Newbie 1488: Igloo-Town Tragedy (Game Over)

[jklash12]

Let's get this started!

VOTE: Billi bilaði

Quite the name there.

[jklash12]

billi- what is the second to last symbol in your name? I had to copy and paste you name for the vote cause I don't know that symbol.

[jklash12]

Cool. Thanks billi, I learned something new today.

[jklash12]

Why is being friendly before the game has really gotten going suspicious? I get once the game has gotten into it, being friendly/buddying is super suspicious but why before the game has got interesting.

[jklash12]

@randomidget- where did he say that scum usually lynch him?

[jklash12]

I am not overly worried about innocent's RVS vote but his defensiveness of late seems survivalistic.

[jklash12]

Can any of the three votes on IV please explain your vote because all the votes on IV came before what I thought was a little fishy from IV?

[jklash12]

I don't like the way that innocent seems to be trying to gain towncred...

Vote Innocent

Please don't put him at L-1 because someone might not notice and waste 12 days of discussion.

RVS mate. It was a little odd, so I put pressure on too see what happened.

So you say that your vote was random but it looks like you were serious about you reason.

[jklash12]

Can any of the three votes on IV please explain your vote because all the votes on IV came before what I thought was a little fishy from IV?

Why on Earth would you think survivalism is dubious? I have one piece of information available to me on day one, that I'm town and if I get lynched then I haven't made use of that information because I've allowed a town player to get lynched. I know IV is an SE but I consider the ability to survive the most useful ability of any new town player because very rarely does anyone have a good feel for scumhunting so simply keeping oneself alive and out of the lynch pool is extremely valuable.

I think we are just arguing over a preference of playstyles. I would rather see them speak their mind about who and why they think someone is scum rather than them aggressively defend themselves.

[jklash12]

I'll put my vote into play before the BB4 on it expires. Lurking is a good enough reason for the first casting.
So, dawn_to_dust, why are you forced to vote to stay alive?
VOTE: dawn_to_dusk

Well it depends if he ends up getting replaced this may be more of a not logging on situation than lurking.

[jklash12]

I am actually not against DDD's private vote. I like it. Looking at Private's posts He has just asked questions in his last couple posts and not much of substance as far as trying to find scum. This would be a good tactic for scum because 1. It gives you more posts and looks like you are active 2. Looks like to other town that you are trying to figure out the game.

VOTE: Private

[jklash12]

I was agreeing with who he was voting. obviously I can't agree with why he voted because there is no explanation.

[jklash12]

Dawn to Dusk- Do you think you unvoting DDD had something to do with his vote on Private?

[jklash12]

Could we do a day 1 no lynch by any chance?

Going back to this. Zeph, when you asked this what did you have in mind? Did you actually want to no-lynch or did you want learn about the no-lynch strategies?

[jklash12]

Randomidget- we still have about a week left to decide on a lynch. Just under 7 days. You probably got mixed up with another one of your games.

[jklash12]

Hang on a minute. We are lynching Private because he isn't very active. This is a terrible excuse. He could be innocent, or a town power role.

No not because he isn't very active. I like the Private lynch because, if you iso him you see, he was just asking questions to looks active and like he cared about the game and wasn't really adding that much.

I am actually not against DDD's private vote. I like it. Looking at Private's posts He has just asked questions in his last couple posts and not much of substance as far as trying to find scum. This would be a good tactic for scum because 1. It gives you more posts and looks like you are active 2. Looks like to other town that you are trying to figure out the game.

This is pretty good point here and I agree to some extent. I read his ISO and he doesn't sound too scummy to me. I would like to hear from him some more before I cast my vote.

Quote tags fixed ~Mod

Do you want to hear from me or Private?

Hang on a minute. We are lynching Private because he isn't very active. This is a terrible excuse. He could be innocent, or a town power role.

Vote IV

best vote we've got. Nothing contributed, and pretty survivalistic.
Dunno, why I said that stuff about Private, I was tired. Sorry about that.

please tell me what the difference between Private and IV are.

PrivateI is asking questions (which I haven't seen much answers to, which can totally kill a line of questioning). He is regularly contributing, although the posts aren't long. So, everything for me says: don't lynch on day one - see how it plays out.

So, you want to no-lynch day1? That would be a very bad idea. If you don't see why it is a very bad idea, just ask me I would be happy to explain why you shouldn't no lynch.

[jklash12]

I am actually not against DDD's private vote. I like it. Looking at Private's posts He has just asked questions in his last couple posts and not much of substance as far as trying to find scum. This would be a good tactic for scum because 1. It gives you more posts and looks like you are active 2. Looks like to other town that you are trying to figure out the game.

This is pretty good point here and I agree to some extent. I read his ISO and he doesn't sound too scummy to me. I would like to hear from him some more before I cast my vote.

Quote tags fixed ~Mod

O sorry misinterpreted that post. But in most cases a no-lynch would not be helpful. It doesn't tell you much about the game because all that it does is leave you at the same point you were on the previous day minus one person if the night kill goes off correctly. Some people might say you can analyze the night kill but all that logic ends up as is WIFOM.

[jklash12]

Dang. I miss Wednesday and the first chance I get to log on on Thursday, and it is twilight. I don't like that lynch, in his first post I thuoght was a joke and I don't see why everyone attacked him for by saying he knowingly lied. I would have much rather lynched private. Someone said that Private has added stuff and IV hadn't, I don't think you can Private added more the IV.

[jklash12]

So, can it be safely said that there is a Mafia roleblocker in this game?

Why do you say that? I don't think there is proof to say there is one.

[jklash12]

So, can it be safely said that there is a Mafia roleblocker in this game?

I'm really sorry, I haven't played THAT many newbie games (just like two), so I don't know how you came up with this assertion at all.

...

Why do you say that? I don't think there is proof to say there is one.

...

Yeah, we don't have any setup information we can trust. A jailkeeper, doctor, or one-shot bulletproof could prevent a kill as well as scum getting cute and submitting a no kill or more likely missing their deadline to submit a kill; too many options to say anything definitive.

Ah, this was probably premature posting on my behalf.
I was thinking upon the maxtrix setup, and the possibility of a doctor having protected me, as my money was on me getting NK'd. I was seeing connections to a Roleblocker when I was called out of the house, and decided to send the post.
Still, as has been mentioned later, I am also on the line that the mafia would not have skipped killing. I think that could only happen by accident on night 1.

Like Jake, I don't like this post. He is thinking about roles when we know NOTHING about roles as we have no confirmed power roles yet. How can you analyze or decide based on power roles when you don't know anything about the power roles.

I like this wagon.

VOTE: billi

[jklash12]

Well, 2 players could back me up on the fact that you are not so lucky 2 games in a row. But I seriously doubt that they will do so until after the game.

What does the last part of this supposed to mean?

[jklash12]

Why is it a bad wagon? Billi has not looked town today. He tried to look for power roles when we know nothing about power roles. The other thing he has said is that he is a pretty much conf town, which he isn't. It is like he was trying to keep suspicion off him.

[jklash12]

The other thing he has said is that he is a pretty much conf town, which he isn't. It is like he was trying to keep suspicion off him..

Isn't this just a variation on the same theme from yesterday? innocentvillager was "too defensive" to some of you and now Billi is scum for saying he's town and now wanting to be a suspect? PRO TIP: Town players should want to appear town so that the town will focus on players who might be scum.

This is different from IV. IV was being super defensive about something that wasn't major. Billi was calling himself confirmed town. He wasn't really being defensive about anything. He was just going out there saying. That from day1 he was conf town, which he isn't.

[jklash12]

...{DDD quote}...
Your protip is horrible

Here's a better protip. Don't give a shit how you are perceived if you are town, just find scum and everything will fall into place. If you happen to get lynched, who gives a rats ass as long as you've done your best to find scum and left behind posts people can use.

Expletives aside, don't you think I'm leaving behind posts that people can use, when I turn out to be town?

I'm sorry to inform you but people usually don't look back at dead people's posts.

[jklash12]

Dtd- if we are dealing with a DDD scum scenario, he probably won't slip. Experienced scum plan their moves to the detail. You have to learn to pick them. I'm still not very good at this but I try my best to pick out the scum.

[jklash12]

DDD- I never said you were scum. I actually think you look town this game. I was just stating how I think someone like you would play as scum.

[jklash12]

Dawn- Why are you using random's analysis and not your own ideas?

[jklash12]

billi said he would have given the same reads and at that time, I didn't want to check the 12 pages myself.

Then I found out that you can read a person's posts in isolation. And I agree with the read

Am I the only one who noticed dtd said he didn't feel like reading the game?

dtd- If you don't want to read the game why are you playing?

[jklash12]

Ok now I get that you didn't say you wanted to read the whole game. It was just you didn't want to look through it for a specific post.

I never said that it made you seem scummy. If anything I feel that would more likely come from lazy town not wanting to read the game.

[jklash12]

VOTE: Private
neither jake nor billi are suspects so it wont lynch someone but not scumhunting can be suspicious. there is one main person not scumhunting according to random's analysis. i tried to give a town-read on private but looking back on it, it was very weak.

Vote private

Same reasons as stated by dtd
Getting a strong town read on dtd, and a weak town on Jake.

Can we consider these two posts for a moment? These two people each reference each other as the reason they are voting for me? Considering that this is a newbie game, I am almost hoping that these are two newbscum who just hardcore slipped. How is your primary reasoning each other? Especially you, randomidget, instead of relying on your own reads, you cite someone who contributed nothing to your own reads? I feel as though you are, at the very least, trying to absolve responsibility for this vote.

I have a presentation to make, and homework to finish, but for now, my vote will be parked on

VOTE: Randomidget

haha

It is actually funny if you look at those 2 post. dtd votes saying he was using random's analysis and then random votes saying dtd's reasons which in the end makes it a complete circle.

VOTE: Private
neither jake nor billi are suspects so it wont lynch someone but not scumhunting can be suspicious. there is one main person not scumhunting according to random's analysis. i tried to give a town-read on private but looking back on it, it was very weak.

Vote private

Same reasons as stated by dtd
Getting a strong town read on dtd, and a weak town on Jake.

Can we consider these two posts for a moment? These two people each reference each other as the reason they are voting for me? Considering that this is a newbie game, I am almost hoping that these are two newbscum who just hardcore slipped. How is your primary reasoning each other? Especially you, randomidget, instead of relying on your own reads, you cite someone who contributed nothing to your own reads? I feel as though you are, at the very least, trying to absolve responsibility for this vote.

I have a presentation to make, and homework to finish, but for now, my vote will be parked on

VOTE: Randomidget

From what I see, it was useless to say the same thing twice. Random may have been about to vote you but I beat him to it so he just said that my reasons for voting were the same reasons that he would have used.

Why are you defending random? Do you think he is strong town?

[jklash12]

I am stating intent to hammer. Private I has been on my scum list for awhile and his play today hasn't changed my mind. So unless Private gets in here and proves he is innocent I am perfectly fine to hammer him.

[jklash12]

That's why I just posted intent. So that we could have more time to hear from private before I hammered.

[jklash12]

Well he hasn't posted in over 2 days and nothing makes me believe that he will or has anything good to say. so let's get to hammer time.

VOTE: private

[jklash12]

First, I want to apologize once again. Finals are next week for us, and so I've been studying and writing.

I want to begin with the person I'm voting for.

Randomidget was someone I voted for on a whim. The one post, I really didn't like, but RM has consistently been posting all game, and dropping some serious towntells. Among these are the fact that he, on multiple occasions, was giving direction in this newbie game to not hammer someone at L-1, and he has been trying to spark and engage in discussion.

Conclusion: Town

Survivalism short of lying is fine, it's just not a scumtell. And of course I want to force my opinion on the town, I want it so that when I want to push my opinion that there are no dissenting opinions.

This seems as scummy as hell. You are basically saying you want us to follow you blindly into whatever you say. Give us one reason why we should do this a few days into Day 1, where you haven't even done anything particularly scummy?

VOTE: PrivateI

No reasoning. Why?
VOTE: Debonair Danny DiPietro
Seems to be the scummiest player so far.

DDD voting private is very suspicious to me. Especially since I just I unvoted them. There were much better options than a randomized vote (due to there being better options) and I kinda gave Private an alibi until further notice, so I see no reason.

VOTE: Debonaire Danny DiPietro

Next, dawn_to_dusk. I chose him simply because he is first on the mod's list, but the fact that he follows RM is an ironic coincidence. You see, DtD has been following RM specifically all game. I've already showed one of these instances, and the quotes above show another. The primary reason I don't have more? DtD votes safe. He only votes for people who have already been labeled as "suspicious" for one action or another by other players, usually RM. My hypothesis? DtD saw RM as town very early on, and chose to follow a safe town vote. This isn't alignment indicative in and of itself, but he has desperately been trying to stay beneath the radar for the entire game. In addition, not a SINGLE post of DtD's mentions RM. None. This means that while he is giving us his (safe, already confirmed by other players) scum reads, he certainly is not mentioning those players who are town. With that in mind,

Conclusion: Potential Scum

I am actually not against DDD's private vote. I like it. Looking at Private's posts He has just asked questions in his last couple posts and not much of substance as far as trying to find scum. This would be a good tactic for scum because 1. It gives you more posts and looks like you are active 2. Looks like to other town that you are trying to figure out the game.

VOTE: Private

Let's move on to jklash12. While jklash has been also lying low, and as a whole simply joining wagons, he has also been asking some good questions throughout the game. However, the fact that this is the only thing of substance that he does coupled with the quote I took from him makes me think strongly this is hypocritical scum. However, I don't have enough evidence for that, so,

Conclusion: Null, Leaning Scum

All right, guys, welcome to Mafia! So many RVS votes...

InnocentVillager, you say that it's usually scum that attacks you because of your name. That's an intriguing statement. Do you have any games to back that up?

Did a little digging:

innocentvillager:
Game 1 (1222 town):

Vincent2128 (town), vijay2vasandani (town)

Game 2 (1247 scum): (voted for lurking)
Game 3 (1249 town):

Shed (town)

Game 4 (1263 scum): (only voted after blocking)
Game 5 (1279 town): (not voted for name)
Game 6 (1281 town): (not voted for)
Game 7 (1376 town): (voted on play)
Game 8 (1375 scum):

Nachomamma8 (town) ? maybe a name vote

Game 9 (1396 town):

DoctorPepper (town)

Game 10 (open 509 town):

Thomas (scum)

NicolBolas, town, for reply)

In first 9 games (all newbies) he's voted 4 (maybe 5) times for his name. Every time by townies.
First in Game 10 (an Open one) is he voted for name from a mafioso.

Didn't have time to analyze further, so I second PrivateI's request for games to backup that statement.

Now, we come to Billi. Billi, as many, many players have pointed out, was the towniest of the D1 players. It was his intro into D2 that got him tripped up. While I still absolutely hate the type of setup spec that he was trying to do, especially since it had the potential to misguide many players, I don't think it was from a malicious mindset. Also, let's remember this post on the very first page of D1. This is a player who wants to find scum. With that in mind,

Conclusion: Town

Mod, your playerlist still shows fused_shadows as playing in this game, when he was replaced by Jake.

Which made it quite confusing. Fused cannot be read based on his RVS posts, in my humble opinion, so I am forced to rely entirely on his replacement, Jake from State Farm. Jake had a horrible entrance into this game by voting for me, but I feel as though his reaction test worked. If, on the other hand, it had resulted in my being lynched early on because of a quickhammer, I might not have the same love for Jake. Anyway, Jake, while I feel his attack on Billi specifically may have been incorrect, it's definitely the same conclusion I drew early on as well. Regardless of Billi's alignment, Jake is likely town.

Conclusion: Null, Leaning Town

Zephyrus. Zephyr is so charmingly newbie that I can barely believe it. Everything, especially his question concerning not lynching on D1, rings completely true with no pretense. Zeph, I hope you learn a lot this game, and definitely continue to play.

Conclusion: Town

And, now, just the one person left. DDD is all that remains for me to read. DDD is the only person that's truly null to me. While he's contributing, he's not doing it in the way I typically expect town players to, especially an IC. I'm really sorry that I have to be this vague, but this "read" can't be based on anything. I don't want you to be led astray either way, so I'll leave you with this.

Conclusion: Null

Now, time for some consideration. I will definitely

VOTE: Unvote

VOTE: DtD

But besides that, I don't know what I can do. I feel as though I'm getting hammered anyway, so best of luck to the town, and get the scum tomorrow!

Ugh i wish you would have posted this before I hammered. This is too much work for newer scum to do imo.

But the part about me, "simply joining wagons". I only joined one wagon which was the billi wagon day2. As for you I pretty much started your wagon. Sure I was the second vote on your wagon but I gave the first reasons for voting you. So I would call that starting the wagon not joining.

[jklash12]

We are in twilight waiting for the flip right now.

[jklash12]

Jeopardy theme song time!

[jklash12]

Good thing I hammered him several minutes his big post because I probably wouldn't have lynched him after that.

VOTE: randomidget

I'm pretty sure the other scum is RM. phone posting now so more detailed when I get on the computer.

[jklash12]

Please check my spoiler for in depth analysis of why random is scum.

Spoiler:

I don't think it is a good idea to have anyone at L-1 this early. Someone could quickhammer.

Private was at L-1 here on day 1 and Random goes out to advise against the wagon against Private.

I'm getting a null read on Private. He has asked some good questions, but is laying fairly low. I just don't think he has done anything scummy, the read is more based on him not doing townie things.

Gives a weird null on Private here. He says Private isn't scummy and he asks good questions. From that it sounds like he should be town but instead its a null. If someone is asking good questions, that would fall under the category of townie things.

Hang on a minute. We are lynching Private because he isn't very active. This is a terrible excuse. He could be innocent, or a town power role.

This is a major one. He says we shouldn't lynch Private because he could be a town power role. Think about that for a second. Whenever you lynch anyone you run the risk of lynching a town power role because anyone could be a town power role. This is a terrible defense against a Private lynch but in his next post it gets even worse.

The reasoning for his lynch would also apply to a power role staying low. He hasn't done anything scummy.

In his next post he takes the defense that Private could be a power role and uses it to defend why Private has been laying low/lurking and yet again say he hasn't done anything scummy.

Vote IV

best vote we've got. Nothing contributed, and pretty survivalistic.
Dunno, why I said that stuff about Private, I was tired. Sorry about that.

Here he votes innocentvillager. As far as contributing you can't say Private contributed more than IV on day1. Then he takes back all the bad defensive stuff about Private because he was "tired".

Private has contributed slightly more by asking questions. Also, IV was oddly survivalistic.

Still defending Private when he didn't need to.

(the rest of the quotes are day2. The ones before were all day 1)

Vote private

Same reasons as stated by dtd
Getting a strong town read on dtd, and a weak town on Jake.

Here is where on day2 Random goes to vote Private. Oddly he list no reasons of his own and just sheeps his ass on to dtd's reasons.

GUYS PRIVATE IS AT LYNCH 1. DO NOT HAMMER YET.

jklash, we still have a couple more days of discussion so don't hammer yet.

These 2 quotes are trying to delay the Private lynch so that his scum partner has time to post and hopefully dig his way out.

I'm not sure, but I know DDD asked you questions that you didn't answer. I am satisfied to hammer Private now.

This is just 3 posts after his previous post. He has an uncalled change in mind to be satisfied with the Private lynch.

He clearly isn't going to post. I have realized this and so have no problem with hammering. I have a decent idea of who is scum, but need to see the flip to see if I am correct. I think I am organized enough to proceed.

Then Jake questioned Random why he is asking for time for Private and this was his response where he says to hammer.

The main points of why Random is scum
-His defense of Private day1 with rather weak reasons and then takes it all back when questioned on it
-sheeps the Private wagon day2. Never says, himself, why Private is scummy.
-His trying to buy Private time to talk at the end of day2
-His weird change of mind between 352 and 355

[jklash12]

Also,

OK, here are my reads
billi

Spoiler:

Town - scumhunting, lots of acivity
Scum - nothing
Note - he could have an idea of the layout through being a town PR
Verdict - Strong town

jklash

Spoiler:

Town - scumhunting, posts make good points
Scum - not that active
Verdict - medium-strong town

ddd

Spoiler:

Town - day 2 scumhunting and making good posts
Scum - Day 1 low post quality and not scumhunting, not answering questions
Verdict - Null. could be either

zephyr

Spoiler:

Town - has been posting information
Scum - inactive
Note - a lot of his odd moves can be explained by the fact that he is new to mafia
Verdict - Null

dawn - going to look at his ISO then provide a read
jake

Spoiler:

Town - little bit of scumhunting
Scum - tries to lynch a player without providing a case, when they had plenty of posts to take evidence from
Note - haven't done anything I particularly like
Verdict - Weak scum

Private

Spoiler:

Town - asks questions
Scum - no effort to find scum, very few posts
Verdict - Weak scum

Please comment on these reads.

random, did you do this based on my notes? c",
Basically the same results as I would give.

Great minds think alike.
I'm getting a weak-town read on dtd. Was lurking day 1, but has been playing well day 2.

He gives a reason or two here of why Private is scum but I find it unusual that his reads match exactly with the player that random has called "the most town player".

[jklash12]

Here is where on day2 Random goes to vote Private. Oddly he list no reasons of his own and just sheeps his ass on to dtd's reasons.

This was in my reads, given before dtd's vote. dtd had referred to my reads in his evidence to lynch Private. His reasoning was my reasoning. If you had been paying attention then you would know that DDD had explained this.

After my big post, I went back and found your reads and addressed your reads in the post right after my main case on you.

[jklash12]

That's why I just posted intent. So that we could have more time to hear from private before I hammered.

This is what you did. 8 posts later, you hammer. Very similar to my 'odd change'.

You tried to buy him time and changed your mind later that day while I gave him over 2 days to respond before I hammered.

[jklash12]

Vote Jake

That lack of defence makes me think he is a good lynch.

What does lack of defence even supposed to mean? Are you trying to say you want to lynch him because he isn't defending himself?

[jklash12]

Jake, lets say somehow billi dies and flips town. Are you saying your next choice for scum would be dtd?

[jklash12]

Billi, you said it would take some convincing to place your vote outside of Jake or DDD, is there anything else I can do to convince you that random is scum?

[jklash12]

Billi, you said it would take some convincing to place your vote outside of Jake or DDD, is there anything else I can do to convince you that random is scum?

If you were a cop with a guilty-result, then you would just say so as the game would be won. So, I don't think you can know that he is a mafioso; only have a strong suspicion.

So, with only suspicions:
Why did random put the 3rd vote on PrivateI on day 2?
- There was no need for a wagon on "the mafia-partner" at that time.
- - Did he then get stuck on a fellow-wagon?

I think he did it to get some town cred and then planned to get off it later when the wagon died but the wagon didn't die. So, like you said, he got stuck on his partner's wagon.

Did PrivateI then revenge-vote his partner (random) after that wagon got rolling?
- and then move away from him to put suspicion on dawn_to_dusk instead?

I think Private got on, saw that random voted him, and voted him back because he was mad that his partner voted him. Just a bit later in Private big list of reads it said random was back to good town read.

Why does random relieve the L-1 pressure of Jake this day (day 3)?
- is it because he is getting heat on him?

No, not because he is getting heat but because it would to get town cred because it looks like he is trying to find scum.

[jklash12]

Private being an SE means nothing. All it is that he has some experience on this site. It doesn't automatically make him a better player and I had played with Private before this game. I could be wrong but I think Private would be the type of person to vote his teammate if he got annoyed with them.

[jklash12]

UNVOTE: Jake
I don't think he is scum. I really don't know with Jake.
VOTE: dtd
The guy whose I distrust the most.

Unvote dtd

I just realized that the point made was by Private, and Private was scum. :/ sorry about that.
I trust dtd after that. It's hard to explain, but I think he reacted in a townie way.

DTD is the only player deeply in my lynch pool (I did vote him earlier I'm not just sheeping).
We are approaching the deadline and so

LYNCH DTD

Come on guys! are you seeing this? If this isn't scum then I don't know what is. He voted dtd saying he distrusted dtd. Then unvoted saying he trusted him and he was townie and then the last one he is back in his lynch pool and he doesn't even have his vote on him. These are 3 of random's last 4 posts.

[jklash12]

If you look at my first game, you will see that my vote does move around quickly. The main reason people are voting me is that my vote moves around very quickly which is my playstyle.

I'm not voting you because you move your vote around quickly. I could care less about your voting patterns. I care about your reasons for voting and thats not the only reason I am voting you as I have explained before.

[jklash12]

Ok we are at L-1 with random. Can we please have one more vote to get us a lynch.

[jklash12]

I've done an ISO on DDD, and would put him as a definite lynch candidate for tomorrow. Got to go now, but will post my reasons later.

Why tomorrow and why not today? We are still in day 2 and can talk about day 3 when we get there.

[jklash12]

Only one we haven't heard from is jk but regardless we are going to end up NO lynching.

At this point my vote wouldn't matter anyway. Looks like we aren't lynching anyone.

[jklash12]

Not good, jk. Why no thougts on the matter at hand?

My thoughts didn't matter because you guys just no lynched when I was offline.

[jklash12]

My thoughts were pretty obvious that I wished we lynched random.

[jklash12]

darn random was town. I was almost positive he was scum. I guess its back to the drawing boards.

[jklash12]

I guess that means there was a 1-shot. Doc would have tried to save random

Unless jk is the doc

I'm not a doc. Just VT

[jklash12]

I guess that means there was a 1-shot. Doc would have tried to save random

Why do you say a doc would protect random?

But Yeah I think a one shot Bulletproof is what could be behind the no NK night 1. That isn't assured though because scum could've missed the deadline to NK.

[jklash12]

I was going to suggest a massclaim today but I don't think there's a point really because optimal play looks the same in my mind as long as there are no quick hammers. A quick hammer should mean you're getting lynched tomorrow no matter what.

We could have the other town PR claim to find out if we a have a one shot BP or a doc. There are pros and cons to this.

Pros-
-we find out whether there is a doc or one shot BP
-we get a confirmed town for today
-if scum counterclaim (or scum fake claims first) we lynch between the two of them and win either today or tomorrow

Cons-
-doc or one shot BP will be the NK if we fail to lynch scum
-

[jklash12]

so one of jk and ddd are scum, time to go back and re-evaluate though i'm leaning heavy on DDD given BB claimed 1 shot.

Why does BB claiming have to do with you leaning scum on DDD?

[jklash12]

I think I understand billi, reckless and full townie day 1 to attract attention, preventing NK and giving town a great edge right?

Also, jk, I was hoping a doc could protect a claimed tracker, just in case it was correct.

Ok that makes sense due to the fact he claimed tracker. I probably wouldn't have protected him though.

[jklash12]

so one of jk and ddd are scum, time to go back and re-evaluate though i'm leaning heavy on DDD given BB claimed 1 shot.

Why does BB claiming have to do with you leaning scum on DDD?

No cc means he's probably clear so it's you or ddd and I was town reading you yesterday

Ok yeah I get the no cc but you just worded your sentence kind of funny.

If we mislynch today either me or dawn will be nightkilled. Is there anyway for the townies to affect the nk-selection to our benefit?

I bet it will more likely be you (billi) as you are conftown.

[jklash12]

Ok so my thoughts right now.

Billi- conf town

So that leaves dtd, ddd, and jake

Dtd- I think most unlikely to be scum as he looks like newb town but I am not ruling him out.

As for DDD and Jake I am not sure but leaning Jake as the final scum at the moment.

Yell at me if you want but I went back and looked at Jake's predecessor fused and found something interesting.

Hi

VOTE: innocentvillager

I doubt you are such.

VOTE: fused_shadows

Opportunistic scum alert.

I tell you it's usually scum that goes for my provocative name.

Yes, I'm scum. How did you know? o: #sarcasm

It made a pretty good RVS joke, no?

Now, innocentvillager got a response out of fused_shadows which got randomidget to place the second vote on fused_shadows. It is a good enough reason that merits some poking into.
So, fused_shadows, how would you yourself respond to such a sarcastic response about being a villain that is destroying our homes?

<Prays for snow so that Igloos can be rebuilt>

Well, if I knew the person was being sarcastic (which I obviously was), then I would likely just ignore it. It's a type of comment that I've seen used by both Town and Mafia, so seeing someone else do it wouldn't really give me any reads on them.

I'm very intrigued by your research results, Billi. I wonder why innocentvillager would lie so blatantly like that.

Fused looks like he is trying to play it cool by saying more than once that he was using sarcasm.

First off, I realize this doesn't make Jake scum but it is a place to start. Tomorrow when I get free time I will go through Jake's posts to see if find anything worth looking at for scum or town.

[jklash12]

Ok so my thoughts right now.

Billi- conf town

So that leaves dtd, ddd, and jake

Dtd- I think most unlikely to be scum as he looks like newb town but I am not ruling him out.

As for DDD and Jake I am not sure but leaning Jake as the final scum at the moment.

Yell at me if you want but I went back and looked at Jake's predecessor fused and found something interesting.

Hi

VOTE: innocentvillager

I doubt you are such.

VOTE: fused_shadows

Opportunistic scum alert.

I tell you it's usually scum that goes for my provocative name.

Yes, I'm scum. How did you know? o: #sarcasm

It made a pretty good RVS joke, no?

Now, innocentvillager got a response out of fused_shadows which got randomidget to place the second vote on fused_shadows. It is a good enough reason that merits some poking into.
So, fused_shadows, how would you yourself respond to such a sarcastic response about being a villain that is destroying our homes?

<Prays for snow so that Igloos can be rebuilt>

Well, if I knew the person was being sarcastic (which I obviously was), then I would likely just ignore it. It's a type of comment that I've seen used by both Town and Mafia, so seeing someone else do it wouldn't really give me any reads on them.

I'm very intrigued by your research results, Billi. I wonder why innocentvillager would lie so blatantly like that.

Fused looks like he is trying to play it cool by saying more than once that he was using sarcasm.

First off, I realize this doesn't make Jake scum but it is a place to start. Tomorrow when I get free time I will go through Jake's posts to see if find anything worth looking at for scum or town.

random is conf tracker. random tracked me N2. it came up with nothing. please tell me how i still have a chance of being scum

He tracked you? I must have missed that let me check.

[jklash12]

VOTE: Unvote dtdOk, im town tracker. Also just wanted to say that I have been really stupid. Last night I tracked dtd. He couldnt have killed Zephyr.
VOTE: Vote DDD he is the player I would most like dead at the end of the day.

I'm an idiot.

[jklash12]

So billi and dtd are conf town. Later today I will read through jake's posts.

[jklash12]

" 3) I don't trust you and DTD to make the right decision without me holding your hand"
"Why would you willingly turn over any power to scum?"

These contradict each other sooooo much. You start by saying we need you to win and we should be following you. You then continue by saying that giving any power to a possible scum is the worst thing for town. Last I checked, you weren't confirmed. So wouldn't we want to keep the power to ourselves in case you were scum? Which I am thinking is a lot more likely now given that you are asking for power and rejecting the idea of giving it to other people

Who are you talking about here? DDD never asked for any power. He wanted you and billi to help with the power since you are the conf town.

[jklash12]

Sorry it was a busy mother's day weekend.

Apparently I am in the same boat as DDD and Jake because I know I am town which makes one of them scum. So if we lynch DDD and Jake we win. And thus one of these is a lie

Let's flip that around, why on Earth would I want to be ignored, what benefit would that serve me as town or scum? But if I'm scum if you follow me to lynch the other two I win the game, and since I am town if you follow me to lynch the other two we win the game. So of course I want you to follow me.

I'm not reading the game carelessly. The game is auto win from my viewpoint. I mean if you really want to put effort in to be right today I can but I don't have motivation to. If DDD isn't scum then it's jk

Nobody had really made a good case for why I'm scum, but they can't cause I'm not.

[jklash12]

Do you mean twilight because no one posts at night?

I didn't respond because I was offline while you guys decided on the no lynch.

[jklash12]

3:51 am was my last post before I went to bed then I have no time in the morning usually. I then am stuck at school all day and get home around 3:30-4:00 pm. I am usually on for most of the night then.

[jklash12]

I think Jake is more likely scum than DDD. So my vote will go there for now.

VOTE: Jake

[jklash12]

I would be fine lynching you or DDD because one of you is scum. Its not that I think you are more scummy. I just think DDD is more towny than you but I could be wrong.

[jklash12]

can either of you guys give me a reasoning why you are voting me at least? I honestly don't know why people suspect me cause I have literally done nothing scummy all game

I would be fine lynching you or DDD because one of you is scum.

Its not that I think you are more scummy. I just think DDD is more towny

than you but I could be wrong.

[jklash12]

I'm thinking DDD is pretty townie. Which is good as, if we mislynch today, we have a much better chance at winning the next day. The main question here is: who do I think is scum right now?

And the answer is jake. I haven't really been interacting with him much but between him and jk, jk is seeming more town. Still, if jake flips town, we can lynch jk tomorrow which puts a lot of pressure on him to pin DDD. Which at this point, is incredibly hard to do.

I won't vote yet, but the point is made.

So you pretty much won't vote DDD tomorrow?

If you are going to do this I would rather lynch DDD today because if it turns out jake is town then we would be screwed. We would be screwed because then DDD would NK billi and then get you to vote me tomorrow for his scum win. If you think like this it would be better to lynch DDD today and if he's town we can lynch jake scum tomorrow.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: DDD

[jklash12]

You missed one thing in that plan: analysis of the NK.

I would have been able to figure that out if NK went to billi

Not necessarily. I still think in a lylo with you, DDD, and myself based on your thinking in the post I quoted that you would still vote me over DDD.

[jklash12]

jklash12: From post 100 in game 1474 (http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 9#p5664883):

"I make sure my vote is on a scum read at the end of a day. I like to switch it around to other people because like you said up in that quote, your vote is your most powerful scumhunting tool. If you don't switch it around to other players you are not utilizing this tool. sometimes you even have to vote players you don't find incredibly scummy just so that you can better understand them. I don't think you can find scum if your vote stays on the first person you find scummy because opinions are bound to change."

What has changed for you?
You have:
2 votes on day 1.
2 votes on day 2.
1 vote on day 3.

Although, you certainly made sure your vote was on a mafioso at the end of days 1 and 2.

And your first 2 games, you give tells on everybody. You have not done so this game.

Is this your first game as a mafioso on this site?

I have changed my mind on that. Although voting is powerful, one vote isn't going to scare someone who is scum. My past couple games I tend to park my vote and just watch out for scum.

As for not giving reads on everybody, I am not sure why I haven't this game because I usually do that. Which 2 games are you referring to because I have played more than 2 games on this site. I think I have completed 5 or 6 games.

And no, this is not my first game as scum on this site.

[jklash12]

I have not been scum on this site yet.

[jklash12]

I have not been scum on this site yet.

Was worth a shot.

Are you town?

[jklash12]

...
As for not giving reads on everybody, I am not sure why I haven't this game because I usually do that. Which 2 games are you referring to because I have played more than 2 games on this site. I think I have completed 5 or 6 games...

You have 10 finished games. (Not 5 or 6.)
I was talking about the ones I found in your Wiki.

Wow 10 games. I really need to update my wiki also. I don't know why I never posted reads though.

[jklash12]

Well I'm back. Wasn't able to get on sunday. Interested to see if Jake is scum. Hopefully he is and the game is won for us. If not we have to lynch DDD tomorrow.

[jklash12]

Yes! good job town!