Newbie 1908 [Game Over]

[Flavor Leaf]

Flavor Leaf's IC Post

Hello, everybody!

Flavor Leaf

(or if you know me by my main account,

Boonskiies

), been here since 2014, and I will be your

IC

for this game.

IC

stands for "

Inexperienced Challenged

". What this means is, as the

IC

, along with playing the game, I have the additional job of answering any questions that you may have about the game, basic mafia game theory and mechanics, or anything specific to the MafiaScum site itself, for those of you who are already familiar with the game of Mafia.

This being said, you should not allow your read on me to be influenced by anything I say as

IC

in response to questions or advice. Roles and alignments are randomly assigned; this means I have just as much a chance of being scum as any of you guys, and I will be playing towards my wincon, whether it be scum or town.

I will never use my position as

IC

to decieve you, and I will try my best to dissociate when I'm speaking as an

IC

, and when I'm speaking as a player.

Alongside myself as the

IC

, we have a few

SE

(

Semi-Experienced

) players. An

SE

is not a teaching role, but more of a showcase role. The goal of all established players is to set a good example in Newbie games to help properly integrate newer players.

A Quick Few Tidbits:

• Don't be afraid to ask questions. I'll happily answer to the best of my ability.
• Be active! A lively game is better than a ghost town of a game. Post as much as you can and interact with your fellow players.
• Occasionally, mafia can be a bit heated, and you may feel a bit attacked sometimes. It's a natural part of the game, but try and confine your comments to a person's play rather than the person themself. Being scum read can seem like an insult, but everyone eventually rolls scum. It's nothing to be ashamed of! Don't look at it as a "Good vs Bad" scenario. Try working with the other players to help them see things from your perspective rather than stating they are wrong.
• Don't let a mistake or a mislynch bring you down. It happens a lot. Don't be afraid to really push for your reads, and don't feel bad if it turns out you were wrong. Even the most advanced players aren't always right! It's the nature of the game.


Here are some key concepts that will help you better understand the site meta:

Spoiler:

Random Voting Stage (RVS)

Games here on MafiaScum almost always begin with what's called the Random Voting Stage (RVS). Beginning of the game, players have extremely low information (besides the mafia team who already know everyone's alignments). At this time, players generally will vote for non-serious reasons to provoke reactions from other players. Eventually the discussion will progress, and the game will get moving out of the RVS Stage.

Voting, L-1, and Hammers

Typically, L-x is how we convey how close to a lynch a player is, with x being the amount of votes needed to successfully lynch a player. You should generally always announce that you are putting someone at L-1, 1 vote away from a lynch, so that someone can't come in and accidentally vote and lynch a player before the playerbase is ready to move on to the next day. This also prevents any Mafia-aligned players from ending the day on their terms by placing the final vote to lynch ("hammer") and then brushing it away like they didn't know it was L-1. Generally, you will also see people post L-2 or L-3 (2 and 3 votes away from lynch).

Before you hammer the player, it is customary that you give an "Intent to hammer" post, so that the player can then claim their role. It is usually best to allow
other players time to react and respond to the claim before hammering.

Claiming Your Role

Unless you are at L-1 and have been asked to claim because of an intent to hammer, it is almost never a good idea to claim your role. If you are a Town Power Role (PR), you are then likely to be killed by Mafia in the night, or Night Killed (NK'ed). If you are a Vanilla Townie (VT), you may think that claiming might not matter too much, but by doing so, you will be narrowing down the field of who a potential PR might be.

There are exceptions to this rule. For instance, if a Mafia-aligned player has just claimed your role, or your role directly counters the Mafia player's, claiming early to counterclaim (CC) would directly out the Mafia player as Mafia, and the town would benefit.

LyLo

LyLo is the abbreviation of “lynch or lose.” LyLo in the Newbie Queue is when there are 3 remaining players, 2 of which are town and 1 is mafia;
or when there are 5 remaining players, 3 of which are town and 2 are mafia. In these situations the town aligned players should not carelessly vote like is done during RVS or early days, as the mafia player(s) can instantly provide the necessary votes to lynch (“quickhammer”) and win the game without the town being able to fight back. MyLo, however, stands for "Mislynch and Lose", meaning the game will end on a mislynch, but not if you choose to "No Lynch". This generally can be helpful when there are an even amount of players left in the game, and you want to narrow down the pool with some night actions.

Thanks for joining this game. I hope we all have a great time.


Here are some links you may want to look at before playing.

Spoiler:

A Guide to Being Awesome At Mafia
Commonly Used Abbreviations
Glossary

edited to remove quote tags

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Rosterfoster

For rhyming.

[Flavor Leaf]

Why do you think it’s defensive scum rather than defensive town?

[Flavor Leaf]

I kind of liked it. He was in RVS (random voting stage) mode, and someone pushed him for joking around. I think it’s valid of him to turn it back around. Great starting point to push us out of RVS.

[Flavor Leaf]

I feel like it’s not necessarily warranted, but I don’t think it’s necessarily coming from a scum perspective. It makes complete sense from what I know thus far of you that as town you would push there as well. That’s coming from an extremely limited sourcepool, obviously, but until i have a better grasp on who you are as a player, I can’t say it’s scummy.

[Flavor Leaf]

I don’t think we choose to move out of RVS. It kind of just happens.

The reason that seemingly happened here is because of the pushback to their actions

[Flavor Leaf]

Boonskies we meet again I see

That explains why doughboy replaced out

VOTE: Flavor Leaf

Haven't caught up yet; will do so later tonight

Yeah, I’m too good. He’s afraid I’ll catch him. So that means you’re likely scum, right?

[Flavor Leaf]

Everyone’s posting in a manner where I have no real reason to scum read anyone thus far. Solid early play. A bit slow, but I’m sure something will happen soon that will cause the game to pick up some steam.

[Flavor Leaf]

Hmm. Neat. Roster’s at L-2 now.

[Flavor Leaf]

Hmm. Neat. Roster’s at L-2 now.

Who are you masons with this time bruh

Roster

[Flavor Leaf]

Hmm. Neat. Roster’s at L-2 now.

Who are you masons with this time bruh

I just won a 26 player game as SK, so I’m redeemed from that now, haha.

[Flavor Leaf]

What’s a doughboy?

[Flavor Leaf]

Hydra are players who make an account specifically to share. Most games don’t allow hydra, but a decent amount of theme games do.

People like playing together, but sometimes just don’t have enough time, or they want to partner up with someone. Generally they aren’t supposed to post with their main accounts, but sometimes they do because they forget to switch. That’s called an alt slip. Or a main slip.

[Flavor Leaf]

They share the same role PM, so it allows them to talk to a player who is playing from the same perspective as them

[Flavor Leaf]

Vivit seems townie from that last post.

I think Xwing as well for the town roster comment, bar them being S/S, but that’s to be figured out later. No point in preflip associates at this point in the game.

[Flavor Leaf]

Vivit won me over with the footsies comparison.

[Flavor Leaf]

what do you think of salamander and jim?
are you good/accurate at reading flavorleaf?

I don't have enough thoughts to post anything meaty right now

And no I don't think I have a good read on flavor leaf, except that he's vastly unpredictable and prone to shenanigans (but probably much less so in a newbie)

I’m generally pretty straight forward in newbie games. I like to think I hit all the right marks as an IC. I have pretty strong newbie retention.

I like to constantly be in some newbie games, though. I basically play as an IC a lot in real life a lot as well.

[Flavor Leaf]

Interesting. Anyone else?

[Flavor Leaf]

@Flavor Leaf: Since you play so many newbie games, can you link a couple of town and a couple of scum games you think would represent your play style?

From newbie games? Because I have a drastically different playstyle in newbie games.

I’ve also played in newbie games throughout the past year and a half and have never rolled scum in a newbie.

[Flavor Leaf]

But yeah, I’ll link some when i get home

[Flavor Leaf]

Oh, I’m L-2 now. Scum’s on my wagon already.


I didn’t like Munch’s hop on me. And the fact he called me Flover.

He said I seemed townie, yet decided to put me to L-2. Interesting.

VOTE: Munch

Time to move off my RVS.

[Flavor Leaf]

She, sorry. Also, you wanted newbie games of mine, right?

[Flavor Leaf]

He said I seemed townie, yet decided to put me to L-2. Interesting.

VOTE: Munch

Why munch when she said basically the same reasoning as Komodo?

Timing. Munch was the L-2 vote.

I like the reasoning coming from the second vote when applying it towards the beginning of the wagon, but in newbie games the 3rd vote is much scummier than the 2nd. You can physically feel it, like when we had 3 votes on roster.

[Flavor Leaf]

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=77801

viewtopic.php?f=50&t=77781

viewtopic.php?f=50&t=77567

Here’s my last 3 newbie games.

[Flavor Leaf]

To be fair, i do see some town coming from Munch. Like I get the vote as town, but I also get the vote as scum. I’m trying to get into that mindset more to figure out what it’s coming from.

[Flavor Leaf]

I also looked back and Komodo just voted, and didn’t do the same reasoning as Munch.

Munch’s reasoning is what piqued my interests. I care less about an early wagon random naked vote. Scum can do that, but it’s just circular WIFOM discussion until further stuff happens.

[Flavor Leaf]

Sorry, I meant to explain that.

WIFOM (Wine in Front of Me) - taken from the Princess Bride, is when you present an argument, and it’s completely circular in reasoning.

Like...as scum, do you think i’d put so and so to L-1 without explaining?

That’s WIFOM because the answer could be argued either way with no real way of proving either side to be true.

[Flavor Leaf]

I agree with what you said there. I let my RVS stay on roster earlier for the same reason.

UNVOTE: Munch

[Flavor Leaf]

I thought Munch’s explanation for voting me was pretty townie. I don’t see scum going through that much and having that thought process to explain a vote on me that they don’t even expect to have much come onto it.

[Flavor Leaf]

I’ll be here tomorrow. Had a friendsmas

[Flavor Leaf]

Yeah, sorry. I’m on my way home now, but it’s a bit of a drive. I don’t know what I think about this wagon. I feel like it’s the first to pass the L-2 threshold, and therefor it’s a mislynch, but I wanna read up.

Hold off on hammering today, and I’ll analyze when I can.

[Flavor Leaf]

Yeah, this is about a good time to say your intent to hammer. Generally if you plan on having your vote on said person, and you’re ready to end the day, but you want people to get their last words in before you officially hammer.

Basically, when you’re ready for people to say their last words to convince or dissuade otherwise.

[Flavor Leaf]

We have the four on wagon, plus xwing and Munch willing to give intent to hammer.

That is 6 of the 9. Take out Jim since being the wagon, that only leaves Komodo and myself.

I feel if Jim is scum, scum is closer to the end of the wagon/in the intents.

If Jim is town, then I like to think both scum are in that 6, either way, I feel that makes Komodo town.

I feel that because Jim happened kind of out of nowhere, that Jim is more likely town than scum.

However, @Jim, it’s time for you to claim, bud.

[Flavor Leaf]

Oh wow. I totally skipped page 8 except for the last Intent to hammer post.

Hmm, then that means Jim probably is scum, and someone helped transfer wagons.

[Flavor Leaf]

I'm pretty active right now so I'm going to unvote until I see Salamander post, and give Jim (or Jim's replacement, if need be) some time to actually participate before we potentially end the day. I've seen too many accidental or intentional hammers in newbie games to go to bed with a -1

UNVOTE: Salamander Consider my vote on there in spirit, however.

I feel like more quick hammers happen in non newbie games. There’s more discussion, sure, but outta nowhere lynches.

[Flavor Leaf]

Nauci’s pretty townie. There’s a lot of things he’s doing, like that pseudo unvote thatjust is doing a lot of unnecessary work as scum.

Sure, he could be doing it to project townieness, but I don’t feel they do that. Seems like town going straightforward at trying to figure it out, but doesn’t really know.

Doesn’t feel like Nauci knows what’s going on, but is trying to, which is all town can do at this point.

[Flavor Leaf]

i thought you wanted to hone your skills without the use of meta?
dont read his meta, just read him as he is here..

Because I have meta knowledge of the very different version of Flavor Leaf outside of newbie games, I needed to read his IC style as a sort of palate cleanser, if that makes sense?

Everyone else I'm going to have to cold read, which is nice.

To be fair, my non newbie games are all drastically different from each other. I’ve been told I play drastically different depending what account I’m playing on too.

[Flavor Leaf]

I think you have a lot of town pull right now, so people are playing follow the Nauci.

I agree that it’s a scummy play to sheep you so fast, but unfortunately I think it’s NAI. I can’t say for sure town wouldn’t follow you like that here.

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m getting misrepped pretty hard. I clearly told Nauci that I don’t believe the people sheeping me is necessarily alignment indicative because of the pull he has.

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Roster

Ptvurist is pretty townie.

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m getting misrepped pretty hard. I clearly told Nauci that I don’t believe the people sheeping me is necessarily alignment indicative because of the pull he has.

I feel like at least one of the pronouns here is a typo because I'm mildly confused

I told you that, then I got misrepped and said I was saying the opposite of what Roster said I was saying.

[Flavor Leaf]

Also, flavor, you've told us some meta analysis of the wagons, but what did you make of the merit of those scum reads themselves?

I don’t really know how to piece it together just yet. I’m putting together my town reads right now. I find that easier in newbie games, at least early. When scum are trying to act townie, it makes it easier to sift through.

[Flavor Leaf]

Nauci changed wagons and people followed. Nauci was the catalyst of the wagon, but didn’t do it himself.

People hopped on and sheeped. It takes more than one person for the wagon.

I see it townie from Nauci wanted to switch wagons, and because people sheeped the person worth a lot of town pull, I’m not necessarily sure it’s correct.

We’re trying to solve a puzzle without all the pieces, and there isn’t a direct way of knowing who the scum was on the wagon from that alone, since Nauci did have a town pull. We discuss it out more and mix future pieces with old pieces, if that makes sense. That’s at least what I am going to be doing.

[Flavor Leaf]

Oops I shouldn't have responded mid-Lyft without fully catching up lol

Flavor, I mostly got confused because you said he. I'm a woman.

I’m sorry. While I was posting I started with She, and then thought I was incorrect, so changed it to be. I guess I had it right originally. My apologies.

[Flavor Leaf]

@IC Flavor Leaf

, in situations like this this one, is it usually better for town to policy lynch than no lynch? I'm feeling the general consensus is that no lynch is bad for town, but I'm not sure completely why.

I give the intend to hammer before the deadline if nothing changes, but I would still prefer a vivit lynch.

I wouldn’t call it Policy lynching, it’s just more of a compromise lynch. Lynching someone who we can get a flip on, even if we don’t necessarily think they’re scum, but doing it for future reads.
I would rather a lynch go through.

Sorry, guy. I got really busy unexpectedly the last couple days.

I should be here a lot now, though.

[Flavor Leaf]

Has Salamander claimed? I’m willing to jump on if we need more people. Salamander’s not a town read of mine, and I’d rather a flip than a no flip.

[Flavor Leaf]

I would also like to hear more from Komodo, he also didn't give any readings yet.

And also @Flavor - why did you vote for Roster. I am asking, because I didn't think he said anything scummy. I also would like to hear your readings, becuse you don't say much, except that Nauci reads town.

I didn’t like his response and his misrepping of me when I pushed the NAI sheeping onto Nauci because of the pull that Nauci has this game, yet was pushing it like I was giving Nauci a pass.

He could have misunderstood, but he could have done that as scum, and the way he hopped onto that discussion was off to me.

[Flavor Leaf]

They are my town reads, along with you and Nauci.

Roster is a weak scum read of mine, but it’s pretty shallow on my part.

Munch, Komodo, and salamander I’m more on the side of scummy than town, but pretty close to bull on each of those.

Munch has some things I like, somethings that I think could be scum just doing it, but it’s enough for me to be okay not going there today. I’m actually solid with a Salamander lynch, to be honest.

[Flavor Leaf]

I generally am near the money on my one lean scum, and then I have one scum within my town reads. Day 1 in newbies I like to take it as a “these guys look town” kind of deal, and see which one ends up coming off like they are projecting town rather than just living it.

[Flavor Leaf]

Vivit seemed townie from this post. And ever since then I hadn’t seen anything scummy coming from vivit. I understood everything they were saying from a town perspective.

[Flavor Leaf]

I really think Roster is scum. He looks like he’s looking for a lynch not scum.

[Flavor Leaf]

Also, Vivit all game has been providing a lot of content, and looks to be trying to solve this game. Vivit is incredibly townie to me.

[Flavor Leaf]

I don’t understand how someone can look at Vivit’s ISO and go, “oh yeah, that looks like the best lynch for Day 1.”

Vivit has so much, and it doesn’t even look like fluff.

I don’t see scum posting like Vivit has been here. Someone’s taking advantage of it. Roster and Pvurist. This wagon has done enough to make me lose my town read on Pvurist.

[Flavor Leaf]

Hmm, interesting kill. I was going to say Munch was likely scum for hammering.

I’m a little unsure now.

I don’t think Pvuritist, Roster, or Nauci make sense as bud votes.

Maybe Nauci’s does, but she’s been playing very townie, and I don’t see the point as scum to state that town read on me. I expected scum to push me for that and have to defend myself for my defense over Vivit wasn’t scummy, so...well, that’s out of the way.

Nikk, Komodo, or xwing is probably where I’m looking at for today.

[Flavor Leaf]

Playing the reputation card, eh?

If you want reputation, I have even more of a reputation at pulling off crazy scum victories.

I mentioned this game that right after this game started, I won a 26 player kill heavy game as a 3rd party Serial Killer.

I’m town locking Nauci because there’s zero reason for Nauci to town lock me as scum here.

[Flavor Leaf]

Pvurist also is stating Nauci’s most likely scum, and Nauci is continuing this mindset. To be fair, Pvurist had me at a lean town and posted the same quotes as Nauci did.

Honestly, had y’all started to push me today, I would have used it as a defense, so good deductions you two. Makes me feel comfortable town reading you guys.

Man, I was just getting ready to clear Roster.

I feel like his last post can come from town, but it does push a scum agenda. It makes sense for scum to push me, and like I said before, I expected to be pushed, but I got some town reads from it, so thats cool.

[Flavor Leaf]

Playing the reputation card, eh?

If you want reputation, I have even more of a reputation at pulling off crazy scum victories.

I mentioned this game that right after this game started, I won a 26 player kill heavy game as a 3rd party Serial Killer.

I’m town locking Nauci because there’s zero reason for Nauci to town lock me as scum here.

This was @Roster.

[Flavor Leaf]

Vivit doesn’t get lynched as my partner yesterday, Roster. I had opportunities to push other wagons, and I’m pretty good at pushing a wagon when I get in the groove of things.

I’m starting to town read Roster for his posting after having it sink in. He’s stuck on a thing, I get it.

What would people think about actually mass claiming?

If we have a tracker/Neapolitan/jailkeeper/cop - every single one of those give us an innocent today, almost 2.

[Flavor Leaf]

Vivit doesn’t get lynched as my partner yesterday, Roster. I had opportunities to push other wagons, and I’m pretty good at pushing a wagon when I get in the groove of things.

I’m starting to town read Roster for his posting after having it sink in. He’s stuck on a thing, I get it.

What would people think about actually mass claiming?

If we have a tracker/Neapolitan/jailkeeper/cop - every single one of those give us an innocent today, almost 2.

If we do this, I’d like to do it a specific way so that scum can’t fake claim without being countered.

[Flavor Leaf]

I said nothing about auto win. This game can just be left out to POE after that. Shouldn’t have to rely on power roles.

7 players, 2 get cleared, possibly 3, we are at a 3-1 scenario, from there, you can POE further, for instance Pvurist and Nauci, (i would also say me at this point, but I won’t) there’s a chance to completely just figure it out here.

[Flavor Leaf]

To be fair, I feel one night action plus PR claim is great after a scum flip. Sure, could get a nice guilty or something later, but claiming early takes away scum’s chance at fake claiming a win later, and makes it so we don’t have to go in circular logic. Also less chance of PR accidentally dying or purposefully if scum picked up on it and kill them before they put results.

[Flavor Leaf]

Playing the reputation card, eh?

I suggest you reread my post again. Particularly the ‘burden of competence’ part. I was hesistant to say it for exactly this reason, but I have to ask questions about what confuses me, and I didn’t follow why Nauci was townreading you. Reputation is not why I think you're scum. Also, I disagree that Vivit Scum was obvious, which is what Nauci said. Also as I have said, I find it really hard to get any sort of read from your posts for some reason. I townread everyone else to some degree, so you're left. I really do want the people we haven't heard from in a while to post.

Maths about massclaiming incoming.

Why do you assume you’re 100% correct with your town reads? I’m null to you, not scum.

If I’m null, there’s been multiple people who have explained why they think I am town, and very adamantly, might I add.

Why are you ignoring those? These are your town reads, after all, arent they?

[Flavor Leaf]

Nikk’s actually most likely town based on Vivit’s push towards Salamander early, alongside the Salamander wagon in general. I’m going to look into the wagons now.

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE COUNT 1.5

flavor leaf (3)

- nauci, komodo, munchmellow

salamander (2)

- vivit, xwing

munchmellow (1)

- jim hawkins

rosterfoster (1)

- salamander

jim hawkins (1)

- rosterfoster

not voting (1)

- flavor leaf

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch

Deadline:

(expired on 2018-12-30 23:00:00)

mod notes:

- xwing is vla on weekends, and will be v/la until 12/27
-

VOTE COUNT 1.6

jim hawkins (4)

- rosterfoster, nauci, vivit, salamander

flavor leaf (2)

- komodo, munchmellow

salamander (1)

- xwing

munchmellow (1)

- jim hawkins

not voting (1)

- flavor leaf

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch

Deadline:

(expired on 2018-12-30 23:00:00)

mod notes:

- xwing is vla on weekends
-

VOTE COUNT 1.7

salamander (3)

- xwing, rosterfoster, vivit

flavor leaf (2)

- komodo, munchmellow

jim hawkins (1)

- salamander

munchmellow (1)

- jim hawkins

not voting (2)

- flavor leaf, nauci

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch

Deadline:

(expired on 2018-12-30 23:00:00)

mod notes:

- xwing is vla on weekends
- jim hawkins is being replaced
-

First wagon shows Nauci, Komodo, and Munchmellow on me. Nauci/Munch town.

Roster was already on Jim/Pvurist slot, then Nauci followed, and then Vivit/Salamander hop on.

Jim is being replaced, so people decide not to lynch there, and jump on Salamander. Xwing was already there, once Roster joined, Vivit hopped over. Roster is either the base scum sticking on things where Vivit followed, or Vivit was the proactive starting one, which I feel is more likely.

It’s probably Komodo based on the wagonomics.

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE COUNT 1.12

nikk (2)

- xwing, munchmellow

vivit (2)

- pvturist, rosterfoster

flavor leaf (1)

- komodo

rosterfoster (1)

- flavor leaf

munchmellow (1)

- nikk

pvturist (1)

- vivit

not voting (1)

- nauci

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch

Deadline:

(expired on 2019-01-01 21:24:00)

mod notes:

- xwing is vla on weekends
-

VOTE COUNT 1.15, FINAL

vivit (5)

- pvturist, rosterfoster, nikk, nauci, munchmellow

flavor leaf (1)

- komodo

rosterfoster (1)

- flavor leaf

pvturist (1)

- vivit

not voting (1)

- xwing

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch

Deadline:

(expired on 2019-01-01 21:24:00)

mod notes:

- xwing is vla on weekends, and until 1/3
-

These ones make it so it seems Pvurist and Roster are town. Nikk was Salamander, and Vivit was after them strong early, alongside almost being hammered. Nauci I’ve explained my town read on, and Munch is flipped. On top of someone on the wagon being killed, I feel like it’s solid to conclude this is an all town wagon.

Leaves Xwing and Komodo.

[Flavor Leaf]

Reads so far:

Rosterfoster

: standard RVS tactics, no real reads.

Salamander

: OMGUS counteraccusation against standard RVS tactics = scum read. Not strong, but stronger than anyone else's at this point. I may remove my vote if he comes in with a good defensive argument before lynchtime, but as is, his posts early in the thread are definitely the scummiest so far.

Nauci

: Made an off-topic post about masons, either a funpost for the lulz or a scumpost for the derail (I'm much more inclined to think the former.) Otherwise, strong town reads.

Flavor Leaf

: Town reads, but pretty quick to clear suspicion on people.

xwing

: Clearly wants to get a move on with the game. Rushing to get out of the early game is normally a scum read, but he has explicitly stated he doesn't like RVS as a personal preference. He seems like he's still getting the hang of Mafia (this has been commented on in past threads) so this definitely doesn't seem like a scum rush. When considering votes, he thinks clearly and critically. Likely town.

Komodo

: Seems to be doing more listening and asking questions than pushing ideas, so I'm guessing town.

Jim Hawkins

: Awfully quiet, so no direct reads either way, but lurking is itself a scum read. His post and login history (which at this writing say that he made his last post about 20 hours ago and logged off about 10 hours after that) indicate that he had chances to post but did not take them

Munchmellow

: Not many posts, not much to go on, but a bit more active than Jim Hawkins, so lurker vibes are weaker.
Keeping my vote on Salamander for now.

The Komodo/Xwing is where I looked at most here.

Xwing description seems like trying hard to make an impression there, and I don’t necessariky see that as s/S.

Komodo’s is the epitome of staying under the radar, so I could definitely see that as S/S.

[Flavor Leaf]

Honestly, Salamander's post seem scummier than anybody else's with the counteraccusations. It's natural to get defensive but it's not necessarily natural to counteraccuse. I'll vote

salamander

.

I agree with Roster. It feels like nooby defense more than anything. I wouldn't think scum would be that defensive off the bat. Not wiping all suspicion on him, but I'm not going to hard push him just yet.

What makes you say Munch is a town lean? I'm not getting any scum reads on her, but I'm not getting any town reads either.

I second this question.

Also I saw the new Spiderman movie and HOT DAMN it was so amazing. One of the few movies that almost made me cry

I've been getting scum reads on Jim all game, and with Salamander's more recent posts my suspicions of him have weakened a bit; his posts seem more scrubby than scummy (though that could be exactly what he wants us to think, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt for now).

VOTE: Jim Hawkins should explain himself or walk the plank.

should explain himself

What do you want him to explain

Okay so like, I could honestly see scum!vivit here. I could see a scum slip of someone just blindly following a wagon while adding a "reason", even if the reason doesn't make sense. Yeah, she expanded on it in the next post, but that's some suspicious wording...

That being said

im not comfortable sheeping nauci based on "not crumbling in real time" as a town read..for all we know pvt is already experienced enough not to crumble under pressure..the scum read on nauci slot based on nauci's early posts seems forced to me..

I want to second this as well. Even if she was town, I don't think a pure noob could do everything she did. Regardless if this is her first game here or not, you have to give some appreciation to her skill and not use her skill to justify a read.

@Komodo, nice to see you are back. Could you give us your readlist?

Absolutely!

Flavor Leaf: Null scum. Almost everything he says feels like a response to someone else that doesn't move the game forward. Not to mention that he has 44 posts by now. That doesn't look good for him.
Munchmellow: I get a strong town read here. First off, everything you've said flows together in a stream of thought and comes with mostly solid reasons.
Nauci: Pretty town. She's dropped from my top town read but still up there.
Roster/Xwing: Both rather town.
Sal/Pvt/Vivit: Null scum/scum/scum.


I'll expand more tomorrow. I didn't realize how long this post would take to type and I need to get ready. I have a hot date tonight

These are all the times Komodo brought up Vivit. The first time it’s to agree with Roster whilst pushing the same agenda as Vivit, but bringing up Roster as the “mastermind”. I like to call that technique Warlocking. It happens subconsciously a lot of times.

The next time Vivit is brought up it is to emphasize that Komodo seconds a question made my Vivit.

I brought the Spider-Man movie up because like...go see it. It’s fantastic. YOURE MY SUNFLOWER!!!

Komodo starts to turn onto Vivit when suspicion spikes up, however they stay in the neutral zone while going “i could see Vivit as scum, but...” paraphrasing, but yeah.

Komodo then goes on to state multiple scum/null scum reads. I am a null scum, along with Salamander.

Pvt and Vivit are both labeled as Scum and Scum, which is convenient because they were in the 1v1 however their vote was on me.

This is a scum slot.

VOTE: Komodo

[Flavor Leaf]

@Xwing - I’m not really shading you. You’re just in my POE (process of elimination). I don’t have a scum case on you, nor do I think I need one. I think I’m correct with Komodo.

Nikk’s probably town based on the way Salamander was being pushed.

[Flavor Leaf]

@Roster - we mind melded. Sick. We both brought up that Komodo voting on null scum.

[Flavor Leaf]

What would people think about actually mass claiming?

No thanks

Yeah, I don’t want to that anymore, but I do dislike the anti-mass claim mind set. I’ve solved many games throughout the years from early mass claims.

I got a whole large game in Day 2 to mass claim once.

But yeah, I don’t think mass claim is best here anymore.

[Flavor Leaf]

But the wagon analysis is just so right. I mean it's the first time he's put in any effort this game, but this is good effort.

That’s kind of my style. I don’t participate much in Day 1’s unless it starts to drag on or I get in some kind of 1v1.

One of the newbies I had literally even hard town meta’d me because I tend to come in, then lurk out most of Day 1. Then I come back for Day 2 and onward with a big presence.

[Flavor Leaf]

But the wagon analysis is just so right. I mean it's the first time he's put in any effort this game, but this is good effort.

Also, I didn’t really have anything to offer Day 1. I wasn’t sure with my reads, and I was kind of just absorbing everything. Once we got some flips, I was ready to go.

[Flavor Leaf]

viewtopic.php?p=10627495#p10627495

I actually just finished a large normal game where I did nothing, but coast on my Innocent Child role until the last couple of days, then I used wagonomics to catch the last 2 scum prior to any of their flips. The first one was being nearly universal town read too.

[Flavor Leaf]

I don't see much TownPosting™ from Flavor

Actually, that might be a reason to town read me in itself.

[Flavor Leaf]

Yeah, Komodo’s scum, Nauci. I’m pretty confident in that.

[Flavor Leaf]

I don't see much TownPosting™ from Flavor

Actually, that might be a reason to town read me in itself.

That's literally what the rest of that post said

Ah, I can see that. I didn’t see that as the same thing, but I see.

[Flavor Leaf]

I kind of just decide on the fly how I want to play. No real plans ever. Apparently I play drastically different on each of my accounts, though.

[Flavor Leaf]

You rolecop?

[Flavor Leaf]

And I’m so sorry

[Flavor Leaf]

Komoooooooodoooooooo

where aaarre yoooouuuu

And I’m so sorry

I cannot sleep. I cannot dream tonight.

[Flavor Leaf]

Woah, I have a wagon on me.

[Flavor Leaf]

If I was scum, Vivit does not get lynched yesterday. I’ve literally lost one scum game in the past two years.

[Flavor Leaf]

How do those posts contradict each other, Komodo?

I don’t participate in Day 1’s much unless something catches my eye. I will post a lot, but I’ll lurk out a lot. Just because I come in and post a lot then go for a while doesn’t mean either of those are incorrect.

So that’s one flawed case, but I like that you tried to put it together.

I also explained very fluidly about my newbie games being different than my regular games because Nauci hasn’t seen my newbie games.

I’m still Flavor posting in it. I have plenty of newbie games to back up what i said anyways.

This is yet another try hard defense case of me.

Also, “I don’t trust his style of posting.” Well, great. Good thing you don’t have to worry about my alignment, though. You were actively just looking for a mislynch not a scum read, and “my style of posting isn’t trusting”. Great. That’s a mislynch case, not a scum case.


The fact that it convinced Pvurist is laughable because every single point Komodo made is incorrect.

[Flavor Leaf]

@Nauci - Komodo’s literally just scum. And everyone else is kind of obv town, so going after me made the most sense. However, the cases aren’t strong because it’s a forced case.
Like, I get why Komodo’s making the cases, it’s just always going to be able to be taken apart by people who aren’t even me.

[Flavor Leaf]

Roster, Nikk, and Nauci are all 100% town in my book for reasons stated already, and by obvious town agenda.

Pvurist is like 95% town based on Vivit vs Pvurist, but that “I’m convinced” line to the weak reasonings that if you just look over is obviously a flawed case opens the 5% up.

Xwing I haven’t really looked into much, tbh, but nothing shouts scum to me like with Komodo.

[Flavor Leaf]

If Xwing was scum, Komodo would be going down by now. Or at this point, I’d be going down.

[Flavor Leaf]

I would claim a PR as scum in Komodo’s situation, tbh.

[Flavor Leaf]

Which is semi why I wanted to mass claim today, because scum going down claims a PR. Especially if we’re in the third column.

[Flavor Leaf]

dont talk about how people will claim and stuff, you're giving them ideas on how to best manipulate the game state..let the claimer claim with as little info as possible on what your thoughts are..share your thoughts after the claim..
so statements from roster and FL earn a frown from me..
im fine with mass claim, but komodo claims first..

Yeah, Komodo claims first, obviously, haha.

L-1 Komodo, it’s claim time.

[Flavor Leaf]

Xwing is town because scumxwing could have just went on my wagon, and then that would further a TvT Komodo/FL double mislynch path.

Pvurist is the only one who can be scum at this point if Komodo isn’t, tbh.

[Flavor Leaf]

But Occam’s Razor, it’s just Komodo.

[Flavor Leaf]

Xwing is town because scumxwing could have just went on my wagon, and then that would further a TvT Komodo/FL double mislynch path.

Pvurist is the only one who can be scum at this point if Komodo isn’t, tbh.

Eh

The way it was left kinda open keeps him in the 5% what if Komodo isn't scum pool for me

Fair, I could see it. The shading of Roster/Myself makes sense in the way.

[Flavor Leaf]

The Roster/Nauci/FL town block is pretty solid, though.

I can’t see either of you as scum at all at this point.

[Flavor Leaf]

It doesn’t matter if I’m not overly town read. I see Nauci and myself as basically a masonry at this point.

And even if Roster doesn’t fully trust me, I will never lynch him and would defend him if he got pushed.

Tip I learned as town: You don’t need the entire game to town read you, you just need a couple good buddies to help you along.

Town finding other town and working together is just as important as scum hunting.

[Flavor Leaf]

I agree with you, Xwing, it’s why I jumped the gun with calling you near lock town.

I do think the game just ends with Komodo lynch, though.

[Flavor Leaf]

Oh, Nikk is hard town to me too

[Flavor Leaf]

Because of his content or the counter associations?

Based on the attitude and play towards Salamander.

[Flavor Leaf]

Yeah, I’m town reading Nikk based on how people and Vivit were going at Salamander

[Flavor Leaf]

Just because you don’t like them doesn’t mean it’s not coming from town me.

[Flavor Leaf]

Woo!! Good game, everyone! I’ll post my thoughts about it when I get home tomorrow.

[Flavor Leaf]

Oh wow. Nauci, you investigated me hard, huh?

[Flavor Leaf]

I thought about that being a thing, but at the same time, I wanted to believe you actually had that strong a town read on me.