Toriel's Patience (end)
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Doing mech spec in an open game is impressive…-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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VOTE:Beeboy-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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I missed voting in pink, it’s so fun-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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We’ve played 2 games together before (Invictus also happened), I tend to vote for non-posters when opening, I like broadening our horizons rather than laser focusing on the handful of slots present at game start, especially if I’m not going to be super present in the few hours after game startIn post 77, Dunnstral wrote: I believe I've played 1 game with them before. I don't like that they voted for somebody who hadn't posted.-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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What if we build a scum block-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Sure let's start the scumblock together!In post 242, Mandate wrote: Can I be in the scum block? No one is townreading me yet.-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Wait was Dann's post not directed at Mandate?In post 250, Merlyn wrote:
I will never be able to know your alignment againIn post 248, Dannflor wrote: im townreading you kinda-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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I think Merlyn was interpreting it as a townread on her, and that she's unable to sort people who townread her (because she just automatically wants to townread them back)
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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All of Sakura's posts have left me perplexed-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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2 shots at hitting scum in an 11:3 mountainous really isn't terrible? and I also don't see in what way the point you're making proves that we shouldn't be scumhunting here.In post 263, Sakura Hana wrote:
I see, although... that sounds like a tall order tbh, how often does that happen in games?In post 258, Mandate wrote: Because limming scum on d1 and d2 is the primary goal right now and we can think about what comes later later?-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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This post made me realize that wikis are no longer displayed besides people's messages...In post 266, Dannflor wrote: 100% of the games dannflor is town in have d1 and d2 scum eliminations
this number is totally real just check my wiki-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Wish this game had hoods so I could pocket Shirou in one...-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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This feels kind of reductive? Wolves post to have thread presence, to be engaged in the game, to have fun... pushing agenda is nice but not every single wolf post is anchored on that and not every wolf post has deep and complex connotations. Wolves absolutely just post random thoughts to look more engaged, which tend to make you look more townie (or at the very least less appealing to lim), and nothing in Sakura's posting indicates that she isn'tIn post 281, Keyleth wrote:
If you're a wolf you want to be townread so you go over or push some wrong villagers but Sakura is just, doing neither? Unless that's the point to get townread but that's wifom ya know?In post 274, Dannflor wrote:
what doesn'tIn post 271, Keyleth wrote: This doesn't help Sakura as a wolf though, does it?tryingto be townread. Wraps around to the classic "if I'm a wolf, how come I'm not being townread?" argument, as if getting townread is this guaranteed thing to gain with certain posts rather than something that wolves fail at a bunch.-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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In post 276, Lazy Shirou wrote:
DOES YOUR EVIL KNOW NO BOUNDS GIRL?!!1!1In post 272, Meuh wrote: Wish this game had hoods so I could pocket Shirou in one...-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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God I reread our PT from that game, actual work of art...-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Okay so it wouldn't let me send my message when it had an emoji in it? Weird-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Ohhhhhhh wait through the process of copy+pasting it went from the emoji between colons to the regular emoji type and THAT was causing my issue!!
I can still spam as many emojies as I want...-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Scum do that, though. Not "for the fun of it", but scum make reads and engage with the game in ways that aren't solely focused on pushing townies over or doing super surface level townie things. Scum want to act like they do as town, to look helpful, to look as though they're thinking about the game, to maintain presence, to cozy up to people, to not get seen as an inactive...In post 307, Keyleth wrote: I wouldn't randomly throw out a townread and defend a player just for the fun of it?
Sakura making a handful of posts that aren't focused on throwing someone under the bus doesn't mean she's town? It feels like a reach-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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I kinda agreeIn post 316, Aristeia wrote: I think sakura is kinda townie-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Main thread roleplaying was really good actually, I think we both put more effort into thatIn post 317, Lazy Shirou wrote: I think the main thread roleplaying was even funnier at some points though
but maybe that's just me
p-edit: Sakura...townie?-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Never thought I'd be playing a game with town Dunnstral, but I think it's finally happening!-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Think I agree with Merlyn being town here-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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The word “perplexed” is deliberate there, it’s negative in terms of her ideas, that seem out there to me, but not her actual alignment.In post 378, Lazy Shirou wrote: Dear Meuh, you spend two of the few content posts you've arguing against Sakura and in the first "perplexed" sounds like it has a negative connotation, but by the end...you find her townie?
Hmmmm
Were you planning to betray me again?!
VOTE: Meuh
I argue againstKeyleth’s argument(which was bad regardless of Sakura’s alignment), then took a look at the ISO and got vague townvibes
You’re imagining implications for reads from the surface of my posting and not the actual thought process I have, there’s no read on Sakura that I actually voice before I agree with Ari, you’re drawing that line, and you’re wrong for doing that! Raises your scum equity a bunch cause I think you’re capable of more substantial reads, was wondering who would react when I agreed with Ari on Sakura, but this is sad…-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Him townreading meIn post 443, Lazy Shirou wrote: I also wonder what made you think Dunn is town though?-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Misunderstood your point, I think engaging in theoretical discussion that doesn't amount to much and revolves around general ideas on the game rather than things specific to what's currently going on is scummy, both for myself and for others, so it's fairIn post 444, Lazy Shirou wrote: Then, did you misunderstand what my point was or do you still think it's an "unsubstantial" read?-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Read my posts they’re all great!In post 467, Taly wrote:
only thing ive read fromIn post 453, Meuh wrote:
Misunderstood your point, I think engaging in theoretical discussion that doesn't amount to much and revolves around general ideas on the game rather than things specific to what's currently going on is scummy, both for myself and for others, so it's fairIn post 444, Lazy Shirou wrote: Then, did you misunderstand what my point was or do you still think it's an "unsubstantial" read?meuhand its a +1-
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I was interpreting it as being “hitting scum on day 1/2 is very difficult/unlikely”, and not being about hitting scum on BOTH days. Your interpretation seems more sensical when looking back at it. To me, Mandate was saying “our goal for the first 2 days is to hit scum” and Keyleth was replying with “but hitting scum is unlikely, (and therefore it’s not what our priority should be)”, which I took issue with.In post 485, implosion wrote: 265 is a funny post because yes, those odds are indeed terrible (EV of limming scum today + tomorrow is just above 3%... only ever so slightly lower than the a priori odds of Mandate's teamread being right)-
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Such a good track!!! I love the album
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Piling onto the mindmeldIn post 527, Taly wrote:
mindmeldIn post 523, Sakura Hana wrote:
I actually have a hard time keeping track of 13 other players at the same time, this is mostly a problem in larges, but this one is at least the samallest large size.In post 501, Taly wrote: <snip> idk whomerlynand is my brain has nothing in it when i think ofbrown eyes
But idk if it's a side-effect of it or not, but i feel like Brown eyes has been mentioned a few times and i cant even remember that they are a player in this game nor what they have done.-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Mandate hardest town readIn post 646, Taly wrote:meuhdo you actually have reads? i see a lot of explaining on your end that im not getting any defintiive stance from
Merlyn, Dunn, you, Sakura, also town
Dann, Ari, Shirou, Key, Implo, I've absorbed some of their posting but don't have a good grasp there
Brown Eyes, Alisae and Beeboy exist I think?-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Echoing what others had said, you seemed generally carefree in your approach in a way that felt authentic, more of a slight feeling than a solid read, although all of your posting since has kind of just gone to reinforce that feelingIn post 666, Sakura Hana wrote:
Ah this reminds me @Meuh can u tell meIn post 658, Lazy Shirou wrote: When she made this post, added with the "Sakura's posts left me perplexed", I thought she was mindmelding with me that Sakura wasn't that townie.whyyou were townreading me when you posted 321?-
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I'm not suspecting them, they're just there. I'm scumreading nobodyIn post 703, Dunnstral wrote:
bonkIn post 691, Meuh wrote:
Mandate hardest town readIn post 646, Taly wrote:meuhdo you actually have reads? i see a lot of explaining on your end that im not getting any defintiive stance from
Merlyn, Dunn, you, Sakura, also town
Dann, Ari, Shirou, Key, Implo, I've absorbed some of their posting but don't have a good grasp there
Brown Eyes, Alisae and Beeboy exist I think?
Having a low post count is not a good reason to be suspecting 3 people, and only suspecting those people-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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I like this post along with the scumread on me, kind of feels like Taly has a vague idea of the place or the way in which scum are playing and is trying to fit someone into it as a puzzle piece, which is how I tend to approach things a lot of the time. (I talk a lot about things "clicking", for me my reasoning for a scumread is often more just that it fits into place rather than some intense feeling on that specific player)In post 655, Taly wrote: I should really be resting soon but the premise of my thinking right now is that scum does not have substance but appears to have something that makes logical sense.-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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YesIn post 712, Dunnstral wrote:
So your reads are:In post 706, Meuh wrote:
I'm not suspecting them, they're just there. I'm scumreading nobodyIn post 703, Dunnstral wrote:
bonkIn post 691, Meuh wrote:
Mandate hardest town readIn post 646, Taly wrote:meuhdo you actually have reads? i see a lot of explaining on your end that im not getting any defintiive stance from
Merlyn, Dunn, you, Sakura, also town
Dann, Ari, Shirou, Key, Implo, I've absorbed some of their posting but don't have a good grasp there
Brown Eyes, Alisae and Beeboy exist I think?
Having a low post count is not a good reason to be suspecting 3 people, and only suspecting those people
Town
also Town
Null
also Null
The nulls are more "unsorted" than null though-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Somewhere else probablyIn post 718, Taly wrote:
they clearly have some sort of knowledge about the others playstyle and mindset for whatever reasonIn post 713, Lazy Shirou wrote:
Taly, Alisae has barely posted.In post 709, Taly wrote:
but im curious, how do you readIn post 675, Aristeia wrote:
I apologize for making you work hard while I just slack off and sip on champagne I can't help it.In post 673, Taly wrote: ari has this weird fucking knack of kicking my ass into gear but okayalisae?
why not feel inflated by the fact that im wrong on you?In post 715, Meuh wrote:
I like this post along with the scumread on me, kind of feels like Taly has a vague idea of the place or the way in which scum are playing and is trying to fit someone into it as a puzzle piece, which is how I tend to approach things a lot of the time. (I talk a lot about things "clicking", for me my reasoning for a scumread is often more just that it fits into place rather than some intense feeling on that specific player)In post 655, Taly wrote: I should really be resting soon but the premise of my thinking right now is that scum does not have substance but appears to have something that makes logical sense.
where should my vote be?
where shouldshirou'svote be?-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Many moments that felt like good, authentic town thought processes!In post 700, Aristeia wrote:
explain the mandate tr plzIn post 691, Meuh wrote:
Mandate hardest town readIn post 646, Taly wrote:meuhdo you actually have reads? i see a lot of explaining on your end that im not getting any defintiive stance from
Merlyn, Dunn, you, Sakura, also town
Dann, Ari, Shirou, Key, Implo, I've absorbed some of their posting but don't have a good grasp there
Brown Eyes, Alisae and Beeboy exist I think?
Mandate has just felt repeatedly like having a town perspective and I feel solid about that
I was going to dig up some posts but I think my time is better spent elsewhere-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Yeah that's kind of the point of the joke there
Reality is that it's less of a lack of belief in myself and more a lack of disbelief in others.
I'll come back to this once I find a scummy player but I've found none. I can vaguely gesture towards my unsorted players as better places to vote but I don't have strong conviction anywhere there (cause yknow, unsorted), so I'm not pointing fingers.-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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My main thought in 34/35 waa Beeboy scum and then suddenly an avalanche of votes on 36
I’ve already been voting Beeboy since RVS but I’ll vote again to be all dramatic about it
VOTE: Beeboy-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Beeboy voting for me is really confusing?
Cause seemingly he wants to shake things up to get people to acquire scumreads and also thinks there’s scum in active players… but like how does a vote on me accomplish either?
I’m not particularly active here, I have more posts than him but not even by a super significant amount and my posts haven’t been super content heavy, so idk how it fits into the idea of scum in the actives (unless “the actives” is the vast majority of players)
and I’m already being thrown out as a theoretical vote or an actual vote? Beeboy talks about the looming threat of a wagon on him or Alisae even though Shirou and I have had a much more real threat of one for a while? His vote doesn’t actually shake things up
It feels disjointed-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Happy birthday Taly!-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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(That was your cue to start townreading me)-
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I still hate Beeboy's vote on me and the gap between his outlook on the game and his actual actions, unless I missed something I don't think this has been resolved in the slightestIn post 902, Meuh wrote: Beeboy voting for me is really confusing?
Cause seemingly he wants to shake things up to get people to acquire scumreads and also thinks there’s scum in active players… but like how does a vote on me accomplish either?
I’m not particularly active here, I have more posts than him but not even by a super significant amount and my posts haven’t been super content heavy, so idk how it fits into the idea of scum in the actives (unless “the actives” is the vast majority of players)
and I’m already being thrown out as a theoretical vote or an actual vote? Beeboy talks about the looming threat of a wagon on him or Alisae even though Shirou and I have had a much more real threat of one for a while? His vote doesn’t actually shake things up
It feels disjointed-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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I do still feel like Merlyn is just town and I'm uninterested in pushing there
I would act all high and mighty because I caught scum Merlyn in another game, but I mostly caught her off of the person she replaced's ISO so I can't even take credit here-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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(I'm also very much pocketed by the idea of me having good reads)In post 1236, Merlyn wrote:
Do you think they were scum driven?In post 1191, Taly wrote:
I don't agree withIn post 1050, Merlyn wrote: I like beeboy. The push on him doesn't feel right. It might be town that's just happy to put there vote somewhereSakuraorMandatepushes.
How do you feel aboutMeuh?
I feel iffy. I feel like I am actually good at reading town Meuh. She's kind of spicy with takes but tends to be right. So I'm kind of waiting for that to happen and if it doesn't then I'll know-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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VOTE: Implosion
Let's nudge here, why don't we?-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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I do think that I have a pretty good read record lately actually, the issue is that I'm too busy being mislimmed to do much with said reads!-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Beeboy/me towncore so real-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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Yeah that’s kind of my main issue there too, I just don’t buy Beeboy’s overall perspective as being one a townie truly believes in, but I can see scum make it up-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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I guess “overall perspective” is vague to the point where it can be applied to like any read ever, but I meant more their thoughts on like, the game stance and groups of people (such as the wagon on them)-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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I say “like” a lot-
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Meuh She/herJack of All TradesShe/her
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In post 1329, implosion wrote:
i kind of despise this vote and follow-up for some reason. Possibly because I know that I'm town and so I'm tempted to just BoP the person who voted me and then immediately said that her reads are really good lately, but she's not actually calling me scum with this vote, she's aggressively not calling me scum with the very noncommittal phrasing of the vote, but then immediately saying she has really good reads? It's just like sort of mentally incongruous, she votes me in a way that seems not motivated by a read (or at least not a materially strong one, though she can correct me) but then mazkes this next post 5 minutes later about how her reads are good lately, it's just like, I don't know why she makes that comment after making a vote that strongly looks like it's just prodding a lurker to start doing something.In post 1295, Meuh wrote: I do think that I have a pretty good read record lately actually, the issue is that I'm too busy being mislimmed to do much with said reads!
Unvote
VOTE: Meuh
1295 was a reflection I had on 1293, not an assertion that I have good reads and therefore should be followed on you. Kind of confused why you thought it was? I did peek at your ISO and came out of it just feeling kinda meh, my vote was for the purposes of applying pressure mostly cause I got the impression you could be scum but wanted some more substance
Also your argument for Beeboy town kinda falls apart when you remember Taly voting for Beeboy? Which I’m also confused as to how you missed because it was just brought up-
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In post 1337, Taly wrote:In post 1310, Meuh wrote: Beeboy/me towncore so real
????In post 1312, Meuh wrote: Yeah that’s kind of my main issue there too, I just don’t buy Beeboy’s overall perspective as being one a townie truly believes in, but I can see scum make it up
The joke there is that Beeboy and I were just voting for each other and that a towncore of us would be unconventional and unrealistic, but I’m mentioning it because we just started voting together for a third player.In post 1339, Taly wrote: is there humor that's genuinely being lost on me rn?-
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In post 464, implosion wrote: Gut from pages 1-4 is Dann town (though I think I remember seeing that's someone consensus?)
Anyone else find this scummy? Implo invoking how much a player is already being townread/thread consensus on an issue when posting his take on it is kind of off to me. It's not really a consideration I have when posting reads as town. It comes more from scum thinking about the optics and the ramifications of their read than a townie just dropping some thoughts.In post 1327, implosion wrote: I think sakura is already (widely?) townread but this cements it pretty hard for me sort of in the vein of the philosophy that I think Shirou mentioned earlier of trying to read people off a few key posts, which I think I kind of agree with or at least am interested in thinking about as a philosophy of forum mafia.-
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Yeah I'm looking at Implo's ISO and there's nothing town indicative there!
The more substantial reads are townreads that are just really easy to make from an informed perspective. I don't think any of said townreads are pushing boundaries to an extent where I think Implo is particularly trying to sort people
The scumreads are just kind of boring and weak? Implo has little actual insight on it, I think the most substantial scum argument so far is the one against me which is super weak
There's just nothing there that actually indicates Implo thinking about the game like a townie-
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I get why Implo would get a day 1 pass and I would usually advocate for it (stuff like EV is generally useful and he's posting in a way that feels helpful) but nothing he's said is actually town indicative and we're starving for scumreads... I think that's the exact kind of slot we need to reconsider in this type of situation-
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Mandate town is easy to say, Implo just proceeds to point out bad postsIn post 464, implosion wrote: Gut from pages 1-4 is Dann town (though I think I remember seeing that's someone consensus?), Mandate town (...) I thought Mandate's opening was slightly +town even from someone who is clearly gimmicking and I like the timing of the Taly vote on page 4 quite a lot. Dann is townish just for voting like 8 times in 4 pages.
149 is actually an interesting post and probably true of me bc I probably would have explained things in the scum PT at some point, alas. Probably +town (maybe strongly) for Brown Eyes to point out an observation like that, it's an observation that could easily just never be made by anyone. Dunn calling Brown Eyes town shortly after this is slightly good for Dunn (who I don't really have much of a read on at this point).
It's a read I agree with but also like, naturally easy to fake
Dann read is, as Implo himself pointed out, what a lot of other people were already thinking, easily fakeable.
The Brown Eyes townread is probably the best read Implo has, but 1. I think it's something he could still notice and then comment on, and 2. it's a read based off of a singular post. I think this comes back around later with the Sakura read and it's interesting the way that Implo is laser focusing on a single post, I think it makes it easier for him to argue a scumread but also feels less townie because well, there's a whole bunch of other posts to consider! This is something that comes back a few times, the specificity of the reads. It's always specific things being pointed out and being the reasoning for reads, which seems to me to come more from scum trying to make sure their reads are understood to be about a thing in particular. Scum really hate it when their ideas aren't clear, but townies are much more likely to make broad statement about other people's posting and the general vibes from said posting. But for Implo it's almost always one post or another, never a player's general direction.
This is like, fine, but also something Implo can just say about a town Sakura. I guess the point about it being surface-level scummy but actually town indicative is cool, but it's also the exact angle Implo would be able to argue from with the knowledge that Sakura is town and the thread otherwise disliking that post from her.In post 485, implosion wrote: 221 is a pretty good point (on Keyleth being town) and probably +town a bit for Sakura. To elaborate a bit since it came into question why I think it's +town for Keyleth, the post is just very frank about what it's trying to do. I think scum on average will tend to shy away from a post that's like "hey, we already have me + x as town, who are the other two" particularly in the context of Keyleth having some heat on her. It's not a slam dunk or anything, but I think it's very easy to glance at that post and briefly *think* it's a slam dunk before you've thought it through intensely, hence Sakura is slightly townish for it (but only slightly and this paragraph is already way too long)
MehIn post 577, implosion wrote: i can see 449 being townish, 378 is kind of eh though.
yesIn post 575, Lazy Shirou wrote: ARE YOU STILL GLAZING OVER THEM
In post 707, implosion wrote: Somewhat inclined to trust Ari on Sakura.
This read is less specific ("the way they're thinking about the game", "evolution of stances"), though I think Implo going out of his way to explain why a widely townread player is town isn't the best look?In post 722, implosion wrote:
wasn't to me but mandate is extremely town in my eyes.In post 700, Aristeia wrote: explain the mandate tr plz
They have all the right stances at all the right times. The way they're thinking about the game feels right, I liked their opening, I liked the evolution of their taly+keyleth team read, I like the evolution of their stances in general, like, the townread on sakura a page or two ago is good for example
Just kind of reiterating that read without anything new, but making sure to keep the door open for a future vote. So like all this accomplishes is setting things up so Implo can vote for Dann later? Which is also something Implo ends up saying about me. Can't say I'm a big fan of these posts anticipating votes instead of just voting when it feels right to. Feels overly careful.In post 725, implosion wrote: i think dannflor's first 10 or however many pages were really town, i'm not interested in voting for dannflor unless time passes and he falls off (which could happen but time has not yet passed).
Taly makes a bunch of good posts (including a vote on Dann, notably) and then Implo pops in with this. I guess it's alright I dunnoIn post 767, implosion wrote: yeah sure whatever taly is town probably
He acts all murky about Ari for a while, then says he can have better reasons to townread her now, and then doesn't elaborate. Only been 24 hours tbf but his positioning around Ari is definitely odd. Feels like he's scared of her.In post 1165, implosion wrote: Relevantly the coalition game that I was in w Ari and Merlyn just ended today and I was scum so I have some extremely fresh scum meta, which is almost never true of me lol
I think it gave me a pretty good sense of some things from Ari to be on the lookout for as reasons to townread her. If I were a man of more patience I would go back and reread the game from forever ago where she snowed me as scum but i am not going to do that probably ever lol
Like Sakura pointed out, this is very much echoing previous sentiments about her. There's a lot of words so it feels good but the crux of it is "Sakura doesn't care about how she's seen" which like true, but also applies to other posts of her and has already been mentioned.In post 1327, implosion wrote:
I think this reaction would be kind of incredible to fake as scum. Like, I've been vaguely lurking and beeboy has been talking about thinking their wagon was scum driven and so i feel like replying to beeboy jumping on me with a ???? after beeboy just listed me near the bottom of their reads list the previous page is just like, something scum who care sharply about how they're perceived would never do. I think sakura is already (widely?) townread but this cements it pretty hard for me sort of in the vein of the philosophy that I think Shirou mentioned earlier of trying to read people off a few key posts, which I think I kind of agree with or at least am interested in thinking about as a philosophy of forum mafia.In post 1307, Sakura Hana wrote: You know what, i'm not gonna ask anymore, i'm just gonna hope someone that's good at the game gives me some guidance while I figure out where my head is at.
I think Implo not noticing the mention that Taly had been on the Beeboy wagon and that Beeboy was townreading her isn't a very good look... feels odd to drop a read like this but then also just not see 1281 which is quite literally 2 pages earlier, and right after Beeboy's readlist. But like regardless, the argument here is just that scum!Beeboy would not take the stance that his wagon is scumlead cause that makes conflict? Which sure is fine I guessIn post 1328, implosion wrote: I have very mixed feelings on beeboy's current trajectory. I think the part of it that I see as unlikely to come from scum is that just literally calling every single person on your wagon scum is I think a somewhat unnatural reaction to have as scum, I think as scum you get to choose what your reads are and so the normal thing to do is to like, pick a token person on your wagon whomst you will say is actually town and then lambast the rest of it. The counterpoint to this is that beeboy is coming back from a long break so I could see them theoretically being kind of lazy as scum and just falling in to pushing all the people pushing them. But I think I am tending to think it's probably town, I don't really see a good reason for scum beeboy to decide to wake up and choose violence in this way. It just kind of puts them at the center of narratives and in the spotlight and embroils them in conflict and idk what the point would be when simpler options exist.
In a dramatic turn of irony i am now going to call beeboy the only townie on my wagon (nah but i am about to call meuh scum i think)
Brown Eyes and Keyleth seemingly haven't changed in Implo's eyes since like his second post? I think the specific mention of the Dunn townread not being spoken about yet is another one of those things that could theoretically be said by town, but that I think scum are more likely to notice. Him elaborating on that read but not some of the older reads that he hasn't touched on in ages very much gives that scummy feel of a player sticking to exactly what's been said before and only deviating on an explicit mention of the contrary.In post 1332, implosion wrote: Anyway. Let's wrap up the post chain with a summary of where I'm at with everyone.
Very Much Locktown: Mandate, Sakura. It'd take a hell of a lot to convince me away from either of them.
Town: Brown Eyes, Keyleth
Probably Town but not as confident as above: beeboy, Dunn (only townread I think I haven't talked about at all yet, but kind of a gut feels-like-he's-playing-like-i-remember-his-towngame-looking)
Town, but will need to be audited sooner than other townreads: Dannflor
Town, but I still have reservations: Taly
Still gotta sort: Ari, Merlyn, Alisae
Also in the still gotta sort tier, but I'm choosing to put him separately not because I think he's scummier than the other people in the tier but because it'll make him angry: Shirou
I saw a thing I don't like and don't remember seeing anything I thought was particularly town but I am definitely going to go look over more stuff later: Meuh
Definitely curious about his progression on Taly, cause it very much swung with the way the thread was going, which feels convenient.
Overall:
-His town reads feel white knighty
-He feels scared of Ari
-His stance of Taly is convenient
-It feels like he has a need to make his stance exceedingly clear and doesn't like leaving things vague (which is very much a scum perspective)
-There's an almost total lack of progression that feels like it's happening outside of the thread. Every little change in Implo's view of the game is stated in thread. He's not developing a full view of the game on his own, he's dropping thoughts in thread and those thoughts alone are his stance in the game.-
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In post 1358, Sakura Hana wrote:
Speaking of this.In post 1355, Meuh wrote: I get why Implo would get a day 1 pass and I would usually advocate for it (stuff like EV is generally useful and he's posting in a way that feels helpful) but nothing he's said is actually town indicative and we're starving for scumreads... I think that's the exact kind of slot we need to reconsider in this type of situation
Do you think implo would have a reason to post the EV stuff as scum.
First and foremost, I'll echo 288 and 315. Scum just kind of do things and it's not always super agenda based or has deep meaning.In post 1360, Sakura Hana wrote: Like that's the one thing on my head, i dont think at the time (although i cant remember havent double checked) anyone was specially suspecting implo, and as scum he could've stayed silent about the EVs and go with whatever better strategy for his scumteam would be.
Or am i just looking too much into something that's NAI.
I do think Implo has some things to gain here. I'm not super familiar with him but I think it may be something that's kind of expected from him, this sort of analysis. I think it's less powerful in making Implo getting super townread (cause sure, EV is something anyone can do), but it creates a presence in thread and makes him less appealing as a lim.
Like hey, look at this! Dunn's stance on Implo shows why it's good for Implo to do. His posting is seen as helpful and denser. It all gives the idea that we should give him a day 1 pass, which I mention here:In post 1334, Dunnstral wrote:
I liked their early analysis and their EV posting. It is a lazier read admittedly, but I don't see their posting as scummy.In post 1317, Aristeia wrote:
can you explain the implosion townread?In post 1313, Dunnstral wrote: I've explained my reads on everybody. I believe I've gone into at least some detail on why I am reading players as town. It's not really surprising, or it shouldn't be.
Ultimately posting about the EV probably goes with Implo's meta, creates thread presence and feels helpful. It's definitely been beneficial.In post 1355, Meuh wrote: I get why Implo would get a day 1 pass and I would usually advocate for it (stuff like EV is generally useful and he's posting in a way that feels helpful) but nothing he's said is actually town indicative and we're starving for scumreads... I think that's the exact kind of slot we need to reconsider in this type of situation
The downside you mentioned is us knowing spare was better, but:
1. Pretty sure people were already leaning that way? (At least I was)
2. People are naturally gonna lean towards spare as it's the unique option (otherwise we're just playing a mountainous, which I enjoy but is definitely less exciting)
3. If there is meta on Implo being good at EV, NOT taking the stance that spare is correct could then reflect negatively.-
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Some were things I saw when first reading the game, but it's also little details that made me go "hmmmm" when I skimmed Implo's ISO before voting there yesterday. There's also specifically that Implo's recent posting, which I see in a more negative light, has little issues in it that I also remembered seeing earlier. The mention of Sakura already being townread got linked to him saying the same thing about Dann, the specificity of reads and single-post-focus is also something I had already picked up on a bit and his stance on Ari I was already confused by. The seeds were there, me taking another look at the ISO to analyze his townreads just made them sprout.In post 1364, Taly wrote: I will say this stance feels a bit spontaneous given that it has posts from much earlier in the thread
Why point it out nowMeuh?-
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