DEFCON Mafia 5.0: GAME OVER - NEW AMERICA FORMED

[Cephrir]

VOTE: total war

i actually don't fully understand the pros and cons but it appears that this vote doesn't matter anyway

[Cephrir]

The only thing I have to say at this point is DONT NUKE RANDOM PEOPLE

Removed mod impersonation

For transparency - this was a faked nuke message. Don't do that - fake nukes are expressly prohibited.

[Cephrir]

-

Gonna say you probably shouldn't do this.

-S

eh, ur right. sorry

[Cephrir]

the dumbass is strong with this one

[Cephrir]

awkward simulpost, was trying 2 burn myself

[Cephrir]

pls don't out me as town i want to survive until the nuke part

[Cephrir]

ah, mastina is scum. unfortunate.

[Cephrir]

"deep-city-lights" is actually a really good username and i'm feelin some kinda way just thinking about it

[Cephrir]

[quote="In post 116, Save The Dragons"][/quote]
welcome to mastina, i'm afraid

[Cephrir]

quote tag why have you betrayed me

[Cephrir]

ceph scum for not knowing how to quote?

СЛАВА-- err, i mean, quotes are communist propaganda, a true patriot wouldn't need to worry about the "record" or "truth"

[Cephrir]

wait you guys have red blood? sus imo.

[Cephrir]

Pooky is self-evidently a TRUE PATRIOT with love of COUNTRY AND GOD above all. He radiates town with every iota of his posting. I realize that I've yet to see a proper Pooky scumgame (I might've seen it once in a hydra? Not sure, would need to check my memory, if I did he was underwhelming but it's possible I haven't seen Pooky-scum before), so I realize that he's apparently pretty damn good at it...but he's doing everything to just be. Town. Through and through. He's just radiating, oozing, town. To borrow his own words, he bleeds red white and blue with his very essence. He's got that energy, that aura, radiating town from him in a way that just, I don't see how that's ever scum.

you were doing so much better last game, it's unfortunate that we've gone back to this

[Cephrir]

VOTE: TOTAL WAR

I have no idea what I'm doing.

THIS MUST BE A TOWN

AMERICANS DO NOT NEED TO KNOW ANYTHING

Knowledge comes from books which are well known to be marxist propaganda

I feel good about Cephrir town, at first I was like nah, but then when I saw him react to Gorilla and I was like, yeh.

This is referring to 90?

-S

86, 90. I might have misinterpreted on 86, I interpreted it as Cephrir calling gorilla a dumb ass which is the same sort of pattern that my initial reaction to Gorilla is.
But also, I caution myself, sometimes we just accidentally slap someone down as VI, instead of scum, which makes us the VI.

U did misinterpret it but also hello congrats on rolling town

[Cephrir]

We know where the nuke button is

What else could we need to know?

[Cephrir]

I'm upset my vibe squad is not in this game

[Cephrir]

That's the regular squad not the vibe squad

It is sad tho. I assume cabd knows he would be nuked immediately.

[Cephrir]

i think there is some benefit to not outing the submarine immediately -- since they won't be openly nuking, it makes them look like a power role

i think there are definitely a few troops that are worth taking just to make sure someone has them. there are also a few i think are pretty much worthless.

[Cephrir]

i guess ill just get into it, at the risk of maybe giving some insight into my draft selections

I think these roles are worth drafting:
Espionage
Aircraft Carrier
Battleship
Submarine

I think these roles are good to keep out of scum hands, but do very little for town:
Fighter
Radar
Counterintelligence, I guess

I think these roles are just bad:
Covert Ops Team
Eavesdropper?
Fallout Shelter
Strategic Missile Defense

I think this role may be good to keep out of SK hands? but maybe it's not horrible for town either?:
Air Base

Not sure:
Fail Safe

[Cephrir]

my intuition is that the threat of an eavesdropper potentially existing gives 100% of the utility actually having one does most of the time.

[Cephrir]

Fallout shelter is a scum claim.

yeah, and i think scum won't take it for that reason, hence just bad

[Cephrir]

There are anti hydra people in this game??

[Cephrir]

folks, after further research i have learned that not only are troop drafts based on whoever PMs the mod first in defcon 4, but defcon 4 itself starts not when deadline is reached / when defcon 5 is hammered, but rather when the mod posts that it is defcon 4

:/

[Cephrir]

Joqiza is maybe confirmed town for posting this at least

[Cephrir]

After all, you can't just lie about being an alt on the internet.

[Cephrir]

I'm seriously considering just putting in my signature " but I could be wrong" to save myself the trouble of communicating this every post.

Mood.

[Cephrir]

I can foresee a great number of problems with this draft method

[Cephrir]

Am I missing something that makes fighter good

[Cephrir]

Telling scum who the air base is seems pretty bad but ok

[Cephrir]

The optimal choice was actually for no one to post for a day but I didnt think of that until a few hours ago

[Cephrir]

The optimal choice was actually for no one to post for a day but I didnt think of that until a few hours ago

Yea, this. Scum are going to be looking to PR hunt from time stamps.

Also, Sunday morning? Cmon!

I guess I wanted a silo anyway, but only sorta.

Protective roles take note. TIA

[Cephrir]

I kind of think if et al were scum they would have observed that their current tack is not working and done something g else

[Cephrir]

sad that i'm not seeing a wife option in the troops...
HI CEPHRIR IM ALSO SEATTLE-ISH!!!

0:
Good choice!

[Cephrir]

Seduce me with posts that make uninteresting observations on probability uwu

There is probably 1 scum in the last 4 players on the player list

[Cephrir]

This feels like a rather flippant and reductive dismissal of my reasoning.

i was responding to 721

[Cephrir]

I wonder what mastina's reads are. If only there were some way to find out.

[Cephrir]

huh

i guess this setup means bussing kinda sucks

Yeah I think so

Lowkey, putting aside any changes the new method of role distribution may fuck it up, I think this setup is pretty townsided

[Cephrir]

Scum with roles almost can't endgame

I think we were right to go mostly nukes in the last one

[Cephrir]

so?

[Cephrir]

I AM

NOT

A

NGRY AT YOU

B

TW I AM JUST STUCK ON ALL CAPS B

E

CAUSE I H

A

VE TO PROVE MY PINKIE IS AN AME

R

ICAN PINKIE THAT DOES NOT GET SORE FROM HOLDING DOWN THE SHIFT KEY

[Cephrir]

i don't think pooky has posted anything alignment indicative but i would like him to continue to be alive anyway because he's entertaining

[Cephrir]

I would attempt to impress the EM people with my account number if I could still find out what it was

[Cephrir]

Let me summarize for you

Joqiza: hi, I'm town
Pooky, nexus, and someone else I bet: et al is scum
Et al: nuh uh
LLD, probably some other people: mastina is scum
Mastina: Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent, a new nation, conceived in Liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal.

Now we are engaged in a great civil war, testing whether that nation, or any nation so conceived and so dedicated, can long endure. We are met on a great battle-field of that war. We have come to dedicate a portion of that field, as a final resting place for those who here gave their lives that that nation might live. It is altogether fitting and proper that we should do this.

But, in a larger sense, we can not dedicate -- we can not consecrate -- we can not hallow -- this ground. The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract. The world will little note, nor long remember what we say here, but it can never forget what they did here. It is for us the living, rather, to be dedicated here to the unfinished work which they who fought here have thus far so nobly advanced. It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us -- that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion -- that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain -- that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom -- and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.

[Cephrir]

Also Cephrir we are damn well going to hallow this ground, just you watch!

I'm unsure what this means but am inspired anyway!

VOTE: church

[Cephrir]

VOTE: mastina

was thinking about doing this anyway

[Cephrir]

Like I literally don't care about your personal scumreads. Nuke them. Or did you cowards take roles instead.

Unamerican I swear.

But Mastina dying is a game health check and will inform us a lot about these people who really don't eant her dead.

So yeah. Mastina today. No substitutes.

i would feel better if you pretended to think she's scum tho

[Cephrir]

i don't know why you're trying to call mastina scum for playstyle when she is actually a little scummy imo for her content

also please let's not all claim before the game even starts thanks!

[Cephrir]

okay, i have no problem with that then

[Cephrir]

If mastina flips town I think Cephrir has a chance for scum.

Why?

The way he voted and already trying to add focus on LLD being the main pusher ready to shift blame tomorrow.

how about you attack me for shifting blame when i shift blame and not because your crystal ball predicts it

[Cephrir]

yeah that church vote was getting a lot of traction idk why i jumped ship so fast especially given my airtight argument for them being scum

[Cephrir]

oh, i actually didn't mean that vote as a joke, i have some mild heebie jeebies from church but have absolutely no reasoning for it whatsoever

[Cephrir]

If ur ok w/ mastina being scum vote it.

I refuse to ever vote here.

?????????

[Cephrir]

oh, i actually didn't mean that vote as a joke, i have some mild heebie jeebies from church but have absolutely no reasoning for it whatsoever

Oh really? Read as a joke cause DV seemed so... Not serious. I will need to read context.

this is gonna sound dumb but for me there was 0 connection between my response to dv and my vote although i see why it looks that way now

[Cephrir]

[Cephrir]

UNVOTE:

i know, i know, but i want a claim first

[Cephrir]

never mind, i decided i don't care

VOTE: mastina

[Cephrir]

eavesdropper here guys. mafia said they like big butts? not really sure what to make of this, would really appreciate some help. more at 11.

oh sick that narrows it down to *checks notes* pretty much everyone

[Cephrir]

also this is an opensetup so i really don't care what mastina claims, lol. she'll 100% tell the truth because why wouldn't she

i was briefly considering that i might not elim her if she claimed certain roles and then i took a step back and realized actually i definitely would

[Cephrir]

i hate myself but i don't really want to end the day without giving people a chance to even post not necessarily mastina but others who haven't checked in yet

UNVOTE: mastina

won't anybody think of the children? specifically, nuking them?

[Cephrir]

[Cephrir]

you're supposed to vote for total war but nooooooo we had to tryyyyyy

[Cephrir]

i think you'll find my summary in 1054 to be essentially a documentary

[Cephrir]

What if Lady Lambdadelta is committing vehicular manslaughter over her buddy Mastina?

also marry is probably scum

welcome to my wavelength

I don’t think LLD would attack two buddies and not mention any Americans. That’s very newbieesque. She doesn’t seem like a newbie. Probably LLD and Marry opposing alignments or both Americans.

what would be newbieesque is caring about something like this

[Cephrir]

oh sick that narrows it down to *checks notes* pretty much everyone

this is probably a > rand response to come from someone who knows it's false

not that it's unlikely to come from town but it's about what I would expect from scum

-S

Where the fuck are you getting this from my response to a shitpost????

Like some points about mognet. The thing titus brought up was something g that really jumped out at me as strange, though I'm not sure if its scummy. They went from asking for a scumgame to acting like the scumgame was some sort of impenetrable UFO when one was provided... why ask if you didnt want to read it?

[Cephrir]

Every game I have been provided you have either pushed or suggested Mastina sucks.

I think it's important to note there is a world of difference between these two things

[Cephrir]

Once LLD and Church Kupo poked at me, then you piled on with “One thing I didn’t like...” this is a common scum ploy. You aren’t calling me scummy like LLD and Church are. You’re saying you don’t like it.

I think you know perfectly well what "not liking it" means. If you claim you don't, then I will point out that "common scum ploy" also isnt calling titus scummy. You seem quite interested in ~what scum commonly do~. I'm more interested in what they are actually doing, here, today

[Cephrir]

Me not liking something =/= scum necessarily. It's me seeking feedback.

Oh

Uh, ok, my bad apparently??

[Cephrir]

Sorry you’re depressed but I think with a qualifier like necessarily you’re scum. You’re wanting people to post about me negatively.

What?????????????????

[Cephrir]

If they always think someone is scum/bad, it turns into the lady who cried scum.

It’s meaningless.

Badness is a persistent quality

[Cephrir]

Again LLD thought in both those games Mastina was antitown. She has not had a game (or had one shared) in which she notices the good in Mastina. I think you’re not understanding my point here Pooky. She always thinks Mastina is bad, bad town or bad scum. So she’s more inclined to want to yeet Mastina which makes her biased.

EXCEPT SHE LITERALLY DIDNT WANT TO YEET MASTINA D1 IN EITHER GAME I LINKED SO WHERE ARE YOU COMING UP WITH THIS SHE ALWAYS WANTS TO YEET MASTINA NONSENSE FROM

She did. She asked MathBlade to vote Mastina in D1 on Warehouse 13.
In the other game she says to invert the reads which means she views Mastina as a liability to town which is an inherent want to be gone.

So yes she always wants to yeet Mastina

[Cephrir]

In the other game I have stated this numerous times. She wanted Mastina’s reads list inverted.

This still isn't the same as seeking an elim. I can't tell if you have an agenda to discredit LLD here or just can't admit that your point sucks

[Cephrir]

In the other game I have stated this numerous times. She wanted Mastina’s reads list inverted.

This still isn't the same as seeking an elim. I can't tell if you have an agenda to discredit LLD here or just can't admit that your point sucks

It’s a bias is my point. I legit don’t get how you don’t see this.

If you think a player is bad you’re gonna see bad everywhere
If you think a player is good you’re gonna think their farts don’t stink.

You've repeatedly stated that LLD wants to eliminate mastina in every game. I don't think your argument supports this claim.

[Cephrir]

i wonder if this is the first ever game on mafiascum where mastina has been discussed by others more than she has talked about herself

[Cephrir]

Yeah that's just straight up wrong but ok

[Cephrir]

huh, really? i checked to see if she was posting elsewhere and thought she wasn't?

pedit hi the entity

[Cephrir]

i predict a scum flip

[Cephrir]

Does anyone have beer in a gif?

I need to chill out because people should have at minimum evaluated why no counter wagon.

no I do not because I am a real american who believes in restoring the 18th amendment

but also people were pretty much set on mastina before votes were a thing, I think mafia resigned themselves to that if mastina was mafia

idk i honestly thought et al was going to be a big wagon today and i'm surprised it didn't materialize

[Cephrir]

whoever did this is a monster

[Cephrir]

Mognets are Moogles thank you very much.

Btw prism submitted a list and got ninth priority and put silos last.

So there are actually very few nukes in the game.

Since I will be afk most of the weekend and likely will get exploded by angry Kupos wanted that out there.

please stop claiming for no reason

[Cephrir]

nah

[Cephrir]

her main utility to scum was served by confirming to them that there was no town eavesdropper.

Let's just say I am the town mirror version of this kind of thinking.

you just claimed. great job.

[Cephrir]

her main utility to scum was served by confirming to them that there was no town eavesdropper.

Let's just say I am the town mirror version of this kind of thinking.

you just claimed. great job.

No he didn’t smiley face Kupo (A)

You gained amnesia

Wanna share reads?

eh. i have a few reads, but most of the game is still in my unknown pile.

[Cephrir]

There is only death!
VOTE: DeasVail

I don't particularly like mastina right now but I think this might be the better lim.

VOTE: Vaxkiller

Silent vote from a player who hasn't done anything all game on to a townread of mine.
Hmm...

VOTE: mastina
I'm good with this, but would prefer something else.

To the end of looking for scum in mastina voters: I think this is a good place to start.

VOTE: T3

oh yeah i forgot about this scumbucket

VOTE: T3

[Cephrir]

Naw, T3's playing just like he did last game. Hes good.

oh gosh im so sorry my bad [fakeunvote][/fakeunvote]

[Cephrir]

mognet my dude you are cruising for being suplexed into the sun like it's your job. i don't even think you're scum but someone is going to nuke you this game.

[Cephrir]

i'd just like to take credit for being the second person to call mastina scum. a shame gorilla beat me to it

[Cephrir]

Votecount 2.1

T3 (3) - gorilla, Cephrir, Bell
marry (2) - VFP, Robert M Hunter
Bell (1) - Mognet
Et Al (1) - Nexus
VFP (1) - T3

Not Voting [14] - DeasVail, Koto, DeathNote, joqiza, Et Al, Save The Dragons, Vaxkiller, Lady Lambdadelta, The Church of Skitter, The Entity, Titus, marry, Toogeloo, samantha97

(expired on 2021-05-22 17:52:00) remain until day end

With 22 players alive, it takes 12 to reach a majority.

This VC is weird.

T3 says Samantha is town. Bell scum by vibe but meta town. This looks to me like a 3P read. If T3 is a Russian, then I doubt it is with Bell. T3 then says something about DV DN? I guess DV = Deas Vail but DN? What is that?

DeasVail then makes a big post poking Vax but no vote.

Then Titus doesn’t comment on any of this and just says she’s performing wagon voodoo and votes Nexus?

This moogle is very confused and thinks wagon scan says one scum in Cephrir/Bell.

Marry wagon is bad but maybe all town.

Nexus is voting Et Al and then Titus naked vote Nexus?

VOTE: Et Al

I think Titus cast a chainsaw spell unless she can explain her vote. What say you Trenchcoat Kupo?

we've evolved from vca to vca on unflipped wagons that haven't even gone to lim yet fucking nuke me

[Cephrir]

i literally cannot possibly imagine what is so strange to you about that completely normal vote count.

[Cephrir]

i read it. i have no idea what any one sentence in it has to do with any other. why does titus have to comment on any of it? i just... i don't understand how any of those sentences make anyone anything.

[Cephrir]

i feel like you're treating it like this is a micro. there's a wagon of 3 right now with 22 alive... who fucking cares?

[Cephrir]

T3 has a conflicting read on Bell. This is typical of a 3P read or a scum hunting a 3P read.

Or it's... just a conflicted townie/scum pretending to be a conflicted townie... having 3P reads in a game of this size is pure hubris

This means if T3 is not American T3 is not probably partners with Bell. Then T3 makes a mention of DeasVail for another reason. It’s confusing and unlikely to be anything but American because it’s such a scattershot/chaotic approach.

I don't agree with either part of this at all. Why can't scum have an unsure read on their partner. What is town about not playing in the straightforward manner you expect.

DeasVail after this provides a big case but no vote on Vax. It’s worth it to see where this goes.

okay

After this wealth of content, Titus interacts with none of it and votes for Nexus.

I don't care lol

She says her reasoning is obvious yet does not explain it. When pushed she says she’s fishing for reactions. This blank vote pinged me as a chainsaw because of lack of reasoning and interaction with prior content.

that's a weird reason to see something as a chainsaw

[Cephrir]

i would think titus would need to try harder if her goal was to discredit nexus' attack; also, i don't think nexus' attack looks very scary for et al right now

[Cephrir]

a naked vote with no reasoning really attached isn't going to make anyone go, "maybe i shouldn't trust nexus!"

[Cephrir]

VFP, assume Marry is scum. Why does scum Marry fake claim eavesdropper multiple times?

Well since mastina was eavesdropper , it's probable scum discussed and wanted to use it with no CC risk.
I didn't take the claims I saw as hard claim though. mastina flipping eavesdropper negates that as any argument here.

Use it?

Townslip for not knowing what the eavesdropper is??

[Cephrir]

Why is this not a chainsaw of Marry?

Is it not possible to suspect someone who has a read without chainsawing for the read?

[Cephrir]

I think that's pretty insane kupo

[Cephrir]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?ti ... aw_Defense

I don’t think so smiley face Kupo.

I think anything that fits this criteria should be pushed. Does it work always? Of course not. But by pushing I find out if it does or not.

yeah where the fuck are you getting any of that from naked votes???? i guess i'm chainsawing for titus right now too huh? maybe we can make a circle of chainsaws

[Cephrir]

And point B being it defense is rather clear as the vote happened right after Nexus pushed Et Al.

:bigredX:

[Cephrir]

this conversation is a waste of time and i am done with it

[Cephrir]

i suppose i am defending you

here, i'll even make it a chainsaw defense:

VOTE: mognet

[Cephrir]

t3/nexus both seem like fine votes to me

[Cephrir]

ya ur right i was just annoyed

VOTE: t3

[Cephrir]

I tried reasoning with you but then you said things like calling that obviously non-chainsaw vote a chainsaw and I understandably gave up

I dont appear to be alone in this

[Cephrir]

Is this your first time encountering naked votes? You sure are acting like it

[Cephrir]

VOTE: nexus

[Cephrir]

i read robert's stuff around his role as town having no idea how to play their role. i think he is claiming Counterintelligence, and i have trouble imagining scum with that role making the posts he's made. i am not locktowning it by any means but that's why i'm not looking to vote there at this moment. on the other hand, that role would be no great loss, so i will not object strenuously if we go there.

[Cephrir]

im not sure if anywhere is the place for this conversation but here definitely isn't

[Cephrir]

i don't think i ever stopped having badfeels about church but i'd still struggle to tell you why

[Cephrir]

Oh no I dont want the entity to be scum

[Cephrir]

Eh, okay. Reread VFP and I'm fine voting there.

VOTE: VFP

[Cephrir]

I'm not sure if he spewed half the game town; it seems to me the only thing he definitely admitted is that scum somehow didnt talk about their draft picks????????? Although that might lead to a similar conclusion

[Cephrir]

defcon deserves better than a 2020-21 era "oh we rolled scum let's not even try" team.

[Cephrir]

i would certainly like to think i wouldn't let my team pick roles as bad as the ones scum have flipped

pedit no bad incorrect

[Cephrir]

you know what?

VOTE: Robert

[Cephrir]

it's kind of a disgrace that we're 20 posts into this day without a nuke

[Cephrir]

well clearly i either don't have nukes or haven't decided who to blow up with them yet

[Cephrir]

im not calling you a pig its a meme hold on

[Cephrir]

hmm t3 is still alive huh

that might need to be remedied

[Cephrir]

imagine having 110 pages of game and your case being "3rd vote = scum"

[Cephrir]

i think someone's going to nuke you for being sassy, my dear

hey if scum feel like outing themselves that's on them (:

[Cephrir]

gorilla have you meta'd like everyone in this game or something?

literally

Doing a little background check on how flipped scum interacts with partners doesn't take much time. For the other stuff I'm just making snap judgments based on who seems leadery.

If you want a spicy meta nugget, though, I would say this: the kills so far point to the SK being a veteran. Not that SK hunting should be our primary concern at the moment, but keep it in mind.

i'm honestly still puzzling over who the fuck would kill et al

[Cephrir]

cephrir is in the maybe pile too because how many times in your life do you get the opportunity to nuke the ones you love

we could be a regular romeo and juliet

[Cephrir]

oh yeah why is Bell still alive wtf

i assume that he was an obvious battleship target which if anything opened the door for an otherwise impossible LLD kill

[Cephrir]

i think town players would be unwise to just use their nuke as revenge

[Cephrir]

should i just go for it or should i try to talk about it first i dunno what proper nuke etiquette is

ask yourself: What Would Pooky Do?

[Cephrir]

Launching a nuke is not a scum claim, btw.

Also, I was the initial wagon that got counter wagoned with scum so uh...yeah.

Meh. Scum haven't exactly seemed to be killing it on the proactive game control front.

i have a few thoughts: i think if someone nukes mafia, they're virtually clear right? mafia isn't going risk that at this point. theyre just gonna nuke town
also i dont really remember what we all thought about mognet and forgot innocentvillager was mognets slot. i think mognet was town for how buckwild they acted

One never knows. They're behind, maybe it's time to gambit.

Moggers might be scum.

Seems to me like Mognet is just carrying on their bollocks and expecting to persuade people into it. it's quite a mastina-style play.

We could just lim Mognet?

I think it's strange that your rationale for nuking initially had nothing to do with your own read and now you're pulling this out after the fact.

[Cephrir]

i have a few thoughts: i think if someone nukes mafia, they're virtually clear right? mafia isn't going risk that at this point. theyre just gonna nuke town
also i dont really remember what we all thought about mognet and forgot innocentvillager was mognets slot. i think mognet was town for how buckwild they acted

I've heard tales of sickos who vigged their own partner and rode the towncred to a win. But I don't think there's anyone like that in this game.

You underestimate me :p

[Cephrir]

Yeah but you have a bad read on me, Ceph, so who cares.

Thanks that's really helpful

[Cephrir]

i think that vfp vote would be a pretty lame bus

[Cephrir]

Of course you do. you're literally going to disagree with anything I'm going to say. @ceph

don't know where you got this idea

[Cephrir]

does scum even want covert ops over silo? i guess like if your buddy is a silo you can covert ops the intended target to make sure it goes through? idk, seems like id rather just take the silo

maybe mech people can figure out if this is a point in my favor or not

pedit: rip thanks cakez

they don't, but they drafted two other trash roles for them, so i don't really care

[Cephrir]

I dont think that's anything

[Cephrir]

I dont think that's anything

if ur talking to me why because when I saw those Bell posts thats what I thought happened instantly considering I don't think he's the player that usually pleads for something to die for no reason, and I think Bell would be inspired to try to push through guilties that way but doesn't have the strength as a player to do it so he got desperate and pleaded for it because things weren't going his way hoping someone would listen to him.

i mean, it was clear you were referencing something; I don't think titus has much to gain by just pretending not to get it / it seems reasonable to me that she just didn't make the connection

i guess i should let her answer though

[Cephrir]

Cephrir what do you think of IV?

although mognet was irritating, ultimately i think his play is more likely to come from town

i don't have too much of an opinion on what iv has done, but i'd wager this is a town flip

[Cephrir]

i've largely accepted that there are going to be a lot of daykills today and i can't control them all, plus et al's argument seems sound to me; i would only argue for a recall if the target was a strong townread

[Cephrir]

i think they were also saying that they shouldn't be recalled *unless* what you're talking about happens, and i don't think it has

[Cephrir]

here's a readlist because i'm procrastinating

Locktown: Bell
Town: STD, gorilla, joqiza
Townish: IV, Vax, Church, marry
IDK: Toog, Equi, DV, T3, Titus, DN
Suspects: Robert, samantha, Koto, Nexus

i don't have good explanations to back up most of this

[Cephrir]

What part?
The part about people agreeing it's obvtown?
or the part that it's obvtown?

because if it's about the part of people agreeing it's obvtown, then what do you think I'm trying to do here?

I see. Yeah, it's not hitting the obvtown threshold for me.

[Cephrir]

high expectations much?
Shouldn't it just matter if it's honest and just, not scum?

i dunno why you have a bee in your bonnet about my opinion on this matter in particular!

[Cephrir]

high expectations much?
Shouldn't it just matter if it's honest and just, not scum?

i dunno why you have a bee in your bonnet about my opinion on this matter in particular!

cuz u seem town and u seemed like a person to bounce this idea off of

ur welcome to keep trying to drum up support im not gonna fight against a recall either

[Cephrir]

Town: STD

okay this one I’m curious about

i wasn't here at day start but i've really liked the way he's been openly pondering his nuke

[Cephrir]

I am not very good at finding scum

ftfy

[Cephrir]

Do not recall IV. I dont care if he is town, do not recall, im too worried about that slot.

Who died and made you president?

UNVOTE: - feeling a bit less conviction here

[Cephrir]

I kind of want to intercept one of them but I want it to.. do something, you know?

IV might do something. I dont think the other options would.

are there specific scumteam configurations with which she could plausibly be with? she’s never aligned with entity right?

Eh. It seems to me like they have a personal issue stemming from TM and that was the problem

[Cephrir]

Regarding STD I’ve been toying with the idea that he’s been using his sense of humour to look town and convey a sense of ease when in fact he is feeling very self-conscious about what he is doing.
I’m not sure how that fits right now but I also am aware that this thought could easily point me to the wrong alignment.

The posts since my vote have been fascinating, though.

That would require me to be funny

[Cephrir]

Hm. Idk, I see a lot more objection to the IV nuke than any other right now. I do think T3 looks pretty likely town at this point as well though.

[Cephrir]

I do think T3 looks pretty likely town at this point as well though.

why?

As gorilla pointed out, his play with the fail safe has 0 scum utility

[Cephrir]

Dear Equinox,

I hope this missive finds you well. If you could spare a moment from your busy schedule undermining the bourgeoisie, I would greatly appreciate some of your input vis a vis who is scum and also why. I will send this message via carrier pidgeon in the Hope's this will make it more worthy of your esteemed attention than the game at large appears to be at this time.

Sincerely,
Cephrir

[Cephrir]

P.S. should you wish to send a return letter, my address is
A warthog
The Savannah
Like, Zambia? 700@E

[Cephrir]

An idea just came to be but this is is stoned ali so I don't know how good this is.

I think we should leave Robert alone.
If we want to, actually read this player, then I feel like the pressure of losing the game will eventually break him and make force him to play the game and post readable content.

I think this is correct, but I'm not 100% sure on it being correct.
It's based on the logic that he believes that his death will have no impact on the game. That's why he sees him dying as him getting what he wants.

In the late game if he is scum and genuinely think that this playstyle will coast him to victory, late game is going to come and he is going to be exposed in the late game. He's not someone who can win F3 unless he puts in an actual effort.

If he's town then if he wants to win in F3 he's going to have to actually, work a tiny bit, for it, or at least by the time we get here, the movements he has made would have made logical sense to come from scum.

Basically I think if it's resolve itself as the game gets smaller and it becomes more important to actually give a fuck.

Not sure how good this is or if this is any good at all or if it's just straight up bad (I also just realized I'm defending the guy who has counterintelligence so on the basis of that alone I should just be okay with this guy dying)

Because I don't want to encourage this behavior and I don't feel okay townreading it if it'll mean that he's can just go do this in his next game. Because the guy obviously needs to just learn how to play the game.

Here's the thing about Robert, and I mentioned this yesterday: he very clearly knows how to play the game. In that view his current play is inexplicable and unhelpful. I'm left in an awkward place where I'm really not comfortable with him endgaming, but also I don't want to be the one that kills him so I can have a clean conscience.

VOTE: Robert

[Cephrir]

I'm upset by how easy this is

[Cephrir]

If we get another it's robert

[Cephrir]

The VCA gods aren't real so I guess nexus has nothing to worry about

[Cephrir]

When I flip town, I hope you turn down your smug bullshit at least one iota.

No one ever does this unfortunately

[Cephrir]

The VCA gods aren't real so I guess nexus has nothing to worry about

It works for Titus and I've seen Titus destroy scumteams (me) a lot with how she approaches the game if she's able to do it. I think if Titus does whats good for Titus that's ultimately good for town. To be honest I don't remember a game where she got everything she wanted and still lost.

I'm not going to get into this

[Cephrir]

Nexus and IV can be

SvS
SvT
TvS

but not TvT

No

[Cephrir]

Dont worry, samantha is not out of the woods on this game day yet

[Cephrir]

Samantha do you have a real reason for your DV scumread that you've been harping on since page 1 yet?

I have just finished rereading your iso and I am really not impressed

[Cephrir]

I'm not being nuked or lynched today.

it kinda seems like you are

[Cephrir]

You vote for them, which ok, maybe a throw away, then you say the are probably scum.. ok maybe your not sure.

THen you say "its over for you" I would assume at this point you are scumr eading them....

But then you say they are suspect... oh ok back to not sure... oh wait add "as fuck" to that.

Very contradicotry.

Are you joking? Nexus' posts are not contradictory at all.

[Cephrir]

eh, to hell with it

@samatha claim or die.

[Cephrir]

VOTE: toogeloo

[Cephrir]

You vote for them, which ok, maybe a throw away, then you say the are probably scum.. ok maybe your not sure.

THen you say "its over for you" I would assume at this point you are scumr eading them....

But then you say they are suspect... oh ok back to not sure... oh wait add "as fuck" to that.

Very contradicotry.

Are you joking? Nexus' posts are not contradictory at all.

Vote

Probably scum

scum

probably scum

probably scum / scum

Is literally how the posts go.

Those are literally all the same thing. This might be the worst attack I've seen in a mafia game this year.

[Cephrir]

You vote for them, which ok, maybe a throw away, then you say the are probably scum.. ok maybe your not sure.

THen you say "its over for you" I would assume at this point you are scumr eading them....

But then you say they are suspect... oh ok back to not sure... oh wait add "as fuck" to that.

Very contradicotry.

Are you joking? Nexus' posts are not contradictory at all.

Vote

Probably scum

scum

probably scum

probably scum / scum

Is literally how the posts go.

Those are literally all the same thing. This might be the worst attack I've seen in a mafia game this year.

SO to you they are no varying degrees of scummy-ness and (prob scum = scum)

when someone says "x is scum" they mean "x is probably scum" not "i have seen x's role pm and know them to be scum"

[Cephrir]

has,bro

Gotta learn to not make waves.

I wanna see LLD

on board this stern

Robert push though

Et tu Ms.

who did you save last night

[Cephrir]

well those are the correct answers

[Cephrir]

i wonder if it's worth killing bell just to prove that

probably not??

[Cephrir]

Wow....

Why can't Cephrir be an option again?

All 5 of the people I am ok with dying (T3 already flipped), were on the wrong counterwagon to VFP yesterday, and oddly everyone town reads them. I broke the 5v5 tie and placed my vote in scum, and I'm the one who's in danger.

it's almost as though mafia is more than just votes! weird.

[Cephrir]

Why can't Cephrir be an option again?

pretending like I'm mafia and bussed both mastina (reasonable) and vfp (insane) makes him great from my point of view

yeah, that empty vote on vfp and little to no other commentary on him couldn't possibly come from scum!

and i wouldn't even call your mastina stance bussing as you were against her elim for a while

[Cephrir]

btw what part of claim or die was confusing to you sam

[Cephrir]

i don't think i can make myself any clearer

[Cephrir]

@std, joqiza, gorilla, bell please lmk if you object to this line, i don't really care what anyone else thinks

[Cephrir]

i will probably wait for nexus to flip, i guess

[Cephrir]

cephrir let me tell you a secret

there is no universe in which I will ever help a mafia wagon grow as mafia, unless that person is just doomed

it's so illogical to me that it's a borderline trust tell lol

i don't care about this

[Cephrir]

The problem with the scum bussing theory is two fold

1) Why would scum bus after just losing mastina?
2) Who's the busser? It's not Bell or gorilla. If we buy Toog's claim it's not Toog. So that leaves Nexus or Samantha. Nexus bussing in an S v S scenario makes some sense. Sam bussing might be true, but we get into the question of why?

Vaxkiller is a spot I waffle on by play, but I think he's just too out there to be scum.

wait, wasn't your whole reason for nuking nexus that you don't think scum were bussing that day, when in fact nexus would have to be bussing?

[Cephrir]

cephrir let me tell you a secret

there is no universe in which I will ever help a mafia wagon grow as mafia, unless that person is just doomed

it's so illogical to me that it's a borderline trust tell lol

i don't care about this

you still haven't claimed or provided a believable reason for your dv read and i'm finding that quite irritating

[Cephrir]

i don't care if i agree either i am trying to understand your thought process in order to discern your alignment and you refuse to help me here at all

[Cephrir]

even if dv is scum that case sucks ass and i struggle to believe that has had more impact on you than anything else that's happened all game, such as more dv posts you could use to further evaluate this feeling

[Cephrir]

The problem with the scum bussing theory is two fold

1) Why would scum bus after just losing mastina?
2) Who's the busser? It's not Bell or gorilla. If we buy Toog's claim it's not Toog. So that leaves Nexus or Samantha. Nexus bussing in an S v S scenario makes some sense. Sam bussing might be true, but we get into the question of why?

Vaxkiller is a spot I waffle on by play, but I think he's just too out there to be scum.

wait, wasn't your whole reason for nuking nexus that you don't think scum were bussing that day, when in fact nexus would have to be bussing?

Bullshit VCA bullshit I imagine.

Justifying bad reads with terrible logic. The Titus special.

Can you stop trying to make things personal and just play the game? Mognet did the same thing too and it makes the game less enjoyable.

did you mean to respond to my post or something? i don't think you're trying to insinuate that it was a personal attack since it, isn't

[Cephrir]

i also am suffering from a lack of options

in particular with your strong townread on titus there is now like no one in the game that isn't get a strong TR from somewhere

[Cephrir]

since i'm essentially out now, i wrote 3116 because i wanted to nuke equinox but then he tried in response and that made me feel bad about doing it

[Cephrir]

i'm not sure i get that, but i'm admittedly not looking for the terrorist and tbh have no idea how i would go about looking for one

[Cephrir]

does that apply in this game where the mafia team is getting dunked on and there are a lot of bleeding town players

i feel like the terrorist should just be looking as town as possible here

[Cephrir]

i would not be pursuing that strategy at this point if i were them so it's possible the actual terrorist subscribes more to my viewpoint too

i think the terrorist needs town to be busy looking for the mafia for as long as possible and they should side with whoever's losing

[Cephrir]

i mean sure but i could call gorilla the terrorist with the same logic

[Cephrir]

i guess if i were looking for someone playing the way i would want to play 3p i'd look for someone who was hiding early on but may have been trying to town it up more recently as the scumteam have been doing worse

but i don't know that seems like a pretty iffy thing to pin all my hunting on

and like, everyone is different; if i were 3p i'd still make lots of posts because that's just how i play this game

[Cephrir]

Nope can't encourage this this is how village loses.

yeah, i don't think it's worth dwelling on right now

[Cephrir]

I read Sam's stubbornness in sticking with their scumread on me without any additional reasoning (which would be very easy to make up as scum) despite ongoing pressure regarding this, to be town.

I do too but I really wish I didnt

[Cephrir]

So glad we wasted a check on my obvtown ass.

I thought samantha was maybe being stubborn because she was the cop, and now that I know that not to be the case I'm not sure I want them to continue being alive

[Cephrir]

Why would they know your role?

[Cephrir]

airbase can be confirmed through role failure

sure, but what role failure?

[Cephrir]

like there are 2 mafia left and one of them according to you is DV whose role has nothing to do with that... ???

ngl i think swiping the airbase from bell is a very terroristy move and with that atop my scumread and your earlier refusal to claim, uh, yeah

[Cephrir]

my nuke pool is dv/sam/titus/equi maybe marry if someone really sold me well. that's also the pool of who i'd like investigated.

i don't see why we would want to not nuke a Fighter claim, it doesn't do anything

[Cephrir]

Cephrir are you still thinking of nuking Sam?
I have no reason to leave this player alive tbh, too many townreads

nothing has changed for me since 3713

you're welcome to take it if you like

[Cephrir]

i'm just being cowardly and indecisive

[Cephrir]

i can come up with reasons for everyone to be town

[Cephrir]

how exactly did i end up in your russian POE anyway Toogeloo

Nuking Koto doesn't really buy that many town points, sadly. I remember disliking some of your earlier posts from DC5-3, but can't really be bothered to go find them right now.

i don't think std nukes his buddy out of nowhere with no trajectory on the slot. that just doesn't make sense to me

[Cephrir]

nuke sam

[Cephrir]

PEdit: if your buddy is gonna get nuked more than likely anyways, why not try to earn a little town cred for it?

right, that's why i think he'd have created a trajectory on koto instead of what looked a bit like a lolnuke

[Cephrir]

{Titus, Bell, Toogeloo, Joqiza, IV, marry, Vaxkiller}
{Cephrir, Gorilla}
{DeasVail}
{Equinox, STD}

Wow Johnny's best nuke is STD if we're going by my reads is this how desperate we are what the fuck

yeah i still think it's insane that reads are coming above nuking scum and i'm like, the king of ignoring mech