NY Mafia 155 - New Age Mafia II - Game Over!

[Quagmire]

hey you guys just a reminder i've played 1 game in the past 2 years (and i flaked on it)

[Quagmire]

Vote Glork

for continuing to vote umoms and consciously post even while umoms was L-1. umoms is p. town. more thoughts coming

[Quagmire]

It was anything but 'pack mentality'.

1) It's ridiculously fun.
2) It's useful.

A quicklynch threat on D1 catches players off-guard. It generates reactions that can be studied later with a couple of flips And I would

definitely

have hammered that wagon if he had been at L-1 by the time of my vote; among other things, analyzing who came after me on D2 would be gold.

Analyzing who came after you on D2 would be a big pile of shit and get you nowhere. I hope you're not actually serious.

[Quagmire]

The nhammen wagon is stupid too. What in the world has he done that's scummy?

[Quagmire]

Question for AGar. Why're you voting for nhammen?

[Quagmire]

Question for AGar. Why're you voting for nhammen?

Same question to redFF.

[Quagmire]

By 'pushing the dominoes one way or the other' you mean 'pushing the dominoes one way' because the other way would have been not voting for the quicklynch

[Quagmire]

Unvote

Vote Tierce

[Quagmire]

I fear with Tierce that I'm falling into the "BAD LOGIC == SCUMMIER THAN" logic, which I've prided myself on never fucking up (why I think redFF is town). I need to think about this more.

nhammen's not scum.

[Quagmire]

Also, this redff wagon is bad and people should feel bad.

redFF: 1 (Flameaxe)

wow what a wagon.

unvote, vote redff

dumb? or scummy?

[Quagmire]

._.
It's a difficult pick between being called scummy and trying too hard.

UNVOTE: umoms
VOTE: Rhinox

Why are you voting Rhinox?

[Quagmire]

I've slept on it, and I think Tierce is the way to go, you guys. Her bizarre play reeks of being caught in doing something stupid, and she seems smart enough to understand why that style of play is stupid.

[Quagmire]

I've slept on it, and I think Tierce is the way to go, you guys. Her bizarre play reeks of being caught in doing something stupid, and she seems smart enough to understand why that style of play is stupid.

No because pardon me if I'm wrong but I don't think you've been around at the right time to know Tierce well and I think her behaviour is summed up perfectly by what JDodge and Bella said in Post #168. I do wish she'd stop talking about it, though.

You could be right but I do hang out in scumchat often so you could be wrong too. I can see where you're coming from, but I'm voting for her because of her reaction to it all. It seems there's too much 'trying-to-cover-my-tracks' nonsense.

Also the last PBPA post above ^^^^^^ also is trying too hard. It smells terrible to me.

[Quagmire]

I'm V/LA through the weekend in Kansas City.

[Quagmire]

I haven't really been able to get into this game. Also, an unrelated, outside conversation reminded me of CrashTextDummie's massclaim suggestion for Almost Normal, and my desire to do the same in Closed Normal. I guess I didn't suggest it earlier because it didn't occur to me earlier?

I don't think we'll get anywhere we want to go with a massclaim on d1. I honestly can't tell if you're stirring shit up for the sake of stirring shit up or for the sake of catching bad logic in its tracks.

[Quagmire]

Forgot to include on the last post: And the fact that I can't read Glork at all means I'd totally be down with wagoning him.

[Quagmire]

I'm in on a Simenon wagon too. He's got the "posting just enough substance, but not really anything good" disease.

[Quagmire]

Hi. I haven't read much of the last few pages over the weekend. I'll get to that later tonight. But I'm not claiming anything.

[Quagmire]

I'm in on a Simenon wagon too. He's got the "posting just enough substance, but not really anything good" disease.

No I'm actually catching scum sorry.

OK fine but your case is terrible and built on three posts and zero substance. If that's the best case you can find, you're way rustier than you should be.

[Quagmire]

Not much that can be said about the whole Rhinox situation that hasn't already been said; I can see why one would attempt to obscure a situational immunity like that - it's dumb, to be sure, and it slowed us down and lost us days that we could have been doing something else, but I feel like we as a town keep going after stupid instead of scummy. Speaking of which,

unvote, vote: singersigner

Because I'm sick of that slot being constantly filled with people that are completely useless and not even playing the game at best to intentionally useless at worst.

Come on now JD. You're smarter than this.

[Quagmire]

Actually, you all should be smarter than this. A massclaim D1 does nothing but work against the town's advantage. Why in the world would an actual cop want to claim cop? Or doctor?

All we're going to get are a bunch of VTs and people claiming marginal roles like Rhinox. We'll spend the rest of the day today debating over whether or not Rhinox is using this claim as a coverup for being the godfather or SK, and we'll spend the next three days doing nothing but pretending we have the setup figured out.

[Quagmire]

Let's say I'm a cop. I'm not going to try and sac myself to give up a mafia D1. That's putting the town at a total disadvantage.

[Quagmire]

My scumlist hasn't really changed over the past few pages. Tierce hasn't posted anything since her fake-ass case to deflect attention/show off she's town...and has gotten away with it. Also she claimed VT so if she's telling the truth and gets lynched day one....oh well we just won't have any townies trying to channel scum play.

[Quagmire]

Let's say I'm a cop. I'm not going to try and sac myself to give up a mafia D1. That's putting the town at a total disadvantage.

You're assuming you'll simply get 1-for-1'd. That's a pretty narrow assumption. You assume nothing of worth will pop it's way up in this mass claim as well, that maybe forces the scum onto a higher priority kill.

There's also the very real possibility people pick the wrong cop. And what if there are two and one counterclaims the other?

[Quagmire]

What the hell? Does noone play mafia during a massclaim? Why not?

[Quagmire]

We'll spend the rest of the day today debating over whether or not Rhinox is using this claim as a coverup for being the godfather or SK

I don't see how that should be a discussion topic at all today. If you think I could be GF with my claim you didn't read it closely enough. As for SK, lol @ SK hunting on D1. And there are much better fakeclaims for SK's to make.

Why didn't you speak up about your massclaim reservations before massclaim started?

I did.

[Quagmire]

I've had enough of this inactivity shit. Massclaim was such a horrible idea.

unvote

Vote Glork

[Quagmire]

The Glork vote is fine. He singlehandedly demolished momentum simply by suggesting a massclaim that will do nothing but give mafia more information on who to kill. He's contributed absolutely nothing worthwhile to the game so far and his play seems totally off to me. His head's either not in the game, or he's mafia, and I'm going to choose the latter.

Also I'm frustrated with being the only active poster while everyone else suspends play and waits for umoms to post in a thread he ain't gonna read.

[Quagmire]

Hi. I haven't read much of the last few pages over the weekend. I'll get to that later tonight.

But I'm not claiming anything.

[Quagmire]

I'm fucking serious, though. I joined this game because it had an excellent playerlist, and I'm really pissed off that this playerlist is more interested in sitting on their ass complaining about how bored they are in scumchat than they are in posting in the goddamn game they're supposed to be playing in.

hi i concur 100%

[Quagmire]

I'm also going to preemptively bring up the idea that Quag has not read his role PM because I remember this being a point of contention in tree stump. Confirm/deny?

Correct, I have not read my role PM. But even if I had, I still wouldn't claim.

[Quagmire]

That is against the spirit of the game.

I either want the mod to have proof that Quagmire read his role PM, or I'm replacing out. This is not a threat or a bitch fit, this is a flat-out refusal to play in a game where someone deliberately chooses to act in a way that invalidates D1 scumhunting.

This is an honor system; it's enough for me to have Quag state he read his role PM--if he actually hasn't, hell, that's something against him on an ethical level. But I will not play in these conditions, where a player says he's doing something that will affect the spirit of the game and is allowed to get away with it.

That.... is a threat and a bitch fit.

[Quagmire]

I'm also going to preemptively bring up the idea that Quag has not read his role PM because I remember this being a point of contention in tree stump. Confirm/deny?

Correct, I have not read my role PM. But even if I had, I still wouldn't claim.

I figured as much, just wanted at least one of the reasons out in the open. Care to give the other ones?

I've been against a massclaim from the very beginning. It gives the scum an early-game advantage to have any idea at what role I might be if I'm town.

[Quagmire]

No, it's not. It's a moral issue. We're all on the same ground, but you decided you had the right to absolutely fuck up any scumhunting you do or others do on your slot during, at least, D1. I will not play in these conditions. If you will not fix this, I'm replacing out--so just say the word.

I'm playing to my win condition no matter what I am. I've gone over this numerous times; find my posts about this in MD. I'm not going to go read my role PM, so if you're going to have a hissy fit over Shit That Doesn't Matter then go fuck yourself.

[Quagmire]

If OGML would rather replace me than stir up this drama, he's well within his jurisdiction. But I'm not going to read my PM.

[Quagmire]

I think it's against the spirit of the game to whine and moan like a fussy-ass and replace out when someone doesn't play the way you want them to.

[Quagmire]

I've read my role PM. Christ. I remembered why I hate playing on this site again.

Can we lynch Tierce yet?

unvote, Vote Tierce

[Quagmire]

I don't really think it's much to ask in this game want to be able to figure out whether someone is scum or not by the content of their posts.

Anyway, mods call, dumb argument, leave it to him. This plus the massclaim, the last thing this game needs is more derailing.

You can. You could look at the differences in my posting from d1 to d2, because you know on d1 I'm acting as town.

I will never understand why people will get in such a hissy fit over this.

[Quagmire]

In the interest of keeping the game moving along instead of focusing on a discussion about my play strategies, I will not post about role PM discussion anymore.

Let's talk about who we need to lynch. That person should include one of: Tierce, Glork, Simenon. If anyone wants a good formal case on Tierce I'll whip it up again, but maybe later.

[Quagmire]

Jesus, you guys. Tierce is scum so hard. How do you not see it?

[Quagmire]

JD is strong protown, you guys. I've agreed with pretty much everything he's said so far.

nhammen is interesting, but I don't think I buy it.

V/LA through the weekend.

[Quagmire]

Jesus, you guys. Tierce is scum so hard. How do you not see it?

I'll be having that case you promised, thanks

It'll have to be Sunday or Monday sometime, I'm going out of town this weekend and don't have time to make it here at work

[Quagmire]

Also, REALLY surprising that Sim hasn't claimed. Unless I missed him doing so, I kind of really want to lynch him after Nhammen.
Quag and Singer should claim, too.
:goodfeelings: about Quag went away because I forgot that his "protown behavioral tells" are invalidated by the fact that he had not read his role PM.

As I've said multiple times, I'm not claiming anything today.

More to come later.

[Quagmire]

singer's a silly lynch. Tierce is obviously the best lynch today.

[Quagmire]

Jesus, you guys. Tierce is scum so hard. How do you not see it?

I'll be having that case you promised, thanks

Here you go

I would like to take this time to note that I believe I am developing a blind spot towards Tierce; I'm finding it too easy to excuse her behavior as her trying to impress us or trying to use knowledge that I'm not entirely sure she understands, so I'm finding it hard to justify any of her actions as scum. I'm worried that this is a problem for me going forwards.

I've wondered the same thing myself. Is Tierce just a terrible player? Someone I just don't like and am more inclined to think is negative/mafia? Is her bitch fit over my playstyle affecting my judgment? At the very least, I suspect it's why noone's taking my thoughts on her seriously.

Not only is there no reason to think Umoms is scum, but the person who is in my book most likely to be scum is hanging on the back end of that wagon.

Tierce, my comment on bellas posts were tongue and cheek, yes, but they were also an attempt to try to steer the conversation in a more productive direction. Izzy's answers to those questions mattered to me. The fact that you blew them off doesn't necessarily read as weird to me on its own, but it does sort of give the impression that you're attempting to stay in randomness. Like, a sequence of

Person A: statement, joke, etc.
Person B: Somewhat serious question with a slight hint of joke.
Person C: HAHAH QUESTION DOESN'T MATTER LETS JUST KEEP VOTING RANDOM PEOPLE.

is suspicious to me. I also don't like how aggressively you jumped on the back end of the umoms wagon with no justification for it.

Unvote, Vote: Tierce

Of course I jumped on aggressively--that was the

whole point

. Push a quicklynch/quicklynch threat on D1, see where the pieces fall and mine the reactions garnered from it on later days. I've already explained this on #98. If I had hmm'd and haw'd about it we wouldn't be having these kind of developments; I wanted to take a decisive stance, to push the dominos one way or the other. People started scattering like frightened chickens, and with a few flips, we're going to have a better understanding of the interests behind this wagon and the reactions to it.

How did I 'blow your questions off'? My impression of Izzy's vote and comments about you was that they were RVS+jokes, and that you were overreacting in a weird manner and trying to fish too deeply for motivation. It felt like cheap posturing. This is not 'blowing questions off', this is "I find your Post 36 scummy", period.

Yes, my own vote at the time was still RVS, I made another RVS joke in the same post (about Bella) and could have shifted to you; I chose not to because, after Glork's #47, I had a plan of action re: the next quickwagon that developed--push it to L-2, L-1 or hammer it.

The first significant marker in this game is the quicklynch attempt on umoms. While obviously a stupid idea, and at the time I agreed with Shea about her scuminess, if her play would remain consistently poor, illogical or quirky I would more or less agree with JDodge's post I quoted above. But it hasn't:

I don't see any evidence of Rhinox looking for motivations--he's jumping on actions and declaring them scummy without showing how, if ever, said actions further the scum cause. He's more interested in criticism than in finding scum.

redFF's tone reeks of "boy oh boy we caught a pseudo-scumslip party time". Look at how he addresses nhammen. Why is he apologizing for stringing him up? If he was THAT cheerful as town, he would be keeping it up, delighted that he had found a legitimate slip and would see someone flip scum very soon. He knows the slot is going to flip town.

And frankly, the number of situations in which this happened/didn't happen is not statistically significant, IMO.

As for you, I don't have a read yet. (Though thinking back that reaction to my vote shows a different mindset from redFF's, so town points for you I guess. I have to analyze this further.) And you're not going to get reads on 'everyone' on D1 of a large from me.

She's pushing vague, simple cases on people who have received little to no attention...and this is coming from someone who supposedly reads a lot of games and has to have studied up on good case practices. Both Rhinox and redFF had virtually flown under the radar at that point...a QuagScum meta, mind you, is to push cases on those under the radar D1 so in the future I can be seen as scumhunting and still avoid the potential spotlights that come with simple bandwagon lynches on protown players (which Tierce has done today also, while defending it with GlorkScum meta)*. Thus, I view this behavior as a scumtell. In addition, other than these few light and fluffy posts, she's been posting contentless one-liners** while still maintaining the illusion of being active.

I also thought it was fairly convenient the bitch fit over my role PM came right as there was some momentum starting to build on the Tierce wagon. But, that's just theorizing and grasping at straws.

*Ignore that I'm doing this right now. K?
**Ignore that I do this. K?

[Quagmire]

In fact, if I were a wagering man, I'd bet just about anything that Sim is some form of scum. I'd even be willing to lynch him

over

Nham today.

See my post previous. This is why I have a scumread on Simenon too. I'm totally down with his wagon.

As for nhammen, I'm getting a neutral read. I don't buy the argument that his reaction whips him up as scum...in fact I get an "aw shucks guys that does sound pretty damning" which is protown if anything.

[Quagmire]

Is that... it?



Doesn't phase me. I mean, it's better than "she's scum for srs guise," but I would think that you have some real-big catch.

Well, it's better than the case on nhammen, and definitely the one on singer.

[Quagmire]

I'm here. What rhinox pointed out about singer is valid. Vote stays.

No, it's not. It's paranoid.

[Quagmire]

I'd also like to take a moment to restate how fucking annoying it is that we have an amazing player list and yet it feels like only 3 of us seem to be putting forward any level of actual effort in playing this game.

Agreed

I blame the massclaim.

[Quagmire]

@nhammen: I mean it feels like an opinion that predates this game and isn't tied very strongly with alignment.

Unvote nhammen

I did think nhammen was scummy earlier, it wasn't just pressure, but I think his responses have been sensible.

Few people looks a bit scummy and not sure who to vote for. I'd like to see scooby with a wagon on him. Quilford looks scummy too.

I could probably do with posting a full ranked playerlist, I have too many neutrals atm.

You really haven't done much this game. I'd like to see you contribute more as the deadline draws near.

[Quagmire]

If the deadline gets near I'm not voting singer.

[Quagmire]

Hello Daisy, what would you like from me? I've stated my beliefs about the current wagons, and given my next preferred lynches, with reasons. Would you like me to expand on those? If so, which ones? Do you just want me to post more?

You need to be more proactive in the game instead of reactive, like you have been; instead of "people are talking about singer, I'd better comment on it," think, "who's scummy, and how can I bring light to it?"

[Quagmire]

Quilford I'd like to see your 'proper analysis' because so far you haven't had any

[Quagmire]

Someone else read AGar's ISO and tell me if you think it's scummy too.

[Quagmire]

I'm going to start out this post by noting that this is a bit of a cash-out of all my current opinions; I feel I'm a bit of a likely target amongst vanillas and feel that any potential inv-immune SKs have a higher incentive to go after strong players than any of the power roles on the board at the moment (if I'm remembering them properly) so I'd rather make 150% sure we have my opinions out fully. Players I would like to see commit to stances on as many people as possible on under the same line of thought include Glork and Quag (aforementioned two other people in the game who seem to be putting forth effort).

I'm not going to post a wall of text like you did but I've made a quick spreadsheet of how I'm feeling at the moment.



Blue means leaning neutral-town. Red means neutral-scum. Stars mean I haven't noticed their posting at all so they have successfully flown under the radar and I have zero on them. Which is another way of saying STEP IT UP!!!!!

[Quagmire]

Someone else read AGar's ISO and tell me if you think it's scummy too.

It doesn't matter if it is - he claimed vig.

I don't understand what that has to do with anything, other than yes I do agree we shouldn't lynch him D1 and stick with a VT. 'Tis a great excuse for the gunsmith to not waste his time with him.

[Quagmire]

I don't understand what that has to do with anything, other than yes I do agree we shouldn't lynch him D1 and stick with a VT. 'Tis a great excuse for the gunsmith to not waste his time with him.

He claimed prior to the Gunsmith claiming, so he wasn't claiming to avoid a possible Gunsmith's gaze. I highly doubt scum is claiming vig in this setup.

I'm not so sure I share your opinion.

[Quagmire]

Someone else read AGar's ISO and tell me if you think it's scummy too.

Love how your play has degraded since reading your role PM.

Combination of already posting what I can find, and frustration. I'm still considering replacing out.

[Quagmire]

Someone else read AGar's ISO and tell me if you think it's scummy too.

Love how your play has degraded since reading your role PM.

Of course it would be shameful of you to try and pull the "you're not posting well" card since you've posted virtually nothing of substance this entire game. But you wouldn't be trying to do that, right?

[Quagmire]

The deadline is also a few hours away. Since Tierce ain't gonna get lynched,

unvote

. As I've said previously, I'm not voting singer...I don't see her pulling this gambit as scum on day one. I'd vote nhammen I guess. There have been worse day 1 lynches.

[Quagmire]

Okay, you guys have my focus now. I'm sorry for not giving it sooner.

Cool. Where's the posting you keep promising?

[Quagmire]

As the deadline's tomorrow.

vote: nhammen

[Quagmire]

I agree with JDodge, but I'm going to hold off voting singer for now. I took some notes on this game, and will consult those and want to see substantive posting come out before we lynch anyone.

[Quagmire]

don't lynch singer yet, k guys? i still need to post (can't now, bedtime)

[Quagmire]

If anything, his reluctance/apathy around deadline when we had two scum wagons running is suspect.

If you actually go look at my posts from day 2, you'll see they were implying I wanted to post stuff and some analysis before we did any lynching. I had no time to make said posts. Day ended in like two days.

[Quagmire]

I'm going to go ahead with a bold assertion and say that Quag shouldn't claim unless his claim will have an incredibly obvious immediate benefit to the town; I believe securely in his towniness and feel that bit of uncertainty that we can have over the scum is quite nice at this point.

It makes sense for me to claim. It made sense for me to claim yesterday, but luckily nothing bad has come out of it.

I am a 1-shot gunsmith. I went back on day one and tried to find who was most suspicious. Originally it was Tierce, but Hoopla's #569 did a pretty good job of convincing me otherwise, and I thought there was enough attention on Tierce it was possible others would target her as well. Turned out I was right.

Instead I went over d1's posts and wagons and thought it was quite convenient Hoopla hardly mentioned nhammen at all upon replacing into the game. Hoopla does not have a gun.

[Quagmire]

I haven't read any of day 3's action so far, nor have I processed anything from d2 yet. It's been a busy 7-10 days. I'll do that and post some proper analysis in the next few days. Let's take our time today...we're 2-for-2 in lynches and we have an opportunity to step on scums' throats if we stay clear and focused.

[Quagmire]

Quagmire, when did you do this "

[going]

back on day one"? And why didn't you have an issue with bev's claim, after there was a claim from a cop as well?

1. I took about an hour of RL time during N1 to re-analyze everyone and their wagons when I was trying to decide who to use my night action on. I actually had a sheet of paper analyzing voting patterns but I seem to have lost it.
2. Why would I have an issue with bv's claim? 2 one-shot gunsmiths aren't broken. I actually think it makes him fairly close to confirmed town in my book.

[Quagmire]

Why did I expect more intelligent play out of AGar?

[Quagmire]

Can someone please link me to the previous setup?

[Quagmire]

Thanks.

[Quagmire]

Apparently one that you aren't, since one of the gunsmith innocents is in your lynch list.

I don't see any reason to trust gunsmith innocents.

[Quagmire]

I don't get the case on scooby. He's a frustrated, lazy poster and people are just getting out-of-tune with his gimmick. What's the current case on him, a roleblock? I'm getting a pretty solid pro-town read on him.

Glork, care to explain why you've been hunting for simenon's head the past couple days, then voted scooby once today opened,

then

reread simenon?

Simenon, care to post something? If you can't get internet access for the next couple weeks, it might be a good idea to announce as such to not leave anyone hanging.

[Quagmire]

So, I'm looking at Rhinox right now. Claims mafia-bulletproof (?) in a game with fairly unsophisticated roles and one single one-shot vig. He's also been branded suspicious in the past and has gone under the radar since iamausername caught nhammen and singer became guilty. Can someone give me a good reason why I shouldn't vote for him?

Vote: Rhinox

[Quagmire]

I've got as-good-as-confirmed town reads on Hoopla and JDodge. Moderate town reads on scooby and bv. Scum reads on AGar, Rhinox... and Glork's given me a bad gut all game long.

[Quagmire]

Scum reads on AGar, Rhinox... and Glork's given me a bad gut all game long.

AGar is a confirmed killer - how can you classify him as mafia?

There's no way Glork proposes massclaim as scum here. I think it's obvious he did it because he believed town could get an edge from it, rather than trying to secure town credit from the ploy. If he were to do it as scum, he'd probably have to warn his buddies pregame and plan for it - because you really risk trapping your buddies if they react badly or claim poorly (like singer did). So, if they did plan for it pregame, why would singer fuck up so badly D1?

I use 'scum' to encompass anyone who's not pro-town. It's plausible he's SK.

Glork also defended singer extremely hard D1 and D2, further discounting the scum bandit. But I can't fight the feeling...as I said, it's all gut.

[Quagmire]

Flameaxe also suffers from "posts just enough; nothing substantive" disease, and should not be forgotten about. Same with redFF.

[Quagmire]

In looking at the differences in power roles between New Age I and what we have claimed here, I'd be very surprised to see a godfather + scum power role...if anything, I think we'd see a repeat of 3 goons + GF (likely) or 3 goons + 1 power role (unlikely, unless that power role is powerful...for example, Staeg). The former is especially likely if the GF is gunsmith-immune and investigation-immune, given the information roles that are in this game.

[Quagmire]

I'm pretty set on Rhinox being the play today, I think. His roleclaim has me suspicious, considering how sophisticated his role is in comparison with all other claims...note he was the first one who had to claim, so he didn't have that observation to back up off if he was scum/SK. Also, remember he soft-claimed at the beginning as well. He's flown under my radar, so he passes the gut/sniff test too (or failed...depending on how you'd look at it). He is also not a role we would end up missing either if he is telling the truth and we are wrong, as his role advantage is negated by being out in the open.

[Quagmire]

What exactly are the objections to a Stag lynch?

If he's a town RB, mafia will kill him in the next day or two anyways unless they're stupid. If he's a mafia RB, we'll find out in a couple days whether or not he's still alive. Scum shouldn't view him as a threat because noone is taking his posting seriously right now but should still kill him for the sake of potentially being the only person alive who can damage their kill target.

[Quagmire]

unvote
Vote: Quagmire

I was in a hurry when I made that post, so uhh, sorry, I guess?

Welcome back to the top of my list!

Vote: Staeg

.

@Quag 840: Leave that thought-line where you found it. I want absolutely no part of it anywhere near this thread ever again. Thanks! <3

It's been brought up before.

Mod Edit: fixed broken link

[Quagmire]

^^^^^ pst. OGML? please fix? ^^^^^^^

[Quagmire]

Staeg is a stupid play today you guys. Stop getting pissed off because someone's stupid.

Izzy. Get your head in the game, or replace out. For the love of god. Quit using your confirmed-town status to skirt caring.

[Quagmire]

Why is he scum?

[Quagmire]

I wouldn't mind a Flameaxe lynch after we lynch Rhinox.

[Quagmire]

scooby's posting makes me lol, and in the good way where it's legitimately funny and NOT in the condescending way where I'd pretend they're terrible

[Quagmire]

Although his last 2 posts are +++ scumpoints. Posting d1-analysis and then a vote on a competing wagon with a little momentum.

[Quagmire]

Can we get a votecount please? So I can urge the people who are voting for scooby to instead vote for Rhinox?

[Quagmire]

I'd actually rather lynch redff than scooby at this point. Scooby's wrong but I'm starting to think he actually thinks he's right. redff hasn't said why he finds me scummy, he's just sheeping bad cases, letting those pushing the bad cases catch all the backlash after I flip town.

vote: redff

Will hammer scooby of course just feel better about a redff lynch now.

It can't be any more obvious you guys

Seriously. I'm not switching to scooby.

[Quagmire]

You should. It would make all our lives so much easier!

[Quagmire]

Doesn't anyone else think it's at least

slightly

suspicious we have a mafia-NK-immune player in a game with zero evidence of an SK and only one

one-shot

vigilante? I don't even know what Rhinox has done that's scummy (outside of refusing to jump on scooby a few posts above), but that's a giant red flag in itself.

[Quagmire]

I'm not completely discounting an SK in this game by any means. I just think Rhinox's claim works out really great (meaning: caught in a big fat lie) if we have 5-14, and so far we've seen no evidence that supports 1-4-14, so until that happens, I'm inclined to think the former.

I also don't think we should count Rhinox in the 'town power roles' department because the only advantage he has is now out in the open, rendering it totally useless. And, the only way we're going to get to test his role is if the SK (which we're not sure exists) kills him, or he gets lynched.

I see Hoopla's et al's logic in killing off the VT pool until we've hit all mafiosos, but I think we should use that as a last resort. The amount of info we'd gain from the setup would be greater if we lynched Rhinox today, because if he's telling the truth we probably have an SK out there.

[Quagmire]

I just think it's really unlikely for there to be a protown mafia-NK-immune role with only one single shot for the mafia-only qualifier to be nullified.

Either way, it's more info than just lynching scooby, a harmless VT.

[Quagmire]

Unvote

I have read along since the game started, so I have a rough idea of the major events in the game. As a spectator, it's difficult to form opinions though, since you're not nearly as invested in the game. I'll need some time to reread to form opinions.

@scooby: vanilla townie, as Simenon claimed during the massclaim.

Deadline is coming up soon, there are two split factions on who to lynch today, and the past couple days have had light posting. If anything, we could use your thoughts on what's happened on day 3 so far.

[Quagmire]

scooby: Your last like 8 posts haven't done much to clear you has town. Most people know they're voting you because you're the VT alive that's posted the least content.

[Quagmire]

I am finding this RhinoX case quite persuasive. I still think Stag is the best lynch right now, but RhinoX is a cause I might consider backing.

There is literally zero good reason to lynch Staeg today and it's been pointed out 100 times why. Care to explain your reasoning on why you are voting for him?

[Quagmire]

Sorry guys, I'm asking to be replaced. I'm heading back to school in 2 weeks, and the amount of time I'm going to have available for anything is going to be drastically reduced. I'm not going to have the time to keep up with a game this size. Sorry.

This is going to happen to me exactly two weeks from today. As I'll be working FT and at school PT, my schedule will be stressed. I will try to post as much as I can but my activity will probably decline. Just a heads up.

[Quagmire]

- We did a mass claim.
- We lynched scum days 1 and 2.
- Current wagons are on Rhinox and scooby
- Current scooby voters cannot give any solid reasoning behind scooby lynch other than he claimed VT and hasn't been posting the most content in the world. Nothing actually scummy about him.
- Rhinox claimed some weird mafia-NK-immune neighbor role when there's only evidence of me (1-shot vig) having killing power outside of the mafia. Has played awfully and tried to push very weak bullshit cases. Had a scumread on singer D1, only to recant when the cop guilty came about on D2, instead liking to believe that the claimed cop was lying about his result.
- You should vote for Rhinox.

Thanks for ignoring my points on scooby! <3

With that said, Rhinox's latest is a bad post and he should be ashamed of it.

He said "solid reasoning" that's why he ignored it.

[Quagmire]

I suppose at this point I'm probably getting lynched in some point in the game regardless so it may as well be today. Some of you will see soon enough just how stupid you're being and the rest of you will be forced to do something other than sheep the pathetic garbage that passes for a case these days.

Rhinox. Read my posts on the last page...they address our course of action if you are town. I don't think we're off the train tracks by any means if you end up flipping town.

[Quagmire]

Your ability is essentially useless now, the only way it could possibly help the town is if we get to LYLO in endgame and someone else hid an NK-immune ability from the world.

I just think it's likely you slipped (I disagree with Michel; I think your reaction on day 1-softclaim was panicked more than anything) and we might be lynching the godfather today. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong...but we can afford to swing for the fences today, since we're 2-for-2, and other than this noone has anything other than "let's lynch the VT pool since there are probably 2 scums in that." If there's a better case out there, I'm all ears.

[Quagmire]

People I'm going to take a look at tomorrow include: Flameaxe (lazy bandwagoning all game long; posts-enough-but-zero-content disease); redFF (does nothing); MichelSableheart (I'm not sure I agree with Glork's eval on sim's scumminess).

[Quagmire]

JDodge, you've spent far too much time moaning about the inactivity of this game. Why in the world are you still voting Staeg?

[Quagmire]

48h != 5 days since your last post, and it's not my job to ensure you're active elsewhere, I'm playing with you

in this game

. It's good that you're keeping yourself busy, but I'm not a mind-reader, so

tone down the pointless aggression.

pot --> kettle

[Quagmire]

JD makes a good point. Rhinox has been trying to play the game; we could keep him alive today, lynch scooby instead, and save him for later. I'd be down with lynching either.

[Quagmire]

Rhinox. I feel kind of bad. The only reason I'm voting for you is because your ability is bizarre in a game full of conventional roles and the only evidence we have of a third-party killing role is a one-shot vig. Will you forgive me?

[Quagmire]

Anybody want to jump to Flameaxe or redFF instead?

I'm game for lynching Rhinox or any of the VTs. Just so long as we lynch someone.

[Quagmire]

I'm probably going to be out all day tomorrow so can we please lynch someone soon? I'm ready to drop a hammer right now and can understand both the cases on Rhinox and scooby.

[Quagmire]

Deadline is in 24 hours. It ain't gonna happen.

[Quagmire]

I can get behind it I guess

unvote

vote Flameaxe

[Quagmire]

I'd still rather lynch Rhinox today

[Quagmire]

Deadline is in less than three hours and someone needs to get lynched.

[Quagmire]

Alright, Izzy, your turn.

[Quagmire]

We need to stop floating along, policy lynching VTs. I'm going to do some wagon analysis over the past couple days when I get time (so probably won't be too soon since classes start today) so we have a good idea on who to lynch. I'm still not convinced on Rhinox's towniness either.

[Quagmire]

Rhinox, from your conversations with Glork, do you think he is town or scum and why? I'm inclined to vote for him today, although I'm going to wait until I do my analysis referenced in the above post before I make a decision.

[Quagmire]

I want to think this is more evidence we don't have an SK and instead 5 scums, but again Staeg is just the optimal choice to kill. Or he got lucky last night.

[Quagmire]

You barely mentioned each other.

Wrong, he was my biggest scumread and if you read my day 1 iso I call him scum from quite early on and (as you said) was first on his wagon.

And he attacked me a lot early in the game.

You act like this means something.

[Quagmire]

Michel: Why couldn't Hoopla be Godfather? I'm not for lynching her but it's plausible she's scum and I'm not.

[Quagmire]

I've created a quick-reference document of some major vote count periods up to this point. You can download it here. It's a quick-n-dirty look. It doesn't contain every official VC by OGML, just ones I deemed had major changes in them.

I just made it so I have to look at it yet

[Quagmire]

Whoops. The correct link is here: http://czwief.com/wp-contact/mafia-votes.docx

[Quagmire]

Just an initial look at these voting patterns makes me want to lynch scooby or redFF today.

vote redFF

Still looking around.

[Quagmire]

If anyone has wondered why my posting quantity and quality has declined over the past couple RL weeks, please review this post:

Sorry guys, I'm asking to be replaced. I'm heading back to school in 2 weeks, and the amount of time I'm going to have available for anything is going to be drastically reduced. I'm not going to have the time to keep up with a game this size. Sorry.

This is going to happen to me exactly two weeks from today. As I'll be working FT and at school PT, my schedule will be stressed. I will try to post as much as I can but my activity will probably decline. Just a heads up.

[Quagmire]

I'm most content with lynching redFF today. I would also be happy to lynch Rhinox, Glork, Michel and Tierce.

[Quagmire]

Your vote hinges on Quagmire being scum, ergo he is the slightly more sensible vote if you've resigned yourself to gambling on conspiracy theories.

No, it doesn't hinge on me being scum. Unless, are godfathers not typically immune to gunsmiths? My being away from mafia for 1-2 years has really gotten me behind on mechanics of modern setups.

[Quagmire]

HEY JDODGE!!!!!!

Where have you been?

[Quagmire]

Here's a list of where we're at with claims and strategy. Let me know if I missed something.

Living (12/19)
1. Hoopla [VT]
2. Glork [VT, neighbor with Rhinox]
3. Quagmire [one-shot gunsmith]
4. Tierce [VT]
6. Bella [Innocent Child]
7. Rhinox [neighbor, mafia-nk-immune]
9. scooby [VT]
11. AGar [one-shot Vig]
13. Knight of Cydonia [one-shot gunsmith]
14. redFF [VT]
16. MichelSableheart [VT]
19. JDodge [VT]

That's 7 VTs out of 12, with maximum of 3 mafia left. I'm inclined to think the innocent results from the gunsmiths (Hoopla and - embarrassing - I forgot?) should be last on the list, as well as the Staeg roleblock on scooby.

[Quagmire]

If Glork is scum, the longer we let him live, the more of a threat he becomes. A Glorkscum with 3-4 left in LYLO is a recipe for disaster. He also pushed for the massclaim D1, which I guess I was the only who thought was a scum-motivated move at the time. We'd really be in the hole if Psyche didn't get that guilty on singer.

[Quagmire]

If Glork is scum, the longer we let him live, the more of a threat he becomes. A Glorkscum with 3-4 left in LYLO is a recipe for disaster. He also pushed for the massclaim D1, which I guess I was the only who thought was a scum-motivated move at the time. We'd really be in the hole if Psyche didn't get that guilty on singer.

My massclaim directly netted us one scum (nham saying "I claim") and indirectly caught us the other scum (singer's refusal to claim leading to the investigation on her). If I'm scum, I literally threw the game away on D1.

Anyway, reading this when I get home tonight. I promise. No matter what.

You seriously can't use nham as a defense here. Sorry.

[Quagmire]

Noone has correctly explained why exposing the entire town's power role structure has benefitted the town. As I said, Psyche's result on singer was a pretty lucky flip, otherwise we'd be in over our heads. How is it possible you're still defending the idea?

[Quagmire]

No, it doesn't.

[Quagmire]

I'm V/LA this weekend. Let's lynch redFF instead.

[Quagmire]

I'm demotivated about this game in a manner that is really absurd. It makes no sense. I don't think it was the D1 massclaim, it's probably the low activity. Granted, that is also my fault, but... just sitting here, not motivated to go through what was already posted. We're still ahead, there's no reason I should feel this bleh about it--the last time I was so irked and demotivated about a game was Mini 1333, but the circumstances are not the same.

Question, redFF--what alignment do you prefer playing as?

@OGML: I'll be LA from the 15th to the 22nd.

You should probably get a replacement.

[Quagmire]

unvote

vote michelsableheart

[Quagmire]

Glrok, concisely summarize for me why early mass claim is pro-town in abstract terms.

it's indefensible, that's why he won't do it

vote redFF

[Quagmire]

KoC is town as hell, you guys.

[Quagmire]

Because you're the most useless townie on the VT list.

[Quagmire]

KoC is a claimed gunsmith - to me, almost completely confirmed town. So he's not an option.

Tierce has numerous townpoints for coming up gunless.

The VT options (we don't need to start lynching power roles yet) then become: Glork; scooby; redFF; CES.

[Quagmire]

I'm still game for lynching Rhinox too, but it still makes sense to put his issue on the backburner for now. It's notable one of the biggest defenders of Rhinox is Michel.

[Quagmire]

I have town reads on Glork, quag, Scooby and CES. Scooby and Quag are the two strongest of those I'd say.

Bella is innocent child.

I seem to remember liking Bev as town for some reason, need to reread but yeah I don't really wanna lynch KoC.

I think there's scum in Tierce and rhinox, possibly both. Tierce has done nothing this game. Day 1 she was on rhinox but he was in no danger of being lynched, wasn't on nhammen wagon. Day 2 she got on Singer but w/e. Day 3 she tunneled scooby who is and was obvtown and then when it looked like rhinox was being lynched initiated a mass switch to flameaxe.

Tierce

, what changed between day 1 and 3 to make Rhinox go from one of your top suspects to someone who you saved from being lynched?[/b] I honestly think this change in attitude towards Rhinox may condemn them both. She was also on Scooby yesterday and not Sableheart. Tierce is generally regarded as a good player, so either she's really off her game or scum. She's also been tunneling on me, and seems to have some meta stuff on me she's researching, where is that Tierce?

in fact

vote:tierce

Agar depends on Rhinox's flip for me but could be SK, Rhinox's role looks weird if he's telling the truth and all we have is 1 scumteam and a 1 shot vig. Would like a rhinox flip, dunno why you guys are so against it.

This post is also super scummy.

[Quagmire]

If anyone actually thinks both KoC and I would fakeclaim the exact same town power role, you should really get your head checked.

[Quagmire]

You sound desperate.

[Quagmire]

Part of me really wans to make a case against Quagmire, but:
A) I'm lazy as fuck;
B) It'll probably just get me lynched, and then nobody will go back and heed my words after I'm dead.

I just wanted to post this for posterity, though.

"It'll get me lynched so I won't try it" is not a pro-town mentality unless you're afraid your case is so shit it'll fall apart on first inspection.
Your obsession with trying to lynch PRs is, again, noted.

ITT, KoC misses the point entirely. I would have no problem making the case and getting lyched for it if I thought it would convince a majority of the town that Quag is scum.

But, do you actually think I'm scum?

[Quagmire]

This game is getting a little too testy so I think everyone should click this link and take a couple seconds to browse around.

[Quagmire]

I don't understand why people are trying to make this game so much more complicated than it needs to be. Let's lynch the VT pool. redFF has been desperately trying to restart the bandwagon on Rhinox.

Tierce: You know that vote on scooby is dumb. His roleblock is just as many townpoints as the gunless result on you.

We need to go back to Occam's Razor and lynch redFF.

[Quagmire]

Again, there are likely 5 scum, with 1 power role scum somewhere within here. Here is the full player list (minus confirmed Izzy/Bella), broken down by VT/not VT.

VT:

Cogito Ergo Sum
redFF
Glork
Tierce
scooby

NOT VT:

Knight of Cydonia rep. bv310 D3, rep. Thestatusquo D1
Quagmire
Rhinox
AGar

4 power roles and 5 VTs. Unless there are 2 scum in the power roles (unlikely - I am town, and I consider KoC to be super town as well...the setup "fits" in OGML's last game, and if you assume I'm town, it would have taken some really good fakeclaim by KoC to claim my exact one-shot role), we can continually lynch VTs until we're out. Considering Tierce's gunless townpoints and scooby's roleblocked townpoints, that leaves Glork-CES-redFF, with a Rhinox potential I'm still confused about.

I'd suspect mafia will want to kill the power roles since they're closer to being confirmed, although they did kill VT Hoopla last night.

[Quagmire]

Something quick as I do stuff elsewhere:

It still makes no sense for Glork to be scum. You people are forgetting the way singer dealt with the massclaim D1; Glorkscum would not go into D1 without making sure his buddies were prepared to handle something like this. In addition, Glork is too good a player to make a throwaway comment like he did about Quagscum. He's just town that can't be arsed, and

Izzy

you lot are barking up the wrong tree

again

.

And if we're going to wonder about the NKs, Hoopla and Glork make both sense as targets for last night--but Hoopla was the one with a gunsmith clear on her, which makes her a prioritized kill.

The Rhinox vote is still stupid, though.

tl;dr: I think Glork is town and we'd better not have any of that 'why is he (still) alive' nonsense, that's what scum want.

I tend to agree with you about Glork but I can't shake the feeling that he's been playing weird the entire game, and is now all of a sudden trying to lynch power roles when he's now near the front of the line in the VT pool.

[Quagmire]

This game is getting a little too testy so I think everyone should click this link and take a couple seconds to browse around.

YALL TAKE MY DAMN ADVICE OK?!?!

[Quagmire]

While scooby isn't confirmed town by any means, again I will reiterate Occam's Razor, in that any sort of evidence against scooby being scum should be put on hold while we attack those who do not have any townpoints.

There is someone who has claimed one-shot not-a-gunsmith (AGar). The reason I think KoC is all but confirmed town is if he were scum he would have either a) gotten a fakeclaim from the mod (which would have clashed with my actual role), or b) gotten extremely lucky to pick one-shot-gunsmith. I would be much more wary if he had picked 'gunsmith'.

[Quagmire]

I don't know how you can't see how my reasoning doesn't make sense from a one-shot gunsmith's perspective. Remember, that's my role too. And I refused to claim during the D1 massclaim, so he either a) has that role, or b) came up with a really lucky fakeclaim. Recall in OGML's last setup there were two one-shot townspeople also.

[Quagmire]

And I full well understand why scooby's "townpoints" are minor. They are just more townpoints than, say, redFF has.

(I also have a townread on scooby)

[Quagmire]

Still here; still think we should save Rhinox for the time being; still think we should be lynching from the VT pool. I'm sure we have at least one other scum who claimed vanilla in there. Still think that person should be redFF.

[Quagmire]

I'm still waiting for Glork to show up and make the case against Quagmire if he wants us to seriously think he's not scum.

Whether or not you think us gunsmiths are infallible or not (and you shouldn't), don't you think we have time to sit and wait on us before making some kind of decision? There are three claimed power roles (four if you include Rhinox) and I'm willing to bet at most one of those four is scum. So, we could sit on this info and wait. IMO the only one of these four who have any threat at being killed overnight soon is AGar, who noone seems to think is scum.

[Quagmire]

That's a really tinfoil-hat case. I don't see where that phrase nips scooby as scum. It could just be awkwardly worded.

I'm also not comfortable with how hard Michel defended scooby when he was near lynch. Michel's a smarter player than to defend him, if scooby were scum along with him.

[Quagmire]

I guess I'd rather lynch scooby than Rhinox. Since noone's going for redFF,

unvote, vote scooby

[Quagmire]

I just don't think we can make that inductive leap from singer's words to, "we know someone got blocked." singer could have just been desperate to create some tinfoil-hat theory to get the guilty result off her back.

[Quagmire]

I should say, I don't think we can conclusively say scooby's a scum RB. But, it's a better case than anything else we have, and y'all know my opinions on lynching VT poolers.

[Quagmire]

Rhinox, you could have said, "yes, I would love to save my ass today," instead of the flaky "I knew it all along" stuff

[Quagmire]

Yo scooby. Real talk. The case on you isn't the best. In fact, it's probably bad. But, you're in the VT pool, the deadline's coming up, and everyone (except Tierce) is too lazy/busy to go through and analyze voting patterns over the first few days. Hope we're still bros after you die today.

Sincerely ~

Quagmire

[Quagmire]

Hey look, Scooby got mislynched. That's cool.


Honestly, my apathy for mafia in general right now is at an all-time low. I might try to cobble together a case against Quagmire overnight. In the meantime, carry on.

Then get a replacement.

[Quagmire]

The problem with your case is that it sucks and your evidence is bad. I'll have time to go over stuff in the next couple days.

[Quagmire]

Also,

Quag

: Why exactly did you target Hoopla with your investigation? In Post 763, you cited Hoopla's 569, but even after that in your Post 580, you listed her as "leaning town." You even responded to her 579, so it's obvious you were reading/paying attention. What exactly made you change to Hoopla and not Simenon, Glork, or Flameaxe -- all of whom were higher on your list?

As I said here, I did a re-analysis on day one's posts between d1 and d2 to use my claim on. I noticed Hoopla didn't talk about nhammen at all upon replacing into the game, and thought she was an innocuous enough target to not get picked off by scum, or another informational role.

Furthermore, the sequence of nightkills appears designed to maximize Quag's credibility. The scums picked off every claimed power role except the two claimed gunsmiths and AGar, then inexplicably decided to off Hoopla (Quag's target) instead of killing KoC, Quag, or AGar.

Because we're not power roles anymore? Is your head even in the game? We have our results; we're one-shot; we're now as useful as a townie.

With Quag's target down as town, and Quag actually participating while AGar does his best to look like a gambitting Serial Killer by lurking and generally being terrible, why would the scums keep him alive? (Rhetoricsl question by the way, the three possible answers are obvious.)

Like... There's plenty of evidence suggesting Quagscum. People just seem to want to ignore it for whatever bullshit reasons that nobody has actually given.

This is super circumstantial and not really substantive. Not much for me to respond to.

[Quagmire]

Well, it looks like he have one mislynch left. If we pick someone at random, we'll have a 2/7 shot.

I'm pretty confident Tierce is town, and I still think it makes sense that KoC is town. I think CES/JDodge is pretty town also, which leaves my candidates at Rhinox-Glork-redFF, in no particular order.

Glork's been rubbing me the wrong way this entire game, but how much of it is due to his apathy? His case on me is pretty bad.

Rhinox still has that bizarre role thing, which doesn't make sense given the rest of the setup. I still think we should push that one until tomorrow, since I can equally envision his role being town or scum. Reminder that his role would only have been broken by one one-shot ability.

redFF has been Game Lettuce and the only reason to choose him would be to get rid of the players who haven't contributed much and you don't know much about.

Holding off my vote while I think some more (and OGML posts a vote count)

Also, my posting will be sporadic the next couple weeks as I work 60 hours/week in addition to my college courses. Life is insane at the moment.

[Quagmire]

Tierce, please explain why you think Quag's claim is not consistent with scum. It came late (last, in fact), mirrored another role for "credibility," and produced a result that never really served to help the town.

He also defended BOTH NHAM AND SINGER (Post 439 and Post 515 respectively), and has spent literally the entire game going after probable protown players (Tierce, Glork, Rhinox?). He also showed a strong preference to wanting to lynch redFF over Michel/Sim, and generally backed Sim earlier.

Quag's play is consistent with scum who only threw down against his buddies when he absolutely had to.

Vote: Quag

Oh hey I missed this post. I attacked Tierce on day 1 only, when there was a major bandwagon on her.

I'm also super rusty and haven't played a game proper for years. (literally) It's the best way to say I was wrong about nham, and singer. Michel's always been on my kind-of-flaccid-kind-of-hard list of people to lynch, I think you can agree that's consistent.

Quagscum always busses at least one buddy, btw.

[Quagmire]

No, actually, not at all. I'm sure you've noticed, but I can be very stubborn at times, to a fault. That's one of those things I almost always do at least once to avoid situations like this where I'm seen as waffly until shit is known to hit the fan. I've just simply been pretty wrong about who to feel strongly about so far this game.

[Quagmire]

Vote Glork

[Quagmire]

Oh, cool. I'm going to get mislynched today, simply because I thought D1 massclaim was a bad idea.

[Quagmire]

I'm assuming the only rationale to lynch me is because I held out Day1 and 'conveniently' co-claimed KoC?

[Quagmire]

what does that mean

[Quagmire]

I mean, when I flip pro-town gunsmith, you'll all look pretty foolish, and then someone will posit that KoC is the scum one, and people will try to lynch him, and he won't object because he's busy too, and the town will lose. The more I see this shitty case develop, the more I think it's Glork, with a last-ditch effort to try to mislynch and interrupt the game.

[Quagmire]

I guess I don't know the case against me then.

[Quagmire]

Also, it's pretty appalling I'm like the only active player despite warning long ago that my activity was going to dwindle when school/work busy time started.

[Quagmire]

It's frustrating to try and defend yourself when there is no case on you and everyone's just voting on pure apathy.

[Quagmire]

There's still no particular reason to not lynch VTs, either.

[Quagmire]

When I die and flip gunsmith, please lynch Glork tomorrow. tia

[Quagmire]

'Grats guys on winning that one. That was flawless play after activity started to dwindle.

Boy was I rusty. I didn't even consider CES as scum until Flameaxe pointed it out in the graveyard thread.

[Quagmire]

I told you it was CES
but nooooooo, let's let him do EXACTLY WHAT QUAG SAID HE WOULD

I was wrong anyway, it wouldn't have mattered

[Quagmire]

most surprising result of the game: Tierce is SK. Who saw that coming?!

If us townies wouldn't have had our heads up our asses, Tierce you probably would have won.

[Quagmire]

I wasn't trolling.