UNI MUM Mafia (Day 3, Stay Gold Pony)

[Learned Hand]

/confirm

[Learned Hand]

Mastina, u were scums before and tried to get me out fast. Now, you make no thoughts on me.

I sad. Sort me.

P.s. If you are a miller loved or anything of the sort and don't claim D1, I am gunna cut you.

[Learned Hand]

Cerb, you're grounded for drunk posting.

Orders of Mama Titus.

Now you go off and sit in your room and think about what you're doing there.

While you're there, tell Santa which of your brothers and sisters are just bystanders and which are ebil.

[Learned Hand]

Mastina, you ignore me. Why?

[Learned Hand]

Cerb, you're grounded for drunk posting.

Orders of Mama Titus.

Now you go off and sit in your room and think about what you're doing there.

While you're there, tell Santa which of your brothers and sisters are just bystanders and which are ebil.

Never drunk Titus, not my thing, BUT! I haven't slept much in the last 72 hours between star wars thursday night+waiting in line, then work+dancing friday, then board games all day today....

And dude, I don't friggin know. That's twice now you're trying to get me to give reads early D1! stahp it, idk, everything here is an enigma wrapped in a conundrum.

It worked well the first time. :-p

[Learned Hand]

i am pretty sure mastin hasn't posted since #42

Hydras should sign,.......

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

If I'm a hated godfather should I claim

Yup, especially the godfather part.

If there's an insane cop, you could be a miller to them.

[Learned Hand]

i agree

~ika

Same.

~ika

Now why would you pretend to be ika and not bring me presents?

VOTE: ika

[Learned Hand]

Cerb, you're grounded for drunk posting.

Orders of Mama Titus.

Now you go off and sit in your room and think about what you're doing there.

While you're there, tell Santa which of your brothers and sisters are just bystanders and which are ebil.

Never drunk Titus, not my thing, BUT! I haven't slept much in the last 72 hours between star wars thursday night+waiting in line, then work+dancing friday, then board games all day today....

And dude, I don't friggin know. That's twice now you're trying to get me to give reads early D1! stahp it, idk, everything here is an enigma wrapped in a conundrum.

It worked well the first time. :-p

But it didn't get meaningful reads from ME. Anyways, yes, hydras plz plz sign, if you're the secret person just sign as "not-varsoon".

Nope. It jump started the game and helped me read people regardless.

Trolling, although fun, is hard to read for me.

Sometimes the response to a request is important as what you say.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Hmm, I don't really do trolling. Nothing I've said is actual trolling, I do have a legitimate interest in hearing the respond to my silly question about whether or not only mastin has to claim certain things d1, or if it was meant as a warning to everyone.

Everyone.

[Learned Hand]

Mastina, God was scum before. You can be anyone II.

[Learned Hand]

VOTE: Dramonic for spelling our flavor name wrong. I even spelled it correctly,

AND

Dramonic went and did the research to make the role so perfectly fit the flavor.

And yes ... anyone who is miller/loved/hated needs to claim. Now. Don't make us hurt you. We're both very good at that sort of thing.

@Mass Flop - Please just sign. I need to know if I'm dealing with hiplop or Mastin, and parsing to see if proper capitalization is in place is not exactly my idea of fun.

~Drixx

[Learned Hand]

In fact; starting at noon, I will be posting random dry facts of American Law and how they came about, until I get the claim(s).

[Learned Hand]

^ was Drixx. I don't think Titus is nearly as mean as me.

[Learned Hand]

Town - Cereberus

Next in line please.

Umm... why? The sample PM that Dram provided said Bystander. There is an implied modifier that almost always appears with that word: innocent. I don't see how you can confirm someone is town because they say their role pm says they are faction: bystander (especially now that Dram clarified). And no townie should have had any confusion because there's no way the win condition for bystander would be worded so vaguely if it was neutral, and if it was scum there would be a link to a scum pt, right?

So you're trying awfully hard to get town credit by appearing to "test" people, but your test isn't actually testing anything. Everyone in this game who got a town PM is smart enough to know that they got a town PM. I mean... Dram clarified, which is erring on the side of caution, but still. I'm trying to decide whether you really think you came up with some way to sort people with this or whether you're putting on a show. Titus is good at day one; I'll ask her. I would tend to lean towards you putting on a show being what we're seeing.

In any case, Dram has clarified so even if you legitimately thought you were getting something of value from what you were doing, the mod blew it up by clarifying.


Love, with eggnog made a little less thick with warm milk, and of course fresh from the oven cookies,
Drixx

[Learned Hand]

I..I.I.I. am not even goign to hide guys I *takers sip from flask*

I am an amnesiac miller, the amnesiac part being that I don't remember my abbilties unless I am visited by a doctor. I. I UGH would go to the interdimensional hospital but that would be a waste of my time so get to it people

Can you still use your abilities although you don't know what they are?

[Learned Hand]

103 was Titus

[Learned Hand]

Oh, and the rest of the post makes sense too, but I could certainly see why one might have a moment of uncertainty. The wording "all threats are eliminated" could indeed easily be a poorly written survivor win con.

Als, Drixx, I'm super sad we're not hydraing this game. I wasn't lying when I said thinking about my role is giving me a headache, and it would be awesome to give that headache to you.

Dude, I am here too. Ouch.

~titus

[Learned Hand]

I don't even know I presumed not

Don't flavor claim. Definitely ask.

[Learned Hand]

Dramonic is way too good a moderator to give a neutral a win condition so vague. That was so obviously town win condition that even though I was like "Bystander???", I was certain enough that we're town and not neutral that I didn't even ask for clarification. Obviously someone did because we have Dram in thread clarifying.

Stop trying to buddy me Cerb. We're already buddies ... but until you earn your town stripes in this game, I view anything you say directed at me as an attempt to manipulate me into town reading you. I expect you to treat us the same.

~Drixx

[Learned Hand]

So far, I don't like the way dice is playing. That might change in the future, though.

Me neither.

VOTE: 3dice

I got 3dice as scum on opposite teams. That whole interaction is fake. Too early to be super sure, but let's see what comes out.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

I don't even know I presumed not

Don't flavor claim. Definitely ask.

The flavor claim thought was to determine legitimacy if amnesiac claim, and potential value of a protective helping him, but, well...do we even care about getting him his powers? He's a claimed miller, barring some fantastic series of events we almost have to lynch him before lylo, and if he's scum we obviously don't want to give him what he wants.

Pedit: 3dicerolling needs to point to something about me other than agreeing with him on the bystander thing, otherwise there is little reason to consider me town, unless you're drixx, to whom I should have obvtowned by now, but I'll assume I have and he's being cautious cause he knows I could fake it. :p

Drixx is afk. You must deal with me.

Until we establish roles are not linked to flavor, no flavor claims.

Second, we don't have to lynch miller claims before lylo. If we did, your vote would be on one of the two millers to establish a read on them.

Third, if you hate town reads on you, why are you bitching about the fact that Drixx hasn't said anything.

Ftr, we're discussing Shiro atm. We'll get to you.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

VOTE: shiro

anyone who is miller

sup

I..I.I.I. am not even goign to hide guys I *takers sip from flask*

I am an amnesiac miller, the amnesiac part being that I don't remember my abbilties unless I am visited by a doctor. I. I UGH would go to the interdimensional hospital but that would be a waste of my time so get to it people

I'm not happy with two miller claims here and I'm not certain why this hasn't be noted :/

I am fine with this but I can see why you would not be.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Shiro, vote Cerb with me. It is your duty.

VOTE: Cerb

Drixx approves this vote.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Why the sudden switch, Titus?

Was getting clearance from Drixx since he knows Cerb better. I don't like not voting.

You should vote someone.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

@cerb, are you seriously going with the you should tolerate me being suboptimal defense? Yeah, that's not cool. Now, you're walking back your suggestion to lynch the millers. You need votes.

@elbrin, I think it's a strong possibility. 100% certainty, no. I think they both are likely millers, but that says nothing of their alignment. Scum would be dumb to cc miller, unless they were one given the heat millers get.

@3dice, huh?

@jeanne, why hesitant on calling it what it is? Both town and scum OMGUS.

[Learned Hand]

@cerb, that's awfully defensive. Why not just have your words and actions align? Are you fearing me lynching you already? You need pressure is what I meant, but you should definitely put your money where your mouth is.

@elbrin, Drixx and I are discussing Errant now.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

@elbrin, I think it's a strong possibility. 100% certainty, no.

I think they both are likely millers, but that says nothing of their alignment.

Scum would be dumb to cc miller, unless they were one given the heat millers get.

What in the world is a scum miller?

What Three Pronged Trouser God gave me in his game. I was universal scum miller Donald Trump. I thought I was Universal Godfather, probably for that reason. Totally borked that game.

A scum miller still shows up as guilty to alignment cops.

I think Errant could have been fearing a vig kill because role madness is likely but meh. Drixx has a differing view.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Any vote on me automatically means that I am getting lynched. That's just how it is. So it's better I prevent it from the get go than be sorry I didn't.

You're claiming hated? Like 5 player hated wtf?

Second, pretty sure I need to work on moonlogic with you.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

I happen to disagree with your interpretation of your role pm, particularly you're alignment, because you're playing like scum.

Nah Jeanne's playing like town that doesn't understand selective disclosure.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

@tn, thoughts on the millers?

[Learned Hand]

Scum would let Elbirn and 3dice get away with naked votes.

Naked votes are annoying as fuck but play style.

One guy deliberately avoids voting because he hates my vca.

People can be dumb.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Second,

pretty sure I need to work on moonlogic with you.

~Titus

Like as in teach her how to do it or teach her how to not do it? (please don't do the first or I will cry)

Both.

Teach her how not to appear moon logicky unless she's sending a veiled message.

[Learned Hand]

@Learned Hand - It's not OMGUS. Read the quotes in 136 and come back to me.

Don't get your point there.

[Learned Hand]

@Learned Hand - It's not OMGUS. Read the quotes in 136 and come back to me.

Don't get your point there.

Noted.

She basically scum reads me, then in the very next post, throws out a readlist basically the same as mine. Pretty fake.

That's not a massive reads list but all of one read. Her agreeing is a point of cognitive dissonance maybe but this isn't lylo. More likely than not players are town, so scum will have town read someone.

[Learned Hand]

(Mental note to self, need to check with the mod about our ability. There's a couple of things which could use clarifying, following Cerb's advice. Kinda sorta, anyway.)

While you're there, tell Santa which of your brothers and sisters are just bystanders and which are ebil.

That an intentional ebil?

^Still want this.
(I may have a read on you, but an answer could help solidify that.)

Also, tn is town. So's Shiro. And Jeanne is, too.

3dice is probably scum.

I'm not happy with two miller claims here and I'm not certain why this hasn't be noted :/

Because, in a dram game, you can expect nothing less.

I was trolling there. Ebil was just fun choice.

You aren't my Godmother are you?

3dice may be scum. Glad we're on the same page but for maybe tn.

Why is TN town?

I really don't like the lynch the millers talk.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

@Learned Hand - It's not OMGUS. Read the quotes in 136 and come back to me.

Don't get your point there.

Noted.

She basically scum reads me, then in the very next post, throws out a readlist basically the same as mine. Pretty fake.

That's not a massive reads list but all of one read. Her agreeing is a point of cognitive dissonance maybe but this isn't lylo. More likely than not players are town, so scum will have town read someone.

And my scum read wasn't massive on her, but it's something that I saw as odd. Her overreaction was pretty uncalled for given the one vote that was on her.

That's Jeanne. I threw her out as mislynch bait, told her I was, and she still freaked out.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

#258 refers to Sudoken mafia

[Learned Hand]

Okay, so how do I prove I am town?!

Find us scum.

[Learned Hand]

So take a hike.

@Learned Hand Teach me not to die in Day 1.

Saying shit like this and only stupid people scumread you day 1 is overly antagonistic. Second, it's false. All you're doing is making people WANT to lynch you. Every ounce of information revealed MUST have a purpose. I don't see any reason for Lol claiming mason. That's what you do AFTER the scums wagon you, not before.

Think before you post. Does this post help people read me, show someone as scum, help solve an alignment or unify town? If no, don't post it.

I am a stubborn dick at points, but you must know what you are doing.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

VOTE: DiamondSentinel

Calls out Jeanne and I for mixing insults with content.

Does the same thing a post later.

This is stretch central.

I agree with Elbrin on tn possibly white knighting DS.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

@hand - what is your experience with elbirn and diamond?

I have had quite a few finished games with Elbrin. Diamond are ongoing.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

It's not a lol claim. I would have no reason to claim it if it weren't true.

Lol claiming means claiming for no reason.

[Learned Hand]

PEdit: It was partial snark, partial me commenting on how he's making another shitty miller claim. To be honest, all these miller claims are ridiculous, and making me lose interest in the game. We should lynch each and every one of them.

this only makes my vote a better one.

Missed that.

VOTE: Diamond Sentinel

That makes me pretty sure he's definitely not aligned with one of you two and scum don't claim miller.

I hope Drixx doesn't mind.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

I have a reason. It's so people stop focusing on me and focus on actual scum. Claiming mason seems the most efficient means towards doing that.

It was two votes on Day 1. Do not ever claim D1 unless less than 48 hours until deadline (or Blitz equivalent) or you're at L minus one.

Scums being out to get you is the state of the game. You denied the group the ability to see who would vote you.

The first lynch is usually on town. We want to see who votes whom organically. That's the whole point of hunting scum. If you deny scum the opportunity to be scummy, no one else will see it.

Now, turn your attention to the whole game state. Give reads on every player using critical thinking and specific posts. Do not quote the posts. Use post tags.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

@hand - what is your experience with elbirn and diamond?

I have had quite a few finished games with Elbrin. Diamond are ongoing.

~Titus

Is there anything uniquely distinct you notice between town and scum elbirn or is it something that takes time to develop?

Blech meta.

Ask me if Elbrin is scum once the game progresses beyond Jeanne and millers.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

I have a reason. It's so people stop focusing on me and focus on actual scum. Claiming mason seems the most efficient means towards doing that.

It was two votes on Day 1. Do not ever claim D1 unless less than 48 hours until deadline (or Blitz equivalent) or you're at L minus one.

Scums being out to get you is the state of the game. You denied the group the ability to see who would vote you.

The first lynch is usually on town. We want to see who votes whom organically. That's the whole point of hunting scum. If you deny scum the opportunity to be scummy, no one else will see it.

Now, turn your attention to the whole game state. Give reads on every player using critical thinking and specific posts. Do not quote the posts. Use post tags.

~Titus

Forgot, miller, loved, and voteless claims are mandated d1. Same with Godfathers and hated.

[Learned Hand]

Not if the player is told they are a cop of questionable sanity.

Why are you reading us as 100% town Dave? You read my scum games and lived through them. Such a hard stance on me is rather suspect.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Combating the mod on this narrows down the pool of probable unless mod did not use insane/paranoid/naive/useless cops. So if you want to complain. Complain privately.

[Learned Hand]

Hey yo Edgar Allan Pro, you need to post. Even if it's just "I am not miller/GF".

[Learned Hand]

What I mean is you're town in my mind right now, and I won't be questioning your alignment for a while. The 100% thing was probably worded badly and a slight exaggeration.

Distracting myself on trying to read you early when there are so many players in the game is a bad idea, and putting you as a certain alignment after just 20 pages means I can concentrate on more important matters, at least for the first day.

PEdit yeh I guess.

I don't like this but tbh I need more players to townread, so flagging this for Drixx.

[Learned Hand]

Agent Titus needs to get clearance from Agent Drixx.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Agent Roleplay, Agent Drixx and I discussed in our pregame briefing how to approach something.

Forgive us for the brief not subtle dalliance. We know there is at least one miller in the game, and possibly more. We are adopting this roleplay style to be unquestioned. Given the formatting, I am inclined to believe both are millers.

However, we are not inclined to believe either or both are town. The mod never mentioned alignment.

Why claim now, especially after the reaming I gave Jeanne for claiming? It's because we got all the reactions we are going to get. People talking about lynching the millers solely because they are millers are suspect.

But wait, that's not all. The mod used similar language with Godfathers. There is at least one, maybe more. Given no one claimed Godfather, the Godfathers are scum. (I am presuming as many Godfathers as millers). If two Godfathers, we are looking at multiball.

Drixx told me that I may have mistakenly implied we were cop. Sorry if that was the case.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

That is an interesting report. Given that knowledge, and the knowledge that the moderator considers feeding agents false information as fair game, I believe it is of paramount importance to determine, as closely as possible, the exact wording of said miller powers. This leads me to an interesting bit of speculation that may or may not have any basis in fact.

May one of our two millers give a close approximation of exactly what their role PM says regarding their miller component?

Once the information has been received I shall update to explain.

There's a difference between a cop variant (insane, paranoid, etc...) and what the mod directly tells you is true. Our role told us there is 1+ millers and 1+ godfathers in game. Millers claimed but no Godfathers did, despite multiple requests from us. It makes sense to assume that means the godfather(s) is/are scum.

Any cops probably need to sanity check on night one. I suspect given that we were informed about roles present suggests that there may be a cop variant that may be able to get an accurate result. Anyone who was told they are a cop should read the wiki on cop variants and how to play them.

[Learned Hand]

@tn, asking people for reasons for voting you but only asking those voting without a reason is inefficient and silly. No one will answer.

VOTE: tn5421

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

@Elbirn @Shiro can I join the masonry?

Aren't you afraid of shiro or something?

I town-read her here. We all town-read each other here, so why can't I be honorary masons with you both.

Elbrin isn't a good townread. Upon reading that VC, Agent Titus is moving back to DS. The company (minus Jeanne and roleplay) isn't good on TN and his response although pretty offensive to me personally, reeks of town wanting to sort people.

VOTE: DS

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

>Godfathers are scum

Stop the presses.

Given this is UPick and I make you miserable, eliminating town Godfather is a smart idea. Town wins by recognizing and not voting each other. Rarely, although it does happen, do scum implode. Even then, if town don't recognize each other, scum can argue too scummy to be scum and get away. Eliminating possibilities is the name of the game.

Your push on both millers being scum claims makes me feel terrible about you. I knew one miller must be honest about being a miller, so I don't like you pressuring both like that.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Titus, explain the "wrongness" of that davsto post? Try to, anyway? I think you might be onto something there

Vague pronoun. Do you mean the 100% town post?

[Learned Hand]

Yeah, just lynch me. I'm terrible at the game and my role is useless. Hell, I might even self-hammer.

DS, this isn't going to help you get any better.

I was handed what usually is a shitty role in Suikoden (make all votes private and pm mod for 24 hours) as town along with messages. Jeanne and I worked together to utilize our abilities for the best town use.

If you're town, do not just say you suck. I may be wrong on my reads right now. You know this from the open game we finished. Take some time to think. There must be an optimal use for your role. Mods don't give useless roles. The game is balanced.

If you're scum, keep whining.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

I hate it when people say that. "You look like you're leaving an opening for backpedaling" or the like, where they're like "ooooh setting up to do X". No, you're assuming that. If you think someone's leaving an opening for something, note it down somewhere that isn't inthread and then call them out when they actually do it. All you're doing otherwise is scumreading someone for potentially doing something in the future which they haven't actually done and may never have been planning to do, or you may simply let scum know not to do that when they would have, stopping them from doing something scummy.

i like this

Why are you reading us as 100% town Dave? You read my scum games and lived through them. Such a hard stance on me is rather suspect.

do you think scum indicative?

May one of our two millers give a close approximation of exactly what their role PM says regarding their miller component?

i don't know what you're saying here.

Possible. Dave buddying me so hard given Nethersprite's game where I mislynched him for claiming a guilty on my partner seems premature. :/

~titus

[Learned Hand]

@elbrin, yes.

Doesn't count. You look like you're swinging, not hunting. I am going to have to discuss this with Drixx. We are having minor tech difficulties.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

@elbrin, yes.

Doesn't count. You look like you're swinging, not hunting. I am going to have to discuss this with Drixx. We are having minor tech difficulties.

~Titus

So, what would be your list of "people who are suspicious because they don't like the idea of having millers and the confusion they cause in the end game"?

Drixx and I are discussing this. He thinks you're overly cautious due to Stevens Universe where Grapes was a scummy miller. I don't. I think you're taking a snarky dig here and that's not town you.

Fact is millers are usually town. Talking about chain lynching millers is sketchy as fuck. Even if there's scum millers, those interactions are VERY informative.

[Learned Hand]

Holiday prod dodge.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

but y'know what? I am tired. Tired of everything going on. I tried to help the town multiple times by keeping myself, a town pr, alive, but it seems that all town wants is death of said pr just because I used to play badly. I am trying to improve here, but all towns wants is my head, no matter which variables present themselves.

Saw this.

*hug* it takes time but I see you're improving. Baby steps.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Merry Christmas all.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Jeanne, please slow down your posting rate. These posts seem to lack purpose other than to annoy me. It's making it difficult to scumhunt.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

I am trying to avoid doing that for now, as I might come off a bit biased.

Determining biases is how we determine alignment though. :s

You literally just said, I am going to garbage post because my logical posting may hurt town. You don't have to be right, but try.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Cerb, this goes for you too. Day 1 sucks and the best players have maybe a 50% batting average d1. In hindsight, D1 is the best day for determining things.

So what reads do you have atm?

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

VOTE: Jeanne

Our hydra can't read anything with the volume of Jeanne's wifom crap.

Like that post to me reads like a white knight from Cerb but I can't exactly get much from him to tell.

[Learned Hand]

Wifom does not mean bury the thread in a lot of shit.

Second wifom is used as a reactionary thing if someone suspects you have an important role, not to hint at yourself.

Third, you should NEVER bury the thread to the point where others cannot talk.

Fourth, readwall please. It would be a springboard of discussion.

UNVOTE:

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

LH: That's s cop out, you are perfectly capable of playing and analyzing in spite of the noise. And yes, it's not a white knght, but it is a statement of fact. I find Jeanne's behavior consistently anti-town and scummy, but I know that doesn't make her scum, she's not consistent enough for it to be that easy. I say this even though if you guys lynch her, it makes my life infinitely easier.

No. I am trying to read you through the noise. If you are using it to avoid content, then I cannot read you.

I have scumreads on DS and TN.

Drixx just has policy lynch a Jeanne.

It's not a matter of keeping up, it's a matter of getting content from everyone else to read them.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

@jeanne, NEVER CRUMB TO SOMEONE YOU ARE NOT HARD TOWN READING. EVER!

Second, being transparent is saying what you know when you know it.

Third, if I ever taught you wifom to the point of stopping others from communicating is good. That's my bad. For any role in existance, you've done enough. Hunt scum only for the rest of the time.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Jeanne, if you're town every body matters. Stop whining. Stop spamming.

Don't roll over dead and bitch. Listen to what we need. Throw questions to get us thinking rather than supposing we're dumb.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

You need to provide reasons. Labels don't show us thought processes.

I can say Cerb is scum; that doesn't tell you why.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

VOTE: Jeanne11

Too much noise and too much smokescreen for scum to hide in. Could have the most incredible role ever conceived and I would still want to get rid of the noise.

~Drixx

[Learned Hand]

Jeanne, can you stop insulting me for no reason, it isn't helping me look at you objectively.

Cerberus, did Jeanne make any claim in the neighborhood?

Also Jeanne, did you quote your role from your PM and if not, can you?

I dunno, why are you literally trash?

Posts like this should stop.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

up to page 29

Your face needs basic training.

ouch

roleplay looks town to me but i'll keep reading
i don't agree with the klingon read but i don't fully understand it either

Also welcome, I'm glad you're in the game and omg I can't express what a relief it is that someone is actually scum reading me, I thought I'd have to dive deep into the deliberate scumminess tank to give scum some reason to not shoot me.

I understand this but I think it's such a weird and odd thing to say

also townread on itlepip as of right now

I don't have any, I hate D1, I think it's all people blowing air up each other's asses because there are no FACTS to go off of, and I only work off of probabilistic reasoning.

If you'll direct your attention to LH's first few posts, you'll see then ask me for reads, and see me get irritated at them for asking me for something they should know I won't do on day one due to lack of information.

you can go ahead and be contrarian if you like, but blowing air up each other's asses isn't necessarily bad D1 because if you do turn out being scum, then we have associative info to go off of.
i also think you're over-pushing the playstyle defense and i don't like that.

More posts like this please.

I am asking the mod to intervene here. This all pointless and personal insults by many parties spamming. I like like 5 posts that are not mine of the past few pages. This is becoming impossible to play and from me, that's saying something.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

@RP, What did you want me to review?

@Errant, thoughts on Elbrin?

Dave is probably town. I have been voteless scum though so...

[Learned Hand]

Meaning why don't you know?

[Learned Hand]

Not liking EAP saying neighbor = town.

If singlball, Klingon is almost certainly town. There's a big difference between here and Suikoden and her other scumgames. Not liking the OMGUS but Kling has always been focused on herself.

To that end, while I don't see any glaring flaws with Roleplay's analysis, the fact he's equally confident both are scum is jarring me. If Klingon is town and they are both equally scummy...that would make Sharky town.

I will flag Drixx and let him use our vote as he wishes till I feel better.

[Learned Hand]

Oh friendly neighbor, I hate those.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

I caught scum d1. They fake claimed fn, changed from full FJ to three shot fn, had a buddy vouch and won flawlessly. InuYasha mafia.

Gtg to work.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Not liking EAP saying neighbor = town.

If singlball, Klingon is almost certainly town. There's a big difference between here and Suikoden and her other scumgames. Not liking the OMGUS but Kling has always been focused on herself.

To that end, while I don't see any glaring flaws with Roleplay's analysis, the fact he's equally confident both are scum is jarring me. If Klingon is town and they are both equally scummy...that would make Sharky town.

I will flag Drixx and let him use our vote as he wishes till I feel better.

@Roleplay, thoughts?

[Learned Hand]

Rather than copping someone, why not ask the mod to publicly post [Player Name Here]'s PM for all to see? Night kill a random scum? Sensor a wagon (reveal how many scum are on a wagon) ignoring any Godfather or Miller PM?

[Learned Hand]

No.

We use mine. Guaranteed scum flip or permanent information regarding wagon composition.

I don't see how yours trump that. Shiro's dream is a scum claim.

[Learned Hand]

I cannot say what my active or passive ability is. I am a Lucid Dreamer, yes. Lucid Dreamers are supposed to be able to do 1 action taken on another player in a day/night phase.

This is the only restrictions I see. Vague is not required at all.

Any action. Done to one player. "I dream a random person who does not have town's wincon dies". Not vague. Not hard. Not game breaking.

Wagon sensor is not done to a person so meh.

[Learned Hand]

Dreaming to be unlynchable is scummy as fuck. It forces town to waste a lynch.

[Learned Hand]

I should rephrase that.

"I dream to murder one player that is not a bystander".

[Learned Hand]

There's also,

I dream to give Sharky the ability of a compulsive strongman weak amnesiac cop. Sharky either dies or we get a lot of town information.

[Learned Hand]

@Sharky, You could give a universally regarded scummy player a compulsive D1 Desperado. We get a confirmed town or dead scum.

I dream I give lurker bait a compulsive D1 Desperado.

[Learned Hand]

Some variants have Desperadoes shoot forever by that would possibly be rejected.

[Learned Hand]

1. Varsoon is my waifu
2. I lied he's not trapping me
3. Reasons I can not divulge at this moment make me doing it more optimal than if anyone else were to do it
4. I don't have any reason to trust zMuffinMan at this point, he's been lurkylurky pretty hard and hasn't done anything to fill me with good feels

Low post number =/= lurking.

Zmuffin has had a lot of content.

Who should Sharky give a desperado to?

[Learned Hand]

Well if zmuffin does nothing then he's not a terrible choice...

@Elbrin, Vendors leave confirmation like I was here.

[Learned Hand]

We should let Tn choose who to desperado. He cannot kill town. If he guesses town he dies. If he guesses scum, scum die. Compulsive so he cannot refuse to guess.

Who tn chooses says a lot about his alignment.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Sharky should dream for one of the millers to be an innocent child instead

Boom

That's stupid. Millers are usually town.

Desperadoes are day events and self confirming.

[Learned Hand]

Hence why I added D1 compulsive. If there's no desperado shot, we lynch Sparky.

[Learned Hand]

That still generates a one for one because TN not claiming ascetic is a scumclaim.

[Learned Hand]

It's not even a one for one, it's a guaranteed kill. Of course there's no reason for tn to not falsely claim ascetic now. I guess in that case we choose someone else to be the desperado, and likely lynch tn. A desperado at sharky seems best btw, clearing him is really really good.

Well now that we have told TN ascetic = lynch, he'll do the opposite of the truth if scum.

[Learned Hand]

It's not even a one for one, it's a guaranteed kill. Of course there's no reason for tn to not falsely claim ascetic now. I guess in that case we choose someone else to be the desperado, and likely lynch tn. A desperado at sharky seems best btw, clearing him is really really good.

I still stand by that TN should pick who to desperado with Sharky being a suggestion.
If the desperado is dreamed as I describe

"I dream that I invent a desperado gun to TN." Then Sharky is likely town.

TN picking says volumes about his alignment.

[Learned Hand]

Oh, btw LH, you still haven't told me what the difference is between now and Suikoden, with regards to klingon.

It's a complete one eighty. In Suikoden she's all excuses and where votes. Here her PoV makes sense, regardless of its accuracy.

[Learned Hand]

Not sure if compulsive effects me doing it or not. I want to, though. I have the freedom to choose who I desperado-shoot. I'm probably going to go with tn, kling, errant, or mass flop. I will clarify which one I picked before I shoot.

Compulsive is a modifier. I left that out. It prevents TN from waffling or lurking out the day.

I dream that I invent a compulsive day one desperado to TN.

That should do it.

[Learned Hand]

If you're going to do that Sharky, you should use the language in 1220 but with the proper spelling of TN's name. :nod:

Then you take an action to tn rather than changing him.

[Learned Hand]

So errant targets sharky, and if sharky is town errant dies?

Why did you decide to give it to errant? I thought you were giving it to tn?

I would rather errant target Cerb or tn now. The fact Sharky appears to have picked someone other than tn is startling.

Tn is the more universal choice. Cerb would stop this hydra from debating his alignment.

[Learned Hand]

Yes 3dice. And if Sharky is scum, yay we killed him! :p

I also want to know rhe answer to that question. I don't mind terribly, giving it to a miller claim seems very reasonable.

Sounds good.

There's a few theories popping around my head right now, but they might just be skepticism, so we'll have to see how errant acts.

Does it have anything to do with dud inventions that kill the user?

Has to do with errant and sharky being scum together. It's a bit premature and should be easily confirmed by how errant acts.

I am more concerned with th Sharky myself.

[Learned Hand]

The solution is the same though. Errant shoots TN or Sharky as the group dictates.

The result will tell us the type of gun it was.

A gun that belonged to a day one desperado is a very strained interpretation of what I wrote.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Klingon is town unless and until multiball is proven. Not voting there.

Can we move forward and Errant bold the following in thread?

I wish to use the desperado gun Sharky gave me on Sharky.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

zMuffinMan - Could you please do something else with your avatar? The flashing lights are really bothering me. I'm not epileptic, but I suffered two major concussions within a 24 hour period and while enough time has passed that just using computer screens does not give me a visual migraine any longer ... your avatar just gave me one.

So you can understand just how damaging a visual migraine is to someone, please check this out: http://www.allaboutvision.com/condition ... graine.htm

They have a series of images that show how it proceeds. First it's right at the focal point, then it spreads out in a ring. It will be 45 minutes to an hour before it goes away, and that hour will have to be spent in a dark room.

~Drixx

[Learned Hand]

VOTE: errant

Just a reminder to shoot Sharky.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Sharky why didn't you give the gun to TN?

Forcing Sharky to give the gun to errant over and over seems to be the best move.

Will need to sync with Drixx on reads.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Skimmed. Totally missed Somethings.

Klingon has the fire a little bit. Hence why townread.

Since the gun is likely Desperado, I renew the request to shoot Cerb.

Sharky not giving a desperado gun to know scum is suspect when he was directed to do so.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

@Sharky,

I think it's you scum, errant scum, tn scum. We should resolve that by having errant shoot you. :nod:

I will be back after this is done.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

DS is also acceptable shot.

[Learned Hand]

^^^ That reminds me of Young and Beautiul's shifting friendly neighbor claim.

@Sharky/DS/Roleplay, we can cut to the chase as to who is bad with a sparky shot. Considering I devised the plan that has netted us a dead scum, your notions are laughable. Plus we scumread tn who flipped scum.

You could always try to get him to shoot me. :-p

~Pbv Titus

[Learned Hand]

Okay, I thought a bit more. LH hates bussing, both heads. TN didn't do enough to seem like a lost cause. Seriously Titus, Drixx, I NEED you to explain the KC read. If you're town, as seems likely if this is not multiball, I'm willing to accept the KC read but not when she's doing the exact same thing you're claiming she isn't doing.

Klingon is epically bad town here.

In Sudikoen she

never

interjected with comments such as "I don't get the TN pressure". She never asked questions. Never interacted with anyone, like at all. Here she's aggressive and her reads aren't all OMGUS.

Second, we could have Errant shoot her, settle this and make it a day since it should be desperado Klingon won't die. You'll be exposed as a liar and Drixx will let me go after you and Elbrin yet.

Third, your whole argument about LH doesn't like bussing therefore LH is scum is shit. It was my desperado plan that lead to scum flipping.

So, you want Errant to shoot Klingon or not?

[Learned Hand]

@Cerb/Elbrin,

I know how to read Klingon. Now, which of you gets lynched first is up to Drixx.

[Learned Hand]

Request Holiday Extension so Drixx can catch up.

[Learned Hand]

DS is town. Jeanne is town. Scum pushed Kling based on lies.

So who is up for a Cerb or Elbrin lynch?

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

DS is town. Jeanne is town. Scum pushed Kling based on lies.

So who is up for a Cerb or Elbrin lynch?

~Titus

Are you two going to actually do anything or just keep repeating this?

You're both extremely competent players and I find it hard to believe that this is the best you can do, i.e. nothing.

Sell me on cerb in your next post or claim scum

I am not selling you on Cerb being your buddy.

VOTE: Elbrin

So many lies about Klingon by you both. You both pushed this was scum Klingon in direct contradiction to any town player seeing that game.

Verb's even lying about not having pushed Klingon. Oh wait, he's active lurking and avoiding voting by his self imposed anti-town behavior so he can claim he never pushed it.

You want a fight Elbrin. You v me. Let's go.

Who defended obvtown Klingon? Who had a vote on scum pre desperado shot? Who designed the plan that forced a scum death?

Who pushed town based on lies? Wanted to chain lynch millers?

Fight us.

(I would be voting Cerb but Drixx thinks Cerb isn't that helpful to D3 and says to let Cerb go).

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

Hai guys. Happy New Year! So, who are we lynching again? It's not errant or Sharky, they're terrible lynches for today, stop being dumb.

Also, Zmuff are you gonna target EAP or what?

Also, I'm down with the KC lynch, because yes, the pool of people who have *no* redeeming posts is getting pretty small.

Errant/ sharky team isn't unimaginable. And, to those of you saying "inventing a unlimited shot gun can't possibly be a town power! " well....wtf? Do you seriously think it's a scum power? Oh hey D1 I can give my team double kills! Or maybe I'll just give them a regular vig shot in a game not balanced for a vig shot, and use our standard scum redirection/roleblocking type abilities to keep it from hitting us!

Seems as strong for scum as for town. That is, too strong.

Okay, think about it for a second. We didn't get a mafia flavor flip (they weren't the purple mafia or the mafia with the silly hats or something). So most likely it's a 4 man scumteam with third parties (5 is a little absurd). Or at a minimum they don't know if there's third parties.

And the most common third party is serial killer.

So it's really likely that we leave EP alive. He apparently has an unlimited shot gun we want to use. Now, even if the SK is bulletproof, taking a bullet and having nothing happen is one of those events that attracts attention. So the SK is very likely to want to cap EP. And Sharky, because sharky is also a huge threat. So you'd basically be gambling that there isn't an SK for... what reason? Saving Sharky? Instead of letting us hammer him and just assuming none of you will be shot by the SK and move on.

Hell, if that happened FINE. It's not something we should worry about on day 1. It's disgustingly low percentage. Talk to me about it later.

Roleplay, I think I've come to understand the problem we have. You take me thinking out loud and expressing my belief that something should or wouldn't be dismissed as espousing a given course. I'm not. I don't think sharky/errant are scum and should be lynched(as should be clear by me saying I could support a kc lynch), I'm merely saying it's not outside the realm of possibility that they are scum together....but I'm not saying it's likely. Just..don't dismiss it, that's all.

Pedit: I am also very interested in this, and it needs to happen soon. Also, KC, you are going to be lynched today unless you show up and wow us. Like, seriously. Nobody thinks your town right now(except LH I guess, but they've been uncharacteristically quiet and ineffective (that is, they're not pushing for any of the answers to the questions they have, just throwing them out there and letting them get lost in the noise), so they're not going to be saving you with the level of faith I currently have in them)), so you should probably do something. Like, useful and stuff. Engage with the game.

You've

got

to be kidding me...

Nice OMGUS Errant. That's so fucking terrible

And the fact that Jeanne jumped on it is beyond ridiculous. If nobody does anything about this scummy exhibit, then, well, SOMETHING. I don't know what. But something.

I'm looking at you, Cerberus. As the de facto town leader, I hope you do something about this.

You..don't want me as the town leader. Not this weekend. Life is too amazing for hardcore mafiaing. Going after DS is dumb though. I don't remember why. Hmm. Oh. Yeah. Okay. I went through DS' ISO trying to remember why people don't like him, and I realized it was the stupid miller thing at the root of it all. His logic with regards to errant is perfectly acceptable, not scummy or inconsistent.

No good reasons for wanting his head exist.

So, also looked at tns iso (which isn't actually what I was interested in, I cared more about how other people felt about tn, but I'm busy and don't have the time for all that). Only people he actively attacked were Jeanne and sharky. He kept saying sharky was scummy but not his top scum read, but nobody ever pressed him on who his top scumread was. :/

At the height of his wagon, which was 4 I believe, when he asked for people who hadn't given a reason for their vote on him to give a reason, he was being voted by roleplay, elbirn, jeanne, and LH.

Votecount 3: Hey, replacing out makes ME miserable

tn5421 (4): roleplay25, Elbirn, Jeanne11, Learned Hand
DiamondSentinel (3): ErrantParabola, 3dicerolling, Davsto
Jeanne11 (2): tn5421, DiamondSentinel
zmuffinman (1): Edgar Allan Pro
3dicerolling (1): Mass Flop

Not Voting: Klingoncelt, Cerberus v666, sharky5x, Shiro, BBMolla, zmuffinman

It is 9 to lynch. Theoretical Deadline is in 12 days and 5 hours, although Holiday Special Extension is possible.

Quick Reminder: It's the holiday season, please keep it civil and jolly. No need to call each other retards :/

22)

Policy:

Have fun. Or else. And remember, it's a game - keep it classy and don't take things personally; everyone's doing what they have to to win.

Then, over the next 4.5 pages, this happened. I need to read these pages and see wtf went on here.
RP and Jeanne moved to sharky, LH moved to DS.

LH decided she didn't like the company on the tn wagon (so, elbirn rp, and jeanne) except for rp and jeanne (so just elbirn).

RP moved to DS when he made his dumb omg I suck just kill me post, then to KC in response to the Judas etc. comments about Ds, then to sharky...after Jeanne naked voted him? So basically for no reason?

Jeanne....makes no sense here. Sec.

Okau. Had to go find where she voted tn. She votes him before going afk for 16h at my request to keep us from flooding the thread. Just says I'm game, so is perfectly happy with a tn lynch. Later, she says she'll never go after him, while voting him, is questioned by 3dice on that and then naked votes sharky. RP sheeps.

VC after that stuff happens.

Votecount 4: Merry Miserable Xmas!

DiamondSentinel (4): ErrantParabola, 3dicerolling, Davsto, Learned Hand
sharky5x (2): Jeanne11, Roleplay25
Jeanne11 (2): tn5421, DiamondSentinel
zmuffinman (1): Edgar Allan Pro
3dicerolling (1): Mass Flop
tn5421 (1): Elbirn

Not Voting: Klingoncelt, Cerberus v666, sharky5x, Shiro, itlepip, zmuffinman

itlepip replaces BBMolla, effective immediately~!

It is 9 to lynch. Theoretical Deadline is in 10 days and 3 hours, although Holiday Special Extension is possible.

Not sure what I got out of all that, actually, but it's really fucking interesting.

Pedit: I'm still unopposed to a kc lynch. If scum, a LH lynch is a good move next. Last time I checked KCs play here is actually just all excuses and dodging, like suikoden. Don't understand Titus insisting that things are different.

KC: you keep promising to be here, and you're never here.

EAP: will you be conftown to zmuffin tomorrow, yes or no? And remember what my standards for conftown are. :p

LH: please convince Drixx to play this game a bit. I'd like him to iso roleplay and mass flop and give his thoughts.

We should lynch Klingon. That's not a push according to your semantics. Then you've never pushed anyone.

[Learned Hand]

I don't like Elbirn planning out deaths. I'm pretty sure that's scum.

I'm not well, and am unlikely to be well before tomorrow at the earliest. Random personal issue that arises occasionally. Nothing I can do but endure it.

~Drixx

[Learned Hand]

This LH/Elbirn argument could not possibly have less life in it. It's like they're going through the motions, poking each other weakly, each knowing the other won't die. With under three days left, is either making the case for the other to be the lynch over Shiro, Itle or Davsto? No. They both have enough experience to know full well what they're doing won't result in a lynch, and yet here they are, going through the motions, not pushing an actual wagon or presenting an actual compelling counterwagon. Just poke, poke, poke, poke. Like straw poll, is anyone giving a shit? No? The town is content to lynch someone other than their supposed "top scum read" (kek) but they just do not care.

Frankly if one is scum then the other is MORE likely to be scum, not less.

Contrast with zMuffin who starts a new wagon and actually tries to get us to join it. Given Itle's response to the votes, I really don't want to (his response was very 'yah, you got me, but I'll go through the motions') but at least he gives a fuck.

LH, Elbirn, shit or get off the pot. We've got two days left, take an actual position.

I take one day off and you're hyper defending obvious scumin Elbrin and then focused on how things will look if Elbrin flips scum.

Shit on your posting. Shit on you.

There, I shitted.

Itepip wagon has too many scum.

Dave's to is town playing voteless correctly.

Willing to move to Roleplay. I really want Elbrin.

@Shiro, *bats eyelashes*

[Learned Hand]

Stop trying to be ABR, you're a shit ABR and ABR is a shit player anyway.

*pats you*

I am no ABR. I am the queen of town blocks.
Dave itepip Jeanne and Klingon are remembers. Itepip has loose membership because his wagon looks too much like Klingon's.

[Learned Hand]

Like, if you want to vote me, fine. At least you'll be taking a fucking position come end of day, and be on a wagon with more than 1 vote. It's a shit position and you'd have to be brain damaged to think I'm scum here, but fine. At least you'd fucking be doing something useful.

One vote wagons don't kill people. You're fucking on a one vote wagon, so either try to get other people who agree with you to vote it, or fucking get on a more useful wagon. There ain't one scum left, so don't give me "I only have one fucking scumread" bullshit.

I am fine voting scum. I hate both wagons with more than one vote.

I am taking a position. Elbrin is scum. Cerb is more obvious but Drixx doesn't see it.

I am under no obligation to vote a wagon because it has votes.

[Learned Hand]

Forgot DS still has a shit wagon. Yeah no voting there either.

@EAP

1) Lied about Klingon meta to push case on obvious town
2) Tried to focus on Millers because they claimed millers when scum don't usually claim Miller on D1.
3) Attempted to save TN
4) Circle jerk defend each other
5) Have been pushing Jeanne and riling her up
6) Pushed wagon on town DS

Elbrin voted TN once. That's the only redemming thing there and it looks like a bus.

[Learned Hand]

Roleplay, shit or get off the pot. Take a stance on me v Elbrin.

[Learned Hand]

@Roleplay, I don't see what the hyponotoad has to do with anything.

@EAP, Why Shiro?

@Cerb, Nah Drixx thinks you suck at early game. Sucking is fine. Lying about Klingon being obvious town is not.

[Learned Hand]

How does everyone feel about the members of the short lived wagon on tn, LH, Jeanne, Elbirn, and RP?

Pedit: No lies here. KC sucked early and she sucks now, but at least she's not gonna get mislynched and she's on VLA.

That wasn't the question. You stated over and over this was like Sudikoen which is just wrong.

Jeanne is town. I am town. I would help you bus Elbrin and RP.

[Learned Hand]

Elbrin never gave a reason for TN scum at all when voting TN.
TN was a counter to DS who amazingly still has votes.

[Learned Hand]

@Roleplay, I don't see what the hyponotoad has to do with anything.

@EAP, Why Shiro?

@Cerb, Nah Drixx thinks you suck at early game. Sucking is fine. Lying about Klingon being obvious town is not.

B...But she's an IC!

Yes. Cerb was lying before the IC flip.

[Learned Hand]

Low post number =/= lurking.

Zmuffin has had a lot of content.

Who should Sharky give a desperado to?

1. I'm not certain I agree with that...he's got 15 posts, of which 10 of them were either pregame or are him saying "I'll catch up later". I don't find lurkylurky to be a scumtell, but it doesn't give me much confidence in him.

I will begrudgingly admit that his 3 or so good content posts were, well, good content. Hrm. I just need more of him in my life.

2. Sharky should give a desperado to ooo himself? Or if not possible, to TN.

3. Reasons I can not divulge at this moment make me doing it more optimal than if anyone else were to do it

Point 3 is almost definitely wrong.

it really isn't.

I'm disappointed. You guys are actually town-reading me even though I admitted I was PMuch active-lurking.

I think you have balls for admitting to lurking this early, so yes, I'm town-lean on you, Diamond.

A fart on both of you.

Game hasn't even been open 24 hours and youre posting more than a lot of people who haven't even checked in. That's not lurking, and giving DS credit for it is really, reaaaallly paper thin, tn.

UNVOTE:

Guys quick, where should my vote be?

TN5421

Gosh, probably
VOTE: TN5421

C'mon, put me at L-1 so that I can claim and we could leave this stuff behind.

Jeanne. Stop. As respectfully and as firmly as I can say it, stop. You are not in danger of dying, and your extreme and irrational fear of death is detrimental. Deep breaths gurl. You're not dying today, you're probably not dying for a while, you're certainly not dying in day play (lynches) cuz Ima fight the fuck outta that shit cuz I'm pretty sure you're town here. Keep a clear head. You're good. It's like 9 votes to lynch. You don't need to worry unless you get 8 on you. Which won't happen.

Dice and Errant, iirc

Wrong pal it was me all along, I am the ohter miller claim. My record is pretty heavy . I .I ugh have done stuff All forms of authorities pretty much hate me and so do I. *drinks from flask*

"What are you doing here?", said Elbirn to Shiro, whom he found settled down in silence before a collection of empty bottles and also a collection of full bottles.

"I am drinking," replied Shiro with a lugubrious air.

"Why are you drinking?", demanded Elbirn.

"So that I may forget," replied Shiro.

"Forget what?", inquired Elbirn, who was already feeling very sorry for him.

"Forget that I am ashamed", confessed shiro, hanging his head.

"Ashamed of what?", insisted Elbirn, who wanted to help him.

"Ashamed of drinking!" Shiro brought his speech to an end, and shut himself up in an impregnable silence.

And Elbirn went away, puzzled.

"The grown-ups are certainly very, very odd", he said to himself, as he continued his journey.

Your push on both millers being scum claims makes me feel terrible about you. I knew one miller must be honest about being a miller, so I don't like you pressuring both like that.

~Titus

Except I previously recanted and shiro is my homeboy for life, soo..?

Admittedly I'm null on errant, and yeah you got me, I was being snarky earlier when I didn't like two miller claims, but I've since reevaluated.

Bus vote on TN.

One comment about TN being paper thin but largely pushes DS and Jeanne who are both likely town. Tried to save TN by suggesting Sharky give Desperado to himself.

You also admitted you double pushed the millers but said Shiro homeboy for life. Now when deadline approaches, tune changes.

[Learned Hand]

LH, I'll say this one final time: KHs play was just as..lacking in fire, to my perspective, as it was in Suikoden. You are someone who I expected fo comment on that, and you never did. I wanted to know why. EVERYTHING about what I was saying with regard to Klingon was about figuring out why YOU were acting in a fashion I didn't expect, not about Klingon. I never had an opinion on Klingon, but I expected YOU to have one that included commentary on her "lack of fire".

Also, so you believe both Elbirn and RP were moving to bus tn at that point?

Dude. Titus. Fucking tell me, right now, that you think I, Mr. Fuck your meta reads, would, as scum, depart from that and make a fucking meta case on someone with NO OTHER EVIDENCE AT ALL in thread to support any read of them?

Please. Tell me you sincerely believe I would choose to depart from my established TOWN meta Ina game with people who have played with me before and know me well, just to...what....push klingon? The fuck do I care about Klingon as scum? To threaten you? No,you're both pains in the ass, I'd just nk you.

Listen to yourself Titus, and try to see how little sense what you're accusing me of doing makes sense for scum me.

I will say this again. You're lying about Klingon. If you're town you're delusional. We went over this. I defined the fire. Explained it. I have know Klingon for about a year now.

*farts self meta to cover lying and being busted for it*

Help me remove scum if you want a chance to be townread by me.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

@Roleplay, I don't see what the hyponotoad has to do with anything.

Really, then why aren't you lynching Sharky? The man who hasn't posted for a million years? Because all glory to the hypnotoad.

Because he can give you fuckers desperadoes which forces your scum team to implode or confirm us as town. Win win.

[Learned Hand]

@Roleplay, I don't see what the hyponotoad has to do with anything.

Really, then why aren't you lynching Sharky? The man who hasn't posted for a million years? Because all glory to the hypnotoad.

Because he can give you fuckers desperadoes which forces your scum team to implode or confirm us as town. Win win.

Yeah, Titus? You're bad at mafia.

The last guy who tried to provoke people is dead and flipped scum.

You shouldn't emulate your buddy or if you are Derp town, scum.

[Learned Hand]

@Cerb, No, you didn't do shit. You're trying to create a false narrative that the guns aren't desperadoes now. Ha.

Confirming Sharky as town is useful.

We are going to fight because you aren't helping town even if you are. You didn't in Sudikoen and not now.

[Learned Hand]

Titus, you have always been bad at mafia. You're copying some of the most violently toxic players on the site, and the past few years haven't made you any better. I'd say that all they've done is give you an ego, but you had that since day 1 (and it was even less deserved then).

Get out of your fucking derp tunnel. You're going to complain that we're all bad and shit when it turns out we're all town and you're helping the scumteam, as usual, but it's basically your MO. I'm sure you have some game you want to link me to where you caught all the scum day 1 and everyone ignored you, but everyone ignored you because you're usually wrong, you live in tunnels, and you operate on pure confirmation bias.

You want to play like a fucking terrorist? Fine. You'll put yourself on the need to die list, and one way or another I will see that happen. I always, always do. That is a promise, by the way. If I'm town and I want someone to die, one way or another they fucking die. I don't by a long shot have a strong town read on you, and the more you flail about trying to threaten me (hah! If you had any fucking clue) then the more you move towards being a necessary death. You think I'm town and you're threatening me because I disagree with your reads, Titus, what does that say about you?

No. I am threatening you because you're scum or need to get your head out of your ass.

Calling me a terrorist while not taking an explicit position on Elbrin and calling me shitty.

You're just trying to rile me up.

This isn't about how good or bad I am. It's about the facts and lynching scum.

[Learned Hand]

Titus, he can't give people desperadoes to people. Check my iso. I asked the mod a number of questions and I assure you he can not give guns wirh any restrictions other than number of shot.

I am fully capable of reading. I am done discussing this.

[Learned Hand]

And not toxic like the "oh ho tumblr now I'm triggered" bullshit that gets tossed around by people who can't handle "bad words" because they haven't matured past early puberty, I'm talking people who drag the game into the mud, make everyone lose the will to live, and trash an entire town with their sheer disgustingly destructive personality.

If you're right in a game you think that gives you a god license and go on to tunnel some other player. If you're wrong in a game you assume that it was because the other person played poorly, insult them, and go on to tunnel some other player. It's worse than RNG, because no one listens to you, and if you do happen to be coincidentally right, the scum just shoot you anyway, and then no one listens to you because half the time when you're shot it's because they can't stand you either.

And the worst part is you know this, and you try to do the same damn thing as scum, because you think it's in your meta to play like shit.

Hey, here's a thought. Break the fucking cycle.

Yes you can. Use facts.

Facts break cycles.

There is no toxic environment but to those who push lies and demand my vote go to wagons without reasons and refuse to provide them.

My reads don't change without reason unless scum.

There is nothing for me to do to break a cycle. You have to stop whining that I won't vote town.

You're trying to provoke me and make me the bad guy.

You also have a temper problem. Catch is, I can take it.

[Learned Hand]

You're just trying to rile me up.

Like honestly, this is the worst part. Someone gives you criticism, they're "just jealous", "just scum", "just bad", "just trying to rile you up", etc. etc. etc.

It's like some Dr. Who perception filter technology where any criticism gets automatically morphed into something where you did nothing wrong. Gaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

I haven't all you have done is whine and call me a terrorist. That's not criticism. I told you I am not voting any of the three wagons because they all suck.

Rather than defend your position, you go on a tirade about how terrible I am for the game.

Facts at facts. You want my vote. Use them.

[Learned Hand]

Jeanne we get it you're investigative please please PLEASE stop telegraphing it everywhere fuck

fuck you too, person who wants me lynched despite professing to know something which I made up on a spot.

Jeanne I have never at any point voted you or called for your head or even implied you were scum or ANYTHING. Disagreeing does not mean I think you are scum.

UNVOTE:

Guys quick, where should my vote be?

TN5421

Gosh, probably
VOTE: TN5421

C'mon, put me at L-1 so that I can claim and we could leave this stuff behind.

Jeanne. Stop. As respectfully and as firmly as I can say it, stop. You are not in danger of dying, and your extreme and irrational fear of death is detrimental. Deep breaths gurl. You're not dying today, you're probably not dying for a while, you're certainly not dying in day play (lynches) cuz Ima fight the fuck outta that shit cuz I'm pretty sure you're town here. Keep a clear head. You're good. It's like 9 votes to lynch. You don't need to worry unless you get 8 on you. Which won't happen.

Dice and Errant, iirc

Wrong pal it was me all along, I am the ohter miller claim. My record is pretty heavy . I .I ugh have done stuff All forms of authorities pretty much hate me and so do I. *drinks from flask*

"What are you doing here?", said Elbirn to Shiro, whom he found settled down in silence before a collection of empty bottles and also a collection of full bottles.

"I am drinking," replied Shiro with a lugubrious air.

"Why are you drinking?", demanded Elbirn.

"So that I may forget," replied Shiro.

"Forget what?", inquired Elbirn, who was already feeling very sorry for him.

"Forget that I am ashamed", confessed shiro, hanging his head.

"Ashamed of what?", insisted Elbirn, who wanted to help him.

"Ashamed of drinking!" Shiro brought his speech to an end, and shut himself up in an impregnable silence.

And Elbirn went away, puzzled.

"The grown-ups are certainly very, very odd", he said to himself, as he continued his journey.

@Elbirn @Shiro can I join the masonry?

Aren't you afraid of shiro or something?

I town-read her here. We all town-read each other here, so why can't I be honorary masons with you both.

I was gonna have some blabla about you being paranoid and afraid of everyone, and that phobia coming specifically from a past game with shiro, and therefore you should fear shiro more than anything and therefore your townread is odd

But now I don't care

>Jeanne hints egregiously that she and Sharky are both investigative, or somehow related, with her insistence that lynching either of them results in the loss of an investigative pr
>I directly ask Jeanne multiple times if I should stop voting for Sharky, maybe they're masons or something, all I needed was her word and I'd move on
>Jeanne says *nothing*
>I move on with my life anyway
>many moons pass
>Jeanne votes Sharky and then claims paranoid gun owner

....

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Jeanne11

Chronology is hard Elbrin. You said Jeanne was never going to be lynched and then voted her later.

[Learned Hand]

There ARE NO GOOD GUYS AND BAD GUYS. Mafia is a GAME! It's fun because we can draw the lines, ooh look, town = good guy, scum = bad guy. It's all a show, and we go about playing our parts, hunting and arguing and debating and lynching and stuff.

REALITY ISN'T LIKE THAT. When you realize that, a hell of a lot of things in your life will get better.

On a more game related note, if you are coming down firmly on the side of Itle&Shiro = town, I think you're going to be very, very surprised about Itle. That reaction was bad, and you can't see it. I think you won't be surprised about Elbirn, because you're already morphing me into scum white knighting him or something to explain away criticism of your play.

Why was the reaction bad? Mere allegations are nothing.

Yes, the world is that black and white. Either you're helping town, or you're not. We may not know it yet, but every post serves one function or the other. You can stop bitching about me being right and present your case now. Maybe we both are. I doubt it though.

[Learned Hand]

Any evidence itepip is scum.

KC is conftown and I hope she'd lead but if not I will.

And both those people are scum, then fine. If Sharky's lying about the Desperado, he probably isn't town and the best play is to shoot him.

If Cerb presents facts rather than woah is me shit, I will listen. Right now, he's told me to go fish in his ISO with wrong evidence regarding Klingon.

I don't go fish. I provide evidence and discuss it.

[Learned Hand]

@Cerb, Poor wording. I am not inclined to go fish through an ISO with known inaccuracies.

Nothing in that goobledygook precludes giving a desperado gun.

Doesn't change the fact that Sharky should be shot next either way.

[Learned Hand]

Really? The mod saying you can't change someone's role in response to a question about giving someone a desperado gun, and saying number of shots if unspecified is dependent upon wording, doesn't sound like a desperado shot can't be given?

It sounds like he can use the phrasing to invent a desperado gun.

Giving someone a vig doesn't change their role. Desperado would be the same.

[Learned Hand]

@Cerb, Poor wording. I am not inclined to go fish through an ISO with known inaccuracies.

Nothing in that goobledygook precludes giving a desperado gun.

Doesn't change the fact that Sharky should be shot next either way.

@Dramonic, can Sharky make someone a compulsive day desperado?

easy way to solve that mess.

Can't use Sharky's name.

Can someone invent a desperado gun use?

[Learned Hand]

@zmuffin please use idiot or moron in place of retard. The word retard carries personal extra baggage to me.

Tempted to vote Shiro because Roleplay's an asshole, but I don't see Shiro as scum. :/

Mass Flop's comments look timed to keep me v Elbrin roleplay going...

Who is down for a 3dice quicklynch? Cerb Elbrin Roleplay are better but we need people working together.

[Learned Hand]

still not answering why shiro is town

still not providing any evidence for your assertions

you're worse than titus

When I tried Roleplay went all Titus is a terrorist. :nod:

Not voting itepip.

[Learned Hand]

I said OLDER than 10, muffin. I know reading is a problem for you, why not ask your teacher for some of those books with the pretty pictures to amuse you while the grownups have a conversation.

Are you counting in Hexadecimal. Base 10?

[Learned Hand]

You called me a fuckwit and a retard.

They're in the ISO. Go print it out and shove it up your ass, then

set yourself on fire

.

I am not doing a dog and pony show for you you waste of oxygen.

Do this again and I will PM the mod. Such language violates site rules. You know this.

Back up.

[Learned Hand]

It does no such thing. What the actual fuck.

Telling people to cut themselves and die in a fire or in this case stick burning paper up their ass all violate rules somewhere.

It's one thing to advocate he's dumb. It's quite another to wish physical harm to another user. :nod:

[Learned Hand]

VOTE: Cerberus fuck it.
The fact that he hasn't voted, hasn't really any reads, and his entire game is just small points (actively lurking) rather than real content is bad, especially when he is making a big show of not going to be lynched is pretty scummy in my book.

"Not voting is scummy"
"Not immediately posting reads is scummy"
"Making a big showy defense is scummy"

It's all shit you could post in Mafia Discussion without even playing in a game muffin.

So if you want to be worthless, be worthless. You can leave the name calling out of it.

this is literally your only response to that, and when i pointed out how fucking dumb this argument is, you go on about buzzwords instead

by your definition of "theory", quite literally every argument that's been posted so far in this game is a "theory" point

because your definition is really no more than "things people think are scummy"

Why don't we talk?

I am not a fan of lynching either miller claim. Errant shot scum so he's unlikely to be scum unless sharky is and that should be resolved by vig. Shiro is a mislynch of last resort. TN tried to wind up Jeanne. Itepip hasn't done anything scummy yet. TN and DS were counters to each other. Sharky will be resolved by shot tomorrow.

[Learned Hand]

Guy guys, all this anger will only lead to bad stuff.

Seriously all 3 of you should take some deep breaths and relax. Anger and arguments of this kind will just lead to discord and apathy in town.

Ding. That's why Roleplay should be the lynch. Rather than justify his opinions, he starts a shit fest.

[Learned Hand]

@Shiro Then vote Elbrin please.

@zmuffin, Because our role pm guarantees there is at least one miller.

I don't have issues with Shiro's posting like at all. *shrug*

[Learned Hand]

@ZMuffin, Those aren't

town

thought processes. I pushed for the miller claims to see who would jump. Scum would love to lynch the millers in succession. When I call him on this, he says Shiro is his homeboy for life. As deadline approaches, he's back to miller hysteria.

He took the same approach with Jeanne. Never going to vote her and then does when it's easy.

The negative utility comments regarding reflexive BG rolecop are subtle jabs at EAP, and I don't get why you townread them.

While one can be a scum miller, it's unlikely unless multiball. Shiro's posting doesn't look scummy to me.

[Learned Hand]

@Cerb, whatever. Not engaging debate about rules.

Now, who are you interested in lynching. I don't want itepip or Shiro. Why won't you bus Elbrin?

[Learned Hand]

*bats eyelashes*

Cmon Shiro.

[Learned Hand]

There's nothing scummy in them thus town. Shiro is not scum unless multiball. The flipflops to lynch Shiro indicate she's town.

Now, you didn't answer my question. I didn't ask you if you thought your buddy was townier than me, I asked you why you wouldn't vote him. We're trying to get scum lynched not play favorites.

[Learned Hand]

That's an indicator of bussing.

Elbrin never had a reason to vote TN beyond RP was the first to ask him to.

Town justify moving their vote. Scum hide. Compare with Sukidoen.

I have errands to run.

[Learned Hand]

I hereby lift my restriction on my hydra partner against going after Cerberus. I had previously told Titus repeatedly that he's terribad at day one and that we should look at him on day three. He's playing outside of expectations now; however, and giving off some pings of the sorts of posts he made when we got assigned scum as our RR hydra.

She's going to be so mad that she is off running errands and I said this right as she posted that, but hey ... that's life.

~Drixx

[Learned Hand]

So if you want to be worthless, be worthless. You can leave the name calling out of it.

yeah, fuck up retard, you're shit at the game and you're calling others worthless and shit

get fucked

This needs to either get modkilled or WotC killed. To my everlasting shame, I slipped and let my exposure to the internet cause me to use the word "tard" in a completed game on site. It's the worst thing I've ever said on this site.

The word "retard" is so far across the line and so blatantly a cruel attack against the person (and most certainly not the play), and it's also ridiculously insulting to the rest of us.

~Drixx

[Learned Hand]

If you're talking to me, save your breath. I've been shitting my guts out and spending 80% of my waking time in the washroom for the last few days. I was V/LA across the site.

I'm trying to catch up in this game and seeing shit like that just infuriates me. I'm crippled. I am not "a" cripple. There's a difference. The word crippled describes my condition. I am not "physically challenged" or any of that politically correct mumbo jumbo. I can take care of myself. I get in and out of my wheelchair without aid. I can get off the ground if I fall. I cook, clean, drive, work and excel in my field. My legs don't work properly due to a spinal injury, so I'm crippled.

But if you decide to call me "a" cripple, you are adding negative judgment and suggesting I am sub-human because of it. The same goes for when you say someone is "a" retard. There's a difference between being retarded (which, as a word, simply means that something has been slowed down ... growth can be retarded both physically and mentally), and being called "a" retard. It's the name calling that has no place in civilized discourse.

~Drixx

[Learned Hand]

Vote Elbrin then.

RP, talking about ripping out someone's spine is not hilarious. Same with telling someone to light themselves on fire after sticking an ISO up their ass. These are site violations.

Retard is my own personal hangup because I was almost diagnosed as retarded.

To attack my integrity because I told you to stop breaking site rules is rich. I am the person who handles that shit privately and I never ever use or try to use modkills for my advantage.

Now I know there's a post from Cerb that I missed and I will reply in a couple hours.

[Learned Hand]

Do not sign up for a game I am in Roleplay. I don't want you around.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

I just want you to follow the rules or not play with me. Pretty simple. If you can't do that, I do not want you around.

As for me being stubborn on not voting town, that a good thing not a bad one.

~Titus

[Learned Hand]

You're the one hiding behind an alt RolePlay. Obviously you have some prior beef with Titus, so that makes the hiding behind an alt thing more dubious in my view. If you cannot deal with the consequences of what you did or said on your main account, you will inevitably do the same things and end up in the same place. Better to deal with your problems than run from them.

Can we maybe get back to the game?

~Drixx

[Learned Hand]

No. You are town Dave playing voteless right. I ain't voting you.

[Learned Hand]

So if you want to be worthless, be worthless. You can leave the name calling out of it.

yeah, fuck up retard, you're shit at the game and you're calling others worthless and shit

get fucked

This needs to either get modkilled or WotC killed. To my everlasting shame, I slipped and let my exposure to the internet cause me to use the word "tard" in a completed game on site. It's the worst thing I've ever said on this site.

The word "retard" is so far across the line and so blatantly a cruel attack against the person (and most certainly not the play), and it's also ridiculously insulting to the rest of us.

~Drixx

Thinking there's a "line" and thinking that one insult is somehow worse than another is fucking

reta

dumb.

Being offended is entirely a subjective thing. The fact that you personally think the word "retard" is worse than, say, the word dumb means nothing to me. I don't care. Nobody should unless they're of the belief that insults

at all

are bad. Making the argument that insults are fine but there's a line somewhere is just a really fucking dumb point of view.

From my point of view, there's little difference between that and being called dumb, worthless, etc. You think being called a retard is bad? Why? Because you personally think that? Why should I care? Insults in general are designed to make one person feel worse about themselves, and the fact that you personally think one insult is worse than another doesn't mean shit, because that's your personal opinion, your personal experience. It is also entirely possible for someone to feel more offended by the term "worthless" or "dumb" than the term "retard" and be able to justify it. Would they have grounds to call for your mod kill if you used either term?

Either take a hard line against insults in general or deal with it. I wasn't the one who started slinging insults. I'm perfectly fine not doing so, but whining for a mod kill is pathetic. Oops. Is pathetic a trigger word for you, too? Sorry but not really sorry in advance.

That whooshing sound you heard when you read my post was my point going right over your head. I didn't say some insults are worse than others. I said that there's a difference between the proper usage of a word and using it as an insult/to inflict emotional pain. I am crippled. That is a state of being wherein some normal physical function of my body doesn't work. It's not an insult to say I'm crippled. It is an insult to call me a cripple.

Similarly it's not an insult to point out that someone is retarded if you are referring to an actual condition. When you use it as an insult, that's the problem.

And whether you like it or not, attacking people in that way is against the site rules. You don't get to call people retards. You don't get to gay bash on people. You don't get to race bash. If I wanted the mod to modkill you, I would have sent a private message. I want you to understand the difference and act like a mature adult. It seems clear that trying to engage you adult to adult is a fool's errand though.

~Drixx

[Learned Hand]

Actually, this play from Jeanne is marked levels of improvement from her prior town play. She's listening to feedback, looking at things and adapting. I will not vote Jeanne. TN tried to rile up Jeanne.

Every time I case Elbrin, he cries lies and Roleplay makes 10 posts about how terrible I am. I will case him again but I feel like I am deliberately getting spammed out and I am the guy who pushes the Boulder up the hill to have it fall again.

[Learned Hand]

my last word on topic:

you can't expect people to know your trigger words. I personally also refrain from the retard word for similar reasons but like people don't know my life story I can't expect them to know the things that set me off more than usual! I like you a lot drixx, just you can't impose your sense of justice on everyone else too

pedit: I honestly don't think RP is scum cerb, any other ideas?

I've been warned by a mod and threatened with a low duration ban because I used the word "tard" once. It's either against the site rules or it isn't. If I'm going to get smacked around because I'm newer to the site, then you better believe I'm going to make sure there's no bullshit double standards going on. Period.

[Learned Hand]

Elbrin's entire ISO is buddying and pushing for easy town wagons that have been disproven and when all else fails, stick his head in the sand. He has one reasonless vote in his ISO. The guy who flipped scum.

Read along kiddies. We are going through Elbrin's ISO in order.

First, he attacks townread on MassFlop slot. Null by itself.
Second, he posts a Rorschach test.
Third, he posts an argument doubtcasting the millers. I suspected this was scum taking advantage of miller issue and pinged because I knew the game likely had more than one.
Fourth, jumps on Sharky with no reason. Picks a fight over Jeanne stating that town obscure their reasoning and only scum need reasoning.
Fifth, he rolefishes Jeanne but tells her he's never going to be lynched.
Sixth (I am at 193), he buddies Klingon with old memories of past games calling it fluff.
Seventh, distances from TN by doubtcasting both TN and DS leaving room for him to go either way.
Eighth, backs off from Shiro when no one says lynch the millers and tries to exclude obvious town Jeanne from being close yo Shiro by invoking their past games.
Ninth, jumps back to Jeanne hoping for easy lynchbait.
Tenth, he jumps on Sharky because of no reason lol easy wagon.
Eleventh, when Sharky claims and thus not lynchable, Elbrin jumps to DS. He votes DS because DS refuses to put up with Roleplay's shit. This suggest Elbrin benefits from Roleplay's toxic as fuck posting.
Twelve th, Elbrin makes up a whole case against the IC and dismisses her posts as nothing but insults.
Thirteenth, he's back to Shiro bring an OK lynch.

Skip the rest is Elbrin picking a fight with me and calling me a liar.

I can't find one push not on town, like at all. Just toxic defense from those three.

[Learned Hand]

We have 9/9 needed for a lynch right here, right now, actively talking, in a game where we're quickly approaching deadline, and you're fucking off about fucking themes.

Then you can fucking vote for anyone I am not fucking townreading. I would rather no lynch than lynch itepip, Jeanne, Klingon, Shiro, errant, DS, dave, or ourselves. Pick someone who is not them.

[Learned Hand]

We have 9/9 needed for a lynch right here, right now, actively talking, in a game where we're quickly approaching deadline, and you're fucking off about fucking themes.

Then you can fucking vote for anyone I am not fucking townreading. I would rather no lynch than lynch itepip, Jeanne, Klingon, Shiro, errant, DS, dave, or ourselves. Pick someone who is not them.

So itle is a town read. Good to know.

Forgot Sharky here.

Pronoun use is vague in your last two posts.

So how about it you two. Got any reads?

[Learned Hand]

There's about 10ish hours left and a wagon on Elbrin.

If you're willing to lynch, you should move. Why is Elbrin in your excluded pile?

[Learned Hand]

*not in

[Learned Hand]

Vote Elbrin? Deadline?

[Learned Hand]

It's just because Learned Hand is sitting around on Deadline funneling all these votes to you.
It isn't too hard, Elbirn.
Just sit here and every new page make sure to remind people of the deadline and say "More votes on ____"

This is probably the most accurate thing I've seen you say all game.

If it's what has to be done to lynch Elbrin scum, then it is what needs do be done.

You had zero problem with this behavior when Cerb and RP were pushing itlepip.

[Learned Hand]

How can I get some Golf Stars?

Not sure what they are, but I will find you some to vote scum Elbrin...

[Learned Hand]

Seriously

Learned Hand: "here are bald faced lies about elbirn, isn't he scum!"
Me: "Hey, uh, none of that is true :/"
Learned Hand: "see all elbirn does is insist I'm lying, what a scum."
Mindless masses: *nods in agreement, thoughtlessly piles on votes*

Except anyone who can read your ISO knows I am not lying so...

[Learned Hand]

So I'm Le Petite Prince

Cuz it's my favorite book forealz.

I had wanted a role that would be likely to be innocent child but apparently klingon stole that from me. I won't tell you people what my role does today, but it's confirmable; whoever I target will receive a flavor message, and confirmation that I targeted them, and what I did.

So there's that

Where's the downside?

[Learned Hand]

How can I get some Golf Stars?

Vote learned Hand and you'll get 50 golf stars and an A++

Part of me would like to let her live til tomorrow. I was townreading her pretty hard early, but then as the game moved along I felt the slot's presence fade. I'll re-evaluate your case when I can, but it probably won't be before the deadline.

3dice when you find scum you kill it
Don't give me this "hurr durr she can live till tomorrow"

Fucking you and cerb can stop slobbering on her knob now, she's not town, therefore she can't be a town asset, she's not useful, we kill scum.

Which is why you die.

Confirming roles are good. Period. This game the mod said would be frustrating by setup. Fruit vendor (which is essentially your claim) doesn't fit.

[Learned Hand]

Seriously

Learned Hand: "here are bald faced lies about elbirn, isn't he scum!"
Me: "Hey, uh, none of that is true :/"
Learned Hand: "see all elbirn does is insist I'm lying, what a scum."
Mindless masses: *nods in agreement, thoughtlessly piles on votes*

Except anyone who can read your ISO knows I am not lying so...

Except you have
And I've pointed it out when you've done it
Sooooo

All you have done is whine, not highlight lies because there are none to highlight.

Now, you should try casing scum. Oh wait you refuse to bus.

[Learned Hand]

It's not fruit vendor. It does something.

My votes on scum you cheeky shit

Calling me a shit is not useful. Whining isn't useful.

It's obvious that I am not scum.

Find another townie to push. I find it amazing that every push you've made so far has been on town fmpov. You didn't push TN at all.

[Learned Hand]

(expired on 2016-01-07 11:45:00)

THERE WE GO

Yes. 6 hours left.

[Learned Hand]

@Jeanne, Last word of advice. Act. Have faith in town. We will win.

This is harder than Sudikoen and we have no chat. One day at a time. You have gotten better. :nod: Believe in yourself and always seek improvement.

[Learned Hand]

OK, that would have been nice to know a few hours ago...

[Learned Hand]

Well I would solo vote before Dave.

I am not voting town so...

[Learned Hand]

I just did. I provided proof. If people thought I was wrong, you wouldn't have votes.I am not going to convince you to claim scum. That almost never happens.

I summarized your ISO quite nicely.

You are dodging the substance. Your significant pushes have all been on town.

[Learned Hand]

Well I would solo vote before Dave.

I am not voting town so...

Oh hey something we can actually agree on

Davsto is town, we don't need to kill him and policy lynching him is dumb. Just treat it like lylo is a day earlier than it actually is and don't waste a lynch on him. Ta daaa

Yes. We agree on that.

[Learned Hand]

@Cerb, the discussion is fruitless. The language I suggested is clear. Errant shooting Sharky resolves this.

@Dave, You were good on logic until paragraph 2. :nod: Given this is a self resolving situation, I would rather not belabor the point.

@Dram, Your response is noted. RP is dangerous to the health of the game. You disagree. Nothing more to be said.

[Learned Hand]

@Cerb, The scum motivation in riling up easy targets and mislynching them should be evident. I have work this afternoon. I will go into detail later.

[Learned Hand]

@Cerb, The scum motivation in riling up easy targets and mislynching them should be evident. I have work this afternoon. I will go into detail later.

You are going to try to sell yourself and Muffin as "easy targets"? Like what, I decide to rile you guys up over Jeanne or Diamond because I'm looking for easy targets?

Hey Muffin, you think of yourself as an easy target now?

This hydra is lying, this hydra is scum and the lynch they're selling you is a lynch on town.

Context is that was about Elbrin not you.

Second, I am an easy mislynch. Fear of Titus scum. Muffin has lurked and insulted people, endearing him to no one here.

Jeanne and Diamond are easy targets. Plain to see.

You're saying these people are terrible players NOT SCUM.

Find scum. Stop insulting town.

[Learned Hand]

I won't move from my only other scumread just because you disagree with it.

p-edit: I think he's scum because, well, his pushes were the players who were already pushed prior to his posts. Also, there is his doubt about how I know I and Sharky were investigative. The answer is, there's no 'and', there is 'or'. I knew one of us is an investigative because that's me. And I was right. Losing either of us is a disadvantage to town.

...Jeanne this doesn't make any sense. Not even a little bit.

You said that losing either you or Sharky would be losing an investigative. Full stop.
I also have zero knowledge of your alignment, therefore even if you are town *I don't know that* and therefore can not know that I'd be pushing town and losing town an investigative role. Which you've completely destroyed the utility of by claiming it early AND claiming who your target tonight is going to be :/

Stop this. You know this is town Jeanne from Sudikoen. You aren't mislynching either of us.

[Learned Hand]

Second she never claimed her target. :/

[Learned Hand]

Anyone seriously pushing us is either potential scum or hasn't been paying attention. I suppose there's a third option: they think we're completely and utterly the most stupid people to ever play mafia.

There's evidence in thread for why we're not scum, as early as our firsts posts. It's vastly sub-optimal to push us and force a claim today. We have already decided when to claim and have sufficiently good reasons for that decision. It only helps scum and harms town to go through the motions of what will only be a disguised role fishing expedition. I get that some of you don't like it when people say no to you when you want your curiosity satisfied, but being responsible town is more important than satisfying your curiosity.

There's nothing in the least bit scummy about our ISO, and in fact there's ample hints as to what role we were assigned. I initially felt that a day one claim made the most sense, but Titus persuaded me that there is a better time to do so, and so we'll do so when that time arrives. Since there are pedantic people in this game who will be asinine and ask about that time, let me pre-empt you by first telling you to save your time and not bother because I won't say any more than this: it will be well before we could ever be considered in end game territory. That is all any town player needs to know today, apart from what we already revealed.

I will say one more thing, although I will warn you that speculation could lead you to make very poor assumptions so do be careful: I submitted the choice for character to play as before this became a hydra. In fact, I gave Dramonic two different choices if I was randomly assigned town and a different choice if I was randomly assigned scum, all of which come from what I would argue is the best television series ever aired: Babylon 5. I'll be happy to reveal the characters that Dramonic chose not to use after the game, but the one that we were given is G'kar (although Dram spelled it G'car, probably to irritate me). You have what you need to go and find the flavor. I will say that the role we have fits nicely with the character.

Of course, the character is ambiguous. Depending on where you step into the story, you could view the character as altruistically good, self-serving good, neutral, or any number of attributes that fall under "bad". Before I close, a particularly apt quote from our character: "We are all the sum of our tears. Too little and the ground is not fertile and nothing can grow there; too much, the best of us is washed away."

---

So, make of it what you will. It will be exceptionally scummy (not to mention petty) to push us today. Town doesn't need to know what we haven't claimed yet. It's much more useful if scum doesn't know. There is a time to claim and solid reasoning for that. I mean ... don't get me wrong; I'm flattered that people are so worried about us being scum that they think it's a good idea to push us on day one ... but people may want to consider that we have both also been quite good as town, and some people's motives for trying to get a wagon on us may not be so pure.


In summation: Town folks; you want us and our role around and will have your curiosity satisfied sooner than later. Scum; screw with us at your peril.


Love, with warm milk and cookies,
Drixx

P.S. - I'm not ill anymore so you won't be just pushing Titus around. Titus is very easy to goad a reaction out of and cause all kinds of ruckus, as anyone who has played with her knows. Unless I'm ill or in a great deal of pain, you generally have to go out of your way and push me pretty far before I get nasty, but when I do it's generally unpleasant for everyone involved, and everyone caught watching it unfold. When it comes to us, you probably want to stop with the insults and such.


@Cerb - You asked why Elbirn, and the response for me is really simple: he was busy planning out deaths. It struck me as super scummy because he wasn't giving any reasons for each one. He basically asserted that the first death would be scum and that apparently somehow justified him listing off a kill order. Scum sort players in the order they intend to kill them, depending on various factors. Town generally doesn't plan out a bunch of kills on day one. There's nowhere near enough evidence to have solved the game. It's one thing if the situation is like what you and I had in SU where we had knocked the scum team 99.99% out of the game and made a list of folks to PoE our way through. At that point the game was essentially solved and it only failed because Grapes bucked when even he acknowledged he needed to be lynched and because you and I didn't stick to the list we made. But that was days into the game with most of the scum team dead and tons of information to work with.

Today is day one with very little information to work with, and Elbirn is making a list of people to kill... doesn't strike me as a town motivated thing. Furthermore, he has no conviction and is jumping on anything to see what will stick. I see scum doing that frequently ... throw enough proverbial pasta and something is bound to stick. You need only look at the post just before the thread was locked for awhile to see what I mean.


Hooray for the Great Wall of Drixx™

[Learned Hand]

Errant shoots davsto tomorrow. No excuses or exceptions made. Solved.

Can we lynch LH now? They're scum. I feel it in my bones.

Oh hey look ... it's Elbirn planning out deaths. It's not like the lynch flip or night kill might give information that changes the equation and makes other actions desirable and therefore town would keep their options open and not pre-commit to somethi... oh ... wait.

I do have to admit to being amused by Elbirn's "I feel it in my bones" reasoning. Great rationale there bud.


@Cerberus - Unless you want me to give an English lesson in the middle of this game, kindly stop trying to correct people and be a grammar Nazi ... especially since your grammar Nazism is wrong in this case.

Love, Succinctly,
Drixx

[Learned Hand]

Bold 1: You should be able to read Twilight and Sukioden and see this is Klingon's town game. While she doesn't sabatoge, the differences were obvious for ANYONE to see. Given you lived it, you should have known. Your push on Klingon was fake as shit and acts as if you suddenly forgot. Klingon just stalls content and OMGUSes as scum. Her votes are out of left field. Klingon was wagoned by scum looking for an easy lynch. You fit that bill perfectly.

Jeanne is imploding like Sukioden but listening and incorporating advice. That fight with you about give me reasons or die is transparently fucking town. Second, flipped scum tried to trigger an implosion from her but noooo we can't know Jeanne is town. We can know Jeanne and TN aren't partners.

Me, you should have known that by judging my actions in thread.

Bold 2: Yeah, we can know who town is by this process called town hunting. It's what I did in Sudikoen and what I am doing here. Your fabrications on Klingon and Jeanne attempting to make them look bad while hiding behind plausible deniability are just scummy.

Scum generally don't claim miller unless multi ball. Talk to me tomorrow about this if we both live.

I quoted the posts on your TN interactions.

DS is town because he has the counterwagon to TN unless multiball is proven.

Your ISO is one big, let's find all the people players won't like and lynch them.

[Learned Hand]

So, eh, just curious, what does everyone think would be the single most overpowered single target non game breaking non killing thing you could target someone with that benefits town? Let's call this a thought experiment. Skies the limit, except for the limits I made. Make stuff up.

........................................

...........................







......Cerberus why the fuck did you know Sharkys role here.

And here's Elbirn throwing some pasta against the wall. It didn't stick so now he's moved on to us, only he hasn't even bothered to give a reason.

@RP - You are toxic and I basically am going to just ignore you for the rest of the game. You admitted that you are on an alt because your previous play on this site got you a bad reputation, and your current play on your new account is doing the same thing. As far as I can tell, making a new account isn't actually going to help you. Perhaps if you drop your completely asinine nastiness towards anyone who disagrees with you, you will not be viewed as toxic. Once you work out your issues where you think your shit doesn't smell and you lash out at anyone and everyone, you should spend some time in the Road to Rome I think. If #2444 is a reliable sample of your play, it could use improving.

Pro-Tip: I told everyone where to look to see what they need to see. If people go and look there, they will have some idea of what we are since there's really only two things that would allow us to make the early posts that we made. So ... either people will conclude that we're probably town and be fine to wait for our claim at the appropriate time, or they will conclude we're scum. Concluding that we're scum necessarily requires thinking that we are both literally the most incompetent people to ever play mafia. Since nobody viewed those posts as scum slips way back when we made them, I'm pretty sure trying to pretend they're scum slips now just makes anyone doing so look silly.

[Learned Hand]

^ Drixx

[Learned Hand]

Hey friends, let me let you in on a little secret: Who is comfortable claiming vague but useful powers to deflect attention away from themselves during the day phase, the people who are afraid of being killed during the night phase, or the people who control the kill during the night phase?

L-0, Drixx has claimed vague but useful powers.

When I'm dead tomorrow, kill the scum hydra. Thanks.

There's nothing at all vague about what we've already claimed. I even told you where to go look. If you have even a passing familiarity with mafia roles, you should have a super good idea what we are.

By the way, I have become quite good at getting the most out of whatever role I am assigned. In Mafiaception I got assigned as "The Mark" in the Innergame and started out as 1-shot BP and gained a Vig shot if town won the inner game. I was able to draw fire on night 1 and prevent a kill happening, and successfully help town get the innergame cleared upon which point I shot someone who was being used by scum as a smokescreen and while the person I shot was town, their flip gave the clarity necessary to finish off the game. I got quite a lot of compliments for how I baited scum, thank you very much.

So your implication that only scum make vague claims is not only absurd on its face, it is completely opposite of my documented easy to verify play. Whoops.

RP, seriously, stop it with the name calling. It's unnecessary. You were already warned by the mod. i don't want the result of this game to be marred by someone getting themselves modkilled.

Drixx: that post was terrible. So bad. Why are you even telling us this right now? Why is it relevant? Why are you working so hard to diminish pressure before any pressure exists? Hell, your slots even ASKED for a 1v1, when you could have just laid low. it doesn't make sense to follow that up with a fucking wall of "keep away from us because we are good for town and we will totally claim soon". You know what happens when you do that? You tell us that you are no longer interested in a 1v1, and now you just want to get the hell out of the middle of things.

Also, I wasn't talking about grammar Drixx! I was talking about how it's very easy to look at that sentence (notice my EBWOP, because I typoed!) in terms of logical syntax, and see a clear claim that both sharky and jeanne are investigatives.

pedit: RP, that's not true. Drixx is quite content claiming vague but useful and deliberately trying to draw NK's to himself, or to do so to WIFOM scum.

I would say that Elbirn, You, 3DR, Mr. Toxic all talking about wagoning us was worth a post on my part just telling you to go look at the start of the game and open your eyes. You know me well enough to know that post had other purposes. Don't treat me like I'm a level zero 1-dimensional player when you know I'm not.

Yeah okay.

Kill the lying hydra tomorrow.

Oh hey, name calling again. We lied where?

Let me make an absolute promise: tomorrow I will stop at nothing and do nothing but work to the hardest of my ability to lynch that lying hydra.

Keep that in mind if I'm shot tonight.

More name calling. Still no actual suggestion of what the supposed lie(s) might be. I particularly find it amusing that Mr. Toxic wants us dead so badly he is predicting his death and pre-emptively putting the blame on us. I wonder if Mr. Toxic even went and looked at our early posts and thought about them? I doubt it, since so little time has passed.

RP, seriously, stop it with the name calling. It's unnecessary. You were already warned by the mod. i don't want the result of this game to be marred by someone getting themselves modkilled.

Drixx: that post was terrible. So bad. Why are you even telling us this right now? Why is it relevant? Why are you working so hard to diminish pressure before any pressure exists? Hell, your slots even ASKED for a 1v1, when you could have just laid low. it doesn't make sense to follow that up with a fucking wall of "keep away from us because we are good for town and we will totally claim soon". You know what happens when you do that? You tell us that you are no longer interested in a 1v1, and now you just want to get the hell out of the middle of things.

Also, I wasn't talking about grammar Drixx! I was talking about how it's very easy to look at that sentence (notice my EBWOP, because I typoed!) in terms of logical syntax, and see a clear claim that both sharky and jeanne are investigatives.

pedit: RP, that's not true. Drixx is quite content claiming vague but useful and deliberately trying to draw NK's to himself, or to do so to WIFOM scum.

Then he lies as town. That's probably a reflection of his character more than anything.

He's lying scum here.

More name calling. Still waiting for some actual specific something that I said which was untrue.

So, eh, just curious, what does everyone think would be the single most overpowered single target non game breaking non killing thing you could target someone with that benefits town? Let's call this a thought experiment. Skies the limit, except for the limits I made. Make stuff up.

........................................

...........................







......Cerberus why the fuck did you know Sharkys role here.

And here's Elbirn throwing some pasta against the wall. It didn't stick so now he's moved on to us, only he hasn't even bothered to give a reason.

@RP - You are toxic and I basically am going to just ignore you for the rest of the game. You admitted that you are on an alt because your previous play on this site got you a bad reputation, and your current play on your new account is doing the same thing. As far as I can tell, making a new account isn't actually going to help you. Perhaps if you drop your completely asinine nastiness towards anyone who disagrees with you, you will not be viewed as toxic. Once you work out your issues where you think your shit doesn't smell and you lash out at anyone and everyone, you should spend some time in the Road to Rome I think. If #2444 is a reliable sample of your play, it could use improving.

Pro-Tip: I told everyone where to look to see what they need to see. If people go and look there, they will have some idea of what we are since there's really only two things that would allow us to make the early posts that we made. So ... either people will conclude that we're probably town and be fine to wait for our claim at the appropriate time, or they will conclude we're scum. Concluding that we're scum necessarily requires thinking that we are both literally the most incompetent people to ever play mafia. Since nobody viewed those posts as scum slips way back when we made them, I'm pretty sure trying to pretend they're scum slips now just makes anyone doing so look silly.

Actually, you bully, it got me a very

good

reputation.

You want me to bring my main in tomorrow? Or are you going to shoot me tonight.

Because there. will. be. blood.

More name calling. *sigh*.

If we had a vigilante ability, I probably would ask Titus to let me use it just to remove toxicity from the game. Sadly, I'm not going to shoot you ever, because shooting isn't something we can do.

So ... do you mean that your toxic style of attacking anyone you claim to have reason to believe is scum (even though you don't give any reasons) and trying to provoke them into fighting back got you a good reputation? Or ... is this toxic playstyle you are employing now something new, and you don't want to dirty your old account with it? I'm confused by what exactly you feel warrants a good reputation. I hope you don't think that attacking people and calling them names and trying to go after people without even having reasons is something that most people would view as good. I mean ... just for your own mental health and that of whomever is in a game with you.

[Learned Hand]

Every ounce of information revealed MUST have a purpose.

This is the player who is claiming vague and ill-defined power roles at like L-7.

What is the purpose of revealing this information?

Is it to dodge the night kill? No. They don't seem particularly worried about the night kill, do they?

Why did you cut out most of post #323? Why do you feel the need to address just that little bit? Why are you claiming that I wrote that post when Titus clearly signed it?

Now you're the one lying. I didn't write that post. You say I did. Hrm.

[Learned Hand]

Wow, you talk about name calling in the post where you do nothing but call me names.

You two-faced hypocrital lying bully.

PEdit: OH I SEE

WE GET THE FUCKING SCUM HYDRA THING

"I DIDN'T SAY THAT, OTHER ME SAID THAT"

FUCK YOU. YOU WANT TO PLAY AS ONE PLAYER SLOT, YOU GET TO PLAY AS ONE PLAYER SLOT.

Still waiting for you to point out any place where I lied.

There's a reason hydras are asked to sign their posts. You asserted that I personally said something in a cherry picked quote where you intentionally cut off most of the post, including the signature showing that it was written by Titus. You seem to misunderstand what a hydra is. If Titus says something, that doesn't mean that I said it. If I say something, that doesn't mean Titus said it.

There's not even any hydra dissonance here since I have good reasons for the post I made. Giving that information when and how I did it has a purpose. Still ... I personally am not the person who said what you say I said. The argument that because we're playing one slot we should somehow mind meld and be thinking the same thing and each be the author of every post from the hydra is a little bit ridiculous.

Again ... there's a reason why hydras are supposed to sign their posts.

~Drixx

P.S. - Can we like maybe move on and find scum? Either put up a case or drop it RP. You can say "X is scum!" over and over and over but if there's no reasons, you're not doing anything but flooding the game with noise.