Newbie 2099 | GTA San Andreas | Endgame

[Bulbazoor]

VOTE: VOTE: FancyPants

It's been a while. I don't recognize anyone here.

[Bulbazoor]

I am the worst at reading anything that occurs in the RVS as I can never get a good read on anything going on. Everyone is seeming sus at this point to me lol.

[Bulbazoor]

UNVOTE: FancyPants

[Bulbazoor]

It's more of a testament to how bad I am at reading anything until things really start rolling.

[Bulbazoor]

VOTE: Rad

Your turn to feel some pressure buddy .

[Bulbazoor]

I am the worst at reading anything that occurs in the RVS as I can never get a good read on anything going on. Everyone is seeming sus at this point to me lol.

WTF is this.

Bulba, can you add additional context to this comment please?

I don't think there's additional context needed. We are still in the RVS stage and I still struggle with making any sort of reads during this stage.

[Bulbazoor]

What context is needed for that post? I feel like at this point that's just making something out of nothing.

[Bulbazoor]

I am not getting town vibes from anyone but I lowkey like Rad so far
Spartan not so much

[Bulbazoor]

UNVOTE:

Don't remember if I have done this.

[Bulbazoor]

I am not getting town vibes from anyone but I lowkey like Rad so far
Spartan not so much

Whooooosssshhhhh

(Appeasement followed by a statement without any actual reasoning)

Zzoooooommm

VOTE: Bulbazoor

At this point it is feeling like a damned if I do, damned if I don't. Like I said, these are vibes and not fully fleshed out reads.

[Bulbazoor]

And at some point I have to say what I am thinking anyway so might as well say my initial "vibe" reads.

[Bulbazoor]

@Bulbazoor, can you provide games where you were town and incorrect on day 1.
Otherwise as Elemk pointed out you're just pre-preparing excuses for being ineffective on day 1.

Most games I got lynched day one as town.

[Bulbazoor]

A key thing to note is I haven't played a full game or been near any sort of mafia for like three or two years now.

[Bulbazoor]

@Bulbazoor, can you provide games where you were town and incorrect on day 1.
Otherwise as Elemk pointed out you're just pre-preparing excuses for being ineffective on day 1.

Most games I got lynched day one as town.

Being lynched day one and being wrong day 1 are different things you say in this post:

I am the worst at reading anything that occurs in the RVS as I can never get a good read on anything going on. Everyone is seeming sus at this point to me lol.

To me this sounds like you're already giving yourself an excuse not to scum hunt.

When did I say I was wrong on day 1? I said I am not good at getting reads just based off of RVS...

[Bulbazoor]

I think it is stupid that I am getting pushed for a comment that is clearly being misconstrued.

[Bulbazoor]

I meant I can never get a feel on anyone's alignment just based off of RVS and I usually don't know how to move the conversation forward so I just awkwardly wait for more content to roll in.

Bulba - who's sus and why?

I like Rad so far. I usually look for town reads before I see anyone as sus. And he seems closest to what I would consider to having a town tone.

I don't know how to read Goldfish and her reaction to being voted. I will have to see what else she says.

I can see you trying to scumhunt but frankly I am annoyed at how you made me seem out to be like I didn't intend on scumhunting. I have also never played with you so I don't know what to make of you other than you have an aggressive style.

Spartan might have just omgused me for saying they were sus. And they said I appeased people when at some point I had to make a contribution regarding my vibes anyway. I don't like them so far.

[Bulbazoor]

And also, we have 8 days. Do you think I would really not scumhunt for those eight days?

[Bulbazoor]

It is more that spartan accused me of appeasement when I would be providing reads soon anyway.

[Bulbazoor]

@Rad.
I'm genuinely sorry if I'm making the game less fun for you, solving the game is what I get out of it - and I feel bad if you feel me try-harding is a buzz kill.

I actually think you're probably town. Voting 5 times and expressing a "I don't give a F#%& attitude." strikes me as tonally town but I wanted to interact with you to try and sort you correctly. I like your last post; logical, genuine and most importantly not at all stressed.

To explain some behaviour: AlwaysNever self voting felt slightly too brazen and meme(y) for newb-scum, I'm not writing him off as comftown, but in my opinion his response was town. Who do you reckon is scum btw?

No worries man. I don't mean to stiffle your play either. You do you. But I think you need to realize that there's probably not as much to be gained from some of this RVS stuff as you're pushing. Regardless, again, you've pressured out some content and now we're out of RVS because of it. That's good stuff and townie as fuck.

I have no scum reads right now. Like Bulba (I think?) also noted, I tend to get some higher town reads easier and then I can focus in on my nulls.

I get that process of elimination is an important strategy for me as well.

To that end got any town reads?

Here is my full disclosure:

Elemk

- I just agree with them - does that make them town? Not necessarily but I know I'm town and seeing a similar thought process to what I'm feeling is a good sign.

Cat.Jpeg

- POE Scum

GoldfishFromTheMoon

- Appeasement, lurkerish - scum.

Juice

- Waiting for responses

AlwaysNever

- Tonal Town, and Seeming desire to game solve

Rad

- I may not agree with everything you've said but the IDGAF attitude is tonal town to me.

Spartan117

(SE) - A newbie I would say tonal town (IDGAF attitude) but as an SE I'm wary

Bulbazoor

(SE) - So many excuses. Appeasement for why they can't successfully scum hunt, the only thing going for them is that they are laying it on a little "too" thick. My head says scum, my gut says town.

Appeasement of who? I was going to provide reads either way. The whole point of this game is to hunt for scum. Would it also have been appeasement for me to have done it later?

[Bulbazoor]

To that end got any town reads?

You Spartan and Bulba so far town leans.

I am not getting town vibes from anyone but I lowkey like Rad so far
Spartan not so much

Whooooosssshhhhh

(Appeasement followed by a statement without any actual reasoning)

Zzoooooommm

VOTE: Bulbazoor

I like this mix of fun rvs and real read. Comes across genuine. I just disagree with the read.

Bulba's openly presenting as newbie townie who hasn't played for a while and I'm reading him that way too. Feels a lot like my recent newbie town game where I hadn't played since 2014. Just kinda lost while also kinda know what's going on, kinda laughing things off while also being a bit frustrated. I don't think I come into a new game after a long period away and just nail townie vibes as scum that easily so reading him the same.

viewtopic.php?f=50&t=77801

My last game I ever played fully on this site or of any sort of forum mafia in general. It was in 2018.

[Bulbazoor]

To that end got any town reads?

You Spartan and Bulba so far town leans.

I am not getting town vibes from anyone but I lowkey like Rad so far
Spartan not so much

Whooooosssshhhhh

(Appeasement followed by a statement without any actual reasoning)

Zzoooooommm

VOTE: Bulbazoor

I like this mix of fun rvs and real read. Comes across genuine. I just disagree with the read.

Bulba's openly presenting as newbie townie who hasn't played for a while and I'm reading him that way too. Feels a lot like my recent newbie town game where I hadn't played since 2014. Just kinda lost while also kinda know what's going on, kinda laughing things off while also being a bit frustrated. I don't think I come into a new game after a long period away and just nail townie vibes as scum that easily so reading him the same.

I am very wary of Townreading an IDGAF attitude. I don't even know if an IDGAF vibe is what spartan is giving off.

[Bulbazoor]

People I don't have at least a slight town vibe from:
Elemk
Cat.Jpeg
GoldfishFromTheMoon
Juice
AlwaysNever
Spartan117 (SE)
FancyPants (SE)

[Bulbazoor]

I liked Juice before he suddenly seemed confident on the scum team on very flimsy ground.

[Bulbazoor]

I'd like to see where his read goes before I decide on whether it's coming from a town perspective or not.

[Bulbazoor]

And, out of the whole list that I put which is everyone except me and Rad, I am suspicious of spartan the most.

[Bulbazoor]

Hey Bulba
I didn't like your opening, 32 and 35 felt like pre-excuses to incorrectly scum hunt. 36 was supposed to be a pressure post but the "winky emoje" and calling him "buddy" made it feel toothless and appeasing, 67 where you warn us you get lynched day 1 as town also felt like you were qualifying for scummy behavior and 68 where you mention you are rusty felt the same.

That said it was mostly RVS and I'd like to chat.

Why is Rad town to you? and why do you find Spartan suspicious?

What felt toothless about my post. If anything I was being a bit passive aggressive

[Bulbazoor]

At thus point all I can say about Spartan is he said me giving reads was appeasing which it wasn't because I will be outing reads either way in the future. And it came at a time where there was already a BW sort of building on me IIRC.

And all I have right now are gut reads. Nothing based on substance. It is strange to me how someone can already have so many reads when it is so early on and we have like seven days left.

And how am I supposed to explain something like a gut feeling (what I call a vibe)?

[Bulbazoor]

So let me get this straight juice.

Fancy is definitely scum. And he's scum with either elemk or bulba. So the best move is to vote one of his maybe scum partners?

I like this line of questioning as well. This is a valid point he made

[Bulbazoor]

I am seeing how FancyPants can be town. He helped us move out of the RVS stage pretty much. Granted I am the subject getting pressed the most but at least it will help me see where everyone might lie as we discuss this further

[Bulbazoor]

@spartan: How would I have had any reads to commit to when a lot of the people had only posted an RVS vote and some is getting prodded? And, like I said to Fancy, you assume my reads are static? It is day 3. We have seven days left. I feel like it is better to say someone isn't committing to anything when it is closer to the deadline.

[Bulbazoor]

People I don't have at least a slight town vibe from:
Elemk
Cat.Jpeg
GoldfishFromTheMoon
Juice
AlwaysNever
Spartan117 (SE)
FancyPants (SE)

Did you just name everyone but Rad and yourself? Lol

That's what I was thinking. Either when beginning to write the post the post they didnt realise they only had a town vibe from one other person or it was to emphasise that everyone was sus. That or it was a roundabout way to townread Rad without buddying/being associated but that is reversed a few posts later.

I did realize and yet I did it anyway

[Bulbazoor]

What felt toothless about my post. If anything I was being a bit passive aggressive

Wait, that post had teeth? You were being passive aggressive? I read that as pure wink wink nudge nudge rvs.

Hmm

Well I did want to pressure you and at the same time I was annoyed that I was being voted as I tend to have knee jerk reactions any time I am voted.

[Bulbazoor]

I do think Juice might be coming from a similar mindset as me in that they don't like being pushed over the smallest of things. I do think it could be town vs town but I really do need some more content from the quieter slots before making any sort of decisions.

To AlwaysNever, why do you think Spartan has decent content? What lines in particular?

[Bulbazoor]

And I did acknowledge that when I said that you were the main reason the discussion progressed past the RVS stage.

[Bulbazoor]

Juice is sounding really town to me. That last line was really good. Doesn't seem like something that would come from scum. He is also very not afraid to call out things he sees as dumb or absurd. I am moving him to a stronger town lean.

[Bulbazoor]

I am too scared to commit to any reads spartan? I guess you just ignored my TR on Juice.

[Bulbazoor]

What felt toothless about my post. If anything I was being a bit passive aggressive

Wait, that post had teeth? You were being passive aggressive? I read that as pure wink wink nudge nudge rvs.

Hmm

Well I did want to pressure you and at the same time I was annoyed that I was being voted as

I tend to have knee jerk reactions any time I am voted.

This feels like an excuse for any reaction that may come from being voted in the future, could be the first scum slip of the game? Hmm

I think this is a very big reach. So town can never be pissed at being voted incorrectly?

[Bulbazoor]

I am going to read this whole thread and make some notes along the way.

[Bulbazoor]

Whole thread as in the posts since my last post.

[Bulbazoor]

Why do you see Fancy and Rad as town?

You're reasons given are just filler - and don't actually amount to answer. Saying you like questioning and prodding has nothing to do with alignment.

The fact that you have shown you can expand for other players - does questions motivations. Almost as if you might already know what one if not both of their alignments are.

You said you don't like Post 166 - but I would ask why? You don't actually explain what you don't like about it.

The post is filled with words - but nothing of any real use. Whats worse - is you've actually just unvoted and offered no suspect of who you think mafia is. You've suggested - that Bulba, Fancy, Rad are town.

And that Cat and Goldfish you aren't happy with. But you've written the least about both of them.

I'm not sure if scum are allowed to talk during the day - or only night period. But I do feel if there is a day chat - you might be being coached.

On a reread this post makes sense to me. I went through elemk's post (188) and it sounded a lot to me like an AI trying to do an impersonation of a list of thoughts rather than genuine thoughts.

What felt toothless about my post. If anything I was being a bit passive aggressive

Wait, that post had teeth? You were being passive aggressive? I read that as pure wink wink nudge nudge rvs.

Hmm

Well I did want to pressure you and at the same time I was annoyed that I was being voted as

I tend to have knee jerk reactions any time I am voted.

This feels like an excuse for any reaction that may come from being voted in the future, could be the first scum slip of the game? Hmm

I still do not see what the purpose of this line was. What were you trying to achieve by indicating that I "might have scumslipped"? It still seems like a big reach to make from that post.

Juice has a similar line (195). I went through elemk's posts and he indeed did not mention spartan prior to this. I am curious as to what that was all about? This is the difference between spartan and juice's assumptions of there being a slip.

[Bulbazoor]

128 is interesting to me. I like his previous post 126 because I agree with the logic he expresses. I don't like 128 because he alludes to some sort of "master plan" without actually expressing anything, the exact thing he then accuses bulba of doing? He states he is being "chaotic", which I see in his earlier posts, but they are RVS posts and isnt't that the whole point of the RVS stage? However, I again like the logic of the last sentence. Slight scum lean for me

I apologize to Elemk. He does indeed mention spartan here but not by name. Ignore my previous post.

[Bulbazoor]

Question for juice: What are your thoughts on the elemk slot now that I have just shown that he did mention spartan in a previous post? It kind of defeats your argument that it is possibly some sort of slip.

[Bulbazoor]

Posts of interest:

225: But up to this point I was not feeling very strongly about my read on spartan other than a gut read.

230: Goldfish, how do we know that you not trying to bullshit any scumreads was not the result of you being busy and not having time to play? It did not really seem necessary to make this post.

232: I am really curious as to who you will name and why. Go through my ISO and tell me your thoughts.

233: If FP is scum, he is doing a really amazing job at sounding like a town. He put in the effort to fact-check a statement on meta. And what I have mentioned before (him moving the game past the RVS stage) and in general having a town tone. He is up there with juice for towniest tone.

For FP, as you stated in post 130, you do not like when people do not explain their reads after being asked about them. So, can you explain your townreads on everyone except the three you named in 205? I am curious as to why you now tr me after having pressed me before?

239: Interesting. I find it interesting how goldfish pointed out that cat is "probably not a PR". Goldfish, what led you to this read? I don't see anything indicating that she is not a PR.

246: I see you are online now AlwaysNever. What in particular leads you to think "you are too scared to commit to anything" can only come from town!spartan? To me, scum!spartan can also use that as a way to prey on my indecisiveness at that point in the game.

252: You say that he did not immediately pile on me. It seems to me like he did join a BW that had been building up at that point (Votecount post 25). That seems like "piling on" to me.

280: I do tend to read more individual-based as that is my preferred method. I actually liked rad more when he questioned your method of reading the game based on possible pairs. I agree that rad is a townlean so far. You and I both seem to be waiting for spartan and his "gameplay" he has planned. It seems like elemk is an implied scumlean for you.




Reads:

Townleans: Juice, FP
Slight townlean: Rad
Neutral: AlwaysNever, Cat, Elemk (after realizing that what I said in the post above was false information I have decided to wait for his replacement)
Very slight scumlean: Spartan, Goldfish

[Bulbazoor]

I guess I am just curious as to your read on me in particular.

[Bulbazoor]

It was because I hadn't really seen you discuss having a TR on me before so I was wondering what changed. I will wait for your read on elemk's replacement whenever that happens.

[Bulbazoor]

if Elmk has been replaced then this whole game is a clusterfuck for me now. what a waste of time

I do also kind of feel this way. I had a question I wanted to ask him. Mainly his thoughts on AlwaysNever which never came.

[Bulbazoor]

if my main scumread is being repped out - it basically takes me back to square one. Because a new player, shouldn't really be judged for reads given out from just Day one.

I am willing to give the replacement a shot. I am leaning on voting spartan or goldfish out today more atm. Spartan mainly because I don't see the arguments (him not piling on me) as having a lot of weight behind them and goldfish reads as scummy so far, especially the line about not bullshitting scumreads, which appears to have been refuted by FP.

[Bulbazoor]

Interesting that Bulba didnt like my content at this point especially in comparison to Rad when we were both having some RVS shenanigans, I don't see a whole lot different to mine and Rads posts at this point on page 3 to make this distinction. Although I do like Rads play so agree with this town read.

Looking back, your lines during the RVS stage do not seem as bad. I am willing to admit that that was not a well-thought-out read. It was more of a gut read. I did take issue with post 58. This is where I felt that you were taking advantage of how I was playing at that stage in the game and piling on to me because you possibly saw me as an easy lynch. What reasoning would you expect from me during the RVS stage on page 3 where we were definitely still at the RVS stage? To me, it seems like having any sort of reasoning at that stage for any read would be easier for scum.

Just a headsup that we don't necessarily get 8 days if someone is voted off before then, I fully get your sentiment on us taking our time, I personally like to feel a game out and not rush things too much but if things get too stale and drawn out you get too many people lurking and avoiding questions.

Interesting how you say this but then say

By the end of in game Day 1, we still have time,

Wouldn't you outing your proposed team produce new points of discussion?

Taking the game out of RVS doesnt make that person town especially when they are dictating the conversation, scum win games based off dictating the conversation alone.

I guess you are correct about this, but the main reason for my town read on them is the lengths they went to verify the meta goldfish commented on. I don't think that would really come from scum. If goldfish is scum especially.

[Bulbazoor]

VOTE: goldfish

So yeah it's Goldfish.
- Based on appeasement.
- Based on my meta.
- Based on her "misremembering" about how she behaves as scum and using it as a defense.
- Based on avoiding this game while under pressure.


Also worst case if I'm wrong, she's not helpful as a townie anyway.

[Bulbazoor]

Juice, just for reference, when you click preview, you can find a button that says vote next to wiki. Then, you just have to type the name of the person you want to vote inside the brackets. Saves time

[Bulbazoor]

I'm surprised this wasn't picked up and I'm also surprised that Bulba just agreed with it. Would be the second time Bulba has OMGUS'ed, I retract my town read on Bulba.

How does this single aspect move me into scummy? I agreed because from the way I read Juice's post it seemed like FP was his scumread and he voted for someone he didn't appear as certain on. I thought it was a valid question from Rad.

[Bulbazoor]

Also when did I omgus for a second time BBT?

[Bulbazoor]

I still don't see how I omgused Juice. All I did was agree with a point regarding Juice.

[Bulbazoor]

That post was more of me giving some slight townpoints to Rad than any sort of omgus.

[Bulbazoor]

More like he tried to incorrectly paint me as omgusing lmao.

[Bulbazoor]

Yes. I did agree because I wanted to hear what juice wanted to say about it.

[Bulbazoor]

Notice how I never scumread juice. He is actually a townread of mine atm. So this whole "you wanted to paint a target on juice implicitly" is moot.

[Bulbazoor]

BBT I would really like to hear your updated thoughts on the game.

[Bulbazoor]

Well you promised you would go through the last six pages so I expect you will anyway.

[Bulbazoor]

The main thing was the quickly disproven meta and also the line about cat not being a PR. I am highly suspicious of that slot atm. And the line about explaining what they would do as scum didn't feel necessary at that time.

[Bulbazoor]

I think you aren't caught up enough

[Bulbazoor]

I don't see how there is no way both can be town

[Bulbazoor]

Why do you get that feeling?

[Bulbazoor]

Giving me flashbacks to when he said I scumslipped lol

[Bulbazoor]

Why this reaction?

[Bulbazoor]

This day seems like it should have ended already with a goldfish lynch. I just don't think they are town.

[Bulbazoor]

Goldfish, mafia goon, lynched

[Bulbazoor]

Interesting how activity happened to die off after Rad asking for hammer. Does no one really have nothing else to add?

[Bulbazoor]

Crushing that goldfish didn't flip scum with the way she played.

[Bulbazoor]

Crushing that goldfish didn't flip scum with the way she played.

Cool. Great. Bummer. Who's scum Bulba?

I will be honest with you guys. I lost a lot of motivation when goldfish flipped town. I really did think she was mafia. I will be paying a lot of attention to what alwaysnever and BBT do today. I also need to examine cat closer.

[Bulbazoor]

I still think FP and Juice are town af. I am very stubborn in my reads so it will be hard to change them

[Bulbazoor]

VOTE: alwaysnever

[Bulbazoor]

I would also be down to vote cat

[Bulbazoor]

I really hope there is a scum in those two. I am not letting spartan off the hook. My pool of players I will be looking into today are:

Spartan
Cat
AlwaysNever
BBT but I am less sure on this one.

[Bulbazoor]

VOTE: cat

My reads boil down to strong trs on Juice and Fancy. I don't see myself ever fosing Juice tbh. And then that leaves you, Rad, who I have a weaker tr on. Then, BBT has done well to ease a bit of the suspicions I had on his slot. That leaves Cat, AlwaysNever, and Spartan.

[Bulbazoor]

I would have been ecstatic after a goldfish town flip as she was incredibly scummy. You guys just can't read me.

[Bulbazoor]

And I can sense scum thinks I am somehow an easy lynch today. I see what you are doing BBT. People just can't see that I am disappointed I was wrong and thus have less motivation to try as much.

[Bulbazoor]

And how does it seem like I am trying to move through the day? There's other slots that have not even spoken a damn word like alwaysnever. Why so focused on me spartan? And suddenly cat picks up her effort today after not trying at all d1? What do you make of that?

[Bulbazoor]

All of this based on a question I did in fact answer. How hilarious

[Bulbazoor]

I voted cat and alwaysnever. Should tell you who I fucking want lynched. I can't even fathom how I am an option for a lynch today.

[Bulbazoor]

For those that can't understand, I would like alwaysnever or cat today.

[Bulbazoor]

And spartan I won't let this push over a fabricated reason slide. You are also on my radar.

[Bulbazoor]

So your response is to vote me for no reason? Have you read what I have said?

[Bulbazoor]

VOTE: Cat

Can someone voting Bulba give me a case. I really don't think it's him.

After reading the last couple pages I'm liking Cat + Rad or Alwaysnever.

It ain't BBT It ain't Juice it Ain't Bulba I'll take that to the bank.

There is no case on me. Simple as that.

[Bulbazoor]

I can't believe spartan is actually seriously doing this. And people are really trying to start a BW on me with such a BS "case" when there is alwaysnever and cat here. Why can't we get alwaysnever out? It's who I originally was voting before spartan and Rad got on me for no reason.

[Bulbazoor]

"Jumping on wagons without conviction " give me a break
... yeah I definitely pushed goldfish without conviction....

[Bulbazoor]

Nothing he said is true other than me operating mainly on townreads today. Which is not even alignment indicative.

[Bulbazoor]

Have you seen alwaysnever's posts. A better question is why are you tunnelvisioning me? I have been lurking my fucking ass.

[Bulbazoor]

Bulba what are your thoughts on BBT, would you be happy with a BBT elimination today?

Bulba please tell the class where you answered these questions, now please be specific and quote your post, you won't be able to mind because I have already quoted all of yours and explained how it doesn't answer it...

He is in the four I mentioned but I wouldn't be as willing to get him out as I would always or cat

[Bulbazoor]

The main qualms I had against the BBT slot were against elemk.

[Bulbazoor]

I seriously don't see how you don't read my posts coming into today as dejected town. But I guess that is just a me issue.

[Bulbazoor]

I don't know what else to say. I clearly answered your question. Him being in my four implies that I am OK with getting him lynched if I see anybody make a good case against him. And if the other slots that I named start being towner.

Why would I care if the NK failed? We are left with a situation where we end up in a 4 way which is arguably better for scum than a three way no?

[Bulbazoor]

Still pushing the "bulba is lurking" thing... I am so tempted to just ignore you

[Bulbazoor]

The most annoying thing is I did answer his question.

[Bulbazoor]

I really don't understand why peoppe say I am lurking. I clearly stated where my head is at right now. I am not going to just discard my day one reads. Most of the times I have done that, I ended up regretting it and lynching town.

If you guys have specific questions directed at me, give them instead of just saying I am lurking lmao.

[Bulbazoor]

Funny how spartan even scumreads me and had similar feelings to me on goldfish flipping scum. What was his case again?

[Bulbazoor]

I don't get how people are even including me as a possible lynch? Like what reasons or case is there against me? Nobody other than spartan (who people just allowed to make me a possible lynch) asked me anything and then go on to accuse me of lurking.

[Bulbazoor]

Whatever UNVOTE: . I am not just going to sit here and allow myself to get lynched over some flimsy case that others just went with.

[Bulbazoor]

At least ask me shit

[Bulbazoor]

Engage me. Don't just go off of some BS case

[Bulbazoor]

I'll answer after a reread. I will just pop in to say it's funny how he says I parrot people then he parrots Juice's lynch list. And yet I'm gonna be the one called out for whatever I say. I will get to all of your questions.

[Bulbazoor]

Spartan just assuming he was a target for me when I said Cat and Alwaysnever had been my main targets a little bit ago. Interesting. Why the assumption?

[Bulbazoor]

At this point before a reread and actually collecting my thoughts yes.

[Bulbazoor]

Barely. Am on phone atm so I will collect everything once I get to my computer.

[Bulbazoor]

I just said I barely read their posts... I am just saying your push on me is a ton of crap that just isn't true

[Bulbazoor]

And the short posts are because I am on my phone in a car currently. I can't really collect all the quotes and make a comprehensive post just yet. That will come later.

[Bulbazoor]

I do apologize for not coming through with my comprehensive post. I had to deal with something irl. I am going to do my reread today so I will get to the questions comprehensively.

[Bulbazoor]

Quick thoughts before a huge reread: Spartan is either town with confirmation bias against me or scum who thinks he has a good case against me. I am really confused as to which he is. He just seems to view anything I do as scum.

[Bulbazoor]

And from what I glimpsed no one else even has a good case against me either. All i have seen is "PoE" so me getting lynched today would benefit who? Just a question to ponder.

[Bulbazoor]

I will probably never understand why exactly I am even a target for a lynch. But whatever. I need to cool my head instead of resorting ti calling you all fucking idiots.

[Bulbazoor]

I'm going to do my reread now.

[Bulbazoor]

I'm in awe of how everyone just sheep's a case that isn't even strong. At least the case on goldfish made sense. What is the case on me? Can someone not named spartan answer? Are you really going to waste your last mislynch on me when there is no case? What is your plan when I flip town? To lose? To BW on someone else with no case?

[Bulbazoor]

I don't understand how anybody thinks it's me. There is no case. Everyone just followed a random guy saying they susses me and their case is not even good. That's how bad the game is.

[Bulbazoor]

Nobody is even reading what I am saying. Fuck this shit. I'm gonna read and ignore you guys as you have done to me until I reread.

[Bulbazoor]

I have a day and 18 hours. I am not forced to name people just because you told me to. Not my fault I was too busy IRL to do a comprehensive read through until today.

[Bulbazoor]

You all have to understand I am very confused atm. This whole "everybody wants to lynch Bulba" is news to me. It comes very out of left field and I don't know what to make of all of there people I trusted suddenly "scumreading me".

[Bulbazoor]

I still don't see how anyone would see me as scum-motivated here. I am just having trouble understanding that. All I am is a big pile of confusion.

[Bulbazoor]

I have already claimed intent to hammer a while ago, they are not coming back anytime soon, let's just see this flip and go from there.

I believe they will flip red it feels like scum who has given up and has no more fight to give. In the event of what I think will happen and

BBT night kills me again

, I think it is the Elemk/BBT slot that was sussed by others before the switch and is and im sure will be sussed after.

Other than that AlwaysNever dropped off too which I felt could have been from feeling flat and deflated that their scum partner was cornered and not being sure how to assist them.

All the best Rad, I hope you can win this for the town.


VOTE: Goldfish

Here, Spartan hammers on goldfish. At this point, he agrees with me that goldfish would flip scum. And he seemed incredibly certain BBT was scum here. What happened to this read?

Bulba what are your thoughts on BBT, would you be happy with a BBT elimination today?

And this is what started Spartan's push on me. I named four players that, up to that point, I saw as possibly being scum. BBT was on it, but since I tend to get swayed by activity, I was more focused on the inactives than BBT at this point.

[Bulbazoor]

And I strongly think FP is town so I won't be focusing my ISO on him. And this new post by Juice really makes me think he is town as well (the one about the gambit to see where everyone's head was at). If he was scum, he had a free blind BW on me to hop on.

[Bulbazoor]

Alright. Up first for my iso analysis is flowers. Coming shortly.

[Bulbazoor]

ok I’ve read everything!

sorry for a wall - there may be another long post or two as I try to show where I am -

(also, as introduction, this is my first forum mafia game so I am new; I have read through past mafia games but have not played)

townreads

Fancy

&

Juice

: radiate towniness. I could articulate / flesh out my own reads on them but don’t think it would be helpful especially today – basically agree with how both have been townread by I think everyone (even Juice by BBT, & Fancy by Cat, unless I have misread those interactions from today.) I will say – I townread Fancy’s Post 312, the FOS on my slot; I also didn’t understand AlwaysNever’s read that Juice & the BBT/Elemk slot were of different alignments; curious how Fancy’s read on my slot will evolve now that it’s active again.

@Fancy - where are your scumreads at now (after the reread you mentioned you would do)? in the world (this world) where I am town, your PoE is Cat, Spartan, Rad?

town lean

BBT

: is, I think, town. I melded a lot with his thought processes & how his reads evolved when he entered the thread on day one & documented his process of catching-up; in particular, during my read of day one, Fancy & Spartan also started as scummy but trended up quite a lot.

it hasn’t been discussed much & BBT hasn’t brought it up after initially pointing it out, but I did like his suspicion on Rad possibly trying to pocket Spartan – Post 385 & Post 387. Post 590 by Rad initially pinged me a lot because I didn't see why Rad so readily agreed with Spartan’s read that the Cat wagon was being pushed by wolves &, furthermore, Rad being sure there is exactly one wolf on that wagon.

@BBT – I see that you question Rad on his train of thought here & Rad responds in Post 601. were you satisfied with this response -- you don't follow up? & why were you so unconcerned with Rad voting on you? (also, who is in your PoE at this moment? aka where would you go next if Cat flips wolf? – I agree Cat’s play has been independently scummy at least.)

this is a little out of order but – I did also like BBT’s interactions with Juice & then Cat today. I think Juice deserved pressure after end of day one but I like that BBT ended up town reading xem; it reminds me of Fancy’s interaction with Juice on day one, for which I townread both. the interaction with Cat was also… very conflictual… & similar to the Juice interaction in that way, but I can completely see why, from a t!BBT perspective, Cat’s reads are scummier (the misrepresenting.)

idk why BBT’s townread on my slot still seems so strong despite AlwaysNever being inactive? it's the seeming strength of that read, not that it exists, that confuses me. as with Fancy’s read on my slot, I’m curious how BBT’s will evolve now that I’m here.


^^^^
those are current townreads & some questions for BBT. going to take a break & write the rest of my reads later – but, below, is a very quick summary of them.

null

Spartan

(I had been townreading Spartan but I don’t love the case on Bulb who clearly is not satisfying Spartan’s answers – but I can see how t!Bulb is answering them in his own way. also, because I don’t think it’s been mentioned – I think Spartan’s frustration / emotion with respect to BBT’s aggressive entrance & refusing Spartan the hammer on day one seems genuine.)

Bulb

PoE

Cat

Rad

(Fancy's slight push on & re-evaluation of Rad is noted. I will write about what pings me about Rad, especially his votes, but I see others have played with Rad before, like Spartan, & I want to know if anyone has a good meta read on him at this point?)


hm. if the three wagons right now are BBT, Cat, Bulb I definitely prefer Cat. but I need to ISO Cat & also ISO Bulb who I don’t have a good grasp on. then I will place an initial vote

Flower also townreads juice and FP. I think flower town-leans BBT interestingly enough at this point. Did flower ever follow up on my slot? There is nothing for me. And spartan is also null for them here despite them saying they have been townreading them. Did you ever elaborate on why you townread him, flower?

oh I just read Cat's latest three posts & tonally they seem so townie

680, 681, and 682 are the posts flowers is referring to. The first post by cat is a vote on BBT, but they mention they would be fine with me getting voted out. I don't see how this post is as tonally town as flower claims. Especially when it also comes after many others started putting pressure on me and BBT. THe second post is something scum can easily fake. Cat was claiming that FP felt like "he was setting up for when he was wrong twice". I can see where flowers comes from with this. But, it does seem easily fakeable as well. I will have to wait until my individual iso analysis of cat before coming to a conclusion. The last post is cat questioning whether there is a case on her. Sounds kinda like me. I wonder why cat is not pointing out the similarities between the cases against her at that point and me atm.

[Bulbazoor]

The most annoying thing is I did answer his question.

Clearly not to his satisfaction. I think a scum!Bulba is probably less openly annoyed here and more just figuring out why Spartan's not satisfied with his answer, cause what heat does scum!Bulba have this game beyond Spartan's tunneling here?

this is how i'm also reading bulb's reaction to spartan's case! what are your current feelings on spartan? i can see it as town tunneling on town; if there is one mafia i think spartan comes off a little scummier?

At this point flower is still tring me. Why did you back down from saying spartan comes off scummier? All he did was get pissed I didn't answer a question in a way he liked.

omg also I just saw Cat is on E-1 (thanks to... Rad) -- please don't hammer!! now that my slot is active it would be nice to get some more interactions, i think that would be helpful for town. i was on pg27 while finishing typing up my wall

Flower knows my weakness. This post reads tonally town to me. It is protown unless cat is wolf but even then I really like this post for some reason.

my Rad ISO journey {

Rad townlean

}

I was suspicious of Rad (as gestured to in my Post 683 ) because their voting seemed so volatile (not that this is necessarily AI – but, for instance, on end of day one, it felt like Rad, as the second vote on Goldfish & asking Juice to vote as well, was the one who really got the Goldfish wagon going --> a flurry of votes, Goldfish gets to E-1 --> Rad jumps off wagon to vote Elemk (though, true, affirming he would be happy to hammer Goldfish later) which felt, as my initial impression, like it could be an attempt to distance from a wagon that w!Rad had precipitated but knew would flip town. Fancy has pointed out this vote movement by Rad; BBT has questioned Rad’s votes based on Spartan’s read around Post 590 .)

rereading & reevaluation I’m moving Rad to my townleans. I can follow their thought processes today very well & it feels genuine. start of day, Rad seconds Fancy’s suspicions on Cat & my slot at the beginning of today (lurk theory); Rad’s scumread on Cat then diminishes as Cat appears & interacts & also as Juice, Rad’s townread, xemself townreads Cat strongly; Rad votes BBT then settles on Bulb based on Spartan’s theory of at least one wolf on town-Cat wagon; Rad then reevaluates Cat as he decides (I agree) that Spartan’s case on Bulb could likely be TvT – presumably, Rad now townreads Bulb strongly enough he is willing to go against Juice’s townread on Cat; Rad votes Cat again. I see a lot of openness / reevaluation / but also consistency / & attempts to work with people Rad townreads.

it is very alarming that my PoE is only one person now – Cat. & my nulls still just two people – Bulb (still yet to ISO, I really want to re-check how Bulb did on day one) & Spartan. compared to my experience spectating mafia games (usually 15 player setups) i'm finding it noticeably harder to make scumreads!! but I'm not sure what that says about the gamestate & the kinds of wolves in the game?

I’m actually still undecided on Cat or Bulb – I do think Cat’s Post 642 reads very scummy but Cat’s other posts, especially their latest posts read as genuine & frustrated town. I know the reasons Juice strongly townreads Cat & will consider that seriously. I’m curious about Spartan as an option, I’m open to it but I think the threadstate is pointing to Cat or Bulb today. still looking forward to Fancy reappearing (I think he said he would be busy until Friday which is today?) & seeing where his head is at; also want to engage more with BBT

I am going to have to look at cat's latest posts because you do mention them a lot. However, on your last post involving cat I analyzed, I only agreed that one post sounded "towny".

[Bulbazoor]

i will wait for Bulb to give a read on me before i post my current thoughts on Bulb; i did do more rereading -- i want to know what he thinks of my slot now that it's active though.

in the meantime, here are some things i did notice while rereading Bulb & Bulb-adjacent posts.

1.) i had somehow forgotten that Spartan has been putting suspicion on Bulb since day one (though still townreading him on day one)

2.) in my 685 i said that Spartan comes out scummier in his most current exchange with Bulb.

in response to my 685 Rad (i wasn’t reading it like this at the time but) basically defends Spartan? i do still townlean Rad much more than before my ISO but – looking through my notes, it is very noticeable that Rad and Spartan have never scumread or pressured each other during this game / have frequently backed each other up. a few examples (i’m getting really tired from reading & writing & will take a longer break) – 145 Rad dislikes my slot for pair-hunting --> 191 Spartan agrees with Rad. 218 Rad defends Spartan from Fancy’s pressuring. again this 584 --> 590 interaction between Spartan and Rad that pings me a lot. like i said i’m getting tired / lazy but would like others to weigh in on the dynamic between the two if anyone is interested? i know they know each other & may have some meta read; i also think a w/w between them would be too obvious. it would be very helpful if i could townread both of them.

@Rad – how sure are you that Spartan is town? in 687, the Spartan emotion tell is one that i think i had already mentioned in my 683 wall.
@Juice – what is your read on Rad right now? i know Spartan is in your PoE.

3.)

Frankly if it's neither Cat or Goldfish scum deserve the win for being that sneaky,

umm the more i think about this quote the more i dislike it? it doesn't really match up with my image of Fancy as intense, excited detective this game & it almost feels like it's setting up for Cat flipping town

I actually did not dislike that post from FP. I was thinking the same thing as him. Goldfish played very scumlike. And cat was not doing much better at that point. And I tend to TR people who agree with me.

Something interesting is your comments about Spartan and Rad. Nobody even sees them as a wolf pair, so why do you think it would be too obvious of a pairing? I actually think that pairing would make sense considering everything that happened today.

hi i will also give my two nominations by the end of today (i'm in eastern u.s. time)!

i will just give an update on where i'm at right now because my reads have been changing --

1.) i think Cat is probably town (my initial read on the slot was colored a lot by BBT's sun on Cat & i townread BBT). i think their responses to being put under increasing pressure have been good. i very quickly looked at a few of their past town games (including their most recent one, where they were voted off as town on day one) & have found Cat's tone / investment / responses to being sussed in our game more or less consistent with t!Cat. that said i have not found any w!Cat games so idk. (@Fancy / anyone -- if you have time i'm curious what you think? I think at least one of the Goldfish games you (Fancy) looked at on day one had Cat in it too.) i'm not in love with the idea of using the early Goldfish meta scumread on Cat (today brought up by both Fancy & Rad i think?) because it was never explained &, actually, the last post Goldfish made was a scumread on the Elemk-BBT slot.

as for that BBT/Cat interaction today (my initial reason for scumreading Cat) -- tbh i don't know how to read it. these long disagreements of people misrepresenting each other / not responding to questions (Fancy/Juice day one, BBT/Juice day two, BBT/Cat day two, Sparta/Bulb day two)... i realize i tend to read all of them as TvT. (@BBT -- why did you read Juice as town & Cat as scum today when, to me, from the outside, your disagreements with both of them feel the same.) i also don't think w!Cat puts themself on the line to defend t!Juice so intensely; if Juice is town & so widely townread, it's surely in the best interest for wolves to make Juice seem suspicious for end of day one.

// oh Cat just posted twice, will respond, & afterwards continue with the pt 2.) of this post

I don't think it is smart to go off of this very limited meta. I did that day one when I voted goldfish off and look what happened.

2.) i was still waiting for Bulb's new reads but yeah basically i think he comes out of the interaction with Spartan today... just very town. it's a slight townlean because i was also looking very quickly through Bulb's past games (though almost all are from many years ago?) &, in a game where Bulb was mafia, he reacted to being pushed in a way that wasn't... very different. also a lot of annoyance / conviction, so i can see the disappointment about Goldfish flipping town / the frustration with Spartan's case being faked.

in other words i agree with this --

Bulba just feels like frustrated town in all these interactions but I don't think that would be particularly hard to manufacture. I'd like to see some real reads and analysis so I could judge something less abstract than tone. I also don't love that he needs to be prompted to give content.

3.) so... partly as a result / & realizing my read on BBT is now relatively stale / reevaluating the BBT & Cat interaction, i want to do some rereading & get a better grasp of BBT's play this game. i also want to reread Elemk-related stuff from day one because i... kind of glazed over those interactions knowing Elemk would be subbed out. to be transparent, if i had to nominate two people right now, it would be 1.) BBT, 2.) Bulb.

Here is where I am confused. You say you think I come off as very town yet you want me out of the game. Why? Also, what scumgame did you look at? Can you link it here so everyone can reference it? I am not sure what to make of you calling me towny and then saying you want me gone. You might just be newbie town.

[Bulbazoor]

Juice: Bulba / BBT
Spartan: Bulba/ BBT
Bulba: Cat/AlwaysNever
Cat: Bulba/BBT

No Nominations:
BBT
FP
Rad
Flower

update --
Spartan: Bulba/ BBT
Bulba: Cat/AlwaysNever
Cat: Bulba/BBT
Flower: BBT/Bulb

No Nominations:
BBT
FP
Rad

--> striking (partly because of inactivities) that Cat was E-1 & now has only one nomination / idk how to interpret that

I am going to give you a chance to elaborate on your nominations. Why me and BBT? It is weird to me how you said spartan was scummier than me up to this point then you sheep his exact nominations.

VOTE: cat

My reads boil down to strong trs on Juice and Fancy. I don't see myself ever fosing Juice tbh. And then that leaves you, Rad, who I have a weaker tr on. Then, BBT has done well to ease a bit of the suspicions I had on his slot. That leaves Cat, AlwaysNever, and Spartan.

And I can sense scum thinks I am somehow an easy lynch today. I see what you are doing BBT. People just can't see that I am disappointed I was wrong and thus have less motivation to try as much.

@Bulb, as you do your reread! -- just to clarify, did your read on BBT shift between these two posts? when you say "I see what you are doing BBT" what did you mean? between the two posts there was the BBT-Cat interaction -- did you have a read on that.

I am going to be honest: I did not read that interaction. I felt like BBT was trying to take advantage of the fact that I was dejected from the Goldfish flip. And in a way, I was right, but BBT is not the one doing that as I thought he was going to. My read on BBT is null atm. I have to reread his ISO. "I see what you are doing BBT" is my attempt to bring attention to him and make people question him. I am also just kinda passive aggressive and throw digs at anyone who scumreads me when I am town. As I did with spartan today as well in another post ("I will not let you get away with this spartan" or something like that).

Juice: Bulba / BBT
Spartan: Bulba/ BBT
Bulba: Cat/AlwaysNever
Cat: Bulba/BBT
FP: Cat/Spartan
Flower: Bulba/BBT

BBT
Rad

Bulba has 4
BBT has 4
Cat has 2

at this point it really looks like we are going Bulba or BBT - dependeing on what Rad says

See the thing here now is it gives the remaining 2 a chance to influence things as they have seen everyone else's votes, I get that there wasn't really a way for us to do it all at the same time. Lets say at the end we have a draw of 5/5 what would you say our next move is then Juice?

i'm not sure if we have been ordering / or if Juice's post preserves all of our #1 or #2 nominations for scum -- that should matter?

i understand the worry that BBT & Rad would have a lot of deciding-power now, especially between Bulb & BBT. & which one we vote out obviously would matter because i don't think anyone has been saying those are simply the two wolves

Do you personally scumread me or BBT? It doesn't seem like you have many reasons yourself.

i don't think anyone has been saying those are simply the two wolves

If I haven't explicitly been saying it yet, I've certainly been thinking it, the way bulba scum reads Elemk to then having BBT ease his sus on the slot with no real explanation as to how that process happened. Also I believe there was an example of what looks like BBT diverting attention /easing the pressure off Bulba but I can't exactly remember the situation so I would need to go back and try and find that.

when you refer to BBT diverting attention from Bulb -- maybe you mean the series of posts that starts around 563 when Bulb flips his vote from my slot to Cat? which you question. & then Cat & BBT post & BBT claims that Cat has misrepresented him? i can see this as diversion;

i have been been starting to consider about the possibility of Bulb/BBT both being wolves this irl day & this was a spot i noticed as well. in part / trying to understand this better is why i asked Bulb the following question:

VOTE: cat

My reads boil down to strong trs on Juice and Fancy. I don't see myself ever fosing Juice tbh. And then that leaves you, Rad, who I have a weaker tr on. Then, BBT has done well to ease a bit of the suspicions I had on his slot. That leaves Cat, AlwaysNever, and Spartan.

And I can sense scum thinks I am somehow an easy lynch today. I see what you are doing BBT. People just can't see that I am disappointed I was wrong and thus have less motivation to try as much.

@Bulb, as you do your reread! -- just to clarify, did your read on BBT shift between these two posts? when you say "I see what you are doing BBT" what did you mean? between the two posts there was the BBT-Cat interaction -- did you have a read on that.

all of this is helping me see where you're coming from on your case against Bulb; i didn't originally grasp where you were coming from / your goals

But then this argument can be applied to spartan and cat can't it? There was pressure building on cat and spartan flipped attention to me. I am just thinking sometimes we struggle with confirmation bias where we see what we want to see. I am just saying try to look at every possibility.

Almost done with the flower iso and I am thinking town lean. Just misguided newbie maybe? I want to hear more from you

[Bulbazoor]

OK my interest in the game has been reignited.

I, like Bulba was kinda depressed Goldfish didn't flip town, coupled with real life being hectic I slacked and I'm sorry for that.

Cat I'm coming for you.

Your partner is probably Rad or Flowers, that is all.

welcome back Fancy

i'm online right now so feel free to ask me questions & talk with me

Yeah lets!

BBT and Bulba why them? I'm needing a case on either of these two slots.

sorry i don't... which sucks :/

i'm really not seeing Cat as mafia -- if you would like to point me to moments when Cat seems especially scummy, i will look at those moments! i think their response to being pushed today has just been townie but you disagree with this? throughout the day, i've also felt better about Rad & Spartan, both of whom were originally nullish for me. my PoE has been pretty standard but if i move Rad & Spartan & Cat out of my PoE, & i have the very useful information that i am town, then it's just Bulb & BBT. Bulb & BBT as a pair also does make sense for me i think? -- i wasn't a huge fan of Spartan's case on Bulb either but pushing on Bulb about BBT makes a lot of sense & it's a line of questioning i also want to pursue. i think i pointed out a weird Bulb-BBT interaction as well.

i'm interested that Juice has seemed noticeably scummier to you on this reread? i haven't evaluated Juice's slot in a very long time

from your point of view, if i am town who would w!Cat's partner be? Rad?

I would like for you to point me to specific posts that lead you to believe these people are towny. I had rad as a townlean but I am concerned about his actions today.

Time for my gambit - was I interested in who people scum read? Yes.

Did I think everyone would tell the truth? Not at all. I also knew - that with a lot of people town reading me, I had an advantage in making this play.

Four people put forward: Bulba/BBT.

One of you is 100% sheeping me, so I town read you. Which mean either - Spartan, Cat or Flower is second mafia and partnered with BBT.

And Bulba - I haven't scum read you for a while, but you were the perfect candidate for people to vote without any real reason to back it up. The fact that Cat has a large amount of votes - means that is quite possible that he is mafia, and my town read is flawed. But I am confident that at least one of Spartan, Cat or Flower will flip mafia.

My actual town reads: FP, Rad, Bulba

hm ok! how do you read my kind of sudden flip from wanting to vote Cat to wanting to vote BBT/Bulb? (@ anyone, really -- i'm curious how people read my thought processes since entering the game, whether they town- or scum- read it)

I was hoping to find more on why you had a sudden flip. Not satisfied with what I saw sadly. But you do have posts that sound tonally town.

[Bulbazoor]

What happened to BBT? Did he forget he was in this game? Haven't seen them in a while. But they are next on my ISO analysis.

[Bulbazoor]

like I said - people should take my gambit seriously. But if I die tonight - get BBT tomorrow.
And remember FP - is 100% town, there is no way he can be mafia

This is so town I don't want to ISO juice.

[Bulbazoor]

I dread the minute I have to ISO spartan. *shudder*

[Bulbazoor]

Here is a tip for people reading this game: Don't use meta to read BBT. He is a very large anti-meta person so who's to say he didn't change his meta?

[Bulbazoor]

BBT: Originally, I had a slight scumlean on elemk. I had a roller coaster ride with this slot. At the end, I can say he is actually a scumlean for me.

Spartan is sheeping Rad hella hard in this game as well. Spartan has also seen Rad being pocketed before and possibly thinks he is susceptible to it?

Something to keep an eye on.

Interesting. Did BBT ever try to argue with spartan or rad after this?

So let me get this straight juice.

Fancy is definitely scum. And he's scum with either elemk or bulba. So the best move is to vote one of his maybe scum partners?

I don't like this.

Fancy was scum based off of Elemk being scum, no? So it would make sense to vote for his stronger scum read first (that he has reasoning for) and then if he is correct, start pushing Fancy based on the associative?

I'm surprised this wasn't picked up and I'm also surprised that Bulba just agreed with it. Would be the second time Bulba has OMGUS'ed, I retract my town read on Bulba.

Juice is still town. Alwaysnever can probably be town, too. I liked his post regarding Fancy's reads on himself and Goldfish.

Bulba moves into null/scummy, along with Spartan and Rad.

Fancy is still scum.

Here, he questions why I agreed with rad. I agreed with rad because his logic was sound to me. If his strongest scumread was somebody, why would he vote for the people he is not as sure of? It is not rocket science. Or maybe I just misunderstood what rad meant. People forget that misunderstandings happen.

[Bulbazoor]

Why is there only one wagon?

Did BBT even try to strongly oppose the wagon? Seems to me like he just asked this question and then let the BW on goldfish happen while giving the appearance of opposing the BW. That is the vibe this gives me.

Page 7, good posting again from Juice and Alwaysnever

168 from AN is particularly townie

Cat is possible scum bc of their attitude/tone as well, only this time it's actually founded in something bc I've played a lot with her before so I'm familiar with the playstyle as town and scum.

If this isn't explained in more detail in the coming pages, it needs explaining.

Well I did want to pressure you and at the same time I was annoyed that I was being voted as

I tend to have knee jerk reactions any time I am voted.

This feels like an excuse for any reaction that may come from being voted in the future, could be the first scum slip of the game? Hmm

Same for this, in what world is that a scum slip? It's a 'By the way, if people vote me I generally don't like it and tend to bite back.' That's completely NAI

Let me admit: I only really liked BBT this game because from time to time he defended the way I played. But, the read on alwaysnever feels odd. It sounds like a read scum would make on someone that others otherwise might have perceived as scummy just to claim credit if they ever got lynched and flipped town. And as flower posts more, the more I townread their slot.

How can I accept you are town when you're lining up elims?

Only one of BBT/Fancy can be town. I want to elim BBT! BBT was elimmed, he was

town

.

Oh shit, looks like I was wrong. Fancy must be scum then! Fancy was elimmed, he was

town

You see my problem?

This post here is actually not that bad. However, it can definitely come from scum. Maybe I am just cautious of BBT’s experience? I don’t think juice is still following this at this point. Also, why the quick assumption he is lining up elims. I wonder what he would think of this whole nominations thing that transpired.

At no point was he scum telling - but most people weren't listening to me.

Why didn't you push for an alternative?

I know you are town though - because you being scum makes no sense

Who do you think is scum atm Juice?

What do you think of it being Bulba and 1 of Cat, AlwaysNever, or BBT.

I feel like the 2 scum are in that pool of 4.

Alwaysnever is probably town

I was sure of Elemk's slot - and BBT is also looking sus. I don't see how this isn't the logical push today.

Smells like OMGUS

If we assume - that last night a killed was stopped. Mechanics wise for this site - do both mafia have to vote a kill for a kill to happen

Scum have to submit a kill. But you know this already

Why does he tr alwaysnever so hard? And he asks juice why he didn’t push for an alternative but BBT himself did not really offer much resistance to the goldfish BW. He voted juice, who was within almost everyone’s townreads.

[Bulbazoor]

I think people need to read Cat's attack on me again, look at how many false statements she makes and the poor reasoning for her scum read on me, and then come and vote Cat with me.

Spartan, my vote started on Cat just to try and gain a read. Felt like she was the player in the game that I didn't really have much of a handle on and wanted to do something about it. I didn't particularly think she was scum, for lurking or otherwise, but her attack on me and defence of Juice is really poor and now my vote is actually because I think she is scum.

In relation to your Bulba read, do you purely think he is scum because he hasn't answered a question? I notice you mentioned deflecting as well, do you think defensiveness is exclusively a scum trait?

Rad, what did you like about the reasoning exactly?

I do not think BBT and cat are paired together due to this pushing today on cat. He makes a good point about spartan’s case on me. And yes, spartan’s case stemmed from me not answering a question the way he wanted.

Hi Juice,

You appear to still be scum reading me and you should probably stop that and help me elim Cat?

How about it?

I have yet to iso cat. I will see what conclusion I come to once I finish that. However, the more posts I see, the more I think BBT and cat might not be paired. I do recall a game where BBT bussed me hard, so I guess my read on this will depend on how I read cat. If cat comes across as blatant scum, then BBT is more likely to be scum bussing imo. If cat is towny, there might not be a need for a bus for BBT!scum. Unless he sees that it boils down to him vs cat as the only good lynches for today. This game can be complicated sometimes.

[Bulbazoor]

VOTE: BBT

I just get scum vibes from him.

[Bulbazoor]

Reads as of now:
Town/townleans: Flower (reads as newbie town imo), Juice, FP
Null: Rad, cat(I need them to say specifically why they wanted me targeted), spartan
Scum/scumleans: BBT

[Bulbazoor]

This is a really, really bad idea.

Look at the composition of my wagon.

You have a very good point. I will need to iso cat and I guess I will do that today.

[Bulbazoor]

This is a really, really bad idea.

Look at the composition of my wagon.

You have a very good point. I will need to iso cat and I guess I will do that today.

Dude why haven't you iso'd the main wagon yet??

I stopped at BBT because I found what he said scummy. But now he does not sound so bad. Maybe it is just spartan and cat and I am overthinking this? BBT plays similarly to me (questioning any line of logic) and his posts today questioning the case on him seem like me when I was doing the same. So now I am considering just flipping to cat. But, for cat, I like their post 642 so much. I just can't read people unless they say something to make themselves obvious town like juice has. And I don't want to lynch flower today. They are sounding like newbie town to me.

[Bulbazoor]

correction to last post: BBT questions lines of logic that make no sense to him.

[Bulbazoor]

flower is creeping into my stronger townreads the more they post.

[Bulbazoor]

I get how flower feels about BBT. I am getting the same vibe and I am so tempted to just hammer cat but I am so hung up on that one post I mentioned.

[Bulbazoor]

Yep this night was not a no kill. Mafia wouldn't leave us with another shot. So if there is a jail keeper, I am confident we have a confirmed mafia. I would say spartan is mafia

[Bulbazoor]

I don't think it's Rad and BBT. I am inclined to believe it was someone that named me and BBT as their lynch suspects as they saw a possibility of getting me lynched.

[Bulbazoor]

I mean BBT and Rad are not partners imo.

[Bulbazoor]

I still think flower is town

[Bulbazoor]

I am thinking spartan and bbt scumteam?

[Bulbazoor]

Maybe this is just confirmation bias but spartan sounds so fake in these last few posts.

[Bulbazoor]

VOTE: spartan

Not it

[Bulbazoor]

UNVOTE:

It's really you, isn't it? So tempted to vote BBT now

[Bulbazoor]

Other scenario I am praying for is real PR/PRs are hiding and spartan is mafia.

[Bulbazoor]

I am pleasantly surprised. One of my other pairings was BBT and Rad. Nice

[Bulbazoor]

I'm never going to be elimmed from this game so might as well vote bbt

[Bulbazoor]

VOTE: BBT let's call it a day please

[Bulbazoor]

Spartan just hated me for no reason. Ignore him and let's win this game

[Bulbazoor]

Rad and BBT is the team. I refuse to believe my read on flower was wrong. I guess I was wrong on Sparta because PRs tend to be scummy.

[Bulbazoor]

Rad is mafia who made the NK last night is my guess

[Bulbazoor]

I'm not getting elimmed buddy. As much as you want that I am here to win this game. Not to fulfill your wrong scumread on me. I'm voting BBT am I not?

[Bulbazoor]

I don't see any world where a rational town votes me over BBT. I even voted him yesterday while you guys voted Cat, a town

[Bulbazoor]

Props to spartan for being the only town alongside me not to bw town

[Bulbazoor]

It's your time to go BBT.

[Bulbazoor]

Spartan is terrible if he is still even considering me.

[Bulbazoor]

I don't see how a single action of mine can be seen as a scum move. I gave cat time to please their case. I could 100 percent have just declared intent to hammer.

[Bulbazoor]

BBT was softing PR as well so why would mafia target Rad of all people?

[Bulbazoor]

I think Rad was the mafia making the kill

[Bulbazoor]

VOTE: rad

[Bulbazoor]

Except I am not dying

[Bulbazoor]

You are hyper focused on me for no reason. Nobody else wants me out so thankfully you aren't getting your wish

[Bulbazoor]

I am thinking it is rad and BBT

[Bulbazoor]

You are just blinded by confirmation bias against me. Hopefully you can get over it and we can win today

[Bulbazoor]

You are hyper focused on me for no reason. Nobody else wants me out so thankfully you aren't getting your wish

If you was town surely you would be worried of only 1 other town reading you as scum, because wouldnt the two scum of bbt flowers and rad just jump on you?

Well there was a huge ass push on me yesterday but you do you bro

[Bulbazoor]

You are hyper focused on me for no reason. Nobody else wants me out so thankfully you aren't getting your wish

If you was town surely you would be worried of only 1 other town reading you as scum, because wouldnt the two scum of bbt flowers and rad just jump on you?

BBT and Rad is the team I am telling you guys.

[Bulbazoor]

You are hyper focused on me for no reason. Nobody else wants me out so thankfully you aren't getting your wish

Maybe I have information? aha

I am town so there is no way you have anything that points to me scum.

[Bulbazoor]

There is no information on me. Spartan just wants me out for no reason.

[Bulbazoor]

Scum is laughing rn at spartan and his tunnelvision

[Bulbazoor]

I bet spartan would throw this game just to eliminate me. Maybe he is a secret executioner

[Bulbazoor]

Maybe it was bbt and spartan and spartan is not PR.

[Bulbazoor]

UNVOTE:

I will wait to see what spartan does next

[Bulbazoor]

Spartan did say he wanted to cause chaos. Maybe this is it

[Bulbazoor]

Lol 100 percent mafia win. Sure bro

[Bulbazoor]

Rad, BBT, and flower all on the cat BW. Remind me why I am a good target for a lynch out of the pool of 4 again?

[Bulbazoor]

Sigh

[Bulbazoor]

Rad, flower, BBT all on cat BW and yet I come out as the scum to people...

[Bulbazoor]

How does rad suddeny tr BBT. When did this happen?

[Bulbazoor]

I had a good case on goldfish.

[Bulbazoor]

I think rad is projecting. It is him and BBT and he is projecting to make it seem like I am hardcore protecting flower when, in reality, idgaf who dies as long as it is not me and town wins.

[Bulbazoor]

i did not visit crap.

[Bulbazoor]

Well the only consolation from this game is your reactions when I flip town. And then you all will win the award for worst elimination ever.

[Bulbazoor]

And how does me being on a scummy town's BW compare to BBT, Rad, and flowers all being on cat, who was not nearly as scummy?

[Bulbazoor]

I do not fathom a world where I flip scum with my gameplay this game.

[Bulbazoor]

Garbage ass town

[Bulbazoor]

Spartan is legit fake PR if that claim is real. And rad is his partner most likely.

PEdit: I am legitimately town so if that claim is real you are scum.

[Bulbazoor]

Spartan, this has to be a fakeclaim. Just own up to it.

[Bulbazoor]

I am 10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000% town.

[Bulbazoor]

well because I can't visit.

[Bulbazoor]

I am a town.

[Bulbazoor]

Spartan wants to waste the last opportunity before mylo on me. Props to him. Seems like he will be getting his lynch on town!Bulba. And I grimace at the thought that he is really about to get his desire fulfilled.

[Bulbazoor]

After the hateboner he had on me for no reason. And people just blindly follow PR claims which is even worse. I really do not want to give spartan the satisfaction of getting me elimmed.

[Bulbazoor]

I don't know wtf he is doing.

[Bulbazoor]

Why would I vote him? It is possible he is just testing me and really is PR. I have no idea what he is doing.

[Bulbazoor]

So your claim is serious?

[Bulbazoor]

As I haven't played in years, I do not know whether PRs reaction test

[Bulbazoor]

He is just confusing me. I have no idea whether he is PR reaction testing or scum claiming PR.