond, came in expressing intent to hammer.. Malcolm sorta did but by qouting a bbt post meant for fred. Lowell calls toffee scum. Im feeling better bt both toffe and lowell so no comment on that yet.Theres nothing distinct I can pinpoint but im storing these few pages in my lookit later bin.

[Eiralox]

Is there anyone openly opposing the Loftwing wagon except for myself? Lack of counter wagon should also be a concern if true.

i think cw is the other one against it from what ive seen.

[Eiralox]

Cats... yeah something pinged me in malcolm's post. not enough to call red but i had to note it.

............................


Toffeee..... no. I said earlier i can see scum fred, but theres no way im voting fred over loftwing today. i havent really studied fred's launch against me, i think the one thing that stood out is they saying i got 12 in scumpile, later 12 in null pile. but we hashed it out and they unvoted so on that alone im not voting in that direction. considering loftwing's...... idk what to call it, plus loftwing's case on me(cw and fred[and 2 way lesser extent kenny] did way more trouble in explainin their votes.... loftwing sticks with the same single..... sploofy reason and even at -1 didnt go after me on any other point in any way... from what I saw? so no, loft over lloyd and fred for me. lloyd.... idk i just got a gut feel they might be uninterested town, while that gut feel isnt so strong in me RE: loftwing.

[Eiralox]

lloyd>llowel

[Eiralox]

@Loftwing imma prob go sleep in bout 2-4 hrs. at that point ill consider whether imma put you at -1 or not.

[Eiralox]

Summary:

Kenny: calls eira poss scum for 'foiling' freds plan of hammer.theres more than 12 hrs left here. Kenny pretty sure that eira/loft scum but doesnt want to switch to loft to reinforces freds intent to hammer? My earlier statement that kenny is very wary of joining loft wagon gains even more weight in my mind now. I almostvoted kenny here but can I justify that vote over loftwing? Idk. Eh. If loft flips red this post doesnt look good for kenny.

Cw: my thinking still is that they form reads in a pretty blaise manner. Even loftwing wants to know why theyre town.thats all imma say on that.


'...........

I mean I guess its loft? I might not vote there tbh. If loft flips red, im looking at kenny, cw, toffee, in that order. If loft flips green, i'll start by looking at llowel, fred and malcolm.

[Eiralox]

And if loft flips green ill still look at cw and toffee, scum can manufacture pre_flip townreads to look good.

[Eiralox]

*sigh*

I mean.... my gutfeel is lowell is town. In the end? Either fred or kenny? Shoshin/mala feel green. At this point I feel good abt toffee and toffee feels good about lowell so meh I guess ill VOTE: Fredrick


Do I feel good abt that vote? No. Do I see the need for wagons beside mine and lowells if yall rightly decide to give loft the benefit of the doubt? Yes.


Lowell felt very scummy 2 me at start but now im thinking thats ther abrasive nature, from feels alone I cant vote there. Fred gave me some slack, then shifted to mala to lowell to loft. But freds natures is wavey as toffee rightly notes so idk.... right now I trust toffees judgement way more than cw's.


Meh. Meow. Maaaah.

[Eiralox]

And if it turns out that look loftwing claim is true trues this wil be my main list of folk that imma scrutinize: Fred, FancyPants, Kenny, Lowell, Malcolm, CW, Irrelephant, Toffee.

[Eiralox]

I am a 1-shot neighborizor,

and a secret second role which I will gladly take to the grave.

It's not a particularly useful power so it's not a huge loss if he dies, but perhaps it's pointless to take a shot at someone we can probably confirm.

[Eiralox]

so ur not unvoting? loft claimed a second role. im not gonna speculate whether that's true or what it is but FancyPants in their uncertainty at least unvoted. so i mean it's either shift off loft or have no exe. if ya'll power through and flip loft.... sure, loft can flip scum. but that's not a gamble im at all willing to take after a claim.

[Eiralox]

freds looks fishy. i also agree loft should do a full claim now, but there are certain scenarios and roles where id likely also be recalcitrant to do a full claim. whether that comes or not, im not voting on a claim d1. it can be verified or disproved. either fred or no exe for at me this point.

i'm out.

[Eiralox]

actually im starting to lean scum on FAncyPants as well. their willingness to revote loftwing:

fancypants townreads confidently wrong but cw is townreading loftwing but fancypants seems still ok with loftwing elim after claim?

this all raises confidently wrong in my estimation, i'm holding open the possibility that cw is town and that at least some of the scum team is walkin in their shadow.

[Eiralox]

the only hard counter to this is fancypants unvote, depending on loftwing alignment. would scum fancy have unvoted? the other question is, fancy expressed intent to vote eira/lowell. now they stated they might vote loftwing anyway after i voted fred. so idk, i guess im just noting this stuff here. and now im out for real, peace.

[Eiralox]

noted, thank you. there's still a few things that give me scummy vibes from recent you, past you i felt green on. same with fred, i've been getting scum vibes lately. no elim cos i got no good reasons for other folk. i can always add u to that list but as i said my vote stays on fred.

not starting a wagon on you any time time soon tho so, peace x2

[Eiralox]

Wagons were loft eira llowel. You put loft at -1. Fred expressed intent to hammer. I unvote loft. Loft claims one shot neigbourizer and secret role. Loft votes lowell. I vote fred with toffe. Lowell votes fred. Cw votes eira then lowell. Pants votes lowell. Cw votes fred. I think that its shoshin. Im in moobile so wont do effort to backread n list who sus who n all that frivolry

[Eiralox]

VOTE: Kennyk with a wand of ennui

[Eiralox]

the whispers.... the scrittering scratching at my tearing and rending all semblances of and as i might try but no the whispers the whispers yes follow the whispers

[Eiralox]

[Eiralox]

sure, I'm doing that. but you're also just itt and I want votes on kenny. Not sure what danger there is for you in being vote #2

[Eiralox]

>.<

[Eiralox]

lol

[Eiralox]

lol

A lot less verbose than said towngame you referenced to defend yourself eh?

my post, for which i was warned, and therefore will not reference again in this game, boiled down to: i hate meta. i do. i always will. you need a better argument for scum eira at this point.

Here are the facts Confidently Wrong:

You were scumreading lowell, eira, irrel and toffee at various points. You hinted at Fred being PR. You voted Fred with the latter grouping, including Malakittens who you also scumread who expressed willingness to hammer. You most vehemently townread Loftwing out of all of us.

UNVOTE: Kenny

[Eiralox]

yeah im not jumping in the mud with you. if u just now noticed my eira habit u havent been reading. if u get me voted off today ill shave my hair off.

VOTE: Confidently Wrong for gnats 'n giggles. I mean kenny's wariness of voting loft is my number one case there right now, but.... i'm wrong a lot so no discounting other pairings... on the off chance that conf. wr. is town.... then i don't know who third is but i'm pretty sure second is kenny.

Not gonna hear much more from me until i get the itch to actually start building cases.... i did write a fair bit bout kenny D1 so guess that's where i'll start expanding when i can be so arsed.

Good luck out there ya'll and have fun -.-

[Eiralox]

i mean it, i'll really shave my hair off. i'm interested in how you'll pull this one off, i'll give you some time even >.<

[Eiralox]

UNVOTE: Confidently Wrong

i mean that's it from me for a long while.

[Eiralox]

>.<

[Eiralox]

if it's gamma, it's not gamma/mala? too easy, but meh. gamma/cw makes more sense 2 me. buuuuut i mean can still be anyone else, ive felt town on shoshin d1 but N1 after hammer i was considering shosh/cw.... look at early stuff, and who cw names and does not name scum. but i'm not going to vote anywhere just yet, Fancy has cast the glove and now the sorting begins.

i'm green on Fancy after Fred vote, i have no reason not to fully trust this claim.

[Eiralox]

quick shosh iso

v irrel
v malc
fancy sms t
malcolm super scummy
kenny is town, more votes malcom
asks loftwing to expand on being satisfied with kenny
almost sort attacks loftwing for kenny stuff, asks why these thoughts didnt matter before..........can be shade on kenny here, can be scum manufac interaction.
Asks if irrel is around'
votes mala
CW/Malcolm/Mala is plausible team.
Eira is probably my top townread, Mala.

Town to scum:

Eira
Fancy
Kenny
Malcolm
Cat
CW
Irrel
BBT
Fred
Mala
Lowell
Loftwing

Loft's jump on & off kenny (and incoherent explanation) is scum.

Why is Eira scum?

Vote CW

Shadow on fred

Vote Loftwing

"It would be nice if we had two competing wagons here."

"And we're deciding between Loft and Fred?"

I'm just gonna sheep Irrel today.

"If I'm in limlo with Irrel, I'd vote him immediately without second thought."

Vote Fred

------------------------------


I mean i still trust fancy's claim at this point, which makes Shoshin's attitude toward loft strange to me. is it possible that, if gamma is scum, the other scum partner also rode on the loftwing wagon day one? maybe we should broaden our scope, depending on gamma flip.... or it could just be from shosh.

the obvious teamup imma mention here is kenny/gamma emerald. see above... it's possible kenny and shoshin shaded the collectively-shaded loftwing day one, a risky game considering loft was up for hammer twice. so maybe loft's plan to claim came only after i gave them a chance? idk. but that's one team im comfortable voting towards, start d2 id did choose to vote kenny after all.

i have less obvious shoshin pair-ups but they're more cooky so imma spare myself the energy for now.

[Eiralox]

oh hey eira opened up an ISO and realized that things are not just level 0 "X defended Y so they scum"

i mean you don't get me at all XD

aaaaaany way.....

Here's a list of people not currently voting: Not Voting (3): kennyk, Gamma Emerald, Eiralox

[Eiralox]

If shoshin is scum i aint seeeing mala/shosh as much as mala/ken and three other lesser pairings. i'm ok with voting either ken or gamma as prev. stated, i'm not onboard a mala wagon.

[Eiralox]

Edit: mala/gamma as much as gamma/ken

[Eiralox]

VOTE: Gamma Emerald

irrell you 100% mirror me at this point. amz i oliphant now? let's see how many more we can sway to our kenny cult. if scum! fancy is willing to claim this D2.... then things must be desperate? i'm not seeing that, i feel good on fancy after the freddening, fancy mostly townread, so even if fancy partner under duress i see no reason for so bold a move, esp. with vig about.

so yeah for now 100% trust in fancy.

the elephant in the room at this point is irrel/gamma, i have'nt studied it so rn i wont endorse it, but its in my mind.


imma listen to the crows

[Eiralox]

egh kenny/mala have been silent, agree that gamma... put in a sticky situation if scum after both shoshin and anthrophage-monkey have left the slot after hammering on town... so eh silence is to be expected at this point.

right now i'm open to either kenny/cw as partner, my feel of mala is... sure they can be the partner but my bet, and this might be way wrong, is that Malakittens is a vannila townie.
Toffee comes in as a possibility but not that high atm.

[Eiralox]

Scratched into the slate wall of the dungeon tunnel, it reads thus:


-)--)----(----

kennyk (1): Irrelephant11

Gamma Emerald (5): FancyPants, BlueBloodedToffee, MalaKittens, Eiralox, Lowell

Confidently Wrong (1): MalcolmTucker

Lowell (1): Confidently Wrong

Not Voting (2): kennyk, Gamma Emerald


----)----(----)


six are needed for a hammer to fall

[Eiralox]

yeah i mean i dont want this awkward silence to drag on so hammer away and let fate roll its bones

[Eiralox]

i mean....

kennyk, u there at all?

i'm not passing comment on this until ive heard from folk

[Eiralox]

Here's something fun, I'm here and going to soft an even night or novice investigative right now. I am going to be on you Lowell. You wonder why I talked about investigatives so much this game and was trying to pretend like i was setup speccing which one? Well now you see.

Do what you will with that info. I know you won't kill me regardless because a tracker exists and you dont know their gate and you think you can mislim me.

I play PR as if I'm a VT and need to defend myself on the basis of dayplay. Because it is shitty play to crutch a roleclaim - in all cases. I knew the only way I died was if I ended up exactly correct on the scumteam.

That being said, i bluffed the gunsmith soft to draw a kill. I probably drew a rolecop night 1.

Lowell has voted for both Loftwing and Gamma at this point, cw has not. If cw is town... well this continued lowell tunnel still makes me open to voting either cw or kenny, as earlier stated. I want to hear from kenny, if theres no response from kenny in 48 hrs i'll vote kenny just cos, depending.

[Eiralox]

lowell is conf. town to me at this point, it'll take a lot to convince me otherwise.

VOTE: Confidently Wrong

I mean kenny is awol so where's the fun in voting there?

And yes I'm considering Loftwing being a planned bus. If so, it's either kenny or irrelphant to me. The glorious government's still shedding it's load all over the lesser publus so i'll get to studying shite 't i wanna 'n posting thoughts whenever.

right now it can be as simple as kenny has given up as scum, or as simple as.... kenny is town. who knows? ask the wind it weil tell us only of the bones of trees and the silence of swallows

[Eiralox]

cos i feel that way

[Eiralox]

Ugh some1just vote cw or kenny or irrell or whatever soz we can end this ego conference and hopefully hit scum or not have vig hit vt after I hinted at them being vt. I mean........ just end it tbh.

[Eiralox]

Just sort cw then kenny, or vice versa. Idc about order at this point. I mean whats the likelyhood that scum isnt in those two?

[Eiralox]

I mean whatever kenny has said nithing since start d2 cw has been on auto-repeat since d1. Im just not gonna be invested in this game till we flip either of them, I have nothing to say till then.

[Eiralox]

Yeah ive heard enough unless kenny wanna make a magic appearance

[Eiralox]

Ugh toffee u gonna vote here?

What I said bout kenny d1 and d2 still stands. Theyre recalcitrance to vote loft. The fact that they parked their vote on eira d1 and didnt vote d2. Many other things. If cw is scum what are the chances that they rolecopped lowell? Other cw reads have changed but lowell has remained the one constant. Cw townread loft, only voice against gamma elim, votes lowell rather than gamma. Now towreads kenny after being onboard that wagon D2.

Sort these slots. Im where I was last time.

[Eiralox]

i voted u irrel voted kenny. thats it iirc.

[Eiralox]

uno

Spoiler:

VOTE: confidently wrong
This is mafia, I am very sure of it.

VOTE: fancy pants

Fancy seems town.

Based on?

I believe it, but I have my sights sent on a pair of pants

actually maybe you are correct

VOTE: CSF

boomers annoyingly know what theyre talking about sometimes

i would know, i play with pooky

VOTE: Fredrick

I do not play with secrets

VOTE: Mala

I want pressure on this slot so i can start solving the game from slots i feel Comfortable solving fast

I'm not even sure it's that you're playing "weirdly" though, it's just that you're incredibly willing to hand out a free townread early on without much of a reason for doing so. I understand meta will often come into games and that's fine, but your posts could easily read as an opportunistic attempt to cosy up to Shoshin and get on her side early on if she's town and you're not.

I will probably explain better at a later date.

Your townblock, for what it's worth, gives me a similar fear...we're not that long into the game, I'm wary to put too much faith and trust in anyone at this stage.

This is fair. Does it make you think I'm scum trying to prop up a partner? Or just town who's likely to be wrong? Because, if the latter, it's only dangerous if you think one of my three townreads is scum. Let me know if you think so at any point.
Realistically I don't think we'll manage a consensus 5-6 person townblock with 0 scum. But I do think we can make one with, at most, 1 scum. And that's a pretty valuable potential town tool.

Like I get your paranoia but do you disagree with the concept of a townblock or just that i've picked three names already?

I don't disagree with the idea of a townblock in general, I'm just not too keen on ruling out certain players as mafia early on in D1. I don't particularly scum-read anyone you've put in there so far but we're only a couple of days into the game, ideally nobody should be completely free from pressure.

My gut-feeling right now is one of you/Shoshin could be mafia. Shoshin's push on me was weak and opportunistic, but if they're town and you know they're wrong could be a useful pocket for you, as I've stated. I'm liking your engagement a lot more this page though.

They're both town

Csf locktown

Still gonna tunnel mala until she towntells

loft is town

lets sort by post count

VOTE: kenny
Yolo

VOTE: lowell

Loftwing is town, unvote them and vote scumclaimed lowell

@CW, This is the part where I ask you why Loftwing is town - you ignore me and I don't change my mind.

The claimed mafia lowell spewed them town

@CW, This is the part where I ask you why Loftwing is town - you ignore me and I don't change my mind.

The claimed mafia lowell spewed them town

remind me the scumcase for lowell?

The interaction regarding malcom was essentially outting

Whats funny was that i changed my read on fancy bc of lowell so cheers thanks for the free town

Mala/Lowell/eiralox is a team I'd lock in rn gth

Its probably wrong but i am confident of at least 2

Well I'm confident enough in lowell that I'd veto anyone i believe is spewed town off him, and i even actively townread loft off meta and malcom as well. Kenny i refuse to comment on because he did fool me recently in a somewhat embarassing way.

I think Lowells reaction to a wagon starting on him however should be indicative enough that he isn't solving the game and is self pressing in a scummy way

VOTE: Eiralox

Have it your way. I offered the easy way, let's do the hard way.

VOTE: Loftwing

Subject to change but time to cast a vote somewhere. Not confident their opportunistic jumping around from wagon to wagon is townie. The vote on Mala felt particularly opportunistic as I said earlier on.

I think fundamentally the reasons you are presenting for reading people is flawed and not consistent(results wise) in any way.

So I envision it shall be difficult to convince you similarly to the last time we played together.


Jumping around wagon to wagon is not a scum behavior.

personally i think the game is solved fmpov

with [Lowell/Eira/Mala] as the most likely team

and then as bonus PoE: [BBT/kennyk]

Every other player I feel a confident enough reason to townread them.

kennyk is also never paired with Lowell

I hope that satiates any concerns you have that my read is faulty based on reasoning you think could apply to you. I could go for a townblock including myself, Irrelephant, you(loftwing), CSF, Fredrick, and Fancy Pants

honorary members Shoshin and Malcom

Where in the world are Lowell and Mala

also i fully think shoshin is town and never eliminate and the only reason their reads are so bonkers is because theyre both misclearing the most obvious scum and misreading an easily findable townie for what I believe are incorrect reasons to label someone as mafia.

shoshin please cite a single thought from Eira you thought was towny. Because I guarantee you binned them town for posting a lot and being pushed by someone you are currently confbiasing into a scumteam for defending your top scumread.

VOTE: Confidently Wrong

Ok I'm still going to read you town and carry anyways

If you want to be obtuse, I think you are town because your thoughts are obviously independent and I can trace how you reached conclusions.

I disagree with your conclusions, and think the process is wrong. But its a towny process.

If you want to play with your ego and get mad and vote me for disagreeing with you go ahead, but don't be surprised when it doesn't help win the game for town.

for visibility

I am at a point where I can call every one of these players town with confidence, if I am wrong about *any* of them it is at worst only 1 in my humble opinion.

Loftwing
MalcolmTucker
Shoshin
Fredrick A Campbell
Cat Scratch Fever
FancyPants
Irrelephant11

And then to add on to that, I would say Mala after her recent postings and Kenny, are both also townreads for me although I am not confident enough to lock them in. Mala is closer to townlocking than Kenny here in this case.

This leaves us with a trio of BBT/Lowell/Eiralox

No I think Shoshin or MalcomT is not that useful right now and I think they are town

CW could be scum trying to power a miselim through. I think loftwing is a pretty good flip

We should consider making a flip happen sooner rather than later because this weekend is a holiday weekend for everyone in the US and we have about 2.5 days left in this game day, during which the American players might barely post (e.g. me, I'll be hanging with family)

What signs do you see me being scum?

And why is Loftwing a good flip? Over Eira even?

Shoshin i will be extremely dissapointed if you help town lose this game because you think your solutions are the only correct ones.

Loftwing i get the vibes thing on Fancy but im pretty sure they are town
I know you're trying your best to help people find you and I'm sorry there are stubborn townies this game being unfair to thay and intentionally ignoring it.

It's hard to vote off Loftwing based on your input because your reasoning for him being Town is meta related, and when I did my dive (admittedly before I knew he was an alt) I didn't find the same.

As for your case on Eira I think I understand your jist but what I don't see is why "Eira is just wrong and bad at cases." is a worse explanation. Additionally it's partially supported by your surety of everyone else's alignment (you could only know Eira is making reads based on knowing everyone's alignment if you ALSO know everyone's alignment, I hope that makes sense).
I understand you could just be that sure of yourself, or at least pretending to be but it's kinda weird and difficult to just sheep.

I'm willing to compromise on Lowell as a "let's avoid loftwing vs eira" thing.

I'm not feeling Loftwing *at all* and I'm seeing their towngame here.

VOTE: Lowell

also BBT's last post being actually towny making me feel better about untownlocking irrelephant in my reads... because now I got a wild potential world of Irrelephant/Eira/Lowell

Let me sell you what I'm seeing in a way that you may see more clearly:

So you said earlier that you feel there's scum pushing Loftwing, no?

Well, if you look back, both Lowell and Eira switched their vote to Loftwing once a wagon on themselves started building.

My conclusion off that was that they were trying to self preserve by voting out Loftwing, rather than being a townie who organically found Loftwing scummy.

Hi , loftwing is obvtown, lets vote out either lowell or eira please

VOTE: eira

VOTE: lowell
Powerlim this

Lowell and Eira are scum together trying not to die d1 desperately

I've not particularly SR'd Fredrick for most of the game (found the slot hard to read initially), but I think BBT is very much town, going to take a proper look at their case on Fredrick and see where I stand.

Lowell's posting hasn't screamed townie at me, but some of their recent responses don't indicate a scum player trying to stay on the good side of town either.

Fredrick is town, probably PR, we are NOT voting there.

he has clearly played in a non agenda way do not fucking counterwagon them last second.,

Nevermind the fact lowell has completely ignored me this whole game while I have pushed them probably the hardest - a fun little tactic.

Lowell/Eira are blatantly paired and Fred is in my townblock. I will vehemently oppose fred unless you have an actual good case there.

Your case implies Irrelephant scum which is why I'm asking because I believe that slot is actually not as town as I first believed.

I admit I'm mostly scumreading Lowell for how they defend Eira in such a subtle yet overt manner.

Fredrick is also here defending Eira without explaination.

TBH

I feel a little less against it purely for the fact Fredrick has gone against my own reads so

fuck it
VOTE: Fredrick

I see it now.

if this flips town pls turbo eira/lowell tho

i think BBT's reasoning on this was town motivated even if it leads to an incorrect conclusion

I'm just gonna sheep Irrel today.

i pray that my read on irrelephant is wrong because if irrelephant is scum i see you being tunneled in on that slot being town and being pocketed to no end.

asking you directly to make sure when you end up in limlo that you actually critically think about *why* you are there and why other people are there.

Kill Fred->Irrelephant->Eira on a loft town flip

1008 is a terrible post

Is Loftwing scum or town

Am i scum or town


What am i if Loftwing flips town?

Kill Fred->Irrelephant->Eira on a loft town flip

irrelephant->eira->lowell on this flipping town

Illl be honest i had lower confidence that loftwing was town after their claim but i was extremely tunneled on eira who was unaligned there

Having a scum flip means i can delete next scum tho

[Eiralox]

dos

Spoiler:

If any more last minute opinions on anything is asked for and I happen to be online, I won't mind giving it, or the information I lack such an opinion.

I think mala and bbt are still town. Kenny actually i think drops to bottom 2 poe off this? I haven't reread game with new info in mind but that's the first thing that comes to mind


Keep in mind i thought i was right and thought id be dead+ its been 5 days since last dayphase.

Also im not answering any PR related probes. Your interest is weird.

Gamma knows how to read me + if i was scum he was dead tonight.
Gamma this is koba btw

On break now. Goal is to create a box of townies spewed rn - that being said just because someone pushed or was pushed by loftwing , it doesnt make them auto town. Remember that if we reach limlo. Lowell is one such slot - but only if mala is town. Context matters heavily. There were multiple dueling wagons and I'm strictly talking about anyone who pushed loft who was a dueling wagon with them. This means lowell+eira are not as cleared as the others - however i am not going to be looking first there. I know people wont like this take but it is a correct one that ensures we dont lose because we only looked at surface level logic of "they pushed scum hard!!"

I had a weird tinfoil based on how fancy was treating me going into this day but i think they were the one who did the meta dive so i think that slot is also pretty locktown.

If i had to locktown people at the moment:

Fancy
Irrelephant
Gamma(shoshin)

Likely town:
bbt(yall will hate me for this one but i sympathize with them. I after all did sheep their case, and that primarily becaue i was working off the false assumption loft was town)
Malcom - i still think the way they approach the game is how they do as town and the identifying factors - the extreme indecisiveness - was proof of that. I am still too wary and have tinfoils that prevent me from locking this in.

I forgot who else was in the game so uh i need to check playerlist before i post more

Funnily enough CW not pushing BBT at all does slightly soften my scumread a bit from very confident to relatively confident - I do feel like that'd be a useful slot for CW to be pushing given they TR'd Loftwing quite strong. Although, of course, there's not necessarily anything ruling out the two of them being scum together, much as I don't see it.

I think its fair to see bbt and I as partnered but from my point of view, and bbts thats obviously... not possible so keep in mind that as town id be seeing things in a different POV adnd have a different view than most, notably being forced to consider slots others think are clear for (what i believe ) are weak distancing reasons.

From where i sit, if the team is lowell loftwing eira - they were in deep shit all day and the fredrick wagon was a godsend.

Like wagons d1 were lowell/loftwing

When lowell was getting wagoned, lowell unexplained jumped on loft. Viable bus, and what i believe was what happened at this point(pending deeper reread, mobile gaming har

Same thing happened with eira

What i need lowell to do is explain their progression and how they reached a vote on loftwing.

Lowell simultaneously pushing me and shoshin when shoshin is extremely unpaired with me is wild

Irrelephant i understand you are trying to see if im.paired with a possible scum kenny but the reason im avoiding that slot is due to history of misreading, not because im scum. I want time to analyze before i commit anywhere. Rushing into another lim after a scum death is how games are lost

My ambivalence and lack of wish to defend kenny is as much pressure to the slot as im willing to give. And i was already clear on wanting to reread most of d1 at least becore i commit

VOTE: kenny

Why did you vote loftwing, eira?

Fwiw im sorting kenny strictly through poe because i have fuck all confidence in reading them.

I feel bad bc i should have been open to the fact i was scumreading playstyle and thats my bad.

I did see the exact post that made me feel.loftwing was town because it looked very thoughtful and complex and reminded me of town Loftwing. Honestly kudos to loft bc it was a really good post to make as scum

Sorry for flooding thread btw just laying out thought process and all

Im like anxiously waiting for people's reaction to my eira 180 bc like i feel like that's momentum shifting and i wanna see it

gamma clearly frozen and crying in scum chat(joke i still townread the slot btw lol)

Why are people voting Lowell? I don't see them being scum here. They haven't left much to be desired.

Why aren't people voting lowell? I see them being scum here. They leave much to be desired.

Why are people voting Lowell? I don't see them being scum here. They haven't left much to be desired.

Why aren't people voting lowell? I see them being scum here. They leave much to be desired.

VOTE: Lowell

Lowell + one of Mala/Kenny is currently where I'm exactly at btw.

Now that's how you analyze spew uwuwu

ok honestly i can't tell which between kenny/mala but like .

lowell

thats 100%

like literally open up loftwing ISO and ctrl-F lowell and u will se

open up CSF iso and see what CSF thought of lowell. she even said lowell/loftwing were paired. thats a pretty damning legacy. she also agreed with my towncore list - which *did* include loftwing at the time i believe *but* she separately said loftwing could be scum with lowell *which* means the rest of it is likely pure.

I'm caught up. Kenny, Cats, malcolm fine for lynch. fancy begrudgingly town, mala town, irrelephant town, toffee town I guess.

WHAT IN THE BUTT

HOW ON EARTH DO I GET A STRONG TOWN READ

NOPENOPENOPE

this reaction actually lowkey unpaired.

im starting to tunnel a kenny/lowell solve now.

actually i can see lowell/BBT both planning to counterwagon fredrick to save loft.....................

and i fell for it because of my faulty read on eira..


ok the objective order for anyone who actually reread d1 (cough cough) is:

Lowell->Kenny->BBT->Mala(i believe the game ends liklier than not before we reach mala fwiw)

I think I’m just gonna sheep CW until I stop feeling drained for some incomprehensible reason (I actually kinda have a guess why, it’s probably burn-out from schoolwork)

. you're not helping my case on why u are town but also i correctly predicted you would townread me so n i c e

Also I think I'm allowed to bring this up:
The replace shenanigans make this slot more scummy in my opinion, especially since Irrelephant said Shosh likes playing town.

Shosh uh did not have a choice in the matter there.

I'm just like wondering why the fuck the CSF kill makes sense now if we are in a world where Shosh is scum ?

like Lowell came into this day hardpushing gamma ???

is watcher a thing in normals?


actually what if scum have a role watcher ROFL

and lowell was TMIing that gamma slot would be likely dead today because they saw a tracker visited gamma

that'd be wild.

But alas its probably just mala



just .... in the mala/gamma world i have 0 idea why you kill CSF there.

lowell I really await your attempts to pair me with shoshin.
it will be funny because I vow to tunnel your slot until one of us are dead.

good job on the TMI tho.

Here's something fun, I'm here and going to soft an even night or novice investigative right now. I am going to be on you Lowell. You wonder why I talked about investigatives so much this game and was trying to pretend like i was setup speccing which one? Well now you see.

Do what you will with that info. I know you won't kill me regardless because a tracker exists and you dont know their gate and you think you can mislim me.

I play PR as if I'm a VT and need to defend myself on the basis of dayplay. Because it is shitty play to crutch a roleclaim - in all cases. I knew the only way I died was if I ended up exactly correct on the scumteam.

also you probably hammered gamma anyways. its clear you want to just rush the day and kill fancy in safety. you have 0 interest in a conversation that involves critical analysis.

i'm still like not entirely sure shoshin slot was even scum and i wanted gamma to say something and rushing here was really bad :/

oh well at least I am sure there is 1 minimum in shoshin/lowell regardless of what gamma flips

The thing is I believe gamma when they say they simply cannot get on because it is not like them to just not post regardless and it is likely genuine.

We can still plan to eliminate the slot just .. wait?

Last scum is definitely a rolecop and holstered kill to scout

That being said it would be fitting if lowell was town and kenny was scum here just for the sheer fact my name was a prophecy so im rooting for kenny scum but still believe its lowell last based on the TMI reads and scummy positioning hes taken this game. Thats a slot that looks to me to have played in an informed way around whats flipped.

The way scum treated me spews me as a townie. The way shoshin pushed me in particular

Also with the vig, the backup flipped compulsive so it can be infinite shot and compulsive.

Loft and shoshin were scum theatering around the kenny slot. I really think that slot is spewed town that way fwiw.

Did anyone but myself open up any scum isos post flip?

See i would self vote here but i know that no one will listen to me abojt lowell so i want to thunderdome lowell here and now and no one contribute arguments for lowell. Let him make his case. I will SHOW YOU he is scum.

I have no urgency to get lowell now or later as scum
In fact id want it after vig is dead

I thought loftwing had a complex thought process that i associate typically with town.. im actually lowkey impressed at the lines loftwing said in light of a red flip.

Shoshin i believed to be too bold and out of scum meta to be scum. Also the tunnel they had on me felt town motivated.

I would say the most compelling reason lowell being town lies around the vote shifts when loftwing unvoted kenny

when the wagon got hot.

ok mafia is a hard game

i went from

"huh maybe lowell town.. kenny scum?" to "nah kenny def town" to "bbt maybe scum? and then "bbt spewed town af" in the course of less than 2 minutes lmao

people i am confident are spewed town or buried scum in a way that is never scum/scum:

BBT/Myself/Irrelephant/Eiralox/Fancy/Malcom
'
People that are nearly spewed town but i see *things*: Kenny,

remaining: lowell

so you see I keep arriving at the same conclusion regardless of what I do lmao

that is from a blank slate strictly reading loftwing/shoshin purely

if there are any scum in bbt/irrelephant/eira/fancy/malcom, they distanced extremely well and kudos to them.

not anything to say rn.

[Eiralox]

i have plenty plenty to say :p

I mean i can write paragraphs about above posts lol... but im not gonna, not now at least.

What im gonna do is feel better bout a cw vote over a kenny vote today, esp. with kenny replacement incoming. Kenny just wandered away it seems.

And cw even if u flip town i wont mind that much tbh, rn u feel so scummy 2 me i cant help but thirst for a flip. meh.

[Eiralox]

i might actually, if im feeling subhuman enough, go through every and each post or some of em and say why l feel like I feel. I mean... there's wrong then there's selective targeting. And yeah maybe ur town, maybe im seeing red, but this is still the flip im rooting for. Like just.... the interactions with loft and shoshin themselves, the feel is way more scummy than you aver. The fact that through all loft and shosh were always in the townlock or townblock. tonwreading loft when any rational view would have been null to scum, townreading ppl for lazy reasons(examples with first lowell sus:fancy and loft). The end day.... heavy scum vibes i got during the fred thing. eira/lowell were going nowhere so scum needed that town mobbing instead of no exe. And already im up a paragraph and havent referenced one post yet. *sigh* imma smookee

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HGLkakiUI9E

[Eiralox]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYwzhFLdddk

might come back with clear head and state logically my thoughts. kenny can still be scum, ill re-go-over kenny, but rn cw cleans the slate, we have a vig so who really acres about the order? Cw sudden re-rentrenchment Re: Lowell after scumreading kenny D2 points to only one thing in my mind: I want to sort kenny/cw with vote/vig, many of want to, scum cw is scrambling against this tactic. My feels at least, wouldnt town cw be rooting for lowell/kenny at this point, for we have vig? why only still on lowell? egh.

[Eiralox]

and the final clincher, i mean this should be obvious at this point, but: Loftwing voting Lowell. FLies by cw. Loftwing and Shoshin at different points townread Eira. Shoshin, from my feel of the game, voted CW as a way to sheep Eira (I was still reading Shoshin green to null because of this before Fancy claim, well played Shoshin btw).

And c'mon its obvious CW wagon was going nowhere D1. look at the posts i qouted, look at cw making sure to display shohsin scumreading them and in turn green reading shoshin(townlock iirc) beacause of that. And this, if I have read correctly, is the main point cw uses to distance themselves from shoshin? after stll townreading gamma d2, being the only one against gamma elim d2? c'mon. how can i not want this flip? its like a raw ripe fruit dangling from the tree of life.

egh i need to drink something out 4 now.

[Eiralox]

so my mind is 95% settled om two scenarios: CW, Shosh, and Loft had a fine scum game planned but the confluent mischance of vig and tracker having sharp noises completely blew that show out of the water. i see that, i feel that, makes some sense to me.

2nd scenario: it's kenny, they gave up. Im waiting to hear from kenny replace but rn eh i thin the above show has more glittering lights^^^^^^


now imma be a dwarf

[Eiralox]

i guess we'll see

[Eiralox]

Ok vote kenny ill hammer. Lets end this.

[Eiralox]

...................

[Eiralox]

kenny is prob mafia who didnt send in night kill after gamma elim. Or whataver. Ive made it pretty clear way early d3 where im at and that im only gonna be engaged once we elim kenny/cw. Only if those slots turn green do I have any real reason to become actively invested here, and I doubt both r green. So yall can wither and tither and hicker but im uncgphanged, bbt can be scum yeh but im not feeling it. Im willing to hammer on kenny just so we can get this over with. The vig knows what to do if kenny flips green.

[Eiralox]

I mean whatever I dont like making a dead horse suffer but you do you.

[Eiralox]

Or dying horse. Fuck im dumb

[Eiralox]

Uh irrel it takes 5 to hammer. So if malcolm votes we can end this. Have fun playing ; )

[Eiralox]

Oh nvm thats what u meant. Anyway malcolms they pivot here.

[Eiralox]

Yeah not gonna change my mind. Have fun tho.

[Eiralox]

I dont often do these but here's a readlist:

Fancy (I mean I dont see scum giving up gamma)
Malcolm/Lowell ... Solid townlocks due to continued towniness
Irrel/Toffee ... If I were to look for other scum id look here. Toffee can be it, but no, not for now.
Cw/Kenny

VOTE: KennyK

Malcolm can decide.

[Eiralox]

yeah im not engaged at all rn. good luck.

[Eiralox]

HHHHHHHHHHHuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu................... ok cool

[Eiralox]

like find the scum then ill read what you have to say. nothing so far from you have convinced me, nor anyone else from what ive seen. im just not readin what you said after my kenny vote, two sentences in and my brain felt funny and im not gonna repeat that. if you're right about this, props 2 u, but im not feeling it, and honestly wont be posting for a long while unless something happens.

[Eiralox]

loftwing stayed on lowell end day one. i've said this before. meh. bye.

[Eiralox]

Flavor 1.5

Death

When you reach zero hit points, you die. Death is also possible when you have nonzero hit points, by several methods of instadeath or delayed instadeath. You lose all the progress you made in that game, and you may have your possessions identified, see your attributes at the time of death (as well as a single post-mortem attribute), see a list of vanquished creatures, see a list of monsters genocided, and see which official conducts you have adhered to.

Dying may also create a bones file.

A particularly spectacular character death, especially of a character that is was well on the way to ascension, is often called a splat. Watching splats (live or on Splat TV) is a part of the fun of social NetHack.

Source: NetHackWiki

Flip 1.5

Fredrick A Campbell

(7): BlueBloodedToffee, Eiralox, Lowell, Confidently Wrong, Irrelephant11, FancyPants, Shoshin

[HAMMER!]

Lowell

(2): Cat Scratch Fever, Loftwing

Loftwing

(1): Fredrick A Campbell

Eiralox

(1): kennyk

BlueBloodedToffee

(1): Malakittens

Not Voting

(1): MalcolmTucker

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to eliminate.

Fredrick A Campbell

has been eliminated!

Fredrick A Campbell's role was

Town 1-Shot Bulletproof

!

[/area]

Night 1 ends in (expired on 2022-07-06 11:17:00).

one of the reasons im scumreading, if uve read my case.

[Eiralox]

To explain my sudden thought process

CW having a tunnel for so long on Lowell based on incorrect reasoning feels incredibly towny
Was Shoshin really the only scum on the feed wagon? When she would have happily sheeped me onto Lowell? (If Kenny is scum the answer is yes apparently)

If CW is town then why did the loftwing wagon falter? Unless it was bbt

toffee takes the time to construct the fred case while the wagons wouldve shifted to either eira or lowell(ansolutely lowell, i judged my wagon was going nowhere after loft claim. Toffee openly stated their townread of lowell and that they did not like either lowell or loftwing wagons. wouldnt scum toffee have remained on fred, let lowell be executed, instead of that heavy push?

the loftwing wagon faltered because loftwing claimed. fred was the only one who still actively wanted a loftwing launch irrc, some were ok with it but not enough to push it(fancypants, ireell irrc).

Only cw and toffee were townreading Loft.
And don't think cw continuing to tunnel makes them town irrel, rn lowell is the only target a scum cw culd really have(along with bbt, which cw is shifting to rn), cw was heavy on kenny D2 but after the entire let's flip cw/kenny cw has 360ed on that.

But I mean either toffee or irrel if both flip green, as ive said. If KennyK flips vannilla town i still highly suggest vig sorts cw.

[Eiralox]

unless toffee absolutely felt the need for a fed push instead of a lowell mob or a no lynch. but rn there's now way im voting toffee over cw/kenny 2day.

[Eiralox]

or no exe, self-censoring Xd

[Eiralox]

Dwarf Fortress <3 <3 <3

I thought about unvoting but meh. dazzle me.

[Eiralox]

ugh end this shit. im still where im at, not seeing toffee as more scum than cw/whoever is kenny. lowell is still townlock and cw continuied tunneling there along with bbt is well not gonna help imo.

VOTE: Confidently Wrong

Honestly just end this shit, If we're wrong we know what to do, but rn im not voting lowell. im not voting toffee. that's it.

[Eiralox]

if cw and kenny slot flip town kill bbt before lowell, BBT is way more scum.

[Eiralox]

VOTE: Dunn

Yeah i'm not feeling it. Either scum cw or scum dunn has lucked out with Irrell starting to shift to toffee. I still wanna hear from malcolm.

[Eiralox]

VOTE: Confidently Wrong


no fuck it this is what im rooting for. Sort either Dunn/BBT vig, idgaf anymore.

[Eiralox]

uno

Spoiler:

VOTE: confidently wrong
This is mafia, I am very sure of it.

VOTE: fancy pants

Fancy seems town.

Based on?

I believe it, but I have my sights sent on a pair of pants

actually maybe you are correct

VOTE: CSF

boomers annoyingly know what theyre talking about sometimes

i would know, i play with pooky

VOTE: Fredrick

I do not play with secrets

VOTE: Mala

I want pressure on this slot so i can start solving the game from slots i feel Comfortable solving fast

I'm not even sure it's that you're playing "weirdly" though, it's just that you're incredibly willing to hand out a free townread early on without much of a reason for doing so. I understand meta will often come into games and that's fine, but your posts could easily read as an opportunistic attempt to cosy up to Shoshin and get on her side early on if she's town and you're not.

I will probably explain better at a later date.

Your townblock, for what it's worth, gives me a similar fear...we're not that long into the game, I'm wary to put too much faith and trust in anyone at this stage.

This is fair. Does it make you think I'm scum trying to prop up a partner? Or just town who's likely to be wrong? Because, if the latter, it's only dangerous if you think one of my three townreads is scum. Let me know if you think so at any point.
Realistically I don't think we'll manage a consensus 5-6 person townblock with 0 scum. But I do think we can make one with, at most, 1 scum. And that's a pretty valuable potential town tool.

Like I get your paranoia but do you disagree with the concept of a townblock or just that i've picked three names already?

I don't disagree with the idea of a townblock in general, I'm just not too keen on ruling out certain players as mafia early on in D1. I don't particularly scum-read anyone you've put in there so far but we're only a couple of days into the game, ideally nobody should be completely free from pressure.

My gut-feeling right now is one of you/Shoshin could be mafia. Shoshin's push on me was weak and opportunistic, but if they're town and you know they're wrong could be a useful pocket for you, as I've stated. I'm liking your engagement a lot more this page though.

They're both town

Csf locktown

Still gonna tunnel mala until she towntells

loft is town

lets sort by post count

VOTE: kenny
Yolo

VOTE: lowell

Loftwing is town, unvote them and vote scumclaimed lowell

@CW, This is the part where I ask you why Loftwing is town - you ignore me and I don't change my mind.

The claimed mafia lowell spewed them town

@CW, This is the part where I ask you why Loftwing is town - you ignore me and I don't change my mind.

The claimed mafia lowell spewed them town

remind me the scumcase for lowell?

The interaction regarding malcom was essentially outting

Whats funny was that i changed my read on fancy bc of lowell so cheers thanks for the free town

Mala/Lowell/eiralox is a team I'd lock in rn gth

Its probably wrong but i am confident of at least 2

Well I'm confident enough in lowell that I'd veto anyone i believe is spewed town off him, and i even actively townread loft off meta and malcom as well. Kenny i refuse to comment on because he did fool me recently in a somewhat embarassing way.

I think Lowells reaction to a wagon starting on him however should be indicative enough that he isn't solving the game and is self pressing in a scummy way

VOTE: Eiralox

Have it your way. I offered the easy way, let's do the hard way.

VOTE: Loftwing

Subject to change but time to cast a vote somewhere. Not confident their opportunistic jumping around from wagon to wagon is townie. The vote on Mala felt particularly opportunistic as I said earlier on.

I think fundamentally the reasons you are presenting for reading people is flawed and not consistent(results wise) in any way.

So I envision it shall be difficult to convince you similarly to the last time we played together.


Jumping around wagon to wagon is not a scum behavior.

personally i think the game is solved fmpov

with [Lowell/Eira/Mala] as the most likely team

and then as bonus PoE: [BBT/kennyk]

Every other player I feel a confident enough reason to townread them.

kennyk is also never paired with Lowell

I hope that satiates any concerns you have that my read is faulty based on reasoning you think could apply to you. I could go for a townblock including myself, Irrelephant, you(loftwing), CSF, Fredrick, and Fancy Pants

honorary members Shoshin and Malcom

Where in the world are Lowell and Mala

also i fully think shoshin is town and never eliminate and the only reason their reads are so bonkers is because theyre both misclearing the most obvious scum and misreading an easily findable townie for what I believe are incorrect reasons to label someone as mafia.

shoshin please cite a single thought from Eira you thought was towny. Because I guarantee you binned them town for posting a lot and being pushed by someone you are currently confbiasing into a scumteam for defending your top scumread.

VOTE: Confidently Wrong

Ok I'm still going to read you town and carry anyways

If you want to be obtuse, I think you are town because your thoughts are obviously independent and I can trace how you reached conclusions.

I disagree with your conclusions, and think the process is wrong. But its a towny process.

If you want to play with your ego and get mad and vote me for disagreeing with you go ahead, but don't be surprised when it doesn't help win the game for town.

for visibility

I am at a point where I can call every one of these players town with confidence, if I am wrong about *any* of them it is at worst only 1 in my humble opinion.

Loftwing
MalcolmTucker
Shoshin
Fredrick A Campbell
Cat Scratch Fever
FancyPants
Irrelephant11

And then to add on to that, I would say Mala after her recent postings and Kenny, are both also townreads for me although I am not confident enough to lock them in. Mala is closer to townlocking than Kenny here in this case.

This leaves us with a trio of BBT/Lowell/Eiralox

No I think Shoshin or MalcomT is not that useful right now and I think they are town

CW could be scum trying to power a miselim through. I think loftwing is a pretty good flip

We should consider making a flip happen sooner rather than later because this weekend is a holiday weekend for everyone in the US and we have about 2.5 days left in this game day, during which the American players might barely post (e.g. me, I'll be hanging with family)

What signs do you see me being scum?

And why is Loftwing a good flip? Over Eira even?

Shoshin i will be extremely dissapointed if you help town lose this game because you think your solutions are the only correct ones.

Loftwing i get the vibes thing on Fancy but im pretty sure they are town
I know you're trying your best to help people find you and I'm sorry there are stubborn townies this game being unfair to thay and intentionally ignoring it.

It's hard to vote off Loftwing based on your input because your reasoning for him being Town is meta related, and when I did my dive (admittedly before I knew he was an alt) I didn't find the same.

As for your case on Eira I think I understand your jist but what I don't see is why "Eira is just wrong and bad at cases." is a worse explanation. Additionally it's partially supported by your surety of everyone else's alignment (you could only know Eira is making reads based on knowing everyone's alignment if you ALSO know everyone's alignment, I hope that makes sense).
I understand you could just be that sure of yourself, or at least pretending to be but it's kinda weird and difficult to just sheep.

I'm willing to compromise on Lowell as a "let's avoid loftwing vs eira" thing.

I'm not feeling Loftwing *at all* and I'm seeing their towngame here.

VOTE: Lowell

also BBT's last post being actually towny making me feel better about untownlocking irrelephant in my reads... because now I got a wild potential world of Irrelephant/Eira/Lowell

Let me sell you what I'm seeing in a way that you may see more clearly:

So you said earlier that you feel there's scum pushing Loftwing, no?

Well, if you look back, both Lowell and Eira switched their vote to Loftwing once a wagon on themselves started building.

My conclusion off that was that they were trying to self preserve by voting out Loftwing, rather than being a townie who organically found Loftwing scummy.

Hi , loftwing is obvtown, lets vote out either lowell or eira please

VOTE: eira

VOTE: lowell
Powerlim this

Lowell and Eira are scum together trying not to die d1 desperately

I've not particularly SR'd Fredrick for most of the game (found the slot hard to read initially), but I think BBT is very much town, going to take a proper look at their case on Fredrick and see where I stand.

Lowell's posting hasn't screamed townie at me, but some of their recent responses don't indicate a scum player trying to stay on the good side of town either.

Fredrick is town, probably PR, we are NOT voting there.

he has clearly played in a non agenda way do not fucking counterwagon them last second.,

Nevermind the fact lowell has completely ignored me this whole game while I have pushed them probably the hardest - a fun little tactic.

Lowell/Eira are blatantly paired and Fred is in my townblock. I will vehemently oppose fred unless you have an actual good case there.

Your case implies Irrelephant scum which is why I'm asking because I believe that slot is actually not as town as I first believed.

I admit I'm mostly scumreading Lowell for how they defend Eira in such a subtle yet overt manner.

Fredrick is also here defending Eira without explaination.

TBH

I feel a little less against it purely for the fact Fredrick has gone against my own reads so

fuck it
VOTE: Fredrick

I see it now.

if this flips town pls turbo eira/lowell tho

i think BBT's reasoning on this was town motivated even if it leads to an incorrect conclusion

I'm just gonna sheep Irrel today.

i pray that my read on irrelephant is wrong because if irrelephant is scum i see you being tunneled in on that slot being town and being pocketed to no end.

asking you directly to make sure when you end up in limlo that you actually critically think about *why* you are there and why other people are there.

Kill Fred->Irrelephant->Eira on a loft town flip

1008 is a terrible post

Is Loftwing scum or town

Am i scum or town


What am i if Loftwing flips town?

Kill Fred->Irrelephant->Eira on a loft town flip

irrelephant->eira->lowell on this flipping town

Illl be honest i had lower confidence that loftwing was town after their claim but i was extremely tunneled on eira who was unaligned there

Having a scum flip means i can delete next scum tho

CW

44 Fancy Vote

89 Asks Shoshin why FAncy is town

108 Reaffirms Pants Tunnel

111 Agrees with Lowell, votes CSF

157 Votes Fred for secret-sharing gambit

200 Votes Mala"I want pressure on this slot so i can start solving the game from slots i feel Comfortable solving fast"

431 "Mala/Lowell/eiralox is a team I'd lock in rn gth

Its probably wrong but i am confident of at least 2"



257 Malcolm has gut feel Irrel/Shoshin could be mafia, CW says they are town

286 Lockstown CSF

287 "Still gonna tunnel mala until she towntells"

^^One of the summiest sentences to me

295 Loft is town

296 Lets sort by post count

I picked up on this and mentioned it a view times to explain CW D1 but no one seems to have picked up on this.

371 Vote Kenny

385 Vote Lowell

402 "Loftwing is town, unvote them and vote scumclaimed lowell"

421 "The claimed mafia lowell spewed them town"

430 "Whats funny was that i changed my read on fancy bc of lowell so cheers thanks for the free town"

Another lazy townread on par with the CSF reads and to a lesser extent the comment about mala

^^^ sorting by post-count coming to fruition here, Note, as I mentioned D1, that CW seems to be going after inactives but never adds Shoshin to that grouping, later townreading Shosh and making sure to display it for all and posterity to see.