Surreptitious II: Secrets and Misdirection

[Toto]

Hay

[Toto]

Why are we not lynching group B? It has highest concentration of scum no?

[Toto]

ANSWER MY QUESTION

[Toto]

I can't have a partner cause I'm town, what's a secret agent though?

[Toto]

K, I guess I'm going to start with the fat boy's ISO

[Toto]

Chess

your ISO is full of shitposts. Is anyone town reading Chess, if so, why?

[Toto]

I'm not mad though. You asked me a tricky question that no one could answer in not an uncomfortable way and you are trying to get me mislynched for it. Scum are know for making big deals out of small things -- it's an olde scum trick.

I see your ISO has shitload of posts with not a single one with a decent case on it, or a single town tell (to be fair I have not read all of them yet, hence my question).

Come, 1v1 me.

[Toto]

Nice try to change the subject.

This is the one where I tell you why you are scum and you get lynched.

[Toto]

Post at page to reads like you know I'm town. Same as your previous previous post.

You went from 'having caught scum' to 'shit I need to deal with a guy with a deathwish now'.

[Toto]

Also transcend are u gonna comment on Ginngie reply or is there no peripheral vision in the checkersman7 tunnel

Reads like you know Transcend is town.

[Toto]

Nah

VOTE: C

[Toto]

What's that?

And what are your reads?

[Toto]

Also can someone make like an nice summary of what has happened so far?

[Toto]

(I'm reading but will take a while)

[Toto]

Yeah, lets discuss Toto cause I think he is town guys

[Toto]

Let's see a case on me.

[Toto]

What sucks about my tone, what was scummy about my predecessor?

That's not a case.

In the event you are actually town please reconsider your read because it sucks.

p-edit. I'm catching up, but I read people better when I interact with them

[Toto]

I have a question. If we lynch in B and myslynch do we lose? It's 3tv2s rn so would be 1tv2s in that case but town still have a living member, correct? (as in, the last town won't be 'endgamed')?

[Toto]

I was kind of townreading you early until you called Alisae's replace out fake. Why did you find it fake?

[Toto]

So he rage quitted because you had them pinned down? Is that how scum usually react when you pin them down as town?

My problem is that, as you say, you are more of a gut based scum-hunter, and usually you can read emotions well, and that post from Alisae was towntelling to me really hard, and the fact that you didn't adapt your read after that makes me think you are scum.

[Toto]

Is that how scum usually react when you pin them down as town?

[Toto]

You didn't answer ^^

[Toto]

I want to lynch thor but he is in group b.

I get now why lynching in b is bad. If we mislynch there we can’t lynch again until we merge groups.

Transcend tunnel on my slot is probably coming from scum. He is not really trying to sort me out. Fat boy looks more townie after readthrough.

[Toto]

Yeah we shoukd be lynching most likely scum. Im om with thor or transcend and c seems safer now.

What are your reads creature?

@ luv whats your read on transcend (and why)

[Toto]

I want to lynch thor but he is in group b.

I get now why lynching in b is bad. If we mislynch there we can’t lynch again until we merge groups.

Transcend tunnel on my slot is probably coming from scum. He is not really trying to sort me out. Fat boy looks more townie after readthrough.

Cry more.

Wut? Why would you say that if you think Im scum?

[Toto]

Your tunnel feels fake bud.

Same crap as ‘alisae replaced out because he was scum and I was tunneling them’

You are pretending to be tunneling your ‘gut reads’ because that is what you do in your town games but here feels forced. Like I said. You are not adapting.

[Toto]

There is no way you can spin "discredit anyone calling me scum and I'm not going to do anything about the shitty gamestate" as a pro-town behavior.

right, i'm supposed to somehow fix everyone's posting habits???

what the fuck are you even talking about

You engage other people about reads, explain why you scumread/townread someone.

You need to play a Newbie game or something so you understand these concepts or?

Yeah, please explain reads.

This is to everyone here btw. Without this we lose the ability to judge whether said reads are believable or not.

Newbie refresher:


1) do they have reads?
2) do they look like real reads?
3) are they changing their reads based on new information?
4) are they pushing their reads in a believable way?

This is how you mafia and you are all failing at it. We are going to get owned if you guys dont stop shitposting.

I already gave you more explanations for my reads than I have seen from any of you after 90 pages. Please return the favor.

I know you guys have big egos but the current interactions are doing very little to help sort people out.

Desperado. Who is your top scum/town read and why? Please explain in as much detail as possible.

You complain about the game state which i sympathize with but you are not doing anything differently.

[Toto]

Yes, and you were.

Fwiw I didnt read you clarified your question when I replaced in and it sounded like a trick question. Also read the game and you have been the most active and been very agressive so Im mostly fine with it for now.

This is not a hard townread, btw. I still have a hard time following your reasoning and your pushes. But im fine to drop the issue. If you are town try to give better explanations for your reads. You dont catch scum with stupid questions.

[Toto]

Toto your partner claimed secret agent is that correct?

[Toto]

I fail to follow your logic

[Toto]

I had not read the all the rules. Im not sure what is your point

[Toto]

Your question is sort of role fishy now that I think about it

[Toto]

I didnt? I voted you for it. Except I misread the question

[Toto]

When I was looking at what happened to prs and why were not voting group b. Some time after that exchange.

What thouht process did I fail to follow? I already explain why I voted you and why I changed my mind in more words that yoi have used to describe your scum read of my slot. What part of it is not satisfactory?

[Toto]

Yes, more or less. And where is the scum thought process in any of my actions because Im pretty sure im town

[Toto]

Im a vt who had not read the game or setup, realized you were asking scummy questions pushed you for it, went and read the game realized you were not as scummy as I originally thought, found transcend to be more scummy than I originally thought, re read our exchage, realized there was a more plausible town motivation for your question. Tried to make piece, realized the full implications of your question.

Now here is a question for you. Why didnt you clarify the question when I answered the wrong one?

[Toto]

Sigh. If anything you should be thinking scum would be more careful about the setup.

You are either confbias or scum pushing a stupid case. Which one is it?

[Toto]

Toto WHY did you claim?

I got rolefished. See, Ill explain, where is the town motivation in getting rolefished?

Its not like there is scum motivation in asking rolefishing questions. We should lynch the rolfishee regardless of what they repond.

#sarcasm

[Toto]

K

VOTE: b

[Toto]

Thor is scum

[Toto]

Im lynching Thor unless you have a better option. Like everyone is saying Thor is scum but no one is trying to lynch him. Why do you think that is?

[Toto]

So Eli is pretty scummy to be honest. Look at all the effort she just put to tell us how much effort she is putting

[Toto]

If we are not lynching thor and group c is not hammered im ok with eli.

[Toto]

Sup

[Toto]

@mod vote count looks wrong. T&r are voting twice and should add up to 6(now 7)

[Toto]

Dog

[Toto]

This has been a great discussion

[Toto]

I already had. Specially since checkers made it really obvious I didnt know what a secret agent was. The better question is why checkers is asking those questions

[Toto]

Why do you ask if you dont care

[Toto]

Cause he is balantly rolefishing and he stikes me as the type that does that type of shit as scum

[Toto]

Why not? Explain why scum!checkers would not do that?

Dont give me the usual scum generally dont try to call att to themselves bs unless you have evidence or experience based on his scumplay?

Is he shy scum, tricky/cheeky scum or idgaf scum?

@transcend ^^^

[Toto]

Bulb= zak = zaklstrasa?

[Toto]

Bulb= zak = zaklstrasa?

I don't even know what you're saying there.

I thought you were someone else

[Toto]

Yeah I cant spell that so I write random letters but usually works

[Toto]

Eli. My problem with you is you have spent two weeks doing meta dives on fucking assemble. And then all you have talked about is how you do meta and showing (as in theatrical performance) how you are doing those meta dives.

What reads do you have other than assemble?

[Toto]

VOTE: a

[Toto]

Like seriously if you are town you need to engage me. I dont understand your attitude. Whats so funny about my post?

@eli^

[Toto]

Her only conclusion that ive seen is assembe is scum because of <insert random meta reasons>

I understand you like meta but my problem is that her only read is on a easy to mislymch slot that has not been here, and has been tunneled on that slot for the whole game. Meta is a good place for scum to hide as it is sort of objective analysis. It is easier to talk about game theory and objective facts than provide believable gut reads as scum.

[Toto]

Alisae was town 100%

[Toto]

Meta homework: find a scum rage quitting beause they are being tunneled and quit the game calling everyone bad

[Toto]

We are not lynching alisae slot. Im sorry you cant see that simple fact. Scum dont rage quit like they did.

[Toto]

K. Prove it. Find a game where scum rage quits like that. Scum rage quit for other reasons. This is not one of them.

I can show you 4 games where I replaced into similar slots. They were all town.

[Toto]

Those are obviously fake. You guys need to git gud at reading emtions.

[Toto]

You need to learn how to play as scum.

This feels like a fake post.

[Toto]

Fuck I feel really fucking good right now

Fake

Which group are you in?

[Toto]

VOTE: c

[Toto]

It doesnt add up. I dunnoh. Just gut. Sorry I caugt you?

[Toto]

It felt ackward. You were talking to me like Im town and then told me I have to get better at scum. So that felt fake.

Also your “happy” moment. I get that you would feel good about thinking you won the argument but it felt forced

[Toto]

Im not trying to convince you to vote yourself.

[Toto]

There is scum motivation in pretending to have town emotions or emotive town reactions (fake town tell) and is up for us to judge if they are real or not.

This is how I read people. Im sorry you got caught for reasons you consider unworthy of your superior play. ( yes scum have emotions too)

[Toto]

By the way what you are doing is omgusing me in its true form

[Toto]

By the way what you are doing is omgusing me in its true form

Prove it with time stamps

Wut?

You are very angry because I caught you for bad reasons.

[Toto]

VOTE: gin

Ok

Nope YOU think the reasons are bad. Im pretty happy with them

[Toto]

Dude. Getting angry for being caught for what you think are bad reasons IS omgus.

[Toto]

1) You are obviously angry even though you say you arent
2) You have not rebutted anything
3) you keep trying to convince me you are not scum and Im supposed to be your scum read.

What logic lmao

[Toto]

Ok lets chat logic then.

This is not a game of logic. Chess is a game of logic.

Done

[Toto]

Dan you got scumreads?

[Toto]

Hey ginnie why is rach town?

[Toto]

its probably desp + vonnflare in C

Not sure about Rach havent seen much in her iso

[Toto]

Von has been actively lurking all game

[Toto]

probably not in the long run

[Toto]

Please replace out if you dont want to play. This shit is unnacceptable.

[Toto]

Fuck this

VOTE: von

Anyone show me a game related post from this slot

[Toto]

1) You are obviously angry even though you say you arent
2) You have not rebutted anything
3) you keep trying to convince me you are not scum and Im supposed to be your scum read.

What logic lmao

1. You can bang your head against the wall saying it but no one is going to care about this
2. You calling OMGUS, you thinking emotions are telling, actually pushed the point that you haven't focused a single bit about play and stick with this emotional route even after I showed only scum push me on emotions.
3. Every scumread has a chance to be town so it's foolish to be conf!bias, the more I talk to a scum read, the more evidence i have to express my scumread to other players, I do this literally all the time with all of my reads.

By the way “only scum push me on emotions” is such a stupid argument I won’t even go there. Im fucking town and Im pushing you on emotions, just because you have a few examples of scum pushing you on emotions doesnt prove anything. That is NOT how logic works.

Also Ill note that if Eli flips red this game this was an obvious chainsaw defense btw.

[Toto]

1. Everyone says they're town
2. No town slot has ever pushed me for sounding fake over my career, and it's a lot of games mate.
3. Logically if only scum have done one thing and town has never done something, and you see someone do that something, you conclude scum.
4. What fucking chainsaw are you talking about?

Idgaf your logic is still shit. You are confusing low sample size statistics with logic

[Toto]

Actually I can't find the post lol


Maybe it was someone else defending Eli, can't remember who.

[Toto]

P-edit: Except Elli has actually drawn conclusions. So how is that theatre if something is actually coming from it?

It was Bulb. sorry.

[Toto]

You have not done shit this game and been here for 2 weeks.

You have posted, but nothing game related. You have not posted single read.

[Toto]

Vonn can die
Desp can die
Gingie can die

RachMarie null

Checkers, Transcend can be town for today.

Alisae's slot is town

[Toto]

Vote Count 2.2


Group A (3): checkersman7, Elliberetta [L-7]

Group B (3): Desperado, momo [L-7]

Group C (8): Lil Uzi Vert, Transcend, bulbazak, EddieFenix, Ramcius, Creature, Ginngie, Toto [L-2]

Not Voting (7): Assemblerotws, InactionDan, Majiffy, SnarkySnowman, Thor665, vonflare, RachMarie

DPI ends in 3 days, 22 hours, 11 minutes

DPII ends in 10 days, 22 hours, 11 minutes

EBWP

[Toto]

2. No town slot has ever pushed me for sounding fake over my career, and it's a lot of games mate.
3. Logically if only scum have done one thing and town has never done something, and you see someone do that something, you conclude scum.

Spoiler: now this makes sense

[Toto]

Sup

[Toto]

Whats your read on ginngie?

[Toto]

y?

[Toto]

Hi Snarky, I replaced whymafia

Why do I give you bad feels. Explain in as many words as possible.

[Toto]

I've been working really hard to solve the game so I'm curious what prompted you to come out of lurking and post this message at right this moment.

[Toto]

Tone / progression

Can you ellaborate?

Why do you like the progression and his tone?

It makes you (and your reads) really hard to read/understand if you don't explain your reads. I'm not looking for a case. I'm looking for more details on what makes you feel good about them.

[Toto]

I think we need two more votes to hammer C.

[Toto]

hey Critter are you still town reading Von?

[Toto]

What made you town read him in the first place?

[Toto]

Thor tone is relatively the same town and scum after reading some of his game. What changes is the agenda. In town games he is actually trying to solve the game and his arguments are more natural. In his scum games he is basicaly avoids any game solving and spends most of his time arguing tangents and slowing the game down or placing his votes tactically.

The reason he is hard to read is his gimmick way of talking has a few layers of indirection. He does this to make himself harder to read. But his agenda is usually pretty obvious once you read past that.

[Toto]

Basically as scum he is an unreasonable motherfucker, as town he is more of a nice guy.

[Toto]

Like here he has spent half the game arguing whether people can meta read him or not, instead of solving the game.

[Toto]

how can VON be town?

[Toto]

Something something activity is not indicative of alignment

[Toto]

Group A (2): checkersman7, Elliberetta [L-8]

Group B (2): Desperado, momo (VL/A) [L-8]

Group C (9): Lil Uzi Vert, Transcend, bulbazak, EddieFenix, Ramcius, Creature, Ginngie, Toto, Majiffy

[L-1]

Not Voting (6): Assemblerotws(Being replaced), InactionDan, SnarkySnowman, Thor665(in scum viking hell), vonflare(V/LA), RachMarie

There you go.

[Toto]

I have a gimmick way of talking?
What's my gimmick?
...I just type like I talk...

Well, you definitely have gimmick
Don't you see?
or is this how you talk all the time?

I lean on the former.

[Toto]

This saddens me greatly.

Does this really sadden you?
or perhaps you were being sarcastic

If it's the former I don't believe it

So, I guess you will tell me is the latter...
And even if you do, why should I believe it?

[Toto]

Mr banderas has not posted in 3 days

[Toto]

I think the doggy is town

[Toto]

Gin whats your read on Von?

Why is rach town?

[Toto]

That was your catch up?

[Toto]

Well you realize that unless you have a better option in your group you are probably eating rope?

I would at least want to know top 2 scum and town reads in your grp

[Toto]

Id add ram to that list if that is agreeable.

[Toto]

Desperado who would you vote in your group and why? Explain your scumread

[Toto]

I did

Your lynch line is gin, von and ram.

Who would you prefer right now. What makes you think they are scum and not town.

[Toto]

Meh

VOTE: antonio banderas

[Toto]

Meh

VOTE: antonio banderas

Desperado =/= benicio del toro

[Toto]

Desperado is scum

Like look at his tunnel on luv. He is voting him but not really pushing him.

For someone who is so confident about his reads he has done very little explaining.

[Toto]

VOTE: Desperado

[Toto]

You still haven't answered that question, btw.

Sorry, I must have missed it. Which question are you referring to?

[Toto]

UNVOTE:

Bulb is giving me the heebie jeebies.

[Toto]

VOTE: Desperado

Desp is still scum

[Toto]

So how is that theatre if something is actually coming from it?

You mean this question? I'm sorry I don't understand what your point is here.

Why does having conclusions makes it less likely to come from scum?

My point was that he is spending a lot of time on doing "analysis" on assembler's meta, and more importantly, was doing a bit of a show on how he was doing such an analysis (why does he need to tell us so much all the things that we don't care about the analysis). Of course the analysis would be presented with their conclusions. That doesn't make it less fake.


It's actually very similar to your wagon analysis on checker tbh. It's a big pile of crap given momo or maj have not flipped yet.

[Toto]

We should have voted B+Thor

[Toto]

Context

Hey Ramcius, I haven't seen you doing much lately.

It's cuz he's scum

Majiffy, i almost have more posts than you and i replaced in, so if that's your only "scumtell" on me, i pitty you, really

[Toto]

So because you don't understand or get why someone would find a particular mode of analysis useful means it's fake?

1) Wolfs are more likely to

show

how they are trying to solve the game. Because their objective is to

look

like they are scumhunting, rather than actually scumhunting.
2) Objective types of analysis (VCA, NKA, meta, game theory) are MUCH easier to fake effectively because they are.... objective. Doing this requires no lying or personal skills.
3) While these types of analysis are effective as town it is a HUGE red flag when this is the only thing someone is doing because they are avoiding doing the hard stuff to do by scum. Showing town emotions (paranoia, frustration, etc) in a way that looks natural is MUCH harder than spending three pages talking about game theory, or talking about wagon conspiracy theories.

[Toto]

You have not disproven what I said by showing me a game where you used meta analysis effectively as town. Just wanted to make sure you understood that. That is not how statistics work.

[Toto]

I'm going to reply to you just this once

WOW you replied to me! Can I put this on my signature?

[Toto]

ENGAGE WITH ME SO I CAN SEE YOUR TRUE PM COLORS BITCH

[Toto]

I'M GOING TO POWER LYNCH YOUR SELF METAING ASS TOMORROW

[Toto]

In all seriousness Eli, why don't you want to discuss reads with me?

Are you trying to look like we are not talking for some reason?

[Toto]

viewtopic.php?p=9700823#p9700823

Your tone this game is way different than is this one lolmeta. You actually had... emotions.

[Toto]

Anyway, a lynch for another day.

[Toto]

What's funny?

[Toto]

Ramcus is town

[Toto]

lol

[Toto]

Eli, I'll ask nicely:

1) Do you have a reason to avoid engaging me? please be honest.
2) What is your read on my slot?

Thanks in advance,

[Toto]

Ok, if you are town, can you please not ignore me on purpose, I don't think it helps solve town conflicts. Unless you think I'm scum, in which case I urge you again to interact with me and help us sort each other.

Also it is not a nice thing to do in general.

[Toto]

So, smocaine, we are lynching people in group C, it would be nice if you can try to catch up and tell us who you think is town and scum in that group.

[Toto]

I don't interact with scum except to meme either.

This implies you scum read me. And very strongly. I'd like to know the reasons because I feel I've been obviously town this game.

[Toto]

If we compare the lists from the 2 analyses, there are no names in common. Unless, that is, we consider the unfiltered versions. In that case, we are left with only Transcend. However, I'm not ready to go down that rabbit hole, as I think he's actually town here.

Hey guys, here are these sets of random observations I'm going to post and then ignore and just vote strategically.

[Toto]

Alisae was obvtown, their rage quit was even more obvtown. Hating MS doesnt make it less AI. People voting that slot are scum claiming.

Like is there scum frustration and town frustration. Town get frustrated when they are not being heard or understood. This is the type of frustration Alisae was showing. They were mad because in her opinion towns are bad in MS, and they were calling everyone bad for scumreading their slot and for not listening to their scumreads.

Also in general Alisae was pretty much then only slot putting effot in trying to sort people out, her reads chamges as they got more info and were putting effort in getting reactioms.

If you lynch this slot as town you deserve to lose.

[Toto]

Desp my problem with you is that you are not explaining your reads. Without opening your thought process it is hard for me to judge if you reads are honest or faked.

I get the gamestate apathy. But I can see it coming from both alignments, moreso scum because you seem to be reading the thread but you are not comenting on how that affects your reads.

Like for example. Gin is one of your scum reads and after reading pages of 1v1 you complain about how it doesnt add any value to the game when instead you should see it as information you can use to sort her.

So if you are town please provide some better explanations for your reads. I will try to post less often now to not pollute the thread too much in return.

[Toto]

Is it possibble your experience with Alisae doesnt line up with your previous one because:

1) they were playing a gimmick alt
2) they are frustrated about the site and therfore is reflected in the way they interact with ppl?

Also,

Your vca assumes that you will find scum in the intersection of two random groups of people. Basically your analysis presumes the conclusions which is lolscience.

[Toto]

Do I expect scum to have pushed and voted for Mick, who was lynch bait? Yes. Do I expect scum to try to further their advantage by voting for B again in an effort to close the game, especially if town don't realize that's what the scum wincon is? Yes. So how is it unreasonable to expect that the overlap of the two would produce scum?

Yes, some scum are likely to have voted Mick, others probably steered away from the wagon. Also note scum don't really know for sure someone is town in this set up, as they don't know who can be traitors.

I disagree with B actually, I think town are more likely to vote B than scum. I know this sounds convenient coming from me but scum usually shy away from things they think will call attention to themselves and are generally more aware from the setup.

Also, in the case of Ramcus I found his progression on his decision to vote B and then other group natural.

And, last but not least, even if you believe those two things you have two believe that the SAME slot would vote B and also Mick. You are assuming there is some non-negative correlation between two random variables.

[Toto]

@Bubl: I don't think you understand what a random variable is.

Yes, I'm trying to discredit your analysis because

1) Your assumptions are wrong,
2) your method is wrong,
3) and

I think your conclusions are wrong.

(I'm town, and I'm very confident Ramcius is town).

If you are town please don't take it personally, and try to reconsider your reads. Desperado is a better option RN.

[Toto]

How so? You seem to agree with me about scum being on the Mick wagon, but you're not doing anything with that.

I think you misunderstood. I don't think the probability of that being true is larger than random chance. If you look at all D1 town flipped wagons I don't think it is true that scum are more likely to be in the wagon than random chance.

If it was a scum flip then I would agree with you, as in D1 scum flips there is usually a scum busing.

Also I feel you are putting words in my mouth. If that is the case, please don't do that.

[Toto]

Well, it's better than trusting crystal balls and the power of belief, as you would want us to do.

I'm actually moving you to locked scum after this. Congrats.

[Toto]

@Toto: Every time someone tries to figure things out with something other than hopes and dreams, you come in to discredit them, not based on the validity of their analysis, but rather that we should just do what feels right and anything else that tries to reduce the fallibility of players is scum driven, just because you can't argue against it.

I have not objected to people using objective scumhunting tools (although as a statistician I think most people here don't know what they are doing).

What I've pointed out is that I scum read people who only use this and fail to show town emotions. This is a psychological game and I don't see why using psychological tools, or you know, empathy, equals to "hope and wishes, and using crystal balls", and the fact that you name it as such is both insulting and scummy.

[Toto]

I don't attack players based on playstyle or how they scumhunt, because that is not alignment indicative, and I realize that other players are not like me.

. However, you are going "What is the easiest way for me to attack and discredit a player and maybe get a mislynch? I know! I'll attack how they scumhunt! Not their motivations or why they're doing what they're doing. No. Something superficial like playstyle is all I need! Meeeeooooowwww!".

I hope you realize those two paragraphs can't go in the same post.

[Toto]

I never said that lmao

[Toto]

Toto!

Who is scum in C?

[Toto]

I think there is a non-zero chance Bulb is just very misguided town.

Majiffy was the one encouraging the venn-diagram shit.

[Toto]

From most scum to most town

EddieFenix
Bulbazak
Smocaine <- I kind of like this guy, but want to see more

Elliberetta <-- mixed feelings here. I like the way they are trying to engage desperado but don't like they way they keep ignoring me.

InactionDan <-- few posts but generally reasonable. Could be good scum too.

Creature <-- Critter

[Toto]

No I went to the first post copy pasted and tried to stack rank people myself.

[Toto]

I also expect that we're going to have to lynch you at some point soon, so it's not worth engaging you on an obviously flawed approach.

This pretty horrible.

[Toto]

3074 feels townie.

Like I kind of get why you are angry at me for me shitting on your VCA but it was bad. Ramcius is town, you should vote someone else.

[Toto]

Not voting (3): SnarkySnowman, momo,

Lil Uzi Vert

EBWOP

[Toto]

Toto's Real Time VCA

vonflare (0): [L-7]

Desperado

(2):

Toto, Creature

[L-5]

RachMarie (0): [L-7]

checkersman7 (0): [L-7]

Transcend (0): [L-7]

Ginngie (4): Elliberetta, InactionDan, Smocaine [L-4]

Ramcius

(3):

Bulbazak, Thor665, Majiffy, EddiePhenix

[L-3]

Not voting (12):, SnarkySnowman, momo, Lil Uzi Vert

[Toto]

Probably 1 goon + 2xtraitors.

Hey maybe Thor is town! (famous last words)

[Toto]

Scum don't know each other, so... maybe they are all on the same wagon. Who knows.

[Toto]

I really don't see Ramcus scum here, you can try to convince me (it's going to be hard, but I can reason with people) but you basically just voted the slot and keep your reads to yourself.

[Toto]

no

[Toto]

Momo talk to uncle Toto.

[Toto]

thoughts on 3018

[Toto]

This was just Alisae being over dramatic. Alisae is an over dramatic person.

NAI - The fact that Alisea is being over dramatic means it is only Alisae.

What do you think about the fact he just started randomly town reading me after everything that went down with no reason given.

I agreed with her read switch when reading the thread, or at least could understand it by reading your posts. (checkers seems to agree here)

Vote someone else.

[Toto]

what's got me fucked up is I don't even know how much faith I have in the Ram wagon myself

*cough*fake*cough*

[Toto]

Very far for the truth, but keep going.

[Toto]

Like you don't even have scumreads in your group lmao

[Toto]

I felt like you could have at least asked me a question instead of just some snarky comment

Uh Im sorry for replying to snarky comments with snarky comments. Tissue?

[Toto]

nom Toto for

Trump Impersonator

[Toto]

Ok ginn. Ill bite.

You seem like a reasoning type.

Ive explained my case why I think Ali/ram town. Can you read it carefully without assuming I am an idiot and tell me how it is wrong?

[Toto]

thoughts on 3018

[Toto]

Am I the only one that thinks Desperado and Elli are having a weird conversation

[Toto]

I dont buy for a second this scrabble mafia BS

[Toto]

Desperado if you are town I respect your scumhunting tools but you are not providing me with any evidence you are scumhunting. It is really easy to pull up someones iso and find things they say in multiple games.

Describe you reads and thought process wtf are you trying to accomplish here. If you are town you need to town the fuck up

[Toto]

I am on mobile and cant do that right now please illuminate me using words

[Toto]

Nope is super easy to find things they say repeadly.

Try mud slinging

[Toto]

Hell try that meme he used on me two days ago. He uses that in pretty much all his games

[Toto]

Ok thanks for explaining.

Can you do that for your scumreads too!

[Toto]

Like rn it would help town a lot specially if they are in group c

[Toto]

Like I cant believe this “attitude” if you are towm. Why are you denying information?

[Toto]

Those are stances not reads

[Toto]

meh

[Toto]

I agree with the dog

[Toto]

Desperado has not explained a single read this game and doesnt seem to care who gets lynched. He votes luv but is not really trying to get anyone lynched.

He hasnt reevaluated a single read (aka stances because he hasnt explained WHY)

His whole tell on bulba is making my spidy senses go nuts.

Maybe deep down there he has reads and maybe he cares who gets lynched but Im not fucking TELEPATHIC

[Toto]

I expect ppl to explain their reads so I can judge if they are real reads or agenda

Which reads do you think he is pushing because I dont see it

[Toto]

So his only real push has been luv but it could easily be a scum tunnel. He is not trying to get more info and sort them out. He just votes and doesnt interact with them

[Toto]

You pushing people around and ask them questions to try to understand their point of view for example. When you think someone is scum you dont just vote them and disappear without trying to sort them out.

I know this is playstyle related but I havent seen anything I can point to and say yeah this looks like town trying to figure things out. Bulbread being the onlu exception but it reads more like a show to make it appear as such (see spidy senses above)

[Toto]

No, I can see people questioning each other with different playstyles in a way that looks that they are trying to sort people out.

I already acknowledged that. Can you point to me to a post you think is townie and explain why?

Like if I squint I can see town apathy which is why Im basically begging desperado to play the game and stop the attitude if it is not fake. But how he is playing is how I see me playing scum in my previous scum game.

[Toto]

Luv you are not voting

[Toto]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tu4Hnbor9rI

[Toto]

Toto + Creature you're voting a vanity wagon vote between Gin & Ram

You are voting town. Vote someone else.

[Toto]

thoughts on 3018

Ginngie

[Toto]

It just didnt look natural because you for some reason refuse to express whats on your mind.

Can you explain your scumreads pretty pls why are you making this so hard?

I dont care if they are short reasons just full honest explanations of why ppl in your grp may be scum. Talk to me about ramcus for example since we seem to disagree there.

[Toto]

@bulb i have explained a fuckload times why I think ram is town

@creature I may get on board gin if things dont develop from here but I think we still have time.

My lynch candidates are still gin von and desp.

[Toto]

Can we please not lynch Ramcius?

Ramcius is at L-1?

If anyone lolhammers I'm policy lynching the fuck out of you tomorrow I don't care which group you are in.

[Toto]

Scum ^

[Toto]

Scum ^